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Fedora 18 To Feature the GNOME2 Fork MATE
dsinc writes "It's not just Mint: Fedora will also feature MATE in their upcoming release (Fedora 18). According to Fedora's Dan Mashal, 'many users have expressed interest in this feature since Fedora 15 in which Fedora was switched from GNOME 2 to GNOME 3.'"
This follows shortly after news that MATE 1.4 has been released. New features includes file sharing over bluetooth, updated backends for mate-keyring and libmatekeyring, new themes for the notification daemon, and improvements to the Caja file manager. MATE is being included in Sabayon as well.
Too many people have problems with GNOME 3. Good to have a choice.
. i have been running mate on ubuntu through a ppa but mainline support or even a full spin like xfce and kde have would be nice. hmm Mubuntu?
---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
I was disheartened with the shipwreck that Gnome 3 decided to become, so MATE was a very positive development. And while I'm not a Fedora user (just not my cup of tea), it's a very popular distro, and seeing them adopt MATE added a huge momentum to the project (a bit like when IBM adopted Java - it boosted it enormously).
"The agriculture ministry is not in charge of Gundam" - Japanese ministry official.
Seadog 19 will feature Matey, the DE that comes with a talking parrot (but doesn't support 3D).
Sent from the iPad I found in your car.
Given how many decent, albeit old, chips covered by the Gnome 3 blacklist - this shouldn't be a surprise.
In addition, not much was ever said about the blacklist other than "R100/R200/$chip just can't handle it" without specifying how something that worked in Gnome 3.0 didn't work in later versions. The excuse generally has been along the lines of "STFU and enjoy the fallback, since your chip is too old" without a reasonable explanation of why it even happened. Never mind that Gnome 3 goes out of its way to make sure a blacklisted chipset stays in fallback to the best of its ability - without any opportunity to override.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
Thank you for the outbreak of common sense from the Fedora team. I've been using KDE since Gnome 3 arrived.
2 that is.
Fedora was the first to jump on Gnome 3. They should work on getting the kinks out instead of trying to go back in time or trying to be a crappy Mint wannabe with no codecs. My boxes have been geting switched over to Mageia (from F 16 & 17) because fewer updates and more stable with Gnome 3.
If you take away Gnome 3 and Unity you will lose alot of new linux users. New users want something cool and flashy not something that looks like a clone of Windows from years past.
It IS customized mint desktop.
Famous last words. Whatever happened to trying to be your own original self. Like in what made FOSS great?
This is being blown way out of proportion. We're all acting like this means that Fedora is dropping GNOME 3 for MATE or something crazy like that. From what I can tell they're simply just porting the packages to Fedora, nothing more. Maybe they'll offer a version with MATE as the default configuration, but this doesn't show any signs of replacing GNOME 3 in the future. Lets be realistic and read the articles, folks.
Also, unrelated, but I feel like the GNOME 3 hate is really blown out of proportion. Sure, some users were driven away, but the exact same thing happened with GNOME 2 and people called it trash and crap and whatever else. By the time that GNOME 3 is mature and more stable, it will have a large userbase again. I can guarantee it. I, personally, really love it as it is, especially how easily extensible it is. I don't know another desktop that allows so many customization options through extensions like that. You can really change near everything with a little tweak and you can write one yourself in minutes.
"Our country is not nearly so overrun with the bigoted as it is overrun with the broadminded." -Archbishop Fulton Sheen
Fedora is going to continue to be a Gnome 3 distro. They are not doing anything special with Mate, they are just going to package it for people that wants to install it.
Since when packaging something is newsworthy?
The vehicle driving interface have not changed much in the last 80 years or so. This has not stopped us to innovate vehicles. Imagine that every 10 years or so, car manufacturers decided that a steering wheel and pedals are out of fashion and should be replaced by something fundamentally different.
The mess we have today in many fields is related to our priorities as a specie. We placed eyecandy before efficiency and this means we place a tremendous amount of energy in entertainment, games and trendy gadgets that sole goals are to steer attention away from real problems by having an entertainment industry so huge.
\
Tomorrow is another day...
Oooo, ouch and damn. Poor GNOME team. How many eighths have they lost now?
Buy your next Linux PC at eightvirtues.com
This proves that linux is the best community. They base most (if not all) of their decisions on their community rather than cash, corporatism or capitalism. I'm not saying the other community are bad but next to linux...it's hard to beat. Look at fedora, they fed team noticed a trend towards another desktop manage, they viewed it, they listened and they changed direction which I must say it pretty rare these days. I know some dev team work with themselves only and formed a closed group and base their decision based on the dev only and not the community unless the demand is getting excessive.
Perhaps this will serve as a wake-up-call to other distros (*cough* ubuntu *cough*).
