Surge In Online Orders Overwhelms UPS Christmas Deliveries

Understandable, but... by DoofusOfDeath · 2013-12-26 05:06 · Score: 5, Insightful

I can understand that UPS / Fedex failed to predict their full load. It's too bad, but part of life.

What really surprises me is that they didn't have a system in place that (a) detected when they were at risk of having too many order to keep their QoS commitments, and (b) warning prospective customers that they might not get a prospective order delivered by Christmas.

Re:Understandable, but... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:18 · Score: 5, Insightful

Actually, they did.
My wife works for a relatively well-known shoe/clothing manufacturer that also does direct sales (website, catalog, etc.) FedEx was warning them several days before Christmas that they predicted a delivery problem due to late orders rising faster than they predicted. Her company has an overflow agreement with UPS, so they started witching some orders to them, but then both companies hit a wall in terms of delivery capacity.
It sounds like this was one of those problems where they both saw it coming, but couldn't do anything about it. There have been more than a few articles about FedEx in particular cutting back its container plane fleet due to fuel costs and the overall drop in package deliveries relative to a few years ago. I can only assume UPS has done the same -- when you cut back capacity in order to remain profitable, it stands to reason that a sudden, unexpected and massive surge of packages in your system is going to cause problems. And because both UPS and FedEx are for-profit, public companies, it's ultimately probably cheeper for them to suffer the ill-will and make-goods required of an event like this than to have a lot of excess capacity sitting aorund unused.
Re:Understandable, but... by Kenja · 2013-12-26 05:37 · Score: 4, Insightful

I've been seeing commercials about a company that has solutions for this sort of thing... can't recall their name but they keep yammering on about "logistics'.

--

"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
Re:Understandable, but... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:37 · Score: 5, Insightful

If anyone would have bothered to read either UPS's or FedEx's website, they would have seen around the 19th of December they had NO guarenteed delivery date deals. Those promises were purely from the retailers at that point. It's a shame though of course the curriers are the ones who catch the flack.
Not to mention if people WOULDN'T WAIT UNTIL THE LAST DAMN MINUTE or get out of the house and VISIT A STORE, much of this could have been avoided. I'll admit, I ordered a few small things on the 23rd with the gift wrap and next day option from Amazon more as a test.. and all 4 items arrived by noon on the 24th. (They were shipped from an amazon DC in the same state so that surely helped).
Hell my wife's gift from my brother didn't arrive before Chrismast (and he didn't expect it to).. no big deal. For the people who waited to order *everything* in the last few days before christmas and all of it via online.. well maybe you should have grabbed a few from the store or have done the "Ship to store" or "instore pickup" option instead. Or at the very least do what we've done before and print a picture and wrap that and just tell the person it wasn't going to arrive in time.
Maybe I'm getting more bitter as I age but this 'I wanted it tomorrow and it didn't make it, I don't give a shit about the massive volume of items from other procrastinators like myself or the ice storms and other weather, I WANT MY SHIT IT'S THE CARRIERS FAULT!' mentality is just so damn annoying.
Lastly, it's not always as it appears either. Over the summer I ordered an RC heliocopter for my son and did 1 day delivery so it would arrive in time for our trip to the beach. All indications on Amazon were it was in UPS's hands later that night. It didn't arrive the next day, and I kept checking the tracking info and it still appeared to be stuck in the intial location in the hands of UPS. After 3 days I called Amazon to find out what was going on, and the agent figured out UPS never had the item as THEY didn't have it either. Here the 3rd party seller or whatever that Amazon did the fulfillment and what not for (for prime and all) hadn't sent them any stock or something along those lines (could have been a complete BS store and Amazon just never packed my stuff). Either way, while the tracking info made it look like it was UPS holding up the show, it was in fact the retailer Amazon that had fucked up. It makes me wonder how many other online retailers didn't have the capacity to fill orders fast enough or were out of stock while the website still listed stock so they had to wait for more before they could box and ship, YET the shipping information was already entered into the system creating a tracking number for UPS or FedEx, which made it LOOK like the delay was on the shipping company used.
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 05:39 · Score: 4, Insightful

At least part of the problem is, not that UPS or other delivery companies promise you, the customer, delivery on time for Christmas. It is Amazon* and other bulk suppliers who are making these promises.
As AC states below, UPS and Fedex were making warnings to those retail suppliers. Amazon, or whoever, didn't pass those warnings on to you, the end user.
Do we expect that Amazon is going to make a public apology to all those children who had to wait until the day after Christmas for their presents? I don't think so. Amazon has your money, and they are going to keep as much of it as they think they can. They'll pass out a few gift certificates, and refund some shipping fees, but they are going to keep as much money as possible.
All of my shipments came in on time.
There IS a shipment which UPS intends to deliver today. Comparing notes, no one in the family seems to have any outstanding orders. Maybe it's a gift from one of the grandparents from several years ago? A gift from the afterlife? Oooohhh - a supernatural gift! More importantly, UPS is going a little extra to deliver whatever the package might be, by calling the house to see if anyone will be available to receive it. We have never before been contacted prior to delivery.
Bottom line here - if you wait until the last minute to place an order, you can expect to be disappointed. Any adult should understand that. Any adult should be ready to explain it to a child. Life is life, and stuff happens. I've had late deliveries in off-peak seasons, after all.
* I am using Amazon here as an example - replace Amazon with your motor sports supplier, or whatever.

--
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Re:Understandable, but... by stonebit · 2013-12-26 05:46 · Score: 2

They do warn, but the wholesellers decide whether to pass on the communication or not. UPS store and the Customer Service Centers will tell you. The risk of not keeping TnT (Time In Transit) is always there. There are frequent surges, depending on where you are... conventions, rodeos, tech shows, college students ordering books at large unis in small towns, bad weather, fires (like the ones we have every summer in many states in the west), and general accidents such as train derailments and hub fires. There's something going on every month to delay your package somewhere. It's just easier to hide if it just a few hubs. The unions jack up a lot too. They determine how much you get paid (yes, they do). There is a negotiated pool of regular salary, then the union decides who gets what portion. The unloaders, sorters, and loaders in the hubs are crapped on majorly. Drivers get a much better wage, but still not amazing. The haulers (big rigs, trailer runners (to and from the rail yard)) get the lion's share. Teamsters considers these lower class employees. The big truckers are well respected. If the pay was better, they'd get more people to show up and we wouldn't have this problem. I worked at UPS for many years. They hire 100% of people who apply and can show up every day. The training lasts weeks too. It's really not easy to take an ordinary person and get them into shape, learn to use the equipment well enough, and get them to learn the sort (sorting is nearly always by memory, zip -> binX). Holliday temps are a joke. They don't know how to use the equipment and they don't know ANY of the sorts. So they become okay temporary muscle, usually not lasting the entire peak season (Thanksgiving to Christmas). During peak, always add a day or two to your TnT and be suprised when it arrives early. And by the way, package priority is: Early AM > Next Day Air > 2nd day > air freight > 3rd / ground.
Re:Understandable, but... by plopez · 2013-12-26 05:47 · Score: 2

Part of what you are talking about is mean capacity covering 90% ish of the cases and surge capacity which covers the unusual volume or weather cases. Surge capacity is expensive and hard to prove of value. So the bean counters don't like it. But they could have I think, for a nominal fee, booked more charter flights, contractors etc. on stand by in case of need. This is a management failure, surges happen and storms happen. Where was the fall back plan?
On a side note, a friend of mine is an ER worker. She said lack of ER and hospital surge capacity is her nightmare. Anytime there is a major event; e.g. large car pile up, plane crash etc.; the lack of capacity creates a nightmare for hospital staff and patients.

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Re:Understandable, but... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 06:10 · Score: 5, Informative

Surge capacity is expensive and hard to prove of value. So the bean counters don't like it. But they could have I think, for a nominal fee, booked more charter flights, contractors etc. on stand by in case of need.
Oh hey guys, look, another armchair quarterback on the internet who is absolutely certain that FedEx and UPS, with their multi-billion dollar operations, missed some obvious, easy, and cheap solution to this problem! Color me shocked.
The reason bean counters don't like paying for "surge capacity" is because "surge capacity" is often left unused, because it is insurance for the rare-to-never case where things completely shit the bed. FedEx and UPS *have* surge capacity built in - what happened this year is that their surge capacity wasn't able to keep up with the actual volume of packages funneling through their systems. Three days before Christmas is a bit too late to begin arranging 'surge capacity' for the holiday season - there's not much volume available for hire at that point, and the planes are frequently not where you want them to be, too, which means they'd have to scramble to fly pilots around to the planes all over the country (or world) where they're parked, fly them to their destination to pick up their cargo, and do this in the space of 12-24 hours in order to get the capacity in place to make a difference for holiday shipments. Then they also need the capacity on the ground in their receiving facilities and delivery trucks to be able to ship everything on time, as well.
When your business is built-on "just in time" delivery, a late surge and weather-based delays can really fuck up your transportation chain no matter how hard you plan. In most cases, it's better to eat some penalties and freebies to angry customers receiving late packages than it is to spend millions or billions scrambling at the last minute to get every last package there on time.
Re:Understandable, but... by SOOPRcow · 2013-12-26 06:11 · Score: 1

Amazon is responding by offering some affected customers refunded shipping costs and provide gift cards. http://nation.time.com/2013/12/26/ups-blames-bad-weather-more-packages-and-online-shopping-for-delays/
Re:Understandable, but... by Virtucon · 2013-12-26 06:13 · Score: 1

I came close to that this year with Amazon but with other Vendors. No missing items, no late deliveries. I think we all expect too much when the holiday season hits and we all expect things to be there by Christmas. The rule says, plan ahead and I think that needs to apply to everybody otherwise just shop locally and handle delivery chores yourself. Dallas did have some weather delays but so did most of the Eastern hubs as well due to the Winter storm. I was flying back from Europe on Monday and had about two hours in delays because of it.

--
Harrison's Postulate - "For every action there is an equal and opposite criticism"
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 06:20 · Score: 1

That is perfectly true. I could have pointed that out, because I already knew that. But, it sort of side steps the point I was trying to make. The retailer should be smart enough to understand that stuff happens during the Christmas season. They shouldn't be encouraging these last minute purchases. It should be the retailer's goal to have all Christmas purchases out the door, and aboard trucks on or before the 20th of December. Any purchases made after midnight of the 20th should have a disclaimer attached. "The Christmas shipping season can be quite hectic, and no one can guarantee that purchases made at this date can be delivered on time for Christmas morning."

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"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by torkus · 2013-12-26 06:31 · Score: 5, Insightful

So just to use your own point...if emergency rooms (i.e. critically necessary medical services largely funded by the gov't) can't provide capacity necessary for the exception-circumstance...how is it reasonable to expect FedEx or UPS to do even more? Getting a beanie boo before xmas isn't quite as important as pushing saline for a trauma victim with low BP. (though if you read the FB page for FedEx or UPS you might get the impression otherwise)
I think the vendors deserve much of the blame here if the delivery companies were communicating with them. Heck, if Amazon posted that orders are surging this year and deliveries may be delayed for last second orders...so order RIGHT NOW. just like they do with the silly (but effective) timer for when you can last order something to get it by X day.
What I find truly ironic - people are blaming FedEx and UPS for 'failing to plan ahead properly' when *they're* the ones ordering things at the very last second. UPS should include a small, complimentary mirror with each of these delayed packages when they're delivered.

--
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Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 06:33 · Score: 1

"But they could have I think, for a nominal fee, booked more charter flights"
I'm afraid that extra flights, contractors, etc are just not available.
You are entirely correct that it is a management failure. Management should have their own extra equipment, and they should have sufficient personnel already hired to operate the equipment. But, you're simply not going to find a lot of planes, trucks, and temporary personnel to contract right at Christmas.

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by paiute · 2013-12-26 06:40 · Score: 1

what happened this year is that their surge capacity wasn't able to keep up with the actual volume of packages
I am not a logistics expert, but it seems to me that they did not actually have a proper surge capacity at all.

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Re:Understandable, but... by geoskd · 2013-12-26 06:48 · Score: 1

Part of what you are talking about is mean capacity covering 90% ish of the cases and surge capacity which covers the unusual volume or weather cases. Surge capacity is expensive and hard to prove of value. So the bean counters don't like it. But they could have I think, for a nominal fee, booked more charter flights, contractors etc. on stand by in case of need. This is a management failure, surges happen and storms happen. Where was the fall back plan?
On a side note, a friend of mine is an ER worker. She said lack of ER and hospital surge capacity is her nightmare. Anytime there is a major event; e.g. large car pile up, plane crash etc.; the lack of capacity creates a nightmare for hospital staff and patients.
This time of year, all rental equipment is in short supply, because the rental places dont like to keep over-sized fleets around just in case delivery companies want to rent extra equipment during the holiday season. You can have all the planes in the world, but the world-wide supply of pilots is somewhat limiting. You dont just take someone and throw them in the cockpit of a DC-10 and let them loose. It takes a lot of training to be allowed to fly these machines, and its just not the sort of thing you can whoop up, even with a few months notice. The excess used to be taken up by simply working longer hours, but a more stringent enforcement of DOT hours of service rules has created a hard limit on how many total delivery and transportation hours are available.
Couple that with the realities of on-line sales, and the problem is very complicated. 15 years ago, holiday package volume was only about 60% above "normal". With the advent of online shopping, holiday delivery volumes are now 300% or more of normal delivery volume. It is very difficult to stretch the infrastructure to that degree. As mentioned, the only way to cope is to keep excess capacity, but that excess capacity is very expensive. Would you still be interested in shipping if it cost twice what it does now? How about if it cost you double all the time, just so that bargain hunter shoppers could wait until the last minute in the hopes of squeezing an extra 10% off the cost of their Christmas shopping?

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Re:Understandable, but... by geoskd · 2013-12-26 06:50 · Score: 3, Insightful

"But they could have I think, for a nominal fee, booked more charter flights"
I'm afraid that extra flights, contractors, etc are just not available.
You are entirely correct that it is a management failure. Management should have their own extra equipment, and they should have sufficient personnel already hired to operate the equipment. But, you're simply not going to find a lot of planes, trucks, and temporary personnel to contract right at Christmas.
That extra capacity comes with a price. Are you willing to pay an extra $8 shipping on every order all year long to pay for the equipment that sits idle for 11 months out of the year?

