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Report: Valve Anti-Cheat (VAC) Scans Your DNS History

dotarray writes "If a recent report is to be believed, Valve is looking at your browsing history. Reportedly, the company's Valve Anti Cheat system (VAC) looks at all the domains you have visited, and if it finds that you've frequented hack sites, you'll be banned. 'The new functionality has been slammed by gamers, who claim it is "more like spyware than anti-cheat". Valve has not responded to the allegations, but all Steam users have agreed to abide by specific online conduct and not to use cheats. The company's privacy policy also explains that Valve may collect "personally identifiable information", but promises not to share it with other parties.'"

373 comments

  1. So by aliquis · · Score: 2

    How do one set up rules to block Steam from accessing firefox profiles? (Linux obviously, though guide for Windows is fine too. Also Chrome.)

    1. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Informative

      Create a steam user without access to your real user's files. Run steam only as this user.

    2. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Cancel subscription, uninstall steam and move on.

    3. Re:So by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 4, Interesting

      How many Linux users do you think have the idea of sandboxing Valve applications, just in case they might be peeking inside other applications' user data?

      There's no "Linux obviously" about it. It's a matter of trust, and Linux or not, users are far too trusting of the applications they install.

      --
      "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
    4. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Maybe run it inside an SELinux sandbox? See `man 8 sandbox'.

    5. Re:So by Z00L00K · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Create a separate virtual machine where you do all your clandestine browsing from.

      If the steam engine is able to access the VM and the disks there then they really are insisting on digging through your computer, but I doubt that they will be able to go far with it.

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
    6. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      We shouldn't have to worry about hiding our browser history from a fucking game company. They have no god damn business even taking a peak. I don't care if if there is a hidden clause in their Eula that they say allows it. It's wrong, and they know it's wrong.

    7. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 3, Informative

      The claim is that the operating system's DNS cache is scanned, not any particular application's history.

    8. Re:So by lagomorpha2 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Steam isn't a subscription service, you pay full price (ok or wait for sales) for games and they can only be run through Steam. So uninstalling Steam means losing access to the games you've bought through the service unless you pirate them back. This does make me want to delete Steam and cease using the service though.

      I wonder if there are enough irritated users to delete and redownload their entire Steam library enough times to send Valve a high-bandwidth wake-up protest message.

    9. Re:So by wagnerrp · · Score: 1, Funny

      Trying to run a graphically intense game inside a virtual machine can only end in tears.

    10. Re:So by ledow · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Why not just run Steam as a different user?

      It's not like Windows where you basically are expected to run everything as one user, create a Steam user which you can only "su" to from certain other users, and then set up a script to automatically make it run Steam only as a user that has access to nothing but Steam.

      But to be honest what's the point? What precisely are they going to do with the hash of a domain name that you looked up, not even visited? The bans are not going to be based on that information. You can't ban someone just because they strayed or were enticed into looking up a domain that might host a cheat, only if they actually use those cheats.

      I reckon they are using it to find similar users and spot trends more than anything else. If a load of confirmed cheaters all have the same hash in their history, but not most people, then its likely that it's worth looking into other user's with that same hash (or at least taking it into account when someone reports a new cheat).

      I'm a Steam fan, it has to be said, but while them looking at my domain history concerns me, they are at least hashing them and they have a full browser in the Steam client. If they want to track my visits, that's infinitely more worrying and does all sorts of cookie stuff (alright, you have to be running Steam and using their browser to visit whatever, but that's still much more info than the hash of a domain I looked up).

      Also, in case you hadn't noticed, the name of domains you looked up all go to your DNS server. If that's not a local one, you're already pushing this information in plain text across the Internet. Please tell me that you're not using Google or OpenDNS before you came to whine on this post.

      Plus, even aside from all the above, there is no real evidence that they are actually transmitting or collecting this information. Someone's just gone into the new anti-cheat modules with a disassembler and seen something suspicious. Doesn't mean that it's even enabled, or not test code. Nobody has yet seen it actually do this stuff (and what would it take? Wireshark and five minutes?).

      If you're using DNSSEC exclusively, didn't read the Steam agreement, are running as a completely unprivileged user (without even access to the name cache, on Linux, presumably?), and can confirm that what is alleged is actually happening, then maybe you have a case to be miffed.

      Otherwise? I have bigger privacy worries every time I send an email.

      P.S. Damn lameness filter, what the hell are you seeing?

    11. Re:So by arth1 · · Score: 1

      How do one set up rules to block Steam from accessing firefox profiles? (Linux obviously, though guide for Windows is fine too. Also Chrome.)

      That's not how this works. FTFA, it apparently does "ipconfig /displaydns" in Windows, which (among other things) lists what DNS lookups you have done lately.

      This is easily thwarted - use a proxy server, and the only lookup that will be registered is the one of the proxy server(s).

    12. Re:So by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      well the rule is stupid if it is in effect because they would need to ban the operators of this scheme too.. since they obviously visited those sites to know whats there.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    13. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Reading comprehension must be particularly difficult for you. I am sorry.

    14. Re:So by pushing-robot · · Score: 1

      Which might be why he suggested *browsing the hack sites* within a VM, not playing games.

      --
      How can I believe you when you tell me what I don't want to hear?
    15. Re:So by jabuzz · · Score: 1

      He is talking about running a web browser in the VM so that you can browse cheat web sites to your heart's content without Valve or anyone else having a clue that you are doing it. Next time engage brain first :-)

    16. Re:So by Immerman · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Still pretty fucking invasive if true. I'm going to have to watch this and, if true, protest. Not quite sure how yet, I'd hate to lose my game library but this sort of invasive behavior can't go unanswered. The "repeatedly redownload your gaming library" idea has some merit if done en-masse along with vocal enough complaints. Perhaps we can dig up the phone number and address of the company executives so we can send our complaints directly to the parties responsible for allowing such a thing .

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    17. Re:So by Wookact · · Score: 1

      Z00L00K actually said to do your browsing in the VM, but thanks for trying!

    18. Re:So by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      That's not how (most) proxies work.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    19. Re:So by Bert64 · · Score: 0

      Or just use a dedicated box for gaming... Not having other crap installed/running will improve gaming performance and reduce other potential compatibility problems too.

      --
      http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
    20. Re:So by Runaway1956 · · Score: 2

      Separate user - or separate machine. Nothing says that my gaming machine is the same as my general purpose machine.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    21. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So you buy games that you can't play unless you have steam? Why would you do that? I play all my games without permission from anyone. I bought them, they belong to me and I play them when I want without some service watching over me. What is wrong with people today... why do you put up with this kind of crap?

    22. Re: So by Runaway1956 · · Score: 2

      While I agree with you - we find ourselves in a world where our government and our corporations have ASSumed the authority to spy on us. I suggest you deal with reality as it is. Let's all learn to hide our history from the likes of Steam, along with Google and all the other trackers out there.

      Run Steam on your real high-tech hardware - and keep everything else on a different machine, or in a virtual machine. Just separate the two, and you're good to go.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    23. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 4, Informative

      I agree that it's very invasive if the list is returned to Valve, however I can't find any evidence that it is. The code originally posted only details the *reading* and hashing of the DNS cache, with no sign of *transmitting* it.

      As far as I can see, numerous headlines and articles since the code was posted have made the claim that the list is sent to Valve, without any evidence.

    24. Re:So by PriceChild · · Score: 2

      Not always... It is my understanding that many games simply use Steam as a handy distrubution mechanism. There is nothing to say they must incorporate DRM. I'm pretty sure The Binding of Isaac is a good example...

    25. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Would that work? It is looking at your DNS history, would'nt the VM'ed browser box just be passing the DNS requests down the stack to the host?

    26. Re: So by sosume · · Score: 5, Insightful

      This is so wrong and against privacy laws (at least in the EU), this would be equal to the IRS regularly scanning your history to see if you visit sites with tips for tax dodging. The police arresting everyone who visits lockpicking tutorials. The RIAA arresting everyone for possession of an internet account, Or the TSA l.. oh wait, they already do that. But at least the TSA can claim that their work is in the public interest.

      Besides. This is a new definition of guilty by association.

      " all Steam users have agreed to abide by specific online conduct"

      I would say this is only valid while using a Steam product. the way it is worded in TFA sounds more like a lifestyle where you have to abide to their rules at all times. Steam makes it even illegal to cheat in games from their competitors!

      This is so ridiculous, all I can do is wait for the class action lawsuit to commence. Steam is done with, if this turns out to be true.

    27. Re:So by PIBM · · Score: 2

      From TFA, they send themselves MD5 hash of the websites people have visited. Knowing that, I believe that they are using your DNS history signature to compare between players that are cheating. I don't see why they would ban people they aren't sure are cheating, as they certainly don't want to be hit by PR nightmare when people would get banned for no reason. The rare false positive they get at this time is already hard on them, and they go great way (well, large amount of steam credits happen) to make those people happy when errors really do happen.

      I have looked at websites offering hacks myself, and that was mostly to know what I was against; I don't want to ragequit out of a game when the players are really good, but I certainly don't want to provide free kills to cheaters. Being able to recognize the difference is important, and knowing their arsenal helps a lot in that department.

      Oh well, I've not been playing competitive steam games in a while anyway.

    28. Re:So by PIBM · · Score: 1

      I though the same, but he must have been refered to those VM on VPNs which you only get to see the remote rendering of, in which case this is totally valid :)

    29. Re:So by arth1 · · Score: 1

      That's not how (most) proxies work.

      You should be more careful about making statements about things you know little about.
      I run and administer several proxy servers, and have even written my own; I think I know how they work.

      When you have a proxy server configured in the web browser, instead of looking up the IP address of the web site, and then connecting to that IP, the browser will look up the IP address of the proxy server, and send the request including the full URL to the proxy.
      The proxy server does the lookup of the address of the destination site, connects to it, and fetches the data, which it presents back to the client. The client does not do a lookup of the destination site - it has no need to know it, and indeed, may not be able to (one of the use cases for proxy servers is when the clients are not allowed to use DNS).

      So you're dead wrong.

    30. Re:So by Nationless · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They also offer a variety of services which I greatly appreciate in this day an age.

      I don't have to lug around all my cds/dvds/Floppies every time I move and honestly I've gotten rid of all my physical media (external hard-drives excluded) about 2 international moves ago.

      It automatically keeps all my games up to date, no more Battlefield 1942 patch hell.

      As a store front it allows me to keep up to date on game releases and even pre-load certain titles.

      Steam sales.

      A robust offline mode which automatically works as long as you've downloaded the game and run it a single time while being connected online.

      I use it as a unified launcher.

      I use it as a communication tool dedicated to getting in touch with other people I know who are playing games and can easily organize matches of any game on our collective steam lists.

      Also not all games come with the steamworks DRM and can be run freely without steam even being installed on the system. Granted you have to download it through Steam first, but that would apply to any digital store front. Not to mention I've never noticed the DRM in action, making it the most non-intrusive form so far and if it doesn't even bother me, I don't see much reason to rage about it if it means that Steam is more likely to stay in business.

      I no longer have to input CD-keys or even worry about where I've physically kept the myriads of manuals containing them and installing software is as quick as simply wanting to play something and double clicking the title and download/installation is automatic. I don't have as much time to waste on gaming as I used to so streamlining it is in my best interest.

      Having to live with the "fear" that one day my games will be gone is like worrying that a Jumbo jet will land on my house. Honestly, I'd just pirate the games I'd lost.

    31. Re:So by Anubis+IV · · Score: 4, Informative

      why do you put up with this kind of crap?

      Cost, convenience, and a lack of alternatives.

      I license the right to play a game from Steam, usually for dirt cheap prices, and in exchange, it's available on any Internet-connected computer I own. Should I lack an Internet connection, it's possible to enable an offline mode as well, allowing me to continue playing regardless of my lack of a connection.

      Games haven't been owned by anyone for a long time now. Even buying a physical disc is just buying a license to play the game, which can and does get revoked in cases of abuse (see: Halo 4, Call of Duty: Ghosts, Diablo III). Of the companies out there that are licensing games to customers, Steam is relatively permissive, and it's rare that a typical gamer will run into issues with them.

    32. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wonder if something similar to what happens to ingress is accounted for inadvertently. Ingress a virtual game played in the real world. It used gps to find your location. In my office, the gps is sketchy and I keep jumping around. I do a google search for ingressw gps keeps bouncing around. The first half dozen links are to hacks/cheats to modify your gps to make the game easier. With chrome predownloading links, I could be considered cheating just trying to fix my issue.

    33. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's transmitted through the steam client, masked as normal communication traffic between the user and steam.

    34. Re:So by goarilla · · Score: 2

      No it does not, most vm software implement a virtual network card at a low level.

    35. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I bought them, they belong to me

      What games are you talking about exactly? Buying a license to play a game, instead of buying the game itself, is nothing new nor was it innovated by Valve.

    36. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

      I doubt it would have any impact, Valve has a reality distortion field amongst it's fanboys that makes even Steve Jobs' look tame.

      I mean, this is the company that is treated like a saint even though it ushered in the era of intrusive internet based DRM that requires them to allow you to play even your store bought game disc sometimes. That did it like a decade before evil Microsoft even considered such a thing with the XBox One before backtracking.

      This is the company that was "Fox"ing game mods when it was a new thing. That was sending cease and desist letters to mods based on the previously open sourced Team Fortress 2.5 for Quake 1 source after they bought it as if they could retroactively change the license.

      This is the company that can ban you arbitrarily and that has tougher restrictions on what you can do with your product than even "Worst Company in America" EA does.

      This is the company that switched to regional pricing resulting in a 100% increase in price for some territories like many European nations when they did so.

      This is the company who has tried to maintain a monopoly in many ways, throwing their teddy out the pram each time a competitor enters the market and starts to gain traction.

      This is the company that's always had as part of it's subscriber agreement the right to take and store personally identifiable information from your system even though they have a horrendous security track record having lost their own Half-Life 2 source code through the simple measure of sending Gabe Newell an e-mail with a trojan attached to it which he idiotically executed.

      Valve has always been evil, they've always been anti-privacy and anti-freedom. But they're given a pass by clueless fanboys who scream "BUT STEAM SALES OMG CHEAP GAMES!" seemingly oblivious to the fact that most Steam games are more expensive than if you just bought them from a run of the mill retailer like Amazon half the time.

      Whilst there is an army of idiots willing to praise Valve, you can expect them to become even more intrusive, and even more abusive in their actions as they have consistently done so over the years. If almost any other company had done even one of the things above these same idiots that excuse Valve would be ranting "OMG, Facebook's EULA says they can store your personal data", or "OMG, Google's building a monopoly with Android", or "OMG, Microsoft is implementing phone home DRM". But because it's Steam, because it's Valve, none of that applies. Suddenly it's okay. Because cheap games.

      Still, idiots get what idiots deserve.

    37. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 1

      Do you have a source for this?

    38. Re:So by FatdogHaiku · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Cancel subscription, uninstall steam and move on.

      Oh come on, this anti cheating detection simply demands that we cheat it!

      --
      You have the right to remain sentient. If you give up the right to remain sentient, you will be elected to public office
    39. Re:So by torsmo · · Score: 1

      Don't know how things work in the Windows world, but in Linux, DNS records are not cached by default, are they, unless you've purposefully set up nameserver address caching? I don't think any distribution does it by default.

    40. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Exactly this. Everytime I've bought a game physically, I've regretted it as a terribly waste, both in terms of energy, material and transportation, and as waste of storage on legacy medium that degrade over time. Floppy-disk anyone? Cassette player? Do you really ever use these games and mediums again? Can you?

      Surprisingly, downloading games for offline storage and use, is just more natural and less limiting over the longer run!
      This is of course assuming the right balance of rights between producers and customers, and that you never ever lose your account!

      Steam is getting there. These features are more or less functional, or getting there:
      *) Off-line mode
      *) Possibility to download as many times as you want
      *) Possibility to gift games away
      *) Possibility to borrow other people's games

      It's especially neat that since I recently switched to Linux Mint Debian and running Steam there, I can download all the Linux versions of my previous Windows games for free! With SteamOS around the corner, I expect the market to mature, and I will anyways never turn back to Microsoft or Apple ever again, regarding anything. I'm Done.

      Yes, you can play "L4D2" and "Metro: Last Light" on Linux! There are also other interesting games, but with SteamOS, I expect dramatic changes to happen virtually overnight. There are very few barriers left, and just even more reasons to abandon proprietary solutions today than ever before.

