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Too Fat For Facebook: Photo Banned For Depicting Body In 'Undesirable Manner' (theguardian.com)
An anonymous reader shares a report on The Guardian: Facebook has apologized for banning a photo of a plus-sized model and telling the feminist group that posted the image that it depicts "body parts in an undesirable manner". Cherchez la Femme, an Australian group that hosts popular culture talkshows with "an unapologetically feminist angle", said Facebook rejected an advert featuring Tess Holliday, a plus-sized model wearing a bikini, telling the group it violated the company's "ad guidelines". After the group appealed against the rejection, Facebook's ad team initially defended the decision, writing that the photo failed to comply with the social networking site's "health and fitness policy". "Ads may not depict a state of health or body weight as being perfect or extremely undesirable," Facebook wrote. "Ads like these are not allowed since they make viewers feel bad about themselves. Instead, we recommend using an image of a relevant activity, such as running or riding a bike." In a statement on Monday, Facebook apologized for its original stance and said it had determined that the photo does comply with its guidelines.Facebook said that its team scans millions of ad images every week, and sometimes understandably misses out on a few.
...their busy schedule of banning conservatives for daring to say that they ban conservatives to determine what an appropriate bikini body is...
Lawrence Person (lawrencepersonh@gmailh.com (remove all "h"s to mail)
http://www.lawrenceperson.com/
The more cush'n, the better the push'n.
We found the fatty boys. Let's all point and laugh.
> For some reason there's a huge number of people who absolutely hate on people who are fat.
No, there's a huge number of people who hate on people who are fat that say it's perfectly healthy to be fat.
Your hair look like poop, Bob! - Wanker.
This doesn't matter to me as a nerd.
There was also policy not to show too much skimpy attire in advertisements, meant to block your typical Budweiser beach bikini ads (drink our beer and these girls might talk to you!). Facebook should have just stuck with that reasoning from the start, or maybe say "our robot filters were confused by the skin to bathing suit ratio" here.
They didn't make a mistake; Tess Holliday is obese and tells everyone that its okay. It's not okay, its unhealthy (I know, I'm the same way and know I need to get in shape; I'm not trying to by a hypocrite) it is hard to get back in shape and I don't blame her for being fat but I do blame her and her kind for perpetuating the "healthy at any weight" bullshit on the internet. She's not fat, she's obese; she's unhealthy and allowing her to tell people that it's okay is not okay. I know it's not okay for me to be obese, either, but I'm not telling people that it is.
Facebook, for once, did the right thing the first time; she shouldn't be allowed in an ad just like anorexic models shouldn't be either. Reversing their decision was the mistake.
-SaNo
99% of us don't care
Everyone has the ability to eat less. It literally requires no effort. People who are fat, just like everyone in this world, do not have the right to have people like them. That's not a thing. It's not "life, liberty and happiness." You have to achieve that last one on your own.
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
They also recently rejected a sponsored post by a powerlifter because it contained a tape measure as it might "invoke a negative reaction from viewers". http://imgur.com/APsVNp7
It's an advert for body positivism, the idea that health is more important than a certain body shape or weight. I'm not sure I with it completely, but the image is suitable.
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
I don't care whether it is in any compliance of any guidelines - an overweight woman wearing a bikini is repulsive, no matter what "plus size" spin the "unapologetically feminist" organization puts on it.
Anybody can dispute otherwise, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder. So sue me.
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
It is more a political or social message. Are those allowed?
Not all ads are about cars and hamburgers.
(-1: Post disagrees with my already-settled worldview) is not a valid mod option.
Yes, but the dating site ads that people are inundated with on the site with breasts photoshopped up to about 200% actual size with gravity defying physics are perfectly OK
They didn't make a mistake; Tess Holliday is obese and tells everyone that its okay. It's not okay, its unhealthy (I know, I'm the same way and know I need to get in shape; I'm not trying to by a hypocrite) it is hard to get back in shape and I don't blame her for being fat but I do blame her and her kind for perpetuating the "healthy at any weight" bullshit on the internet. She's not fat, she's obese; she's unhealthy and allowing her to tell people that it's okay is not okay. I know it's not okay for me to be obese, either, but I'm not telling people that it is.
My kingdom for mod points. I'm the same btw. BMI > 38, BP of 170/110 and cholesterol levels through the roof. It's unhealthy, period.
I'm an ugly, fat, middle-aged man, and I know it. And for that reason I don't shower in the gym. Not because I feel ashamed, but because I don't want to make anyone suffer by looking at my plump ugly fat ass.
Or, spend a year WWOOFING. (www.wwoof.net). You work on a farm, in exchange for food from the farm, and a place to stay. A lot cheaper than a gym membership, and a lot more effective. And a lot more fun.
The excuses that "I can't lose weight because of my genes" or "I can't lose weight because I can't afford a gym membership", are complete bullshit. If you go work on a farm for a whole year, and only eat food from that farm, i.e. no processed junk food, you WILL lose weight, and become strong and muscular, guaranteed.
It's a bit like a reverse Alien vs. Predator.
Whoever loses
We win
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
No, there's a huge number of people who hate on people who are fat that say it's perfectly healthy to be fat.
Self-righteous fitness nuts who think they can lecture people on how to eat and diet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
Mimetics Inc. Twitter
Facebook is like a convenience store. You go there for specific and fairly basic reasons: share photos with families and friends, let them know what's going on in your life, message each other and arrange get togethers...probably 90% of what a person does on Facebook.
But, like a convenience store, the places is polluted with hundreds of items you have no interest in and would never buy or use. And if you did actually want any of it, you sure as hell wouldn't get it from a convenience store....or Facebook.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
Exactly. Plus I find it really funny her photo is totally airbrushed.
Many of the +sized model are really ++++++++++++++++sized. :D
They managed to fuck up the pirelli calendar with that.
I'll bet that nobody would kick up much of a fuss if they decided to ban a photo of an anorexic model. Tess Holiday, being morbidly obese, obviously suffers from disordered eating due to a food addiction, yet is paraded around as some kind of paragon of moral virtue, while pictures of women with anorexia would be censored for being harmful to little girls. But seriously, do you think that presenting a morbidly obese woman as a socially acceptable norm sends girls a message about body image that is any less harmful?
