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Worst Design Ever? Plastic Clamshell Packaging
Hugh Pickens writes "Rebecca Rosen writes that if you've recently opened up — or, more specifically, tried to open up — a CFL light bulb, you can sympathize with the question posted on Quora last year, 'What is the worst piece of design ever done?' The site's users have given resounding support to one answer: plastic clamshell packaging. 'Design should help solve problems' — clamshells are supposed to make it harder to steal small products and easier for employees to arrange on display — but this packaging, says Anita Schillhorn, makes new ones, such as time wasted, frustration, and the little nicks and scrapes people incur as they just try to get their damn lightbulb out. The problem is so pervasive there is even a Wikipedia page devoted to 'wrap rage,' 'the common name for heightened levels of anger and frustration resulting from the inability to open hard-to-remove packaging.' Amazon and Wal-Mart are prodding more manufacturers to change their packaging to cut waste. 'We've gotten e-mails from customers who've purchased scissors in a clamshell, which would require another pair of scissors to open the package,' says Nadia Shouraboura, Amazon's vice president of global fulfillment. Other worthy answers to the Quora question include the interfaces on most microwaves, TV remotes, New York City's parking signs, and pull-handles on push-only doors, but none gained even close to the level of popular repudiation that clamshells received."
I've had plenty of terrible times trying to get things out of plastic clamshells. I've also had no trouble at all... when they don't press seal the entire circumference of the package. If they just use a couple press locks (maybe with a touch of adhesive or a staple), these packages aren't bad at all. Why they insist on hermetically sealing them, though, that is baffling to me.
.. and you guessed it.
Comes in a nice cardbox box : http://the-gadgeteer.com/2009/08/10/zipit-clamshell-package-opener-review/
EMail: 0110001101100010010000000110001101110010 0110000101111010011011100110000101110010 0010111001100011011011110110
For every iPhone sold there is at least one package. Absolutely THEIR fault.
The nice thing about clamshell packaging is that it clearly displays the product itself, and usually so you can see most or all the sides of the product. This is in many ways better than a cardboard box with a couple of printed pictures on the outside.
I'm sure I'm not the only one who has pried open a cardboard box in a store to get to the product inside to see what it actually looked like. Clamshell designs largely prevent that.
The fix is to make them possible to open by hand. Many clamshell packages have a perforated panel on the back you can simply pull open. That's a pretty good design.
Clamshells have been on their way out for a while now.
Here is an example of what is replacing it.
http://www.hpcorporategroup.com/the-benefits-of-natralockr-paperboard-packaging.html
Don't know something? Look it up. Still don't know? Then ask.
when trying to open those packages with scissors, knives, screwdrivers, laser cutters, C4 then finally a nuclear bomb and the package is still not open
I agree, I hate the plastic clamshell anti-theft junk because it wastes so much plastic. These need to go away. Usually how I open them is I take a kitchen knife or pocket knife and just cut straight through the packaging right above where the object in it rests, take the object out, and the dump out anything else in it through that opening.
We'd see a quick end to this crap if stores were required to open packaging at point of sale and then put a "opened by" sticker over it. Like when you buy pre-packaged sushi, meat, and stuff, so that you aren't harassed about potentially having stolen it.
I got a handy little tool from Think Geek called "The Plastic Surgeon" that works pretty well.
Ignorance killed the cat. Curiosity was framed.
If you're a shoplifter, and you need a pair of scissors (or more likely, a bolt cutter) to open the package, they have succeeded.
After all, once the damn thing is paid for, the manufacturer certainly doesn't care how hard it is to open. They've got theirs. Whereas losses from pilferage take (prospective) money out of their pocket, so THAT is not gonna happen if they have any say in the matter.
Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
I just use a wire cutters on everything.
My nominee would have been the user interface on substantially all computer projectors. At a typical meeting I attend -- the type of group doesn't seem to matter -- the first ten minutes is usually spent trying to figure out how to get the projector to work. "Is it on?" "Is it off?" "Is it plugged in?" "Is it warming up?" "Is it cooling down?" "Is the bulb bad?" "Is the cable bad?" "Is it receiving anything from the laptop?" etc. Not to mention the eleventeen connectors and plenty-two buttons, when all anyone ever uses -- at least in my experience -- is a PC laptop cable and the on/off switch.
Whether it's a group of administrative assistants, football coaches, electrical technicians, farmers, or Ph.D. computer scientists, it's always the same. My kingdom for a projector that has a nice little LCD that tells me its present state, and what I need to do to either (a) see my presentation, or (b) turn it off, from there.
...and the little nicks and scrapes people incur as they just try to get their damn lightbulb out.
Not to mention the estimate 6,000 - 7,000 people a year who get cut badly enough to seek treatment in emergency rooms!
I remember a few years back an, only available on TV, ad for a special pair of scissors specifically designed to open these packages and yes it was sold in one of them.
Undetectable Steganography? Yep, there's an app fo
I use a pair of scissors (or a utility knife in a pinch). The advantage is i can use them for other things and they don't require batteries. I hate those packages as much as the next person, but they really don't require a custom designed opening tool.
