Slashdot Mirror
WordPress Bans Fascist Website Linked To Charlottesville Killer (fastcompany.com)
tedlistens writes: WordPress has said that it does not censor websites like that of self-proclaimed fascist group Vanguard America. But last night, the group's site was taken offline for violating the company's terms of service. The about-face was likely prompted by Vanguard's participation in last weekend's Unite the Right rallies in Charlottesville, Virginia, during which James Alex Fields drove his car into a crowd, killing one person and injuring 19. Fields has claimed allegiance to Vanguard America; the group denies that Fields was a member. For WordPress to drop a site, even a fascist site, is a very big deal; the same is true of GoDaddy's and Google's decision to drop their registration of neo-Nazi site the Daily Stormer (another site that GoDaddy previously said would be permitted on free speech grounds). WordPress hasn't explained the shift in its approach to the website: the company's user agreement and terms of service have not changed since Charlottesville. That policy, like that of other tech platforms, has long stood by strict neutrality and freedom of expression. That may now be changing.
Does WordPress have anything in their terms of service about inciting violence, committing crimes, or breaking the law in general?
If Vanguard America hasn't distanced themselves from the actions of this alleged member, perhaps they could be classified as a terrorist organization? This isn't necessarily an issue of free speech any more than breaking the law is.
Ok, suggestions for what label would be acceptable? Assholes is too broad a term.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
...looking for other sites that violate the "terms of service".
inspire magazine telling how to derail trains is bad.
This is about free speech and not nazis or there ideas.
But a site saying the rich jews are putting the working man down is not on the same level. That is covered free speech. and just banning based it being about white power in general is taking there free speech away.
>there profits
Paid Russian trolls need to up their grammar game
I'm pretty sure it's heavily weighted towards PR.
Look, Wordpress is here to make money. You can't make as much money if everyone is boycotting your services because you "support" hate groups.
Mr. Hu is not a ninja.
I call BS. There are plenty of platforms which like to spout that platitude, but have special rules when it comes to naked people. Other platforms disallow "adult content" altogether. Yet point out that a platform is supporting white supremacists, and the "free speech" card gets played.
Nudity is treated as more offensive than racism. Think about how messed up that is. We're only seeing this reaction from GoDaddy / WordPress now because there were full-on Nazis in Charlottesville.
It's just PR. It's not like corporations are people.
Trolls.
Troll didn't used to mean what it does now. Now it apparently means "asshole on the internet".
Voltaire got it right.
These neonazi fucks are fuckers and I hope their brand of idiocy fades from the world, but we should be careful about what we do about them. While it's true that the US 1st amendment does not protect you from private companies, and it's ALSO true that it does not guarantee you the right to use someone else's printing press, at some point just a few companies control most human communication, and that may be even more dangerous than government censorship (in the US - different tradeoffs apply elsewhere). If the government censors you for political reasons, you have a chance of recourse in the courts. If internet companies do, they are judge, jury, and executioner. Something becomes qualitatively different when the vast majority of people are using just a few centralized services.
The internet started out free: if people said something you didn't want to hear, you dropped them in your local killfile - but that choice happened at the individual level, not a company or government making the choice for millions or billions of people at once. Now, the Chinese, many middle eastern countries, Russia, etc, clamping down hard on what people can say online. And we're seeing western countries going the same way, even if the mechanism at play is private instead of public.
I understand: It's really, really easy to root against neo-nazis. They are about the second more despised target out there. "Of course these companies should shut down neo-nazis! Anyway they're private and don't have to serve people they don't want". But this isn't going to stop at neo-nazis, not in this world of "micro-offenses". The net WILL be cast wider and wider. The bar of unacceptable offense will be gradually lowered, and each step is going to make the next easier. (We already ban this other kind of speech...) Eventually it's going to come for you too. In many countries, for many people, it already has.
Think carefully before leaping on bandwagons, no matter how good they feel. Yes, neo-nazis are assholes, but let's be careful of how we shove on the internet. Like terrorism: if you radically alter your way of life because assholes flew planes into a building, the terrorists have won and you have lost. Let's not let the neo-nazis win.
Depending on the exact context, authoritarian, nationalist, and supremacist are all pretty descriptive.
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
What? Are you high?
Fascism is an economic model and has nothing to do with Donald Trump or Nazis.
Really? Really???
"Fascism is a form of radical authoritarian nationalism, characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and control of industry and commerce, that came to prominence in early 20th-century Europe."
"National Socialism (German: Nationalsozialismus), more commonly known as Nazism, is the ideology and set of practices associated with the 20th-century German Nazi Party, Nazi Germany, and other far-right groups. Sometimes characterised as a form of fascism that incorporates scientific racism and antisemitism, Nazism's development was influenced by German nationalism (especially Pan-Germanism), the Völkisch movement and the anti-communist Freikorps paramilitary groups that emerged during the Weimar Republic after Germany's defeat in First World War."
I'm sorry, but you absolutely do not get to paint this a color that pleases you.
Fascism does indeed have a few economic ideas in it, but that's only a very small part of what fascism actually is. Saying Fascism is nothing more than an economic policy is like saying a five course dinner is about the glass of water they serve alongside it.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
action and google's and godaddy's, etc. just remember your position on this when GoHillary.com or BlackLivesMatter.org is taken down because the sites allow "hate speech" to be posted.
We can fine an endless supply of "hateful" speech, even speech calling for violence on the left, too. The KKK has no monopoly on that.
Black Lives Matter protester: 'Only good white man is a dead white man'.
New Black Panther Party (NBPP), whose leaders are known for anti-Semitic and anti-white tirades. Its late chairman, Khalid Abdul Muhammad, famously remarked: “There are no good crackers, and if you find one, kill him before he changes.”
Though she opposed [a proposed Constitutional anti-gay-marriage amendment], [Clinton] said that she believed that marriage was "a sacred bond between a man and a woman" and she took "umbrage at anyone who might suggest that those of us who worry about amending the Constitution are less committed to the sanctity of marriage, or to the fundamental bedrock principle that exists between a man and a woman." [Pretty hateful words, by today's LGBTTTQQIAA... standards].
"White folks was in caves while we were building empires. We taught philosophy and astrology [sic] and mathematics before Socrates and those Greek homos ever got around to it." Al Sharpton [A gay slur, a nationalist slur, and a racist comment, all in one!]
You cannot define "hate" speech to just include white-supremacist or other speech you disagree with. Because if you do, when power shifts or something bad happens, your speech is next. We didn't go and shut down any of the sites that James Hodgkinson was active on, and if Trump and the right had tried to do so, the media would--correctly, for once--said that would be wrong and a violation of free speech rights. We didn't go and shut down the mosque where Omar Mateen's anti-gay views were stoked by his religious indoctrination. It would have been wrong.