-- Knowledge shared is power lost. -- Aleister Crowley
Her response to this? Blame everyone but herself in the press like here in People magazine, the comments sections are particularly informative about the fact that not everything has been addressed. Any group associated with this person is enabling a scam artist.
Horror & SciFi Erotic Nudes
No, there's a huge number of people who hate on people who are fat that say it's perfectly healthy to be fat.
Self-righteous fitness nuts who think they can lecture people on how to eat and diet.
Self-loathing fat person who lacks self control...
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
And nowhere near as repulsive as the coward hiding behind the AC.
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
It's an advert for body positivism, the idea that health is more important than a certain body shape or weight
Which is complete bullshit. Obesity is not healthy. They are complete opposites.
Basically they have just admitted their policy is meaningless. They will bend and twist the language as needed when political pressure is applied.
They are essentially giving up the curating and running of their own site, its mob rules now.
Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
I just want to be clear about what is being discussed here:
1) The feminist group wants to show photos of half-naked obese women because it helps to "destroy" the concept of the perfect body?
(Already, I'm completely lost. How does this work exactly? Men see a fat woman in a bikini, and start to get turned on -- thereby changing the standards of beauty? Would that work with other images too?)
2) The feminist group wants men to stop "objectifying women" physically, so they are using a photograph of a fat woman in a bikini to help us stop thinking about women ... in terms of their physical bodies.
(Swoooooooosh!...that was some kind of feminist logic doing a low-altitude fly-by somewhere near my head)
Self-loathing fat person who lacks self control.
I'm a fat person who accepted being big and has control to limit my diet to 150 grams of carbs/1,500 calories per day. Will you change your prejudice or call me a liar?
You know, when you say "people who hate on people that are fat" you might be onto something there.
Some psychologists say that there's some atavistic sense kicking in when we see people who are too thin or too fat. regarding "too fat", back when we were yet to invent writing, being fat was a sign of using up someone else's food resources (tribe's, community's, etc). Being fat meant there's too much food available to you while too little was available to all others.
Likewise, "too thin" usually meant "sick" and people tend to isolate those who are unnaturally thin. As a 6.1 tall / 140 pounds heavy person, I encountered this behavior. Even doctors were trying to find what's "wrong" with me (turned out it's genetic, my father was thinner than me, my grandfather was like a walking stick).
So yes, there are limits beyond which people are perceived as abnormal. I'm guessing the uncanny valley plays a role in this too.
...gis sdrawkcab (usually not responding to ACs; don't bother posting as AC)
... I no longer give a shit about what other people think.
Chaser:
... few people are willing to risk their life to fat shame me in person.
And biologists, medical researchers, and practitioners.
I was born fat. Doctor told my mother that she would have twin girls (five pounds each), and got a ten-pound bowling ball of a boy. School officials ordered repeated rounds of blood tests in the 4th, 5th and 6th grades to figure out why I was so big. A principle tried to fat shame my parents by calling them in for a conference but was shocked to discover that they were skinnier than him.
Everyone has the ability to eat less. It literally requires no effort.
And it could fuck up your life even worse.
There are people who, if they eat less, will develop a whole series of diseases which, when turning chronic, would send them to the grave ASAP.
On the other hand, those people while overweight, would not be sick and their state of being would not be unhealthy. Still, they shouldn't say "it's generally okay to be like me".
...gis sdrawkcab (usually not responding to ACs; don't bother posting as AC)
Why is this 'news for nerds' ? It's SJW nonsense. Keep it on Tumblr please.
Are you completely sedentary? Because that's the only way a 1500 calorie diet could sustain your weight.
Try moving your fat ass.
Sorry, but unless you recently started your strict calorie limit of 1500 per day, or you are exceptionally short, or you have some bizarre medical condition, there is no way your are being honest. If you are overweight, it means you are eating more energy than you body needs, and so it stores the extra energy as fat. If, every day, you eat only what is required for your body to maintain a healthy weight, then your body will move towards that weight, whether you are underweight or overweight to begin with. I'm not trying to "body shame" you, or any of that crap. If you are fat and happy, then it's no skin off my back. But don't sit here and tell me you eat 1500 calories per day and you're still overweight. Dishonestly like that may convince someone who is unhappy being fat that "it's just the way their body is and they can't change it".
Spoken like a true fatty. I don't exercise, but I limit the amount I eat to less than elephantine portions every meal.
You're making some YUGE assumptions there. My diet is 150 grams of carbs and 1,500 calories per day. I also walk 20 minutes per day and work out at the gym every weekend. Despite being 350 pounds, I'm doing a lot more than you are.
I haven't known a single fatty fat that didn't eat a shit ton of fatty/sugary foods.
I had skinny people accused me of trying to shame them because I eat less than they do at a restaurant. I only eat half a plate for that meal and then take the other half for a different meal.
Would you want to see advertisements that included bikini girls with hairy moles, cleft palates, and lobster claw hands? How about one that's so fat she's starting to become one with the fabric of the sofa she's lived on for the past 3 years. Why not? You can be a quarter-tonner and still be healthy, all women are beautiful, right? At what point does Facebook get to state that they are not obligated to accept every ad, and some of these images are driving off more people than they're bringing in? They are a business, after all. This isn't fat shaming, or whatever the fuck guilt-laden term you want to call it, these are images people find to be unappealing and generally don't want to see. I'd rather watch that Sarah McLachlan commercial with the dogs than look at this woman in a bikini. I'm fine with her believing that she looks good, but a lot of us don't agree and don't want to see it. Nobody would want to see my hairy ass walking around in a bikini either, and I totally respect their wishes.
So it's ok for anyone to ban/censor everything that is not ok? Really?
If she can't toss me over her shoulder and carry me away she's not big enough.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
or you have an actual medical condition
You can't rule this out. My weight was fine until I went on a certain medication (Actos) that is known to cause weight gain in many people. I steadily gained a pound a month and couldn't stop it even with 60 minutes of good exercise 6 days a week and a diet that should have worked. After two years on Actos I looked like a small whale. I would NOT put my picture on Facebook, that's for sure.