      Even RMS has stated that games are entertainment, and something that is not so fundamental to life that you could be forgiven if you get in non-Free form.

      I'm expecting my Steam-library to outlast any games-library I've had in the past. By then, I probably don't care about the games, but they should be there. As long as companies behave and I don't pay too much expecting unreasonable things, it should be good.

    41. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How about purchasing a whole other PC. Then Steam can't snoop your browsing. Maybe even put the new PC in another room. And maybe even move to a different state. Or maybe just not use Steam.

    42. Re:So by nurb432 · · Score: 1

      Several companies already block things from running in a VM, or software virtualization/sand-boxing.

      --
      ---- Booth was a patriot ----
    43. Re:So by BlueMonk · · Score: 4, Interesting

      The reason I *started* using Steam was because I bought a game in a store only to find when I got it home that it was pretty much a dummy disk that just made me install Steam and download the game in order to play it. The game was Civilization V. I don't get outraged by much, but come to think of it, that kind of is an outrage, but one just borderline enough that I was willing to accept it rather than not play the game. I don't/didn't know what else to do.

    44. Re:So by nevermore94 · · Score: 1

      Simple:
      Firefox - Use New Private Window
      Chrome - Use New incognito window
      I also set my browsers to clear all history when I exit even when I don't use the private windows, more as a matter of house keeping than paranoia.

      --
      Nevermore.
    45. Re:So by geminidomino · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You forgot

      *) Possibility to cancel your business relationship with Valve and keep playing the games you paid for.

      Oh, wait.. No you didn't.

      DRM is DRM, and there's no such thing as "DRM done right."

    46. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 1

      The decompiled file appears to be "VAC3-MODULE-bypoink.dll", which sounds like it's come from the Windows version of Steam. My Linux version of Steam has no .dll files, only .so files as expected. Perhaps this is limited to Windows.

    47. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then wouldn't flushing your dns with ipconfig (a trivial thing to do) totally bypass this?

    48. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 1

      Yes. However, presumably if Valve are using the DNS cache for cheat detection, then it's just one of many factors that they use to determine the probability of cheats being used.

    49. Re:So by Mark+J+Tilford · · Score: 1

      1) Add a bunch of images with height and width 1, and have src on a suspicious server to your website.
      2) Anybody who visits your site becomes a false positive.

      --
      -----------
      100% pure freak
    50. Re:So by Immerman · · Score: 1

      So, it's invasive if transmitted to Steams central servers to be processed, but not if processed only on "your" node of Steam's massively distributed "bot net".

      No argument that I would object more strongly to sending all the details home, but surreptitiously poking around and only sending the "interesting" details home isn't exactly a huge improvement. Who's to say what they might decide is interesting tomorrow?

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    51. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The difference is in the practical application of your "ownership". With an game that came on CD or floppy disk, yes there was an ephemeral legal construct that said you didn't "own" it, but reality said you did. You could do whatever you wanted with it, play it, snap it in half, disassemble and change it, sell it to someone else. It acted just like anything else you owned.

      Compare to newer games that have dependencies on companies through internet connections and only exist in digital form. Your real world limitations are much more visible. You have a corporate agent sitting on your hard drive, running in the background, pecker-checking everything you do. If they think you cheated in a game, bye bye, guilty until proven innocent. If they think you pirated a game, watch access to all games attached to your account become inaccessible. Again, guilty until proven innocent. Try selling a game from any of these digital services to another user. If even possible, it's incredibly annoying it do by design. They have an amazing amount of control they can exert over games you have paid for.

      The line between rent and own is very, very clear in the case of steam and other similar services.

    52. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 1

      There's no evidence that anything from the DNS cache is sent home at all - perhaps the processing is done locally.

      Of course local processing/data can't necessarily be trusted, but this may be just be one of many tests performed to decide the statistically likelihood of cheating.

      If anything from the cache *is* sent home, then I will be just as angry as you. At the moment there isn't any evidence for that though.

    53. Re:So by modecx · · Score: 1

      With unknown quantities of browser and associated exploits out there, it really would be smart to restrict the visiting unscrupulous sites to inside a VM, where you can revert to a known-clean snapshot with the click of a button.

      --
      Constitutional rights may be respected, repealed, or modified; but they must never be ignored.
    54. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not to mention that comparing a hash of the hostnames would be a very stupid way of checking for cheating related sites.

      A hash is not a unique value. A good hash function will have low collisions, but not none. The purpose of a hash is not to uniquely identify something (though large numbers of people attempt to use them for this). The purpose of a hash, is that for a given file contents, with a calculated hash, it should be very difficult to come up with modified contents that deliberately has the same hash. However accidental collisions are definitely possible, and even very likely when the hash size is smaller than the size of hashed data.

      Using this as a way to detect cheaters _will_ result in false positives.

    55. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Got some examples of that? Those would be companies I would not do business with.

    56. Re: So by mark-t · · Score: 1

      Equal? Not hardly... one is a crime, for which you can be prosecuted and sent to jail. The other can at worst result only in ostracization.

    57. Re: So by DrGamez · · Score: 1

      You're going to have to try a lot harder than this.

    58. Re:So by bruce_the_loon · · Score: 1

      Disable the DNS Client service in Services MMC stops this as well. You'll have a few more DNS queries, but who cares.

      --
      Trying to become famous by taking photos. Visit my homepage please.
    59. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Psst, if you "cancel your business relationship" with Comcast, you can't watch TV anymore. Steam is a subscription service, it's not a secret. Some people prefer that.

    60. Re:So by ArbitraryName · · Score: 2

      Steam isn't a subscription service,

      You should probably read the things you agree to. Steam is most definitely a subscription service.

    61. Re:So by cultiv8 · · Score: 1

      The DNS cache is scanned to compare visited IPs against IPs that are known for cheating. Are you saying it is more likely Valve keeps a list of known IPs on your local machine? I doubt that, it would be trivial to modify a list of local hashes to prevent being detected.

      --
      sysadmins and parents of newborns get the same amount of sleep.
    62. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't have to worry about shit if you don't play, but their business model is quite logically based on the fact they have an (evidently) irresistable product.

      If you want something different sack up and boycott. Anything you do that isn't voting with your money is meaningless.

      Money has power. Crying ain't shit.

      I don't give them my money. At all. Do you? If so, what would it take to make you stop?

    63. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      why do you put up with this kind of crap?

      Games haven't been owned by anyone for a long time now. Even buying a physical disc is just buying a license to play the game, which can and does get revoked in cases of abuse (see: Halo 4, Call of Duty: Ghosts, Diablo III). Of the companies out there that are licensing games to customers, Steam is relatively permissive, and it's rare that a typical gamer will run into issues with them.

      Nintendo can have their NES, SNES, and Gamecube games back when they pry the cartridges and/or discs from my cold, dead fingers!

    64. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm no expert on proxies, but I have set up TOR connections in the past. And one thing that they (used to, at least) warn you about specifically is DNS leaks. If I remember correctly the newer SOCKS ones are supposed to encapsulate lookups, but the old HTTP proxies do whatever the hell they like.

    65. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't see why they would ban people they aren't sure are cheating, as they certainly don't want to be hit by PR nightmare when people would get banned for no reason.

      You would think, but Warden, VAC, and others are all final-say anti-cheat tools. If you get flagged by such an application, then you aren't a false positive in the eyes of the host company. Never mind extensive use of a known unreliable hashing algorithm like MD5 -- a clear indication that their tracking software isn't horribly concerned with accuracy.

    66. Re:So by DrGamez · · Score: 2

      BUT WHAT IF THEY SHUT DOWN?*

      *and there was no advance notice?
      *and you had no way of backing up all these old games?
      *and all your computers stop working the day before the shut down?
      *and video games become illegal?
      *and we reach the heat death of the universe?

      Yeah, I bet you VALVE-APOLOGISTS will really be loving your DRM then.

    67. Re:So by Anubis+IV · · Score: 2, Interesting

      *) Possibility to cancel your business relationship with Valve and keep playing the games you paid for.

      That same complaint applies just as well to physical copies of games as it does virtual ones, and is really a complaint about the licensing model used in the software industry, rather than being a complaint about DRM.

      When you purchase a game disc at your local retailer, you're merely purchasing a license to play the game. That's the nature of your business relationship with Ubisoft, EA, or whoever. As such, canceling your business relationship with them would mean rescinding your licenses. For a physical game, the way you'd do that would be by snapping the game discs in half, deleting any copies of the games that you had made, and refusing to make use of their services.

      But no one does that, not even you, since you'd still like to play those games, as you said.

      Instead, if you never want to deal with Ubisoft or EA again, what you'd actually do is refuse to buy anything more from them. You don't cancel your business relationship, since that would mean being unable to play your games. You'd simply refuse to expand your relationship with them further. So why would you apply a different standard to Steam?

      If you never want to interact with Steam again, you wouldn't cancel your business relationship with them, since that would mean terminating the licenses you had to play their games (i.e. the digital equivalent of snapping the game discs in half). Rather, you'd simply enable offline mode and be done with them. You can continue to play the game for as long as you like, can make backup copies of the game, and can continue enjoying it hassle free.

      As such, I really don't see what your complaint about DRM is here, since your complaint is really just aimed at the licensing model used by the software industry as a whole. The only way that DRM is involved is inasmuch as it's used to enforce the license, but, as I just pointed out, Steam itself is exceedingly permissive (some games have their own DRM, but that's a separate issue from Steam). It does have limits not imposed by physical media (just as physical media has limits not imposed in the digital world), but the limit you cited is not one of them.

    68. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's wrong, they should be raked over the coals for it.

      But.....

      This really shouldn't be a security concern for anyone who takes reasonable steps to protect themselves. Specifically, the gaming machine is for web-browsing and gaming, but NOT for investing, online banking, paying taxes online, etc. Important stuff like that is done on a separate machine on which one never does any web-surfing or gaming. Such separation greatly reduces the risk of compromise.

    69. Re: So by ArcadeMan · · Score: 2

      He's running Slashdot inside a VM and using a virtual keyboard and mouse to hide his clandestine non-work-related browsing, give him a break.

    70. Re:So by ArcadeMan · · Score: 1

      Or nuke the gaming PC from space. It's the only way to be sure.

    71. Re:So by DrGamez · · Score: 1

      This is what I want to make sure. So far there hasn't been any evidence that info is being transmitted to Valve.

    72. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 1

      I'm not speculating which possible thing I think is more likely, I've only been trying to point out what we *don't* know, to try to counter the stated-as-fact unknowns that various articles have been giving.

      (I'm all for getting an answer from Valve about what's actually happening.)

    73. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I read an interview with a cheat developer and he explained that most cheats are run directly from the cheat website... that way it is more difficult for pirates to share the cheats for popular games (CoD, BF, etc). He used Java embedded in the browser to load the cheats into memory... I'm sure there are many other similar techniques.

    74. Re:So by eu_virtual · · Score: 5, Funny

      Gabe Newel has stated that if we reach the heath death of the universe, you can get a new account with all your games on the next one. You just have to provide proof that you came from this universe.

      Of course you have to move to a universe where steam exists, but I think you'll find valve is operating on most of them.

    75. Re:So by Sperbels · · Score: 4, Insightful

      * or, what if they disable your entire game library because you visited a blacklisted website.

    76. Re:So by LoRdTAW · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What games are those? Console? Older PC games?

      Steam and their competitors make it easy to buy, download and play games. Even if you don't want Steam you have few options: buy the actual game on CD or DVD (and have it loaded with buggy malware-like copy prevention and needing the CD/DVD when you want to play) or a publishers distribution platform which works just like Steam. Downloading the game makes so much more sense in the internet age and I would never go back to buying physical media copies.

      Steam and steam like service benefits:
      - I can pre-order, buy or gift a game instantly from my PC, no running to stores, shipping or waiting for packages.
      - Instant download. Buy the game and play it once its downloaded which can easily happen in under an hour.
      - NO CD/DVD's needed and no storing of bulky media and packaging. Who wants a shelf full of plastic taking up space and collecting dust?
      - Built in communications. My brother and I once played a game of TF2 while casually chatting using the Steam voice chat. It was an amazing thing to be able to casually talk as if he were next to me yet still be able to play the game and use its voice to talk to teammates.
      - I can log into another PC using my Steam ID and I instantly gain access to my games. No lugging around any media.
      - You can't lose the media. Remember old games and their copy protection? "Turn to page 42 of the manual and enter the second word in the third paragraph" or One that I hated until I got a cracked version from a friend who was a BBS master, Quarinitine. It had a dark red card the size of a sheet of paper with black almost unreadable text (to prevent photocopying). It was a chart you used to look up a set of numbers and then enter the corresponding code to play the game. Those were the devil, loose that card or manual and you were screwed.

      disadvantages:
      -no refunds. Easy - play the demo, look for recommendations/reviews or don't buy it, I haven't regretted one purchase yet (well maybe crysis 2 but that was because its gameplay sucked compared to the original but on a whole it was pretty fun).
      -sometimes there are connection/server issues but they usually clear up within hours or a day. You won't die from not playing games.
      -off line might crap out. But honestly, who uses that? Only two scenarios need off-line mode: places where the internet is flaky and prone to outages OR you are away from home like on a business trip or vacation. If you are part of the former, then the problem isn't Steam, its your shitty internet. If you are the latter then I assume you have better things to do than play games. Go out and have some fun. That or people just like to bitch about a non-issue just to bolster their prejudice against a media distribution platform. They could be paid shills but I digress.

      Since using Steam from the day it was released (after the beta AIM looking days), I have only had two or three connection issues with Steam cloud syncing. They were steam server issues that went away within a few hours, no big deal. Contrast that to my last run-in with copy prevention CD malware like securom which randomly crashed, randomly locked up my pc on launch or permanently changed my mouse cursor to a rainbow colored CD until I rebooted (after it randomly crashes). I actually had to download a crack for Crysis just to play the fucking game without securom (aka suck-rom). And of course what if you lose or damage the CD/DVD? How do you play your copy protected need-the-cd-to-make-sure-you-aren't-a-thief game? Screw that.

    77. Re:So by chris200x9 · · Score: 2

      Not really, you only use games that use steam DRM. If your game is DRM free just back it up, delete steam, double click the binary and watch it launch. Steam itself is just a distribution service not a DRM. Sorry I might be a bit off topic but I'm just really annoyed at the "ZOMG steam is DRM!" crowd at the moment. Steam makes DRM available blame the publishers for using it not steam. No where is a DRM mandate.

    78. Re:So by locopuyo · · Score: 1

      Do you happen to live in a cave?

    79. Re:So by thoughtlover · · Score: 1

      Why is this such a big deal (aside from the digital gestapo tactics)? Just flush your DNS before launching Steam. http://www.wikihow.com/Flush-D...

      'nuff said.

      --
      No sig for you! Come back one year!
    80. Re:So by Arker · · Score: 1

      Nonsense. I dont buy licenses. I buy games. I have no continuing business relationship with the retailers, the publishers, or the developers as a result. The games I have bought are mine, remain mine, and I use them as I see fit without any further involvement with the aforementioned.

      The publishers can comfort themselves with unlawful legal fictions if it makes them feel better about the transaction but they got their money and I got my disk and that is an exchange, not a license. I have neither asked for, nor accepted, any sort of license.

      Steam, on the other hand, does not merely console themselves with unenforceable legal fictions. They actually have the balls to demand you install their traitorware on your system to do business with them.

      "If you never want to interact with Steam again, you wouldn't cancel your business relationship with them, since that would mean terminating the licenses you had to play their games (i.e. the digital equivalent of snapping the game discs in half)"

      They, not I, actually took that step years ago, when they first released Steam. I had programs I had purchased from them prior to this, which were online games, which they therefore had the technical ability to disable. I believed at the time that they were good guys and could be trusted with that power, and they proved me wrong. They shamelessly used that technical ability to try to force me to install Steam, just in order to have access to the games I had already bought.

      Obviously I am not submissive enough to be their customer. A company gets to treat me like that once only, and they better not expect to ever see another penny out of me after. At this point they couldn't pay me to enter any sort of relationship with them.

      --
      =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
      Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
    81. Re:So by LifesABeach · · Score: 1

      Wire Tapping is Wire Tapping. One cannot help but wonder what the browsing histories of Valve board of directors, and its Legal Staff?