When the KKK and Nazi's want to expose themselves and their idiotic and repugnant ideas, it's not a good idea to create martyrs-to-the-cause of any of them nor answer them with violence. That just feeds them.
As for Trump... He hasn't explicitly said that he supports or admires fascism, but he's spoken often about how much he admires leaders and systems which function in a similar way.
I'll just quote from the wikipedia definition, to save you some clicks:
Fascists believe that liberal democracy is obsolete, and they regard the complete mobilization of society under a totalitarian one-party state as necessary to prepare a nation for armed conflict and to respond effectively to economic difficulties.[8] Such a state is led by a strong leader—such as a dictator and a martial government composed of the members of the governing fascist party—to forge national unity and maintain a stable and orderly society.[8] Fascism rejects assertions that violence is automatically negative in nature and views political violence, war, and imperialism as means that can achieve national rejuvenation.[9][10][11][12] Fascists advocate a mixed economy, with the principal goal of achieving autarky through protectionist and interventionist economic policies.
Looks pretty peaceful to me. Nobody ran him over with a car. In fact, he was completely unharmed. Isn't this the kind of protest you spend hours on here defending?
As if you have a choice. The Alt-Left opens your wallet for you. And your children are theirs, your media, your employer, your barista, everyone you interact with all the time, everywhere, that doesn't think for themselves.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
I expect a bit of both.
First there is an acknowledgement that these groups are more then just a random ranting hicks. But groups trying to push a well crafted narrative of fear that giving others equal rights will diminish their own rights, and hatred of the groups who are getting such rights and trying to show that they are not worth it. It is the responsibility of everyone to stand up against this groups in one way or an other. These groups use the same methods and logic that had created much of the foreign terrorist groups, and their growth to a point where they had destroyed countries came from a population that more or less just let it slide. Racism really has no place in business, as all it does it reduce your customer base and partners to work with.
Then there is a PR problem of being considered friendly to this group, this will attract more undesirables to your service, and effect your general perception. It could be like the Simpsons quote "Not Raciest but #1 with racist)
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
That certainly shows the other side in a less forgiving light.
But let's not pretend that all those who wish to keep the statues around are angels that only care about honoring their ancestors.
And let's not pretend that this video is the standard chain of events. The whole reason we have this news post from the beginning is that someone decided those protests were worth killing over.
IANAL but perhaps someone who is versed in such matters can explain why, in light of their behavior, writings and speech, Americal neo-nazis and other groups bonded by hatred are not subject to this law (Link to Cornell Law School's Legal Information Institute - https://www.law.cornell.edu/us... ).
Whoever knowingly or willfully advocates, abets, advises, or teaches the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying the government of the United States or the government of any State, Territory, District or Possession thereof, or the government of any political subdivision therein, by force or violence, or by the assassination of any officer of any such government; or
Whoever, with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any such government, prints, publishes, edits, issues, circulates, sells, distributes, or publicly displays any written or printed matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or attempts to do so
....
It certainly seems to me that the frenzied acts and utterances by these thugs is as much a threat to the nation as yelling "Fire" in a theater, which I think is not covered by the First Amendment right of free speech.
Socialism is an economic model, enforced by violence.
Men with guns.
Please try to be consistent. Only a 'free market' could be considered a purely economic model, and then only if the State retrains itself and leaves the market alone. Fascism, Socialism, etc all rely on the State to force conditions.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
I have no idea what happened with this guy and his car in Charlottesville. But then, no one else really does either. So it's really kind of sad to see the continual press coverage about how he deliberately search out left-wing protesters in order to run them down. This is what the press says, and what their video clips seem to show.
However, lots of people captured the event on their phones and other videos are circulating that support a different interpretation: the guy drove his car down a road he shouldn't have - stupidity, accident, who knows - and was swarmed by protesters. In this interpretation, he did what you are supposed to do: never stop, keep driving no matter what.
Which interpretation is right? I have no idea. The point is: neither does anyone else other that the driver himself. He deserves his day in court, and I wish /. and the rest of the Internet would let him have it.
Enjoy life! This is not a dress rehearsal.
Speak for yourself, AC.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
The only people that can't cope with multiple political parties are liberals that assume that anyone that doesn't follow their group think is some kind of Nazi.
The entire media narrative surrounding this event distils down to nothing more than that.
You either support the absurd whitewash being perpetrated by Reb state politicians or you're a Klansman.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
So you all believe that white people, and ONLY white people, don't have the right to have their own countries, and to simply HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH other races - and therefore no ability to harm them in any way. And you also believe that non-whites HAVE to live around white people in order to somehow get 'a better life', and that the prospect of all non-whites simply living around their own kind is dreadful.
Please explain.
alt-left is a term invented by you nazis to try to equate your evil with people who just want to live their lives.
Looks pretty peaceful to me. ... Isn't this the kind of protest you spend hours on here defending?
You mean the part where people were yelling, getting right into his face is peaceful? No wonder you're perfectly fine with this as they are.
So, since we're convicting without a trial. I'm sure that you're going to be shaming those anti-confederate protesters for their violence right? After all, holding you to your standard: Words are violence.
Om, nomnomnom...
change of venue
"He can simply run his own website,"
Like The Daily Stormer', right?
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
Start your own nazi web host. Im sure you will get the best sort of investors.
I cruise at -1 just to keep an eye out for the crazies^H^H^H^H^H^H^H ACs and bottom dwellers. It's painful sometimes.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
If they actually threatened violence against him, yeah I am fine with them being arrested. What I saw in the video was mostly them saying "go home terrorist" and "fuck you" a lot. Again, I am fine with equal treatment for both sides, you are the one that is not. You pretend that "fuck you" is the same as "all jews should die and here is how it should be done." You are the one equating yelling in someone's face with running them over with a car. One is not like the other.
That certainly shows the other side in a less forgiving light. ... And let's not pretend that this video is the standard chain of events. The whole reason we have this news post from the beginning is that someone decided those protests were worth killing over.
Go watch any protest at the start where there is some "anti" group protesting and you'll see something similar. Hell even Jordan Peterson experienced in Toronto when he was speaking in public. This isn't an uncommon occurrence by the left, it's standard operating procedure. That was Canada. This is in the US, and you can find plenty of other examples.
Om, nomnomnom...
You pretend that "fuck you" is the same as "all jews should die and here is how it should be done." You are the one equating yelling in someone's face with running them over with a car. One is not like the other.
I'm holding you to your standard.
Om, nomnomnom...
Orwell had a pretty good commentary on the definition of fascism. It's kind of a worthless label in that as Orwell points out it's been applied to just about every different political group and doesn't have much of a shared definition in common use.
As if you have a choice. The Alt-Left opens your wallet for you. And your children are theirs, your media, your employer, your barista, everyone you interact with all the time, everywhere, that doesn't think for themselves.