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I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
Re:Understandable, but... by plover · 2013-12-26 06:55 · Score: 2

"Brown stands for the quality of our service".
Actually, this is all part of Jeff Bezos' master plan. They wanted to place a lot of blame on the couriers today, so that the FAA will have no choice but to approve Amazon's request to fly drones next year.
It's a conspiracy, I tell you! Soylent Brown is slow people!! ;-)

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John
Re:Understandable, but... by LordLimecat · 2013-12-26 07:02 · Score: 1

I would be impressed if anything came of Amazon's drone plan.
Re:Understandable, but... by linearz69 · 2013-12-26 07:12 · Score: 1

This is a management failure.
Maybe. Assume that, after 40+ years of package deliver, FedEx and UPS have a good grasp on the accuracy of their projections over the holiday season. That is, the management of these companies can predict the risk of failing to meet these targets. Surely these large companies have bean counters (a.k.a. computers) that can asses what an acceptable risk vs. cost is. The cost for at least some of the packages shipped and not making it on time is tangible - both companies have options for guaranteed delivery deadlines which will refund the shipping costs if the parcel doesn't make it. If the cost of these refunds exceeds the cost of additional capacity to offset risk, then the management will have failed. I'm sure the people the management answer to (i.e. sharholders) will hold the management accountable if this failure results in a significant loss. As for the rest of the packages - no promises are made on delivery times, and the parcel companies cover their ass pretty clearly here when one fills out a shipping bill. If these packages don't make it by the magic day, it is the shippers fault. Customer happiness really isn't part of this equation. It would be interesting to see a breakdown on how many of these packages "still being processed" are shipped with guaranteed delivery. I'd expect the vast majority are not guaranteed, and so deprioritzed and left for after the rush of two-day and overnight packages. Just another tempest in a teapot.
Re:Understandable, but... by ultranova · 2013-12-26 07:16 · Score: 3, Insightful

So just to use your own point...if emergency rooms (i.e. critically necessary medical services largely funded by the gov't) can't provide capacity necessary for the exception-circumstance...how is it reasonable to expect FedEx or UPS to do even more?

It seems unlikely that half of FedEx and UPS board of directors are actively trying to sabotage their company for ideological reasons. The same is not true of federal government - and sadly, this sickness seems to be spreading as well as the rest of American culture.

--
Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.
Re: Understandable, but... by Mabhatter · 2013-12-26 07:19 · Score: 1

I hope you don't apply to be "fine print writer" any time soon... That was terrible fine print you got there. No marketing person would ever let that out the door.
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 07:28 · Score: 3, Insightful

That extra capacity carries with it some benefits, as well as a price.
I've some experience in trucking. I know that some companies only have enough trucks to meet commitments. Other companies have a few extra trucks sitting around the yard. I don't mean 30 or 50 percent extra capacity - but maybe 10 or 15 percent.
What good are those trucks? Well - a driver who is coming through the yard with a truck that is due (or overdue) for maintenance can bail out of his truck, and take one of the spares to complete his run. Preventive maintenance, done on schedule, can prevent breakdowns and accidents.
That extra 10% of vehicles can pay for itself in fairly short order, really. And, when you DO have a surge, all you need is to pick up a few temporary people to put those trucks on the road, to meet the surge. I've seen it done. We had a contract come up that required tens of thousands of tons of rebar to be moved, and all those extra trucks were put on a dedicated run to help meet the deadline.
BTW - those extra trucks are usually older, nearly worn out vehicles that have already paid for themselves, many times over. They are still roadworthy, they are paid off, they are still insured, they still pass inspection - why get rid of them? Keep a few around for whatever emergencies might happen. They've already been depreciated, so on the books they are valueless, and cost next to nothing.

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by Jonboy+X · 2013-12-26 07:31 · Score: 1

I ordered a toy for my nephew 5 days before Christmas, with Amazon Prime 2-day GUARANTEED shipping. Right on the item page, Amazon GUARANTEED that it would arrive by Christmas. I don't hold UPS responsible. I hold responsible the vendor that made the claim. I spent my Christmas Eve driving to a Toys-R-Us 3 towns over, instead of sipping egg nog and decorating the tree.

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"In a 32-bit world, you're a 2-bit user. You've got your own newsgroup, alt.total.loser." -Weird Al
Re: Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 07:40 · Score: 1

LMAO, don't worry. I'm not applying for a position in Human Relations, either. ;^)

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 07:41 · Score: 1

You must understand that the "guarantee" does not mean the item will arrive on time, just that Amazon will offer recompense if it doesn't.
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 07:42 · Score: 1

Thumbs up, for understanding where the fault lies. And, I'll give you the other thumb up too, for making the effort to get the kid what he wanted. But, you get a half thumb down for waiting so late in the season to do your shopping!!

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by bondsbw · 2013-12-26 07:46 · Score: 1

Please cite a credible source that shows that "half of" the federal government is "actively trying to sabotage" true emergency care (involving loss of life or limb) "for idealogical reasons".
I'm serious, I would like to know. I understand that there are opposing viewpoints in how to treat non-emergency conditions, including conditions such as cancer that can eventually lead to emergency care needs. But I don't know of a politician who has stated that they are against treating direct and imminent threats to life or limb.

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All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.
Re:Understandable, but... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 07:47 · Score: 3, Interesting

That extra capacity carries with it some benefits, as well as a price.
I've some experience in trucking. I know that some companies only have enough trucks to meet commitments. Other companies have a few extra trucks sitting around the yard. I don't mean 30 or 50 percent extra capacity - but maybe 10 or 15 percent.
What good are those trucks? Well - a driver who is coming through the yard with a truck that is due (or overdue) for maintenance can bail out of his truck, and take one of the spares to complete his run. Preventive maintenance, done on schedule, can prevent breakdowns and accidents.
That extra 10% of vehicles can pay for itself in fairly short order, really. And, when you DO have a surge, all you need is to pick up a few temporary people to put those trucks on the road, to meet the surge. I've seen it done. We had a contract come up that required tens of thousands of tons of rebar to be moved, and all those extra trucks were put on a dedicated run to help meet the deadline.
BTW - those extra trucks are usually older, nearly worn out vehicles that have already paid for themselves, many times over. They are still roadworthy, they are paid off, they are still insured, they still pass inspection - why get rid of them? Keep a few around for whatever emergencies might happen. They've already been depreciated, so on the books they are valueless, and cost next to nothing.
That's great, but FedEx and UPS already do that. What happened here is that they overran their 15 percent. Most companies don't have surge capacity on their surge capacity.
The other tricky thing here is the logistics -- I'm pretty sure UPS had at least almost enough trucks and feet on the ground to do pickups and deliveries -- the problem comes from having more volume than their processing plants can process and more air deliveries than they can charter flights for. The big one is really their processing hubs, which can only scale up to max capacity -- you can't go any further, period.
Re:Understandable, but... by dkf · 2013-12-26 07:52 · Score: 1

It seems unlikely that half of FedEx and UPS board of directors are actively trying to sabotage their company for ideological reasons.
No, but it's certainly been the case in the past that companies have effectively-sabotaged themselves just to make the next quarter's numbers on Wall St look good. I wouldn't say that that's necessarily happened in this case, but it's unwise for you to assume it can't. Stupidity trumps ideology (well, it does when ideology isn't just stupidity in a silly hat; stupidity never trumps stupidity, it just adds together).

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"Little does he know, but there is no 'I' in 'Idiot'!"
Re:Understandable, but... by P-niiice · 2013-12-26 07:56 · Score: 1

wild guess here, but he's probably talking about the American People.
Re:Understandable, but... by Kalium70 · 2013-12-26 07:58 · Score: 1

Actually, several emergency rooms in my area have large billboards posted on the freeway with their current wait times.
Re:Understandable, but... by sh00z · 2013-12-26 08:02 · Score: 1

If anyone would have bothered to read either UPS's or FedEx's website, they would have seen around the 19th of December they had NO guarenteed delivery date deals. Those promises were purely from the retailers at that point. It's a shame though of course the curriers are the ones who catch the flack.(snip)
Absolutely. The retailers should be taking the flack here, not the parcel carriers. UPS and FedEx have my absolute sympathy. I placed an order through Amazon Prime to a "covered" Amazon partner on the 11th. They didn't hand my package over to UPS until the 16th. I consider myself EXTREMELY lucky that my wife's gift arrived at 7:30 pm on Christmas Eve.
Re:Understandable, but... by Dragonslicer · 2013-12-26 08:08 · Score: 4, Insightful

I ordered a toy for my nephew 5 days before Christmas, with Amazon Prime 2-day GUARANTEED shipping. Right on the item page, Amazon GUARANTEED that it would arrive by Christmas. I don't hold UPS responsible. I hold responsible the vendor that made the claim. I spent my Christmas Eve driving to a Toys-R-Us 3 towns over, instead of sipping egg nog and decorating the tree.
Congratulations on teaching a child the true meaning of Christmas.
Re:Understandable, but... by UnknowingFool · 2013-12-26 08:08 · Score: 2

What I find truly ironic - people are blaming FedEx and UPS for 'failing to plan ahead properly' when *they're* the ones ordering things at the very last second. UPS should include a small, complimentary mirror with each of these delayed packages when they're delivered.
Well from the stories I've read and anecdotally, not everyone was "very last second". I know of at least two people whose packages were shipped two weeks before Christmas and still have not gotten them yet. There's also stories that the packages have sat in UPS facilities for a week without being moved or delivered.

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Re:Understandable, but... by bondsbw · 2013-12-26 08:34 · Score: 1

That's not an answer. And I'm pretty sure "federal government" is unambiguous in this context.

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All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.
Re:Understandable, but... by HaZardman27 · 2013-12-26 08:40 · Score: 1

My thoughts exactly. Unless a kid is suffering from a terminal illness, there's no reason to suffer this much to get them a toy that they otherwise would only have to wait a couple of extra days for.

--
Apparently wizard is not a legitimate career path, so I chose programmer instead.
Re:Understandable, but... by bjwest · 2013-12-26 09:01 · Score: 1

Interesting enough, I had three (non gift) packages scheduled for FedEx delivery today (Thursday) that showed up Tuesday. My apologies to three of you for the delaying of your gift arrivals.

This is something I really never though of before. Perhaps in the future I'll delay any non seasonal orders I plan on making two weeks or so before Christmas, until afterwords. Or order early, if I know I'll need something.

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--- Keep the choice with the user..
Re:Understandable, but... by JoeMerchant · 2013-12-26 09:12 · Score: 1

We have been seeing "surge handling" end-point deliveries for weeks - guys in their own SUVs with "Package Delivery" magnetic signs on the door, they have been carrying a lot of Amazon packages (not just for us, I can see them sorting in the passenger seat when they deliver to our house...)
Re:Understandable, but... by kqs · 2013-12-26 09:13 · Score: 1

As you said, 10% extra capacity pays for itself, and UPS had that. They probably had 50% excess capacity and had plans for 100% excess around Christmas, but then they suddenly needed 150% and that was a problem. (Numbers made up.) And 150% excess capacity does NOT pay for itself.
I'm sure that the wintery storms across much of the USA for the second half of December just made a bad problem worse.
Re:Understandable, but... by JoeMerchant · 2013-12-26 09:13 · Score: 1

If all of our service industries follow the U.S. health care delivery system, we're going to fall into the nobles and peasants society of the middle ages.
Re:Understandable, but... by PrimaryConsult · 2013-12-26 09:24 · Score: 1

The government is run by representatives elected by the American People who choose to vote. It can be argued that they are the same thing.
Re:Understandable, but... by D'Sphitz · 2013-12-26 09:35 · Score: 1

I don't think the main issue was that nobody could do anything about it even though they all saw it coming, rather nobody was willing to do anything about it, i.e., be upfront and honest and potentially have to watch some of the holiday cash infused shoppers walk away while their wallet is still fat.
Re: Understandable, but... by Holi · 2013-12-26 10:13 · Score: 1

Umm no, YOU didn't have any problems with Fed Ex, both UPS and Fed Ex had many problems and always do at this time of year.

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Sorry, teleporters just kill you and then make a copy. A perfect, soul-less copy.
Re:Understandable, but... by ranton · 2013-12-26 11:36 · Score: 1

Maybe I'm getting more bitter as I age but this 'I wanted it tomorrow and it didn't make it, I don't give a shit about the massive volume of items from other procrastinators like myself or the ice storms and other weather, I WANT MY SHIT IT'S THE CARRIERS FAULT!' mentality is just so damn annoying.
What a shock, each generation starts to take things for granted that the previous generations all had to work very hard for. 10,000 years ago when some young farmer complained about a bad crop I'm sure he had a grandparent complaining that in his day you had to forage for your food. A hundred years ago when some kid complained that the plumbing wasn't working his grandparent said that in his day they had to use an outhouse. And now when some young adult complains that his package took a week to deliver you have people calling them procrastinators because in their day you didn't have free two day shipping.
Although now technology changes so fast that even 25 year olds can remember a time that was wildly different than the world that teenagers live in today. So instead of taking for granted something we have used for decades, we take for granted something we have had for a few years. Immediate access to whatever you want is simply the norm now. It isn't the norm because we are becoming more narcissistic, it is because technology has advanced far enough to make it possible. Soon we will probably get used to same day shipping
The simple fact is that the commerce sites promised something they couldn't deliver on. The consumers have the right to be upset. They should probably be upset with Amazon and other retailers instead of UPS, but they have still been given poor service.

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-- All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. -- Edmund Burke
Re:Understandable, but... by hairyfeet · 2013-12-26 11:51 · Score: 1

It was the same thing with USPS and Fed Ex, its like they used the ice storm a few weeks back as an excuse not to do anything. I know I had some packages in south Texas that sat in the facility until I went down and complained and i had a friend IN south Texas to report the road conditions to me and she said the roads in that area were completely clear within 24 hours. BTW these were packages sent out the first week after Black Friday, so not like it was anywhere close to "last minute".
I don't know WTF was going on behind the scenes at the big three but its something they aren't telling us, as I can't picture all three companies having a case of "sit on ass" all at once like that.