    82. Re:So by Arker · · Score: 2

      It would be nice to know exactly what they are doing with it, but it seems fair to assume they are doing something with it or it wouldnt be collected in the first place.

      And I cant think of anything, however far-fetched, that they could be doing with it that would be legitimate.

      --
      =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
      Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
    83. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      why do you put up with this kind of crap?

      [ Lots of extraneous bullshit excuses deleted ]

      In other wrods he's a kind slavemaster, and the only master i know.

      Sell your soul for a game and justify it then. See what you get in return.

    84. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ", but that would apply to any digital store front."
      Bullshit. When I buy through humblebundle or goodoldgames I can download the installer through my browser (and I don't need to launch any middleware to be able to play them.)

    85. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Thanks to DNS Prefetching, all a griefer would need to do to ban people is to have them go to a page like a Google search for "steam cheat" or something. Your browser makes a bunch of DNS queries, they sit in your cache, and (if true) are uploaded to Valve for your ban. Huzzah!

    86. Re:So by ericloewe · · Score: 1

      I would, but my ISP might start bothering me and I don't feel like wearing out my SSD.

      The latter problem is of course easy to solve, but my ISP is notorious for aggressive traffic shaping, despite the large promotional text that says "unlimited".

    87. Re:So by Cederic · · Score: 2

      You're making wild assumptions here.

      You're assuming the MD5 hashes are used as part of anti-cheat detection, not just because Valve want to know which porn you enjoy.
      You're assuming that MD5 clash rates are materially significant.
      You're assuming that accessing a cheat site is deemed cheating and leads to a ban.
      You're assuming that bans are based on single data points.
      You're assuming that VAC automagically determines you're a cheat and that there isn't a human review involved.

      Steam isn't perfect, but please, do try and at least base your wild speculation on some modicum of common sense.

    88. Re:So by idontgno · · Score: 1

      That won't help if Valve is scanning the operating system DNS resolver cache.

      For Windows, the DNS lookup part of the network stack retains all positive DNS results (i.e., a lookup worked) for 24 hours, and all negative returns (i.e., lookup failed because of a mistyped FQDN, for instance) for 15 minutes.

      That's below the level of the privacy tools of the browsers. No application can override that. (Only administrative/network management tools like "ipconfig" (for Windows)).

      Valve would probably register "bad evul hack-n-cheat browsing" if you did nothing more than "nslookup" the addresses of the "bad evul hack-n-cheat" web servers, even if you never fired up a browser.

      --
      Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
    89. Re:So by Sowelu · · Score: 4, Informative

      Worth noting that VAC doesn't lock you out of running games or delete your account, it just prevents you from playing multiplayer on VAC servers. VAC is a voluntary-to-publisher service that Valve offers to creators of multiplayer games. If a publisher says "yeah, if someone cheats on a different game then we don't want them playing on our servers either", they can do that...it's pretty much the same as publicly shared email blackhole lists. If you have a problem with a publisher putting VAC in their games, complain about them and not Valve.

      Many (most?) multiplayer games that let players run their own servers give an option of running a non-VAC one, or to connect directly to IP, whatever.

      Seriously...even if Valve didn't run VAC, someone else would run an equivalent service (can you say Punkbuster?). All it takes is for one or two companies to say "hey we have this way to detect cheaters, why don't we share the steam keys of the cheaters we find and keep them from playing online on our servers", and there you go.

    90. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      no crap would mean no steam

    91. Re:So by Sowelu · · Score: 1

      Many games require Steam to be running, usually because they use Steam services for online matchmaking or whatever. That's the game developers' choice though, they aren't obligated to do it.

    92. Re:So by Z00L00K · · Score: 1

      I do suspect that the Mozilla Firefox browser will work fine in a virtual environment.

      --
      If builders built buildings the way programmers wrote programs, then the first woodpecker would destroy civilization.
    93. Re:So by CurryCamel · · Score: 1

      The line between rent and own is very, very clear in the case of steam and other similar services.

      This is perhaps the crux of the matter and the reason people here too act outraged. Any and all intellectual property goods are distributed on a rent model, not an ownership basis, per definition.
      Physical media, like CDs or cars or license dongles have an implicit reselling-allowed clause in them (and sometimes an explicit reselling-deined one...) for that particular item. This seems to confuse the matter further.
      Even the infamous "car analogy" works here: if you could, would you be allowed to make an identical *copy* of your car, and start selling those? (as opposed to just building your own cars).

      You must evaluate steam and any other subscription service on their own terms. Is what they offer value for money? Can I trust them to deliver?
      I don't. Well... didn't. Then I heard they have Civilization V... Huge fan. Must buy^W get it.

    94. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "DRM is DRM, and there's no such thing as 'DRM done right.'"

      Unfortunately, you are wrong. The world isn't black and white.The world is full of shades of gray.

      Steam is the closest thing to DRM done right available. You get actual VALUE out of the relationship (all the perks of STEAM) AND it's unobtrusive.

      Just like there are plenty of reasons to use Bittorrent and a variety of reasons to pirate stuff.

    95. Re:So by lgw · · Score: 1

      All that matters is the odds. The odds that Valve will be a problem are far less than the odds that my physical media will be a problem (I move often), so for me it's easy. It's not like games are priceless treasures, after all, and if Steam somehow manages to lose my entire collection I'll shrug and move on.

      Of course, I buy everything I can find of interest on GoG, but that's a very limited selection.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    96. Re:So by jxander · · Score: 2

      A few reasons, but the sales are the biggest ones.

      If you buy a AAA retail game (that originally sold for $60) for $5, you've gotta know that there are going to be some strings attached. If you're willing to deal with those strings, well, you just saved yourself a bunch of money.

      There are other benefits. I've never once had to deal with scratched or lost disks, backwards compatibility or multiple system.

      Of course there are negatives as well ... and whether or not it balances out, up to each person to decide.

      --
      This signature is false.
    97. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or, how about run 'steam' as a seperate user. Perhaps one called steam?

      If anything, Steam would be isolated. Not the rest of my computing experience, which is pretty freaking dumb!

    98. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This.

      Likewise, you should visit "shadey" sites in a VM anyways.

      I mean... you are cohorting with cheaters. Why wouldn't you expect other asshatery from them as well?

    99. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hmm. We see you are repeatedly visiting the Steam website. It appears as though you are "repeatedly redownloading your gaming library". Terms of service prohibit this activity. You are denied access to your library.

      Also, we see you are posting your disagreement with our policies on Slashdot. This is now against our terms of service and requires you to pay a $3000 complaint fee.

      PS. We know you saw the new terms of service because we know you visited the link.

    100. Re:So by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Remember when GameSpy just did this without integrating with the game?

    101. Re:So by lgw · · Score: 2

      BUT WHAT IF THEY SHUT DOWN?*

      I have far more important things to worry about in life than some games. If Valve craters, there will be a new outlet for games (maybe we'll get lucky and there's be a move to GoG). As long as the risk-adjusted price I pay is fine, I don't see the problem.

      As with everything in life, you pays your money and you takes your chances. The chances that Valve will vanish in the next few months, while I'm still heavily playing whatever game I just bought, are quite small.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    102. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What if you took two minutes to educate yourself on what VAC is and what it does?
      Get VAC banned? You can still play all of your single-player games. You can still play your multiplayer games on non-VAC servers.

    103. Re:So by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      If Tor is running on the local machine, yes. Normally you don't use a remote HTTP TOR.

      Classical proxy server HTTP sends a normal HTTP request, but always sends it to a particular IP. Normally you look up www.slashdot.org and send the request there. The request includes a Host: header always, so instead of GET /index.html HTTP/1.1 to Host: www.slashdot.org on 216.34.181.48, you send that to 10.10.100.50. 10.10.100.50 uses the Host: header to DNS look-up www.slashdot.org and sends the exact same request on.

    104. Re:So by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Applications can override that. Just connect to 8.8.8.8 instead of running OperatingSystemApiDNSLookup().

    105. Re:So by Anubis+IV · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Nonsense. I dont buy licenses. I buy games.

      No, you don't (unless you're representing a game publisher or developer, in which case maybe you do). Read the fine print included with any game you buy today on physical media. You bought the disc, so you generally have the right to resell the disc, and the licenses are transferable as well, so it gives many consumers the illusion of ownership, but the fact is, you don't own any of the games that you've "bought". That's why companies are legally capable of cutting off customers who break rules in their games. I provided links to several examples a few posts back in this thread.

      I'm not suggesting I like that it's this way, mind you, nor that it should be this way. I'm merely pointing out that it's the reality of the situation. Having you deny it doesn't magically make it untrue.

    106. Re:So by wolrahnaes · · Score: 1

      I doubt that, it would be trivial to modify a list of local hashes to prevent being detected.

      As opposed to it not being trivial to modify your DNS cache?

      Anything that's checking standard local resources will be trivial to edit for someone who cares to. Sending a list of flagged hashes would be the more privacy-safe way to do this. Whether they do or not I have no idea, but nothing about the information I've seen posted so far including any of the decompiled code seems to indicate one way or another.

      --
      I used to get high on life, but I developed a tolerance. Now I need something stronger.
    107. Re:So by Anubis+IV · · Score: 1

      Name one alternative that doesn't rely on licenses.

      Bet you can't.

      Whether it's physically or digitally distributed, the fact is, all games are "sold" as licenses and have been for years. The only choice we have is in choosing which license we like. Physically distributed games are generally more expensive and come with a transferable license. Digitally distributed games are generally cheaper and are non-transferable. I'll take a cheaper one that's non-transferable over a more expensive one that's transferable most of the time. You're welcome to do otherwise, but don't kid yourself into thinking that you're any less of a slave to the same masters. They can cut you off just as easily as they can cut me off, as the links I provided earlier in the thread demonstrate.

    108. Re:So by Cruciform · · Score: 1

      Gabe stated a few years ago that if Steam has to shut down there is a method of releasing all content on an account to the user. A master key or something. And they would give advance notice.
      If they were unable to give advance notice, it's likely that whatever caused it would be impacting your life as well. Alien attack, Godzilla, Roseanne Barr clones...

    109. Re: So by master5o1 · · Score: 2

      No other crap, not no crap.

      --
      signature is pants
    110. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Linux by default doesn't cache dns entries, so this doesn't directly effect them.

    111. Re:So by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      So, you do know what a transparent proxy is, right? I'd like to cite my daily usage of ssh -D as an example of how you're missing half the picture.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    112. Re:So by Arker · · Score: 1

      "No, you don't (unless you're representing a game publisher or developer, in which case maybe you do). Read the fine print included with any game you buy today on physical media."

      No thank you, I have no desire wasting my time reading bunch of dense legalese written to intimidate the ignorant. Fine print that I do not read or sign has no bearing on the situation. It certainly comes nowhere close to having the required elements of a contract.

      "You bought the disc, so you generally have the right to resell the disc, and the licenses are transferable as well"

      Where do you get this absurd idea that you need a license to use a program?

      Do you need a license to read a book? To listen to a CD?

      No, you only need a license when you intend to do something with a work which is NOT normal use, which is NOT permitted by copyright law. Like modifying and redistributing the work.

      A EULA is not a contract because it lacks the required elements of a contract, and it is not a license either, because it grants NO license! Instead, it purports to impose an anti-license, that is to impose draconian limits far above and beyond what copyright law provides, unilaterally. There is no legal principle to support this, other than 'who has the gold makes the rules.'

      Companies are able to make ludicrous 'legal' threats and claims and abuse their customers and get away with it but that is the result of a legal system that requires money, and lots of it, to get satisfaction. Companies have tons of money, individuals of modest means who somehow come to their attention can be railroaded and the law be damned. But let's not pretend that there is any legal or ethical support for them to do it. It's brute corruption of the legal system and process, nothing more.

      --
      =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
      Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
    113. Re:So by arth1 · · Score: 1

      A transparent proxy is a completely different implementation.

      I was talking about [b]configuring[/b] a proxy server. In which case you forward all requests to that proxy, and the browser does not do lookups.

    114. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In the Halo and CoD cases, at least, the bans are for the online play, only. If you were banned, you were still able to play offline.

      Granted, some (many?) people aren't interested in the single player, but they are running a service for the multiplayer, and when you break the rules of their service, they are cutting off access to it, but not revoking access to the game.

    115. Re:So by reve_etrange · · Score: 2

      they can only be run through Steam

      A lot of games, including multiplayer games, can be run without simultaneously running steam. You have to launch the applications directly from the steam library directory, but steam doesn't need to be running.

      --
      .: Semper Absurda :.
    116. Re:So by Anubis+IV · · Score: 2

      A EULA is not a contract because it lacks the required elements of a contract, and it is not a license either, because it grants NO license! Instead, it purports to impose an anti-license, that is to impose draconian limits far above and beyond what copyright law provides, unilaterally. There is no legal principle to support this, other than 'who has the gold makes the rules.'

      Go look up contracts of adhesion. IANAL, but this is basic stuff that anyone on Slashdot should know since it's of vital importance to the software industry and has been repeatedly upheld by the courts. Ignorance of them is no reason to stick your fingers in your ears and act as if they don't exist.

      If you want to make an argument that their terms are unconscionable, that's one thing, but you're arguing that the contracts simply don't exist. I'll agree that there may not be an ethical basis for what they're doing or that some specific contracts may not be upheld in court, but let's not pretend that there is a lack of a legal basis for what they're doing in general.

    117. Re:So by Zxern · · Score: 0

      There is always the Pirate bay store. Solves all of your above above problems.

    118. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It certainly comes nowhere close to having the required elements of a contract.

      Actually, it does, and has been held up in court as such.

      You seem to be operating on legal theories that are entirely of your own invention, and not those that are actually in use in the real world and in the real courts that have tried these exact issues.

      I know you want to buy a game rather than a license, and I know you believe these EULA's are unenforceable, but objectively, based on case law from actual trials on these exact subjects, you are incorrect.

      Like it or not, understand it or not, sign it or not, you are buying a license. That is the reality, and it will remain so until the laws change.

    119. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > against privacy laws

      Here in the US it doesn't matter if it is against the law because of the amount of money those criminals give to the Republicans. They'll never be punished for breaking the law.

    120. Re:So by tragedy · · Score: 1

      Steam is the closest thing to DRM done right available. You get actual VALUE out of the relationship (all the perks of STEAM) AND it's unobtrusive.

      Unobtrusive... Except for all the spying on you and handing out the data to pretty much anyone who pays (does anyone believe that their "privacy policy" is actually binding on them?) or demands with some sort of legal clout.

    121. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      FYI: Modern CPUs have a built-in GPU and VT-x and VT-d instructions. The latter means that if you boot from a hypervisor, you can use a brand new PCIe 3.0 x16 video card in a virtual machine, and the VM will think it's talking directly to the card directly (i.e. 100x faster than that lame GPU emulation crap that limits you to 5-10 year old video tech in OS-level virtual machines).

      My i7-3770 is capable of doing this, but I haven't bothered to figure out the details of installing a hypervisor. If someone knows how to do it, please let me know. :)

    122. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If the claim is true, you could get all your enemies banned by tricking them into visiting a page that tries to load non-existent images from the "bad" sites. This could be as simple as posting on a forum that hotlinks images.

    123. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      VAC Bans (i.e. Valve's) only apply to online play and to also let other people know that you are a cheater and not to be trusted. They still let you play your licensed games that are single-player or those that do not use VAC.

    124. Re:So by ninlilizi · · Score: 1

      I keep my Steam sandboxed to its own physical set of drives. Far away from my actual working OS and data.
      If I want to play a game. I power down. Swap out the entire array and boot back up.

      Had thought this was pretty much the standard way of operating when dealing with an untrustworthy blob that pulls down even less trustworthy payloads wrapped in piles and piles of 3rd party DRM and rootkits.

      Given Linux lack of stereoscopic gaming support. A dualboot is required anyhow. The extra 10-15seconds to swap out a few drive caddies is a non issue.

    125. Re:So by l_bratch · · Score: 1

      Presumably, if the DNS cache /is/ even used to detect cheating, then it's just one part of some weighting system. Even this is just assumption. We don't have enough information yet.

    126. Re:So by Hamsterdan · · Score: 1

      I'd really like to know what, I've never encountered anything up to now that wasn't allowed in a VM. Not doable (like playing GPU hungry games), ok, but not *allowed* ?

      None so far...