Mmm, immigrants and globalism are the root of all the world's problems, "alt-right" surely is a bastion of independent thought.
I do not want your cheap brainburning drugs. They are useless for work. And I am a working man today.
getting a fair jury trail may be hard and the last thing we need to do is take that right away from him!
That is not flamebait. It's the truth. The more idiots call everything they don't like to be fascist the more that word is diluted to the point of irrelevancy. The OP is correct. Fascism is primarily an economic model. Nazism adds race to the equation.
If you're scared of your govt then you need to further restrict its powers
Vote 3rd Party in 2016 and beyond
Maybe I should just open my wallet for you and avoid the violence?
Your sense of humor went missing. I suggest buying a pair of poopy glasses to bring it back.
Iv'e seen some videos from a different angle that may tell a different story.
The is a possibility that the car was hit first after which the driver made a stupid maneuver and rolled (slowly) over somebody. Then a mob surrounded him so he panicked and escaped.
The images aren't that clear, and even if true that doesn't excuse the driver, but it how how what you consider "peaceful protesting" may spiral out of control.
But in your case, "trolls" seems to mean "people who live in reality".
You mean a reality where it's OKAY to create false accounts, post dick pics and re-post personal information from public records?
Who, that guy who condemned Nazis and white nationalists? Yeah, he is such a Nazi. You can always tell the Nazis because of how they condemn Nazis - dead giveaway!
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Yep I don't agree with that, sounds pretty dumb. Next?
I want to know where all of these people cheering WordPress and GoDaddy were when ISIS was beheading people and posting it all over the internet. Where were these people when left wing groups were posting anti-cop rhetoric and inciting riots? Where were they when people were making movies depicting the assassination of a sitting president (not Obama)?
Apparently, Jordan Peterson and Gad Saad are hosting an event and it's being protested because "anti-semitism"... Gad Saad is jewish.
The madness doesn't end.
That's completely different than opening the wallets of every American to bail out the Banking Industry. Thanks Republicans, for being SOOOOOOO smart that you don't need my money! Oh, wait...
Before blaming that on Republicans, you should look at the facts: Democrats voted 172 to 63 in favor of the bailout, while Republicans voted 108 to 91 against it.
Mmm, immigrants and globalism are the root of all the world's problems
I can't say I saw GP say that they were.
Your sarcastic statement, however, is as patently false as the statement: Immigrants and globalism don't cause any problems.
Like most things, the truth is somewhere in between, and trying to pretend otherwise just makes people look like ignorant fools.
We tell the world we have free speech, yet here we are proving otherwise. To be clear, I don't like what is going on and I do believe Trump has encouraged the neo-nazis, "white pride", white supremacists and and hate groups to come out of their holes. And yes, they now have the courage to mobilize and organize (somewhat, heaven help us if they ever truly organize).
The problem is if we respond to this with actions of fear, like suppressing opinion and speech, whether we agree or not, we turn ourselves into the likes of Putin, Xi (Chinese president) and Vajiralongkorn( king of Thailand) who instantly take measure to stop anyone saying anything they don't like, especially if it questions their authority or their policies.
Free speech can bring all sorts of things to light, good and bad. And we have to respond to both equally: With intelligence, rationale and restraint when we disagree. If we can't do this, the efforts of those like Ghandi and Martin Luther King Jr, were for naught. The ACLU has been condemned by many for defending the rights of some of these groups to speak. But those are the real defenders of American values: Whether they disagree or disagree with people, they defend our civil liberties without prejudice. So long as it's only speech, we need to be true to the values we claim demonstrate our ability to have real dialogue among our citizens and government leaders.
The real problem with this rally was bringing weapons. The allowing of a POLITICAL (not military or mob style) is fine, but the bringing of weapons is where the line should have been drawn. (and easy enough to use politically: Police see baseball bats/shields, they get together and say "you may only proceed if you leave your 'equipment' here." A quickly improvised response unfortunately consisted mostly of people who were reacting rather than acting, and the result was baseball bats were brought by many of them as well. Trump uses this as an excuse to support the neo-nazis indirectly. This tragically lead to someone being killed. Even more tragic: There is footage that suggests that the death was not in fact a direct attack at all, but a neo-nazi who attended the rally panicking after his car was attacked by a protester a baseball bat (https://www.allenbwest.com/2017/08/14/new-shock-theory-emerges-charlottesville-drivers-motive-blowing-minds/).
So where does this leave us: Hopefully a lesson that knee-jerk reactions, like pulling any opinions or sites from the Internet that we don't like are the wrong response. Okay, child porn, is one thing and pulling that I encourage because the actions to create such material are monstrous. But pulling political statements, even racists ones, from the Internet because we don't like or are afraid of it brings us to a lower level and long term consequences are horrifying to imagine. Basically we become fascists, whatever our good intentions. While legally people can make their own statements to not support it by showing it on the media they control, when you are a media company (including Internet) one has a great responsibility if they truly believe in the right to free speech. They must have the courage to allow what they don't like to be said, as long as the speech content itself is not created by morally or ethically questionable actions (like child porn). There was a film I remember, "To Kill A Mockingbird". Perhaps we should all review it.
To use Benjamin Franklin's statement (and yes he didn't address it specifically for civil liberties but I think it works so...): "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety" I would substitute "Civil" for "essential", especially pertaining to freedom of speech and freedom of the press. We should try to be responsible, but we should not eliminate it when a few people use it in a way we don't agree with. (Another film "Absence of Malice" gives a good example of this.
"Imagination is more important than knowledge" - Einstein
I'm not a member, nor do I identify with, anything alt-right. Reacting to comments with the limited vocabulary of the Left leaves you accusing everyone so dishes with you of being a fascist. That's stupid.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
Let's be fair. All economic models are enforced by violence.
ALLEGEDLY drove the car into the crowd, ALLEGEDLY killed one person and ALLEGEDLY injured others.
Not allegedly. There is ample proof that he did do all of those things.
The only possible argument isn't about whether or not he did those things, but about what his motive was. I've seen people here trying to make the (incredibly weak, IMO) argument that it was self-defense, but even they aren't trying to imply he didn't actually commit those acts.
Yes, like The Daily Stormer. Nothing is stopping them.
Wouldn't you have done the same?
Not unless the mob actually succeeded in gaining access to the inside of my car.
Bakeries owned by religious people are forced by law to accommodate anyone for any reason
This is absolutely untrue.
first they came for Nazis, and i dont give a fuck, because fuck nazis. they can come for genocidal racists all they want.
Or it could just be that polite society is attempting to re-exert some degree of control via social censure.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
I'd say it is very well crafted towards the target audience; disaffected young white males. It has remarkable success, just look at all the crypto-fascists on /.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Who has taken their free speech away? They can find some other place to host their site. Quit conflating private entities giving these bastards the boot to some sort of state suppression. The First Amendment protects you from the state silencing you. Private actors are under no such obligation.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
The madness doesn't end.
