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European Parliament Votes in Favor of Controversial Copyright Laws (engadget.com)

The EU has voted on copyright reform, with members of European Parliament this time voting in favor of the extremely controversial Articles 11 and 13. The 438 to 226 vote, described as "the worst possible outcome" by some quarters, could have significant repercussions on the way we use the internet. From a report: The Copyright Directive, first proposed in 2016, is intended to bring the issue of copyright in line with the digital age. Articles 11 and 13 have caused particular controversy, with many heralding their adoption as the death of the internet. Article 11, also known as the "link tax", would require online platforms such as Google and Facebook to pay media companies to link to their content, while Article 13, the "upload filter", would force them to check all content uploaded to their sites and remove any copyrighted material. How this will affect regular internet users is still subject to debate, but it could seriously limit the variety of content available online -- and it could pretty much spell the end of memes.

Unsurprisingly, these parts of the bill have been met with opposition from digital rights groups, computer scientists, academics, platforms such as Wikipedia and even human rights groups. Supporters, however, say the consequences of the measures are being blown out of proportion, and that the provisions are merely intended to give creators and smaller outlets the opportunity to reclaim the value of their work.
More details on Reuters.

491 comments

  1. No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So this means no more shuffling copies of the same mass culture around? There won't be 10,000 copies of the same 200 songs being passed from peer to peer?

    How will we cope?!?

    1. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      You will get arrested and imprisoned for sharing works as old as Handel's Messiah or The Ode to Joy.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    2. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the Ode to Joy

      You mean the EU hymn?

    3. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      this only affects Facebook Google and other big thief, not end of internet. Internet is fine and will be fine, once google and all the cloud google optimization services would back off, we would have our interent back

    4. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Recordings of people performing said works. Write out the notes. Play them yourself. Hum them. Enjoy freely.

    5. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by Bongo · · Score: 1

      You will get arrested and imprisoned for sharing works as old as Handel's Messiah or The Ode to Joy.

      Ironic. Ode to Joy is the European Anthem.

      lah, la la la la la la la lalalala laa lalaah!

    6. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Donald Trump drank all my beer!!

    7. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fuck you, prole, that's why you can't have any music.

    8. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by rickb928 · · Score: 2

      As an aside, you aren't actually violating copyright for performing or even, with the permission of an artist, playing these works, they are long in the public domain.

      However, you are probably violating copyright if you perform or play any of several arrangements, as these are re-arranged regularly to be published anew.

      One of the quirks of public domain, if there's no financial reward to publishing it, then it is unlikely to be published. How much is a score for Ode to Joy worth? Such a great question, but of course it's never just *a* score, it's the entirety, at least what, 20 separate scores for orchestra. Me? I'd pay for Mahler's First, not so much for Mendelssohn, but that's just me.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    9. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Donald Trump grabbed his wife, by the cat!

    10. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Without google how would you find things? You plan to use Bing? lol.

    11. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      The public domain doesn't mean a single fucking thing when you have to defend yourself against Disney in a lawsuit - because they believe they own Cinderalla, Snow White, etc, etc, etc.

      All that matters is money.

    12. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They'll soon have to switch to Ode to Unemployment. :)

    13. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Now, with Google's automated copyright filters, this is not reliable anymore. Your videos can be taken down because your performance of the same work that is in the public domain sounds too similar to someone else's. No, the current regime isn't defensible anymore. Modern copyright is theft.

    14. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Umm DuckDuckGo works for 90% of daily searching.

    15. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by sittingnut · · Score: 3, Insightful

      ode to joy existed before eu and will exist long after the demise of that undemocratic bureaucratic authoritarian state with its out of touch unelected leaders.

    16. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      Yes, but a piece of music has more than one copyright. The musical notes are one copyright, and would indeed be long, long expired. But a specific performance if that music is it's own copyright. So if you want to actually share Ode to Joy, you need to either find a sufficiently old recording, or an orchestra which has performed the work and allows redistribution.

    17. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Which country has elected leaders in touch with their average citizens? I live in the US and I know we aren't an example of said country.

      Not sure about the EU but here, most our "leaders" are more primarily in touch with disproprionately (and often undeservingly) wealthy who contribute little-to-no value to society themselves, exploiting benefits of mass accumulated capital. Our "leaders" are looking at their own gains, not the country, not their constituents.

      As for "elected", it's pretty much a joke. Business marketing and manipulation strategies guide the mass uneducated vote here in the US where people rarely take any time at all to research running candidates. Whoever has the resources to put together the best ad campaign that appeals to the active voters wins, regardless of their true intent once elected.

      Let's not even pretend most would ever even consider running for office as an alternative. The payout at the beginning is so low and the high level game is controlled by big money, so you're figuring a losing battle and decided to become a martyr. It's a lose-lose game unless you start from the pockets of wealth first. Our government is a joke (now on display for the whole world to see), so I'd truly like to see a working democracy.

      Yes, it could be worse. It also could be a helluva lot better.

    18. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by BrianMarshall · · Score: 1

      Fuck 'em.

      --
      "When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro" -- HST
    19. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Which bits do you feel are unelected? The parliament is unelected. It elects the EU Commission President. The other body is the Council of Ministers of representatives from elected governments. In a number of cases the EU is arguably more democratic then its consistent nations.

    20. Re:No More Shuffling Around? by Cederic · · Score: 1

      No, this effects anybody that wants to post anything on the internet on any site, including their own shitty little one.

      It's a fucked up policy and hopefully the UK will leave the EU early enough to avoid this one.

    21. Re: No More Shuffling Around? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      DuckDuckGo will block news websites, too.

  2. Brexit by cirby · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...suddenly doesn't look quite so bad, does it?

    1. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      ... Except the UK is still bound by law and trade agreements to implement this... :P

    2. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Yes it does.

    3. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Brexit is irrelevant. Basically if you want to have a political or economic relationship with the EU, you will have to comply. That’s why this applies to Google and not just EUoogle or whatever.

      Just like GDPR, you have to get with the program no matter where you actually are.

    4. Re:Brexit by markdavis · · Score: 4, Insightful

      >"...suddenly doesn't look quite so bad, does it?"

      That is exactly what I was thinking.

      >summary: "with many heralding their adoption as the death of the internet."

      Well, no, but it might be the death of the "internet" in the EU. At some point they are going to go too far (this might be it) and companies will just give up and start blocking the EU and it will be like the great firewall of China, except in reverse. Then the EU can live in their own "digital utopia world" with as much censorship, manipulation, taxes, and control over information that they want.

    5. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dont tell me .... we will build our own internet just like the GPS system.

    6. Re:Brexit by stealth_finger · · Score: 5, Funny

      ...suddenly doesn't look quite so bad, does it?

      We get blue passports and memes, fucking hell yeah! Brexit is paying out big time :|

      --
      Wanna buy a shirt?
      https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
    7. Re:Brexit by rudy_wayne · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Then the EU can live in their own "digital utopia world" with as much censorship, manipulation, taxes, and control over information that they want.

      It's almost as if "be careful what you wish for" is pretty good advice.

    8. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Lol, you seriously think the people of the worst wannabe police state in western Europe, aka CCTVland, will get off any lighter? Amusing.

    9. Re:Brexit by alvinrod · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You might have more of a point if the UK weren't actively trying to clamp down on the internet in their own various ways.

    10. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >At some point they are going to go too far (this might be it) and companies will just give up and start blocking the EU

      GDPR has already gotten us halfway there, the fraction of US news sites that now hit me with a "Sorry, no Eurotrash" splash page is surprisingly high, and I've seen more than a few special interest / SME websites that have decided GSPR compliance isn't worth the effort.

    11. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      As a citizen of a EU member country, i hope all rest of the world stop serving EU members with any internet related stuff to show the assholes of these giant turd rules, that they can shove it.

      I won't be joining any EU sites and i won't accept these new fasist and impossible EU BS rules. What a bunch of ignorant fools. The god damn filter will never work correctly, that's for damn sure. Who the fuck is going to be updating the copyright filter with up to date contracts between different parties?

      I don't fucking understand how copyrights now trump everything else. These lunatic rules and laws and punishments jump the shark so high, that they are going over to moon. Worse crimes are being punished by diving under the shark.

    12. Re:Brexit by theM_xl · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You had a good comment, and then you just had to throw in that last sentence...

    13. Re:Brexit by froggyjojodaddy · · Score: 1

      Only if you are assuming the British Govt won't do an equivalent thing too.

    14. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "I'll be looking forward to collect the tears of memespouting racists and misogynists."

      Sorry, you'll have to pay a tax on that.

    15. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nope, because one of the parties pushing this initiative has been BPI (british phonographic industry) and british artists like Paul McCarthy. So even after Brexit, they will surely be able to bribe^H^H^H^H^H lobby Downingstreet 10.

