NYC Bans Mention of Dinosaurs, Dancing, Birthdays On Student Tests

New submitter SchroedingersCat writes "New York educators banned references to 'dinosaurs,' 'birthdays,' 'Halloween' and dozens of other topics on city-issued tests. That is because they fear such topics 'could evoke unpleasant emotions in the students.' Dinosaurs, for example, call to mind evolution, which might upset fundamentalists; birthdays are not celebrated by Jehovah's Witnesses; and Halloween suggests paganism. Homes with swimming pools and home computers are also unmentionables — because of economic sensitivities. The city asks test companies to exclude 'creatures from outer space' as well — for unspecified reasons."

Comments

April fools

[Anonymous Coward]

April 1st is a few days away still yet...

Re:April fools

[Beardo the Bearded]

That's what I was thinking, is this an Onion article that got out of control?

They live in New York. Isn't the slogan "Fuck you and piss on your corpse."?

Re:April fools

[jhoegl]

Ask Madonna that last question

But this is pretty surprising... I mean, it seems very unreal.

Re:April fools

[Genda]

Sorry, no can do... the earth is only 6,000 years old, in fact the universe is only 6,000 years old and all them fossils were the result of the great flood! God has an incredible sense of humor... he created a brand new universe that was already 14 billion years old, just to test our faith. Who do you believe, your eyes or God?

Re:April fools

[camperdave]

How old is Maggie Simpson, or Mickey Mouse? I'm not saying that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, but if a God did create something to look 14 billion years old, then that's how old it would look despite our best testing.

Re:April fools

[CaptainLugnuts]

That all the freaks live upstate?

Re:April fools

[flyneye]

Apparently , that's the slogan that will appear on the tag of NYCs fleet of "short buses".

Re:April fools

[Monchanger]

It's been a long time since I studied this in detail back in school, but I'm pretty sure that Maggie Simpson and Mickey Mouse are "fiction".

Kind of like the story of creation.

Re:April fools

[ancienthart]

So, basically you're saying that God is the spiritual/intellectual equivalent of a Rick-Roller?

Re:April fools

[PremiumCarrion]

I'm more upset that my religion which bans mention of the words "new", "york" and "city" hasn't been considered.

Damn those insensitive clods who I'm unable to refer to.

Re:April fools

[philip.paradis]

I think he's saying God is more like this.

Re:April fools

[the_bard17]

No, by introducing stupid concepts like those referenced by the summary & article above, which the really loony Upstate folks then use as a shining example of how life should be.

Re:April fools

[FrootLoops]

That's just a test. God values faith very highly, far above living morally (which is impossible). Making scientific evidence which contradicts His word is just a way to solidify our faith.

The righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe.
        - Romans 3:21

All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law." Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith."

Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law.
        - Galatians 3:10-11, 23-25

Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance.
        - James 1:2-3

The science is wrong. It's just a test. No matter what people say I will keep my faith. God told me to expect this in advance:

Blessed are you when men hate you, when they exclude you and insult you and reject your name as evil, because of the Son of Man.
        - Luke 6:22

Now go away. I've got other things to think about:

Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.
        - Philippians 4:6-8

...like pure, lovely, honest gay butt sex between men who love each other.

Re:April fools

[Benaiah]

Its funny that on the front page of /. we have an article belittling Europe's treatment of free speech and we have this article that says NY'ers can't even talk about dinosaurs because you might upset someone?

Re:April fools

[jsternberg]

The civilizations that had a "flood myth" also happen to correspond to every civilization that lived in the Mesopotamian area near the Black Sea. No other civilizations outside of that area have a flood myth. There's a lot of evidence that a flood occurred in that area, but there's no evidence of a "global" flood. Civilizations in the Americas don't have the same myth.

Also, having a "creation" myth is par for the course. Doesn't mean there's any proof that any of those happened. Just that somebody tried to explain what happened (we're still, to this day, trying to explain where we came from).

Re:April fools

[FrootLoops]

You say I cherry picked passages and bent their meaning. I disagree. You didn't provide a single specific charge for me to refute (eg. "I'm fairly sure that the galatians passage was about the old law of Moses" -- great; so how did I misrepresent that passage?), so I can't do more than disagree.

My post is both serious and not. Certainly the conclusion that God put dinosaur bones on earth to test Christian's faith sounds ridiculous, but how else would a young earth creationist explain them? Such people do get persecuted for their religious beliefs, by the way; I don't know what the point of most of your post is, but you seem to think my James and Luke passages weren't apt when they were.

That said, I feel compelled to tell you that your discussion skills leave me very disinclined to listen to you. You...

  * ...claimed the Law of Moses talks about "Things like feast, food laws, offerings and sacrifices." You left out the 10 Commandments, the death penalty for man-on-man sodomy, and many other important things. I fail to see the relevance of this line of discussion, but still, your statement was very misleading regardless.
  * ...insulted me by comparing my post to stuff from "fox news or /r/circlejerk" while simultaneously forgetting to tell me specifically what I did wrong.
  * ...brought up some irrelevant musings about faith and science.
  * ...perhaps didn't read my entire post, particularly the last line?
[ * ...have numerous grammatical and spelling issues. It's the internet, though, so that's not a big deal.]

Re:April fools

[MightyMartian]

It's called omphalism, and the minute you invoke it to explain away inconvenient time spans, you open the door to concepts like Last Thursdayism. If God can make a 6,000 year old universe look 13.8 billion years old, then why not a six second old universe look 13.8 billion years old? At the end of the day, it's just another form of epistemological nihilism

Re:April fools

[Joce640k]

Direct quote from the man:

“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 5:17-20

So...how many Christians do you know who follow all the Old Testament laws? Your new mission in life is to learn a few and point them out at every possible occasion. Ask them why they aren't out stoning children to death, etc., as stipulated in their laws.