      --
      I've got better things to do tonight than die.
    127. Re: So by Hamsterdan · · Score: 1

      But most people have (and only need) one computer. It's different from the /. crowd where multiple PCs is the norm (3 powered on at the moment)

      --
      I've got better things to do tonight than die.
    128. Re:So by ubrgeek · · Score: 1

      > Cost, convenience, and a lack of alternatives.

      Are we talking about Valve or hookers?

      --
      Bark less. Wag more.
    129. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Reading comprehension must be particularly difficult for you. I am sorry.

      Sadly, he won't likely understand your post either.

    130. Re:So by Hamsterdan · · Score: 1

      "The "repeatedly redownload your gaming library" idea has some merit if done en-masse"

      Won't do any good other than bust your monthly quota since it will probably get served from a CDN so should not cost Valve more (Unless the ISP is double-dipping)...

      --
      I've got better things to do tonight than die.
    131. As the saying goes, wish in one hand and shit in the other, then see which one fills up first. I wish you good luck with your strategy.

      --

      Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.

    132. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    133. Re:So by Zero__Kelvin · · Score: 0

      "Actually, you're right it doesn't, but the courts ignored the law once again and did whatever benefits big business anyway.

      FTFY

      --
      Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
    134. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You should be more careful about making statements about things you know little about.

      You should take your own advice.

      I run and administer several proxy servers, and have even written my own; I think I know how they work.

      You certainly do think you know how they work. Unfortunately you don't actually know. It sounds like you have limited experience and you are trying to extrapolate that to internet expert. That's a bad idea, because you end up looking foolish (like now) when people with real knowledge comes along.

      instead of looking up the IP address of the web site, and then connecting to that IP, the browser will look up the IP address of the proxy server, and send the request including the full URL to the proxy.

      Some proxies can function this way. SOCKS5 proxies do, for example. SOCKS4 cannot. Arguably the most popular proxy in the world, squid, does not handle DNS.

    135. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's called "offline mode", and it works just fine. You never need to connect to Steam's servers again - unless you want to.

    136. Re:So by Arker · · Score: 1

      Contracts of adhesion are weak and suspect, at best, and we could have a nice debate about it, but it's beside the point here because a EULA isnt a contract of adhesion either. A contract of adhesion, weak as it is, is still something that you see up front and accept or reject prior to closing the deal. With a EULA, the deal is complete, the money handed over, the product accepted, before it's seen.

      Imagine if booksellers tried to get away with this. You buy a book, you pay your money, you get your receipt, you walk out of the store, and start reading. And find a nice little note from the publisher claiming to be a contract (though it isnt) and/or a license (and clearly not that) which purports to strip you of basic rights in return for permission (which you dont need) to read the book. It further cautions you in the strongest possible terms that violating these rules will result in the harshest legal actions.

      Would you regard that as binding? Or would you just laugh and ignore it?

      If as one would suspect based on your argument so far your answer is the former I am afraid you are part of the cancer that is killing our civilization. That may sound dramatic, but it's true. Civilization cannot long survive if people are buffaloed into submission so easily.

      --
      =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
      Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
    137. Re:So by idontgno · · Score: 1

      Your suggested answer is "Roll your own DNS resolver?"

      That's pretty hardcore. While you're at it, maybe the app should just poke the network drivers directly and bypass the OS's network stack.

      More to the point, I've seen no evidence that browsers do their own DNS resolution. Do you have any?

      --
      Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
    138. Re:So by Bugamn · · Score: 1

      Another advantage for me, is that I often find there games that I don't find on shops around here.

    139. Re:So by arth1 · · Score: 1

      Some proxies can function this way. SOCKS5 proxies do, for example. SOCKS4 cannot. Arguably the most popular proxy in the world, squid, does not handle DNS.

      Uh? It most certainly does.


      $ telnet myproxy 3128
      Trying 10.11.12.13...
      Connected to myproxy.
      Escape character is '^]'.
      GET http://slashdot.org/ HTTP/1.1
      Host: slashdot.org
      Connection: close

      HTTP/1.0 200 OK
      Server: Apache/2.2.3 (CentOS)
      SLASH_LOG_DATA: shtml
      Set-Cookie: betagroup=51; path=/; expires=Thu, 18-Feb-2016 00:08:24 GMT
      ...

      If squid didn't do DNS for you, you would have to provide the IP address. It does,so you don't.

    140. Re:So by arth1 · · Score: 1

      Reading the parent post again, he might be deluded into thinking this is about sending the client's DNS request to a proxy server. That's obviously not what we're talking about.

      The point of using a proxy server here is to avoid having the client contact any DNS servers, no matter what the method is. When the OS doesn't know what hosts you contact, the OS can't log it.

    141. Re:So by slimjim8094 · · Score: 2

      It doesn't matter.

      Look, when I was a kid, I used to play Counterstrike pretty seriously. I was curious about these cheats that I kept seeing on VAC-secure servers, so I went and found some and played around with them - on VAC-insecure servers, of course*. They're really cool bits of code that hook into the game and understand the engine well enough to find the head "bone" and wait for it to come into the player's view. Being a coder, I wanted to know how they worked - not to write my own, but software that hooks into other software is fairly unusual, and thus, interesting to my teenage self.

      Anyways, since I was just looking around (and not willing to pay/join the "clubs" that made new undetected hacks), the aimbot I had was definitely no secret and surely would've gotten me banned if I'd played on a VAC-secure server. The deal was - cheat on a secure server, get banned. But the counterpoint is - cheat on an insecure one, no problem. It felt really fair - joining a secure server is an agreement not to cheat, and if you do, you're banned.

      If this story is true, it completely changes that agreement. Presumably it's a "once a cheater, always a cheater" attitude, but that's not really fair. The cool thing about VAC was that it was indisputable. It doesn't make mistakes - you knew categorically that someone who was VAC-banned had broken the agreement by having cheat code loaded while connected to a secure server. So there was no arguing, pleas, etc - they were a cheater, they had cheated in a game that was annotated "no cheats". This would completely change that dynamic, and Valve is really careful about that kind of thing, so I'm suspicious that this is as-reported.

      *Before somebody chews me out for cheating anywhere - first, it was only on cheat servers (all players were using them), and second, it only makes sense to view the active decision to turn off VAC (it's on by default) as a decision to allow cheaters.

      --
      I have developed a truly marvelous proof of this comment, which this signature is too narrow to contain.
    142. Re:So by geminidomino · · Score: 1

      When you purchase a game disc at your local retailer, you're merely purchasing a license to play the game. That's the nature of your business relationship with Ubisoft, EA, or whoever. As such, canceling your business relationship with them would mean rescinding your licenses. For a physical game, the way you'd do that would be by snapping the game discs in half, deleting any copies of the games that you had made, and refusing to make use of their services.

      Not quite. Physical (excepting scumbags who put steam DRM on box copies) and DRM-free digital purchases are different in that they don't allow "Ubisoft, EA, or whoever" to decide when the discs get snapped in half.

      Once again valve has proven that they shouldn't be trusted. I'm glad I got out the last time they did, and was only out $40 worth of games.

    143. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You forgot

      *) Possibility to cancel your business relationship with Valve and keep playing the games you paid for.

      Oh, wait.. No you didn't.

      What are you talking about? I've "canceled" my business relationship with Valve plenty of times, and have never lost access to the games I bought through Steam.

      By the way, if "not buying games" doesn't count as "canceling my business relationship", then I don't know what does, because I'm not paying them a monthly fee or anything. Or maybe you are confusing "Valve declaring bankruptcy" with "me canceling my business relationship with Valve"?

    144. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I've always found it amusing when people bring up lost or damaged disks as a reason for Steam. In over 20 years of gaming I've had a problem with only one CD, whereas problems with Steam have been rife.

    145. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is total bullshit. They *may* be able to do this for their titles, but certainly not for any other publisher.

    146. Re:So by mjwx · · Score: 1

      How do one set up rules to block Steam from accessing firefox profiles? (Linux obviously, though guide for Windows is fine too. Also Chrome.)

      The only real way to be 100% sure is to use a browser on a different box.

      Other methods I can think of is putting Steam on a separate user to the one you use the firefox/chrome on (but still may not be effective as steam will have admin rights) or using the browsers incognito/private modes (but I'm not 100% sure if this clears DNS info).

      Also, I'd be very surprised if other anti-cheat measures like PunkBuster didn't do the same thing.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    147. Re:So by LoRdTAW · · Score: 1

      Ill admit that back in the 90's after I met my aforementioned BBS friend I never paid for any software until around 2003-ish after I grew out of it though I still grabbed a lot of music and movies from BT sites. It was fun to pirate stuff from BBS's and later 0-day warez ftp servers. I remember playing Quake well over a month before it was released in stores. Early leaks were the bomb.

      Anyways, today I pay for all of my games and software, even my copy of Windows 7 ultimate (every other PC I have runs Linux). I still buy music but I also trade a lot of music but I don't download it from BT sites, instead I trade with friends. I don't care about movies anymore but I still watch a little TV from time to time.

    148. Re:So by thePowersGang · · Score: 1

      Even if valve do not release a master anti-drm patch if they disappear, I feel safe in the knowledge that all DRM can be cracked, and if Steam goes down permanently, many annoyed programmer+gamers (like myself) will be working hard to remove the DRM and keep playing their games.

    149. Re:So by Bite+The+Pillow · · Score: 1

      Just a bookmark for me regarding conclusions and the jumping thereto, especially in light of the ars technica article and gabes reddit topic. Fear not, you will serve humanity as well as you thought you were when posting.

    150. Re:So by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Seriously? Do CDNs not charge based on bandwidth usage? How do they make money then? I would think even if they provide serious cost savings they would still incur a lot more expenses from the guy whose content gets dowloaded to the tune of a billion terabytes than the guy whose sad cat video only gets three views.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    151. Re:So by jxander · · Score: 1

      20 years? So, 1994.

      Still a few years before N64 or original Playstation released, which means you must be talking about SNES or Sega Genesis games. Kinda kills your "only had a problem with one CD." Unless you meant CDs or ROM Cartridges. Or maybe you just meant 16 years instead of 20. Little hyperbole never hurt.

      So, still got your copy of FF7 around and ready to go? Because I do. On Steam.

      --
      This signature is false.
    152. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Better yet, don't use Steam. They don't offer anything you can't get elsewhere aside from a paltry assortment of old, generic Valve FPS games.

      Steam is DRM + spyware. Do you really want to be using and supporting that?

    153. Re:So by sosume · · Score: 1

      Will you be crafting DNS request packets by hand? If not, then you will still go through the windows IP stack, regardless of your DNS server.

    154. Re:So by Ash+Vince · · Score: 1

      Seriously...even if Valve didn't run VAC, someone else would run an equivalent service (can you say Punkbuster?). All it takes is for one or two companies to say "hey we have this way to detect cheaters, why don't we share the steam keys of the cheaters we find and keep them from playing online on our servers", and there you go.

      Exactly, a few years back I used to play America's Army 2 quite a lot. Most clans would stream bans from all the anti-cheat organisations they could on top of punkbuster being built into the game. So once PB kicked you for cheating, that IP you were using got recorded along with the GUID that was linked to your account. Any other accounts linked to that one by GUID or IP also became suspicious.

      Obviously if you were on a dynamic IP the IP link would be tenuous because you would be linked to loads of other players, but if you were on a static IP (you could tell by looking through your entire history of games and seeing how often it changed) then you needed to get a new IP before most AA2 servers would let you in. This worked because AA2 logged pretty much every game.

      The reality is the people who cheat spoil online gaming for everyone else, just about all games companies therefore have to be seen to do something about it.

      I personally would be much happier if Steam simply deleted your account along with all your games if you were caught cheating just once. Actually I would be happier if when you were caught cheating Valve sent someone round to your house to break both your legs but I can foresee a few legal difficulties with this.

      --
      I dont read /. to RTFA, I read /. to offend people in ignorance.
    155. Re:So by grumbel · · Score: 1

      DRM is DRM, and there's no such thing as "DRM done right."

      While it would be nicer without DRM, DRM is really only a small piece of what makes the whole service. Take for example Linux versions, on Steam, you automatically get them when they become available for free. When you buy on GOG or physical discs you don't get them, either they aren't provided at all or you have to pay again for them. If you want to play a non-english version of a game you also have a much better chance at getting it on Steam then on any other service.

      While that doesn't make the DRM go away, Steam does give me a lot more freedom on where and how I can play my games compared to other services. Would it be nice to have a DRM-free service with the same feature set as Steam? Sure, but as far as I know no one like it exists, closest thing is Humblebundle Store, which gives you both DRM-free versions as well as the Steam version, but they offer a lot less games then Steam at the moment.

    156. Re:So by grumbel · · Score: 1

      There's no "Linux obviously" about it. It's a matter of trust, and Linux or not, users are far too trusting of the applications they install.

      I don't think it's a problem with user trust, given all of the viruses and malware I don't think many are left that have trust in software. I think the problem is that no desktop OS gives you an easy way to properly isolate apps from each other. In Linux I can fudge around with multiple user accounts and such, but it's generally a mess, if there would something as easy as "sandbox ./your_untrustworthy_app" then people might actually use it.

    157. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Just get cracks for your games and remove Steam.

    158. Re:So by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Well, more "use libbind" the same as all the bind utils. It's one library call versus another. The point is that applications can, but don't, override this; there's nothing in the application allowing the user to tell it to do so, but it's bluntly easy for an application to provide a "stealth mode" that queries the OS for its DNS settings, then calls a stock DNS resolver library. Hell, I'm pretty sure that's how it's always done on Linux, using res_query() from libresolv (hence /etc/resolv.conf).

    159. Re:So by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      You think the Windows IP stack sniffs packets and then breaks TCP/IP to act as a DNS cache? Windows only has a list of recent DNS lookups because Windows apps call DnsQuery() to go through the WMI DNS Provider service, which is equivalent to setting 127.0.0.1 in /etc/resolv.conf on Linux and running bind locally as a caching nameserver.

    160. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      actually I still do have my copy of ff7 along wit the Brady strat guide. :] fuck steam

    161. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The suggestion wasn't to run the game in the VM it was to do your "questionable" browsing in the VM. I've never had trouble running a browser in a VM.

      I do agree trying to run the games in a VM is problematic. Even older games do not play well with the virtual Graphics card. I recently experemented with a windows 98 VM for nostalgia games that will not run under windows 7 regardless of the "compatibility" settings.

    162. Re: So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't care if if there is a hidden clause in their Eula that they say allows it. It's wrong, and they know it's wrong.

      There is a lot of stuff hidden in contracts that violates fundamental rights. Legal professionals have a vested interest in pushing the scope of contract law as far as they can, since most of their business relates to contracts in one way or another. The technical term for this is "unethical practice of law".

      Since the legal profession is in a position of ethical conflict of interest with respect to recognizing fundamental rights versus extending the scope of contract law, don't expect them to do anything about this. Entropy always increases in a closed system: the force for change in legal ethics matters must necessarily come from outside the legal profession.

      The right to ethical practice of law can be asserted as a fundamental right retained by the people under the 9th Amendment, and thus such practices are illegal under US law, or for any entity doing business with US citizens.

    163. Re:So by Samizdata · · Score: 1

      Or, when Games for Windows Live shuts down, you lose DLC you paid for through it, and get told by Steam and the Publisher, "Yeah, well, you need to buy it AGAIN if you ever want to uninstall said game."

      --
      It's not the years, honey, it's the mileage. - Colonel Henry Walton Jones, Jr., Ph.D.
    164. Re:So by Samizdata · · Score: 1

      I actually kinda of got into Steam because of the whole "losing physical media" thing.

      --
      It's not the years, honey, it's the mileage. - Colonel Henry Walton Jones, Jr., Ph.D.
    165. Re: So by jxander · · Score: 1

      And a working PS1 on which to play it, with controllers? And a TV with open RCA jacks?

      For my money, having it on Steam is just more convenient. Of course, ROMs are the best option, but I'm limiting to fully legal avenues

      To each their own, I suppose

      --
      This signature is false.
    166. Re:So by lgw · · Score: 1

      I did as well. Now I always check GoG first, because Steam just gets more annoying every year, but still better that than physical media!

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    167. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You are so full of shit it's embarrassing.

      I have a thirty year old video game on a floppy disk. To this day I can still put that floppy into a drive in order to play the game. No company in the world can come take away my floppy disk. On the other hand, the day Valve goes out of business or decide to change their service terms, you're fucked. They press a fucking button on their end and all of your games are gone.

