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YouTube Ordered To Remove Videos, Filter Future Uploads By German Court
suraj.sun sends this excerpt from Deutsche Welle:
"YouTube was told by a regional court in Hamburg on Friday not to display seven out of 12 contested clips without permission from the German copyright fee collecting society Gema. Gema claimed that its members were losing money every time their music was being displayed on YouTube. A proper licensing fee between the two sides expired in 2009. The Hamburg State Court ruled YouTube would in future have to install an efficient mechanism to filter out such content uploaded by users or face a fine of up to 250,000 euros ($330,000) for each case, or up to six months imprisonment. Knowing that a foolproof filter system looks next to impossible, Gema is now hoping that Google will finally agree to a new bilateral licensing treaty whereby the collecting society would not get an annual lump sum for the contested videos, but a fixed fee each time copyright-protected videos are watched."
I hope that Google plays hardball, and simply blacks out Youtube for Germany. The resulting user outcry would then be turned against Gema.
Or Google could just block access to YouTube from German IPs and let them see what they've really won.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Especially given gross fiscal incentive to doso.
Just like Grooveshark did, google should just block youtube from germany.
You don't like free advertising, GEMA? Now you get none. Fuck the fuck right fucking off. Germany is only 80M ppl. Youtube wouldn't even feel a dent.
Let's face it. How many videos and comments have been censored by the allseeing eyes of GGle? They use copyright as an excuse all to often. If you want to see stuff, you have to use alternatives. Try Gibiru for instance.
If they can't automatically filter the videos, how can they automatically detect them to calculate the "fixed fee each time the copyright-protected videos are watched?"
This is either a sign of complete, magical belief in technology or judicial incompetence.
Unfortunately I lean towards the latter.
Or its just Germans being German.
"Oh, you hate your job? There's a support group for that, it's called everyone, they meet at the bar."
The Germans are obviously upset with all of the Downfall parodies.
Because if one state in the US is a jackass, it makes us all look stupid.
Guess who looks stupid now.
"... the collecting society would not get an annual lump sum for the contested videos, but a fixed fee each time copyright-protected videos are watched ..."
And then start paying people to watch the videos.
Profit!
No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
Come on, everyone knows that the true name of the E.U. is "Scheinheiliges Römisches Reich Deutscher Nation"
"Gema is now hoping that Google will finally agree to a new bilateral licensing treaty whereby the collecting society would not get an annual lump sum for the contested videos, but a fixed fee each time copyright-protected videos are watched."
1. Get YouTube to give you two cents each time one is watched
2. Go to a third world country/botnet and pay a penny per click to get viewers
3. Profit!
Seriously, pull out of Germany and let the people tell their politicians how they really feel. I imagine they will be welcomed back when a few rules are tweaked.
Sorry, but when Gema is using the courts to force Google into a "licensing" agreement that they've defined on their own, knowing that what the courts have mandated is outright impossible, that's called "UNILATERAL".
GStreamer - The only way to stream!
This is the problem with allowing single entities (no matter HOW they are intentioned) to be the gatekeepers to the internet. It makes the entire system vulnerable to censorship. The more diverse it is, the more resilient it is.
So remind me again: why is it that we seem to want to allow a few giant companies like Facebook and Google to control all our content?
I just can't understand Germany lately. This is a great country with really enlightened people running it for the most part but their positions on IP - software patents (legal in Germany) and draconic copyright measures are just counter to everything else the Germans do in terms of forward thinkingness.
I am guessing it's because they've drunk the IP Kool-Aide and think that all these measures are somehow making for a stronger economy ... or something....
Last I checked, treaties are between governments. Between corporations, those are supposed to be contracts.
The difference is that treaties and governments are supposed to supersede any contracts (e.g. you can't expect a contract of indentured servitude to have any force in the US).
I am officially gone from
This is an interesting dilema for Google. In my opinion google should appeal the descision asking GEMA to provide a filtering algorithm that meets GEMAs demand. If GEMA cannot or will not supply the algorithm the Google should be able to ask the courts to reverse the decision based on the evidence that GEMA has asked google to do something that GEMA themselves cannot do.
if they can't identify the videos, how are they supposed to count the video views?