Of course it doesn't, and sometimes it actually get's worse. Like in this picture here(SFW). Just remember it the next time someone claims that antifa really aren't bad guys and they really are fighting fascists.
Om, nomnomnom...
Watch Ken Burns' "The Civil War" on PBS. Shelby Foote's insights are incredible. He has a trilogy of books that are wonderful too. He is(was) a master of Civil War history. One of his greatest insights was the small grammatical change that happened after the War. References to the US changed from "The United States are" to "The United States is". The US was seen as a collection of semi autonomous states. Many people felt more loyalty to their state than to the collection of states that made up the country. Lee was such a person. He resigned his commission in the U.S. Army to fight for Virginia. The Confederacy was ancillary to his loyalty.
The marching pace of progress in modern society is much different than 1861. At that point, we were only 71 years into the experiment of a "strong" central Federal government which was not all that strong anyway. People had more loyalty and ties to their home state than we do today.
Your "good ole boy" comment only shows your own ignorance of the facts involved. And I fail to understand at all what the Fugitive Slave Act had to do with the reputation or motivations of Lee. Are you alleging he had a hand in crafting it?
Fascism is a governing model. It isn't limited simply to economics at all.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Don't get me wrong, the people at the Daily Stormer are the scum of the earth. I hate them and what they stand for.
It's just that I still remember when "I disagree with what you say but I'll defend, to the death, your right to say it." was the ideal to which we aspired.
During the course of the last week, I have noticed that all kinds of people are being lumped in with Nazis, KKK and White Supremacists. For example, I don't like the idea of confederate monuments but I can understand how someone from Virginia, whose 4th great grandfather went into battle for the Confederacy might not necessarily be racist but still wants to honor his ancestor with a statue in a park.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Have you even watched the fucking video? He starts speeding up in a relatively unpopulated part of the street, and drives into a larger body of protesters. Why are you people so interested in making this white supremacist look like a victim?
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
neo-fascism
Like most things, the truth is somewhere in between, and trying to pretend otherwise just makes people look like ignorant fools.
There has been a bit of a sea change. While it is easy enough to claim that people who want nothing to do with the White supremacists and Ku Klux Klan members and their websites and actions are somehow equivalent of driving your nice new car into a crowd of people and ending a person's existence - it isn't all that surprising that a lot of us don't particularly want to be associated with the White Supremacists or the Klan. Vanilla ISIS don't cut it.
That is pretty simple. But here is the problem.
People who will drive their cars into crowds of people that they don't agree with, are not going to be swayed by the rest of us just saying "We embrace you because your opinion is equal to ours". Nope. People who lynch black people and chant "Blood and soil, and drive their cars into protesters will only demand more.
There is a history with them. And like it or not, it must be forcefully responded to either now, or when they set the world on fire. The last time they held sway in much of the world, it got a little messy.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
If you can't tell the difference between Nazi's and other people, then either you're an idiot, or you're intentionally trying to make some point that doesn't make any fucking sense. It's not a "slippery slope" to deny Nazi's web hosting.
I don't respond to AC's.
You guys are doing a shit job of taking over. Say what you want about the nazis, at least they were fucking competent.
A couple thoughts on that. The alt-right folks have inadvertently hurt their cause badly. A lot of the statues of the second place finishers in the war of Northern agression are coming down, more than before.
The Nasties were competent after a fashion, but their hyper agressive stance and hate based ideology just burnt itself out. Right wing, left wing, notwithstanding, hate cannot work for very long. Because in the bigger scheme of things, ideologies need to amp it up. So eventually hate based ideology becomes "Everyone is a traitor and must die, except for you anid I. And I'm beginning to think you are traitor."
To be honest, it relaxes me no end to see how fucking hopeless most of the alt-right are as human beings. Lots of bleating, but fuck all else. Long may it continue.
Sometimes bad babies need spanked though.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
And the previous bailouts and the wars were started by republicans.
Almost every single US international war started under a Democratic administration. Democrats also voted for the bailouts and Republicans voted majority against them.
But herrrppp-derrrppp der ebil repurblikerns!
Fucking lying idiot.
Wrong.
Supreme Court ruled that corporations are a person. They were granted personhood and given the same rights as a person. That's how incorporation gives full protection since you cannot sue the ceo personally. you sue a ceo or sue anyone in the company for the company's doings it automatically gets protected by the corporation since it acts as an umbrella protection to its workers. Incorpation is the act of giving personhood status to a corporation in legal and foreign trade circumstances.
This rule of construction is specified in 1 U.S.C. Â1 (United States Code), which states:
In determining the meaning of any Act of Congress, unless the context indicates otherwiseâ"
the words "person" and "whoever" include corporations, companies, associations, firms, partnerships, societies, and joint stock companies, as well as individuals
This is a problem with using WordPress.com to host your content. WordPress.com can then decide if it wants to host your content. There is a self hosted version of Wordpress, which is typically referred to WordPress.org, or just "WordPress" by people involved in WordPress development. This "version" of WordPress allows for you to deploy on any server running PHP + MySQL, and doesn't involve making calls back to WordPress.com for the purposes of political correctness (UNLESS you install the JetPack plugin, which bridges many of the helpful features of WordPress.com into WordPress.org.) WordPress.com is a complete service, closer to SquareSpace or Wix. WordPress.org is a CMS, similar to Drupal or Joomla!
Seriously, if you are doing shady stuff, why not protect yourself? Register your domain in a country that doesn't care at all, or supports your form of bizarreness. Then, point the name at a server which you either control, or is really an empty container (AWS EC2?) again preferably hosted in a country that either doesn't care at all, or supports your particular flavor of perversion.
I see this all the time. People either:
1.) Break a law
2.) Are obscenely offensive
then get caught/in trouble / kicked offline, and then it's "news." This shouldn't be "news" if they actually thought about what they were doing, and performed the steps I outlined above to prevent this, and also because this isn't news, it's called being dumb and making your host/registrar/provider dislike you. This is "we reserve the right to refuse service to anyone" but applied in the context of hanging an obscene poster from your poster holder called a website.
BLM and antifa have been using violence and arson for quite a while now, across the US and in Europe. Why are you suddenly concerned about violence now? Where have you been?
inspire magazine telling how to derail trains is bad.
This is about free speech and not nazis or there ideas.
But a site saying the rich jews are putting the working man down is not on the same level. That is covered free speech. and just banning based it being about white power in general is taking there free speech away.
Funny how some alt-righters have no idea of what exactly free speech is.
You are allowed to say whatever you like, short of threats of violence. The Government isn't allowed to arrest you for it.