New shinies are nice. Choice is better.
Except the GNOME people don't want to work with outsiders or take criticism. All they want is some echo chamber circle jerk. This is why people have gotten frustrated.
its good to fork once in a while to keep the projects momentum going and bring in new blood?
by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
....so looking forward to using MATE when it's finished compiling some time in 2014. :-)
Windows 10 is great - I used it to download Linux.
A thousand developers all going a thousand different directions.
And after a thousand compilations each day and after a thousand days, we will end up with the most beautiful Desktop Environment ever!
I may actually go back to Fedora. Once it switched to GNOME3, I dropped it in lieu of CentOS6.
I am insanely curious to know what kindof hit they had on users after GNOME3 was integrated. There has to be a drop.
tora
Now that they have someone big on their side, they stand a good chance of getting these issues cleared up.
Where is Debian? I still don't see Mate in the standard repos, let alone as an installation option (or, preferably, the default.)
I've been running XFCE4 for a while but, frankly, the longer I use it the more issues I find. Like VNC and NX interoperability, or the infamous xfce4-terminal hang that just caused me to lose some work last night.
thegodmovie.com - watch it
For people who like their desktop to have familiar features rather than being dumbed down for touch screens?
There is no way Gnome 3 is designed for touch screens. Or at least, not for touchscreen-only computers. I use Fedora 17 on a pen-based computer (fujitsu stylistic) and I can tell you that if it were not for the fingerprint reader on it, Fedora would be *UNUSABLE*. Whenever Gnome 3 needs a password to connect to WiFi or to unlock the screen or unlock following suspend, THERE IS NO WAY TO ENTER THE PASSWORD! The password windows captures all mouse input so it is NOT possible to bring up an onscreen keyboard.
So lets stop pretending Gnome 3 shell is for tablet-type computers. It CANNOT BE USED ON A COMPUTER WITHOUT A KEYBOARD.
Oh, and when one IS able to use the on-screen keyboard, it has is no tilda (~) character. Not that you would ever need to type a tilda on a unix-like operating system.
I've filed bugs on all these complaints, but there has been no action.
Are you listening Gnome team?
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I left Fedora after using it for many years because of the Gnome 3 crap-fest. Been using MATE on Mint since then and have been very satisified. Understand that Fedora is cutting edge and used to test and develop new stuff for RHEL but Gnome 3 was unusable (for me, hate it when others make all the UI decisions for me, no minimize because it is against their philosophy, please...) Going to take out F18 for a spin for sure, always nice to have options. And once again, not bashing Gnome 3, to each their own, it only failed from my point of view!
Only if you install from a LiveCD, and there are already KDE and Xfce spins if you prefer. Assuming that there's not a MATE spin (and that's a pretty big assumption) all you need to do is install from the DVD and select whatever DE you prefer.
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Given how many decent, albeit old, chips covered by the Gnome 3 blacklist - this shouldn't be a surprise.
Yes, I'm in Fedora update hell right now. My Dell D620 laptop is running Fedora 14, and I was trying to update to Fedora 17, had it hang after downloading all of the stuff I used on F14. The reason I'm trying to upgrade now, is I want to switch to Arduino 1.0 instead of 0.22, and the newer avrdude will not work on the old system.
Huh? I've been sharing files over bluetooth for a couple of years, in both KDE and Windows.
You have been able to use Bluetooth file-sharing in GNOME2 for years now, but that functionality was never actually a part of GNOME2, it was provided by an outside package. This announcement just basically says the Mate - team has now made that functionality a part of the actual Mate desktop environment.
bluetooth is faster than Samba over wifi!
Bluetooth v1.1 has a maximum available bandwidth of 0.7 Mbit/s, v2.1 has a maximum available bandwidth of 2.1 Mbit/s and Bluetooth 3.0+HS and Bluetooth 4.0 have a theoretical bandwidth of 24Mbit/s, though that bandwidth is actually provided by Wifi, not the Bluetooth - chipset itself. If you really are getting higher speeds with Bluetooth than with Wifi then your wireless settings are screwed up or you're having some serious interference.
Of course, the Windows machine needs a third-party app to run the bluetooth dongle (kubuntu does not).
You must have some strange off-standard dongle. I have several ones and none of them have ever required installation of anything under Windows or Linux.
Trinity. Not everyone likes KDE v4. :P
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Hi, the last name is spelled Mashal and I am honored to be a part of this.
1. they dont' want input from users. they don't want users tweaking its innards. users are expected to update their workflows and expectations to the 'one true path.'
2. sure there is. if gnome 3 is going the flat-learning-curve/flat-power-curve route...