      Yeah, fuck that. Only a complete idiot would think that's cool.

    168. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In other words, you don't know how to manage your software collection, so you'll put up with all kinds of abuse from somebody else that will do it for you.

      Keeping your game cd collection as virtual cds, and having them with you everywhere you go is trivial.

    169. Re:So by Samizdata · · Score: 1

      Well, Steam is pretty much lost me as a customer over me getting screwed on my Bioshock DLC purchase, so there's that. But I have too much stuff to throw it away.

      --
      It's not the years, honey, it's the mileage. - Colonel Henry Walton Jones, Jr., Ph.D.
    170. Re:So by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do not know how to rip an image from a disc? It doesn't sound like you do. Every single one of my games has been ripped to hard drive and zipped with their respective cracks. The optical media serves as a backup.

      Plus with physical media I don't have to wait for hours to download and install, I get a nice box, real manuals/books and any other little trinkets they throw in...all at the same price or less than you pay on Steam.

  2. Oh good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    So security researchers who also game are pretty much screwed then?

    1. Re:Oh good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Security researchers? Most game server admins I know (at least, the good ones) will browse hack sites/videos, so they know what's out there and what to look for. Unless it started very recently, they're not doing any banning for this.

    2. Re:Oh good by mjwx · · Score: 1

      So security researchers who also game are pretty much screwed then?

      Any security researcher that goes to hacking sites on their gaming box is screwed.

      IIRC, most security researchers use VM's these days to avoid contaminating systems that they use for production.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
  3. Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shock* by Puls4r · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Actually, the article doesn't say anyone has been banned using the data. It specifically says that NO one currently knows what happens with the data. So that's a pretty large red herring. That doesn't negate the heinousness of them tracking the websites you visit *just* in case you might cheat. Very NSA-esque.

  4. Visiting !=guilt by Justpin · · Score: 0

    For example a recent case was with World of Tanks. There was a botter who had been caught red handed, he was even silly enough to use his WoT user name as the bot forum user name. He was subsequently banned, but had a long winded argument with the support crying innocence, claiming it was a bad connection. The forumites even suggested he say that his son was disabled and used WoT as his only communication outlet. As a result quite a lot of legitimate WoT players visited this site (before the link was removed) simply to laugh and mock him. Does this mean all of us who went are all guilty of being cheaters?

    1. Re:Visiting !=guilt by mlts · · Score: 1

      This might be a way to bully/troll someone. Find what their account name is, then make an account with the identical name on every botting site. Of course, account names are hard to come by, but it is a way for someone to cause mischief, similar to people who create bogus FB profiles.

  5. GoG? by Torp · · Score: 1

    I've been trying to switch my gaming purchases to GoG anyway, mainly because it's a pain to game on both a laptop and desktop with Steam. This is just another reason for it.
    All GoG needs is to start supporting Linux...

    --
    I apologize for the lack of a signature.
    1. Re:GoG? by neilo_1701D · · Score: 1

      Windows person first and foremost; I'm a Dynamics AX technical consultant (please don't hurt me).

      I've been evaluating various Linux distros for my desktop, as my hobby time is more and more Linux (hello, Raspberry Pi and robotics!). I looked at Wine, and learned about CodeWeaver's CrossOver (this is probably old news to you). Once I had appropriate 3D drivers installed for my Toshiba S955 (that was a battle), I was able to install some stuff from GOG. Medal Of Honor: Allied Assault, for example, ran flawlessly in an XP bottle. Unreal was a disaster. That's my experience so far, which matches with what I read on CodeWeaver's site.

      So, whilst having GOG support Linux would be ideal, that's not going to happen. This seems to be a good alternative.

      (FWIW, I certainly got a buzz out of seeing Office 2010 install and run flawlessly on Fedora 19!)

    2. Re:GoG? by manicb · · Score: 1

      PlayOnLinux also makes it pretty easy, and explicitly supports a lot of GOG installers... Currently enjoying Neverwinter Nights from the GOG Insomnia sale on my Linux music production rig. Still, native versions are nice, and I won't buy a game from them if I have reason to suspect a native version is available.

  6. Browsing history? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I have no browsing history.

    Clear history when firefox closes. check

    1. Re:Browsing history? by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 1

      Why gee, such skills in online browsing history masking leave me speechless...

      --
      "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
    2. Re:Browsing history? by X0563511 · · Score: 2

      Last I checked that doesn't do shit about your OS' DNS cache.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    3. Re:Browsing history? by Barefoot+Monkey · · Score: 1

      Not browsing history.

      Run cmd.exe and in the command prompt type "ipconfig /displaydns" (without the quotation marks). That's your DNS history, and that's what Steam is looking through.

      To clear that, type "ipconfig /flushdns".

    4. Re:Browsing history? by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Won't make any difference if they're monitoring your DNS cache instead. Sorry, did you not realize that your porn-browsing habits leave secondary footprints on your system as well?

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    5. Re:Browsing history? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The listing surprised me, for a few reasons.

      One, it was fairly short.

      Two, for such a short list, it contained sites that I have not visited in a very very long time.

      Three, it seems to list sites that I definitely have NEVER heard of, much less visited. I have exclusive use of this machine, so it isn't from someone else. I suppose some are things that get loaded from other sites I visit?

      Someone said it should be empty when you boot, but that is definitely not the case here.

  7. Sweet! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    So all I have to do to limit the competition is search a cheating site from my buddies computer?! Thanks for the tip!

  8. ipconfig /flushdns by gatkinso · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Done.

    --
    I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
    1. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by peon_a-z,A-Z,0-9$_+! · · Score: 1

      But... Is an "empty" DNS history more suspect than a moderately populated one?

    2. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Right. Just be sure to do that before every time you launch Steam, and always shut down Steam before browsing the web.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    3. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by Mashdar · · Score: 1

      flushdns, ping goatse.Solved!

    4. Re: ipconfig /flushdns by lostfayth · · Score: 1

      most operating systems boot with a clean cache, and steam typically runs at startup/login. an empty or near empty DNS cache would not be an uncommon finding.

    5. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by sunderland56 · · Score: 1

      Why is there an API call to read the DNS history in the first place? The only required API is "please look up this address"; I can't see any valid reason to have a "please give me DNS history" call.

    6. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by BitterOak · · Score: 1

      But does the flushdns actually ERASE the contents of the cache or merely delete it? (By erase, I mean overwrite with zeros or something else so snooping software can't reconstruct the original cache contents.)

      --
      If I can be modded down for being a troll, can I be modded up for being an orc, or a balrog?
    7. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by Dogers · · Score: 1

      I assume you're doing that on your router too?

      --
      I am a viral sig. Please copy me and help me spread. Thank you.
    8. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Services.msc
      disable DNS Client service
      set service start to manual
      ipconfig /flushdns

    9. Re:ipconfig /flushdns by gatkinso · · Score: 1

      I suppose I have to roll a simple batch file for you as well. *sigh*

      --
      I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
  9. DNS cache really doesn't say that much by DigitalSorceress · · Score: 0

    Yes, sure, if your dns cache is full of porn sites, one may be able do deduce that you're actively visiting porn sites, but there are lots of sites on blocked/porn net nanny lists that are not actually porn.

    If your dns cache is full of right wing news sites, maybe you're right wing right? or wait, maybe you're not ,but you keep tabs on them, or maybe your brother used them.

    For instance, back when i was playing WOW a lot, I was also authoring (legal) addons for it. Since one of the activities I was supporting with dual boxing/multi-boxing (one player playing on multiple characters at once (each through their own paid account - legal under the TOS of the game), I did need to tread carefully to keep from crossing the line into what they'd consider "botting" (automation that allows an account to play without human intervention). I did research on some of the bots / botting that was available at the time - as part of understaning the difference (I never downloaded or used one, but yes, I surfed around and very likely included some "bad sites"

    My point being that dns histroy is only the grossest of measures of what you're doing on your pc - yes, it may be true that someone who never visits hack sitex/cheat sites will be less likely to have them show up on dnscache, but if they're active in gaming forums or if they're jus plain inquisitive, they could so easily be falesly accused.

    Someone who is actually cheating would likely be able to quickly figure out that they should use another computer to download/browse and/or ipconfig /flushdns before playing, etc...

    Like most all copy protection - it only stops the casual user and inconveniences many legit users. Anyone actively cheating with any amount of effort will easily avoid this.

    Yeah,

    --

    The Digital Sorceress
    1. Re:DNS cache really doesn't say that much by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      Doesn't WOW have public test servers? Why didn't you do your work on that?

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    2. Re:DNS cache really doesn't say that much by Immerman · · Score: 1

      >My point being that dns histroy is only the grossest of measures of what you're doing on your pc

      Don't worry, it's still enough to let the NSA send you to Guantanamo indefinitely if you do anything else suspicious, or if someone doesn't like you. I'm sure it's only a matter of time before such privileges extend to their secret corporate sponsors as well. And for those kinds of privileges who *wouldn't* sponsor them?

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    3. Re:DNS cache really doesn't say that much by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Here's the kicker - the "dns service" on windows is completely unnecessary. And without it running? ipconfig /displaydns returns no results. It's that simple.

    4. Re:DNS cache really doesn't say that much by DigitalSorceress · · Score: 1

      They do have test servers, but I'm talking about just researching the bot issue - looking up web sites that discussed technical information that maybe WOW would consider "cheat sites" -

      Warcraft wasn't using VAC obviously, but I was trying to give an example of researching information that may be on sites that if you looked at my DNS, you might assume I was cheating - In other words: DNS doesn't in and of itself tell the actual story.

      --

      The Digital Sorceress
    5. Re:DNS cache really doesn't say that much by DigitalSorceress · · Score: 1

      Well, indeed, with the way things are today, you may have a point. /looks nervously over shoulder

      --

      The Digital Sorceress
  10. What about cheat haters? by AlienSexist · · Score: 1

    I've known gamers to frequent cheat sites just to see what the cheaters are using and what is possible to exploit When a legitimate player suddenly faces inexplicable challenges sometimes they go find where people are downloading their skills/advantages from in order to explain their new struggles. Often times it starts with the feeling "that HAS to be a cheat" then digging around finding if there is a cheat the enables that behavior.

    1. Re:What about cheat haters? by Rich0 · · Score: 1

      I imagine that they'll get the same experience as somebody who runs a Tor relay-only node. Admins will block them because it is easy to do, and has a minimal impact on their sales. They really don't care if it has no impact on security.

    2. Re:What about cheat haters? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I swear, I just read it for the articles.

  11. This is the VAC and not steam client by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Keep in mind they're talking about the VAC software and not the steam client. VAC runs when you run a game that supports it. (The wiki page has a list of games though I do not know how up to date it is.) The Steam client doesn't do this reporting itself.

    1. Re:This is the VAC and not steam client by Torp · · Score: 1

      And this makes it better how?

      --
      I apologize for the lack of a signature.
    2. Re:This is the VAC and not steam client by DrGamez · · Score: 1

      Because more information is usually better than not having this information?

      The AC you replied never said this is better or worse, so stop trying to color their arguments to make your own comment look better.

  12. Article based on REDDIT post by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    The article is based on a REDDIT post. We all know they are always 100% accurate and credible. They did catch the boston bombers afteralll!

    journalism at its finest.

    1. Re:Article based on REDDIT post by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But we hate Valve, so it must be true. Just have some faith.

    2. Re:Article based on REDDIT post by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Now if only there was another interesting source of news articles

  13. This is why you should use the apk host file. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Obviously it blocks malicious behavior such as this.

  14. Time to run apps as if they were applicances? by davidwr · · Score: 1

    Perhaps its time to put certain applications, such as web browsers in their own "VM appliance" to isolate them from being spied on or misused by other apps.

    In the meantime, get into the habit of using your browser's "privacy mode."

    If games and other apps that don't "need" to work with your other applications can run in a VM without an unacceptable performance hit, consider putting them in such a box as well.

    If your OS supports running apps in sandboxes/jails and your favorite games work well in such an environment, that may be easier than putting them in a full-blown VM.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
    1. Re:Time to run apps as if they were applicances? by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Perhaps its time to put certain applications, such as web browsers in their own "VM appliance" to isolate them from being spied on or misused by other apps.
      \In this case that would have no effect - the DNS cache is (indirectly) accessed by every 'net enabled application on you computer.

      Or perhaps it's time to start implement finer-grained permissions for all applications, such as the security system OLPC was experimenting with. There's no reason anything in my game library should be able to look at anything except the application and save-game folders. A document editor may need access to your complete documents folder and external media, but there is no reason for it to be able to examine what other programs are installed on my computer. And *nothing* should be able to touch my web cam without explicit permission. Law enforcement can already listen in on any conversation that takes place within earshot of a telephone, but there's no reason to let nefarious individuals do the same thing with any conversation within earshot of a laptop/tablet/etc.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
    2. Re:Time to run apps as if they were applicances? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Would this work? Steam is looking at the HOSTS DNS. I would assume that that VMs DNS just passes its DNS requests down.

    3. Re:Time to run apps as if they were applicances? by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Good luck with most games. Game makers hate it when you run their games in a VM, considering a tool used only by crackers, so they'll do whatever possible to limit your ability to even run them in a VM.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  15. AppArmor by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That's why my steam client and games are confined to an AppArmor profile.

  16. Workaround by goombah99 · · Score: 1

    How do one set up rules to block Steam from accessing firefox profiles? (Linux obviously, though guide for Windows is fine too. Also Chrome.)

    The only useful workaround is to boycott steam. Otherwise they will work around your workarounds till they finally just install a Sony rootkit. Do you really want a company that even takes even one step over the line? teach them a lesson.

    --
    Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
    1. Re:Workaround by dshk · · Score: 2

      Players who are frustrated by cheaters are also ready to boycott Steam. If I were Steam, I would serve my frustrated, honest users. We also maintain a gaming site, and you cannot believe how many people get angry because of cheaters.

      I have no issue if they only check for domains or only selectively download the list. But I use three different machines for gaming, development, and system administration.

    2. Re:Workaround by Zxern · · Score: 1

      Yeah and I bet most of the time people claim someone is cheating when they in fact aren't. The other player is simply better and they get frustrated and claim cheating. Happens all the time.

  17. they know where you porn, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    where you bank, where you talk politics, who your friends are, what your secrets are...

  18. solutions to this might be drastic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I still haven't purchased a single game that requires Steam, Microsoft Live or the like. It sucks, but it is what it is. I fully intend to do whatever it takes to defend my First Sale Doctrine rights and purchase physical versions I can re-sell later on. Until these rights are extended to digital goods, I'm gonna die one grumpy dude playing CIV II, III and IV, but never V, Dawn of War and all the expansions, but never DoW II and so many other titles.

    At least I have my PS3, and so far, PS4 titles that don't require Online Passes...

    I'm voting with my dollars.

    1. Re:solutions to this might be drastic by Immerman · · Score: 1

      Good on ya. If you really miss not being able to play many newer games though may I suggest a slightly different perspective? Steam doesn't sell games, they make long-term rentals. And there's nothing wrong with that - I occasionally rent movies, watch hulu, or borrow books from the library - none of which make any pretense to transferring ownership in the first place. As I see it the biggest problems with Steam are twofold:
      1) They claim to be selling the games.
      2) They charge full purchase price for the rental.

      Now (1) is deceptive advertising, and if you consider it worthy of boycott I won't argue, except to point out the general ineffectiveness of a boycott without widespread popularity and organization. But (2) has a solution for the conscientious consumer - wait until the "purchase" price falls to what you'd consider an acceptable rental price, and then rent it. It may take a few years, and the graphics will no longer be quite as impressive as compared to new games, but at least for single-player games the gameplay's all there.

      There's also some DRM-free games sold through the Steam storefront, they don't compel publishers to incorporate Steam DRM after all, they just make it easy. I have no objection to such games, and you've got to admit Stream is doing some wonderful things for the indie game market. Plus being a Steam-store customer who will buy full-price DRM-free games but only rents games when deeply discounted is likely to send a far clearer message as to the nature of your objection to those data-mining the sales data.

      --
      --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
  19. DEBUNKED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    This story is being debunked in the original reddit thread.

    http://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/1y4za5/steams_vac_now_reads_all_the_domains_you_have/

    1. Re:DEBUNKED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ok maybe they are not doing it. However, it is an interesting idea. Using other applications on your system and scanning thru them and sending the data back. Obviously you want some sort of sandboxing. How do we as end users enable this behavior? If it does not exist how do we as developers build it? Then on the flip side there are many applications I want to share data between. For example doc files I want them to be seen by both the editor and my email application, however not by my steam instance. But sometimes I would want to enable that behavior?