Also ... next time you see a Christian with an iPhone or a car you need to remind them that they're supposed to sell all their worldly goods and give to the poor. God will provide, it's harder for a rich person to enter heaven than to pass a camel through the eye of a needle.

Don't feel bad about doing it, their immortal souls are on the line...

Re:April fools

[noodler]

", but if a God did create something to look 14 billion years old, then that's how old it would look despite our best testing."

But that would make the god a very childish one, for wanting to fool us this way.
And besides, we are then nothing but puppets for its ammusement, aren't we?
I mean, he had absolute power to design us like he wanted and yet he gives us black death and cancer and aids.
I mean, why all the needless suffering?

Re:April fools

[MadFan]

But I am serious! Gay butt sex between loving men is fine for Gentiles [== not(Jews)] post-Jesus. For while it is written in the Law of Moses that

If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads. - Leviticus 20:13

it is also written in the New Testament that

...some...said, "The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to obey the law of Moses."

[The council concluded] we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God [by requiring them to follow the whole Law of Moses]. Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood." - Acts 15:5, 19-20

Now sexual immorality is a rather vague phrase which I take to mean rape and generally non-consensual sex. You might be a little confused by the scattered references to homosexuality in Paul's letters which seem to imply that homosexuality is sexually immoral. However,

Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders ... will inherit the kingdom of God. - 1 Corinthians 6:9

discusses homosexual offenders, that is, people who break the law. Since sodomy is not illegal in my country, we're fine there. Next,

What a cop out. The above quote in Leviticus 20:13, sets the law from God. Arguing that it isn't against the law of USA doesn't mean anything to the "kingdom of God". You could argue that in some African country it is legal to rape and kill, and hence "we're fine there", Next.

For the law was not intended for people who do what is right. It is for people who are lawless and rebellious, who are ungodly and sinful, who consider nothing sacred and defile what is holy, who kill their father or mother or commit other murders. The law is for people who are sexually immoral, or who practice homosexuality, ..., or who do anything else that contradicts the wholesome teaching that comes from the glorious Good News entrusted to me by our blessed God. - 1 Timothy 1:9-11

Here one must practice homosexuality for it to be a sin. The people I was imagining weren't actively practicing their technique; they simply did what came naturally. Some translations don't even list sodomy/homosexuality here, so the interpretation is also debatable. Finally we have,

Here one must practice killing their father for it to be a sin. If you only do it once then it isn't a sin because you only killed your father once. About "what came naturally": The argument here is that homosexuality isn't normal. The argument goes along the lines of a male is designed for a female. and the union there of is a symbol of the relationship of God to Jews and Jesus to Gentiles. Because some closed closet homos decided to rewrite verse to make homos not listed there, doesn't subtract to what was written.

...God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. - Romans 1:26-27

This one is trickier to interpret correctly. What is an "indecent act" or a "natural relation"? For gay men, an indecent or unnatural act would be sex with a woman.

I call BS on that. There isn't Male, Female, Gay, Les, there are only Male & Female. For a gay man it's still an unnatural act even if he prefers & love doing it.

The men u

Re:April fools

[SirSlud]

Shit is rediculous, but don't muddy the waters in suggesting this is a free speech issue.

Re:April fools

[thejynxed]

The Bible is actually an exciting read in places though...murder, suicide, incest, rape, pillage, giants, midgets, wizards and witches, vengeful deities....

Someone should turn it into an AD&D sourcebook...you'd make lots of $$$ just in modules based on the Old Testament.

Re:April fools

[g0bshiTe]

If only one guy was convinced Obama is the spawn of Satan how educated could the state actually be?

Re:April fools

[Grishnakh]

I disagree, for all three of those cases. I think the people in the more rural parts would all like to separate from those cities, as the cities dominate their politics and make all their laws (since the cities have so much population). However, I don't think the politicians in the cities want to lose control of the rest of the state; they get tax revenue from those places, as well as control of natural resources.

I do personally think the country would be a lot better off overall with those cities made into city-states, however.

Re:April fools

[Grishnakh]

Except that, from what I've read, Mass. is actually not very close to the top of the list for high-tax states. Obviously, compared to places like Wyoming, it's high, but compared to New York, Illinois, and California, it's pretty cheap. Mass. is probably somewhere in the middle.

Here's some figures showing where states rank in various taxes:
http://modernsurvivalblog.com/retreat-living/lowest-to-highest-taxes-by-state/

Re:April fools

[Grishnakh]

It seems to me that counties with a population of 500k need to be broken up. We have that here in AZ, with Maricopa County having most of the Phoenix metro area (~4 million). It's so screwed up that they have a redistricting commission figuring out how to gerrymander^Hdraw congressional district lines, which are all inside the counties, because there's no way to divide the state's 14 counties (two of which are huge with Phoenix and Tucson, the rest of which have little to no population) evenly among the Representatives. Heck, every time I use one of those web forms that lets you send letters to your Representative, I have to give a full street address because the Congressional district line splits my ZIP code.

Re:April fools

[Grishnakh]

NY isn't relatively high-tax, it's absolutely high-tax. It's probably in the top 3 states for taxation according to the sources I read. Of course, YMMV, since sales taxes and property taxes vary a lot between counties and municipalities and the articles like the one I listed above can only average them together (without making an article the size of War and Peace), and also because different people have different circumstances so the taxes will hit them differently: retired people don't care as much about income taxes, and property owners care more about property taxes, for instance.