It seems a bit unfair to call plastic clamshell packaging the 'worst design ever' just because the collateral damage don't like it very much...
It can be inexpensively vacuum formed from plastic sheet stock, easily machine cut and sealed, allows items to be presented for display in a retail environment, and makes it harder for the small-but-valuable stuff to wander away. From the perspective of the actual customer(ie. the one who buys clamshell packaging, not you, you peon) it's actually quite a successful design.
Obviously, it is out of place in mail-order environments, and now that a large amount of merchandise gets moved that way, I assume we'll see dedicated 'warehouse-only' packaging come to the fore; but clamshell has been phenomenally successful on the shop floor.
In other news, shell-shocked civilians describe high-explosives as 'pretty lame' and 'about the worst ever'...
Plastic clamshell packaging has always been a nightmare from an end-consumer's perspective, and yes, there's lip-service paid to changing things in the words of major retailers and consumer goods distributors, but it's not likely to change because of "wrap rage." Clamshell packaging is adored by the retail industry for a handful of reasons:
A.) Product visibility: transparent plastic packaging that hugs the product, displays it prominently, and can showcase it visibly with flashy liners and inserts is just loved by marketing departments. Using corrugated boxes, trays, or cartons just isn't sexy if you're pushing a mostly-commoditized consumer good.
B.) Tamper evidence and loss prevention: opening boxes is easy. Opening a clamshell is difficult and noticeable, particularly if you're an unscrupulous retail employee trying to get the widget out of the package and into your pockets without the embedded loss-prevention device (RFID, etc.) coming with it.
C.) Cost of packaging: getting something into paper or corrugated boxes and cartons is a slow and expensive process, in terms of unit throughput, materials, and equipment/process complexity. Mechanical fastening (staples, etc.) is slow, adhesive application systems aren't cheap and aren't much faster, and self-seal packaging comes with a host of other issues that contribute to waste and cost. By comparison, a clamshell packaging process can be quick, with a minimum of material and significantly less scrap.
Until boxes are cheaper and faster - until the cost per unit in time, money, materials, and processing is lower using paper packaging than clamshells - those nasty, finger-slicing hunks of PVC, PET, and polycarbonate aren't going anywhere.
Karma: Excellent, but still won't get you laid.
http://boaty.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/bare.jpg
a knife works too. the problem is that you don't have one while at the office, bus-stop or wherever.
theft prevention and being cheap as fuck to put together are the reasons for these horrible packages though.
world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
But what part of this news makes it nerdy ?? I am little confused.
-- It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. -- Aristotle
Personally I don't like their charge up time.
I'll turn one on and it'll be five minutes or so before it's at full strength.
Used both cheapo dollar store ones to more quality GE and Phillips brands. I just refuse to use them now.
Just pierce the casing with a knife in a flat spot, it tears apart easily from there. Having said that, that packaging truly sucks.
Use a can opener.
Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
Scissors
I'm here for the experience, not the Hyperbole.
Hi -
The wonderful HBO series "Curb Your Enthusiasm" worked this idea into a storyline in season seven.
Here is some of it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R8HZbWusMDI
- Tom, Redondo Beach, California
I wonder what's more difficult?
Writing is, quite literally, child's play. Plastic clamshell packaging, on the other hand, is child-resistant, if not actually child-proof.
Might help us see your point if you gave us links for these claims.
Steve Magruder, Metro Foodist
They suck. If the only think wrong with a CFL bulb was the "clamshell" packaging, I'd actually be happy. I saw on youtube last night of a bulb covering a bathroom with smoke/soot as it burned-out (normal operation according to the manufacturer). It cost the family thousands of dollars because they wanted to save a few pennies.
How full of shit is he Johnny? Well, Bob, he's pretty darn full of shit. Nothing in there indicates it could cover a bathroom.
That is exactly what a filthy pirate who is smuggling counterfeit light bulbs would say!
Who leaves the house without at least one knife?
I went to Golden Coral with my family on mothers day and was unable to cut the steak with the butter knife they provide at the table. I wouldn't have been able to find the edible half of that slab of gristle without my razor sharp folding pocket knife.
We've gotten e-mails from customers who've purchased scissors in a clamshell, which would require another pair of scissors to open the package
I wonder how many people ran into this problem, and went to the store to buy another pair of scissors, only to get home and realize they still have the same problem :P
What do I know, I'm just an idiot, right?
There's many CFLs in my place-of-residence and the few that have gone out have done so not with expelled smoke, soot, or a bang, but a harmless flicker (though the bulbs do turn black in one or two parts near the base as they near their end of life). They've also lasted MUCH longer than the incandescents (months or years, instead of weeks).
Maybe I've been lucky, but you'll find no loathing of CFLs from me.
You can hold down the "B" button for continuous firing.
Why don't you have one at the office or bus-stop?
I always have my skeletool in my pocket. Pocket knives are cheap and extremely useful tools. I suggest keeping one in your towel.