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ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
Re:Understandable, but... by ShaunC · 2013-12-26 12:13 · Score: 1

BTW - those extra trucks are usually older, nearly worn out vehicles that have already paid for themselves, many times over. They are still roadworthy, they are paid off, they are still insured, they still pass inspection - why get rid of them? Keep a few around for whatever emergencies might happen. They've already been depreciated, so on the books they are valueless, and cost next to nothing.
Your point is well received, but unfortunately, it doesn't scale to aircraft. My understanding (I'm not in the parcel industry anymore, but used to be) is that air freight was the real bottleneck this holiday season. It's absolutely not economical to keep 15%, 10%, or even 5% of your air fleet's worth of old jets sitting around "on ice" while ensuring that they're airworthy, pass inspection, can be made active within 24 hours, etc. The stakes, and the costs, are much higher when it comes to air freight.

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Thanks to the War on Drugs, it's easier to buy meth than it is to buy cold medicine!
Re:Understandable, but... by msobkow · 2013-12-26 12:25 · Score: 1, Informative

Meh. It's nothing but an excuse.
I've never had UPS deliver a package on time, regardless of the time of year.
I'm surprised at FedEx falling behind, but not UPS. UPS is THE worst package delivery service on the planet.

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I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
Re:Understandable, but... by Jonboy+X · 2013-12-26 12:59 · Score: 1

I usually get away with shopping late, but I guess I got my hand caught in the cookie jar on that one. There was no way I'd show up to the family X-mas party without a gift for my nephew (who is also my Godson). I'm just annoyed that Amazon displayed so much confidence in their shippers, and it ended up causing me headaches. The other 51 weeks of the year, 2-day shipping means 2 (occasionally 3) days. They're probably as good as anyone on the planet at shipping consumer goods to people, so when they said, "We've got this," I believed them. Meh.

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"In a 32-bit world, you're a 2-bit user. You've got your own newsgroup, alt.total.loser." -Weird Al
Re:Understandable, but... by paiute · 2013-12-26 14:30 · Score: 1

The issue was trivial. They did not have capacity to handle the unexpected demand. Their capacity to handle a surge was not there. They did not have the proper surge capacity.

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If Slashdot were chemistry it would look like this:Cadaverine
Re:Understandable, but... by Rich0 · 2013-12-26 15:41 · Score: 1

The reason bean counters don't like paying for "surge capacity" is because "surge capacity" is often left unused, because it is insurance for the rare-to-never case where things completely shit the bed.
You make it sound like they're trying to make money or something.
There is a simple solution for the surge capacity problem - flexible pricing. If $10 is the regular overnight rate then make the guarantee that it will get there overnight on 99% of all shipping days, which means the company is free to take longer 3 days a year. Then offer an overnight for $100 for the exact same size/weight that comes with the 100% guarantee. Now you can afford the surge capacity, and you can bump the 99% tier as much as you need to the day before Christmas. If somebody absolutely needs their X-Box the day before Christmas then they can just fork over $175 for shipping.
They'd have no trouble getting the packages delivered for that rate. Just put out an ad in the paper that anybody can show up and be given a package and an address in exchange for a deposit, and upon return with a signed receipt for delivery they get their deposit plus $100. People would line up to deliver packages. You could even pay people $50 to pick up their own packages at the depot.
You can deliver anything, for a price. It just doesn't make sense to staff for a peak that you only hit one day per year. Sure, you can surge by scheduling double-shifts and such, but that only lets you maybe double or triple your capacity. You aren't going to maintain a fleet of delivery vans that you use one day per year. At least, not if you want to stay in business, because as much as everybody would prefer that the guarantee be honored that one day per year, they're not going to switch to a carrier that charges 25% more the other 364 days per year in order to do it.
Re:Understandable, but... by Rich0 · 2013-12-26 15:48 · Score: 2

Which is why UPS should have, oh, went public with the information and told the press that Amazon and others were lying?
UPS telling their customers (which is Amazon, not you) what the deal is makes their customers happy. UPS embarrassing their customers by calling them out to the press doesn't make their customers happy. Which strategy do you think will be better for business?
UPS is going to lose zero business because of these delays. Everybody who actually pays them money knew about them in advance and chose to use them anyway. Anybody other than a retail shipper doesn't care since normal businesses don't ship tons of stuff out the day before Christmas.
UPS didn't promise anybody that their package would be there on time. Amazon may very well have, and that's where the fault lies. Amazon doesn't even let customers pick the courier anyway - they just pick the delivery timeline and Amazon picks the courier. So, even if UPS went on the radio saying that they'd spend a million dollars a package getting stuff there on time if that was what it took there would be no way to buy something from Amazon and be assured that they'd use UPS anyway. And the only way UPS is going to spend a million dollars getting you a package is if somebody paid them a $1.1M to do it.
Re:Understandable, but... by Rich0 · 2013-12-26 15:53 · Score: 1

That extra capacity carries with it some benefits, as well as a price.
There are lots of couriers out there that you can use when you just HAVE to get a package there in time. I'm sure somebody needed a heart transplant somewhere the day before Christmas, and I'm sure it got there on time. It was packaged up in a hospital, where a helicopter landed and took it to a small airfield, where it was loaded on a jet and flown to another airfield, where it was loaded onto helicopter and taken to a hospital where it was run down to the OR where the patient was waiting with their chest cut open. You can imagine what it cost to get it there, and the courier wasn't the one who ended up footing the bill.
UPS is a general-purpose parcel service. They aren't going to stick a box in somebody's carry-on allowance if that is what it takes to get it someplace. They aren't going to handcuff a briefcase to somebody's wrist and have them followed by a squad of guards. What they will do is get your package someplace on-time 99.5% of the time for $10.
Re:Understandable, but... by torkus · 2013-12-26 16:04 · Score: 1

There are always going to be exception cases. So yes, there are *TWO* people with badly delayed packages. This out of how many millions of packages delivered in the 4 weeks leading up to christmas? Unfortunately the more extreme the example the more it's referred to...even when it's basically irrelevant.
Yes, UPS and FedEx messed up some deliveries. They're not some magic perfect wizard den ... but neither is any large scale enterprise. It sucks for those who missed packages but a large portion of those were shipped by vendors who knew there were delivery delays.

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You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 16:18 · Score: 1

Well said. Some of my other posts have indicated that somebody's late Christmas present is of little importance. You have driven that point home with your post.

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"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by jedinite · 2013-12-26 16:44 · Score: 2

I was one of these customers.
I ordered a mSata SSD that via Prime 2-day was scheduled for delivery on xmas eve. I got a notification that day (from Amazon) that UPS was overwhelmed and the package wouldn't be delivered on the "guaranteed" date.
On xmas day I received a (totally unsolicited) $20 gift card credit email from Amazon, that let me know $20 would be waiting in my Amazon account, no code necessary.
On xmas +1 the SSD arrived (and I ordered something else, taking full advantage of the gift card).
Result? At least in this regard, 100% satisfied customer...

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There is no try at jedinite.com
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 17:03 · Score: 1

I'm not so very sure of that. We have seasonal peaks in holiday travel. The airlines manage to move amazing numbers of people during the holidays. What happens to all those aircraft during off-peak seasons, when we can be quite sure they are not full of travelers?
Granted, maintenance schedules can be manipulated to some extent. In the run up to the holidays, aviation techs are probably working overtime to ensure that the entire fleet is in the air during the most critical days. And, those same techs probably work some overtime in the days after the peak, ensuring that any minor work that was delayed for a couple of weeks is made up.
But, it's probably a safe bet that each of the major airlines has a few extra aircraft, that get rotated into and out of active status.
I'm sure that small airlines aren't capable of doing that. If they only own five aircraft, and those aircraft are filled to 80% or more of capacity most of the year, then they don't figure into this equation at all. An airline that operates fifty aircraft may have an extra craft that fills in when necessary. I really don't know where the breaking point would be, from an economic point of view.

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"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by Waccoon · 2013-12-26 21:02 · Score: 1

I work for a Fortune 500 shipping company that sends medical supplies to hospitals. I can tell you right now that even though our trucks have our own company logo on the side, they are under lease. We don't have old, retired trucks just sitting around -- they go back to the rental company. We have extra capacity only when we're not at our busiest, and things don't get fixed unless they actually break.
I should also probably point out that I don't work at a particularly good Fortune 500 company, though.
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 23:55 · Score: 1

I understand, very well.
IMHO, executives should all be veterans. The army has a reputation for having the finest motor pool mechanics and drivers in the world. They have a maintenance schedule and an operator's checklist that is pretty amazing. Taking shortcuts can and will cost a man his career. The Navy is similar. Ships are never at "peace" - the ocean is the enemy, if all other enemies have given up. We do our PM's religiously, and gundecking the logs will cost an otherwise good sailor his career. I have no experience with aviation, but aviators certainly face the same risks we do at sea. The Marines, of course, are part of the Department of the Navy, and their discipline is far more rigorous than us mere sailors. PM'ing equipment is just as much a religious experience for them, as it is for us.
We all understand that our lives depend on the condition and the readiness of our tools and equipment.
If executives of companies both large and small had the same sense of dependence on their tools and equipment, their businesses would be so much better - we wouldn't even recognize those businesses.
I worked for Brown and Root before they sold out to Kellog. They ran their business quite like the military does. Cranes, trucks, whatever, all were PM'd to a pretty rigorous schedule. B&R readily wrote equipment off when it became expensive, but they quickly replaced that equipment, then rigorously maintenanced that equipment.
We simply don't see a lot of that today.
The company that I work for now scrimps and cheats on maintenance. Our PM schedule is about half, or maybe less, what the books call for. The attitude that leads to such practices has run the company into the ground. Right now, the company is up for sale, and none of us knows if we will have jobs next month.
So much of management in this country is simply incompetent. All they can see is the very short term return on investment.
Ehhh - I guess the best thing to do is smile. Things are going to get worse.

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"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by 400_guru · 2013-12-27 06:25 · Score: 1

Then you balance out my excellent UPS Service. We live in a rural area that was CLOBBERED with Ice on Dec 22, over 75% of our county had no electricity. My UPS packages still arrived on time. Speaking to the driver he admitted some did not because he could not reach the homes due to downed trees and blocked roads. Six days later, power is STILL out in areas around here (mine is out now in fact) so a delay in delivery is not at all unexpected.

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There are two rules to success in life: 1) Don't tell everyone all that you know.
Re:Understandable, but... by 400_guru · 2013-12-27 06:30 · Score: 1

But you need drivers. And as it works out in the Midwest of the U.S. Christmas happens when the weather is often 'quite frightful'. I do work for trucking firms and know that getting GOOD drivers is a full time challenge. Need to staff up at Christmas and you're not going to get the best drivers. Then put them in old trucks. Now put the poor drivers in old trucks on sloppy slippery icy roads and you can imagine that incremental capacity is no where near as cheap as you think it might be.

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There are two rules to success in life: 1) Don't tell everyone all that you know.
Re:Understandable, but... by stoatwblr · 2013-12-27 06:36 · Score: 1

"UPS is THE worst package delivery service on the planet."
You have clearly never used Yodel (or the myriad other couriers in the UK, such as Citylink or Parcelforce)
Re:Understandable, but... by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-27 06:39 · Score: 1

This is why you maintain relations with former good drivers. Retirees, among others. People who have moved on to other occupations, but might be laid off during the winter months and/or Christmas season. Oddly enough, my employers were always able to bring in known, good drivers when they were needed. People you might call "casual labor", but were dependable. In some instances, those drivers were related to the management and staff. We never had to settle for kids who recently graduated from those jokes known as "driver academies".
Of course, many companies see no need to cultivate good relations with former employees, so those resources wouldn't be available.

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"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Understandable, but... by 400_guru · 2013-12-27 07:28 · Score: 1

The logic is good BUT said drivers, being retired, are not likely to want to work Christmas or New Years. Also they need to maintain their endorsements and physicals etc which many choose not to do. On a fabulously smaller scale my wife hires drivers and prefers that most of them be part time. This gives her maximum flexibility to scale up and down easily week by week as routes vary. This week every driver is working maximum daily hours because they got Christmas Even and Christmas off but the job is getting done. Her methodology doesn't work as well for a massive truck fleet.

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There are two rules to success in life: 1) Don't tell everyone all that you know.
Re:Understandable, but... by UnknowingFool · 2013-12-27 19:31 · Score: 1

Did you read the article and others like it? Yes, you can't always expect to get your package at the last minute but that wasn't the case here. Many packages are delayed that were shipped with plenty of time. It happened. Lumping everyone into one category doesn't addressed that a major meltdown happened.

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Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
Re:Understandable, but... by niftymitch · 2013-12-27 20:05 · Score: 1

How is it that folk have no memory longer than yesterday.
Weather does cause delays.
Volume causes delays.
How does that sign go?:
"Your procrastination does not justify an emergency for me."
In a nutshell this is what is wrong with the way so many people think today.

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Truth is stranger than fiction, but it is because Fiction is obliged to stick to possibilities; Truth isn't. Mark Twain.
Re:Understandable, but... by bondsbw · 2013-12-29 03:28 · Score: 1

My point is, what does this discussion have to do with my post? We aren't talking about the American political/election system. I asked for "a credible source that shows that 'half of' the federal government is 'actively trying to sabotage' true emergency care (involving loss of life or limb) 'for idealogical reasons'."

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All my liberal friends think I'm a conservative, all my conservative friends think I'm a liberal.
Re:Understandable, but... by mgcarley · 2013-12-30 09:03 · Score: 1

You must live in Michigan - I was up there for a week over Christmas with the in-laws and even lucky enough to have power (and a generator if it went out) - but then, they live in the sticks so they're always prepared. I seem to recall seeing trucks out and about even in rural areas, and I think they (UPS & Fedex) did a far better job at delivering their service than the power companies did/are doing!
And even when Illinois/Missouri/Kentucky/etc had that "once in a few years weather event" earlier this month, my deliveries (both FedEx and UPS) all arrived on time - sometimes on the afternoon truck rather than the morning one but, I'm hardly going to complain about a 4 hour difference - and I had packages coming in from both sides of the country, mostly on 2 or 3 day delivery. A couple of times, packages have even arrived earlier than anticipated.