Just going off what I read in that one article, the highest tax states appear to be NY, NJ, IL, and CA. MA seems to have even lower taxes than Arizona where I live, except for the property tax, but our sales and income taxes are higher than Mass's. But the property tax one is hard to figure too; the property taxes here in Phoenix are likely much higher than in Navajo territory, for instance, but the number in the article is an average.

Re:April fools

[Grishnakh]

What's interesting is I actually used to live in Virginia, and was even born in Fairfax County, so I'm a little familiar with it. VA has a LOT more counties than AZ, probably close to 100 IIRC (I also used to live in TN, and remember there were 95 counties there). Things are very different that way from the west coast states like AZ and CA, where counties tend to be huge. There's only 14 of them in AZ, and many of those are bigger than many east coast states in land area, though are frequently unpopulated and mostly open desert.

So one problem I see is that breaking Fairfax Co. up would create even more counties in VA, though it's probably still better overall. Maybe the least populated counties should be merged with neighboring counties to make up for this (subject to approval by referendum of course). There's some counties in central VA that have zero or maybe one stoplight in the entire county. A county that small should probably be merged with another county, as it obviously doesn't have the revenue base to really exist on its own effectively and efficiently. If they can't even afford a friggin' stop light, how do they afford to have a courthouse or jail or run their government?

I would like to see a redrawing of State lines however, something like what was proposed with the 38 States. Fewer states would be more efficient than 50 states, and redrawing them this way would make their populations more equal too so you don't have giant states like NY and CA dominating the elections, plus make government in those areas more responsive by trimming it down (people in Napa Valley shouldn't have to fight with people in San Diego over things; the fact that they're in the same state is entirely a historical accident). Of course, the 38 States proposal needs some modification because things have changed significantly since 1975, with a lot of population moving south and a lot of immigration into the southwest, but the idea is sound and the fact that many state lines (particularly these out here in the West) were drawn for bad reasons, with zero regard for local culture, hasn't changed. All the lines out here are straight lines along an arbitrary parallel, after all.

Nobody...

[Lord_of_the_nerf]

...puts T-Rex in a corner.

Re:Nobody...

[ohnocitizen]

T-Rex would be as bad at dancing as boxing or pushups.

Hmm

[lightknight]

And there was a time when people would strive to find things that challenged them, if only to learn more about themselves.

Re:Hmm

[cpu6502]

RTamerica has more about WHY they did this. The reasons ALMOT make sense..... if you want children to grow-up with no ability to deal with stressful words/ideas.

"Dinosaurs were thrown out, for example, as they call to mind evolution, which might upset fundamentalists. Birthdays shouldnâ(TM)t be mentioned because they arenâ(TM)t celebrated by Jehovahâ(TM)s Witnesses. Halloween appeared on the black list as it suggests paganism. Dancing is taboo, because some sects object..... Terrorism was considered too scary. Poverty is on the forbidden list as well as words that suggest wealth because they could make kids jealous. Divorces, as well as diseases, are also set to be forbidden in order to not traumatize kids having relatives who split from spouses or are ill.

"Officials say they are simply trying to avoid topics that "could evoke unpleasant emotions in the students.' " - http://rt.com/usa/news/school-test-list-ban-656/

Re:Hmm

[jamstar7]

I'd love to know how they can call this 'No Child Left Behind' if they're never picked up in the first place. Seriously, they expect their kids to compete in the Real World when they can't teach natural history, history, science, and math?

Oh, well, it was an interesting civilization while it lasted. Time for my Mandarin lesson...

Re:Hmm

[Genda]

What would a person have to believe in these days to even get a rise out of society... perhaps this?

More important, why are we letting the mouth breathers and knuckle draggers dictate what our children will experience? Are we in fact trying to homogenize our young into a consistent state of profound stupidity? Is that now the goal of public education?

Re:Hmm

[Obfuscant]

More important, why are we letting the mouth breathers and knuckle draggers dictate what our children will experience?

Slow down. City-mandated standardized progress tests should not be the only thing that your children experience. You get to dictate what they experience at home. The "professional educators" get to dictate what they experience at school.

That latter statement is why "we" are letting TMB and KD dictate, because we've turned the education of the children over to professionals that get paid to keep studying what the best way to educate children is. "Common sense" would mean an end to almost all education degrees and grants for education research.

I lived through the change from "old math" to "new math". I saw the math that kids were being taught a few years ago and it bore no resemblance to math as far as I could tell. I no longer wonder why high school graduates can't figure out your change when they sell you a burger.

Now, for the people who are insulting the yokels upstate and blaming them for this, if you read the fine article, you'd note that it is New York City officials calling for this, not New York State or Syracuse or Albany or Buffalo or Rochester.

Are we in fact trying to homogenize our young into a consistent state of profound stupidity? Is that now the goal of public education?

We are trying to equalize outcomes because equal outcomes is a measurement proxy for equal opportunity. If all the kids get the same score on tests, then they all obviously had equal opportunity to learn. (If there are 5% of male students playing school-organized softball then "equal opportunity" means that there will be 5% of female students playing school-organized softball. Even if only 1% of the female students want to play softball. This IS how schools are evaluated in Oregon.)

Equalizing outcomes means slowing down the faster learners, thus bringing the average down, further lowering the "average standards", slowing the faster learners down even more. We're seeing the unanticipated consequences of valuing self-esteem over knowledge.

Nuts

[Anonymous Coward]

You know something is wrong when real life seems like a South Park episode.

Re:Nuts

[alonsoac]

If I saw this in a South Park episode I would say "haha that's funny, 'cause it would never happen in real life". I guess it is that funny after all.