    16. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      They were just trying to be like APK.

    17. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      The US doesn't follow EU law and they have trade agreements with the EU. What applies to business doing business in the EU does not also apply to separate sovereign nations.

    18. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its not the internets fault that your country does have too many idiots. Also, only state sanctioned thought is a good thing. War is peace.

    19. Re:Brexit by lucasnate1 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I don't fucking understand how copyrights now trump everything else

      Because the west bases more and more of its economy on intellectual property while the production of physical property is moved to the third world.

    20. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Translation... My fascist view of how the world should be doesn't hold up when debated openly. I am hoping we get censorship en mass so that my viewpoints are not questioned and debated. I am unable to win honest debates and am tired of it being pointed out that I resort to name calling and idiocy once I failed to make any intelligent arguments.

      I think that just about sums up the left these days. Thanks for your worthless input and letting us know you are all for a dictatorship and free ideas and democracy should be banned. Please keep your views to the EU and keep on letting the UK know brekexit was a GREAT idea.

    21. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      ...suddenly doesn't look quite so bad, does it?

      Yeah, what have the Romans ever done for us?

    22. Re:Brexit by lucasnate1 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      How is this law going to censor the nuts you are talking about? The only effect of this law will be to prevent small companies from opening interactive sites, reducing the internet gradually into television. The nuts will still have their place, because they bring eyeballs.

    23. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your whole comment can be summarized by saying that youâ(TM)re only okay with democracy and free thought when it goes your way. Youâ(TM)re just as must a fascist as the people youâ(TM)re complaining about.

    24. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The results will be that all European news outlets collapse. Google, Yandex, etc. will no longer link to them. New organizations elsewhere will get an influx of European visitors as they struggle to find any local news. American, Russian, etc. news organizations will start reporting on more European news. How this helps anything, only some dorks in the EU parliament know.

    25. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless, of course, you are a company run by greedy money-grubbing 'merkins, who just can't stand the thought of losing a few dollars.

      FTFY. You're welcome.

    26. Re:Brexit by anegg · · Score: 1

      Well, no, but it might be the death of the "internet" in the EU.

      Well, there were many in Europe who don't like the Internet, I guess. Those TCP/IP protocols with no proper respect for the ISO OSI network reference model. Now they can build an OSI protocol-based that fully realizes and respects the OSI model.

      They can build in all of the proper government controls and monitoring while they are at it. No more of this free-wheeling, practically anything goes communications. All hail the PTTs!

    27. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Well, no, but it might be the death of the "internet" in the EU. At some point they are going to go too far (this might be it) and companies will just give up and start blocking the EU and it will be like the great firewall of China, except in reverse. Then the EU can live in their own "digital utopia world" with as much censorship, manipulation, taxes, and control over information that they want.

      This is exactly what they want, something closer to the Chinese model (calm down everyone, I said closer to, not close to). Protectionism for the domestic internet services, like China has, so they can develop them internally. They've been going after the US tech companies for several years now because they cannot compete with them. They started by suing anyone who would hold still long enough to wring some money out and this is just the next step. I can't say I blame them. I still think the #1 problem is the tech salaries in the EU. Absolutely shockingly low. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad.

    28. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, because there are no Neo-Nazis in Germany since Germany banned it.

    29. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Every time I see FTFY, I translate that to "Fuck This, Fuck You".

    30. Re:Brexit by e3m4n · · Score: 1

      my prediction is google, facebook, twitter all get together and ban access for all members of eu parliament and their staff. So many people are so fucking addicted to social media at this point it wont be long till heads start exploding. Lets not forget how wording in legal documents have a way to get fucked up. By clicking 'like' on someone's post or picture, is that also considered 'linking'? Do they explicitly say it doesn't? because some lawyer probably can argue the sky is green and likely be convincing.

        This whole thing reeks of trying to protect the newspapers from going out of business. You know, the Arbiters of _their_ versions of stories they want to manipulate the masses into believing vs telling just the facts.

    31. Re:Brexit by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      and companies will just give up and start blocking the EU

      No reason to block the EU, if you don't have a physical presence there. It will, however, motivate internet companies to leave the EU. It will destroy a lot of internet businesses which are currently in the EU, too, and which can't survive a relocation.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    32. Re:Brexit by DarkOx · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I don't know if you are trolling, human garbage or just the typical deeply ignorant useful idiot. What you fail to understand is its the internationalists that harbor the deep hate, not those right-wing nuts. They might dislike one group or anther for whatever reason but they are NOT the authoritarians this time around.

      The Internationalists are! Step back and look objectively at the treatment by the major international bodies EU, UN, WTO etc of anyone who does not subscribe to their current secularist viewpoint, and anyone who believes that they might want to take care of their family and neighbors before considering themselves a world citizen. Why they will come down on them with tools of oppression that would have made the Nazi state blush. No they are not piling up the bodies yet but that is coming; rest assured. Its a major reason they are all gun grabbers. They know eventually good people will be forced into a corner defending their families or their faith and have no choice left to them but violent resistance and they want to make sure those people will lose.

      These international bodies are NOT different than the empires of old; they just bamboozle folks into thinking they are. The UN isnt about international cooperation its about one world government, a post national world. The EU is the same thing. When there are no-nations to stand up to the abuses of other nations you will have a single giant empire again like Rome and it will be oppressive! People who support this stuff are fighting to end their own freedom. (Well unless you are part of the ruling class; I suppose).

      Right now there is a lot of talk about voting rights and influencing elections the question you need to be asking yourself is once all this power is turned over to these international bodies will the elections matter at all? Seriously unless you are part of the POL/Money changer classes supporting international anything is aggressively stupid and against your interests.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    33. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually, I was wrong now that I think it about, it really doesn't. Don't mind me.

    34. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Donald Trump looked at me funny!!

    35. Re:Brexit by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      I haven't read any of the law/bill/proposal, but does it also include any services delivered to EU consumers? That would make sense for these socialists, to force this not only on EU publishers, etc, but on ISPs and consumers, so there is no way to permit content to be delivered no matter the source unless it's compliant, and thereby maximize the impact. After all, this is about making the world a better, more just place.

      All legislation is someone's morality.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    36. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not sure that ~30% of the eligible voting public is "the will of the people".

    37. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's time for the UK to just say no to the EU. What's the EU gonna do about it now? Kick them out faster?

    38. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "under the heals"

      Good thing medical care is free!

    39. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      More like "no court in the EU can touch this US non-profit legal entity" and they'd be right.

    40. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why do you care about the end? Why are we looking for PC purity? Someone who is wrong about one thing can be right about other things. Celebrate the things you can agree on. Tolerate that people can think differently on the things you cannot agree on.

    41. Re:Brexit by campuscodi · · Score: 1

      Except the UK already has an Internet blocklist in place... for years. Don't worry, they'll support this even after they leave.

    42. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes it does.

      Pantomime season isn't here just yet.

    43. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Great Firewall of Europe.

    44. Re:Brexit by Ol+Olsoc · · Score: 1

      >"...suddenly doesn't look quite so bad, does it?"

      That is exactly what I was thinking.

      >summary: "with many heralding their adoption as the death of the internet."

      Well, no, but it might be the death of the "internet" in the EU. At some point they are going to go too far (this might be it) and companies will just give up and start blocking the EU and it will be like the great firewall of China, except in reverse. Then the EU can live in their own "digital utopia world" with as much censorship, manipulation, taxes, and control over information that they want.

      While if the European Union wants to turn their internet into a latter day version of 1930 Germany''s Volksradio, for some reason they have the weird idea that they can force the rest of the world to appease their ideology.

      Meanwhile I will be implementing measures to block people from the EU from accessing my web pages, And serving notice that citizens of the EU are not welcome on my sites, and that if they use efforts to get around that blocking, that is their problem.

      --
      The shepherds did so well protecting the flock that the sheep no longer believed that wolves existed.
    45. Re:Brexit by rickb928 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Freedom's a bitch, ain't it? Being a European, sadly, you're losing your freedoms, such as they were, in the name of, well, what?

      Only the British have a significant history of seeking and defending freedom, the Magna Carta being the first great manifestation of that. And that's an indicator of why Brexit is a thing.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    46. Re:Brexit by MobyDisk · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I think that is a actually a registered Slashdot user. He goes around making these really insightful posts then ending them with an irrelevant anti-Semitic remark. I'm trying to search my post history because I know I've replied to him before. It exactly fits the pattern. I just can't seem to find the post. There is a part of me that wants to make a bot that re-posts his posts but without the last sentence. I bet it would get quite a lot of karma, and bring some of the intelligent points back into the conversation.

    47. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      He sounds a lot like the average liberal to me.

      I used to consider myself a liberal... then the entire frame shifted and suddenly being in favour of free speech and ensuring that even people I disagree with have a right to express their opinions... made me a raging white supremacist, racist, homophobe misogynist.