But we are allowed to react to what you said. It's probably heartbreaking for the Supremacists and Klan, but if you want to open a "Blood and Soil" website, no one is forced to host it. Your freedom of expression does not mean that I have to let you burn a cross on my lawn.
Buy your own servers, and host your own sites. Or move your sites offshore. Places in Russia will probably be happy to host them.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
That's the opposite of a polite society.
I can't figure out whether you're just a paranoid schizophrenic or a racist.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
Due process?
Thank you for volunteering to be a live illustration to the point I was making.
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Wordpress, and Google, are both pretty savvy about "narrative" (probably true for Go Daddy, too, but I don't know Go Daddy). Being savvy about narratives is part of their corporate cultures.
So what has changed between before the death of Heather and after it? The words on the websites had not changed significantly. The narratives are the same.
What changed is the inescapable recognition that the words had motivated 700+ loose nuts to pick up assault weapons and march on Charlotteville, and one loose nut to use a car as a lethal weapon.
There are limits to free speech. Yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater is beyond free speech protection. Getting a few dozen Good Old Boys drunk on mob hysteria, pointing them at some group and telling them "Let's you and them fight!" is also beyond the limits of free speech.
So that is what has changed. Go Daddy, Google, and Wordpress now recognize that they can be used as megaphones to incite violence, and that violates their TOSs as well as their collective corporate conscience.
There is a legion of white men between 30 and 60 years old who have been disenfranchised; the American Dream they had been promised is no more. Passed along from grade to grade during their school years since staying with their peers was more important than getting a solid education, their promised lifestyle of living like their Dad had, putting in forty hours a week on an assembly line until retirement but having their evenings for poker games and bowling leagues and their weekends for barbeques, has died with automation and computers. There is no way that America can send this vast horde back to school, there are simply too many of them to get them all retrained for today's decent jobs. This is a huge pol of anger and resentment that can be manipulated by persons who are unencumbered by ethical considerations, such as Rush Limbaugh, Jerry Springer, David Duke, Richard Spencer, and Donald Trump.
It is critical that web hosts, Twitter, and similar services that can act as megaphones recognize their potential for inciting violence and enforce their TOSs.
Bullshit. That's what polite society has always been about. Modern democracy gives people wide latitude in their speech and behavior, but that doesn't mean that those who fart in public can't be called out.
If you hold noxious views, then expect people to distance themselves from you. It's your choice to be that kind of person, and it's my choice to call you out and refuse to allow my property to be used for you to spread your beliefs.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
And the original regulations, which prevented this situation, were repealed by the Newt Gingrich Congress with veto proof margins.
Guess what, the same stupid investments of breaking up mortgages and chopping them up into AAA rated investments have already started up again, and sub-prime lending is back. We'll be lucky if there isn't another collapse in 10 years and the Republicans want to roll back Dodd-Frank the only law requiring that the banks carry enough assets to prevent such a collapse from taking them down.
Welcome to republican Fiscal management, you take a bunch of tax payer money and give it to rich people to bail them out for the mistakes they made.
General Lee waged war against the US. He is the very definition of a traitor.
Traitors don't deserve statues.
BLM and antifa have been using violence and arson for quite a while now, across the US and in Europe. Why are you suddenly concerned about violence now? Where have you been?
Why do you assume that I'm only "suddenly concerned about violence" Is this a thread about antifa and blm?
You see, your weird ass logic is actually validating all the violence. Because when you answer a statement about alt-right violence by saying the left is doing it too - you've just said it's all okay.
That's why I love it when you alt-righters go off on your tangents about Hellery, you are excusing her of everything, and you aren't even rational enough to know that. See what I did there?
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
That picture doesn't show what you think it does.
What a rotten party, have we run out of beer or something?
General Lee waged war against the US. He is the very definition of a traitor.
Traitors don't deserve statues.
Like George Washington? History is written by the winners.
"antifa" or anti-fascist groups wouldn't exist without the fascist groups. They wouldn't have even shown up to do counter-protests if the fascists didn't come to various locations. Everyone who says these things obviously support these fascist ideas, or at least that's how everyone around the planet perceives this false equivalency.
Arguing that white supremacist groups, pro-Nazi groups, etc should be able to perform their what is basically a "march for treason" either supports their goals or does not comprehend what these groups actually want to accomplish. Their very loud calls for a "white ethnostate" is a call for genocide, murder, and totalitarianism; there is no other way to accomplish this goal. IMHO anyone flying a Nazi flag is committing treason, as the Nazi were most certainly considered enemies of the USA since they declared war against us. Marching with their flag is "adheres to their enemies" and "providing them aid". Now, just "displaying" the Nazi flag is covered free speech, but these marches go far beyond just display.
I'm not even going to address BLM here, as that is a different conversation. I am just addressing the antifa vs fa problem.
The fact that your post is marked at 4, Insightful is disturbing. Mine will probably be marked down, which is equally disturbing.
Wish I had mod points, sorry can't upvote.
Welcome to Trump land.
Todays -1 crazy, is tomorrows Trump plan.
George Zimmerman springs to mind. Trump will use the Presidential Pardon to free the KKK man.
I hate to smack you back into reality, but Zimmerman was found not guilty in a public trial. I know you Berkeley types think that CNN had already found him guilty, but no pardon, Presidential or otherwise, was required.
You're either standing against the mouth breathers waving Nazi flags and chanting "blood and soil," or you are WITH them. Call me whatever stupid name you want, there are very few issues where such moral clarity is even possible.
When is the media going to start mention that the driver is a diagnosed schizophrenic? and on antipsychotic medication? I find it oddly puzzling this and him beating up his mother leading to a stint in juvenile detention facility haven't been talked about really at all.
Even the possibly mythical 'free market'?
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
Not today. They've gone to the Dark Web...
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
Call BS all you want. It's meaningless because you have no idea what my background or personal experiences are.
If they are inside, then it's already too late.
Not hardly. If someone is climbing through a broken car window, it's pretty hard to swing a bat or a fist. Especially if the car is accelerating.
Once inside, the mob has access to do even more grievous bodily harm.
Even more? A mob cannot do you grievous bodily harm from outside the car unless they're tipping it over. So there's no "even more" about it.
Right, but escorting people off your property because they farted might be considered a tad bit impolite. A small number of companies have very powerful control over the Internet right now and that concerns a lot of people, rightfully so. It's worth hearing both sides out. You can't turn off phone service to someone you don't agree with, you can't turn off their power.. should web hosts, payment processors, search engines and the like be treated similarly or are they more like a traditional business with a right of refusal? It's a fair question. Saying no and refusing to consider it under the guise of a "polite society" is crap.