I got a handy little tool from Think Geek called "The Plastic Surgeon" that works pretty well.
Did it come in a plastic clamshell package?
Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
It's called a KNIFE!
-- By all means let's be open-minded, but not so open-minded that our brains drop out.
4 1/2 inch blades and very heavy (nearly a pound) duty. Makes short safe work out of this kind of package.
All your database are belong to U.S.
It was designed by the space devil.
http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2002/09/30
Whereas losses from pilferage take (prospective) money out of their pocket
As do losses from people not buying your product because they don't want the hassle of dealing with shitty packaging.
There were 243 million CFL's sold in the US in 2009. And there were 34 reports of smoke, and 4 reports of fire in a US consumer product safety database from March 2011 through December of 2011 (see this article for more information). Seems like a pretty safe product to me.
In terms of your supposition that CFL's actually cost more than incandecents? Here is a study that says no, In terms of the ACEEE.org study, I can't find specifics (unless you are talking about the 2006 study, which is hopelessly out of date). But electric cars top the ACEEE.org list of cleanest cars this year.
Pinto?
blindly antisocialist = antisocial
I'd like to see a law that stipulates that any store that offers products in plastic clamshell packaging MUST be willing to open all of the packages in the checkout line (no "go wait in a separate customer service line after paying") at no extra charge. Those packages would be gone within a year.
Right now, clamshell packaging is a huge win for the store, but all of the customer frustration is an externality. By forcing the stores to deal with the externality, we align store interests with consumer interests.
--
Don't hand it over.
I give them the option of calling the police and having me searched by a police officer or I shall give them the receipt and items back in exchange for a refund. I bought this crap, it is now mine and they have no right to search.
The only way those cases stopped the drug addicts I knew as a teen is if they were LARGE; otherwise it all fits into a coat well enough. They sure have enough cameras now in the mega stores everybody goes to...
My complaint is they use #2 plastic which is not recycled in my area (but bottles they take - because those are almost always #2) and #2 has no solvent glue so I can't make that much with it - yes, I keep large packaging for using later. If they use it, it should be a bioplastic that can dissolve within my lifetime... but not that evil plastic being used today where they just use a weak binder in conventional plastic so you end up with microscopic plastic particles that last for centuries, which are already showing up in every creature on earth (including us... the large portion of which is thought to come from CLOTHING plastic not from broken down large items!!! BTW, #2 is polyester so is #1.) I've always had a horrible time thermowelding #1 and #2 but its supposed to be possible if you get the temp just right.
I think the "cheap as fuck" bit is probably the most important, since many clamshells still use press-locks instead of hermetic sealing (and press-locks are obviously useless at theft prevention). These things are probably very easy to set up a fully-automated assembly line to put together, whereas cardboard boxes usually require humans to pack products in.
Except when someone returns the item, the packaging is destroyed and then it's very hard to resell it at full price. It's not the retailer taking the hit on this, it's the manufacturer; places like Walmart do not buy products from mfgrs and resell them, they're actually basically consignment shops for the mfgrs. If the retailer can't sell something, it returns the product to the mfgr, who must reimburse them for the cost of the item.
Swiss army knife. Press through top corner, slice down. Press through other top corner. Slice down. Array package on side. press through top corner and slide down. Voila.
"Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork
Thought not part of the usual obligatory set:
http://thedevilspanties.com/archives/6062
This Space Intentionally Left Blank
These clam-shell packages are useful for brick-and-mortar stores trying to prevent theft, however these same packages offer no benefit for online retailers. I understand that it's difficult for a company to set up different packaging lines based on whether their product is going to an online retailer or a brick-and-mortar retailer, but that's what I'd like to see happen nonetheless.
The receipt check as you leave isn't even because they think the customers are thieves. They treat you like a criminal because they believe their own employees are thieves.
I got annoyed one Christmas and found the perfect tool for opening them, the band saw. Four quick passes and every sealed edge is removed with significantly less danger of injury despite the far more powerful cutting device.
Violence is like duct tape. If it doesn't solve the problem, you didn't use enough.
Just grab a pair of trauma shears. You can cut through a penny with them, a clamshell package isn't a big deal.
I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
The bane of our times: a few people (shoplifters in this case) do something bad, and the immediate reaction is to make life harder on everyone else.
-----
Testing, 0, 1, 2... -- Donald Knuth
Whereas losses from pilferage take (prospective) money out of their pocket, so THAT is not gonna happen if they have any say in the matter.
Nope.
The manufacturer got paid when the shipped it out to the retailer. It's the retailer that eats the cost. Especially since it just goes missing.
For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
having recently purchased some item (don't recall what it was) in such packaging I used scissors to cut the edge off so to remove the item..... only to then realize it had a perfed back and finger hole to grab the back panel and rip it at the perf.........
I got a handy tool called a pocket knife. In the old days it was rare to not have one on you at all times.
Ever try to scan to email lately? Try using the touch panel on a multifunction copier? It's an exercise in frustration and aggravation. Even machines that don't have scan set up seem to go happily along pretending to do something and actually doing nothing. It's an area that's ripe for innovation for any company that can investigate how to build a better UI.