But I quit the Actos and weight is starting to drop.
Overweight is not pretty and it's not healthy. Now, it would be hypocritical of me to criticize others for being overweight or for their appearance, and I don't and won't. But if this plus model is telling people that it's okay to be morbidly obese, that does no one a service.
I'll call you a liar. Unless you're under 5' tall, 1500 calories a day will cause you to lose weight. Source: Me. Also a fatass who finds when I cut my intake to 1500 calories and sticks with it - regardless of carbs - I lose weight. It's like magic, you give your body less fuel and it burns its reserves to make up the difference needed to operate. Or are you saying you're somehow still fat despite cutting intake to a confirmed 1500 calories that you have maintained for a considerable time? If so, please contact the James Randi foundation as I am sure they have some sort of 1 million dollar prize for demonstrating your immunity to the laws of physics in a controlled environment.
But don't sit here and tell me you eat 1500 calories per day and you're still overweight.
When I did weight training and ate a 3,000-calorie per day diet, my weight went up to 400 pounds. I loved the muscle mass but finding 4XL shirts was a bitch. Now I'm going in the opposite direction (borderline 2XL/XL), I'm going in the opposite direction.
Facebook, for once, did the right thing the first time; she shouldn't be allowed in an ad just like anorexic models shouldn't be either. Reversing their decision was the mistake.
Hold on there, Smokey. Facebook really shouldn't be in the business of curating advertisements. Do they want that kind of liability? Once they say they are, they become liable.
Fat people buy clothing and fat people should be buying clothing that's modeled by fat people. That's just obvious - you can't get an idea about what something, like a swimsuit, is going to look like on you if you weigh twice as much as the model.
It may be unhealthy, but it's reality. I can't find the victim here.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
>I don't exercise, but I limit the amount I eat to less than elephantine portions every meal.
Try limiting it to the point that you feel sick and have the urge to throw up, but can't because you've eaten nothing. And then repeat that or 1 or 2 years. Then get back to us that you call fatty fat about your success.
You literally don't know what it's like to be overweight, because you've never been there. Or, if you have, it was for a few months. Find someone who has been overweight for 10+ years and ask them just how horrible the experience of losing weight was. Preferably, find someone who has also gone through quitting smoking cold turkey so you can get a comparison between the two. Hint: Quitting smoking cold turkey is much easier and far more pleasant.
That isn't to say that being overweight is healthy. It isn't. But your advice is not only unwanted, but pointlessly hurtful. It's on the same level as telling a heroin addict to just stop using, immediately, forever, with no other support whatsoever. And then insulting them for not doing it or not being successful.
If you don't understand this, that's fine, you've never been overweight and I hope to hell you never are. And being an ignorant asshole is totally your prerogative. But now you've been told what *you* are, perhaps you'd like to change it? I bet quitting being an asshole cold turkey is still easier.
I replied to you upthread but have to post again seeing this. Again, please report to the James Randi foundation for testing and to claim your prize for breaking the laws of thermodynamics. Unless you're awake for 15-20 minutes a day and spend the rest of your time comatose, your basic metabolic burn rate will exceed 2500 calories per day sitting in a recliner and not moving. Either you're lying or you can't measure calories.
For some reason there's a huge number of people who absolutely hate on people who are fat.
I can't say I really ever cared in the past. But my wife has MS and in the last few years has not been able to get around on her own. So we finally got a handicapped tag so I can park closer to the stores for her. But half the time there are no handicapped spots because apparently being fat now qualifies. And then if the stores have motorized chairs, most of the time they are all taken by fat people. So yeah, it's pretty damn annoying. Especially since parking closer to the store and not walking isn't helping their situation.
Not everyone has the ability to simply "work out and eat less" to lose weight. Sometimes there's medical or genetic reasons why it's difficult to go down in weight.
True, but that is not the case in most situations. It's pretty damn obvious that it's not genetic when I see people riding around in the motorized chairs stuffing their face with cookies and chips and a soda the size of a beer keg.
People should be able to feel good about themselves, not live in mental torture and anguish from the crazy people who spew hatred about some specific physical aspect of their body.
People who are actually handicapped should be able to use services that are in place for them. But they can't because of people who CHOOSE to weight what they do.
"Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."
Note the bolded part. It's important. Note that you can "pursue happiness" while overweight. or underweight. or normal weight. Whether you catch it is another question entirely....
"I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
It's an advert for body positivism, the idea that health is more important than a certain body shape or weight.
It's not a boolean, it's a sliding scale. Health is more important when you're 5kg overweight. Weight is more important when you are (like the woman in the photo) close on to 70kg overweight.
We don't allow advertisments to tell people that smoking is healthy. Why should we allow advertisments that tell people morbid obesity is healthy?
I'm a minority race. Save your vitriol for white people.
The New York Times had an article on the study of the 2009 Biggest Loser contestants who regain their original weight. Their metabolism slowed down from dieting (expected) but never recovered seven years later(unexpected). If they ate a normal diet for their height and weight, they still ate an extra 400 to 800 calories because their metabolism slowed down. It's almost as if their body wanted to regain the weight back.
http://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/05/02/health/biggest-loser-weight-loss.html
That's where I tend to agree with you. At some point extreme weight does start to become a health issue. But below that threshold, I tend to agree that it's better to be healthy than look like a photoshopped model (who is probably quite unhealthy).
const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
An advertisement is supposed to be appealing to people.
No. An advertisement is supposed to make an impression on the observer. The deeper the impression, the more successful the advertisement. If the advertisement gets people to talk about it, as in your case, it's very successful.
In other words, you're either lying (to us or yourself about how much you actually eat) or you have an actual medical condition to maintain a weight of 350 pounds on an actual dietary intake of 1500 calories per day.
Unless I'm lifting weights to gain more muscle mass (400 pounds), I've always been 350 pounds as an adult. I've been on the 1,500 calorie diet for two months now. I've been getting comments from coworkers about how muscular (probably less rounded) I've become.
It's a free ride when you've already paid
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
It's an addiction to sugar just like smoking is addiction to nicotine and alcoholism is addiction to alcohol and just like them it can be beaten. Pretending it's ok to be addicted to something is the same denial you get from smokers and drinkers. The difference is that there's no healthy at every black lung or cirrhosis acceptance movement.