Re:Nuts

[Bodhammer]

http://www.dilbert.com/blog/entry/the_one_that_didnt_get_published/

As a responsible teacher...

[Anonymous Coward]

I now feel the need to write a single test question that involves every item on this list.

Aren't they missing something?

[Hartree]

Shouldn't they just ban the tests, since tests make many students feel uncomfortable?

Re:Aren't they missing something?

[Anne_Nonymous]

Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning?

Re:Aren't they missing something?

[MachDelta]

My PolSci prof went on a rant today (after explicitly singling out the Education students) about how teachers are actually glorified HR managers trained to "identify problems and then direct them towards a specialist" in order to conform and "normalize" children, and that any "learning" that happens along the way is purely accidental. Then he accused the entire class of being illiterate (having seen several of our written-in-class short essay/exams) but clarified it by stating that no one needs to learn learn to spell anyways; we just need to learn to use a computer (eg: spell check).

It was part of a larger rant on historicism, positivism, and the soulless guts of a technological society.

He's a pretty entertaining prof.
His exams do suck though.

Great

[Cosgrach]

This is about the stupidest thing that I have read all day. These people need to grow up.

Re:Great

[Geof]

I would really like to believe what you say. But a brief web search did not turn up any rational explanation. I have mod points to spend, but you won't get one - even if you're right - because I'm left asking for a citation.

Re:Great

[interkin3tic]

These people need to grow up.

Poor choice of words. Adults are far more bitchy when it comes to hurt feelings than kids. Kids cry it out when their feelings get hurt, 5 mins later, they've forgotten about it. Grownups make idiotic, shortsighted changes in the laws when they get their feelings hurt.

Re:Great

[timeOday]

This isn't about bitchiness, it's just another stupid sensationalist headline amplified by slashdot, as usual lately.

None of these things are banned from curriculum, nor are they banned from being spoken of our taught.

The purpose of avoiding emotionally-laden terms on standardized tests is prevent biasing the test against any students. It is amply proven that emotional influences interfere with what the test is supposed to be measuring - knowledge and ability. Since this impact would be different on kids with different cultural backgrounds, those questions would be biased one way or another. This is simply a matter of good test design by eliminating unwanted variables.

But whatever. Everybody go back to your ignorant whinging. No need to know anything about what you're commenting on when you've got "common sense" on your side.

Re:Great

[bmo]

Oh look, if I look at CBS New York, there is a fuller article saying that it is a list of suggested words that may be banned from tests.

And the CBS story has the whole list of words being mulled over.

In other words, the debate over what should on the list is ongoing.

The reason for this is that you want to make tests that are fair to everyone. If you're going to make a math test with word problems, you don't bring up the subject of murder. The obvious drawback is that it makes tests boring. Big fucking deal.

TFS and The Post has taken this to mean they are already banned and that this is just more "educrat nonsense" and it's written in such breathless style (they even use the word bizarre to describe it) merely to be inflammatory. It's journalistic porn.

While I agree the list, as it stands, is sub-optimal, it doesn't mean that the list is final and that it's probably likely that the list is going to get a lot shorter.

http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2012/03/26/war-on-words-nyc-dept-of-education-wants-50-forbidden-words-removed-from-standardized-tests/

I told you there was more to this, but hey, let everyone believe the fucking Post. The Post is in the business of selling newspapers, not news.

--
BMO

Re:Great

[Grishnakh]

Not only that, but if it were some ultra-conservative organization reporting on it, they'd at least leave out the part about dinosaurs since they agree with the ban on that.

Leaked question

[Anonymous Coward]

Question: A man walks into his house and flips the switch to his 60-watt lightbulb for 8 hours. How many kWh does the lightbulb use?

Answer: None, because his electricity was disconnected several months ago due to the economic downturn.

Re:Leaked question

[Obfuscant]

Question: A man walks into his house and flips the switch to his 60-watt lightbulb for 8 hours. How many kWh does the lightbulb use?

Answer: you cannot answer the question because the lightbulb is a modern CFL that is rated at 60W for light output but uses much less energy. The amount of energy depends on the specific brand and how modern the bulb is. Oops, the correct answer is "close to zero" because the CFL just burned out, but the electronics in the base still draw current anyway. (For "lightbulbs" that last so long, I seem to be replacing them on a regular basis.)

I also propose to ban

[gweihir]

"Test", because it evokes unpleasant emotions.
"New York", because it could be associated with stupidity.
"Student", because that could be mistaken for somebody that wants to learn and has an open mind.

Seriously, there is a limit. Modern human beings should have a reasonable level of tolerance for ideas that are not their own, and only reject them after they have looked at them carefully. (Yes, that includes actually looking at creationism and concluding for yourself that it is stupid.) They absolutely must have an open mind for all things scientific.

Re:I also propose to ban

[pseudofrog]

1) Find something I don't like.
2) Assert that it "comes with liberalism."
3) Raaage...raaaaaaaaage on the internet.
4) Pretend that's what Jesus would have done.

Re:I also propose to ban

[Skidborg]

As one of the fundy nutjobs, I'd like to say that this is ban is one of the stupidest things I've ever seen.

Re:I also propose to ban

[Anarchduke]

I guess you aren't as conservative as you thought you were.

Re:I also propose to ban

[JasterBobaMereel]

Problem : Jesus was a liberal... ...well actually he was a communist : sell all you own, give it to the poor, live in a community and share resources ...

Now watch the fundamentalists brains melt ...

Questions on Faith & Humanity?

[malraid]

I hope they get rid of those two. Because I just lost all my faith in humanity. “I Don't Want to Live on this Planet Anymore”

Re:Questions on Faith & Humanity?