    2. Re:DEBUNKED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Scanning the DNS cache, looking for suspect sites, is apparently common technique for other anti-cheat tools like PunkBuster. There's nothing in the original "article" (*cough* astroturf *cough*) to indicate that Steam is sending the analyzed DNS data back to their mothership. They're not Canonical and Ubuntu, after all, Steam actually *has* a business model.

      Now *if* Steam collected the data, what could they do with it? They could sell it, data on what web sites gamers like to visit could be valuable. They could also analyze it for tuning ads on their own Steam client for their own customer, which could even be done loally but is more easily done upstream. And they could *analyze the DNS data from know cheaters for common sites!*, and use that to flag customers as "keep an eye on this one". That would be exactly the kind of system monitoring a political or law enforcement or divorce lawyer analysis could find intriguing, without requiring decryption or complex analysis of logs that might be harder to find.

      So it's raised an interesting question.

    3. Re:DEBUNKED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Where is the debunking in that link? All I see is "No they're not" backed up with such undeniable proof as "I can read C!".

      It's debunking in the same way that creationists debunk evolution by saying "DARWIN IS A LIAR!!!!!111111".

    4. Re:DEBUNKED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There is no need to believe anyone. The code isn't actually that hard to read. Look at it yourself. If I am not mistaken the debunker is right. I don't see any sending of the computed digests to valve in the published snippet.

    5. Re:DEBUNKED by 0123456 · · Score: 1

      That would be exactly the kind of system monitoring a political or law enforcement or divorce lawyer analysis could find intriguing, without requiring decryption or complex analysis of logs that might be harder to find.

      You do realize this is a GAME we're talking about, not a terrorist cell?

    6. Re:DEBUNKED by makomk · · Score: 2

      For values of "debunked" equal to "people clueless about how VAC works are loudly insisting that it's not true, and being believed because Valve fanbois". (Amongst other issues, you won't find the code of any VAC modules in Steam's or the game's DLLs because they're downloaded from the server at runtime in order to make them harder to reverse-engineer and block.) Someone later in the thread has apparently tested and found that stuffing the DNS cache with bogus entries increases the amount of SSL-encrypted data VAC sends back by almost exactly twice the size of the MD5 hashes of all those entries, and clearing the cache returns the amount of data sent back to what it was. (It may not necessarily be possible for others to replicate this, as I recall one of VAC's anti-reverse-engineering measures is that different people receive a different subset of the payload modules. So far no-one's tried though, they've just said it's not proof enough.)

    7. Re:DEBUNKED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      If by debunked, you mean "confirmed, but vehemently defended".

  20. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Indeed, it also says the the actual entries themselves are not sent back, but only the hashes. This would not stop someone checking if Joe has visited a specific site, but it would stop someone from looking at all Joes history to find out what he's been up to.

    I'd guess that they are not looking for *web*sites related to cheats, but rather the servers that provide software updates etc. for the cheats.

  21. How ironic . . . by Kimomaru · · Score: 1, Insightful

    I thought the point of playing a game was to relieve stress. Getting online to play something is starting to become more involved and complex than most people's jobs. It is kind of a shame, though, that people take Counterstrike and Call of Duty so seriously that they need to scam the system. Defeats the purpose, no?

    1. Re:How ironic . . . by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I thought the point of playing a game was to relieve stress.

      I know people love games and I do too. However, there is such a glut of entertainment choices in our modern world that anyone who pushes too hard sends me packing to greener pastures. Gaming became too hard for me (I have bad wrists now that limit how long I can play) so I moved on. Something comes with DRM somewhere another doesn't. Favorite TV show starts to "jump the shark"...thankfully there's another series coming up. iOS programming getting to be a pain, maybe I'll explore a new language today. There are a ton of good books that are inexpensive or free. I can pickup my guitar or play some paper-n-pencil RPGs

      The point: there are probably a 100 things you enjoy and just don't have time to enjoy them all. Steam being a pain, well guess it is time to pickup that knitting project that's been sitting in the drawer.

    2. Re:How ironic . . . by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It is kind of a shame, though, that people take Counterstrike and Call of Duty so seriously that they need to scam the system. Defeats the purpose, no?

      Those are both eSports. It's possible to win prize money from tournaments(*) by being good at them.

      (*) Hurr, durr eSports, play a real sport, etc. I know. Not more ridiculous than Poker. Chess or Magic the Gathering though.

  22. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by moronoxyd · · Score: 2

    Luckily, not everyone lives in the US.
    Some countries have different laws, even consumer protection laws that are worth that name.

    And yes, even companies operating out of the US have to conform to at least some of these laws if they want to do business in Germany/Europe. An yes, they WANT to, because Europe is not an insignificant market.

  23. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    > Indeed, it also says the the actual entries themselves are not sent back, but only the hashes

    DNS names are easily enumeratable, the only reason to emphasize that it's hashes is if you're clueless or dishonest.
    From a privacy perspective, they are sending back DNS names, saying that's hashes is only fooling people.

  24. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In any case, Valve can do what they so choose,

    Bullshit. They cannot do things thay violate the law (not saying this does or doesn't in any jurisdiction). It also does not pur Valve above criticism even if this tired excuse line wasn't bullshit.

    One agreed to this when logging and downloading their software, and this EULA/TOS will stand up in any court in the US.

    While this particular EULA may, just because someone enters into a contract does not make it legally valid. See illegal contracts.

    Only thing one can do is not use their service.

    No, one can do many other things such as loudly criticize them, report them to the country's consumer protection group, etc.

  25. another workaround. if you care by goombah99 · · Score: 2

    flush the dns cache before you launch steam:
    on a mac that command is:
    sudo killall -HUP mDNSResponder

    However since steam is normally installed with admin permissions it may very well be running some sort of spyware deamon that is violating your privacy even when the application is not running, making that dodge useless. Since they are willing to go that far I would not put it past them to also be running a spyware daemon as well.

    --
    Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
    1. Re:another workaround. if you care by Carewolf · · Score: 2

      No on Debian, I run steam as a normal user under user credentials. It doesn't launch any daemons, and has no suid executables, but it does have read/write access to all local files which includes saved history of browsers. Will do strace when I get home. Should be interesting.

    2. Re:another workaround. if you care by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

      flush the dns cache before you launch steam:
      on a mac that command is:
      sudo killall -HUP mDNSResponder

      Except, mDNSResponder isn't a DNS cache. It's the multicast (hence "m") DNS server used by Bonjour/ZeroConfig.

      It has zip to do with DNS caching other than storing what services are being made available on your machine to your network. It binds on a multicast IP.

    3. Re:another workaround. if you care by ArbitraryName · · Score: 1

      It has zip to do with DNS caching other than storing what services are being made available on your machine to your network. It binds on a multicast IP.

      False. mDNSResponder is also used for unicast. The command to flush the DNS cache given by the GP is exactly how Apple tells you to do it using Mountain Lion.

  26. Promise not to share by gmuslera · · Score: 1

    ... unless an employee decides to use it, a secret order of the NSA requires to disclose it, their servers get hacked (by the NSA, other countries intelligence agencies, hacking groups, or script kiddies) or the protocol have a vulnerability or the information can be captured and decrypted. The respect of privacy by US companies had become an oximoron. Is a promise that they can't possibly honor, and they are too big to close doors like Lavabit if the NSA want their customers data.

  27. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Unlike in 'murica, in the civilized world the answer to corporate misbehavior is not to simply continuing taking it up the butt. I know, I know. It's ebil "socialism"!!!!!!

  28. Re:Is it safe now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The amount of comments are only a third of what they were before, but articles get posted more often.

    Haven't seen as many spambots, so not all bad. Still get modded troll when I post for some reason, so not much has changed with the community make-up.

  29. Isolate browsing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You should be isolating your web browsing on a vm you use only for that anyway.

  30. This isn't as hard to combat as you think.... by ToddHofer · · Score: 1

    The easiest thing to do is, is created a batch script that empties your history and flushes your DNS. After that, it opens steam. Assign your steam icon to that batch file. Problem solved.

  31. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Immerman · · Score: 1

    I'm not so sure.
    1. Are you sure the EULA actually states that they may monitor your non-steam related activities? I would appreciate a pointer to the relevant paragraph if so.
    2. My understanding is that it's still somewhat up in the air exactly how legally binding an EULA really is. Though I doubt most people could afford a good enough lawyers to press the issue
    3. Even assuming the EULA is binding, it's generally accepted that a contract cannot demand that either party surrender their constitutional rights, and the 9th Amendment specifically states that the enumerated rights are only a sampling, not a comprehensive list, or even a list of the most important, and in no way should be interpreted to detract from the importance of the rights not so enumerated. Privacy included.

    --
    --- Most topics have many sides worth arguing, allow me to take one opposite you.
  32. VM is your friend... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    run your cheat browsing in a VM.
    Problem solved...

  33. Re:Is it safe now? by sideslash · · Score: 1

    WHY HELLO, MY FELLOW LOYAL, SLASHDOT-READING COMRADE. LET US TALK OF DNS CACHES AND GAME SUBSCRIPTIONS AND VALVE AND STUFF.

    [whisper] Would you shut up? You're gonna get us killed. All the first wave of revolutionaries have already been lined up against the wall and shot. Keep it under the radar. Now see if you can sneak over to the Facebook love analysis article, and another resistance operative will brief you there.[/whisper]

  34. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It'll no doubt get used as features. Correlate DNS lookups to someone caught cheating, find other users with similar patterns, watch/ban them.

  35. Ineffective anti-cheat mechanism, no? by rnturn · · Score: 1

    It wouldn't, for example, prevent anyone from cheating by doing some browsing at the local coffee shop to find the cheats and then coming home to play games on the desktop system at home.

    --
    CUR ALLOC 20195.....5804M
    1. Re:Ineffective anti-cheat mechanism, no? by Ash+Vince · · Score: 1

      It wouldn't, for example, prevent anyone from cheating by doing some browsing at the local coffee shop to find the cheats and then coming home to play games on the desktop system at home.

      You get the reply, but I think many of you here are missing the point about why Steam might be doing this. They probably don't care about your browsing history, when they care about is other bits of software doing DNS requests.

      In my very limited experience these sort of cheats that VAC are looking for are now a subscription service. They know that VAC or PB or whatever will detect them very quickly, so they update them regularly and you subscribe. That means the cheat software probably phones home to check your subscription is still valid and see if the game has been updated to detect the version you are currently running. VAC is probably trying to detect that phoning home.

      Of course, now everyone know they do this the cheat authors will just make sure they bypass the DNS cache and VAC will probably have to find another way.

      --
      I dont read /. to RTFA, I read /. to offend people in ignorance.
  36. This is hacking by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    If an individual does something like this, you can bet the government would charge them with computer crime under the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act. If a company does it, nothing gets done.

  37. Re:Is it safe now? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nope I was redirected to beta again this morning.

  38. uninstall by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    time to uninstall steam and stop getting anything from valve

  39. that insane... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    so now no one with a CS degree can play on steam!? REALLY!? who the hell thought this was a good idea...

  40. Different question by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The question is not whether Steam is doing it.

    The real question is what is there to stop them from doing this, or worse. Now, or in the future.

    Steam is a company, it won't die with the death of its dictator-in-chief. Today we a graced with benevolent chap, but the next chap might decide to tighten the screws.

    So, what you gonna do about it?

    Me, I personally thought about complaining to UK office for fair trade (or some such name) about potential case of tying here, which is illegal in UK. But other than that, I have no idea what one can do. Tying means selling you one product but also implicitly tying into using another service, where you can't use product you bought without using the service also.

    1. Re:Different question by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The question is not whether Steam is doing it.

      I'd say you would fit in better at Reddit, but looking at this thread, apparently Reddit came to slashdot.

    2. Re:Different question by Jaysyn · · Score: 2

      So, what you gonna do about it?

      Download the games & crack them, just like I used to do before Steam made them dirt cheap?

      --
      There is a war going on for your mind.
  41. Good not to be a gamer by erroneus · · Score: 1

    I have a non-addictive personality in general... perhaps it would be more accurate to say "anti-addictive" as there have been times when I would go overboard with some activities. X-Wing vs Tie Fighter, for example, cost me hundreds of dollars in "sick days" after calling in to work because I wanted to accomplish something. (Sick and stupid right?) I came to my senses after a paycheck demonstrated the value of my lost time. Anyway, I don't really play games which are time consuming and/or deeply involving... not often anyway.

    But if I were a gamer, I would be intensely offended by Valve's activities. Then again, I spent some really late nights playing Halo 2 losing sleep and feeling miserable... yeah... I did it again. Didn't cost me money, but cost me in health and rest and all that. It was while playing that and similar games that I really appreciated how much I hate cheaters. Aim-bots and all this other crap just served to anger me...which kept me awake playing. Eventually, I woke up to what I was doing (again) and restored myself to healthier ways. But I do know cheaters see cheating as a game in and of itself which is why they do it.

    So I understand why Valve wants to do it but as a Bill of Rights guy, I am deeply disturbed and disgusted by Valve's actions as well. (Yes, I know Valve isn't government but the principles have a way of bleeding into all walks and areas of life and it's quite likely that they are sharing data with government as just about everyone seems to be. Go visit Dick's Sporting Goods and see how much information they try to get from you when you buy guns and/or ammo. Holy crap it's scary and disgusting. And they CERTAINLY and DEFINITELY share data with the government electronically.)

    I'm not going to say I don't care about this or that I don't have a dog in this fight. I do. I see many of the principles laid out in the BoR as common sense and as a structure for how to maintain mutual respect for various parties not only government.

    Personally, I think people should stop playing shooting games and buy real guns and ammo. It's harder to cheat, for one, but is more expensive to be sure. But the effect of practice and skill certainly serve to trigger those accomplishment feelings. Also, PC gamers can also appreciate the desire to acquire high performance devices of all sorts ranging from scopes to lasers and all sorts of creative and amusing shotgun ammo. Caution: Guns and Ammo are expensive... way more than PC gaming. But the fun is unquestionable.

    Stop using the software and services of these rights offenders entirely. They need to understand where the line should be drawn.

    1. Re:Good not to be a gamer by nurb432 · · Score: 1

      You think it will stop here?

      --
      ---- Booth was a patriot ----
    2. Re:Good not to be a gamer by erroneus · · Score: 1

      Well, since the story is actually not real, who knows.

      It does serve as a message to the industry about what's not acceptable. That message has come out loud and clear in so many ways against so many companies lately that it stands reason that the industry, and valve especially, will still get the message.

      As for dumping games and buying guns? I don't know. The market in that area is still growing. And as elections are getting closer, the price of guns and ammo as well as gasoline are temporarily dropping. And the market is especially interested in women as a growing demographic. So very interesting things are happening there despite the present media hype about gun violence. (They rarely report that it's decreasing every year and has been for a long time and even more rarely report that places with more restrictive gun laws have more gun violence than places without.)

      And the US's culture of politically correct fear is just about ready burn itself out as issues are increasingly coming to a head. We're tired of racism. We're tired of fear, hype and hysteria. We're growing more tired of government though admittedly, most don't realize or understand how incredibly dependent on government they actually are. The landscape is shifting even if it's not fast enough for my taste.

  42. Overkilllll by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So Valve wants to do market research, how about pay me for it? Even my dns data history is my data, not yours.

    Doing this under guise of cheat prevention is total BS...

    In fact unless this is specifically mentioned in contracts i believe this would in many countries be totally illegal to do.

    If they really want to catch cheaters, they should try do that in-game and make their game unhackable.

    Just because someone reads about hacks, docent mean he uses them. I for one like to know what it looks liek when someone hacks so i can report them... Its like putting all chemist in prison just in case because some chemist manufactures drugs...

  43. Use a proxy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The DNS cache is then stored on the proxy server rather than on your own. You'll only have the proxy information on your computer.

  44. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by arth1 · · Score: 1

    DNS names are easily enumeratable, the only reason to emphasize that it's hashes is if you're clueless or dishonest.
    From a privacy perspective, they are sending back DNS names, saying that's hashes is only fooling people.