3. no they couldn't, well, not as easily. gnome2 is say 90% of what modern users want. it's easier to add the 10% and get it working well, than rewriting half of gnome3 and resyncing their changes with every gnome release.
4. talk to the gnome3 devs.. their demagoguery is the problem. their slavish apple chasing attitude is another.
Desktop environments and toolkits have been horribly fragmented on *NIX systems since the beginning of X. I guess the Linux community is just carrying on that grand tradition.
I've been a GNOME (on Ubuntu) user for about 4 years, and was more or less planning to migrate to KDE when I finally upgrade to 12.04 as I really detest Unity and GNOME 3 just feels incomplete. I've also considered XFCE... I guess I really ought to give MATE a closer look too.
1. they dont' want input from users. they don't want users tweaking its innards. users are expected to update their workflows and expectations to the 'one true path.'
you know this because?
2. sure there is. if gnome 3 is going the flat-learning-curve/flat-power-curve route...
I agree, Gnome 3 with the defaults sucks, WTF could they not have made tweak tool part of the control panel??? or at least default install. But just grab tweak tool and some extensions and Gnome3 is nice.
3. no they couldn't, well, not as easily. gnome2 is say 90% of what modern users want. it's easier to add the 10% and get it working well, than rewriting half of gnome3 and resyncing their changes with every gnome release.
No need to 're-write' it, just use the components, and tie them together differently, basic simple javascript.
4. talk to the gnome3 devs.. their demagoguery is the problem. their slavish apple chasing attitude is another.
Again, you know this because?
Have you actually spoken with them, or just parroting what someone allegedly said? I've submitted some patches just fine.
> 2012
> Not having switched to XFCE4 long ago due to GNOME being a complete failure
come on, guys. Really?
9/11: Never forget it was a false-flag operation
You just made everyones point for them. They should not have to install gnome tweak to bring back basic functionality. We should not have to install extension to make a desktop usable. As for those extension, how do you build them when the api is a moving undocumented target as you yourself admitted? You said your a developer and now have a mess because mate uses gtk2 and gnome uses gtk3, well those are just libraries pick one, you can have both on the same system. that won't even be an issue long because (iirc) mate plans to port all of their apps to gtk3 eventually.
---Saying gnome 3 is better than windows 8 not so much a compliment as it is damning with light praise.
because I've used it. it's obvious the thing was meant to be used as is, with very little tweaking.. I've already tried to explain why they don't include the tweak tool. it's for the same reasons microsoft doesn't want you messing with that 'command bar' in windows 7 or the full screen start menu in windows 8 (apple does similar things with osx, to the point of threatening lawsuits against 3rd party skins/hacks). the attitude is 'it's just better, get used to it' rather than 'here's what we think is a sane default, but you can customize it as much as you like.'
it might be possible to fix these with a hack, but one shouldn't need hacks for basic functionality. if that's what's needed, the software's broken. it's better to replace the whole thing (hence MATE). writing javascript patches for things isn't exactly user friendly, which is what the gnome people were supposedly going for..friendly as in mouthbreathing moron friendly. these people will never write javascript in their lives. hell, most programmers are too lazy to write code for functionality that should only require a single click-drag. if we're back to writing code for everything, why have a GUI at all? desktop environments are supposed to provide flexibility for the user to define his own workflow by providing reasonable building blocks with intuitive hints, and a sane set of default layouts to start with. it really is a case of 'undevelopment' as these capabilities have been around for the last 15 years or more. why remove them? reading the mailing list suggests they're so far up the ivory tower, they're breathing vacuum, and honestly, it shows. they want to find 'the one true workflow' and force everyone to use it. this is ass-backwards.
You have been able to use Bluetooth file-sharing in GNOME2 for years now, but that functionality was never actually a part of GNOME2, it was provided by an outside package.
Ah, like Windows then.
If you really are getting higher speeds with Bluetooth than with Wifi then your wireless settings are screwed up or you're having some serious interference.
Well, video streams are fine so it isn't the wifi. My guess is still roadblocks MS put in the OS to require W7pro that Samba hasn't quite gotten past.
You must have some strange off-standard dongle.
That's possible, but it's also possible that it would have worked in Windows without the installation programs.
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Huh? I've been sharing files over bluetooth for a couple of years, in both KDE and Windows. In fact, because of MS's wanting you to not be able to connect to a network without a copy of Win 7 Pro on the network, bluetooth is faster than Samba over wifi! Of course, the Windows machine needs a third-party app to run the bluetooth dongle (kubuntu does not).
I guess I won't be trying this distro out...
Would someone please explain to me why they think that comment is a troll? 100% on-topic, 100% factual, didn't bash anyone. The two of you who downmodded that should never EVER have mod points.
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