[TWX]

NO OUTER SPACE QUESTIONS!

They've banned outer space creatures! You can't do that!

Yea, this helps, all right.

[Cazekiel]

Dinosaurs, for example, call to mind evolution, which might upset fundamentalists; birthdays are not celebrated by Jehovah's Witnesses; and Halloween suggests paganism.

Once again, religious sensitivities prevail over having an eclectic set of experiences in the world around us. And mentioning swimming pools equates to classism? We're asking our kids to not acknowledge things in existence. What next? Closing down art museums because holy-hell, some features paintings with naked people? For real, can we get a grip already? Dinosaurs. They're worried about mentioning. Fucking. Dinosaurs.

Re:Yea, this helps, all right.

[LWATCDR]

This makes perfect sense to me, you see this Dinosaur from outer-space decided to have a pool party for his birthday but no one came. He didn't relize that it was Halloween and all his friends where out trick or treating. Well he was so upset he made a map of his school in and practiced his assault using doom3. Latter that week he followed his plan a put peanuts all over the school and all the students died of allergic reactions. Of course that evil Dinosaur was a Fox news watching Muslim member of the the tea-party. It did happen but the media covered it all up a friend of mine was there and told me. You see real problem was that he was sensitive to EM radiation and the wifi drove him crazy. I blame it on his getting vaccinated as a child Dinosaur from outer space.

Re:Yea, this helps, all right.

[sjames]

They banned mention of Halloween becZause it suggests paganism. How do they suppose that makes the Pagan kids feel? They have just been told (indirectly) by the state that the mere mention of their religion is offensive.

Re:Yea, this helps, all right.

[wisnoskij]

Well simply owning a house makes you above the really low classes. And owning a REAL pool shows that you are at least lowish-middle class levels of wealth and more likely moderately well to do middle class or above. A real pool costs thousands of dollars minimum to tens of thousands (for one you can actually swim in) of dollars and is likely to be the 3rd most expensive thing a normal person would own and any one time (house>car>pool=boat=sports car).
Their are lots of families and whole communities in the US that have never seen a personal pool bigger then those couple hundred dollar inflatable ones.

Not that there is anything wrong with pointing out that the wealth classes do exist.

Re:Yea, this helps, all right.

[interkin3tic]

I'd propose a ban on religion. I'd be willing to settle out of the legislature if religious people would agree to also stop trying to push their legislative agendas on the rest of us.

Re:Yea, this helps, all right.

[Cazekiel]

Agreed, they exist, and yes again, having a house that you're not killing yourself to pay for puts you a bit above. But it's a blanket-statement to equate something like a pool with "being rich". To some, it's simply a goal: "I don't make a lot of money, but I want a pool. Therefore, I'll make a good number of sacrifices over a period of time and save up to get one." That applies to putting expensive rims on cars, GETTING a classy sportscar, whatever else that elicits "man, they must makes millions, the bastards!" assumptions, when maybe, in SOME cases, it's something they simply worked hard for to have.

Not all cases follow those lines, of course.

Re:Yea, this helps, all right.

[Grishnakh]

I think these guidelines don't go far enough. They shouldn't be allowed to talk about people who get 3 meals a day, because that's classist and indicates wealth. They also shouldn't be allowed to talk about people being healthy, because that's classist and indicates wealth. They shouldn't be allowed to talk about cars, since that's classist and indicates wealth, but they also shouldn't be allowed to talk about any kind of public transit, because that's classist and indicates wealth (people in countries like Somalia don't have public transit).

They also shouldn't be allowed to say anything about women not wearing burkhas, because that'll offend someone. They also shouldn't be allowed to mention voting, since that'll offend someone too (even worse if they mention women voting).

A British Test

[dintech]

MATHS TEST FOR STATE SCHOOLS
Name:
Nickname:
Gang Name:

1. Simon has 0.5 kilos of cocaine. If he sells an 8 ball to Matt for 300 quid and 90 grams to Ollie
for 90 quid, what is the street value of the rest of his hold?

2. Damon pimps 3 bitches. If the price is GBP40 a ride, how many jobs per day must each bitch
perform to support Damon's GBP500 a day coke habit?

3. Crackster wants to cut the kilo of cocaine he bought for 7,000 quid to make a 20% profit. How
many grams of Strychnine will he need?

4. Trev got 6 years for murder. He also got GBP350,000 for the hit. If his common law wife
spends GBP33,100 per month, how much money will be left when he gets out?
Extra Credit Bonus: How much more time will Trev get for killing the slapper that spent his
money?

5. If an average can of spray paint covers 22 square metres and the average letter is 1 square metre,
how many letters can be sprayed with eight fluid ounce cans of spray paint with 20% extra paint
free ?

6. Liam steals Jordan's skateboard. As Liam skates away at a speed of 35mph, Jordan loads his
brother's Armalite. If it takes Jordan 20 seconds to load the gun, how far will Liam have travelled
when he gets whacked?

MATHS TEST FOR PRIVATE SCHOOLS
Name:

(If longer please continue on a separate sheet)
School:
Daddy's/Mummy's Company:

1. Harry smashes up the old man's car, causing x amount of damage and killing 3 people. The old
man asks his local Chief Constable to intervene in the court system, then forges his insurance claim
and receives a payment of y. The difference between x and y is three times the life insurance
settlement for the three dead people. What kind of car is Harry driving now?

2. Fiona's personal shopper decides to substitute generic and own-brand products for the designer
goods favoured by her employer. In the course of a month she saves the price of a return ticket to
Fiji and Fiona doesn't even notice the difference. Is she thick or what?