    Oh? If they're really easily enumerable, pray tell, which DNS name does the following hash point to?
    c0ff3e297157c1e60bc2a2bedb5f6532

  45. BFD by bigwavedave33 · · Score: 1

    Use another user profile on your box to play the game that is not an admin. Problem solved

  46. There's absolutely no potential for abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There's no way just looking at your browser history would lead to possible abuses.

    Also, do you have to look at so much lesbian porn all the time? There are other things on the Internet, you know.

    1. Re:There's absolutely no potential for abuse by ArcadeMan · · Score: 2

      Also, do you have to look at so much lesbian porn all the time? There are other things on the Internet, you know.

      What do you mean? An African or European lesbian?

    2. Re:There's absolutely no potential for abuse by Cederic · · Score: 1

      Trans-racial lesbian porn is always a tense experience: Which colour will the dildos be?

    3. Re:There's absolutely no potential for abuse by Hamsterdan · · Score: 1

      There's even a third type which includes *both*...

      --
      I've got better things to do tonight than die.
    4. Re:There's absolutely no potential for abuse by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pink, of course.

  47. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Gaygirlie · · Score: 1

    That doesn't negate the heinousness of them tracking the websites you visit *just* in case you might cheat.

    They aren't tracking websites you visit. They are tracking your DNS-requests. They are not the same thing, DNS-requests only show what domain names your system has queried and doesn't even say if the queries have come from the browser, IM, games or anything else -- there is no way for Valve to deduce the websites you've been visiting from these if there's more than one site behind the domain, like e.g. many blogging platforms and such host thousands of blogs under a single domain-name.

  48. Browsing history or DNS cache? by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

    These are different things.

    Also, not to apologize for Valve, but there are games far more invasive than this. Some NFS games (NFS:S2U for one) will trawl your actual browser history to put targeted ads on in-game advertising surfaces. Unless you use a software firewall to block their Internet access ;-)

    --
    "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  49. 2 different things by fluffythdestroy · · Score: 1

    Going on a website and getting the info is 1 thing but using that info to your use might be another thing. For example I could go on a cheating website to report it to steam at the end but I have to at least go on the website to verify if the app is available. To steam unfortunately it doesn't matter but it should. The lack of effort from Steams side is surprising as they should involve its users in the fight against cheats instead of fighting against users. Users pay for games, I'm pretty sure some of them wouldn't mind report cheats as I don't know a person who likes to get cheated in games.

    --
    PC Gaming enthousiast that gives comments, opinions and reviews on Games. I'm just having fun with games while doing let
  50. Windows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Disconnect from net, Open command prompt, Type: ipconfig /flushdns
    Reconnect net.

  51. Not like I have other computers by FrozenGeek · · Score: 1

    Oh, wait. I'm a slash-dotter. I have lots of computers. So I'll Steam on one computer and get cheats on another. Sorry Valve.

    --
    linquendum tondere
  52. nothing related to browsers by fluffythdestroy · · Score: 1

    Its related to your dns cache. In windows you type ipconfig /displaydns to get the info steam could use against you but doing a ipconfig /flushdns might do the trick to flush what steam would use but i don't know when steam fetch the info so the best way is to either use a proxy (some are free as well) or use VM. If you have Windows 7, you could use the XP Mode and after doing some test, whatever you do or go on xp mode, the dns of your host is still clean. So do your cheat or browsing in xp mode then close it down and your dns will always be clean.

    --
    PC Gaming enthousiast that gives comments, opinions and reviews on Games. I'm just having fun with games while doing let
  53. wrong fix by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Sounds like they are solving the wrong issue. The issue isn't what sites I go to and to be frank that's none of their damned business. I don't cheat on multiplayer, but on single player I download trainers because I don't want to waste time grinding most of the time, and my enjoyment comes from the story. Online cheating punishes the whole server and to think that Steam can solve the issue like this is just plain wrong. This just punishes people for browsing and doesn't stop the cheaters.

    1. Re:wrong fix by dshk · · Score: 1

      I am sure that a visit to a site which distributes cheating tools is only one of the many factors in the evaluation of whether the player is a likely cheater or not.

  54. Better answer by nurb432 · · Score: 1

    Just don't support valve with your money for pulling crap like that.

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  55. Re:cmake by hawkinspeter · · Score: 1

    Browsing the internet only from a VM is actually the most secure way to do so whether or not you're running Steam. With a VM, you can do some browsing, click on all the most depraved and unsavoury sites and then close it down and revert to a snapshot.

    --
    You're a temporary arrangement of matter sliding towards oblivion in a cold, uncaring universe
  56. So? by Travelsonic · · Score: 1

    ...but all Steam users have agreed to abide by specific online conduct and not to use cheats.

    So?
    Doesn't necessarily mean "any means necessarily" is necessarily what they agreed to, or legal - especially something to goes that far without being explicitly confined. *sighs* I wish people who cite the EULA, etc not as an argument, but as a shutout to opposing arguments would just shut up and learn that it doesn't cancel out all arguments, particularly since it being written doesn't necessarily mean it's legal, nor does it negate that people will/can have an opinion about it.

    --
    If you believe in privacy, and believe you have "nothing to hide" at the same time, you're a goddammed idiot
  57. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Calydor · · Score: 1

    c0ff3e ...

    Starbucks.com

    --
    -=This sig has nothing to do with my comment. Move along now=-
  58. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by JesseMcDonald · · Score: 2

    Oh? If they're really easily enumerable, pray tell, which DNS name does the following hash point to?
    c0ff3e297157c1e60bc2a2bedb5f6532

    I have no idea, but even you must be able to see that it would be trivial to put together a lookup table of the top million or so domain names indexed on their corresponding hashes. From that you can easily work out the domain name from the hash, without actually reversing the hash function.

    --
    "The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
  59. even worse yet by slashmydots · · Score: 1

    In case you're not familiar with Steam and VAC, it doesn't work worth a shit and people cheat all the time. It's a complete joke that makes even Punkbuster look good. MW3 was a huge budget game that was ruined by cheaters. It's a complete mess roughly equivalent to a low budget game like Renegade where over 50% of people are shooting through walls with unlimited ammo, etc. That's all on top of VAC too, which does NOTHING.

  60. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by PFactor · · Score: 2

    What he means is that there are rainbow tables available for many MD5 hashes. There is software that can search hundreds of thousands of possible hashes per second. You don't need to calculate the MD5 hash over, you just have to do a simple text compare, followed by a lookup in the rainbow table. If you have a rainbow table of the major hack sites in which you're interested, I bet it doesn't take more than a second or two to determine if the hash you sent is of one of those sites. Maybe that doesn't fit your definition of easily enumerable, but it fits mine.

    --
    Don't believe anything I say. I crash test crack pipes for a living.
  61. Cat got my tongue.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "more like spyware than anti-cheat"

    Sums up pretty much every "anti-cheat" and "drm" system I've ever seen..

  62. The Privacy Policy does NOT... by Rizzen · · Score: 1

    ... allow for harvesting of information on your computer. If you read the full agreement you'll see that it specifically states, "By using Valve's online sites, products, and services, users agree that Valve may collect personally identifiable information (as defined below)."

    No where does it say they will go through your DNS cache. At best, the policy covers things such as your Name, Address, Phone Number, CC #, etc for billing purposes, and the use of cookies and the like.

    Unfortunately the Steam TOS has a binding arbitration clause which effectively keeps you from suing them. (See section 12 of the Steam TOS)

    Linky things:
    Valve Privacy Policy: http://store.steampowered.com/...
    Steam TOS: http://store.steampowered.com/...

  63. Big Deal / Easily Evaded by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most people have an old p/c lying around that's not up to gaming anmore, or a cell phone. Visit the cheat sites on those and Valve will never be the wiser. This is a non-event now that it's known about. The spyware aspect is another issue though.

  64. Disable DNS Client Service In Windows by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Disable the DNS Client Service in Windows to avoid this tracking from Valve and others.

  65. No SteamBox for me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't play these games. I have been considering getting a SteamBox when they become generally available. I have a free HDMI port on my TV. But this, along with other things that I have read about Valve, has made me decide to not get hooked. I play some nice games on my Android. Maybe not as action packed as on a console, but I'm 61 and have slow reflexes.

    1. Re:No SteamBox for me by iamacat · · Score: 1

      Did you carefully read and understand the lists of permissions before installing these Android games?

  66. avoid Steam by Tom · · Score: 1

    Just one more reason to avoid Steam, and that's even considering that TFA is largely bogus and bans based on this data gathering are a myth.

    But that a fucking game center spies on your browser history is crazy. It has no fucking business doing that. Prevent 3rd party tools from accessing the games and modifying them in-memory, etc. - fine with me, that's what I expect with an anti-cheat software. Gather statistics on my online browsing habbits? Quite honestly, this should be illegal and carry jailtime penalties. Why are we giving corporations stalking permissions when private people can go to jail for much less?

    --
    Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
  67. Easy to defeat... by BronsCon · · Score: 1

    Gaming rig for gaming, general purpose rig for porn, finding hacks and cheats, and everything else. Duh.

    --
    APK quotes people (including myself) without context and should not be trusted. Just thought you should know.
  68. Guilty before actually committing the "crime" huh? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is the same thing as saying that since I own a gun and ammo, that because having those things allows me to kill people, that I am already a killer.

    Just because you went to a hack site, it doesn't mean that you use those hacks on a Steam game. Personally, it feels like Valve is just getting lazy in detecting hacking activity and is just going after people who look at those sites.

  69. If steam goes that far.... by CTU · · Score: 1

    then its time to pull out a second system for web searching and bring in your cheats via flash drive. Steam can only check the system it is running on

  70. Hacking SteamOS to disable VAC? by tlhIngan · · Score: 1

    Given how one of the main points of SteamOS is it's openness - does it make sense to have VAC on it?

    I mean, it's a LOT easier to make a Linux kernel module that finds out what the VAC (or Steam) processes are, then having the kernel module modify responses to hide stuff from it.

      I mean, lets say you have an aimbot or other cheat. You can run it on SteamOS, and have the kernel module hide that process (or even the fact network packets are redirected through it) so VAC can't even run anymore.

    And I don't see VAC as a kernel module as every component in SteamOS is supposed to be replaceable so even compiling a new kernel is an option.

    So I guess the question is - how is Valve protecting against SteamOS cheaters? It's a lot harder to do it on Windows since you have to do a lot of hooking and kernel signing and all that (plus trusting random binaries), whereas on Linux it's way easier to hook things.

  71. Just the first step by jmcwork · · Score: 1

    They are just mining browser history until they get the pre-cogs on-line.

  72. It's either cheating, spying or walled garden by iamacat · · Score: 1

    Once you allow custom software and especially device drivers to run on a box, it is theoretically impossible to automatically discover what that software is capable of doing. Any workarounds are sleazy in some way. Even basic DRM hides stuff and restricts rights of the legitimate owner of the hardware and software.

    In this case, the alternative is no or ineffective VAC and, accordingly, not much fun in multiplayer games. I guess it would be nice if Valve gave users the option to opt out of VAC and play on special open servers or only with specific trusted players.

  73. unwise by DaveGod · · Score: 1

    Back when I was a fansite and game admin I'd check the hack sites once per week or so to keep tabs on things.

  74. what is it using ? by JohnVanVliet · · Score: 1

    the $94,000 question is
    Is it using System V or System D to look up the dns cache ???????

    --
    "I don't pitch OpenSUSE Linux to my friends, i let Microsoft do it for me
  75. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by _xeno_ · · Score: 2

    Happily enough, Alexa offers a download of the top million domains. Even calculating the MD5 hash for every domain every time and doing a simple string comparison using node.js, it takes only a couple of seconds to run through every single entry in that table.

    arth1's domain isn't in the top million list, though.

    But still, there are plenty of sites in the top million list you may not want to share with Valve that you visit, like #83, pornhub.com, or #84, huffingtonpost.com.

    --
    You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
  76. My wife is cheating on me by sandbagger · · Score: 1

    Her name happens to be Borderlands 2 --- yeah, her parents are strange -- will Valve help me find out who she's seeing?

    --
    ---- The above post was generated by the Turing Institute. Maybe.
  77. sensational by SkunkPussy · · Score: 1

    Some guy has decompiled (what he claims to be) a VAC (Valve Anti Cheat) module that seems to be downloaded and executed when you connect to a game server. He has found code that scans the dns cache, hashes the domain name and adds it to an array.

    Its not clear what is done with the data - whether it is compared against a blacklist sent by the server, whether it is used as an anti-proxy measure to verify that the VAC module was downloaded from the correct server, or whether this data is indeed sent to Valve. Tellingly, the guy who found the code where Valve scans the dns cache, has not found any code where this data gets sent to Valve.

    So until someone actually finds code that sends this data off to Valve, I'm leaving the pitchfork party early.

    See also: http://www.reddit.com/r/Global...

    --
    SURELY NOT!!!!!
    1. Re:sensational by Sowelu · · Score: 1

      > to verify that the VAC module was downloaded from the correct server...
       
      ...actually that sounds about right, if not that exactly then something close. I can totally see someone using a HOSTS file to screw around with a security system, it makes sense. In an ideal world, they would only upload very specific entries.

  78. You missed one by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 2

    Home Owners' Associations

    They're almost the perfect example of American Greed: "We forbid _you_ from doing anything that might affect _our_ property values."

    Fascists.

  79. Derp by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I believe your account of how a proxy server works with a web browser would cause an SSL certificate warning on every https site. Among other problems.

    I think you are a fucking retard.

    1. Re:Derp by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

      Well. I've browsed sites like Milw0rm ad Packetstorm without https. I'm sure there's non-https warez sites... Pirate Bay? So maybe you just don't need HTTPS. Or maybe you just accept the exception for this session, and the 1 or 2 sites you hit you just browse.

  80. Re: Summary that misrepresents the Article... *sho by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You have a bizarre understanding of contract law. Luckily it has no basis in reality or a simple thing like a non disclosure agreement would be impossible.

  81. This is why I stopped buying PC games by WaffleMonster · · Score: 1

    I just want to play I don't want all of your bullshit. Between anti-piracy hoops, spying, forcing Internet connectivity and removing LAN functionality it just isn't worth it.

  82. Please, consider it in context. by Edgewize · · Score: 1

    When you play "Valve Anti-Cheat" (VAC) enabled games, you agree to allow Valve to scan your computer for evidence of cheat/hack programs. This is what VAC does. It's like Punkbuster, Warden, etc - depending on your point of view, it tries to level the playing field for multiplayer games, or it is an invasion of privacy because you have the right to cheat all you want.

    Valve's VAC, Blizzard's Warden, etc are all "spyware" by definition. Their job is to find and collect evidence of suspected game-tampering cheats, both known and unknown, and report them. They already sniff your running processes, window titles, loaded drivers, USB devices, filesystem, etc. Scanning your local DNS cache is probably one of the least invasive things that VAC does, *and it only happens when you play games which advertise the VAC feature*.

    If you don't like this, don't play VAC-enabled multiplayer games. It's that simple.

  83. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by bluefoxlucid · · Score: 1

    What blogging platform hosts thousands of blogs under a single domain name?

  84. Re:DEBUNKED - Not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Thank-you for linking to a page the reinforces, not debunks the original article.

  85. It turns out this is true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    On the Firefox help channel a user complained that attempting to upgrade Firefox asked it to reboot their machine, which Firefox never asks unless the firefox.exe process is "in use" by some unknown other process.

    The user then found out what process had hooked into the firefox.exe by attempting to delete it and Windows told them the process that had it in use was the STEAM SERVICE.

    captcha: ALERTS

    1. Re:It turns out this is true by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean Steam opened their default browser, which soft-crashed upon opening? The horror.

  86. Go ahead and try to delete firefox.exe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    and when Windows tells you the process is in use Unlocker can tell you which processes those are.
    Guess what you'll find?

    One of them will be the STEAM SERVICE!

    captcha: HIJACKED

  87. ...unless you have an IOMMU by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    (1) give your VM access to your PCIe graphics with your IOMMU
    (2) play Quake in your VM
    (3) pew pew pew

  88. Yet another reason... by phoenix182 · · Score: 1

    I don't use/allow steam or similar programs or services. True or not it's a headache I don't need.

  89. ipconfig /flushdns by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ipconfig /flushdns

  90. Must be true if it's on reddit :) by DTentilhao · · Score: 1

    Must be true if it's on reddit :)

  91. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

    So, would you be okay with everyone knowing that you hit goatse.cx every day at 11pm?