I never said it's okay. I'm curious why there wasn't such fervor over the antics of BLM and antifa. I don't agree with supremacists on either side, and I recognize there are such on both sides. Why is that difficult to understand? What I'm asking is why is it that BLM and antifa don't get the same type of response? One person hit by a car and the media is all over it. Five cops shot dead, dozens of businesses torched, people assaulted, the media gives it some slight coverage if at all and moves onto something else in a day or two. There's a huge bias and it needs to be called out. The President saying there were two parties involved even got blow-back, and he was absolutely right.
While it is easy enough to claim that people who want nothing to do with the White supremacists and Ku Klux Klan members and their websites and actions are somehow equivalent of driving your nice new car into a crowd of people and ending a person's existence - it isn't all that surprising that a lot of us don't particularly want to be associated with the White Supremacists or the Klan. Vanilla ISIS don't cut it.
I must confess I struggled to parse this sentence. Having read it through half a dozen times I'm still going to have to disagree (with the bit I highlighted, having removed some extraneous bits). There is no equivalence between people wanting nothing to do with <insert distasteful group here> and <insert random act of violence here>. Anyone who would claim otherwise is insane - just my opinion, of course.
That is pretty simple. But here is the problem.
People who will drive their cars into crowds of people that they don't agree with, are not going to be swayed by the rest of us just saying "We embrace you because your opinion is equal to ours". Nope. People who lynch black people and chant "Blood and soil, and drive their cars into protesters will only demand more.
I'm still not sure I see 'the problem', as you put it. Anyone who participates in a lynching or who has driven their car into a crowd of people has the right to demand, and receive, a fair trial, and not a lot else. Most people who are arguing for their rights are not saying "Come here, get a hug and everything will be ok", nor are they saying "we value your opinion as much as our own". No, what we're / they're saying is "you have the right to your opinion, however wrong we think it is". I'm more than a little surprised this needs to be spelled out to you.
There is a history with them. And like it or not, it must be forcefully responded to either now, or when they set the world on fire. The last time they held sway in much of the world, it got a little messy.
If someone breaks the law they should be tried and punished in accordance with the law. Someone, anyone, everyone, no matter what side of the political fence they sit, no matter how 'distasteful' you find their opinions, or how much their opinions accord with yours. The law is and should be blind in this regard. If someone hasn't broken the law they should not be punished, not by an arm of local or national government, and certainly not by some self appointed 'guardians of the moral majority'.
I tend to think "Don't grant yourself powers you wouldn't want your 'enemies' to have" is a pretty reasonable way to approach interactions with people you disagree with. (And please, don't respond with "But they wouldn't do the same for you". I don't care. I can be better than that!)
Public information, is, well, public, fat man.
Your attempts at INTIMIDATION failed. Suck it.
BLM and antifa have been using violence and arson for quite a while now, across the US and in Europe. Why are you suddenly concerned about violence now? Where have you been?
I don't know about the US, but in Europe there has been hundreds (if not thousands) of instances of arson against refugee centers over the last 2-3 years. While few of the arsonists have been caught, I think it is quite likely that they follow the same nasty ideology that the C'ville killer did. "Why are you suddenly concerned about violence now? Where have you been?"
The truth may be out there, but lies are inside your head
You're making a "chicken and egg" argument. The problem is that antifa was not in response to white supremacists. It was in response to our new President being elected and a rejection of conservative/libertarian values. If you're not a liberal, you're a fascist or a racist or a bigot. That's their mantra. This whole white supremacy thing is a circus side show that the left fell for. It has nothing to do with what's been taking place over the last few years. We've had BLM torching entire city blocks, assaulting people, inciting the murder of police officers, more recently we have antifa doing similar things.. but only now does the media really start talking about violence. It's absurd.
You do know that in some cases, it was the migrants themselves lighting the fires? They want better digs than they've been provided with.
It's not really that clear and straightforwards, but it's always been true that "the power of the press belongs to the man who owns one". It's *one* of the ways the wealthy and powerful use to remain the wealthy and powerful.
FWIW, I don't use WordPress, so I don't know either their terms of service or whether they are paid for their service. If they are, and their Terms of Service don't justify their action, then they are violating a contract. Good luck enforcing it though.
This is, however, a clear warning of how unpopular views are readily suppressed. It's not clear to me what the best answer is. I certainly don't want to be coerced into listening to the views of every nut group...these days I even use an ad blocker. And it's also true that the "echo chamber" effect is injurious to society. These appear to be in conflict, but there's also the problem of "information overload", which weighs in on some of the otherwise potential solutions.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
Antifa has no moral or legal right to physically attack people. That woman died because Antifa physically attacked people they don't agree with regardless of whether or not the driver reacted in retaliation or out of fear.
I will agree that "allegedly" is weaker than required, but I wouldn't go stronger then "apparently". I don't unreservedly trust videos, especially those shot from only one angle and selected by those with an axe to grind. I've been present at a few news shots, and seen how they can bias the reporting with perfectly honest photographs.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
No. It may just mean you're tired of listening to them. I won't listen to Flat-Earthers or Jehova's Witnesses. This doesn't mean I'm afraid, it means I don't want to waste my time on idiots.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
BLM is a legitimate campaign with some crazy members. The neo-nazis aren't all that neo, and don't deserve any sympathy. I don't know anything about Antifa.
That said, equal enforcement is important, and should not be avoided, just because some group you like will be hurt. Either enforce a rule or revoke it. If you have a rule that your service cannot be used to advocate violence and BLM advocates violence, they should be subject to the same criteria as the neo-nazis. If you don't have such a rule, then you shouldn't enforce it against the neo-nazis.
This gets more difficult when you start considering things like "pattern of behavior", and how that affects degree of enforcement, but still, equal enforcement should be applied.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
If I had mod points, I'd mod you funny.
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
The woman died because a neo-Nazi fuckwit ran her over. There is no other reason no matter how much you try and whitewash it
Are you really asserting that there is some doubt about whether the car drove into the crowd, injuring people and killing one? I don't think that it's reasonable to try to argue that didn't happen. The only room for argument is over motive.
Only because that's what they voluntarily chose to do. It certainly wasn't necessary in order to keep the site up.
Yes, even that.
George? Is that you Mr. President?
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
You mean the war where the South fired first?
24 beers in a case, 24 hours in a day. Coincidence? I think not!
Well, there are shades. Protecting a statue of American history is not a bad thing. Murdering someone, like that woman was a bad thing. The leaders of the white trash should have told their people that violence will harm their cause. If they go about this issue in a nonviolent way, they might have easily won. Especially if the "left" side kept up their own violent ways, because, they were not saints in this conflict either. They just didn't go about killing people.
Patents Drive Free Software as Hurricanes Drive Construction Industry
I truly want to believe this is sarcasm. I wish you had added some comments about how we could use them to make glue, or some such.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
You're either standing against the mouth breathers waving Nazi flags and chanting "blood and soil," or you are WITH them.