    48. Re:Brexit by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      heals. Ha, ha.

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    49. Re:Brexit by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      Look out behind you!

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    50. Re:Brexit by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      ...suddenly doesn't look quite so bad, does it?

      Given that EU proposals are up to member nations to implement Brexit still looks like taking a sledge hammer to a delicate item best served with a jewlers hammer.

      The result is already demonstrably worse for the UK than this (or any other) proposal is for the EU. Yes Brexit still looks every bit as shit, and won't look any less shit because of one crappy EU proposal.... especially given what the UK bureaucracy is able to come up with by itself.

    51. Re:Brexit by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      And the EU thanks you for the contract to produce those new passports.

    52. Re:Brexit by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      They won't. They will do far worse... errr already have done far worse. Their attempts to exert control over the internet have already earned them a long and detailed wikipedia page.
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

    53. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So you are *all for* the wrong thing.

      Laws clamping down on copyright do not do anything to curb fake news, hate speech or the likes of Trump.

      Think again.

    54. Re:Brexit by Rhipf · · Score: 1

      So you want people to have the right to live their own lives as they see fit but you don't want them to be able to vote for their own government representatives?

    55. Re:Brexit by prefec2 · · Score: 1

      There is no separate UK internet. You know? BTW the UK will most likely still implement these policies or even worse one. It is a neat trick by nationalists to tell us "Look over there in X they do Y. How shameless and bad. Better be Z and distance us from those in X" then they do "Y++" and the nationalists in Y use the same scheme. Don't let them trick you to become a prick. Instead fight totalitarian ideas wherever you are whenever you can.

    56. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't know what the voting numbers look like this vote, but last vote (when it failed) it had support from libertarians and conservatives. It was opposed by the left and the greens. It's hardly a "socialist" thing.

    57. Re:Brexit by PPH · · Score: 1

      There is no separate UK internet.

      Really? Try streaming Netflix in Germany. Or the BBC in the USA. Or watching a YouTube video in "your region".

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    58. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The results will be that all European news outlets collapse. Google, Yandex, etc. will no longer link to them. New organizations elsewhere will get an influx of European visitors as they struggle to find any local news. American, Russian, etc. news organizations will start reporting on more European news. How this helps anything, only some dorks in the EU parliament know.

      Wtf? American news outlets barely even report on American news. I have seen Fox, CNN, etc. and it mostly consists of a quick, edited soundbyte followed by partisan "infotainment". If you think that existing, much higher quality news outfits in Europe will be displaced by the crap you have in America, you are deluded.

    59. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The blocking of the EU has already started. I read Fark quite a lot, have done for years. Over the last few months it seems like a tenth of the headlines take me to sites that simply refuse to show me any content whatosever because I'm in the EU. Some of the FOX websites do this. Not the best example as that's not exactly a huge loss but they're not alone.

    60. Re:Brexit by PPH · · Score: 2

      Oi, mate. Ave you got a loicense for dat post?

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    61. Re:Brexit by phayes · · Score: 1

      We've already been cut off from many news site in the U.S. who saw little benefit and many potential downsides of conforming to the GPDR.

      Go to https://news.google.com/ because you want to see the american point of view on the news. Click on many articles and discover that we are locked out because the publisher (like the L.A Times) has deemed that readers from Europe aren't worth the effort.

      What will likely happen is that all the european sites like news.google.fr, news.google.sp, news.google.it, etc become less and less informative and unless one uses a VPN to escape to a freer part of the Internet, we will be walled away from information.

      --
      Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
    62. Re:Brexit by Thud457 · · Score: 1

      "link tax"

      Ted Nelson cackles maniacally why dialing his lawyer.

      --

      the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

    63. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This. Sieg heil! Sieg Heil! SIEG HEIL!

    64. Re:Brexit by oldmac31310 · · Score: 1

      What the hell are you talking about?

      --
      http://www.acetonestudio.com
    65. Re:Brexit by Z80a · · Score: 1

      Every right you take from a "nazi" is also taken from you.

    66. Re:Brexit by jwhyche · · Score: 3

      Just like GDPR, you have to get with the program no matter where you actually are.

      I assume that is the comment you are talking about. What is the issue with it? Pleading ignorance here.

      --
      I read at +2. If your post doesn't reach that level I will not see or respond to it.
    67. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you not aware of European history that you believe it is the model of the Internet that is giving rise to 'extreme right-wing nuts'? Oh, you mean comparable to Trump. Before, they were just compared to.. who exactly?

    68. Re:Brexit by AmiMoJo · · Score: 0

      Except that it's all complete bollocks.

      For example, the "link tax" is actually designed to stop companies like Google and Facebook having to pay for linking to stuff. It's the exact opposite of what the summary claims.

      A couple of EU countries did try a link tax - Germany and Spain. Google News pulled out for that reason, and it actually hurt publishers. The EU did a study, understood that the market had decided that it wasn't going to pay for links or snippets and decided to have an EU wide standard that allowed linking and snippets for free.

      This is good news because before you had to worry about which EU country you were operating in, but now you can be sure that your news aggregation site can operate anywhere in the EU without paying any licence fees.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    69. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Not sure that ~30% of the eligible voting public is "the will of the people".

      If they're more tan those voting against it, then yes. People in the eligible voting pool who don't vote are fine with whatever is decided by those who go to vote. If they cared either way, they should have voted themselves.

      Captcha: destroys

    70. Re:Brexit by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      This is another Euromyth, the latest in a long line that convinced people to vote for brexit against their own interests.

      Straight bananas, hair nets for fishermen, hard hays for tightrope walkers, mandatory small size condoms, a slop bucket in your kitchen, wine lakes, red passports, the list is endless and the "link tax" is just the latest one.

      What really worries me is how people keep falling for it after decades of debunking. Straight bananas was mid 90s and it was far from the first one.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    71. Re:Brexit by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      The sad things is we don't need to brexit for either of those things. Croatia has blue passports, we just picked red of our own free will because at the time no-one thought anything of it and that was the default colour.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    72. Re:Brexit by bazorg · · Score: 1

      I dunno, food insecurity because in the last 2 years nobody did anything about logistics capacity in UK ports looks pretty bad.

      If I have to choose between bad copyright laws with a full stomach, or good copyright laws on an empty stomach with a side of Theresa May's snooping charter... I think I'll go with bad copyright laws and hope to change them asap.

    73. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So you think Putin is going to claim copyright on all the fake news his employees spread, or how does what you say relate to the law in question?

    74. Re:Brexit by wyHunter · · Score: 1

      But the left wing nuts that have been running the bloc for so long are okay?

    75. Re: Brexit by wyHunter · · Score: 1

      Actually, I would claim he or she is more of a communist. Of course, fascism and communism are mostly the same thing.

    76. Re:Brexit by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      As an European I am all for it, because Wild West model of Internet currently in use gave us here rise of extreme right-wing nuts, comparable to Trump. Obviously, freedom on Internet looked nice in those times, when proffesors and students chat and shared some data on Usenet and FTP. Now, it is pretty much destroying democracy. Fsck all that and censor fake news to the ground, that is the priority, not movies and music, there is torrent for that. Real problem is millions of mindless internet-informed zombies in polling place.

      Translation: I really wished that either the communists, nazi's or fascists had won. I'm too damn stupid to think for myself, and need someone to tell me what to think. Filtering out, challenging my points of view? Real people know that the only truth comes from The Party! The Party knows best!

      ::screams:: in the distance as should_be_linear is dragged away for deviation from party guidelines::

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    77. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Only the British have a significant history of seeking and defending freedom

      Yes, they found quite a lot of it in India, Ireland and Africa, and did wonderful things with it. America could have benefitted from it too, but apparently they didn't like the tea they were sent.

    78. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That will be bad for their quarterly profit statements.

    79. Re:Brexit by Mashiki · · Score: 4, Informative

      Just read the law itself, it's the exact of what the summery states. The link's in that article and it also explains in small words that this is a link tax. It's an exact mirror of the existing German law that does the same thing.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    80. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      By "the west" you mean "a bunch of greedy mobsters who live in the west"

    81. Re:Brexit by skovnymfe · · Score: 1

      Smoke on the water. Fire in the sky!

    82. Re:Brexit by barc0001 · · Score: 1

      Are you having a giggle? Who's running the UK? Teresa May. The same Teresa May who has been for years looking to censor the living shit out of the Internet, track every user in the UK, and ban porn "because of the children":

      2017:
      https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/theresa-may-election-latest-internet-regulation-downing-street-speech-manifesto-a7783186.html
      2016:
      https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/theresa-may-prime-minister-privacy-mass-surveillance-snoopers-charter-attack-warning-a7133431.html
      2014:
      https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/11/government-public-case-surveillance-state-theresa-may

      I'd take the EU's crappy link bill over living in a digital East Germany any day.