A 350lb body does not promote any kind of health. It's just as bad as the 100lb starving ones.
Thanks for saving me the time of posting this.
And I think it's because when you gain weight, you produce new fat cells. But when you lose weight, those fat cells empty out - but they are still there trying to store fat. Getting the proper metabolism back for your size depends a lot on how long you've been overweight.
I have the exact same problem. I am, and have always been pretty fat, and I know it is unhealthy and unattractive. I try ridiculously hard to keep it under control. I eat about 1500 calories and no candy. I'm 6 foot tall. I walk at least 40 minutes every day. I constantly feel like I am absolutely STARVING. I often feel so hungry that I want to throw up, this happens at least once a day.
Then I get assholes, who have always been as skinny as a beanpole and can eat thanksgiving dinner every meal with out gaining any weight, who tell me I am lying about how much I eat, I cant possibly walk or move at all, being skinny is SOOOO easy, etc. etc.
The science is clearly not out yet on all factors of weight gain, and a simple "calories in = weight gained" model is bullshit flawed quack science... I'm not going to complain about fat shaming being a bad thing, I think everyone should be encouraged to loose the extra few kg they are carrying around, but this bullshit idea that naturally skinny people have that being skinny is easy REALLY pisses me off.
You punch anyone in the mouth that dares give you honest feedback about your life decisions?
Nope. Only pricks who get into my face and expect me to cower before them.
You must have some really great yes-men friends that never give you an constructive criticism.
I had a whole church full of them. That's Jesus for you.
I'll give you some opinion right now - check that ridiculous aggression - it's only going to hold you back.
That aggression gets the bullies to leave me alone and find a weaker person to pick on.
Based on your height, weight and age that you stated elsewhere, you resting mass intake is 2800 calories per day. Even if your body freaked out and dropped that by 800 calories you're still looking at 2000 calories per day for maintenance. Which is last time I checked, still greater than 1500.
Then there's the question of adding exercise to the equation. Moving around takes energy, there's no way around that.
Facebook really shouldn't be in the business of curating advertisements.
Yes, they should. No advertising network should openly accept scams, for example.
Then there's the question of adding exercise to the equation. Moving around takes energy, there's no way around that.
I'm trying to master the rowing machine at the gym. It's... painful... in a good way.
Not to mince words, yes, the image is rather undesirable.
If you've stopped allowing yourself to be affected by what other people think of you, good for you! That's an excellent step towards living a much happier life. Internalizing others' judgement and setting aside your own value judgements in favor of theirs leaves you vulnerable to the whim of others' emotions. You're in a much better place.
If you're trying to make choices to improve your own health because that's what you want to do, also good for you! Your own desire for change is the only thing that can motivate that. Bending to others' judgements and trying to change yourself to fit their ideal never works, at least not for long. I wish you nothing but the best in your effort. I've made the effort myself over the course of the past few years shedding about half my body weight, and it's been life changing.
That said, as others have said,150g carb/day isn't even close to low-carb. More like 20g/day would be low-carb. You'll still lose weight at 1500kcal/day, regardless of the composition of those calories; but if you're making other health decisions based on the premise that you're eating low-carb (and thus achieving both the benefits & drawbacks of doing so), you should be careful. It's unlikely your body is operating on a fat-based, low-carb metabolism at 150g/day. Again, no doubt you will drop weight at 1500kcal/day, but you're not getting the benefits of low-carb, if in fact that's what you're seeking.
There's one thing you're NOT doing though, and this is another good for you: You're not telling people that being at your current weight is a healthy thing that they should accept as good. You're not saying that there are no health drawbacks to being overweight and therefore there's no health reason that other overweight people shouldn't attempt to lose weight. That's what Tess and the rest of the Health At Every Size followers are espousing. Specifically that Tess at BMI 46+ is just as healthy and will experience no negative health consequences as compared to someone at BMI 20.
That assertion is the one thing I have against Tess & other HAES adherents. I would never tell anyone they have to feel bad because they're overweight. It's your body, and you can do what you want with it. It's entirely possible to both not hate yourself for being fat but also take steps to work towards becoming less fat. Loving yourself isn't the same thing as giving up on changing yourself.
The HAES movement is reprehensible for its claim that there are no health or other benefits to not being overweight. They serve as a collective denial and self-apology movement where members can reassure each other that a host of problems they have in life don't actually have anything to do with their weight. (Can't fit in chairs, always tired / no energy to do basic life things, can't walk up a flight of stairs, medicines don't work properly, have to take a boat load of daily prescriptions just to stay healthy, can't just walk into any store and buy XXXXXL clothing, etc. etc....). They reinforce the idea that they're "perfectly happy" being overweight and that no aspects of their life could possibly be improved if they were less overweight. They also advance the claim in many cases that's it's actually "impossible" to lose weight. With things like "set point theory" and other pseudo-science that try to claim that your weight is controlled exclusively by your genetics and that your diet and exercise levels have nothing to do with it. They insist there's just no sense trying, and they re-badge "giving up without trying," as "just being happy the way you are."
To be clear, I understand that your genetics, your upbringing, life situation, etc. can have a huge amount to do with your appetite and your activity level. I don't doubt that some are genetically predisposed to eat more, or at least to not have satiation signals that work as well. I don't doubt that it's part genetics, part addiction, and part mis-learned coping mechanisms from using eating as an emotional b
Don't take any advice from anyone, you're the victim, and you're such a tough man.
I don't have a problem taking advice from people who are sincere about the advice they're giving. It's the pricks who get a power trip from talking down to someone that I have a problem with, especially when they think that my weight . Playing the victim game means letting the bullies get away with their abusive behavior. They're not going to change until someone confronts them.
The Biggest Loser metabolism finding DO NOT correspond to people who lose weight in a proper, controlled fashion.
I lost 70 pounds one summer as a teenager when I got a bicycle that I road everywhere. My weight was 325 from riding my bike 20 miles per day for three years because I had a restaurant job down the street (yes, it was 10 miles away). When I got into weight training as an adult, my weight went up to 400 pounds. After I stopped weigh training and did treadmill only, my weight settled to 350 pounds for the last decade. I only recently cut my calories to 1,500 to see if that makes a different.