The receipt check as you leave isn't even because they think the customers are thieves. They treat you like a criminal because they believe their own employees are thieves.
More like because they know their own employees are thieves. They just don't know which ones. Of course, they were honest when hired, but employees won't always stay honest if employers get them sufficiently PO'd .
Oh, I'm sorry sir, I thought you were referring to me, Mr. Wensleydale.
Indeed. I carry a Leatherman plus a cheap lockback.
I'd propose that, before approving any type of plastic hard-shell wrap for a product, the company's execs need to be locked in a room for three days with the only food and water available wrapped in the same type of package. If they can survive without the help of knives, scissors or any external tool, then the product can ship.
Hidden cost, hard to quantify, doesn't show up on spreadsheets often.
I want to shoot the idiot that thought a single unlabelled dial was the best interface for a microwave oven.
General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
I think the "cheap as fuck" bit is probably the most important, since many clamshells still use press-locks instead of hermetic sealing (and press-locks are obviously useless at theft prevention).
I've seen a few packages with both hermetical sealing AND press-locks...with the press locks OUTSIDE of the hermetical seal. This would be closer to "stupid as fuck", since cutting away the seal cuts away the press-locks too.
Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
Right, because a burning gas which floats quickly upward is SO much more dangerous than a burning liquid which pools underfoot. The lesson from the Hindenburg should have been that "most passengers survived, let's figure out how to up the number." Instead they went to gasoline powered bits of linen and balsa wood in a quest for safety. Twits!
Oh, I'm sorry sir, I thought you were referring to me, Mr. Wensleydale.
I always keep a cheap folder on me, but there are some places you cannot go with a knife, luckily you don't normally have to open packages in those places.
I hear that pocket knifes are illegal in New York City though, that has gotta suck.
Don't know something? Look it up. Still don't know? Then ask.
I also use this technique.
Ahhh...the great dumpster continuum. Many a free computer will be found there. -- sowth (748135)
I have always heard of these packages referred to as "blister-packs"
Wh47 d1d j00 541, 31337 15n't t3h r0xor5 ne m0r3???
I went to Golden Coral
Well, that's your problem. Coral is known to be hard to cut.
Seriously, though. That is your problem... Going to Golden Corral.
General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
It was mothers day, I didn't get to pick the restaurant.
Other than airports and court I can't really think of any.
NY state has some restrictions, but I do not think even NYC bans them outright. They just have to be under 4" blades and cannot be flicked open.
It's probably not stupid at all; it's probably done for manufacturing. They probably have some machine that folds the package over and presses it closed, and then sends it on to the next machine. Then that machine does the hermetic sealing. The press-locks probably aren't for end-users at all.
You guys seem to be looking at things entirely from the viewpoint of the end-user, and totally ignoring the manufacturer and all the trouble they have to go to to package your widget.
I'm not a big fan of these packages, either. But I have never not bought something because of the package. I mean, its sealed in plastic. I may curse when opening it, but that experience is forgotten shortly after getting the item out.
Usually, yes. I have dealt with clamshell packages where if your knife is any less sharp than a razor you're likely to need considerable force to cut through. An accident waiting to happen.
Why spend money on that when a conventional box cutter works.
First, it is the manufacturer who packages the stuff, not the retailer.
Second, if you want to be treated better as a customer, shop at a better store. If you are getting your receipt checked at the door, you are shopping somewhere whose main claim is that they are cheap. One of the ways they get so cheap is by minimizing shrinkage. Another is by paying a low wage, getting poorly motivated employees. You are the one making the determination 'get it cheap' or 'be treated well'.
Finally, the 'checking your receipt at the door' is not necessarily that they don't trust the customer, it is that they don't trust the cashier. I have had my receipt checked (Sam's club) and there was an item in my cart not on the receipt. They did nothing do me, didn't even ask a single question. Just said 'have a nice day', and didn't make me pay for the item. But the checker did make a note of who the cashier was.
Lamps have infuriating and nonsensical design problems.
1. The switch is almost always put in the most inaccessible of places: behind the lamp shade where you can't see it, can't peek around the shade if the light is on because it's too bright, can't peek around the shade if the light is off because it's too dark, and if you feel around with your fingers you risk being burned by the bulb. Also, most table lamps are set in a position where you really need a second elbow to be able to reach under, across, and back up to reach the switch. A sensible lamp switch should always be visible.
2. Inconsistent activation methods: you've got knobs, pull strings, little pins to push, sometimes levers. Your own lamps you get used to often enough, but any new lamp is always a mystery and takes far too much investigation just to figure out how it works. Particularly when the lever is entirely hidden (see #1 above). A sensible switch mechanism should be obvious at a glance.
3. Poor durability. Despite the fact that every lamp has basically exactly one moving part, that part breaks or jams far too often. I can't tell you how many lamps I've thrown away because the activator either bound up so tightly you can't turn it anymore, or became so loose turning it didn't work the mechanism. A device with a single moving part should have a well-designed part that continues to move appropriately for decades without problem.