Many sides... Lotta blame on many sides... Many fine people on all sides...
Nazi rally, nazi murderer, anti-nazi protesters, anti-nazi victims. Really, how much bravery does it take to pick the side opposing nazis? Declaring "nazis==bad" and "murderer==at fault" isn't exactly revolutionary. I don't care if the protesters were carrying clubs; surely DJT isn't suggesting this was self-defense... Even deriding the protesters as "alt-left" is upsetting. Opposing nazis doesn't make you "alt-anything". It makes you a decent human being.
MAGA!
He's getting rather old, but he's a good mouse.
You're talking to people who have come to agree with one another that a group of people they disagree with should be denied the right to walk down the street together. Of course they believe their phone service and power should be cut off.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
Because everyday of your life on slashdot will now be spent battling trolls.
You must be new around here.
And, hell, for that matter, they can find someone else to bake their damn cake!!
(It's a reference to another issue where this same argument was used.)
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
And if you want cakes for a gay wedding, you can open your own bakery?
C'mon, bask in the cognitive dissonance.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
George Washington waged war against the Kingdom of England, not the United States. George Washington is a Traitor of King George. They shouldn't have any monuments to George Washington in the UK because he was a traitor to that Kingdom.
Unlike of course General Lee, who waged war against the United States on US soil. He's a traitor of the United States.
Traitors don't deserve statues in the nation they Betrayed.
It's worse than that. Victoria Secret can parade young women in underwear that definitely look underage in larger than life billboards at the mall. A 60 yr old man would be arrested for having the same photos on his home computer if they'd been taken privately.
Aah, change is good. -- Rafiki
Yeah, but it ain't easy. -- Simba
This is, however, a clear warning of how unpopular views are readily suppressed. It's not clear to me what the best answer is.
There is no clear answer. But as a metric, We can compare The activities of the White Supremacists and Neo Nazis to other groups.
Bastille day celebration with a terrorist driving a truck through it. 84 people killed. https://www.nytimes.com/2016/0...
Man drives into crow of people in Israel, killing one http://www.timesofisrael.com/d...
Man tries to drive a car through a crowd in Belgium https://themuslimissue.wordpre...
How ramming cars into crowds became a major terror tactic (London attack) https://www.washingtonpost.com...
Another attack in Stockholm https://www.nytimes.com/2017/0...
Attack in Heidelberg http://www.nbcnews.com/news/wo... Isreal again. http://www.westernjournalism.c...
London again: http://www.dw.com/en/terrorist...
And that is just some of them.
So what we have here is a tactic used by terrorists. Pick a crowd, and play Bowling for Humans. Looks like the Bastille Day guy has the highest score so far. This is pretty obviously Terrorism, and the only people who support it is likewise terrorists and their supporters.
So we have a group of people who support supremacy of one race over another - That would be the Klan. They have a history of violence and murder.
We have Neo-Nazis. Another group of people that support the National Socialist movement and all that entails. These two groups dovetail rather nicely together.
Then we have a member of the second group who runs his car through a crowd of people in Virginia.
It all fits. I don't negotiate with terrorists, nor do I wish to appease them. Appeasement doesn't work with Nazis, if we recall our history. And Blut und Boden puts the Neo's directly into Nazi ideology.
Which is why I put support for these people into the support of terrorism, support that it's practicioners desire to become mainstream. And if that happens, what are the odds that they extend anything remotely resembling free speech to others. Historically it has been exactly opposite.
Perhaps my detractors will mod this up to 5 to show their support for free speech that offends them.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
You mean the war where the South fired first?
Not the revised historical account.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
And if you want cakes for a gay wedding, you can open your own bakery?
C'mon, bask in the cognitive dissonance.
I have to confess, I'd feel a little odd eating a tallywhacker cake.
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
Antifa has existed for decades. Antifa is not new, the only reason why you're hearing about it now is that there are a lot more fascists coming out of the woodwork at the moment because there's a friendly federal administration that somehow manages to consistently weasel out of condemning nazis unless someone pushes a prepared statement under his nose and tells him to stop talking once he's done.
You do realize that BLM makes the exact same kind of statements and have done so since the beginning? The white power stuff is a distraction, they pop up every few years or so, get some headlines, and then go away again. No one supports their BS other than themselves. What antifa wants is a more socialist type of government which is very unfavorable to many Americans. That's a big part of how Trump managed to win. Antifa is really anti-Trump, anti-Brexit, anti-anything-nationalist. Now you're going to see non-liberals tarred and feathered by the actions of a bunch of racist dipshits that weren't part of any of this until now. That's why I think making some of these online services content-neutral is worth talking about. Even if it just dials back the rhetoric and witch hunt.
you missed the second sentence.
You're basically saying "first they came for the people who were coming for people". You're using a quote meant to support minorities as a means of supporting those who don't want to persecute minorities. Your hypocrisy is astounding.
I ignore Anonymous Coward posts. If you want to discuss something, that's awesome. Log in.
Oops, I meant "You're using a quote meant to support minorities as a means of supporting those who don't want to persecute minorities." as "You're using a quote meant to support minorities as a means of supporting those who want to persecute minorities."
I ignore Anonymous Coward posts. If you want to discuss something, that's awesome. Log in.
Yes, if you jump to conclusions you'd think that.
If you googled it, you'd find that it's the "white mans march" they're protesting against.
It's not a very catchy slogan though, I'll grant you
What a rotten party, have we run out of beer or something?
That picture doesn't show what you think it does.
Leftists engaging in identity politics, using violent imagery which supports attacking a race of people(whites). That picture shows exactly what it means. They're no different then any other racist.
Om, nomnomnom...
Leftists engaging in identity politics, using violent imagery which supports attacking a race of people(whites). That picture shows exactly what it means. They're no different then any other racist.
They're against nazis and other white pride types. Which I thought was a no brainer but apparently is up for debate these days.
What a rotten party, have we run out of beer or something?
On the Reddit website there's a discussion forum titled StormfrontorSJW in which I believe people post comments such as the one to which you replied, and invite people to guess whether it was written by a neo-nazi or someone that could be described as a social justice warrior.
I don't frequent it, but the times on which I've seen it referenced it does turn out to be bloody scarily impossible to tell.
Which is one reason it's interesting to see so many technology companies shutting down only one side of the extremist dialogue.
I can't mod you because I'm replying to you instead.
Terrorists shot people in Paris.
They then shot people again in Paris.
They shot people in Holland when I was living in Germany
They shot people in Northern Ireland.
According to you, that makes anybody that shoots someone a terrorist.
The incident in Charlottesville does not look like a pre-planned and intentional attempt to kill multiple people with a large vehicle. Shitty choice of vehicle, no follow-up, very different behaviour from the driver to the other incidents you've quoted.