    83. Re:Brexit by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Perhaps Britain's real failing - they did not grant the freedoms they coveted for themselves to those who they conquered...

      A common failing. In fact, many nations seem determined to impose on their subjects, domestic and foreign, the same oppression they impose on their citizens..

      And actually, we loved the tea. We sort of had a problem with being told to pay and pay and pay without benefit. Once this was understood as a lack of Common Sense, the solution was obvious.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    84. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No it doesn't, it really doesn't

    85. Re:Brexit by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Why link to a blog post when you can go to the precise details of the vote itself?

      http://www.europarl.europa.eu/...

      By the way, if you actually read that blog you will note that she mentions that there is in fact an exemption. It appears to be mis-worded and will likely be corrected in future, stating "individual words" rather than the proposed exemption for snippets: http://www.consilium.europa.eu...

      Which itself is based on this report that suggests an exemption is necessary because Germany and Spain tried forcing companies to licence snippets and it failed: http://www.europarl.europa.eu/...

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    86. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Philosophically, right wing nuts and authoritarianism are inextricable. Right wing views have always been driven by authoritarianism; this is an irrefutable fact that has been reinforced throughout history.

      Not excusing the authoritarian tendencies of the EU, but you make yourself look like an ahistorical fool by pretending the current far right wingnuts aren't 100% authoritarian.

    87. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'd like to see Facebook deleting all EU accounts, and see the outcome. There would be some unrest, which would be mercilessly put down by EURGENDFOR (the EU schutzstaffeln), then the rest of the populace would grumble a little bit and then march in lockstep to the dictates of the European Commission, as always.

    88. Re:Brexit by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      Here in the UK, our greatest economic movers are in the services sector. Costs here are too high for much manufacturing - there's some, but it's high-margin, low-volume goods only. We're a financial powerhouse though - most of it centered on London. And we've got a lot of technology companies which have their management and R&D in the UK, though any production is going to be elsewhere in the world.

    89. Re:Brexit by SuricouRaven · · Score: 1

      Two of them, actually. We've got one blocklist of sites blocked by court order - mostly torrent and streaming sites blocked for copyright infringement. There's also the IWF's super-secret blocklist of child pornography sites. For obvious reasons, that one isn't made available - but it also has zero accountability, as not even the operators of the blocked sites are informed that the site has been blocked, and many ISPs will spoof a 404 page in order to conceal the act of filtering.

    90. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Google, Facebook, et al, could make this interesting right now.

      They could make it mandatory to select an open license before uploading any content. This means that content owners must accept that anything they post is free to share or risk their major promotional avenues going dark.

      While a working automated content id system is the childish fantasy of those with little technical knowledge or experience, domain filtering is trivial. Search engines and social media could block links to all known news outlets unless they pay for the privilege of having their domains whitelisted. Oh, that sounds like extortion? Well, maybe they just shouldn't be linked at all and every search for a current event will take us to a Google owned property.

    91. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As a European, you're a Nazi so it's obvious you're all for it. You may claim you're not, but you're a Nazi. Europeans have always been a bunch of fascists who love authority and strong figures, and always will be. I'm glad mass migrations will eventually wipe out all the sad remains of European ethnicities and culture. They brought nothing but grief to the world.

    92. Re:Brexit by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Why link to a blog post when you can go to the precise details of the vote itself?

      Easy answer. You're fundamentally ignorant of what's going on around you, and need someone to hold your hand with an actual opinion of what it says, especially after your previous comment.

      It appears to be mis-worded and will likely be corrected in future, stating "individual words" rather than the proposed exemption for snippets

      Nope. Because they voted down an amendment that would have changed it. Go on keep reading.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    93. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Democracy cannot exist without freedom of speech and the ability for people to discuss any and all ideas. Freedom of speech exists precisely to protect the expression if ideas that are not popular. Progress can only happen if people are allowed to discuss the controversial. That means allowing the bad as well as the good. What might be considered bad today, might actually be tomorrow's better world.

    94. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As a Conservative, I believe in small government, personal responsibility and freedom of speech. It's the left that wants large, intrusive government, a nanny state with no personal responsibility and to silence anyone that does not agree with their agenda. If you look at the platforms of Progressives, Democratic Socialists and Antifa, they all dictate how one is allowed to think and put the power in the hands of the few.

    95. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You people have no sense of humor. This appears to have been a tongue-in-cheek joke in reference to the headline, "Eric Trump's ugly 'three extra shekels' attack on Bob Woodward draws accusations of anti-Semitism". Keep up!

    96. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am just amazed that with all the serious problems going on in the world today the EU has time and money to waste on this kind of shit. The leaders of world are not leading they are posturing and politicking to ensure that when everything crashes down they will be the ones standing on the top of the smoking ruins.
      So everyone has issues with their national governments but what do the proles in Europe do? They add a whole new governing body they have no power to deal with. It's like saying the government is bad and the solution is adding another governing body to take care of the problems. The EU has never lived up to what was intended. From the very beginning the US wanted Europe to form a cohesive military force to replace NATO. Actually the US was hoping to end the subsidizing the European militaries. The second reason for the EU was to create a cohesive economic pact which would help both the US and Europe. EU economic are dominated by 3 countries who treat the other countries as vassals. The EU has not fulfilled these two tasks. Russia would overrun Europe faster than Hitler if the US wasn't providing military protecting. And what has the US received in return for babysitting Europe for the last 60+ years? Nothing but contempt, insults, and animosity. And the EU economic strategy consists of shaking down successful foreign companies. Europe as asleep at the wheel during the personal computing and internet age so shaking down Google, Facebook, Twitter, and any other rich corporation is the only way the can profit.

    97. Re:Brexit by reboot246 · · Score: 1

      Do you even know what a merkin is? Google it and be surprised. And look at the images!

    98. Re:Brexit by theM_xl · · Score: 1

      Welcome to the problem of reading at +2. That is not, in fact, the comment I was talking about :)

    99. Re:Brexit by jwhyche · · Score: 2

      Yes. I found the post after you commented here. But I still don't know what GDPR means.

      --
      I read at +2. If your post doesn't reach that level I will not see or respond to it.
    100. Re:Brexit by theM_xl · · Score: 1

      General Data Protection Regulation, the EU directive about private information/cookies/etc. If your site is visible from the EU, congratulations you need to make sure it is compliant, even if you're in the US yourself.

      Mind you, typing GDRP into your preferred search engine would've cost less time than writing the comment :)

    101. Re:Brexit by MachineShedFred · · Score: 2

      If the voting public can't be fucked to show up and vote, it is not valid to include all of them in your statistic.

      This is as meaningless as when people whine about "winning the popular vote" in US Presidential elections, but losing the one metric that counts - the electoral college.

      Stop moving the goalposts, and just get people to actually give a shit and vote.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    102. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The voting public now is not the same as before, both literally and metaphorically. Some have died. Some have reached 18. That's the literal. And all have become more informed over the last few years. The result of the referendum is what is clear. That it is the will of the people is supposition

    103. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > moved to the third world.

      No, manufacturing has been leaving the U.S.A. for decades.

    104. Re:Brexit by PrimaryConsult · · Score: 1

      In the case of the most recent example of the US Electoral College, the winner of the popular vote did not win more than half the votes cast. If everyone were forced to vote, this effect would simply have been enhanced (as the third parties would serve as the spite vote / "none of the above").

    105. Re:Brexit by The+Cynical+Critic · · Score: 1

      Still looks kind of bad seeing how the U.K wants to stay in the common market and to do so has to continue ratifying EU laws like this.

      Sure, the U.K could leave the common market, but that's pretty much economic suicide for Britain. Not only is 40% of the U.K's exports into the common market, the common market is so much bigger and thus has so much more leverage than the U.K that any trade deals it has or is going to make will be much better than anything the U.K could negotiate on it's own.

      --
      "Why should I want to make anything up? Life's bad enough as it is without wanting to invent any more of it."
    106. Re:Brexit by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      It's an exact mirror of the existing German law that does the same thing.
      We don't have such a law in Germany, yet.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    107. Re:Brexit by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      I don't know anyone who reads "news.google.*" ... I did not even know that google has a "news service".

      But here it is: https://news.google.com/?hl=de...

      Interesting ...

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    108. Re: Brexit by MachineShedFred · · Score: 1

      You can make the same argument for every election ever. Does that mean that we should just declare all policies and office holders by weekly sampled tracking poll, or just for the stuff you don't like?

      Seriously, you sound like an idiot.

      --
      Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
    109. Re:Brexit by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      If your site is visible from the EU, congratulations you need to make sure it is compliant, even if you're in the US yourself.
      That is wrong.

      You only need to comply if you have a branch under european jurisdiction, a no brainer obviously.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    110. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      How did the uk mep voted?

    111. Re:Brexit by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      The vote was indeed to "please trash our economy".