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Founder & COO, Hayai India (hayai.in) / USA (hayaibroadband.com) // t: @mgcarley
Re:Understandable, but... by 400_guru · 2013-12-30 12:27 · Score: 1

Yes I do and our stuff WAS on time but knowing the roads and massive number of trees down around here that WAS impressive. The trucks were spending extra time and miles figuring out how to get to various addresses but not everyone was even accessible. We were told as many as 6 days to get power on but it was only 2. Yes it went off a few more times and our generator got a workout but as you say, live where we live and be prepared! Fedex called me to meet them down the road so they would not get stuck having to back a 53 footer away from a downed or 'low hanging' tree.

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There are two rules to success in life: 1) Don't tell everyone all that you know.

Procrastination is not someone else's problem by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:08 · Score: 2, Interesting

How about you don't wait until the 22nd or 23rd to order your gift and expect there to be 0 shipping/fulfillment issues? Yes, this is a service that has a "guaranteed" delivery date, but any common sense will tell you it's a best guess. Yes, it may be right 99% of the time, but obviously no one can predict weather, plane/truck issues, wrong inventory counts (Only 1 left in Stock!), etc.

'merica by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:09 · Score: 1, Insightful

#firstworldproblems

Re:'merica by SJHillman · 2013-12-26 05:44 · Score: 1

Google defines "First World" as "the industrialized capitalist countries of western Europe, North America, Japan, Australia, and New Zealand."
So unless you own a really crappy globe, "First World" and "Around the Globe" are not at odds, especially as Asian countries like India and China are pushing their way into First World status.
Re:'merica by plopez · 2013-12-26 05:49 · Score: 1

Unless you count the impact on the entire supply chain going back to China, India, Bangladesh etc.

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putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
Re:'merica by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 06:06 · Score: 1

#firstworldproblems
Does Slashdot use hashtags now, or are you just trying to look like a hipster?
Re:'merica by mrclisdue · 2013-12-26 07:36 · Score: 2

#hipster

Are these folks idolators? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:11 · Score: 3, Insightful

It seems to me, they worship physical objects, and not their Creator. Give the U.S.P.S. a break if there's a snowstorm. I can't believe that a holiday these folks allege to be a Religious one can be "ruined" because stuff they want (that has nothing to do with the religious observance) is a day late.

Re:Are these folks idolators? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:30 · Score: 4, Insightful

How do you know physical objects are not The Creator? For all you know, the universe could be run by Kindle Fire HDXs, and they only chose now to manifest themselves in reality.
Re:Are these folks idolators? by DoofusOfDeath · 2013-12-26 05:35 · Score: 1

Would do +1 insightful if I hadn't already posted a comment.
Re:Are these folks idolators? by LordLimecat · 2013-12-26 07:08 · Score: 2

Heres a hint: Christmas is not a religious celebration for the majority of people who observe it.
Re:Are these folks idolators? by khr · 2013-12-26 07:16 · Score: 1

Give the U.S.P.S. a break if there's a snowstorm
Not far from my apartment there's a huge post office in which "Neither snow nor rain nor heat nor gloom of night stays these couriers from the swift completion of their appointed rounds." is actually carved in stone.
Carved in stone seems to suggest a commitment.
Re:Are these folks idolators? by Dragonslicer · 2013-12-26 08:18 · Score: 1

Stop waging your War on Christmas!
Re:Are these folks idolators? by Cro+Magnon · 2013-12-26 09:09 · Score: 1

Sure it is! Don't you see the look in their eyes as they worship the 72" TV?

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Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
Re:Are these folks idolators? by JustOK · 2013-12-26 09:30 · Score: 1

That's why Mother Nature invented Sleet and paid vacations and sick days

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rewriting history since 2109
Re:Are these folks idolators? by ShaunC · 2013-12-26 13:29 · Score: 1

That commitment might explain a little bit about why, unlike UPS and FedEx, the United States Postal Service hasn't really had much of a problem. They've had the last-mile problem down to a science for many, many decades. You might get your mail at 9:30PM instead of 11AM, but by god, it's going to be there.

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Thanks to the War on Drugs, it's easier to buy meth than it is to buy cold medicine!
Re:Are these folks idolators? by DoofusOfDeath · 2013-12-27 01:43 · Score: 1

Right. Because name-calling will resolve the question about whether or not there's a God.

serious by kcmastrpc · 2013-12-26 05:12 · Score: 1, Insightful

I rarely say this, because it's so often overused... but... "1st world problems..."

Re:serious by memnock · 2013-12-26 05:37 · Score: 1

I was thinking the same. Instantaneous gratification probably played a hand in this. People are getting used thinking everything is a 24/7 operation and there can't ever be a hiccup.
I don't want to work on Thanksgiving or New Year's or any other major holiday and I feel bad for people who have to because there are customers to satisfy. I'm not talking about police or fire department. But does someone really need to go shopping or to see a movie on a holiday?

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"To stop the terrorists."

Tough choices... by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:14 · Score: 1

'While others take vacation and time off in December, remember we aren't allowed ever to be off in December. Ever,' said a 20-year veteran UPS driver on the UPS Facebook page.

As somone in a similar position (not career, but limited vacation-time availability), that's a career choice each person must make. If you aren't happy with it, change careers.

Re:Tough choices... by geoskd · 2013-12-26 07:12 · Score: 4, Insightful

'While others take vacation and time off in December, remember we aren't allowed ever to be off in December. Ever,' said a 20-year veteran UPS driver on the UPS Facebook page.
As somone in a similar position (not career, but limited vacation-time availability), that's a career choice each person must make. If you aren't happy with it, change careers.
And just what career do you think that a delivery driver (who I might add is not qualified to do anything requiring more than a high school diploma) is supposed to switch to? Remember, half of the people in the world have an IQ below 100 by definition. Should we just relegate all of these people to 2nd class citizen status with poverty level jobs (if any job at all)? Most of these people dont have any other options that offer any chance of paying enough to allow them to raise a family. Or is it your considered opinion that these people exist only to serve you? People like you invented slavery, and would have us return to it in the name of capitalism.

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I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
Re:Tough choices... by DNS-and-BIND · 2013-12-26 10:10 · Score: 1

I don't know if you're keeping up with the latest trends in left-wing thought, but the idea these days is to limit the freedom of second-class citizens and double-digit IQs. When given freedom, all they do is make wrong choices. See Bloomberg's ban on cola drinks.
Oh, and by the way, capitalist countries didn't start slavery. Capitalist countries ended slavery.

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Shutting down free speech with violence isn't fighting fascism. It IS fascism!

Re:What a load of BS by oodaloop · 2013-12-26 05:16 · Score: 1

See that first link? It quotes the high volume. Things can have more than one cause, and sometimes two causes work together. A lot of grown ups understand this.

That being said, having your gifts arrive a little late falls in the First World Problems category. Get over it.

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Tic-Tac-Toe, Global Thermonuclear War, and relationships all have the same winning move.

Re:What a load of BS by jedidiah · 2013-12-26 05:18 · Score: 1

I had packages delayed by the unusual weather. However, I did not despair or immediately go to social media to "vent". I realize that it sucks to be a delivery guy during Snowmageddon.

The kicker was the guy driving the golf cart.

That one made me feel a little guilty.

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A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.

Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 05:18 · Score: 2, Informative

'While others take vacation and time off in December, remember we aren't allowed ever to be off in December. Ever,' said a 20-year veteran UPS driver on the UPS Facebook page. 'So when you see your family and complain that your package is held up, everyone who moves your package is working and doesn't get the Xmas experience you get, Be thankful for that.'"

Hey, fuck you, buddy. They told you that shit about not taking time off during the busiest shipping season of the year when you took the job 20 fucking years ago, and probably reminded you every year since, so don't try to play the fucking victim here. Plus, "Dur, I had to work" is a really, really piss-poor excuse for failing to meet your work obligations, now isn't it?

I don't really get to take a lot of time off, period, but you don't see me using that as an excuse to suck at my job.

Side note: My wife ordered me a new watch on Dec. 4, shipped via UPS.

The current arrival date is sometime after Jan. 4.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Re:Fucking WAAAA. by kcmastrpc · 2013-12-26 05:21 · Score: 2

Side note: My wife ordered me a new watch on Dec. 4, shipped via UPS.
The current arrival date is sometime after Jan. 4.
Something tells me this has something to do with the fulfillment and not the shipper. You don't want to/can't wait for a package? Go to the store.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 05:24 · Score: 1

Side note: My wife ordered me a new watch on Dec. 4, shipped via UPS.
The current arrival date is sometime after Jan. 4.
Something tells me this has something to do with the fulfillment and not the shipper. You don't want to/can't wait for a package? Go to the store.
It was shipped Dec. 6.
Yes, I actually understand how to use a tracking number.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:35 · Score: 3, Funny

That's because it was destroyed. A bunch of thieves broke into a UPS factory and destroyed it. The UPS workers fought with their lives to protect your package and others, and 32 workers fell in the battle. How many lives must be lost before you are satisfied? You're still getting your watch, but remember who died to get it to you.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by hypergreatthing · 2013-12-26 05:46 · Score: 1

It's probably not a low level employee's fault personally that this happened. However, why the fuck would a low level employee try to even address the issue by telling others how harsh his work is and to be grateful? If you don't see the problem with that, then you are at a loss for even trying to understand why this would inflame people who weren't with their families and had to work as well.
Best course of action would have been to keep his mouth shut and let the company spin dr. explain what happened.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by plopez · 2013-12-26 05:52 · Score: 2

When anything bad happens it is never management's fault. They are, however, responsible for everything good that happens.

--
putting the 'B' in LGBTQ+
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 05:59 · Score: 1

I don't know how in hell you got that "insightful" moderation. Oh - the title of your post? "Fucking WAAAA" That's how I see you and the million or more Americans crying about your late deliveries.
Over the course of my own driving career, I seldom made a late delivery. But, when I did, there was a good reason for it. Reason number one, "I'm out of hours on my log book." Reason number two, "It's unsafe to drive in this weather."
If some cry baby at the other end cried to damned hard after being given one of those two reasons, then he could expect that he wouldn't get his goodies for an extra day or six. I can always stop off at home to take care of personal business.

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by BLKMGK · 2013-12-26 06:03 · Score: 1

Wow aren't you the entitled little prick? These guys are working their asses off well over a normal work week full of hours to try and fulfill a larger than predicted volume of demand doing physical work and THIS is your attitude? This doesn't sound to me like the guy is sucking at his job but rather being asked to do a good bit more than should be expected. It's a Christmas holiday, a time for people to be together with loved ones, and you're angry at people who gave that up to deliver packages for everyone else? Don't you get that it's not about gifts? Be happy you have someone to spend it with who will surely understand if something is late due to circumstances you don't control. Just wow....
Check your tracking info on the precious package that has you so excited. As others have pointed out, when you make the order companies print out a shipping label which produces a tracking number - even if they don't HAVE the item. It now shows up as being tracked but has often never left their premises and may not even be in stock. I see this nearly every time I order from NewEgg for instance. Then after a day or so (maybe because I never spend the extra for their "rush" processing) the thing shows up on a truck on it's way. I won't be surprised if your's has yet to show up on a truck and is instead just a label awaiting stock to go out.

--
Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by krakelohm · 2013-12-26 06:12 · Score: 2

Woah.... Who shit your Cheerios? Chill out man.

--
You are all a bunch of idots.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by petermgreen · 2013-12-26 06:23 · Score: 1

I would have been blaming the WRONG PARTY
Is it really wrong to blame the company who told you they had your package when they didn't?

--
note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by Bob+the+Super+Hamste · 2013-12-26 06:39 · Score: 1

He probably also blames the clerk at the gas station every time gas prices go up, and the dealers at the blackjack table when he hits a 16 and busts.

--
Time to offend someone
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by Bob+the+Super+Hamste · 2013-12-26 06:40 · Score: 1

It wasn't me, I just pissed in them.

--
Time to offend someone
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by fscking_coward_2001 · 2013-12-26 06:46 · Score: 1

I bet his job involves sucking
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by the+eric+conspiracy · 2013-12-26 07:03 · Score: 1

Be sure you blame the right company. Labels with tracking numbers are printed by the retailer and are shown to customers BEFORE the package is picked up by UPS.
I've seen lots of cases where the package wasn't actually handed off to UPS for a while after the retailer claims it was shipped.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:07 · Score: 2

So if you wanted it earlier you should have paid for expedited shipping.
Didn't bother to RTFS, did you? Even those who did pay for expedited shipping got screwed. Says so right there, at the top of this page.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:10 · Score: 1

I don't know how in hell you got that "insightful" moderation. Oh - the title of your post? "Fucking WAAAA" That's how I see you and the million or more Americans crying about your late deliveries.
We paid for a service, and the company we paid failed to provide said service. The Rules of Capitalism dictate that we have every right to bitch about it.

Over the course of my own driving career, I seldom made a late delivery. But, when I did, there was a good reason for it. Reason number one, "I'm out of hours on my log book." Reason number two, "It's unsafe to drive in this weather."
Yea, see, this is why I prefer to ship via USPS - they aren't huge pussies.

If some cry baby at the other end cried to damned hard after being given one of those two reasons, then he could expect that he wouldn't get his goodies for an extra day or six. I can always stop off at home to take care of personal business.
Nice work ethic you've got there, really drives home that point that you're a selfish asshole nobody should listen to.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by LordLimecat · 2013-12-26 07:10 · Score: 1

Yea thats not UPS's fault. Ive ordered a TON of stuff from Amazon and others over the past few weeks. Only one item failed to arrive within 3 days, and that one was backordered.
As a ton of people have pointed out, not all "shipping problems" are actually problems with the shipper.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:14 · Score: 1, Informative

Wow aren't you the entitled little prick?
Well, I paid them damn good money for a service they failed to deliver.
So yea, I am, and regardless of your attempts to marginalize the fact, I have every right to be.
Welcome to capitalism, bitch.