It's possible for people to commit crimes without it being terrorism. The police certainly think so, they've charged him with murder and not terror related charges - and that's the police that fucking chose not to prevent illegal demonstrators turning up with weapons and assaulting a legal demonstration.
If they don't think it's terrorism then this is not pretty obviously terrorism. Call it what it is: Suspected murder or manslaughter. Those are serious crimes and will be prosecuted using actual laws with very severe punishments. Why the fuck isn't that good enough for you?
This may sound odd, but as I haven't seen any actual evidence that the accused man was even driving the vehicle in question then I don't find it unreasonable to be cautious about describing his actions.
Luckily there's a socially accepted mechanism for finding out who was driving the car, what their motives were, the extent to which the driver and their vehicle were at fault for the injuries that occurred and whether this broke the law. Following completion of that process we'll all be able to speak with greater certainty on the event.
In the UK there was no adverse coverage of the Occupy movement's desire to protest, or their right to do so.
There were complaints that they were a fucking nuisance shitting in the street and raping each other.
You want to march past my house complaining that my cat purrs too loudly, you go right ahead.
You want to camp in my garden and stop me emptying my bins, I'm going to tell you you're out of order.
Is that so fucking hard to comprehend?
Fair enough. You can have any standard of proof you want in terms of what convinces you that something is or isn't true.
I just hope that you're at least equally skeptical of everything that comes out of the mouths of the "alt-right", the likes of Fox news, and especially of Trump.
I didn't. You are saying, Freedom of Speech is not for everyone. I get it...
In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
Hmm... that way it does have a semblance with "Nazi" or "Fascist"...
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
I do my best to avoid Fox news, if that helps? It's on the list of sources for which I seek corroborating and alternate views, rather than trusting outright.
There are a mix of such sites on that informal list, across the political spectrum.
The President saying there were two parties involved even got blow-back, and he was absolutely right.
Yes, there was the side that was attacked by a terrorist and a side that wasn't. I expect Trump didn't have to bring up the sides at all, he could have just denounced the attack, but for some reason he felt the need to try and edge in some weasel-words to de-victimize the wounded party.
The initial bailouts were pushed by President Bush (no. 45), and then more favored by Democrats than Republicans in Congress. I'm calling that bipartisan.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
And racial discrimination and hate speech aren't an uncommon occurrence by the right. Antifa identifies as left-wing, but not all leftists identify with Antifa. I, personally, wish they'd go away, partly because I don't approve of violence, and partly because they make leftists look bad.
So, we had a right-wing rally in which a rightist drove a car into a crowd and killed a woman. Clearly the right wing is violent.
So, if you will refrain from blaming the entire left for Antifa, I'll refrain from blaming the entire right for Nazis.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
The only people that can't cope with multiple political parties are conservatives that assume that anyone that doesn't follow their group think is some kind of Communist.
That's at least as accurate. I see leftists attacking Nazis for being Nazis and right-wing people attacking leftists for being Communists, personally.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
Depends on the state. The Federal definition of child pornography requires that the subject be an identifiable person under the age of 18, and requires some actual sexuality as opposed to just nudity (unless you consider lascivious display of the genitalia to be plain nudity). Even as is, this leads to the odd result that it's legal for me to have sex with a 16-year-old girl (age of consent varies by state), but it's highly illegal for me to have any video of it. Girls posed in underwear and not explicitly doing anything sexual fall way outside the Federal law. Not all states have laws stricter than the Federal one.
Now, if you're saying that the police could break into the 60-year-old's house, confiscate anything that might possibly hold an image, arrest him, ruin his reputation, run him through a terrifying process, and then have the case dismissed, that's more plausible.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
That's the opposite of a polite society.
You are the opposite of a gentleman.
When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
They're going to have to do an expensive search for jurors, I'd think. That's how all highly publicized crime trials work. Nothing out of the ordinary.
"When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
I can't mod you because I'm replying to you instead.
Terrorists shot people in Paris. They then shot people again in Paris. They shot people in Holland when I was living in Germany They shot people in Northern Ireland.
According to you, that makes anybody that shoots someone a terrorist.
Are you stupid? People shoot people all the time, and make no mistake, they aren't terrorists. Seriously guy, if this is what your intellect raises to, I am beginning to understand why you have a desire to allow terrorists to have free reign under teh aegis of "Free Speech".
Call it what it is: Suspected murder or manslaughter. Those are serious crimes and will be prosecuted using actual laws with very severe punishments. Why the fuck isn't that good enough for you?
The fuck it isn't good enough for me is that there is a difference between a murder of passion or criminal or pecuniary intent and a person who is a member of a terrorist group using a terrorist tactic and resulting in what is classic terrorist ways and means, two groups that have a history of exaclty that. Or are all of the klan lynchings and other killings fake news too?
=
The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
People shoot people all the time, and make no mistake, they aren't terrorists.
People run people over all the time, and make no mistake, they aren't terrorists.
You keep bleating on about terrorists but fail miserably to make anything remotely resembling a case that this is a terror attack.
Or are all of the klan lynchings and other killings fake news too?
Wait, this guy was in the klan? Sorry, that's a new claim, I hadn't encountered that one before.
Seems to me you're talking utter fucking nonsense. Is that a detraction? I'm not sure, it may just fall under justified abuse.
Don't you think it would be advisable not to give these creeps any more news coverage? It's too much and people are people. Some could decide that these nutwits are victims and worth considering joining their ranks. Just ignore them. Far from mind keeps them - far from mind. Easy.
"It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society." - Jiddu Krishnamurti
They're against nazis and other white pride types
So you're trying to argue they're protesting against one type of supremicism, but not others. Gee, seems to me that belonging to an ideology that's killed 80m people in the last 100 years vs less then 15m wouldn't be a great thing to promote, but what do I know.
Om, nomnomnom...
So you're trying to argue they're protesting against one type of supremicism, but not others.
You can be against nazis and at the same time be against other things. For instance, I don't like nazis but I also dislike peanut butter. Doesn't really fit on a banner though.
Gee, seems to me that belonging to an ideology that's killed 80m people in the last 100 years vs less then 15m wouldn't be a great thing to promote
First you argue that they must be anti white because you misread a banner. Now you argue that because they're anti-nazi they therefore must be pro-communism? Surely stupidity has killed more than 8M people?
but what do I know.
Indeed
What a rotten party, have we run out of beer or something?
free speech is for everyone who is not trying to whip up some genocide.
And posting nonsensical objections when called out for being a Nazi apologist makes you what?
Seriously, what the fuck is "the limited vocabulary of the left", and what, specifically did you see in the post that makes you think that AC's vocabulary is limited, much less "left-limited"?
This comment is my opinion and does not represent an official position of Donald Trump or others I do not work for