    112. Re:Brexit by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      And remember, this applies to the copyrights owned by corporations. They don't care about copyrights owned by individual artists.

    113. Re:Brexit by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      "Too many idiots" probably applies to every country out there.

    114. Re:Brexit by theM_xl · · Score: 1

      From the GDPR FAQ:

      Who does the GDPR affect?
        The GDPR not only applies to organisations located within the EU but also applies to organisations located outside of the EU if they offer goods or services to, or monitor the behaviour of, EU data subjects. It applies to all companies processing and holding the personal data of data subjects residing in the European Union, regardless of the company’s location.

      The EU may not be able to cash the fine if you don't have a branch under European jurisdiction but don't expect them not to try to enforce it just because their law is stupid.

    115. Re:Brexit by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Note that the left vs right spectrum does not necessarily correlate to a liberal vs conservative spectrum. We often tend to conflate them together but that's only because people prefer simple ideas like us versus them, and not more complicated ideas.

      So you can be liberal and right wing. Most right wing economic policies are really neoliberalism. But when you start linking social politics together with economic politics, as in the US, you end up with a seriously messed up system. So politican A may agree with politician B with regards to banking policies but will still refuse to cooperate with each other on this issue because differing views on gay marriage.

    116. Re:Brexit by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Remember, the Magna Carta only applied to the aristocratic elites. Basically it was an agreement that the king at the top level couldn't push around those on the second level, but it didn't prohibit the the level twos from oppressing everyone below them.

    117. Re:Brexit by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      And then it started this whole freedom thing. When the Crown was denied the privilege/right to do whatever they wanted, then even the landed elites found their subjects/tenants demanding some rights also, and well it all went from there.

      It started somewhere. Mind you, several proletariat revolutions since then were not nearly so civilized...

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    118. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're going to pay for that link, right? Criminal

    119. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A fake accent? That's a non-Crime Hate Incident! Call the police!

    120. Re:Brexit by PPH · · Score: 1

      Push me and I'm going to say something about teeth.

      --
      Have gnu, will travel.
    121. Re:Brexit by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      Why do you cite a FAQ, when you could cite the law?
      So: no the EU has no way to fine a company that has no business in the EU. A no brainer.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    122. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We don't have such a law in Germany, yet.

      It's been on the books for 5 years, and every attempt at getting someone to pay has been refusal.

    123. Re: Brexit by prefec2 · · Score: 1

      This is just the same shit as regional DVDs. Classic content industry rubbish. When we talk about free speech and internet, these platforms have nothing to do with it and they are not affected by that regulation, except YouTube.

      This law can have a severe impact on public debate, as rightwingers could attack unwanted commentary.

      Also this was not my central argument. My central argument was do not point fingers at other countries and be happy how stupid they are, better help them, because eventually the same shit will happen where you life and then you might need those people help. Also if it works in A politicians try to apply that in their location.

    124. Re:Brexit by rastos1 · · Score: 1

      I don't get it. I assume that the "link tax" is covered by "Amendment 74 - Proposal for a directive - Article 11" which states:

      Article 11
      Protection of press publications concerning digital uses
      1. Member States shall provide publishers of press publications with the rights provided for in Article 2 and Article 3(2) of Directive 2001/29/EC so that they may obtain fair and proportionate remuneration for the digital use of their press publications by information society service providers.

      The bold part is the proposed change. I understand that as "information society service providers" (for example a blogger ?) should pay for use of material of the copyright holders (i.e. press publications). Aside from the vague definition of terms, that seems to be fair enough.

      Subsequently then in it says:

      2a. The rights referred to in paragraph 1 shall not extend to acts of hyperlinking.

      How is that a "link tax" if it explicitly says that hyperlinking does not constitute "digital use" of copyrighted material?

    125. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Left wing nuts are driven by authoritarianism too.

      You've obviously not noticed this.

      I find it particularly amusing at the moment - as the EU is trying to sanction and disenfranchise Hungary and Poland for not bowing to the demands of the totalitarians in the EU.

      What Euromaniacs don't understand - mainly because they have no knowledge or understanding of history - is that Hungary and Poland recognise authoritarians when they see them - whether it's under the cover of left or right. Both countries suffered under the nazis and both suffered under the soviets.

      Horseshoe theory ain't far off. Anyone who can't see the current left wing in the west as anything other than authoritarian pricks who want to control what anyone says/does is simply stupid.

    126. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No more general elections... The people spoke in 2017!

    127. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There are GEs every few years. EU membership votes twice a decade, perhaps, to cover the changing electorate?

    128. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Many on the left do not want a large and intrusive government either and campaign against government intrusion, and in fact seem to be the majority in this effort.

    129. Re:Brexit by phayes · · Score: 1

      You didn't know ?!? Typing "news" in google has given the google news site forever and while there used to be separate news.google.tld sites they all map unto https://news.google.com/ with the arguments ?hl=$LANG&gl=$LANG&ceid=$LANG. Given how the younger generations type EVERYTHING into the URL bar (including complete URLs) & that's sent to google, it's clear that anyone typing "news" into a browser that uses Google for search, the vast majority of people looking for news are going to news.google.com.

      Thus news.google.com is how much of the world looks up their news & is the #1 target of the media conglomerates that lobbied the EP into passing the libertycide regulations TFA, the EFF, etc are denouncing.

      Interesting that you are from Germany, The legislation passed is an attempt at keeping you from changing your news source.

      --
      Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
    130. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Arguably it was the Black Death that started this, due to Iabour having greater power.

    131. Re: Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you or have you ever been a Beatle?

    132. Re:Brexit by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Yes. I found the post after you commented here. But I still don't know what GDPR means.

      ... Did you not use Slashdot for the entire months of April and May?

    133. Re:Brexit by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      I never typed "news" into the search bar.
      When I want to read news I go to a newspaper or search for news containing the topic of interest.

      Interesting that you are from Germany, The legislation passed is an attempt at keeping you from changing your news source.

      I have not really a news source ... I read stuff like spiegel.de, sueddeutsche.de, https://www.bangkokpost.com/
        or /. obviously. Sometimes wired or http://www.silicon.com/ or http://thefutureofthings.com/

      If those new rules wont be changed, I guess it will backfire heavily.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    134. Re:Brexit by Cederic · · Score: 1

      I'll take economic suicide over political suicide.

      As it happens the EU trade deals aren't great for the UK as they accommodate the diverse needs of many nations, rather than allowing a focus on things that will benefit the UK. So while the EU have more leverage, the UK has greater focus.

      So I'm not worried that it's economic suicide either.

    135. Re:Brexit by phayes · · Score: 1

      The way people use the internet has changed -- especially for younger people.

      Most people used to use a homepage like Yahoo or MSN. Some, like you, went directly to the web versions of their real-life information sources.

      People today grew up using Google for everything: Google is their home page. If they want the weather, they google "weather". If they want news, they google "news". They won't even paste an URL into the address bar they paste it into google & then click on the google link.

      So, yeah, If the EU's (I'm french btw so I'm not throwing any shade), dumb rules to appease the media conglomerates go all the way to enforcement, everyone who uses google as a source will no longer see the news sources that want google to pay to excerpt them. When Google is no longer driving any people to their web sites, it'll backfire on the conglomerates who will soon be lobbying for laws to _force_ Google to use & then pay them.

      --
      Democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding what to have for lunch. Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the issue
    136. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The power is not in U.S. news outlets, but U.S. news aggregators.

    137. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Nah.

      They'll do surgical deletions, esp. the accounts of the people who voted for this in the EU. If any member country votes this into law, too, then the supporting parliamentarians' accounts on Google and Facebook will also be affected. Then they'll go after the accounts of music publishers who signed a petition supporting this.

    138. Re:Brexit by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I haven't read any of the law/bill/proposal, but does it also include any services delivered to EU consumers? That would make sense for these socialists, to force this not only on EU publishers, etc, but on ISPs and consumers, so there is no way to permit content to be delivered no matter the source unless it's compliant, and thereby maximize the impact. After all, this is about making the world a better, more just place.

      All legislation is someone's morality.

      how is this socialism? It is actually the opposite since it is protectionism for IP ie: businesses that own IP -

    139. Re: Brexit by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      It's the government that assumes the role of both judge and enforcer, it seems to me. They merely (merely) compel media to censor according to their intentions...

      Actually this is more like fascism, you're maybe correct, it's not simple socialism...

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
  3. Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It also marks the day where the EU finally succumbed to the power of the copyright lobby and became a nest of utter corruption just like their US counterparts.

    It's not the end, but it's definitely the beginning of the end of democracy, a truly sad milestone.

    1. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It also marks the day where the EU finally succumbed to the power of the copyright lobby and became a nest of utter corruption just like their US counterparts.