Try 50 grams carbs day and eat what you want... seriously I am not being a jerk. It's not easy but it works.
love is just extroverted narcissism
If that's the case then I'd really suggest looking at how you're measuring that 1500 calories, because once I started doing it, the weight came off so I suspect that what you think you're eating is probably not actually 1500 calories. My big (ha!) problem is that I lack willpower and am lazy. Need to get back on it again.
I started to loose weight when I woke up every single morning for a few months with a significant back age (sometimes lasting all day) whilst having adjusted my bed for the heaviest weight possible. After 5kg lost, the back pain was gone, now at 15kg down, no longer fearing going to bed but sleeping like a baby and waking earlier. Obesity isn't healthy.
Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
I don't know about your life but mine has no aggression in it.
I live an aggressive-free live, but I don't shy away from confrontation. It's like when I ask a stupid question at a group meeting. Some people will take me aside to tell me that I've asked a stupid question. I ask them to tell me how many people in the audience wanted to ask that same stupid question but were afraid of looking stupid by someone else. They can't give me a number. The people who thank me for asking a stupid question outnumbers the people who criticizes me for asking a stupid question by 3 to 1.
But if this plus model is telling people that it's okay to be morbidly obese, that does no one a service.
If you're in the business of selling plus-size clothes to women, what kind of models would you suggest to where those clothes in an advertising spread?
It's not "life, liberty and happiness." You have to achieve that last one on your own.
I was saying the same thing.
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
As soon as your change your prejudice on fitness nuts ;)
Brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.
That said, as others have said,150g carb/day isn't even close to low-carb. More like 20g/day would be low-carb.
Low-carb diets are 150 grams or less per day.
http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/150-carbs-per-day-still-considered-low-carb-7754.html
You're not telling people that being at your current weight is a healthy thing that they should accept as good.
I wrote that I accepted the fact that I'm a big person, which means I'm not going to beat myself up emotionally it as I have no desire to relive my teenage years. Nowhere did I write that being fat was healthy. If that was the case, I wouldn't be on a diet and eat whatever I wanted.
Specifically that Tess at BMI 46+ is just as healthy and will experience no negative health consequences as compared to someone at BMI 20.
Arnold Schwarzenegger, Tom Cruise, Sylvester Stallone and Mel Gibson are morbidly obese based on his BMI score. If I shed my fat and tone my muscles, I'll still be morbidly obese. It's not a reliable indicator.
http://www.docshop.com/2008/04/08/arnold-schwarzenegger-is-obese-problems-with-body-mass-index-bmi-calculations
It can take awhile for a lower calorie diet to have an effect though. Your body will attempt to maintain an even weight. This will eventually change unless there is an external reason for that not happening. I've found that when I do lose weight, it is essential to track it over time, and it will take forever at times to show results. For the most part, on a serious diet, I can lose as little as one pound every two weeks, but in the end, as long as the overall trend is downward, the desired result is inevitable. The hard part is the plateaus and the occasional up ticks. You pretty much have to be a machine about it because while results can be drastic and immediate for some people, for others, it is glacial.
That said it is certainly possible to have an endocrine system that promotes the storage of fat to a certain percentage. That can be harder to overcome and you may need medical advice about weight loss in that situation.
The question is whether this can be a healthy weight for you to be at. This woman in the picture is 350 lbs, like you are, but I'd hazard to say that you probably have a much better frame for carrying that amount of weight than she does simply by dint of being male. Women can carry a lot of weight in certain parts, but if it is all over, it starts to become dangerous.
How about a punch in the mouth? I found that most bullies are unwilling to pay the price for their opinions and flee from imminent harm.
Watch out, we got a badass over here!
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the (supposed) good of its victims may be the most oppressive
There is no fucking way that you are even remotely telling the truth on anything here, you lying fat piece of shit.
Why would I lie?
You fat fucks are like children who tell outrageous lies to adults and think we're buying the shit you're selling.
I'm always called a liar. The funny thing is that no one has ever proven me to be a liar. Some people have trouble accepting a reality that varies from normal. Nothing in my life is normal.
You don't even know how fucking retarded you sound.
Because I was poster child for mongolism, I spent eight years in Special Ed. No one though it was odd that I graduated the eight grade with a college-level reading comprehension. I had skip high school to go to community college to get a real education. The difference between treated like an idiot in grade school and an adult in college was night and day.
I'm not addicted, I can stop anytime I want to.
As soon as your change your prejudice on fitness nuts ;)
As long they stay on their side of the gym and dance to the Jane Fonda fitness video. :)
That said, as others have said,150g carb/day isn't even close to low-carb. More like 20g/day would be low-carb.
Low-carb diets are 150 grams or less per day.
http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/150-carbs-per-day-still-considered-low-carb-7754.html
The source cited by your source is "the 2010 Dietary Guidelines for Americans." IE the same people who have espoused for years that fat was the devil and we should be getting over half our daily calories from sugar & starch. Defining "low carb" as "less than the way too much we've been told to eat the entire time we've become the fattest people in history," is maybe not the best definition. I think a far more reasonable definition of low-carb is the point at which you have metobolic changes versus "normal carb" eating. Anything less than that is just changing your diet without it having a specific effect. From my experience, the benefits of being in ketois taper off above 20g/day and are pretty much gone by 40-50g tops.
Specifically that Tess at BMI 46+ is just as healthy and will experience no negative health consequences as compared to someone at BMI 20.
Arnold Schwarzenegger, Tom Cruise, Sylvester Stallone and Mel Gibson are morbidly obese based on his BMI score. If I shed my fat and tone my muscles, I'll still be morbidly obese. It's not a reliable indicator.
http://www.docshop.com/2008/04/08/arnold-schwarzenegger-is-obese-problems-with-body-mass-index-bmi-calculations
Arnold, Sly, and Tom are are huge (or tiny...) outliers because of their height and/or muscularity. BMI doesn't work well on the edges of the human population, but it's a very reasonable indicator within average ranges of height & muscularity. It's a poor model when applied to professional athletes or the very tall or very short, but it's pretty good for everyone else. Not sure what's up with Mel, but that applies to both physical & mental condition for him...