4. Poor usability. The activator device is almost always more complicated or less efficient than it needs to be. So many lamps have knobs that are tiny, thin little sticks, which makes it almost impossible to rotate them. (This is the type that invariably binds up, making the situation worse). You should have nice, big knobs or easy-to-grip dongles on the end to take advantage of applied force and angular rotation - it's much easier to turn a screwdriver than a screw, and easier still to turn a wrench than a screwdriver. Most knobs also only rotate one direction, which means if the knob is positioned on the left side of the lamp for righties or the right side of the lamp for lefties, you either need an awkward reach around or to reposition the lamp to rotate the darn thing - not terrible if you only ever reach in from one position, but difficult if you approach the lamp from different angles (both sides of a desk, say, or if one person in the house is a righty and the other a lefty). The push pins are just as bad: you need your hand on one side of the lamp to turn it on, but your hand has to to to the other side of the lamp to turn it off, and you have to fumble around to figure out which side has the pin sticking out. The beaded draw strings are really lousy about catching and jamming. Compared to another very popular on/off switch -- the common wall-mounted light switch -- all of these are badly inferior. I've never, ever had a light switch fail on me, but lamp switches break all the time. (Even the average power button - press once for on and press again for off - is vastly superior.)
5. They're unnecessarily loud. Again, compare to a normal wall-mounted light switch which works silently, the average lamp is surprisingly noisy as it clicks or clacks. I've woken up my wife turning off the bedside lamp at night, and there are enough times that my baby -- in another room, behind two closed doors -- wakes up as I turn off the light that I suspect she can hear it. This is *not* an unusually loud lamp; just the normal sudden clacking is enough in a dark and quiet space to startle someone.
6. Added to the noise is the fact that most lamp shades simply will NOT stay tightened, and also spin and rattle when they inevitably come loose. Being able to change a shade is a valuable option, but I'd say I change one shade a decade. With approximately ten lamps in the house, that means the average lamp shade life span is about a century. Even disregarding that loose math, the default behavior should clearly favor being fixed in place. Much better that it's hard to remove the shade th
The Quirkz Handbook of Self-Improvement for People Who Are Already Pretty Okay
Clamshell packaging sucks from the consumer perspective because most of it isn't designed with consumers in mind. It's designed with retailers in mind. Retailers don't care if you cut yourself opening the package, but they are highly paranoid about the possibility of shoplifting (even though a majority of retail theft is internal).
What surprises me is that there haven't been any large-scale lawsuits over this junk. Fully-sealed clamshell packages deliberately put the end user at a greater risk of cuts (since you need a sharp instrument to open them) without providing any offsetting benefits to the end user. People have gotten themselves on the wrong end of multi-million dollar punitive judgments for much less. A good trial lawyer should have little trouble convincing a jury that a company which deliberately traded off product safety for less shoplifting should be responsible for the human costs of that decision. Especially when everyone on the jury remembers struggling with the damn things themselves.
Alternatively, the CPSC should mandate that clamshell packages must be able to be opened without the use of a sharp implement.
If you're a shoplifter, and you need a pair of scissors (or more likely, a bolt cutter) to open the package, they have succeeded.
After all, once the damn thing is paid for, the manufacturer certainly doesn't care how hard it is to open. They've got theirs. Whereas losses from pilferage take (prospective) money out of their pocket, so THAT is not gonna happen if they have any say in the matter.
I'm surprised nobody has filed a class action suit against them for the packaging. I'm sure more than enough people have gotten hurt or damaged the item itself.
I hear that pocket knifes are illegal in New York City though, that has gotta suck.
Isn't that the same myopic dystopia in which the government thinks they have the right to stop and physically search anyone and everyone they please?
All things considered, I would be more surprised if NYC didn't ban anything and everything a citizen could use to protect themselves from the authoritarian regime; despotic leadership tends to be that way.
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
The thing is, some of the bulbs actually get bright almost immediately, but unfortunately, it's almost impossible when shopping for them in the store to figure out which are the instant-on ones and which aren't. Some of the instant-ons might be labelled as such (if marketers were smart, they would), but I've gotten some packages which weren't labelled like that, and were still instant-on.
The thing I absolutely love about CFLs isn't so much lower electric bills (though I like that too), but the fact that I seem to never have to change them. I've been using the same CFLs now for like 4 years.
Amazon sells stuff in "frustration free packages" - I'm much more likely to buy something when I see that note. It's really weird getting an SD card and holder in a small cardboard envelope, with absolutely nothing else but a sheet of paper (packing list). Weird, but great.
I just cut 'em open. I'll take the trade of inconvenience for product protection because I _KNOW_ I should be carrying a knife (or the far more useful multitool) at all times.
Serrated paring knives work very well. When mine wear a bit, they go from kitchen to "scattered anywhere handy".
These "Vickies" by the way are terrific utility knives. I even take one to salvage yards to cut radiator hose! They last a LONG time.