      Are you kidding? The copyright lobby and their insane demands started in Europe. The US managed to avoid their madness for a long time and didn't implement the Berne convention until 1989. One particularly evil aspect of the Berne convention was the removal of the requirement for copyright registration.

    2. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, I'm not kidding. At no time in the past, at least not since the breakthrough of democracy, has the legislation in Europe been so obviously corrupted and put well being of a special interest group above any and all other things.

      Presumably this was because most of Europe have proportional election systems with several alternatives to pick from and plenty of opportunity to punish politicians who were too obviously on the take. The EU has done away with this link, and there is little to no accountability, just like in the US. Rather predictably, corruption has soared for some time but this is a milestone.

      It may be that the copyright lobby comes from Europe, but that's more related to it simply being older here, and that the US simply stood a lot to gain from simply ignoring it from the start. The wholesale, institutional corruption from lack of accountability and "soft" money is very much an American import from the last few decades.

    3. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Presumably this was because most of Europe have proportional election systems with several alternatives to pick from and plenty of opportunity to punish politicians who were too obviously on the take.

      The proportional election system in Europe does the opposite: it allows parties to shield politicians from the voters; meaning, powerful party figures who have fallen out of favor with voters are simply moved from a direct mandate to a party position.

      Furthermore, the parliamentary system in Europe has resulted in numerous extremists and dictators taking over, foremost Hitler; people like that have no chance under the US system.

      And European governments are far more under the control of large corporations than the US government.

    4. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Furthermore, the parliamentary system in Europe has resulted in numerous extremists and dictators taking over, foremost Hitler; people like that have no chance under the US system.

      And European governments are far more under the control of large corporations than the US government.

      You mean like President Pussy Grabber, who has rather pro-Authoritarian and Nationalist stance? I'm sure he'd like to don the purple.

    5. Re:Not only the death of Internet by AHuxley · · Score: 1

      AC in the USA you still have the freedom to use the internet, link and talk about links.

      --
      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    6. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hasn't every president in the history of the US grabbed some pussy in their time? They've had no gay men or straight women in the position yet, right?

      There are tons of reasons to dislike the man, but him liking to grab some pussy is hardly one of them.

    7. Re:Not only the death of Internet by dryeo · · Score: 2

      Meanwhile Trump is pushing a bunch of IP bullshit in NAFTA including forcing Canada to take down sites based on the say so of private companies along with extending copyright. Then there is the patent shit that they're mostly hiding to make sure the drug companies continue to have increasing profits.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    8. Re:Not only the death of Internet by dryeo · · Score: 0

      Once the American Supreme Court is arranged right, extremists and dictators will be Constitutional, probably in the name of national security just like how so many other rights don't matter if there's a national security reason to ignore them.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    9. Re:Not only the death of Internet by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      "plenty of opportunity to punish politicians who were too obviously on the take. "

      Ah, all politicians are 'on the take'.

      You probably want them to be 'on the take' from YOU. They are probably NOT.

      Failing that, you hope they are 'on the take' from whatever philosophy you find most appealing or least offensive and damaging. Sadly, they are most likely not, but can be scared into not being so damned awful at the ballot box. Assuming it's not rigged, deceived, or muted by clever processes, like proportional election when you're actually choosing one thing.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    10. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, yes, very insightful. That's why there basically are two parties in both the US and the UK, which are all basically 100% beholden to their sponsors and gives fuck-all about what the common man thinks. How could I be so stupid as to think that voting on a different party with a realistic chance of it actually meaning something could have any effect!?

      I must be hallucinating about all these minor parties which are very influential on the lower levels that we have here... (No, they aren't a thing on the national level, because they a) generally have no national agenda and b) they do not have the resources for that, but that's beside the point.)

      How about you shut up about things you apparently know nothing about, great expert?

    11. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Zorpheus · · Score: 1

      You have Trump in the US. It looks likea joke when you tell us that European election systems allow worse people to get in power.
      In many countries no single person could even get as much power as he got, nowadays.

    12. Re:Not only the death of Internet by thegarbz · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Furthermore, the parliamentary system in Europe has resulted in numerous extremists and dictators taking over, foremost Hitler; people like that have no chance under the US system.

      ahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahha

    13. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      You probably want them to be 'on the take' from YOU.

      No, not at all. I want a minimalist government, one so small and with so few resources that it isn't worth bribing politicians.

    14. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Once the American Supreme Court is arranged right, extremists and dictators will be Constitutional,

      SCOTUS has been a tool for abuse of executive power under progressive presidents, starting with FDR. Fortunately, that development seems to have been halted for now at least.

    15. Re:Not only the death of Internet by rickb928 · · Score: 1

      Ditto, but that's the take from YOU.

      And of course this requires constant vigilance.

      --
      deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
    16. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      In many countries no single person could even get as much power as he got, nowadays.

      The power of European prime ministers spans the executive and legislative branch. Trump only controls the executive branch, and even there his powers are checked.

      It looks likea joke when you tell us that European election systems allow worse people to get in power.

      That's merely a reflection of your ignorance.

    17. Re:Not only the death of Internet by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Both sides do it. The 1st does not say Congress will only abridge freedom of speech for these reasons, with reasons varying from national security, through protecting the children and stopping smut and the 2nd doesn't say that the right to bear arms will only be infringed for this list of people, where the list includes felons, potential felons, people who can't pass background checks as well as various government controlled places such as court rooms, and other government operated places.
      Those are just the most straight forward parts of the Bill of Rights, then we can get into what reasonable is, what cruel and unusual is and so on.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    18. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Falconnan · · Score: 1

      No chance in the US? You're joking, right? Almost all of our local and state elections, and absolutely all of our Federal elections, are "first-past-the-post", which translates to "winner-takes-all". The Separation of Powers reduces the risk, certainly. However, our Legislative branch has been happy to cede power to the Executive. We are slow-rolling to monarchy. I don't care if I voted for the current POTUS or not, I don't want that much power in one person's hands.

      As for control by the corporations, you might wish to reconsider. Studies have been done, and in the US there is almost no chance of any law with popular support happening if the large corporate interests oppose it. The opposite cannot be said to be true.

    19. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Considering that Canada's priorities seem to be womens issues, and payments to natives as a core component of NAFTA? I'm perfectly fine with Trump crashing it so fucking hard that the Liberal Party of Canada won't exist by next year.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    20. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Green+Mountain+Bot · · Score: 2

      One particularly evil aspect of the Berne convention was the removal of the requirement for copyright registration.

      That's not evil at all - that's a very good thing. It allows artists to control their copyrights without needing to spend their time navigating bureaucracy. It's one of the few changes in copyright law that has been beneficial for the people who create at those who would exploit them by removing obstacles to ownership of their material.

      If you want to talk about indefinite copyright being a major issue, I'm right there with you. But anything that allows creative people to keep their creations for a reasonable length of time is a good thing.

    21. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Zorpheus · · Score: 1

      In which country? As far as I know legislative power is with the parliaments only. They usually have less power than theUD president, e.g. they can't impose tariffs, or do anything with international treaties. They also need the parliament's approval to go to war.

    22. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sorry, you are just making things up.

    23. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Spoken like someone who have never used a proportional voting system, nor understands it.

      Local parties are a thing were I live, they are all sprung out of people being seriously unhappy with the established parties. Several of them actually are not only quite influential in their respective region, but actually have ousted the established players from power. If we hadn't had a proportional system, but a "winner takes it all" one, we'd be stuck with the corrupted established parties. But people get pissed off, and the established parties gets voted out instead of being allowed to dictate who we are allowed to vote for.

      Hard concept to grasp for an American, just like the leaders for our established parties, I understand, but there it is.

    24. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      n which country? As far as I know legislative power is with the parliaments only.

      Legislative power is with parliament only, but the prime minister usually also controls their party and is a member of parliament. That's different in the US.

      They usually have less power than theUD president, e.g. they can't impose tariffs, or do anything with international treaties. They also need the parliament's approval to go to war.

      Pretty much the same as in the US.

    25. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, *anything* is way out of line. That's the speech of an extremist and a dictatorship worshiper. Sometimes you have to accept that the battle is lost and move on, you can't stop progress.

      This legislation is a horrific example of that, not only throwing the baby out with the bathwater, but killing it in the process to appease a bunch of particularly greedy money-grubbers who would rather burn the world than forsake their "right" to double or tripple-dip, at the expense of everyone else.

      It's just plain evil. If universally implemented it will kill not only sites like Wikipedia and Slashdot, but the very point of the Internet, the sharing of information. Having a discussion? Want to make a point by linking to an article? Verboten, unless you pay up. Partaking in an event, and wanting to share the experience? Same thing. It's actively killing informed discussions and debate, it's outright anti-democratic. All so these greedy fucks and their brown-tongued lackeys can get a bit richer, or so they hope.