*baffled*
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
while its still fresh. Imagine the look on GEMA's face when all videos from Germany are blocked or better yet deleted. The applause Google would get from the rest of the world would overshadow what they would lose from cutting Germany off.
If they don't want to do that then at least
by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
I had no idea what FRAND was, but a wikipedia search indicates it covers patents. This is a copyright dispute, not a patent dispute.
END COMMUNICATION
Without youtube most of these people's works would have faded from public view or remained obscure.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
Re-direct all german traffic to servers in the US. Turn off the German ones for a while and save some power.
Only allow those requests to view the 240 version of all videos. Not only will it be lower resolution, but slower than usual, too.
Put a nice big banner above the videos explaining why, with contact information of GEMA.
I had a sucky sig.
I do not have a problem with Google blocking all uploads by German Court (whoever he/she is).
There is no right to feel safe thru security vaudeville at the expense of everyone's freedom, privacy and tax money.
Come on Google. Just block the entirely of Germany!
Google should comply wit the court order by blocking these videos. Ideally, they should block them by redirecting users to videos by bands not controlled by Gema with a message as to why they were redirected. If the users like the redirected videos enough, well that solves the problem completely.
The Christian religion has been and still is the principal enemy of moral progress in the world. -- Bertrand Russell
People still fail to grasp the essential difference between actual property and intellectual property.
If you take my actual property, you are a thief, because I make a loss that I didn't consent to (meaning you have a definite negative impact on my life), and you are responsible for it.
If you take my intellectual property without me consenting to it, you might gain something in the same way as with taking my actual property, but the important part is I don't necessarily lose anything. Thus you had a neutral impact on my life. Now obviously I prefer you to have a positive impact on my life, but really, can I demand that to the extent that I can dictate the terms? Only to the extent that I have to work in order for you to get the intellectual property, i.e. if I have to run the server you download it from, or I have to read or explain or sing it to you. But if somebody else gives you that intellectual property, I don't work for that AT ALL. So I can't demand anything at all, either!
Then the only negative impact you have on my life then depends on my values, on my view on life. Just like when gays fuck each other and some anti-gay person knows about it. He might not approve of it, it might even anger him, but that still doesn't mean he has a right to deprive them of their fun. So you, dear artist, may not like me enjoying your music without giving you the moneys, you may complain about it, but you still don't get to deprive me of that joy just because you would like to.
You are used to surely get compensated by giving your stuff away to some distribution company which will pay you over time. That worked when they could piggy-back your bill on the money they get for doing actual work, like printing a book, pressing a CD, distributing it to stores, hiring people to guard the stuff and taking people's money in exchange for the actual good. I.e. it worked fine when buying plastic disks or packs of sliced trees were the only ways to get your stuff. But that is over! Now the delivery is so cheap and easy that everybody can do it from their own home, free of charge, without thinking about it. Yet you still give your stuff away before you get compensated for creating it. And then you whine about people not giving you any money, people you never signed a contract with, who never agreed to it, as opposed to the labels and publishers. No, there's just a law on your side that basically auto-creates a contract, i.e. without anybody having any chance to define the terms for themselves. That's a pretty weak basis.
You have to come up with something new. YOU have to make sure you get payed for your *actual* work (performing and recording your songs, writing your books) in some other way. Distribution is now essentially free, so don't piggy-back it on that. Find something else. Say how much you want for you *one-time* work, get people interested in paying a portion of that by providing samples of your work, wait until enough people promised to give you their money so you get your money's worth, and only *THEN* release your stuff in its entirety. If you still get donations afterwards, out of shear gratitude, good for you! But you won't need them anymore, cause you got compensated before already. So you also don't have the urge to demand it from people. And call them thieves if they don't comply.
That's because opponents see YouTube as a piggy bank that you can shake and make it rain money.