Search for:
"Victorinox Bulk Pack Paring "Knife 3.25in Blade Black Handle - Victorinox 40600"
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
Tinsnips. No, it's not a sexy purpose-built anit-clamshell device, but it might as well be.
Seriously. $6 for a pair at Walmart, they will last a lifetime of clam shell cutting.
mov ah, 4ch
int 21h
CFLs are sealed in the container so you do not contaminate the store when you drop the package.
If you break a CFL you have a serious environmental problem with toxic mercury vapor. If it is in a hermetically sealed container when it breaks, then you do not have a environmental problem. You really should be careful about where you use these hazardous lighting appliances in your home. Only use them where you are very confident they will not break and introduce toxic mercury vapor into your home--such as in outdoor or garage lighting only.
I was told by an employee at the big home improvement center that if they break a CFL outside of the packaging they have to call in an EPA approved cleanup service. It is very expensive, costing from several hundred to thousands of dollars to get the mess cleaned up properly--depending on the degree of contamination. No joke.
I like these:
http://www.makfasteners.com/Products/ByManufacturer/MidwestSnips/Tinnersnips/MagSnips.aspx
A set of Kitchen Aid spatulas purchased from Costco clad in double-aught polycarbonate cost me a nice Denby butter dish I had purchased at a good price from an upscale consignment store where most of the drippings are better than my best china. I was working my triceps just pushing the scissors through the Kitchen Ache customer-deterrence Hadrian wall. When the scissors finally lunged into the creeping seam, the package lurched 12" inches across the countertop before my triceps released. Butter dish hit the hard ceramic tile and both halves became an instant butter dish crumble. All I really wanted from the package was the superior tongs, not the excessively canted flippers and spoons.
The packaging was so excessive it made the Formula 100 baricade-bundle of individually wrapped TP rolls flush red for being underdressed. Bad Costco. Bad Kitchen Aid. Maybe some entrepreneur could recycle the used package clippings into a razor wire that even the coons will size up with props and a splayed-claw ebonic paw gesture.
If I wasn't at work I would give you links, but youtube is blocked. I'm sure you can find the relevant anti-CFL stuff on youtube & google. It isn't hard. Try "flaws with CFL" or "burning CFL"
My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
It goes both ways. If stores want better customers, treat them right. One big box store is short $10k/year just because I got tired of dealing with their ill-trained door Nazis. I never shop Best Buy, either, because they pull the same crap. I bet the thieves still shop there, though. They're not going to be outraged at being treated like thieves, are they?
Sure, it's fine to vote with your wallet, but it's also fine to tell places that treat you poorly that you're willing to give them business if they treat you well.
Do you have the Instant-Ons?
Got a brand and model #?
>>> I seem to never have to change them. I've been using the same CFLs now for like 4 years.
My CFLs burn-out every 6 months and rarely last longer than the "normal" bulbs. Of course I know why: The CFLs used in normal "right side up" lights will last long, but in ceiling lights, which are positioned upside down, the heat becomes trapped in the enclosure & kills the electronics (the caps swell and leak). I suspect the same would happen with LED bulbs. These modern designs aren't good for enclosed or upside-down fixtures... the heat kills them.
My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
No, that will just persuade the cashier that you're a jerk, make them have a slightly worse day, and unless people do this in numbers, never make it even to the store manager, let alone the manufacturer.
Products in Japan tend to come in packaging that is easy to open and close again (for durable goods anyway).
In fact, I often store some things from Japan in the original packaging because it also makes a convenient case to hold it.
(Japanese FOOD, on the other hand, tends to come hideously overpackaged in many concentric layers of paper and plastic that all goes to waste.)
n/t
There are many tools that can be use to open clam shell packages; knives, scissors, saw , specialty hand tools, specialty electrical tools, etc. So when you buy a pair of scissors in a clam shell you may need to find a knife to open them.
The main point is that patience and care are needed to open the package safely. I have seen people hack at packages with knives and that causes the blade to slip and cause injury. I have never injured myself opening a sealed clamshell; I am careful.
There's an even easier tool to use that everyone already has.
A can opener.
Makes opening these things quick and easy.
Leap seconds. And yes, it can run Linux.
I have a pair of these Open-It shears, and they're one of my more frequently used tools. Work great:
http://www.amazon.com/Zibra-ZPCOPEN-OR-Universal-Package-Opener/dp/B000IHHOVI/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1338583772&sr=8-3
We once bought 30 micro-SD cards for a project at work, which came packaged in annoying, hermetically sealed plastic clamshells. I used our laser cutter to slice around the actual card in each package. Voila!
We're wanted men. I have the death sentence in 12 systems!
Hidden cost, hard to quantify, doesn't show up on spreadsheets often.
OT I know, but am I the only one that hears Mordin Solus' voice when I read that?
"So after all this, you make my case for me. To end this stalemate, you must die..."
I use a chainsaw.
That's stupid design. I have a microwave oven but keep it unplugged when I am not using it. It never complains about not knowing the time (it just defaults to 00:00 when plugged in), I can just heat up the food and unplug the oven again.