These guys are working their asses off well over a normal work week full of hours to try and fulfill a larger than predicted volume of demand doing physical work and THIS is your attitude?
They got paid, right? Probably overtime, too.
Meanwhile, I had to do my unfulfilling job for regular pay. Where's my pity party? Oh, that's right, I'm not a narcissistic little bitch who can't do his job and blames everyone else for his own failings, so I guess I don't get one. Bumtown.

Don't you get that it's not about gifts?
You obviously don't, or else I wouldn't have to keep repeating "capitalism" as if I were talking to some sort of idiot savant.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:16 · Score: 2, Interesting

Woah.... Who shit your Cheerios? Chill out man.
You know, that sort of attitude is why our economy is so fucked, and why corporations get away with murder.
A company took people's money in exchange for a promise of service, and subsequently failed to provide the service those people paid for. Why wouldn't we be pissed? Corporate America is sticking it to us again, and people are making fucking excuses for it!
Idiots advocating against their own best interest just sticks in my craw, I guess.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:19 · Score: 1

Doesn't seem to matter either way, there's precedent for this sort of thing: Shipper blames retailer, retailer blames shipper, somebody hands out a few token refunds, and the whole episode gets forgotten by the public-at-large within a month.
Maybe that's what really pisses me off about this: If I did my job as poorly as these retailers and shippers did, I'd be on the fucking streets, but Corporate America just gets to write the losses down and continue on like they didn't just fuck a ton of people out of money.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by geoskd · 2013-12-26 07:21 · Score: 1

'While others take vacation and time off in December, remember we aren't allowed ever to be off in December. Ever,' said a 20-year veteran UPS driver on the UPS Facebook page. 'So when you see your family and complain that your package is held up, everyone who moves your package is working and doesn't get the Xmas experience you get, Be thankful for that.'"
Hey, fuck you, buddy. They told you that shit about not taking time off during the busiest shipping season of the year when you took the job 20 fucking years ago, and probably reminded you every year since, so don't try to play the fucking victim here. Plus, "Dur, I had to work" is a really, really piss-poor excuse for failing to meet your work obligations, now isn't it?
I don't really get to take a lot of time off, period, but you don't see me using that as an excuse to suck at my job.
Side note: My wife ordered me a new watch on Dec. 4, shipped via UPS.
The current arrival date is sometime after Jan. 4.
What is the tracking #? unless you can provide a tracking # I call BS. If the shipper tells you they don't have the tracking # its because they haven't shipped it yet... If it doesn't start with a 1Z, then your package was not sent UPS, and that alone could be part of the problem. Get me that #, and I'll show you how to find out where your package is, and who you need to talk to about it...

--
I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:21 · Score: 1

was it actually shipped, or was the shipping info just entered into the UPS system? I've had nurmerous times experienced where it LOOKED like the item was in UPS's hands and stuck very early in their shipment process, but after a call to the retailer (Amazon) it was discovered the item was NEVER ACTUALLY GIVEN to UPS as Amazon didn't infact have ANY IN STOCK as their inventory levels were off. Hence, had I taken your attitude, I would have been blaming the WRONG PARTY
Well, IMO, they're both at fault, and for the same reason - they promised consumers products and services that they were unable to deliver. That constitutes a failure in my book, and regardless of what the retailers did, a company that sells itself on logistic competence has absolutely no excuse to drop the ball like this.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:23 · Score: 1

You know, if they sent me a letter to that effect, I might actually cut them some slack.
Maybe; I was raised in a capitalist society, after all...

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 07:38 · Score: 1

I suppose you completely missed the point. You are in no position to judge the conditions that the driver faces on the road. My boss was never in a position to judge those conditions, nor my wife, and most certainly not the customer. I once sat outside of the city of Buffalo New York for a week. Yes, an entire WEEK. When the cops finally opened the city to inbound traffic, I still didn't move. The wreckers were out, late into the night, towing away cars and trucks that got into trouble. The FOLLOWING DAY, I finally ventured into the city.
I decide when my wheels will roll - and you live with it.
If I were flying an aircraft, and decided that conditions were unsafe to take off, would you still feel that you had some right to bitch? Hey, put YOUR ASS in the pilot's seat, and see what it's like! When a mistake is going to end your life, are you going to worry about some pussy's fucking WAAAAA?

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by rochrist · 2013-12-26 07:39 · Score: 1

I'm pretty sure we can all see who the selfish asshole is here just fine.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by krakelohm · 2013-12-26 08:01 · Score: 1

There is a difference between being pissed and being a dick about something. Your 'fuck you, fuck that' attitude is not justified.

--
You are all a bunch of idots.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 08:09 · Score: 1

Yea, sorry man, but when you basically said "I don't care that I'm getting paid to do a certain job in a certain timeframe, I do shit my own way and fuck the people cutting my checks," I decided there's nothing you can say that's worth my time. I tend to get that way about lazy, selfish people.
Can't handle the demands of your work, find new employment. Nobody owes you a job.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by ultranova · 2013-12-26 08:13 · Score: 3, Informative

Maybe; I was raised in a capitalist society, after all...

Well then, what are you complaining about? The company has decided that its current level of effort maximizes its expected profits. Sucks for you, but that's usually the outcome for the weaker party to a deal in a capitalist society (or any society, for that matter).

--
Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 08:14 · Score: 1

There is a difference between being pissed and being a dick about something.
Ha, yea, namely perception. See, you've decided somewhere along the line that you don't agree with me, so that means, to you, I'm being a dick. Were you on the other side of the fence, I'm certain your perspective on the situation would be 180 degrees different.

Your 'fuck you, fuck that' attitude is not justified.
A matter of opinion, obviously.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by krakelohm · 2013-12-26 08:48 · Score: 1

True on both accounts.

--
You are all a bunch of idots.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 09:17 · Score: 1

Ahhhh - BUT - I'm so damned good at my job, that I can get a job anytime at all. I don't have to kiss some fool's ass just because he thinks that working class people should kowtow to him.
Fuck all the managers and assorted crybabies who think they run the world. You should have done a tour in the military. Colonels and generals don't get shit done - it's the NCO or PO who actually makes things happen. The next time you decide that you have some goal to meet, climb down off your pedestal, and talk to the people who are actually going to do the job.
No, I'm not a good little capitalist. I'm the man that the capitalists need to ensure their money isn't just pissed away on meaningless dreams.
Merry Christmas anyway, dipstick.

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by rochrist · 2013-12-26 10:22 · Score: 1

It hasn't been remotely demonstrated that he DIDN'T do his job. Just because YOU didn't get your little toy for Christmas, it does not follow that he, or any other UPS driver did not do his job, possibly above and beyond the call of duty. Your whining won't change the laws of physics. I might have a slight touch of sympathy for you if you actually went after the management, rather than the poor shmucks driving the trucks. For that matter, how about going after Amazon. They knew that there were likely to be problems with some orders being delivered on time and still continued to promise unrealistic order dates.
Re:Fucking WAAAA. by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-27 02:29 · Score: 1

Capitalism means you have a choice of suppliers.
That's one of the things that term entails, yes. You're leaving out quite a bit, tho.

But capitalism has nothing to do with manners, and it doesn't mean you can be an asshole to the delivery guy - who, in the original quote, was simply stating the facts - either in person or on an internet forum.
Uh, did you actually read the quote? He's not "simply stating facts" - he's whining about the expectations his employer has of him. Expectations he's known and accepted for 20 years. For example:
"... everyone who moves your package is working and doesn't get the Xmas experience you get, Be thankful for that."
If he was a slave, working for free? Yea, I might feel bad for him.
But he's not, he's actually a pretty well paid dude, probably makes more money than me. Do you see me pissing and moaning and attacking my customers (yes, attacking, unless you have another idea about why the dickhead tells us, "be thankful for that.") because I had to work on Christmas Eve? No. Why? A couple reasons: one, I'm not a selfish bitch. Two, I know damn good and well what's expected of me, and if I have a problem with it, I know where the door is.
Personally, if I were this UPS driver's boss? We'd be having a little pow-wow after I read this comment, one that would likely end with the driver's termination.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Re:What a load of BS by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 05:21 · Score: 1, Insightful

That being said, having the deliveries that you paid for timely delivery of arrive a little late falls in the First World Problems category.

Yea, still true, but that doesn't mean people shouldn't bitch - they paid for a specific service and the corporation failed to hold up their end of the bargain. UPS deserves to get hit hard for this, because they only do one thing, and they somehow failed to do that right.

Capitalism accepts no excuses.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

I just hate delays by twocows · 2013-12-26 05:22 · Score: 2

I get that there can be high load during holidays, and I'm not upset that I didn't get my purchase by the 25th (I wasn't expecting to), but when they miss my delivery date by as much as they're predicting they're going to, I should be compensated to some degree. I paid for 3-5 day shipping and it doesn't look like it's going to be 3-5 business days (I ordered Thursday and the estimate was this Thursday, they're now estimating it won't get here until next week). It has nothing to do with procrastination, the thing I ordered wasn't even a Christmas present, it was a replacement graphics card for my desktop (the current one failed about two weeks ago). The issue is that I paid for a particular service and I expect it to be completed as advertised. If it's not, then they should reasonably compensate me for the difference between advertised and delivered. Don't advertise "3-5 day shipping" if it's not 3-5 day shipping.

Re:I just hate delays by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 06:02 · Score: 2

I would go with the flip side of that. They shouldn't be advertising 3-5 business day shipping this close to Christmas. Instead of making empty promises for fast shipping, they should be stressing the fact that the longer you wait to order, the more likely it is to be late.

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br

Morons by jason777 · 2013-12-26 05:22 · Score: 1

What kind of idiot orders presents on dec 23 and thinks for sure it will get there? I go by dec 17 at the latest. I mean, every year UPS gets a backlog at this time, so a delay should be expected.

On the other hand... by wcrowe · 2013-12-26 05:23 · Score: 1

I had packages delivered both by UPS and FedEx last week. All were right on time. In fact, one of the FedEx packages was sent 2-day air, and actually arrived at its destination, 1500 miles away, a mere 19 hours after being sent.

--
Proverbs 21:19

Re:What a load of BS by Deadstick · 2013-12-26 05:25 · Score: 1

the delay has nothing to do with volume and everything to do with bad weather.

Well, a Fedex I received from my daughter calls BS on that. The tracking log showed that it went aboard a delivery truck on the guarantee date; returned to the shipping center that evening; and went back out the next morning.

BTW, where do you get your data?

Members of Amazon Prime can request one free month by JoeSchmoe007 · 2013-12-26 05:28 · Score: 1

Members of Amazon Prime can request one free month of Prime membership for each late package. I received 2 so far - just contact Customer Service via website.

Re: hey, seems like all my US Postal Service packa by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:35 · Score: 2, Informative

True story: UPS has handed off a lot of its last-leg delivery to the USPS, especially in rural areas. Those routes were never profitable for UPS so now they only deliver as far as the local post office, which doesn't exactly put a priority on delivering someone else's packages, so they may sit for a while before getting loaded on the USPS trucks for final delivery.
This happened to us 2 years ago - we'd ordered some stuff that would not arrive before we went to visit relatives, so (with their permission) we had it shipped to their house. According to the online tracking, it sat in their post office for two days before USPS deigned to deliver it. Fortunately, the packages were still "on time" that time, but we did have some worries over it.

So, just keep using surge protector strips by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:35 · Score: 1

until the UPS gets there..

Re:Thankful by damicatz · 2013-12-26 05:35 · Score: 5, Insightful

UPS and FedEx drivers have been working 10-12+ hour days 6-7 days a week since Thanksgiving.

Your Christmas will not be ruined because of a late package unless you value some item or trinket over spending time with your family. First world problems indeed.

Re:No sympathy here by Russ1642 · 2013-12-26 05:36 · Score: 1

But if you're told you can order 2 days before and still have it delivered on time, shouldn't you believe them?

no

Re:What a load of BS by Deadstick · 2013-12-26 05:36 · Score: 5, Insightful

That being said, having your gifts arrive a little late falls in the First World Problems category. Get over it.

True, but so is a corn futures contract. If you sell me one and the corn doesn't show up at the warehouse, I'm not gonna let you off the hook because you had a dry year...and Fedex/UPS should be expected to compensate their customers some way. It won't kill them to knock something off the next shipping bill.

Re:hey, seems like all my US Postal Service packag by zlives · 2013-12-26 05:37 · Score: 2

+1

sent mine using USPS and everything got in time.

Re:Members of Amazon Prime can request one free mo by Sarten-X · 2013-12-26 05:38 · Score: 3, Insightful

The libertarian thing to do, then, is to order many individual packages during December, with careful attention paid to the origin and destination so as to maximize the expected profit.

The invisible hand of the free market will finally serve the consumer!

--
You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:39 · Score: 2, Insightful

they didn't. The RETAILERS did. As of the 19th both FedEx and UPS said there was NO guarentee for a "By the 24th" delivery date, yet the retails kept that promise. The blame is getting passed onto the wrong parties

Re:No sympathy here by Desler · 2013-12-26 05:40 · Score: 1

Nope.

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by SJHillman · 2013-12-26 05:41 · Score: 2

When I pick a political candidate to vote for, I know he won't keep all of his campaign promises so I apply common sense to weed out the more farfetched ones.

Likewise, when a company promises something that seems a bit farfetched (like making last minute deliveries just before Christmas), I know there's a good chance they'll fall short. It may not be ideal for the consumer, but it's how the world works.

Surprisingly, USPS delivered all of our Christmas cards by the 23rd in spite of us not getting them out until the 21st, which was after their "Will deliver by Christmas" deadline.

Why, indeed by jamesl · 2013-12-26 05:44 · Score: 1

'Well then why, all the way up until the 23rd, were they offering next-day delivery?