Obama's legacy: (N)othing (S)ecure (A)nywhere and (T)error (S)imulation (A)dministration
Perhaps I'm missing something, but how would they imprison YouTube? Would all the videos have bars in front of them? Are they going to round up all of Google Gerrmany's employees and send them to prison? Would just the head of Google's Germany office get sent to jail? How exactly do you send a company to jail?
My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
Why the fuck is a court uploading videos?
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
That's for video's specifically targeted at sharing the "infringing" content.
But they also take issue with people uploading their own videos /w copyrighted soundtracks, and how about if I upload a video of myself singing "Song X" (I'm not sure if this is considered "fair use", though it may considered "cruel and unusual punishment" given my singing ability).
How about:
YouTube Ordered By German Court To Remove Videos, Filter Future Uploads
or
German Court Orders YouTube to Remove Videos and Filter Future Uploads
> but a fixed fee each time copyright-protected videos are watched
Gee, there would be any way to game that system, now would there?
The 302 thing usually signifies involvement by the 'church' of Scientology. For reasons unknown, 302 meant something significant to L Ron Hubbard. Read "Battlefield Earth" and pay attention to how many times the number 302 appears. It's kind of weird. Maybe he was a fan of Ford V8s?
As the article mentions, Gema is fully aware that it is almost impossible for Google to implement a filtering system that prevents videos with Gema content from being uploaded. They are using this court decision to force Google to renew a license with them that expired in 2009 and changes the terms of that license so that Google would have to pay Gema every time a video with Gema content is viewed rather than their previous agreement of paying a single up-front licensing fee.
I think Google's best option is to comply as much as possible with the court ruling. Their German distribution system should immediately disable audio for all of their videos and provide a link describing their fear of being fined for any videos that are currently available that contain Gema content. They can explain that audio on all videos will remain disabled until they come up with a proper system for removing all currently available videos with Gema audio and preventing any future videos from being uploaded with Gema content. They should also explain that this will probably take months, maybe years, to complete such a filtering system. This way, Gema's extortion plan backfires (instead of getting more money in licensing fees, they get nothing) and the ire of YouTube users is directed at the German government and Gema (where it belongs).
Based on the article headline, I figured the solution would be simple: Just close the German Court's account so it can't upload any more videos. After reading some of these comments, it sounds like it might not be as simple as that.
The GEMA filter would probably be set to timeout the computer if not melt your hard drive.
Maybe it's just because you visit crap on the tube?
the from youtube section:
-Rios: 'There Are Tons of People in Government' Who are..
(some commie shit? 330 views, no idea why it's here, maybe it was trending just then when I visited the page).
-NORTH KOREA PERSPECTIVE
-New Photo Shows Zimmerman's Bloody Head
-ONLY IN MALAYSIA
etc.
(then there's some minecraft stuff, some galaxy samsung III leak vid, some ps3 reviews which I couldn't give a shit about etc. I think these are mostly composed from page history _outside_ of youtube)
you know what's funny creepy? I'm not logged in to youtube("Create account/Sign in" button is there..).
now, the recommended list makes a little more sense, it's composed from pages I've visited on youtube and pages related to them, some c64 remixes, omf remixes, some elder scrolls history stuff, some old pc game reviews. etc.. the recommended list is the only one which makes sense, however the vids I watch 10 times a day aren't there!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c86USvTJFso (Kris Hatlelid is my new favorite computer game musician)
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
You mean there are German bands other than The Scorpions, Kraftwerk, Ramstein, Nina, and Tangerine Dream? (I deliberately exclude David Hasselhoff, no one likes him except the Germans anyway)
On a more serious note. Google/YouTube is unlikely to negotiate with people attempting extortion. Germany, get ready to kiss YouTube goodbye.
make imaginary.friends COUNT=100 VISIBLE=false
how can per click payment be possible? If they knew it required payment, they would have known to filter it.
this signature has been removed due to a DMCA takedown notice
"...Gema claimed that its members were losing money every time their music was being displayed on YouTube"
I'm lost here... For example, assuming that youtube was the only way to watch videos and all GEMA video was blocked, how GEMA would gain anything if nobody would know that her videos even exist? What these GEMA executives have in their heads?