Hidden cost, hard to quantify, doesn't show up on spreadsheets often.
Did anyone else read this in Mordin's voice?
"Quote me as saying I was mis-quoted." -Groucho Marx
If you are getting your receipt checked at the door, you are shopping somewhere whose main claim is that they are cheap.
Ever been forced to purchase something at Best Buy recently? They check receipts all the time and sure as hell can't claim their prices are cheap, which is why more and more people are avoiding the hell out of them (to say nothing of the rampant ignorance of their employees).
"So after all this, you make my case for me. To end this stalemate, you must die..."
In the arena of software design, nothing undercuts the Windows Registry as the Worst Idea Ever (for consumers, anyway).
Ok, at least that makes a bit of sense. I was looking at my new Hard Disk packaging wondering WTF just a couple days ago.
Now why the 'OEM' HD needed to be in a very well sealed very large clamshell capable of standing upright on it's own is the next big question. I miss the old reuseable plastic packages these used to come in, at least this time i wasn't saving the old drive.
I use EMT style utility scissors capable of cutting thru seatbelts (or metal) to open this crap.
Stores do not care about 'better customers'. Stores, like all businesses, care about profit. Treating you better costs them real money. $10K/year is revenue, not profit. The profit from your $10K/year is not going to make up for the increased cost to them. To make up that cost they must raise prices, and all the customers who are there solely because the price is low (which is 99% of their customers) and who don't particularly care how they are treated, are going to find somewhere cheaper.
Some places (like Walmart) have a business model that is to attract as many customers as possible by offering the lowest price. Other places have a business model that is to attract very few high-paying customers.
Going to Walmart or its ilk and telling them you would shop there if they treated you better is like going to a high-end dress shop and telling them you would shop there if they lowered their prices. They don't care. Walmart is there to provide low prices, and customer service suffers for it. The high-end shop is there to provide excellent service, and it is reflected in the price. And there are loads of other stores between those two extremes, with varying degrees of service and price.
Forced to buy something at Best Buy? No, never. However, I have voluntarily purchased things at Best Buy recently, and I have always found their prices to be at the very low end for brick and mortar stores. The only time I have ever had my receipt checked at the door was when I had an item that was too large to bag.
Indeed.
Coffee makers need the time, because you can make them do something at a specific time. VCRs need the time, because you can make them do something at a specific time. Many radios need the time, because you can make them do something at a specific time. Automated thermostats need the time, because you can make them do something at a specific time.
There is no way to make a microwave do something a specific time, so NO ONE NEEDS A FUCKING CLOCK ON THEIR MICROWAVE.
This is not goddamn rocket science. This is not, has never been, and will never been the slightest reason to have a clock on a microwave. These only exist because of some sort of ego-trip that microwave makers were on when they were almost the sole device in the home controlled by microprocessor and had an LED display, so it was like LOOK AT MY FANCY COCK! I MEAN CLOCK!
Now, I have no real issue with building clocks in things that don't need clocks.(1) I mean, no car radio has any sort of alarm, so doesn't use the time, but most of them have clocks, but you don't see me complaining about this. But why the fuck do half of the microwave makers seem to assume this is some vitally important function for microwaves to perform and thus require you to set it when the power goes out? (The other half have been beaten with a cluestick and no longer require this.) I don't have to set my car radio time to use my car, or even to use my damn radio.
1) Although I have to question what sort of added power consumption in a microwave that is adding for no reason at all. Hopefully there's some sort of low-power power supply thing going on.
If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
That's Cristian Weston Chandler's favorite place to eat, you insensitive clod!
Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
Yes. The only reason people died during the Hinderburg is that they didn't know what to do, and tried to jump out of the damn thing when it was too high. (Well, except for that poor slob who jumped out at the right time, survived the jump, but then had the thing land on him.)
Of course, they only tried to jump out because the structure was on fire, and they thought it would collapse on them afterwards. Again, the structure was on fire, not the hydrogen...hydrogen explodes, and it floats, obviously, so it's not like it was hanging around to cause any harm. The framework and skin was what was burning.(1)
But is it is possible to have a 100% safe hydrogen dirigible. (Well, barring collision with an airplane or it landing on someone.)
All you have to do is have like five or so separate hydrogen chambers, kept far enough apart that they can't reach each other, and in a way that any explosion is directed straight up, so that it just sorta vents a single giant flame out the top then coasts to the ground.
And build the structure out of asbestos or something.
People forget that, back then, everything caught fire and killed people. Just ask theatre-goers. Nowadays, we can actually build things with fire-stops and emergency doors and whatnot, and the hydrogen explosion and fire isn't going to kill anyone...it didn't even kill anyone back then! The entire damn airship being on fire, thus causing people to jump, is what killed people.
But if we build one correctly, the only danger would be the cabin making an emergency landing on people.
1) Some people assert that the skin was painted with some flammable paint, and I think Mythbusters did something to demonstrate it might be true. But regardless of why everything else was on fire, the fact is that the 'hydrogen' was not. Hydrogen does not sit in place on fire. There might have been holes slowly feeding hydrogen into the fire...but that, as I said, is easily fixed by building an emergency venting system to let it out the top.