Well they why, if it was so important, did you wait all the way up until the 23rd to place your order or ship your package?

In any case, UPS was not guaranteeing on-time delivery well before the 23rd. I sent a package through the local UPS store where they made it clear that they couldn't and wouldn't guarantee delivery by Christmas even though it was shipped in time.

Re:Why, indeed by nedlohs · 2013-12-26 06:17 · Score: 1

Because planning is for people with a brain cell or two.

Re:What a load of BS by Desler · 2013-12-26 05:45 · Score: 2

As others have said above, UPS and Fedex were both stating close to a week before Christmas that they couldn't guarantee shipment times. If you were given such a guarantee even after that point it was because the retailers were lying to you.

Narcissistic Society says by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:47 · Score: 5, Insightful

"'I wanted it tomorrow and it didn't make it, I don't give a shit about the massive volume of items from other procrastinators like myself or the ice storms and other weather, I WANT MY SHIT IT'S THE CARRIERS FAULT!' mentality is just so damn annoying."

Society is increasingly narcissistic. The person to whom this is a reply is correct in the statement quoted above as he explains the instant-gratification mentality he observes.

Re:Narcissistic Society says by neonKow · 2013-12-26 07:21 · Score: 1

Seriously. Thanks to instant gratification and the internet, it appears that all of us have dropped about 50 IQ points and decided that weather and logistics are not real things and there is no reason why clicking on a few things on our computer shouldn't cause packages to materialize on our doorstep.

Re:What a load of BS by SJHillman · 2013-12-26 05:47 · Score: 1

Tracking logs are not always accurate. Especially with FedEx... More than once I've had them mark a package Delivered several days before it actually showed up on my doorstep.

Re:What a load of BS by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 05:49 · Score: 1

"The tracking log showed that it went aboard a delivery truck on the guarantee date; returned to the shipping center that evening; and went back out the next morning."

I can't help wondering if that is true. Is it possible that you don't read the tracking log correctly? Or, is it more possible that someone logged it incorrectly?

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br

Re:Winter Weather by jedidiah · 2013-12-26 05:49 · Score: 2

Many places don't expect "winter weather" in winter and are ill equipped to handle it when it actually happens.

Pretty much the bottom half of the country...

--
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.

Re:Thankful by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 05:50 · Score: 1

No kidding. All of those drivers working their asses off so people can get their CRAPPY stuff. Be thankful that you have family and friends to spend time with and sit down and eat food. These drivers never get to spend the holidays with their families. Nearly every single person complaining has no room to complain. Now, if they ordered their package 3 weeks ago, it shipped and still hasn't arrived, that's one thing. But that's probably no the fault of the delivery company unless it's DHL or USPS.

Re:What a load of BS by BLKMGK · 2013-12-26 05:51 · Score: 1

That does sound like volume to me. It went on a delivery truck along with a zillion other packages and the guy simply couldn't make it to all of the stops before he was forced to end his day - so it was returned to go out the next day on another delivery truck. Does that not sound like a volume issue?

I too ordered some things late and I had no great expectation they would arrive despite my promised date. To my surprise they did manage to show up and except for one package that's supposed to show up today (and was predicted that way too) all went well. I think overall these guys did an awesome job and while I understand for some it could be pretty frustrating were it not for these services we wouldn't have ANY expectation of being able to shop so late. Heaven forbid we're all forced to go back to the hell that is a mall just days before Christmas! :-O

--
Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org

Overworked UPS Drivers and Lowly Paid Temps... by Ron+Bennett · 2013-12-26 05:52 · Score: 1

Not surprised at all. To digress a bit, many of the packages delayed were sent well in advance of the Christmas holiday - many reports mention packages sitting for over a week in trailers.

With that out of the way, UPS drivers are expected to make many more delivery stops than they used to. These days, 200+ is common with upwards of 300+ during holidays...

UPS drivers are still well paid, but are worked far harder. More specifically, in regards to the holidays, an ever increasing reliance on seasonal "driver helpers" (typically paid $8-$10 per hour), which is hit and miss; spotty attendance, delivery mistakes, rough handling, theft, etc.

To put it simply, the drivers are spread thin. Very little extra delivery capacity to pick up the slack than in the past.

This incident will further push Amazon and other large retailers to contract out more delivery to smaller regional / local companies; more leverage to negotiate better pricing / service levels with the big name shippers.

Re:No sympathy here by SJHillman · 2013-12-26 05:52 · Score: 1

Only if you can still count your birthdays on one hand. Most people understand that shipping is prone to unexpected delays year round, and it's almost guaranteed by mid-December.

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by lgw · 2013-12-26 05:52 · Score: 3, Informative

UPS stopped making any promises mid-December, as did FedEx. They knew, and were honest and upfront about it. What more can you ask of them? You should be asking why Amazon was still making promises they knew they couldn't stand behind.

--
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.

Re:No sympathy here by Runaway1956 · 2013-12-26 05:53 · Score: 2

Sure you can believe them. Retards are allowed to believe any damned thing they like. Children are allowed to believe any thing their parents encourage them to believe. Fools can believe in Utopia. Progressives can believe that they are evolved. And, you can believe that your Christmas order, placed on December 22nd, will be personally, and lovingly handled by a Christmas elf so that will arrive at the stroke of midnight on Christmas day.

--
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br

Thanks Obama! by Rinikusu · 2013-12-26 05:54 · Score: 1

(sarcasm).

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If you were me, you'd be good lookin'. - six string samurai

Re: hey, seems like all my US Postal Service packa by SJHillman · 2013-12-26 05:55 · Score: 1

This is why I've started having important or time-sensitive packages delivered to the local UPS or FedEx store. It's not quite as convenient as being delivered right to my door, but I can usually get it a day or two earlier and don't have to worry about it being left in a mud puddle with a muddy welcome mat put over it (I'm looking at you, FedEx).

Meh... by mythosaz · 2013-12-26 05:55 · Score: 5, Informative

First, The UPS "guaranteed on-schedule delivery" already includes the following:

The guarantee does not apply to UPS shipments that are delayed due to causes beyond UPS's control, including, but not limited to, the following:
[SNIPPED some basic things, strikes, acts of god, government, customs, etc.]
disruptions in air or ground transportation networks, such as weather phenomena; and natural disasters.
The guarantee does not apply to UPS 2nd Day Air A.M., UPS 2nd Day Air, UPS 3 Day Select, and UPS Ground shipments that are picked up or scheduled to be delivered between December 12 and December 25.

http://www.ups.com/media/en/terms_service_us.pdf

Can you read that? Christmas is excluded. The whole Christmas season is excluded. ...and they're still offering compensation.

Good guy UPS.

Re:Meh... by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:28 · Score: 1

First, The UPS "guaranteed on-schedule delivery" already includes the following:

The guarantee does not apply to UPS shipments that are delayed due to causes beyond UPS's control, including, but not limited to, the following:
[SNIPPED some basic things, strikes, acts of god, government, customs, etc.]
disruptions in air or ground transportation networks, such as weather phenomena; and natural disasters.
The guarantee does not apply to UPS 2nd Day Air A.M., UPS 2nd Day Air, UPS 3 Day Select, and UPS Ground shipments that are picked up or scheduled to be delivered between December 12 and December 25.
http://www.ups.com/media/en/terms_service_us.pdf
Can you read that? Christmas is excluded. The whole Christmas season is excluded.
Huh, reads like an advertisement for USPS to me...

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:Meh... by mythosaz · 2013-12-26 08:25 · Score: 2

USPS has a money-back guarantee for Priority Mail Express (in most markets), but charges more for holiday delivery.
https://www.usps.com/ship/priority-mail-express.htm
So, like any consumer, you choose the shipper that best meets your needs based on their well documented service offers.

First world problems by symbolset · 2013-12-26 05:56 · Score: 4, Insightful

If you ordered a gift at the last possible second, the problem is not UPS. It's you.

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Help stamp out iliturcy.

Re:First world problems by BradleyUffner · 2013-12-26 07:01 · Score: 1

If you ordered a gift at the last possible second, the problem is not UPS. It's you.
Unless the seller guarantees that the item will arrive on time. Even then the problem is most likely with the seller, not the shipper.
Re:First world problems by arkhan_jg · 2013-12-26 07:56 · Score: 1

I got presents for my nephews that arrived late (from a seller that only shipped in-country), so I was delayed shipping them on to where they live. Entirely my fault for not ordering earlier, and I fully warned my sister that they would likely arrive after xmas, and sent extras with my parents (they were tight on room for luggage, so could only send small presents that way). Estimated delivery window fell right around xmas.
As it turned out, they only took 4 working days to cross europe, and arrived on xmas eve. Very grateful, and thankful for the delivery guys working right up to xmas to get stuff there in time - and if it had arrived after, as I fully expected to, I certainly wouldn't have complained.
People bitching because stuff ordered xmas 23rd didn't arrive on the 24th across a country the size of the US? Blimey, talk about a sense of entitlement.

--
Remember kids, it's all fun and games until someone commits wholesale galactic genocide.
Re:First world problems by symbolset · 2013-12-26 08:03 · Score: 1

Believe it or not, some people are already shopping for gifts for next Christmas. Imagine that.

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Help stamp out iliturcy.
Re:First world problems by D'Sphitz · 2013-12-26 09:43 · Score: 1

If you ordered a gift at the last possible second, the problem is not UPS. It's you.
I have many problems, but Monday morning xmas shopping wasn't one of them, it worked out just fine. I don't know if it's funny, sad, or stupid how self righteous people are on the internet over the most petty and inconsequential shit. Good job on your shopping this year champ, pat yourself on the back.
Re:First world problems by NormalVisual · 2013-12-26 10:53 · Score: 1

Only 364 shopping days left!

Seriously though, I ordered some non-Christmas stuff from Amazon this past weekend, but even with a 2-day shipping guarantee, I knew at least some of it was getting here after Christmas because I knew the shippers were getting slammed, and I'm kind of surprised that more people didn't think about that. Boo hoo, I had to wait for my BeagleBone case and UV resist film to get here today when it was promised Tuesday. Whatever shall I do?

--
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Re:What a load of BS by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 05:59 · Score: 1

As others have said above, UPS and Fedex were both stating close to a week before Christmas that they couldn't guarantee shipment times. If you were given such a guarantee even after that point it was because the retailers were lying to you.

That's assuming the order I'm complaining about was placed close to a week before Christmas.

It wasn't, unless we're going by the abstract concept of "close to," in that December 4th is closer to Christmas than June 17th.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

USPS Where are you?? by Capt+James+McCarthy · 2013-12-26 05:59 · Score: 1

All this revenue that could be pulled by the one time largest shipper in the US, but for some reason, they keep losing billions a year.

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There are no loopholes. It's either legal or it's not.

Re:USPS Where are you?? by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 06:35 · Score: 1

USPS is shipping plenty of things too.
But they also don't have a problem with their revenue.
Their problem is with Congressionally-mandated expenses. And no I don't mean abuse of the franking privilege.
Re:USPS Where are you?? by unitron · 2013-12-26 07:04 · Score: 2

I'm gathering you haven't heard about the "Murder the Post Office in Slow Motion" law passed in 2006?

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Re:USPS Where are you?? by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:29 · Score: 4, Informative

All this revenue that could be pulled by the one time largest shipper in the US, but for some reason, they keep losing billions a year.
No, they aren't "losing billions a year."
It just looks that way, because the USPS is the only government body that's required (thanks to Congressional legislation) to fund ALL retirements and pensions through the next decade.
If it were allowed to be ran like any other government agency, the Post Office would actually be doing OK.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese
Re:USPS Where are you?? by Actually,+I+do+RTFA · 2013-12-26 07:47 · Score: 1

If it were allowed to be ran like any other government agency, the Post Office would actually be doing OK.
Or to use the same accounting methods as almost every private enterprise. I say "almost" because I'm fairly sure there are some sole-proprietorships/partnerships that get a tax advantage from doing that screwball accounting.

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Re:USPS Where are you?? by Idarubicin · 2013-12-26 08:45 · Score: 1

All this revenue that could be pulled by the one time largest shipper in the US, but for some reason, they keep losing billions a year.
There are a number of regulations imposed on the USPS which prevent it from competing effectively with UPS and FedEx in certain markets. One of the most relevant to this discussion is that the USPS is not allowed to own its own fleet of cargo aircraft.
Yes, you read that correctly. The USPS must contract with private suppliers for air shipment capacity. Some USPS freight is carried by the cargo arms of domestic airlines like Delta and United. A big chunk of USPS air freight, though, goes by FedEx because the USPS isn't allowed to carry it themselves.

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~Idarubicin
Re:USPS Where are you?? by Belegothmog · 2013-12-26 10:26 · Score: 1

All this revenue that could be pulled by the one time largest shipper in the US, but for some reason, they keep losing billions a year.
No, they aren't "losing billions a year."
It just looks that way, because the USPS is the only government body that's required (thanks to Congressional legislation) to fund ALL retirements and pensions through the next decade.
If it were allowed to be ran like any other government agency, the Post Office would actually be doing OK.
Is this the same as saying, "If it were allowed to pretend to pay its bills like any other government agency, the Post Office would actually be doing OK."?
Re:USPS Where are you?? by will_die · 2013-12-26 18:51 · Score: 1

Please stop repeating this lie, granted it is repeated enough on alot of hate sites. For you it was probably a mistake since you did not know the truth.
Congress want to protect the taxpayer from having to take over the duties that the USPS said they would do,back in the 70s, the postmaster general and the postal unions want to make the taxpayers pay for their poor management and keep things as they are.
The postal accountability law,2006, requires the USPS to actually do some proper financial management and dropping it would not make them competitive again; even ignore the money they owe for this they would of lost money for the last couple of years. Without the money set aside they would not be able the meet the obligations they agreed to back in the 1970s and the people who are retiring now would not have the monies that they are suppose to get.
BTW the 75 years, not life, is number of years that is for ACCOUNTING purposes they have to figure future liabilities. It is NOT how long they have to fund benefits. That 75 years of accounting is followed by the DoD, social security, department of Housing, etc.