Religion: The greatest weapon of mass destruction of all time
.. I'd actually welcome something as drastic as preventing german visitors access to youtube. Otherwise the populace will never get that GEMA is to be removed ASAP. But Google will just go least resistance with most revenue and bow. Damn, I hate how little political well doing is done by the powerful Google.
No big deal. I'll bet that German court hasn't uploaded very many videos.
Anyone know that the German Court's YouTube ID is? I did a search and I didn't see anything obvious. Maybe the "uploads by [the] German Court" have all been removed already?
block all music that not release under cc-sa/cc-0 conditions
that would block all established music and allow independent musicians to release their content
It truly the only way you could block all infringement.
Logically, legally, and morally one would think this a good idea.
However, it fails when you have a system that allows audio of wild birds singing in a forest to be blocked/removed because of false claims of copyright infringement. Add things like SoundExchange (US version of GEMA? Or would that be RIAA? Or is GEMA SoundExchange+German RIAA?) that takes a cut from any & all music regardless of the artist's desires (they offer a cut to the artists...they just have to join and strengthen the organization!), and that means such a system is impractical at best.
Jeez Louise, it's a wonder there hasn't been a case filed against someone walking down the street whistling a tune.
Yet.
If OWS wants something to protest against that will make them popular, they should be camping outside all these copyright organization's front doors and harassing *them*, instead of pissing off people trying to get to work and take their kids to school.
Strat
Progressivism (aka US 'Liberalism'): Ideas so good they need a police/surveillance-state to enforce.
What about it?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use
^ Doesn't apply to "here's a video of my dog with some music".
What about it?
WTF? If you don't listen to GEMA music, how would this concern you? If you do, how does not being able to broadcast a song from your childhood change the fact that you heard that song in your childhood, and that you and your pals remember it?
I doubt you know what you want. I really do. You do not want to make posts that make the slightest fucking sense, that's for sure.
So you want to change the world... into a world which is exactly as it is now? Man, I envy your energy for such a huge ball of nothing.
While I agree that the AC's post was a bit "over the top", your reply wasn't entirely accurate either. For one, "here's a video of my dog with some music" is indeed covered by fair use.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lenz_v._Universal_Music_Corp.
The problem is not the person uploading the video. Advertisement dollars earned by Google on the work is the problem.
Gema claimed that its members were losing money every time their music was being displayed on YouTube.
This is priceless. I lose money every time you look at this comment. $250,000 EVERY SINGLE TIME. Please close your eyes when scrolling past the comments section.
Accounting for all this is going to be prohibitively costly. I wouldn't be surprised to see youtube pull out of Germany.
I find it more interesting that GEMA's filters tend to block legitimate publishers on youtube more often, like VEVO. Also, are you not familiar with other cases such as these?
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
How will you block people who ignore these terms and upload anyway?
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
Because Google is already blocking videos GEMA highlights and their automated detection systems flag. Google doesn't want to host any of GEMA's content to German users is the issue.
Change is certain; progress is not obligatory.
I wonder just why some people here seem to think that stopping copyright infringers (impossible) is an end which justifies the means. Here are the usual solutions: cut off internet connections of accused copyright infringers (bad because of collateral damage), use automated systems to detect and remove supposedly copyrighted material (bad because of collateral damage), and then there's always giving copyright holders the ability to do whatever they please (bad because of collateral damage). All of those have a common drawback: collateral damage. If your solution to stop copyright infringers from copying your precious data is a solution which would harm innocents too, you can fuck right off.
Since Youtube makes money off someone else's work, it is only fair that this someone must be compensated for their work.
There is no such thing as Intellectual Property. First commercial use ought to belong to the innovator; after at most seven years, that's it. If one can not find a way to stay first, wtf. I support any and all methods including revolutionary dismemberment of all nation-states, to vindicate my position on this.
I get a lot, and I truly mean that, a lot of video from US colleague, forums or whatnot which tells me "due to lack opf licence agreement the GEMA blahlbha" on youtube. I can't even watch the video SOUNDLESSLY, even the picture is not available jsut a fragging black screen with the GEMA text. Verdammte verfickte GEMA.
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