    26. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      No chance in the US? You're joking, right? Almost all of our local and state elections, and absolutely all of our Federal elections, are "first-past-the-post", which translates to "winner-takes-all".

      That means that about half of voters need to actually approve of a candidate, while under a parliamenteray system, someone like Hitler can get into power through coalition making.

      As for control by the corporations, you might wish to reconsider. Studies have been done, and in the US there is almost no chance of any law with popular support happening if the large corporate interests oppose it.

      I know those studies, they are bullshit, and you don't have a baseline from Europe anyway.

    27. Re:Not only the death of Internet by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      The US has a presidential system where it comes down to a choice of two candidates, so the idea that Hitler could never happen when the last election gave you the option of either Hilary Clinton or Donald Trump is clearly wishful thinking.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    28. Re:Not only the death of Internet by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      So how come the EU took away the link tax and made snippets explicitly free from copyright claims, meaning that the copyright industry can't try to collect licence fees for things like news aggregators?

      That doesn't sound like the work of the copyright lobby.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    29. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Both sides do it.

      There are more than two sides. The side I'm on is that of limited government; Democrats universally reject it, and most Republicans obviously do too.

    30. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Laugh if you like, but Europe descended into fascism and socialism and Europeans murdered many millions of people and dragged the world into two world wars. The US throughout its history committed no crimes that are even remotely comparable.

    31. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      The matter isn't settled yet, and within the EU, there are competing corporate interests that have different policy preferences.

    32. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      The US has a presidential system where it comes down to a choice of two candidates, so the idea that Hitler could never happen when the last election gave you the option of either Hilary Clinton or Donald Trump is clearly wishful thinking.

      Can you explain how a choice between Clinton and Trump amounts to "Hitler is just around the corner"?

    33. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Considering that Canada's priorities seem to be womens issues, and payments to natives as a core component of NAFTA?

      Doesn't seem that way to me. This article listed like 10 things Canada is focused on. Sure women and natives are part of those 10 things, but that's what it is: they're just parts of a larger whole.

      Are you one of those SJWs who gets triggered if something isn't completely ideologically pure and align to your pet peeves 100%?

      I'm perfectly fine with Trump crashing it so fucking hard that the Liberal Party of Canada won't exist by next year.

      You're perfectly fine with putting your own pride and ideological bickering before the country's well being? You'd rather Canada gets bad deal so many of its poor and working people suffer, just so you can spite your ideological enemies (who probably won't suffer that much, because you know, they're ivory tower elitists with plenty of money and connections to whether the storm)?

    34. Re:Not only the death of Internet by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 1

      You probably want them to be 'on the take' from YOU. They are probably NOT.

      Why shouldn't they be? Politicians should put the people's interests first (and perhaps it should be the only interests they take into considerations). Yes, CEOs and shareholders are people too, and the public in general benefits from healthy commerce and healthy corporations. But businesses should only be kept healthy for the sake of people's interests, not for their own sake.

      That is very much a problem with commissioners and MEPs in Europe: corporate lobbyists certainly have their ear, and whatever stuff they are being fed by those lobbyists is not well balanced - by public advocacy groups or by their own conscience - against the interests of the public at large. This law is proof of that. By the way, I fully expected this thing to pass. It is almost always the case when a law gets sent back by parliament, and is resubmitted again after a few changes. Hell, that's what they did with our so called constitution.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    35. Re:Not only the death of Internet by JaredOfEuropa · · Score: 1

      Dunno about other countries, but over here (NL) the PM most certainly isn't an MP. The PM and other ministers are generally (but not necessarily) selected from the newly elected MPs, but after they form a government they leave parliament, and people further down the lists of their respective parties fill the vacancies. Since one of the more important roles of parliament is to oversee and audit the business of government, it would be weird to have government be part of that.

      --
      If construction was anything like programming, an incorrectly fitted lock would bring down the entire building...
    36. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Europe ascended into fascism from absolute monarchy, a step the American continent took in another age where weapons were not nearly as devastating, and the populations much smaller. Huge changes in society are rarely bloodless. The devastating wars were probably as necessary as they were regrettable in order to crush the old order.

      The US on the other hand, currently seems to be looking for ways to descend into fascism from a dubious democratic status; not much to brag about.

      Besides, socialism is not a crime, just like being christian isn't. It's what people do in the name of it that constitutes the crimes; just like what's done in the name of capitalism, even if capitalists usually try to hide their real motives for their atrocities behind various smokescreens, like "freedom", "socialism", or "terrorism".

      As for your comment of the US being innocent of everything, the only thing that comment does is further putting the spotlight on your ignorance.

    37. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Zorpheus · · Score: 1

      Merkel also isn't head of the paye party anymore. But her party follows get more than I like. They just do this to stay in power though, the party could vote her out of office any time.
      Trump cancelled the Iran agreement and imposed lots of tariffs on the world without any consultation of the parliament. I don't think this is possible anywhere in theEU. And he is the head of the military, I don't know if this is the case anywhere in the EU. And are you sure he can't just declare war? I thought he could. He can even just launch a nuclear strike.

    38. Re:Not only the death of Internet by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      You were given a choice between a crook/populist and a very unpopular candidate. You picked the one who promised a Muslim ban, is trying to build a wall to keep foreigners who he accuses of being criminals out, and who locks children in cages.

      And what's more, he didn't even win a majority of the votes.

      At which point Nazis thought they were winning so hard they could openly march in Charlottesville. Fortunately they were wrong, but don't pretend you don't have a president whose former close adviser is Steve Bannon and who refused to condemn those people.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    39. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And European governments are far more under the control of large corporations than the US government.

      Is that why the EU has given consumers and workers much better rights than anywhere else in the world? And is that also why the EU slaps hefty fines on domestic and foreign corporations left and right all the time?

      I think you're ill-informed, my friend.

    40. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Merkel also isn't head of the paye party anymore.

      I didn't say that she was party leader, I said that prime ministers have a lot of control over the party.

      Trump cancelled the Iran agreement and imposed lots of tariffs on the world without any consultation of the parliament.

      Yes, retaliatory tariffs under a law created by Congress, not an inherent function of the executive.

      And are you sure he can't just declare war? I thought he could. He can even just launch a nuclear strike.

      Congress has given the president broad freedoms for military action, but the power ultimately still rests with Congress.

    41. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      You picked the one who promised a Muslim ban, is trying to build a wall to keep foreigners who he accuses of being criminals out, and who locks children in cages.

      So your complaint about Trump is that he tries to enforce US immigration laws?

      At which point Nazis thought they were winning so hard they could openly march in Charlottesville.

      Neo-Nazis walk openly on German streets all the time. In some German towns, you can't safely walk on the street if you are a minority or homosexual. And Germany has actual communists in parliament. Germany has extremely high levels of hate crimes, and the German government ignored murders by neo-Nazis for years. People who sit in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

    42. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      And all of that amounts to a stronger separation of powers than in the US... how?

    43. Re:Not only the death of Internet by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      We aren't talking about Germany, we are talking about the US. You will note that simply enacting laws is something fascists hide behind often.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    44. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      This is what we are talking about: Furthermore, the parliamentary system in Europe has resulted in numerous extremists and dictators taking over, foremost Hitler; people like that have no chance under the US system.

      The complete self-destruction of the Weimar Republic and widespread political extremism in Germany make Germany a poster child for the failure of European parliamentary systems.

    45. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Trump only has a lot of power if you don't understand how the US federal government works and misunderstand how much power he has. I'll give you a hint, not much when compared to the other two branches. The wall will never be built unless congress approves it because all government spending must be approved by congress. He cannot create new laws, he can only choose to not enforce already existing laws. The president is the single most powerful person in the US government, yes, but when compared to the total power of the US government, he wields a very small percentage of it. The terrifyingly powerful branch is the Judiciary, but people never talk about that one.

    46. Re:Not only the death of Internet by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Except that Germany has a strong, stable and moderate government that is in no danger of turning fascistic.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    47. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Except that Germany has a strong, stable and moderate government that is in no danger of turning fascistic.

      Well, it certainly is strong! Stable? Have you slept through the last few years?

      Whether it's "moderate" is in the eye of the beholder, but on social and religious issues, Merkel and her party are to the right of most Republicans.

      And it was the predecessor of the CDU/CSU that cast the deciding votes making Hitler dictator of Germany. That's the kind of government Germany has.

    48. Re:Not only the death of Internet by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      Oh I know my history. I am just laughing that you think this has anything to do with the political system at play and even more so that you think that you are immune to it.

    49. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Depending on just what you call "madness":

      > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Term_Extension_Act

      "Following the Copyright Act of 1976, copyright would last for the life of the author plus 50 years, or 75 years for a work of corporate authorship. The 1976 Act also increased the extension term for works copyrighted before 1978 that had not already entered the public domain from 28 years to 47 years, giving a total term of 75 years.[2]"

      captcha: retail

    50. Re:Not only the death of Internet by PrimaryConsult · · Score: 1

      The vaccine against totalitarian dictators is private gun ownership. Unfortunately 1.25 of our 2 major political parties are anti-vaxxers in this regard...