Re:What a load of BS by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 06:01 · Score: 1

Tracking logs are not always accurate. Especially with FedEx... More than once I've had them mark a package Delivered several days before it actually showed up on my doorstep.

That must be why I find it... less than comforting... that our government wants to replace USPS with these stooges.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Communication by Cigamit · 2013-12-26 06:02 · Score: 1

I think what made a lot of people mad is the way it was all handled. Since I had a few packages that were delayed for a week (mid December), I was checking out a lot of the online complaints at the time.

The online tracking sometimes wasn't updated for days when the package was just sitting in a truck waiting to be unloaded somewhere. Sometimes the package would do something wacky, like go from Dallas to Illinois and back again. Other times the package would be marked out for delivery for 3-4 days straight.
Those UPS workers maintaining the UPS Social Media accounts seems more like drones, their only answer was "Please keep checking your tracking number on our website to know when it will arrive".
Phone support wait was long, and usually the reps would just hang up on you when you finally got one.
People were overnight shipping perishable goods, that then got delayed for over a week. Week old defrosted steaks, yum.
UPS claimed a 3 day weather delay in Dallas was completely responsible for the week plus delay, even though the packages before the storm were also being delayed.
They claimed to be using FIFO on the packages, yet while my 2 packages were stuck in Dallas for a week, I 2-day shipped another item and got it 1-day through that same hub. (I have never gotten something that fast, so it was extremely odd)
They claimed to be sending 3500 additional workers to Dallas to help sort. I could have sworn How Its Made (or How Do They Do It) did a show that showed how sorting was all automated nowadays, so it makes you wonder if they really had a system meltdown and just blamed it on whatever was convenient.

My items weren't important so the delay didn't bother me much. As always, I did get my UPS driver a nice card and gift certificate for Christmas. I appreciate him driving out to my house 100+ times a year since I live in the middle of no where.

Re:Thankful by anglico · 2013-12-26 06:03 · Score: 5, Interesting

When I was a driver (~2000) we could only be on the road for 12 hours (13 with lunch) if I remember correctly, so whether we were finished or not, we had to be back at the building within that time frame. Every Christmas I worked as a driver we were taking packages on the way home in our cars, on our own time, to make sure people got their presents.

Re:Thankful by callmebill · 2013-12-26 06:09 · Score: 1

GP's point (and the point made in the summary) is still valid, though: Customers were still offered 2-day shipping, when the grounded planes and full trucks should have caused a red flag to be raised indicating that the offered delivery window will not be as dependable as it usually is.

It had been an issue for the last few weeks by ArhcAngel · 2013-12-26 06:12 · Score: 1

I ordered something on the 12th of Dec. for scheduled delivery of the 17th and was seeing the warning on both FedEx and UPS saying weather was preventing delivery in many cases even though neither the product origin or my home were affected by the weather in question. Can only assume planes were grounded in those places preventing them from reaching other sites. I think it reached a head on Christmas Eve since a package I was expecting that day was at the depot but lost in their pile of orders. Says I should get it today!

--
"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K

For my own anectdotal evidence by gman003 · 2013-12-26 06:13 · Score: 1

For what its worth, all of my orders came in before Xmas. Some that were actually projected for the vague "December 20-January 3" range ended up being delivered on the 23rd, and the one order that did end up being late was projected for Dec 16 (arriving on the 20th).

So while this issue may be widespread (one anecdote doesn't prove them all wrong), it may be localized to certain regions.

Re:What a load of BS by Zynder · 2013-12-26 06:18 · Score: 1

Capitalism accepts no excuses.

You know I never thought of it like that but you are absolutely right. That's insightful there, thanks. It made me realize something that is insightful as well. You know who will accept an excuse, hardship, extenuating circumstances, and is just generally a more compassionate system? Socialism. Whenever capitalists dig their grave too deep to get back out of and capitalism stops accepting their excuses, they all come running to socialism to bail them out. And every single time, we invite the greedy fucks back into our homes and vaults, they take whatever they think they can get away with, and then turn around and try to kill the system that just saved them via legislation and all other types of general douchebag moves. In this context, people that tend towards liberal/socialist beliefs are battered women who keep on believing that the handsome and strong conservative capitalists aren't gonna keep beating them, even when historically they always have.

One word summary by Megane · 2013-12-26 06:19 · Score: 1

"Uups!"

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#naabhaprzrag, #sverubfr-000, #agi-fcbafberq, negvpyr[pynff*=' negvpyr-ary-'] { qvfcynl: abar !vzcbegnag; }

Asking the wrong question, and responsibility by dkman · 2013-12-26 06:22 · Score: 1

Asked why the company underestimated the volume of air packages it would receive, Black noted that previous severe weather ...

Umm, because we have very little influence on the volume... Perhaps you might think about that!?

Forecasting what kind of increase in online vs physical shopping is going to happen from year to year is some kind of black magic or dump luck - something akin to meteorology. Yea you can have an educated guess, but what really happens isn't in your control.

Sure, if you went out of your way to pay extra for 1 or 2 day delivery and it didn't arrive on time you have some right to whine, but if you waited until December 22nd to order your Christmas present then that's really on YOU.
There's a serious lack of taking responsibility in this country. It's been brewing for a while, but it needs to be repeated.

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I refuse to sign

Smallest Violin by ThatsNotPudding · 2013-12-26 06:23 · Score: 1

You're foolish or lazy enough to cut ordering gifts that close and have the unmitigated gall to whine when the dice you rolled came up snake-eyes? Eff right off.

Re:Smallest Violin by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:31 · Score: 2

You're foolish or lazy enough to cut ordering gifts that close and have the unmitigated gall to whine when the dice you rolled came up snake-eyes? Eff right off.
I've read reports of people who ordered stuff on Black Friday and are still waiting on UPS to find and deliver their packages.
Where are you folks getting the idea that this fiasco only affected last-minute orders?

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Logistic is complicated by ThePhilips · 2013-12-26 06:24 · Score: 2

Logistic is complicated. That's why for so many years now I have a rule: never order any shipment in three last weeks of December and first two weeks of January.

I had anecdotal experience when a parcel from Amazon ordered first week of January came to me sooner than a parcel I have ordered a week before Xmas.

So for the sake of the inner calm, I have simply stopped ordering on-line during this time.

--
All hope abandon ye who enter here.

Re:Logistic is complicated by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 06:50 · Score: 1

Inner calm? There's nothing calm about a department store in December; I'm pretty sure the Thunder Dome in the Mad Max movies was a reenactment of Macy's in December. I'll roll the dice, thanks.
Re:Logistic is complicated by ThePhilips · 2013-12-26 07:16 · Score: 1

Waiting in line an hour is nothing compared to the knowledge that my parcel is stuck in some cold way station. Or due to overload had to make a road trip across the whole country. Especially when it is a piece of electronics. I'd rather wait or wait in line and pay more in the retail.

I'll roll the dice, thanks.
The only thing which can't wait are the gifts. The trick is to buy gifts before, for example in November.

--
All hope abandon ye who enter here.

Re:Thankful by Salgak1 · 2013-12-26 06:25 · Score: 3, Insightful

. . .except, of course, that it was NOT UPS (or FedEx, or DHL. . . ) that promised the 2-day shipping. The MERCHANTS did. And that's who the medium-large can'o'whoop@ss should be opened on. . .

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by Bob+the+Super+Hamste · 2013-12-26 06:31 · Score: 1

I have wondered the same as I remember when I was younger if you ordered something (a rare thing then) that you wanted to make sure you ordered it 2 weeks to be sure it would arrive before Christmas and 7-10 days was about the bare minimum you could push it to.

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Time to offend someone

Re:Common sense by ISoldat53 · 2013-12-26 06:34 · Score: 1

If only Christmas came on the same date every year people could plan ahead and not have to wait until the last second.

Re:What a load of BS by Bob+the+Super+Hamste · 2013-12-26 06:35 · Score: 1

At least I feel better now knowing that I am not the only person that this has happened to.

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Time to offend someone

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by Talderas · 2013-12-26 06:36 · Score: 1

Which means that if Amazon was promising it when their shipping providers weren't making that promise, Amazon should have been looking for alternative shipping methods that could meet the promise.

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"Lack of speed can be overcome. In the worst case by patience." --Znork

Ordered dec 23 got it dec 24 by Bruha · 2013-12-26 06:37 · Score: 1

Just ordered some small toy we thought our son would like and it arrived just fine. But it was no big deal if it was late either. Some areas of the country had weather issues and shit happens.

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by torkus · 2013-12-26 06:39 · Score: 3, Insightful

The problem is the vast majority of people sending things aren't interacting with UPS or FedEx other than selecting shipping speed through xyzshopping.com

They were told 'last day to order for xmas eve delivery is 11:59PM on Dec 23rd (or whatever) by the retailer.

Last second shopping? Go to a freaking store people. :)

--
You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.

True, but not really the point either! by King_TJ · 2013-12-26 06:40 · Score: 2

Any attempts to place blame on the employees working 10+ hour days for the carriers and not getting any vacation time is uncalled for. But the problem does lie at the feet of upper management!

As others said, it's not like they should have been taken by surprise that they had a pending problem, if there was a backlog of undelivered packages due to bad weather., just ahead of the holiday rush.

Every online merchant I visited promised "guaranteed delivery before Xmas" if I placed an order by a certain cutoff date (and paid the heavy markup on shipping costs required to upgrade to overnight delivery).

It was irresponsible of the carriers to let everyone believe those commitments would still be met, if they had a backlog in the pipeline.

It might be in the "spirit of the holiday" to say we should just forgive and not get worried about this. But this was a corporation charging you good money based on a promise they literally failed to deliver on. I'm sure some people spent nearly as much as the merchandise itself cost to ensure it arrived someplace before Christmas. They certainly deserve refunds.

Re:Outright lies by fscking_coward_2001 · 2013-12-26 06:41 · Score: 1

You don't say where the package was going, but it's possible the delay was related to conditions at or on the way to another hub in the system. Look at the airline system. You often see weather-related delays and cancellations in areas where weather is fine. It's like a domino effect, rippling over the whole interconnected system.

Re:What a load of BS by Kijori · 2013-12-26 06:54 · Score: 1

Your order was shipped on December 4th and not received before Christmas?

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by geoskd · 2013-12-26 07:00 · Score: 2

Which means that if Amazon was promising it when their shipping providers weren't making that promise, Amazon should have been looking for alternative shipping methods that could meet the promise.

I'll give you a hint: There aren't any.

Why do you think Amazon has been making noises about starting their own delivery services. They are sick of the results they have been getting from *all* of the existing delivery companies. To Amazon I say, "Good Luck", let me know how that works out for you...

--
I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted

Re:What a load of BS by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:02 · Score: 1

It happens - One of the packages I had sent last year had OUT FOR DELIVERY on the tracking page at least 3 different days before it actually showed up at my house.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Re:What a load of BS by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:03 · Score: 1

Yup; original date on the tracking page was Dec. 7, which changed to Dec. 14, which changed to Dec. 17, which changed to Dec. 23, which is now sitting at Jan. 4.

Which is why I roll my eyes every time I see one of those "dur, shoulda shipped it sooner" posts.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Re:Thankful by avandesande · 2013-12-26 07:04 · Score: 1

Not to mention the thought that paying less for things + no sales tax has a risk associated with. Nothing is for free.

--
love is just extroverted narcissism

Re:Thankful by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 07:04 · Score: 4, Insightful

Thanks.

Shop Early by LMariachi · 2013-12-26 07:07 · Score: 2

In the early 20th century there was a movement encouraging people to shop early, so as to be considerate of retail and delivery employees’ health and sanity.

Core to "Shop Early" was the notion that "the crowding of the shops by late purchasers of Christmas gifts is a crude and obvious denial of the Christmas spirit," as a 1913 editorial in the The Outlook magazine put it. "It is dishonoring the day to cause thousands upon thousands of girls and women to dread its approach."
The "Shop Early" ethos was around for decades, though it faded along with the political star of the progressives who popularized it. Today, some people still try to shop early, but the ethos is dead. Every opportunity for consumer convenience is extolled.

Source article.

UPS and Amazon Are Winning by the+eric+conspiracy · 2013-12-26 07:08 · Score: 2, Insightful

The real war on Christmas.

The day after the birthday of the Savior what do we have as news? UPS couldn't deliver packages full of meaningless crap.

This is so wrong.

Re:UPS and Amazon Are Winning by Anonymous Coward · 2013-12-26 13:08 · Score: 1

Truly devoted Christians celebrate Christ each day, and express his teachings in all of their actions. Christmas, therefore, shouldn't actually be anything special (spiritually speaking).
So, the current tradition is a largely shallow festival of vain consumerism. People are going to do that sort of thing, and God knows this because God created people with such inclinations. The truly devoted need not lament this, and their efforts at inspiring others are better achieved by living as examples of God's love, rather than going around making accusations about how people choose to party at the end of the year.

Re: hey, seems like all my US Postal Service packa by geoskd · 2013-12-26 07:17 · Score: 2

True story: UPS has handed off a lot of its last-leg delivery to the USPS, especially in rural areas. Those routes were never profitable for UPS so now they only deliver as far as the local post office, which doesn't exactly put a priority on delivering someone else's packages, so they may sit for a while before getting loaded on the USPS trucks for final delivery. This happened to us 2 years ago - we'd ordered some stuff that would not arrive before we went to visit relatives, so (with their permission) we had it shipped to their house. According to the online tracking, it sat in their post office for two days before USPS deigned to deliver it. Fortunately, the packages were still "on time" that time, but we did have some worries over it.

What you are referring to is a specific cut rate service level that UPS offers to shippers. It is called Surepost, and FedEx has their own version of it. You can avoid this by ensuring that the shipper sends your package by ground, or one of the air variants. If the shipper is offering free shipping, or just says UPS shipping, then it is most likely the above mentioned shipping option. Neither UPS nor FedEx will ever downgrade any other shipment type to the USPS, so unless you are only paying for the cut rate shipping, your package will be delivered to you by UPS or FedEx.