3. Tristram fancies the arse off a certain number of debutants, but he only has enough Rohypnol left
to render 33.3% unconscious. If he has 14 tablets of Rohypnol, how is he ever going to shag the
other two thirds?

4. If Verity throws up 4 times a day for a week she can fit into a size 8 Versace. If she only throws
up 3 times a day for two weeks, she has to make do with a size 10 Dolce & Gabbana. How much
does liposuction cost?

5. Henry is unsure about his sexuality. Three days a week he fancies women. On the other days he
fancies men, ducks and vacuum cleaners. However he only has access to the Hoover every third
week. When will he stand for parliament?

Re:A British Test

[Jeremiah Cornelius]

Brillo! But, it's LSD that you cut down with strych, mate! Coke is don ewith laxitive powder.

Re:A British Test

[jhoegl]

Boy, Gang slang has gotten more "Britishy" since the 90s.

Re:A British Test

[nasalicio]

Congrats, you pass! A+

Why JWs don't celebrate birthdays

[tepples]

There's a reason JWs don't celebrate birthdays. Both mentions of birthdays in the Bible, one in the Hebrew Scriptures and one in the Greek Scriptures, ended up with the birthday boy ordering someone's execution. See Genesis 40:20-22 and Mark 6:21-27.

Re:Why JWs don't celebrate birthdays

[Cazekiel]

My birthday's coming up on Sunday, April 1st. I celebrate it, even though I can't tell you how many times I was subjected to intricate pranks. The worst one? When I was around 9 or 10, my mom came into my room to wake me up and said, "Hey... it snowed a ton last night, and they canceled school," only to leap outta bed, look out my window and see nothing but sunshine and green grass. The scarring. Oh, the scarring... I may as WELL have been executed. Woe is me!

Re:Why JWs don't celebrate birthdays

[darthnoodles]

I was a Jehovah's Witness for the first 30-odd years of my life, and neither me nor the many hundreds of other Jehovah's Witnesses that I knew would have ever been offended by the mention of birthdays in a test. Why are they being over-sensitive in retarded ways?

Re:Why JWs don't celebrate birthdays

[RussR42]

Assholes are like birthdays... every body has ... um, wait...

At least someone is thinking of the children

[viperidaenz]

Next on the list, they should either:
A) Ban children from libraries, or
B) Ban any books than mention any of these subjects

Re:There's always math

[nitehawk214]

So maybe there's hope for them yet.

Kids are afraid of math, that's been banned too.

Test limitations

[danielpauldavis]

Does anyone realize that some test-takers don't know what a "pillow" is? So yeah, the poor kid will stare at some word, wondering what it is, get a worse than accurate score, because the test is testing something that WASN'T TAUGHT IN CLASS. That's what this little rule is trying to avoid. Fair testing for all. 'Bout time.

Re:Barney is fucked!

[Chrutil]

What's 'independant' thought?

I think it's slang for a thought locked inside a necklace.

Years ago ..

[OzPeter]

I knew a woman who worked as a kindergarten teacher. She had a bunch of Jehovah's Witnesses kids in her class. When any of those JW kids annoyed her past her tolerance limit (which if you are a Kindergarten teacher must be pretty high to start with) she would send home a note to the parent mentioning that they would be celebrating another kids birthday that week. When the JW parents saw such notes they would yank their kids from school for that day - thus instant relief! The kicker was that the parents never worked out that they celebrated more birthdays during the year than there were kids in the class.
 
And to dick with the parents some more she used to make sure all the kids knew how to sing "Happy Birthday".
 
On the flip side I once had some JW come to the door soliciting their beliefs .. on Christmas day .. with kids in tow. Talk about cruel to the kids.

Re:Years ago ..

[Cazekiel]

A small part of me says "dude, that's kind of an abuse of power, not sure I agree with that on an ethical level."

A large part of me says "FUCK ethics, give that teach a raise."

Re:Years ago ..

[BitwiseX]

A large part of me says "FUCK ethics, give that teach a raise."

We're marking that insightful now? Listen, I was one of those kids. I took shit about my beliefs from teachers and students alike, and when it comes from teachers it will fuck you up majorly. Having someone you are supposed to be able to trust ridicule you for your beliefs or for your family's beliefs. THAT is cruel.
It is hard to be a JW and go to public schools. It shouldn't be. I thought this was America.

Christians attacking other Christians..... *sigh*

Re:Years ago ..

[Remus Shepherd]

I think the point is that nobody cares what you believe. But if your beliefs are such that you force everyone else to censor themselves around you, then yes, you will draw ridicule. The ridicule shouldn't come from teachers but I'm not surprised that happens.

I can't think of any subject that bog-standard Christians forbid from being mentioned in public. Homosexuals, maybe? The theory that Christ was a black man? No, I've seen fundamentalists discussing that in reasonable tones. The Albigensian heresy? I've never had a public conversation about that, I might have to try some day.

But a subject as mundane as birthdays? If your religion forbids them from being mentioned then I'll happily ridicule you, and you'll deserve it.

(Note: I'm an atheist. Feel free to call me a smug atheist prick, it won't offend me.)

Yet another problem with government schools

[Kohath]

Government schools are not appropriate unless the culture is homogeneous. In in a heterogeneous mix of cultures, government schools inevitably tax a person to pay for compulsory lessons that are counter to his culture's beliefs. This is unjust.

Re:Yet another problem with government schools

[Artifakt]

That's a problem with everything. The position as you state it is a conservative claim, and an extension of similar claims about such things as the National Endowment for the Arts, which inevitably picks some artists viewpoints (and 'art as a form of speech') to favor over others. it sounds pretty logical to many libertarian types.