If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
But regardless of why everything else was on fire, the fact is that the 'hydrogen' was not.
But, if I'm understanding correctly, one of the reasons that the entire structure set ablaze so fast was because the hydrogen combusted in its entirety very quickly, transferring the heat of the reaction to almost the entire structure practically in an instant.
As you say a hydrogen based airship can be made safe with modern techniques, limiting the effect of any ignition that does occur and using better materials for the rest of the design too. But a different gas being used to impart lift would also have made the day very different.
It depends on the product and the distribution setup they have. Some of the larger retailers have gotten their suppliers to sign off on deals like that.
The manufacturers put it into whatever container the larger retailers ask for. How do you think Costco and Sam's Klub get those oddball sizes that aren't available anywhere else? (OK, actually, Costco runs a lot of their own packaging operations. They buy the shit in bulk and repackage it.)
The hydrogen didn't explode, it burned.
All the CFLs I have seen (and bought) come in cardboard boxes.
But, if I'm understanding correctly, one of the reasons that the entire structure set ablaze so fast was because the hydrogen combusted in its entirety very quickly, transferring the heat of the reaction to almost the entire structure practically in an instant.
No one actually knows why it burned so quickly.
An interesting fact is that hydrogen does not burn at a frequency the human eye can see, except maybe shifting a bit into blue. Whereas, although you can't tell from the black and white footage, all the big flames were red. So all the flames in the footage you see are something else burning.
However, you are probably correct, in that at least the initial hydrogen burning (Which almost no eyewitnesses seemed to have noticed, and we have no footage of, as the cameras hadn't started yet.) heated up the structure of the ship to the point that the flames spread very quickly. It's pretty much the only way the flames on the skin could have spread downward, which they clearly do.
As you say a hydrogen based airship can be made safe with modern techniques, limiting the effect of any ignition that does occur and using better materials for the rest of the design too.
A major problem is that the hydrogen bags were close enough to each other to damage the next one when they exploded, and that they were confined inside the skin together. So the heat of the explosion had nowhere else to go.
Put the hydrogen in long strong 'heat-retardant barrels' with a thin-ish top, without anything above them, and direct any explosion upward. And don't coat the skin with stupid flammable paint.
Problem solved.
Seriously, this was back in the day when no one bothered to protect against fire. Five years later, 492 people would die in a nightclub fire in Boston. No one suggested that nightclubs were untenable. No, we fixed building codes, and actually started enforcing it.
But a different gas being used to impart lift would also have made the day very different.
Well, yeah. For one thing, there would have been no Hindenburg in the first place. The Germans had no helium.
If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
in most cars I've seen, windshield wiper is controlled by a stick to the right of the wheel, turn signal by a stick to the left of the wheel. Different things, although I still occasionally hit the wrong one.
A lot of controls seem to be hybrid - can be turned like a dial (for adjusting), can be pushed like a button (for on/off). Either way, I don't like to fidget with them while driving.
I listen to both RIAA and non-RIAA stuff if I like the music, tangential business/politics nonwithstanding.
The assholes you are used to dealing with (customers and retail store owners/employees) are in no way representative of the average decent person.
In my experience, most people who label themselves and their buddies as "average, decent people" while calling a huge portion of the rest of us "assholes", are actually themselves some of the biggest assholes around.
I should know, because I'm one of them.
How many frustrated consumers does it take to change a light bulb, now?
Curb your enthusiasm
Just bought 2 boxes of CFL, they were in 100% cardboard, no clamshell, just straight cardboard. In fact it didn't even have tape on it.
Let's complain about something more fundamental... CD jewelboxes. Worst. Design. Ever. At least 1/3 of my old CDs from high school and college have broken tabs on their jewelboxes. And the amount of space they take up is unholy. I actually CELEBRATED when some labels ditched jewelboxes in favor of album-like cardboard envelopes.
Then, let's complain about the construction of the discs themselves. I have discs from 25 years ago that barely have a visible scratch. I have a disc I bought last summer that almost became unplayable after I dropped it onto a tile floor in the living room. They've definitely lowered their durability and manufacturing standards over the past few years. It seems like new CDs are as fragile now as LPs used to be, if not more.
I agree. But I never thought of this until I saw someone else do it. It works perfectly. Unfortunately, a box cutter is something you don't usually have in your kitchen. I have to go to the basement work room.
Does the manufacturer even care if their item gets shoplifted? The store carrying it is the one taking the loss in most cases (no pun intended).
>>>>These modern designs aren't good for enclosed or upside-down fixtures... the heat kills them.
>>
>>Then why does the packaging explicitly state that such configurations are ok?
They don't. They say the exact-opposite. "Do not use this CFL in enclosed fixtures." -- That's okay but since the EU Parliament and US Congress outlawed the sale of regular bulbs (effective 2014), what are we supposed to use instead? I guess our enclosed fixtures will just have to stand empty w/ no bulbs.
My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"