--
I wish I had a good sig, but all the good ones are copyrighted

What the hell? by austerestyle · 2013-12-26 07:18 · Score: 1

Since when has everyone turned into cry babies? I'm literally ill after reading people's complaints. If you wanted it on time, make precautions, guaranteed delivery is rarely delivered. Order early if it matters so much for you. Lay off the companies who never even made the guarantees in the first place. If everyone ordered at a date not crammed near Christmas, these poor guys can actually spend it at home with their families rather than carrying your iJunk on their backs.

Re:What a load of BS by Deadstick · 2013-12-26 07:20 · Score: 1

Isn't that what I said?

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by neonKow · 2013-12-26 07:24 · Score: 1

I still remember ordering things by mail! Then you have to factor in the time to mail in your order and for them to process your hand-written order! And you'd better double-check that you calculated the total and taxes correctly too!

Re:What a load of BS by Deadstick · 2013-12-26 07:24 · Score: 1

It was logged as "On vehicle for delivery" twice, on two consecutive mornings.

Re:What a load of BS by Kijori · 2013-12-26 07:29 · Score: 1

Capitalism accepts no excuses.

You know I never thought of it like that but you are absolutely right. That's insightful there, thanks. It made me realize something that is insightful as well. You know who will accept an excuse, hardship, extenuating circumstances, and is just generally a more compassionate system? Socialism. Whenever capitalists dig their grave too deep to get back out of and capitalism stops accepting their excuses, they all come running to socialism to bail them out. And every single time, we invite the greedy fucks back into our homes and vaults, they take whatever they think they can get away with, and then turn around and try to kill the system that just saved them via legislation and all other types of general douchebag moves. In this context, people that tend towards liberal/socialist beliefs are battered women who keep on believing that the handsome and strong conservative capitalists aren't gonna keep beating them, even when historically they always have.

You talk about "socialism" all through your post, and then about "liberal/socialist beliefs" in your final sentence. I'm not sure why; liberalism and socialism are completely separate political philosophies, with significant contradictions. They are not interchangeable.

More generally, the image that you conjure is of someone repeatedly suffering from the failings of capitalism, but continuing to support it and stick up for it, unquestioningly faithful that it will do better next time. Socialism is a pretty broad church, but I don't think you would find any socialists with those views. The views that you describe as socialist are in many ways the exact opposite of traditional socialism.

There are varying 'degrees' of socialism, but in a great many cases it involves believing that capitalism cannot, and will not, do a good job of managing certain sectors, and so it should either be removed completely or heavily regulated - i.e. the opposite of what you are describing as socialist.

"Socialism" and "liberalism" are not simply pejorative terms for anyone who disagrees with you. In this case, the views you dislike are more prevalent among capitalist, economically right-wing people; for example, the UK's Conservative chancellor, a center-right conservative capitalist, recently went on record stating that his view was that bailing out the banks after a crisis is the price to be paid for the benefits of unregulated capitalism.

There's a reason by kilodelta · 2013-12-26 07:33 · Score: 1

Why UPS nickname is Shit Wrapped in Chiffon. They're awful. I've ordered items outside holiday times to find that they'd say an item was delivered and it wasn't, etc.

If i must get a package or receive one I cannot stress this enough, the United Stats Postal Service does a far better job of it. You can print the postage at home, they GIVE you the Priority mail 3 day boxes and they'll even pickup your packages to go out.

All my amazon purchases went USPS - and all got there PRIOR to the 24th. In fact I had shipped a package from Providence, RI to northeast NC on the 19th of this month and it got there before the 24th! If you have to ship, USPS is the deal! I use the medium shipping box, it's $11.30 to ship. How much would UPS charge for a similar? $12.75 and they won't pick it up from a residence. Oh and USPS - for the $11.30 you get the full tracking.

Re:What a load of BS by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-26 07:37 · Score: 2

In UPS's defense, I will point out that every other package they shipped this year was delivered on time, to the right address.

Still, I've had entirely too many issues with that company in the past to ever voluntarily trust a delivery to them.

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by Rob+the+Bold · 2013-12-26 07:53 · Score: 1

if you thought ordering something on the 20th was a good idea and you'd have it by the 25th, you're a retard. every postal or package service gets slowed during the christmas season in north america.fact, every year, every time.

This approach is also great to use on the boss: "Sorry, Mr. Bossman. I promised you these changes by last Friday when you needed them, but you've got to admit the real fault lies in you for believing me.

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I am not a crackpot.

Re:Thankful by anglico · 2013-12-26 08:29 · Score: 2

By the time you become a driver you have spent at least 5 years with the company, so if there were any doubts about your integrity, it would normally have surfaced before you then while you were a part time loader or unloader. Each driver had also written down addresses of the 4-5 pkgs we took, so if there were any questions, the company knew right where to go, and we used paper records to get signatures.
Most of the time they were packages for your customers on your normal route that had arrived after you left the building in the morning, so these were your friends you would be stealing from, so just not worth it. No package was worth losing a good salary and benefits for what you may think is in the box. I worked for them for ten years and never witnessed or heard of a driver stealing, ever. I hope that answers your question.

Guaranteed by BranMan · 2013-12-26 08:44 · Score: 1

"I think that word means what you don't think it means"

Re:No Vacation in December?! by HaZardman27 · 2013-12-26 08:50 · Score: 1

Yes, everyone should share your misery. Good point.

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Apparently wizard is not a legitimate career path, so I chose programmer instead.

Re:What a load of BS by Deadstick · 2013-12-26 08:58 · Score: 1

...and, matterafact, I just saw that Amazon is doing exactly that: compensating their delayed customers with giftcards. Apparently it was the merchants, not the carriers, who were guaranteeing delivery dates. Good on them.

Not our fault by MitchDev · 2013-12-26 09:15 · Score: 1

"'While others take vacation and time off in December, remember we aren't allowed ever to be off in December. Ever,' said a 20-year veteran UPS driver on the UPS Facebook page. 'So when you see your family and complain that your package is held up, everyone who moves your package is working and doesn't get the Xmas experience you get, Be thankful for that.'""

A) We didn't choose to work at UPS, not our problem
B) You sold a service and failed to deliver on your promises, refunds are in order.

Re:What a load of BS by kqs · 2013-12-26 09:23 · Score: 1

From what I can tell, the "packages are weeks late" is a very different problem from "last minute buying surge overwhelms capacity", which is what TFA is about. And for TFA, "dur, shoulda shipped it sooner" is an appropriate response.

The "weeks late" problem is IMO far more interesting. Did the retailers lie about shipping them? Did UPS/Fedex lose or damage them? This is a sign of a serious structural problem somewhere.

Re:What a load of BS by kqs · 2013-12-26 09:31 · Score: 1

Different problems.

All of the services overload their delivery drivers. This means that they give their drivers more packages than the drivers can reasonably deliver, so some won't be delivered. If you're at the end of a driver's route, this may happen a lot.

Bad weather means both that the packages take more time to arrive at the correct shipping center, and that the drivers can deliver even fewer packages per hour (due to slow traffic and poorly-plowed streets and driveways, mostly).

This year we got both problems: poor planning (a failure of capitalism) and poor weather (a failure of nature). Add in a late buying surge (a failure of expectations) and you have 2013.

Well that explains the monster credit. by Cyberglich · 2013-12-26 09:47 · Score: 1

I had a prime package (xmas gift) get delayed by USPS screw up for the upteeeth time i opened a ticket to ask them to please stop trying to use post office or smart post its gets delayed an extra day or 2 50% of time lately. Amazon credited me the entire $28 buck order amount (luckily still got it on xmans eve.)

Re:Well that explains the monster credit. by Cigamit · 2013-12-26 11:12 · Score: 1

I was in the same boat. USPS takes their time in my area, and they don't actually deliver to my house (my mailbox is 1.7 miles away from my house, 3 streets over). So anytime Amazon uses Sure Post, that nice 2 day shipping I am paying extra for takes an extra 2-3 days before I actually get my package. I have to wait for USPS to decide to attempt delivery, fail, then make me wait another day before I drive 6 miles into town to pick it up. If I was going to drive to town, I could probably just buy the item while I am there.
I complained to Amazon about them not notifying me beforehand whether they are going to use Sure Post, so I have the option of not buying the item from them. They flagged my address so that they will not utilize that shipping method in the future. They may be able to do the same for you.

Re:What a load of BS by craighansen · 2013-12-26 09:56 · Score: 1

Which could mean either that it was sorted onto the wrong truck or that the driver didn't complete all their deliveries. **It happens.

Re:Holiday Staffing to Suit Consumers and Business by craighansen · 2013-12-26 10:00 · Score: 1

Actually, people call 911 on Christmas Day to check out their shiny new cellphones. Humanity never ceases to amaze.

Re:What a load of BS by BLKMGK · 2013-12-26 10:03 · Score: 1

Yes, I was agreeing with you :-)

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Build it, Drive it, Improve it! Hybridz.org

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by NormalVisual · 2013-12-26 10:56 · Score: 1

And waiting for the check to clear too.

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Please stand clear of the doors, por favor mantenganse alejado de las puertas

Re: hey, seems like all my US Postal Service packa by radarskiy · 2013-12-26 12:31 · Score: 1

"According to the online tracking, it sat in their post office for two days before USPS deigned to deliver it. Fortunately, the packages were still "on time" that time, but we did have some worries over it."

You're complaining that you didn't get a faster delivery than what you paid for?

Also, do you think that UPS and FedEx don't leave packages at their destination depot if the delivery commitment can be met tomorrow? They do that deliberately to distinguish 1-, 2-, and 3- delivery so people won't gamble that a slower delivery will get their one day faster than what they paid for.

Dumbass... by vettemph · 2013-12-26 12:49 · Score: 1

>> "That guaranteed delivery was 80% of my decision to buy the gift."

If you loved your child, you would not have waited until the last minute. Some folks have the shopping done before Black Friday.

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The government which is strong enough to protect you from everything is strong enough to take everything from you.

I know this is ancecdote, but by kramerd · 2013-12-26 16:09 · Score: 1

I ordered a new monitor to replace a burned out one last Friday (Dec 17) with 2 day shipping. Not amazon prime, but UPS, specifically 2 Day shipping. Should be here either last Monday or Tuesday, right? Worst case, it arrived today? No, It is scheduled to deliver NEXT monday (Dec 30). I paid an extra $20 for it (free shipping would be scheduled for when I am SUPPOSED to now get it), and you better believe a $20 UPS giftcard isn't going to cut it.

Re:oh fucking cry about it. by sgt+scrub · 2013-12-26 16:33 · Score: 2

The USPS is the only one of the two that does do guarantees. Still they get ragged on no matter what. I wonder what the people that preach "the USPS sucks because they are a bloated government agency" would say if this was the USPS. All my gifts got to where they were supposed to be by the time they were supposed to be there. "But private sector is so much more efficient than the government... bla bla bla". Now that UPS and FedEx are getting into the amount of packages handled by the USPS they are showing how difficult the job really is.

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Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.

Re:No sympathy here by PlusFiveTroll · 2013-12-26 21:23 · Score: 1

Strange strawman argument.

Over my entire lifetime people have always been told to order their packages at least a week before Christmas if not longer. If after 40 years your retailer suddenly says you can order two days before and everything will be just fine, your e-tailer might be full of shit.

Re:What a load of BS by CanHasDIY · 2013-12-27 02:54 · Score: 1

From what I can tell, the "packages are weeks late" is a very different problem from "last minute buying surge overwhelms capacity", which is what TFA is about. And for TFA, "dur, shoulda shipped it sooner" is an appropriate response.

The "weeks late" problem is IMO far more interesting. Did the retailers lie about shipping them? Did UPS/Fedex lose or damage them? This is a sign of a serious structural problem somewhere.

Were I to wager a guess, I'd say the "last minute buying surge" didn't actually happen, but rather is UPS's nonsense excuse for failure, considering how many people are still waiting on deliveries of stuff they ordered months ago.

On that, how handy to have such a convenient scapegoat as last-minute shoppers!

--
An enigma, wrapped in a riddle, shrouded in bacon and cheese

Delays due to incompetence? by afgun · 2013-12-27 08:25 · Score: 1

I had a package put on a truck two days in a row (according to their computer anyhow) and it wasn't delivered either time. And this was in Austin, with no snow/ice to deal with. Clearly there was incompetency involved somewhere (e.g. if a package is on a truck and doesn't get delivered the day it was supposed to, why not reverse the route the next day so it can be assured to be delivered early? Oh yeah, because UPS trucks only turn right http://www.businessinsider.com/ups-efficiency-secret-our-trucks-never-turn-left-2011-3). Sorry, this has left me a little bitter about using UPS for anything. This isn't the first issue I've had with them, either. NEVER had a problem with FedEx.

Too many expectations by Dripdry · 2013-12-27 09:49 · Score: 1

I just stopped worrying about Christmas. People get so worked up over this expectation of happiness, it doesn't seem like a holiday as much as a sport or battlefield.
Last year, I just stayed home, listened to christmas tunes, ate a burrito, had a nap and played some games. It was restful, jolly, and maybe the best Christmas I've ever had.

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Re:Thankful by Dripdry · 2013-12-27 10:02 · Score: 1

What if I don't value either of those and would rather just sit back smugly at all the mice scurrying around trying desperately to have a good time?
Worked last year.
worked this year.
Never had jollier, more relaxing holidays before that.

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Update... now blame UPS by aaronb1138 · 2013-12-27 21:33 · Score: 1

UPS still has a huge backlog of undelivered packages, that are by their own records late. These are items which for multiple days are listed as out for delivery at 7 AM, then around 3 PM listed as accidentally left at the distribution facility.

The turn is this: some of those same hubs are already being taken off weekend/late hours.... while listing the same package as now scheduled for Saturday delivery.

So the reason people are mad is ultimately dishonesty on UPS' part. Stop lying multiple days or weeks in a row with "I'll get it done tomorrow." Everyone hates that guy, just give an honest range of delivery dates with an honest guarantee.

Re:What a load of BS by Zynder · 2014-01-01 09:00 · Score: 1

I AM a liberal socialist, you insensitive clod!

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