  92. VPN, virtualbox, proxies, OH MY!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There are tons of solutions to bypass such monitoring. Anyone growing up in grade school knows how to break the system, or anyone trying to circumvent a filter at work.

    Me? If I were the cheating kind, I'd browse the hacking websites through a VPN and then play regularly on my personal laptop. Or use any one of the privacy-oriented Linux distros available.

    How about public libraries, coffeehouses, and other pools of ne'er-do-wells? There's lots of options to circumvent this nonsense.

    But at the end of the day we need to speak with our WALLETS and not our WORDS. Stop buying their products if they will snoop so vigorously at your history. You shouldn't be treated guilty before proved innocent.

  93. the report is wrong- It'streaming cheat detection. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just in case no one mentioned it already; The VAC update is scanning fro streaming cheats supplied by cheat sites running servers to host the cheats. Instead of the user having the cheat on their computer a server will stream a cheat to the user. These are paid for private cheats not your average google search and download.

  94. your software my hardware by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's totally simple. If I'm using my hardware for something where I don't have control over the software, that specific software will find a completely plain installation with nothing. That installation of the OS is used exactly only for that purpose of hosting that software. Vacuum all the data you want.

    Especially for games this is easy to fulfil. It's not that they're being played in a multi-tasking environment with other things going on at the same time. So why should these other things even exist.

  95. Gabe responds by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Valve has responded and stated very convincingly that this accusation is crap.

  96. Response from Gabe Newell by gman003 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming...

    Basically, they're looking only for the DRM servers used by some very specific kernel-level cheats (apparently even cheats have DRM now - and these are not web sites, but DRM servers they're looking for, you won't trigger it by searching for or even buying cheats unless you use them). They do this comparison client-side, transmitting only if there is a match, and only transmitting the hashed value (which is used so the VAC servers can confirm it was a cheat when issuing the ban - otherwise one would be able to forge a "cheat" and get someone else banned). They also only do this scan at all if VAC has detected the cheat in the first place, which they claim has affected less than 0.1% of their users.

    Valve is explicitly denying that they are gathering your browser history.

    So my overall analysis:
    1) If what they say is true, then they're doing everything they can to *not* gather your browsing history, and are only gathering the hashed value to protect users.
    2) This should be possible to verify - see if the code doing the checks is triggered at all during normal use, and see what a packet sniffer picks up.
    3) Even though I like Valve a lot, after recent events (Snowden, some personal betrayals, etc.) I feel I can't trust anybody. I'll let others do the verification (I'm not technically skilled enough to trust my own work on it), but if it turns out that this is all they are doing, it's a good thing that is very, very close to being a bad thing. If, however, they are not just spying on us but then lying about it, I will be downloading a Steam crack immediately (I spent over $1000 on Steam games, they're mine no matter what the law says) and taking everything into offline mode.

  97. Gabe response by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/1y70ej/valve_vac_and_trust/

  98. Windows' dnscache service = FLAWED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I turn it off: It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size datastructure that's inflexible (+ POORLY default 'aged' as to items in it being replaced, & SLOW on that too, causing 'thrash')

    E.G. -> That dnscache clientside service causes HUGE "lags" IF on!

    You CAN 'tune' the TTL in it for it but it's pointless to RUN then imo (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since the hosts file gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem, like any file is).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in memory by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE & FAR FASTER subsystem vs. usermode + loaded with my fav sites @ the top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms notged below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for reasons of security vs. known servers of malware/botnets/maliciously coded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al): My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> IF You're correct (I didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  99. Windows dnscache service = FLAWED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I turn it off: It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size datastructure that's inflexible (+ POORLY default 'aged' as to items in it being replaced, & SLOW on that too, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL in it for it - but then, it's pointless to RUN then imo (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since the hosts file gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem, like any file is).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in memory by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE & FAR FASTER subsystem vs. usermode + loaded with my fav sites @ the top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms notged below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for reasons of security vs. known servers of malware/botnets/maliciously coded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al): My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=>Still, from what I've read here (I didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it is told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

    1. Re:Windows dnscache service = FLAWED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Advertisement? This has been posted multiple times verbatim!

    2. Re:Windows dnscache service = FLAWED by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nope: Just valid information, that actually works (& it IS more efficient by turning off a service that has FLAWS with the solution offered... that's all - doing "the right thing" for FREE, since the code IS free, & has been verified by the security community on MULTIPLE LEVELS by said individuals, tools & organizations, as safe (sourcecode + analysis via JOTTI online test & others)).

      Should you require PROOF of that? Simply ask. I will supply you with it.

      Thanks!

      Sincerely,

      APK

      P.S.=> WoW... I 'stumbled upon' your post via having it in some tabs I keep open, bit late on YOUR part, but there you are... I suppose, sorry for MY being late spotting it! apk

  100. Best work-around (w/ GREAT benefits) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turn off Windows FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size datastructure that's inflexible (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parametert for it - but then, it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem, like any file is).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem vs. usermode + loaded with my fav sites @ the top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for reasons of security vs. known servers of malware/botnets/maliciously coded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  101. Even BETTER workaround (w/ benefits) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turn off Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parametert for it - but then, it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem, like any file is).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem vs. usermode + loaded with my fav sites @ the top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for reasons of security vs. known servers of malware/botnets/maliciously coded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  102. Eliminate using the faulty dnscache (Windows) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turn off Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parametert for it - but then, it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem, like any file is).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem vs. usermode + loaded with my fav sites @ the top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for reasons of security vs. known servers of malware/botnets/maliciously coded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  103. Then ELIMINATE the possibility, period... apk by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turn off Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parametert for it - but then, it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem, like any file is).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem vs. usermode + loaded with my fav sites @ the top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for reasons of security vs. known servers of malware/botnets/maliciously coded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  104. DNS server INITIALLY (then local dnscache) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Correction (see subject) & turn off Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parametert for it - but then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ the top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my browser historie. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/maliciously coded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  105. "Correctamundo" & why I turn it off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Has HUGE benefits WHY I do - read on: Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  106. EASIER way to "thwart it" (w/ benefits) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  107. Even BETTER (turn off dnscache service) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why? Great benefits & Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  108. Mine's ALWAYS clean (how, why, & benefits) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I turn dnscache off: Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  109. Easily eliminate the problem (benefits too) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turn OFF Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  110. "Beat 'em @ their OWN game" pun intended by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Benefits too: Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  111. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Buzer · · Score: 1

    Youtube?

  112. THOSE, get cached (turn it off & why) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Benefits too: Turn off Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apk

  113. DNSCache & beat it (benefits too) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service lags w/ large hosts files since it's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of index speed (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built up since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read in fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my histories of many kinds in browsers, etc. & firewall logs study over time here to determine that)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> From what I've read here (didn't 'RTFA'): I'm able to tell their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE..."/quote>... apkb

  114. THIS technique does (huge benefits) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turn OFF Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files & built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW then, causing 'thrash')

    Yes, You CAN 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of indexing (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) by having the hosts file cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loads w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they are good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking out adbanners (up to 40% of site pages on avg.).

    (My hosts file's HUGE built since 1997 initially for speed gains by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later, 2002 onwards vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms noted below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ & growing line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ top so they read in fast & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my browser histories etc. & firewall logs study over time here)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malicoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking (etc. - et al) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in the rest of my hosts file.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    APK

    P.S.=> I beat their app (since it's told ZERO) "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE" + get ALL of the benefits of added speed, security, reliability, & anonymity hosts yield: BONUS!/quote>... apk

  115. Yes, lets (& beat beta redirect this way too) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Turn off Windows' FLAWED clientside local usermode dnscache service - It lags w/ large hosts files: It's built on a fixed-size inflexible datastructure (+ POORLY default 'aged' w/ items in it being replaced & SLOW with 'thrash')

    You CAN try 'tune' the TTL parameters for it - then it's pointless to RUN it (wasting CPU cycles, RAM, & other forms of I/O since hosts gets cached by the OS kernelmode diskcaching subsystem like any file).

    I offset loss of indexing (since USERMODE slower local dns clientside cache = OFF here) w/ hosts cached in RAM by the OS diskcaching KERNELMODE subsystem!

    A far FASTER subsystem (vs. usermode) + loaded w/ my fav sites @ top of hosts so they're good to ~ 3 million lines of indexed dns entries (do the math) + blocking adbanners (up to 40% of site pagesize on avg.).

    (My hosts = HUGE built since 1997 initially for speed gain by adblocks + fav site inserts for faster local in RAM resolutions of ip addresses for domains, & later 2002 onwards, vs. 'malcode' of ALL forms below, to currently being @ a 2,223,640++ line item recordsize - 24 fav. sites of mine @ the top so they read fast, & I spend a GOOD 99% of my online time @ those from my browser histories + firewall logs study here)

    It's large for security reasons vs. known servers of malware/botnets/malcoded sites + bogus DNS servers, adblocking, tracker, & spammer/phisher blocking (etc) + My favs list isn't big, nor do I attempt to "resolve all the hosts-domains on the internet" in hosts.

    * I create hosts from 12 reputable & reliable sources via this program I created in 2003 + released in late 2012-> http://start64.com/index.php?o...

    I get bennies in added speed, security, reliabiilty (vs redirects) + anonymity & show their a "Move along - NOTHING to see HERE"

    APK

    P.S.=> Beat 'beta' redirect (Add 2 lines to hosts as favs @ top w/ faster resolution locally in RAM & 1st DNS resolver QUERIED = hosts))

    216.34.181.45 slashdot.org
    216.34.181.45 beta.slashdot.org

    ... apk

  116. Let me tell you by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yes, steam monitors me. I'm cool with it because I enjoy online games. Because of the way games are built there has to be anti-cheat systems. The stronger the better. If they ask every gamer to bend over I'll be the first in line to get to games with no cheaters. I want the game to be as fair as possible, but because of the way games are made some (mostly kids i hope) feel the need to cheat to feel better about themselves.
    I completely understand writing and creating cheats as a technical challenge, but using them in game without telling the other players is just low. Wouldn't really care about the games that have "experience" systems as part of the game mechanics, as they aren't skill based competitive anyways, so who cares if you skip the 7 years of menial work, but the games that are based on player skills, the competitive games, cheating in those just breaks the game for everyone, including the cheater.

  117. Beware of iframes by kyoko21 · · Score: 1

    I guess the next thing to do is to start making websites with hidden iframes that loads pages of "questionable" content so that it will posion your DNS history. You may not have actually seen the "questionable content" in question, but your browser certainly loaded the content which in technical terms would fall in-line with the profile of this "anti-cheating" system.

    It's as if you are assumed guilty of any sex crime simply by walking through the red-light district.

  118. Reply to Comment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    But I already my own unified launcher, though. It's called desktop environment. Other than than, yes, Steam has some pluses to it.

  119. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Gaygirlie · · Score: 1

    DNS-cache doesn't cache the times you access the domain, either, or how often. They only cache the fact that such a domain has been queried. It doesn't even say that it has been you who queried the domain -- it could be your IM-application when someone throws you a link to that domain, it could be your browser that just queries the domains for all the links on a site or something completely different.

  120. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

    You're right, it doesn't record the date. But if you monitor it all the time, you'll see the entries come in. And they will have to come in eventually as it is a cache - entries don't stay cached in perpetuity if not regularly visited. OTOH, if the entry does remain in the cache past the usual TTL (which is known), then that website was visited at least once in that period.

    Re: IM and browser querying domains... you'll have to explain that to other people when someone tries to blackmail you like that.

  121. Re:Summary that misrepresents the Article... *shoc by Gaygirlie · · Score: 1

    OTOH, if the entry does remain in the cache past the usual TTL (which is known), then that domain was queried at least once in that period.

    Fixed that for you.

    Re: IM and browser querying domains... you'll have to explain that to other people when someone tries to blackmail you like that.

    Eh. I don't. Everyone knows I'm a creep.

  122. Steve Jackson games. On books. copyrighted. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Oh, but if everyone does it, then it must be legal, right?

    Everyone speeds. So close the rules against it.

    Everyone pirates. So close the rules against it.

    They and you can have you EULAs "because everyone does it" if I can pirate it instead "because everyone does it".

    Deal?

    1. Re:Steve Jackson games. On books. copyrighted. by Anubis+IV · · Score: 1

      Explaining the reality of a situation does not imply that one condones it. Don't read between the lines and think that I like the way things are. And unlike you, if I'm stuck making a choice between two crappy options, I'm not going to delude myself into thinking that one is a "good" one just because it's slightly better than the alternative. You seem to be content to do so, however.

      EULAs are legal and have been upheld in court repeatedly. I don't like them, but that's how it is. Denying them doesn't make them go away. You're living in a fantasy if you're pretending that the alternative (physical media) which hides them a bit more is a better option. At least my eyes are open and I know what my choices are. You? You're still convinced there's a difference.

  123. Why should you have to? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why should it look, even if it's not sending the results off the computer? Why should the agreement stipulate that I must agree to this happening?

    This is why Steam IS NOT "Good DRM". You have to agree to a license to use the game every time you try to install or run it online and that "agreement" isn't going to be the one you agreed to it when you made the purchase.

    And the DRM ensures you MUST agree. Can't play or install from backup without agreeing to the CURRENT "agreement" because the DRM refuses to let it run.

  124. steam users nightmare by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What sites do you have to visit to be blocked by steam?

    I would like to know so I can load non existant images from them in my forum posts.

  125. And re hacks for non steam games by doccus · · Score: 1

    And if you're getting hacks only for non steam games, and they cut you off, isn't that THEM violating the contract? And where in the steam contract anyways does it say they are entitled to look at your private browsing history? And re offline mode, Valve says there's no time limit and the users say there is.. Who's right?

  126. Yomama by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You made me lol alot. Just for the record, i'm not american, i'm not even close to USA.

    Europe has tons of companies selling weapon grade malwares to dictatorships, france has stupid and invasive laws like HADOPI. And what do europeans do about it? Squat, nada. They whine about it. Because thats all you europeans do, whine. But hey, next time you are in trouble with a major cataclysm, next time some other countries want to kick your butts don't forget to call the americans. 'Murica sucks until you need them.

    You are obviously an ignorant European who enjoys a little too much 9gag/USA bashing while criticizing them for the straw in their eye while deliberately ignoring the construction beam in YOUR eye.

  127. So Fucking What by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I'm not much of a gamer, I only play TF2 on steam. OTOH I am a real obstinate opponent of onerous TOS.
    Somehow, I have not felt oppressed by Gabe, and am not concerned by this NSA-style incursion, as I am not interested in any cheating applications.
    sorry about that.

  128. Is privacy really a non-issue? by matcheydj · · Score: 1

    So basically, shut down Steam completely then run a simple console (e.g., Windows) "1. ipconfig /release all, 2. ipconfig /flushdns, 3. ipconfig /renew"; Not to condone cheating, but this is something that can clog your system if it's having to be constantly checked.

    If Steam can access the internet, and be running (to put it plainly) with permissions to install, then it runs as Admin on your stuff -- good luck setting up rules to not have to manually shut down if cheating is something you want to do.

    Although, have you seen so-called "cheat" sites? They basically list achievements/trophies for games, because these cheats aren't coded in like they used to be in old consoles. It used to be something fun, I don't know what's happened to the judgement of it.

    At the risk of saying too much, is privacy even an issue, really? I was filling out a form today for some website, and it struck me that so many services online have access to our personal information, and copy the same sort of security questions. When you're filling out a form for a new site, would you choose the same security questions and answers if they appear? And, since there are so few "common" security questions, would that be a clue to which question/answer combo you would pick on, for example, a banking site -- given its relative importance to a marginal or third party site (like one for shopping that has your CC info but doesn't hold your actual money). It seems like the more you want to do online, everybody is going to end up with your information. Not really a big deal when you give it some thought. Less stress on you since they won't have to fight eachother over your info, they'll all have a piece, and likely leave you alone. It's like devaluation of the currency of privacy, I guess?

    But I digress. Doesn't seem like Valve's changes are that big of a deal - if the old days of button combos are dead, and walkthroughs are plentiful -- then the only cheats that are really out there are console or specific technology hacks that circumvent fair gameplay in a more massively multiplayer world of gaming. To go even further on the privacy bit, why not demand they share it with other parties and see what happens. It would relax controls on gaming companies and you may even get better offers, freeing up the market.

    Anyway...

  129. learn to reddit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Gabe posted a full run down of how the VAC works in /r/gaming. Go have a look.