If you're a few BMI points off your ideal range, it's certainly very possible you're fine. Arnold was supposedly BMI 33 when he was Mr. Universe, but that's still a far cry below Tess' 46. I'm not aware of any body builders or other athletes that are 40+ BMI. There may be some for extreme heavy weight lifters perhaps, but you're by definition at the outliers of normal human physique there.
>Pretending it's ok to be addicted to something is the same denial you get from smokers and drinkers.
I do not pretend that it's okay to be overweight and I do believe it is unhealthy.
However, telling someone overweight to just stop eating so much is literally worse than worthless advice. Not only does it rarely have any success, it generally leads to making the person fatter than their original weight because the diet fails.
My advice to those who want to tell a fat person they're fat:
a) Don't bother. You think we can't tell?
b) Don't bother telling us to eat less if that's where your advice ends. You seriously believe fat people are that stupid? That somehow we got overweight without the knowledge that more calories in than burned == increased weight? My 6 year old (who is actually rather skinny, since you might wonder) knows this. Every overweight person knows this. Repeating it with no help to back it up is just being an asshole. It's like telling the smokers outside your building "You'll die smoking those" every time you go by.
c) If you actually want to help, help in a worthwhile manner. That will take your time and effort, possibly a significant amount of it. If you can't offer those, simply ignore and move on.
Anyways, yes, it can be beaten. There's proof out there of it. But snarky comments sure as fuck won't get anyone there.
I didn't say that they should ban normal ads. Tess Holliday and her HAES (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_at_Every_Size) followers are telling people being obese is okay and that science is wrong; you can't lose weight and 400+ lbs might be your "healthy" weight. What they're saying is dangerous and borderline criminal. They shouldn't be allowed on the internet.
-SaNo
> For some reason there's a huge number of people who absolutely hate on people who are fat.
No, there's a huge number of people who hate on people who are fat that say it's perfectly healthy to be fat.
I've also seen people hating on fit people as if there is something wrong with it. Criticizing them because they are in shape. It's hard work but enjoyable work to be in shape. If people think it's hard work or too expensive to be in shape wait until they see how much the medical bills will cost them later in life. Humans adapted to walking about 35km a day to get food and we are still the fastest animal to *accelerate* to our top speed so there is little doubt that we all have to do some exercise.
Personally I've found that having martial arts in my life, like Muay Thai, Jui Jitsu and others has made being fit more fun because it was a consequence of trying to achieve a new grading, stripe or belt - I wasn't trying to get fit, I just did. The added benefit was not only did the fitness make me a better coder by clearing my mind and making for better sleep, learning things like meditation helped me tame some of the anti-social aspects of my character.
Nothing wrong with big people that are carrying fat, some of those big guys have got a lot of power. Despite the fantasy, many Spartan warriors carried extra fat because it added some protection against weapons penetrating vital organs. Also I've experienced getting a flu while I had very low body fat and it is a very unpleasant experience, very painful. The issue is when big people don't exercise *and* they're fat, it's a recipe for diabetes.
However in almost every instance of a fat guy coming to our gym (BJJ) and fighting is that if they stick with it they turn into big powerful guys and loose most, but never all of their fat.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
hahaha big, beautiful women get love too <3 True story: I used to work with the woman who fought her case to the Supreme Court of California and won, making it illegal in California to discriminate against someone based upon their weight when their obesity problem is due to an underlying medical problem for employment purposes (http://scholarship.law.berkeley.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1429&context=californialawreview). I think it's incredibly unfair to simply write off their weight problem as a lack of work ethic or hedonistic desire for food regardless of its health impact (which, actually, aren't that bad https://www.nih.gov/news-event... in the grand scheme of things -- smokers, alcoholics, drug abusers, etc I'm sure are far worse off). https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
Why would I lie?
I believe you. My brother is in the same situation and I am really fit. He used to exercise with me however I'm starting to come to the conclusion that the gut flora has a lot to do with the situation. Like him, you are probably really strong guy and exercise might be a little painful to get through. I eat full cream milk, cheese yoghurt, vegetables and fruit - I can't stand processes fast foods, but he eats them. You're probably one of those types of people that are hyper sensitive to fast foods - if you eat them at all dump them and let you instinct guide you to the fresh foods you like, learn some recipes you like and hack your gut flora by varying the yoghurt and cheeses.
Oh, beer, it's hurts to miss it, but it's a big one if you drink it for big guys like you. I don't think it's the carbs, I think it's the yeast.
Some people have trouble accepting a reality that varies from normal. Nothing in my life is normal.
Yeah, that's not cool. I can see why it would piss you off, especially when you are working so hard. My mate I train(ed) with weighs 140Kg, what that's roughly 260 odd pounds? He gets that too. When he strips down, he is still a big guy but the difference is I'm 85Kg at fight weigh and almost 90Kg off training. He is around 100Kg so he looses almost half my body mass. I can still choke him out, but once he paniced one day as I did and both our body weights landed on my shoulder and dislocated it. I think he apologized about 50 times but there certainly was never any animosity, after all we were friends and we both got something different out of it. I learned I can control a big guy like and overcome the intimidation and as he learned to control his power, he became lethal.
The difference between treated like an idiot in grade school and an adult in college was night and day.
Yeah, just ignore that stuff, humans are varied creatures and nature finds a balance. My concern for guys like you is you are probably susceptible to diabetes. If you don't mind me saying though, I can sense your frustration and I can't say I blame you. If weights and pissy aerobics aren't working for you go find a Brazillian Jui Jitsu school and start to train. They are humble guys and if you are too, they will welcome you as fighting you will be outside their comfort zone as well, you will make good friends that respect you. It's not easy, but I think you will like it - think 'body chess'!
I miss my big mate, I really wish he'd stuck with it for all the physio it cost me to train with him ;) - Good luck to you!
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
Could be mismeasuring the amount of calories he's consuming. But it does appear that dieting can permanently alter a metabolism in a negative way.