BUT, it applies to everything! (which is what the people who came up with this argument can't stand to see addressed): The Amish don't want their tax dollars spent on grading high speed curves by the Dept of Transportation. The people who seriously believe the Moon landings were fake don't want a NASA budget just to 'do more fake moonshots'. The Pacifists oppose spending anything at all for the Dept of Defense. The anti-vaccine persons oppose the Center for Disease Control, at least as it stands today. Just ask the nation's 50 million Pot smokers if they want a single dime of their taxes to go to the DEA, or even the BATF, FBI, and others. Many people would claim to oppose a tax on moral grounds if it got them a bigger refund (or whatever) regardless of whether they had an actual moral opinion. If every person has a right to not pay taxes if they run counter to his or her beliefs or alleged beliefs, then there will be next to no taxes at all, and government itself becomes unaffordable. Ultimately, you are demanding absolute Anarchy..

That's fine if you are really an Anarchist. The problem is, are you? Most of the people advancing your argument want it to apply to the parts of government they don't see a need for, and not the rest. Are you willing to apply your argument to Police, Courts, National Defense and such, or just to the things you want "justice tested"
Do you want all taxes to be voluntary, or do you want some of yourrs to be avoidable while mine continue to be manditory?

Re:Yet another problem with government schools

[Kohath]

Yeah, that's why small government is better than big government. There's less injustice.

Since there's no perfect government, your "anarchist" argument is silly. No one is proposing (or could ever possibly propose) a perfect government. It's impossible to optimize to perfection, and the "where's the perfect dividing line?" questions are completely beside the point.

But smaller is better than what we have now. See this Slashdot story as evidence. A class of 10 students with no Jehovah's Witnesses can celebrate birthdays. A class of 10 students with all Jehovah's Witnesses can read from the Watchtower every day. No one is unjustly taxed to support alien or offensive beliefs, nor is anyone unjustly restricted. Clearly, that would be better for everyone involved. Do you want to argue otherwise?

1984, anyone?

[mark-t]

It was intended that when Newspeak had been adopted once and for all and Oldspeak forgotten, a heretical thought ... should be literally unthinkable, at least so far as thought is dependent on words.

Re:Dinoaurs? (sic)

[Cazekiel]

There are big differences between an everyday Christian and Fundamentalist; the most showcased of all differences is that a Fundy has to believe that the Bible is the end-all, no mistakes included way of the world. No picky-choosy, ever. In order to do that, they need to believe that the world (and the encompassing universe) is only 6,000 years old. To acknowledge the fact that dinos existed, with its carbon-dated proof is to instantly dispute the Bible's teachings. Therefore, they will dismiss anything, anything, that goes against one iota of the Good Book's teachings, no matter how much proof is given.

Re:Barney is fucked!

[Anonymous Coward]

My guess is you can't mention that 2 + 2 = 4 either because there might be some offended dilholes that believe 2 + 2 = 5. Honestly, we have all kinds of people out there. Some of them believe some pretty outrageous stuff. While you can try to be polite to people of all beliefs, you really can't try to tailor reality to them. If some religious dude doesn't want to hear about dinosaurs, have him go to a religious school or be home schooled. The rest of us can't pretend there weren't any such things. We would be creating a society of people who lacked basic science information and couldn't compete with people from places where education teaches you reality. If some other person's family doesn't believe in celebrating holidays, that's fine - the family has the responsibility to teach the child why they don't agree with having birthday parties and why it "seems" to the kid like they are the only "mean" family on the block. If someone is upset that they don't have a pool (hell, I don't have one), teach them about the value of hard work combined with a smidgeon of luck.

Reality folks - that's where we live. Believe what you want. My beliefs shouldn't affect you, your beliefs shouldn't affect me. And I sure as hell don't mind having my kids see yachts on a test even though we can't afford one. They can show churches on a test too - even though I don't go to one.

Halloween...

[Aryden]

and Halloween suggests paganism.

You mean the religions that most of the christian holidays are based on in the first place?

Tragedy of the Commons?

[davids-world.com]

This is tyranny of a set of minorities, who all expect to have their irrational beliefs respected and tolerated. Is this another instance of what the ecologist Hardin called the Tragedy of the Commons? By making use of simple, seemingly reasonable demands, a large number of individuals exploits a shared resource (culture, education) up to the point where the total of the actions disables the system. Religious and political freedom may now destroy the education system and with it the environment that makes these freedoms viable in the first place.

I am officially gob smacked.

[bdwoolman]

How do well-intentioned people paint themselves into such ridiculous corners? It really beats me. Unpleasant emotions are part of life. Tests are supposed to be pleasant? Since when? And since when do people need to be insulated from customs in which they don't take part? A JW kids knows he does not get a birthday party. He is probably proud of the fact that he doesn't; that is, if he has bought into his religion and is proud of that. But he should know that other kids do celebrate birthdays and then be taught to be glad for them. No mention of Hanukkah because some celebrate only Christmas or vice versa? Please. And some other kids celebrate Ramadan and Kwanzaa etc etc. It is called diversity and reasonable people think it is a good thing.

Dinosaurs in the fossil record are established scientific fact. Kids love dinosaurs. There is no controversy concerning them. Especially in a public school setting. Has NYC suddenly gone creationist? If this were in Kansas I might not be surprised. But NYC? Whoa. Come on. No school trips to the natural history museum, kids. They teach "science" there. WTF! If somebody's kid freaks because evolution is invoked he should be counseled. Or, if his parents are also freaked, then they can send him to a religious school that provides a spiritual non-scientific view of the universe. Public schools should try to teach facts.

Most kids celebrate Halloween, which has pagan roots. So? So do many religious customs. Candle lighting echoes Zoroastrian fire worship. No one should make a kid participate in Halloween fun, of course. But he should know that some people do like to do so. If a kid feels bad because his parents won't let him. Tough. Kids feel bad all the time because their parents restrict their behavior for religious and other family centric reasons.

Lastly. I do agree about the space aliens. They have no place on a test about the real world because there is no evidence to date that they exist. I will concede that it stands to reason that they are out there (Thanks, Dr Sagan.). But no one has delivered up any credible proof to date. So no aliens for the children. No aliens whatsoever. And that is final.

PS If this is a pre-April Fools joke by Rupe and his no-ethics thugs at News Corp to make us liberals look bad, then I have been punked into a rant. But screw them. Fake news is not funny when it has an ulterior political motive. Hmmm. The more I think about this the more likely I think it is that this nasty story is a News Corp send up. But what the heck. I'll post and be punked.

Re:Barney is fucked!

[Dragonslicer]

Stupid dancing birthday dinosaur.

I say it's worth it then.

Speaking as someone born and raised in NYC...

[Zakabog]

Speaking as someone born and raised in NYC all I have to say is, what... the... fuck!

I did a glance over the summary and thought 'Oh some bible belt city banned mentioning dinosaurs on city tests, hah!' Then I did a double take and read NYC...

We have community pools, the natural history museum that every city school seems to visit (featuring the only thing most kids remember, THE DINOSAUR EXHIBIT) and paintings of the virgin mary made from elephant shit. If there was a place any of these things might offend a group of people, this isn't it!

I can't believe this PC bullshit actually made it past the board of ed without any parents kicking up a shitstorm...

Re:never happen in real life

[TaoPhoenix]

The new secret is to propose stuff so preposterous that it numbs the sanity checkers into a coma and then gets passed. I mean, don't "promote religious tolerance", ban everybuddy's favorite prehistoric animal, Dinosaurs, because ... wait for it... a TurboFundy Christian might be upset.

Re:Barney is fucked!

[ewanm89]

2+2=5 for large values of 2.

But dinosaurs existed!

[Kaz Kylheku]

So you're not going to mention dinosaurs, which existed (rational evidence given by their fossilized bones), because it might ruffle some people who believe in something for which there is no rational evidence?

Say, don't creationists simply believe that dinosaurs were created and are therefore not offended by dinosaurs?

don't overreact to this one

[awilden]

While I acknowledge the apparent insanity of the political correctness that seems to be the cause of this case, these sorts of exclusions are there for a reason. Tests should evaluate the topics they're designed to evaluate, not grade people on how "normal" their family background is. As an example, my mom was a nurse for a head start preschool and when she was going through records she noticed one kid had been labeled as having a low IQ. She could see he clearly wasn't dumb, so she looked into where the label came from. One of the main causes was that during an IQ test the kid was shown a picture of a birthday cake and he didn't recognize it and said it was a candle pie. A little research showed that he was a member of a religious group that didn't believe in celebrating birthdays, so he literally had never seen a birthday cake before.
PCness can certainly get out of control, and it sounds like it has in this case, but this is a serious topic. There are consequences for low scores on tests. This kid had been labeled dumb because he had never seen a birthday cake. When low scores are based on some sort of cultural gap, that's punishing kids who come from social groups that are out of the mainstream. Kids from _all_ social groups should be required to learn the same material, and as an example, I strongly object to parents keeping their kids from being taught evolution because of their religious beliefs. At the same time I think it's wrong to test kids on topics related to evolution (including dinosaurs) before the school has taught you about them.

Re:Barney is fucked!

[Grishnakh]

Or teach them about climatic differences between regions of the country. Everyone and their brother has a pool here in Arizona, but it's a lot cheaper to do so here because you just dig a hole in the ground outside and line it with concrete, plus land isn't all that expensive. Then, you have a pool you can use year-round. In NY, you'd have to build a heated building around the pool to make it usable, not to mention all the power you'll use in heating the pool to keep it from turning it into a block of ice. In NYC, you'd have to be mega wealthy to have the land for a pool.

Re:never happen in real life

[Grishnakh]

Given all the fundamentalist Jews living in NYC, I wonder if they weren't the reason for the ban on dinosaurs. I even had a friend tell me they had to program all the elevators in NYC to automatically go through a cycle on Sundays (or is it Saturdays) to open the door, close it, go to the next floor, open the door, close it, go to the next floor, etc. in a loop, so that Hassidic Jews wouldn't have to use the elevator controls on that day, because their religion forbids them from doing any kind of work that day (but somehow, walking into the elevator is OK).

NYC never seemed like a hotbed of fundamentalist Christianity; that's the southeast and the heartland.

Not pagan, Christian

[Roger W Moore]

They banned mention of Halloween because it suggests paganism.

Hallowe'en is short for "All Hallows Eve" is a Christian feast coming before All Saints Day (see Wikipedia). While it was conveniently timed to coincide with a traditional pagan holiday so was Christmas. Hence Hallowe'en suggests paganism as much as Christmas does.

I suggest a new rule: those put in charge of education should be required to have had one.

Re:never happen in real life

[GungaDan]

Not so. Shabbat elevators can be found all over NYC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shabbat_elevator

For those buildings where the True Believer nutjobs can't afford such a fancy elevator, they can simply bring in a Shabbat goy - a non-Jew to do the "work" of button pushing for them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shabbos_goy

The world is not so small as to be comprised of only "urban legends" outside your realm of experience.