I totally agree. I'm a bit overweight too. My weight has gone up and down in my life. Nothing was as demotivating for me as when loved ones asked if i wasn't overdoing my obsession with it (at bmi 24!) or when a girlfriend said she likes a tummy (at bmi 27!). But hey if you say it's a feminist thing, they suddenly need to agree with whatever you say.
The problem wasn't the slow metabolism, that just means you have to eat less. The problem was, even after eating enough to give themselves energy, they still felt hungry.
In other words, they needed the hacker's diet, which takes into consideration the fact that your hunger doesn't match your eating needs.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
The way I look at it,
1) "I am not a bad person just because I am fat"
2) "I have good qualities even though I am fat"
3) "People shouldn't mock fat people"
Those are all good ideas, and we should especially spread the last one. However,
1) "I am perfectly healthy even though I am fat"
There are serious problems with that idea.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
She could borrow Desperate Dan's.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Calories in - calories spent = weight gained/lost
This is clearly true, and almost completely irrelevant. As should be clear from the post by friesofdoom, some people simply want to eat more. They need to eat more before they feel similarly full to another person who may have eaten less. This means that those people, in order to remain thin, must fight a constant never-ending battle against themselves, that no human being can ever be expected to win. Of course if you eat more, you get fat, and if you eat less, you get thin. But imagine you were in a situation where if you didn't eat more than your body technically required, you felt hungry. Now imagine being hungry every day, for the rest of your life. Imagine that hunger, present, all the time. Imagine that if you gave in to that hunger, you would gain weight. Now imagine trying to remain thin in that situation. Perhaps if you were in that situation, you would not be so glib about 'thermodynamics'. And, of course, I am not the only person who understands this
You win, I fell for your troll.
am very obese and I feel bad about it.
Great. Is that 'feeling bad' actually helping? Or are you just basically feeling bad? Honest question.
Of course you will. But then, when you move back to a country that surrounds you constantly will fatty and sugary foods, that weight will pile right back on. Which simply demonstrates that the true cause of obesity is not individual moral failings, but the food that we are surrounded by. It's so unbelievably clear, that I find it astonishing that anyone could believe otherwise. The evidence is literally all around us.
It literally requires no effort.
This is completely untrue. Given a strong desire to eat unhealthy food, do you really believe that constantly fighting against that desire requires no effort? Does it also require no effort to forego other pleasures in your life? There are books on this subject.
Forget beauty, whatever you or the next person thinks it is. Being that obese means that her children, if she has any, will be left without a mother rather early.
It's like smoking, or free-solo climbing. Sure, you can do it, it's a free country. But if you have people that love you and don't want you to die young, it's really not OK.
It's the internet. You are being the angry "tough guy".
I can be a "tough guy" off the Internet too. Except for the occasional fitness nut, most people aren't that stupid to provoke a person with enough muscle mass to put them in the hospital.
If you don;t want to see fat people on the internet, don't post your picture on it.
You posted a headshot from 2009 (thanks for reminding to change that pic). Here's most recent headshot is from 2013.
http://cdn-www.cdreimer.com/images/cdreimer.jpg
Both pictures are nearly identical in showing my head. What these pictures don't show is my broad shoulders and narrow waist. Even if I completely eliminated my body fat, I doubt my jowls will go ever away.
You've trolled that 1500 calorie claim for a _long_ time in a lot of stories and it is just not credible.
I love trolling the trolls.
You are now free to dismiss my empirically justifiable claims with your internet tough guy swagger, as per your usual MO.
Slashdot exists to keep me amuse while I'm waiting for a script to finish at work. Thank you for your participation.
You win, I fell for your troll.
Your comment made no sense whatsoever.
No, we will call you a disgusting tub o' lard. Which is what you are. You didn't have to "accept being big", you simply lacked the willpower to do anything about your nauseating condition. You're a mass of yellowish flesh, your grossly misshapen body trundles about in a parody of human walk. The stench of sweat in your presence is overpowering. Why don't you do the right thing and kill yourself?
You got the potty mouth of a third-grader! LOL!
unless you only had it one day a month
I'm entering month three since I started with a 1,500-calorie cap. The mechanical scales at the gym is no longer thunk at 350 pounds (maximum weight for scale), but it's very hard to get the scale to balance out. I may be down to 345 pounds.
All the proof I actually need is you saying you eat 1500 calories and are continuing to be a fat fuck and that you ate 3000 calories WHILE working out and got to 400lbs.
If you want to gain muscle weight, you need to increase your calorie intake while lifting weights. I liked being at 400 pounds, I loved the muscle mass. But buying 4XXL shirts was a bitch.
Being this delusional. Just wow.
This is Slashdot. You must be new around here.
FB is rapidly becoming the bad guys from the novel 1984.
I think you're miscounting your calories.
My growling stomach in the morning after a 12-hour fast disagrees with you.
In my experience, there are plenty of people who like to hate on fat people, and that is a problem for lots of fat people. I haven't had a fat friend claim that fat was perfectly healthy, probably because they're smarter than that. (I have one who told his doctor that he'd go on any weight loss program that had better than a 5% success rate over five years. I think he pretty much gave up on his weight, but he knows it isn't healthy.)
I'd like the fat shaming to stop, because then maybe some of my friends could stop feeling defensive and start addressing their weight issue more rationally.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
Luckily, nature does correct this: he'll be dead long before a normal-weight person.
Not likely. I don't smoke. I don't drink. I'm on a diet and work at the gym. I get my flu shot every year (perk from working in a hospital). I haven't seen a doctor in 16 years. Besides seasonal allergies, I haven't been ill in years. That's called living a healthy lifestyle.
They should be directing her to appropriate medical attention, because she's morbidly obese and in dire need of intervention.
What would that be exactly? I was literally the only fat kid at school. School officials ordered my parents to take me to the doctor and get blood tests. Three years of repeated blood tests failed to find anything wrong with me. Some people are just big that the doctors can't do anything.
"Instead, we recommend using an image of a relevant activity, such as running or riding a bike"
The fat fuck probably can't do either.
Running for a fat person is a quick way to blow out your knees. You don't want to be hobbling around like those skinny guys who get replacement knee surgery because they play basketball to aggressively. Jogging in the swimming pool is a better idea. When I rode my bike 20 miles a day to get to a restaurant job in a different city for three years, my average wait during that time was 325 pounds.
Being fat meant there's too much food available to you while too little was available to all others.
Being fat was a sign of wealth in African cultures. Some of the wealthiest people in America are black people. Go figure.
I'd like the fat shaming to stop, because then maybe some of my friends could stop feeling defensive and start addressing their weight issue more rationally.
I think fat shaming will be the last form of legalized discrimination, which is one of the reasons why I'm pushing back against it.
Another idiot that believes what fat people tell them.
You mean like the idealized versions of bodies we see in advertisements. You should really question your belief systems and try to uncover which version of photoshop they came from. Why is that any healthier?
Ectomorph, Mesomorph, Endomorph do you even know what that means?
Yep, breaking the laws of thermodynamics is fine because "everyone is different".
Humans aren't internal combustion engines with a stoichiometric ratios and mechanical inefficiencies that can be factored.
Their gut floras are magically grabbing calories out of thin air. Okay. He's the specialest snowflake that ever existed.
No, people's gut flora are different. He can change it if he chooses just like you can stop being a cunt if you choose to.
It's just a shame the taxpayers will be the ones shouldering the financial burden of keeping him alive so he can shovel more shit into his mouth for a while longer.
Well there are people out there like that and it is unhealthy, however that is a factor of the fast food and sugar industry spending billions of dollars on getting us to shovel that shit down our throats. If you eat that shit and drink those crap drinks you're every bit to blame for not being able to exert self control.
creimer is obviously functional because if he was morbidly obese he would barely be able to communicate and the evidence shows that this is not the case. In any case how does anything you say help people in that situation. If you were sincere you would be lobbying against the fast food industry for being able to advertise to children and I doubt you are doing that.
Slashdot always was a fat sympathizing group. Mostly because I believe a majority of you are fat fucks, yourselves.
I'm a purple belt in brazillian jui jitsu. My warm up is most people's work outs which is generally 2 hours of fighting a day 6 days a week, sometimes twice a day because I love it. I have abs that you can see and can do two finger pushups. I understand how ATP transaction in muscle work and I know I look good because of the way females look and interact with me.
Take a step back and try to see what is going on in the world Mr AC. I've told you about my experiences and taken the time to do so but all you can do is meet it with hostility. This suggests you probably have some issues of your own and are in self denial about it. At least this man is honest about his experiences and all I am saying is they are consistent with people I have met and trained with.
I suspect if you ever walked into a BJJ gym you would be folded into a cube and told to fuck off because you're coming across as a real asshole. Why don't you go focus on your own issues instead and try to make the world a better place.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
I updated my picture on Indie Book Lounge. Thanks for point that out!
Try 50 grams carbs day and eat what you want.
I did 150 grams of carbs and ate whatever I wanted for four years. When I put a calorie cap on what I ate two months ago, it made a difference. I'll wait another four months before I reduce my carb intake.
i was 10lb 10oz. I'm a normal build at 33. Get your shit together, son.
I'm being lectured by a millennial. How cute.
I once was a fatty, I'm now off to ride 50km.
I used to ride my bike 20 miles per day for three years to a restaurant job in a different city. My weight during that time was 325 pounds.
They should have gone on a tofu diet. all protein, no sugar or carbs, zero GI. makes you feel full.
Because they are eating the wrong things. Should be eating tofu and lo-GI.
Yes. Obviously. But we do not live in a society that surrounds us with easy access to those foods. Quite the opposite in fact.
Facebook said that its team scans millions of ad images every week, and sometimes understandably misses out on a few.
That response is BS, because facebook took the time to clarify their stance. They didn't miss anything, they just got it wrong.
Facebook: It's not a huge issue here, so just admit your prejudice.
You were 400lbs of pure fat, just like every other morbidly obese fuck.
Nope. You're totally wrong on that point.
You're gonna talk to me about fitness when you spew out shit like this?
You're assuming that the human body is a perfect thermodynamic machine. It is — on paper. Individual people are deeply flawed thermodynamic machines. We're all different.
I'm done.
I doubt that. ACs reply to me all the time.
Showing different body types baring skin doesn't mean that the issue is attraction.
The issue is that fat women (and men!) get a lot of shit that they don't deserve from other people imposing their "concern" on them.
The issue might be about FEELING attractive because as human beings that's important.
The issue is that it's their body and they should be allowed to dress as they see fit. If you think it's obscene, that's your issue. You don't have to like it, but you also don't have any right to harass them over it.
i'm no where near a fitness nut, but that lady is super obese and i'll be shocked if she isn't dead in the next 3 years at that weight.
It's the same as seeing a heroin addict with needle scars up and down both arms, but you don't have a moment of herion users speaking up for themselves and shaming anyone concerned about their addiction.
but in your mind anyone you disagree with is being insincere. see the problem?
the bullies are the ones punching people for expressing their opinion. you just expressed a willingness to intimidate another person with violent force for expressing themselves.. and then you called them a bully.
I think you have your head up your ass, maybe you should come punch me in the mouth
i'm no where near a fitness nut, but that lady is super obese and i'll be shocked if she isn't dead in the next 3 years at that weight.
As another poster pointed out, she's 350 pounds. I've been 300 to 400 pounds for my entire adult life. I'm 46-years-old. I don't smoke, I don't drink, I exercise regularly, I'm on a low-carb diet and I get my flu shots every year. I haven't seen a doctor in 16 years because the only thing I get each year is allergies. I've been hearing for years that I'm going to drop dead at any moment. I don't pay attention to that nonsense.
but in your mind anyone you disagree with is being insincere. see the problem?
I don't have a problem with someone wanting to talk to me about my health. I do have a problem with someone getting into my face to talk me about my health. One person is sincere and polite, the other person is insincere and confrontational. See the problem?
I think you have your head up your ass, maybe you should come punch me in the mouth
Are you standing in my face? No.
Are you trying to intimidate me? No.
Are you threatening me with physical violence if I don't cower before you? No.
Do I care about your opinion? Oh, hell no.