    51. Re:Not only the death of Internet by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Merkel has been chancellor since 2005. That sounds pretty stable.

      Right of most republicans? Have you noticed how progressive Germany is on things like LGBT rights and socialized healthcare?

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    52. Re:Not only the death of Internet by balbeir · · Score: 1
      Keep telling yourself that.

      You're not going to get far with you pea-shooters if things get really serious.

    53. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Oh I know my history. I am just laughing that you think this has anything to do with the political system at play and even more so that you think that you are immune to it.

      So you're saying that "descending into fascism and socialism and Europeans murdering many millions of people and dragging the world into two world wars" has nothing to do with the political system at play?

      Do tell what you think it has to do with then!

    54. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Right of most republicans? Have you noticed how progressive Germany is on things like LGBT rights

      You mean the country that widely discriminated against homosexuals for most of the 20th century and trailed years behind the US in most of its important gay rights legislation? A country that for years had government-financed priests preach against homosexuality? Is that what you mean by "progressive"?

      and socialized healthcare?

      You mean its privately run two-tier healthcare system, a system with strict limits on abortion, strong religious exemptions, and strong cost controls? A system without anything like Medicare/Medicaid? Conservatives and libertarians would love such a system in the US (I certainly would), but it would be far too right wing to even be considered in Congress.

    55. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      We're not talking about consensual activities, but the sort of pussy grabbing that would get the average person a stern talking to by the police and a good chance on getting on the sex offender list for life.

    56. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      SCOTUS has been a tool of encroaching executive power under presidents of BOTH parties. Stop being partisan and believing that your particular team is more righteous than the other team.

    57. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      The executive in the US is not elected by the citizens but by electors. The real power should lie with congress to which we vote for our representatives. However power has been shifting towards the executive for most of my life, and congress has not done much to prevent this. Thus the biggest power now lies with person generally elected by the political parties rather than the people. The electoral college doesn't even have the same balance as congress.

      The two most populous states actually have a lesser effect on choosing the president than many small states. That's because the two most populous states lean a solid 55% one way or the other and so are "safe" electoral votes that are taken for granted; compaigning in those states is only done for the purpose of fund raising from the party faithful and never to sway the undecided or moderate voters.

      If you want your presidential vote to matter you'd do better to live in Iowa or New Hampshire, rather than in California or Texas where the vote is irrelevant. If you want to change this situation however, you need to start paying attention to voting for good congress members rather than only showing up to vote for president and leaving everything else blank.

    58. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      SCOTUS has been a tool of encroaching executive power under presidents of BOTH parties

      Really? Care to put some meat behind that statement? It seems to have been primarily progressive jurists and progressive presidents who have tried to expand executive power.

      top being partisan and believing that your particular team is more righteous than the other team.

      My "team" is classical liberals, and the other "team" is progressives and democratic socialists. Yes, I certainly do believe that my team is more righteous than the other team.

    59. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      The real power should lie with congress to which we vote for our representatives

      I disagree. The power of the federal government should be strictly limited, and what little there is should be split between the three branches of government.

      The two most populous states actually have a lesser effect on choosing the president than many small states

      Yes, as intended.

      If you want to change this situation however, you need to start paying attention to voting for good congress members rather than only showing up to vote for president and leaving everything else blank.

      I'm certainly voting for representatives who stand for shrinking the federal government and devolving power back to the states. If they strip the president of some powers along the way, all the better, although I don't see that as the primary problem.

    60. Re:Not only the death of Internet by dryeo · · Score: 1

      How do you keep limited government? There's always wealthy people who want big government to do whatever agenda they have, usually making more money by tilting the playing field.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    61. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 2

      How do you keep limited government? There's always wealthy people who want big government to do whatever agenda they have, usually making more money by tilting the playing field.

      Wealthy people don't elect our president or representatives, the middle class does because only the middle class has the votes. So, we get smaller government when the middle class decides that it is in their interest. For the last half century, the American middle class has been propagandized and manipulated into believing that big government is in their interest, but more and more people are realizing that the American dream they were sold by government was a fraud, and new technologies makes it easy to undermine the old institutions and corrupt arrangements. That's why corporations like the NYT, institutions like public schools, and politicians like Clinton and McCain are bitching and whining.

    62. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Spoken like someone who have never used a proportional voting system, nor understands it.

      Well, as an emigrant from Europe, I grew up with it.

      If we hadn't had a proportional system, but a "winner takes it all" one, we'd be stuck with the corrupted established parties

      Yes, Europe gets newly corrupted parties all the time, complete with communists, fascists, racists, and kleptocrats moving into parliament.

      You can see how well that works from Mussolini to Hitler to the GDR.

      Hard concept to grasp for an American, just like the leaders for our established parties, I understand, but there it is.

      Not hard to grasp at all. What is hard to grasp is that after centuries of that folly, Europeans persist in it.

    63. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Politicians should put the people's interests first (and perhaps it should be the only interests they take into considerations) ... the interests of the public at large.

      Yup, that's the fascist view of the world. As you demonstrate, Europeans are so steeped in fascist and authoritarian thinking that the only workable alternative, an actual liberal government, doesn't even occur to them as a possibility.

    64. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Is that why the EU has given consumers and workers much better rights than anywhere else in the world? And is that also why the EU slaps hefty fines on domestic and foreign corporations left and right all the time?

      Oh, you are so cute believing that EU regulations on the curvature of bananas, laws that keep people from getting fired, or massive fines against Google make your life better.

    65. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      I must be hallucinating about all these minor parties which are very influential on the lower levels that we have here...

      You aren't hallucinating at all: European parliaments are full of socialist, fascist, communist, and nationalist splinter parties, and they indeed have a disproportionate influence on politics.

      One of the most prominent ones historically was the NSDAP, which managed to come to power as a minority party, because the more moderate voters were split amongst half a dozen other parties.

      In a US-like two party system, moderate voters in the Weimar Republic would have been forced to switch between the Christian Conservatives and the Social Democrats, the NSDAP would have remained a footnote in history, and tens of millions of people would not have lost their lives.

    66. Re:Not only the death of Internet by dryeo · · Score: 2

      Wealthy people pick the candidates and finance their campaigns. While in theory you are right about the voters deciding, in practice it doesn't seem to work that way and you end up with billionaire Presidents that pretend to care and a Congress full of millionaires that everyone hates but they keep getting re-elected.
      As you say, there is also a lot of propaganda to get people to vote a certain way and to consider only a limited number of choices. Look at how few votes the other parties got last election even though both candidates were horrible.
      Small government is a good thing to strive for, but it is going to be quite an uphill battle and as the media is owned by the rich and the internet is getting more locked down (lack of network neutrality, copyright laws that allow sites to be knocked off the internet just by accusing them of breaking copyright are two examples), it is going to get harder and harder.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    67. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Wealthy people pick the candidates and finance their campaigns.

      More importantly, they also finance the newspapers and TV stations that promote these candidates. But those old mechanisms are breaking down. Hillary didn't manage to get elected despite her massive funding and massive support from billionaires and corporations.

      and the internet is getting more locked down (lack of network neutrality

      You seriously think that the internet being controlled by the FCC and regulated as a public utility would have removed it from government and political control?

      In reality, net neutrality was a convenient alliance between big corporations (Google, Netflix, etc.) who wanted to keep their operating costs down, and an FCC and federal government that has been chomping at the bit to impose content and other controls on the Internet just like they did for other FCC-regulated media. Net neutrality is a nice example in which the enemies of liberty and small government pretend that their policies serve to safeguard liberty.

    68. Re:Not only the death of Internet by dryeo · · Score: 1

      I think that ISP's being free to block any site they feel like is not going to work out for the best. Everyone talks about fast lanes and ISP's double dipping but the real danger is the ISP's just not allowing connectivity to any sites they don't like. If people can't load your site that talks about small government, well, good luck in pushing the agenda.
      Myself, I have exactly one choice to get on the internet, its a scary bottleneck.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    69. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      I think that ISP's being free to block any site they feel like is not going to work out for the best. Everyone talks about fast lanes and ISP's double dipping but the real danger is the ISP's just not allowing connectivity to any sites they don't like.

      Just like supermarkets not carrying products they don't like, bookstores carrying books they don't like, etc. This tends to be self-limiting.

      Myself, I have exactly one choice to get on the internet, its a scary bottleneck.

      In most of the US you have at least cable and DSL, a couple of wireless providers, and satellite. If you have substantially less than that, you must have chosen to live very far out. Furthermore, the small number of local wired providers is usually the result of local government restrictions; your local government can certainly make unrestricted, unfiltered access a condition of letting companies put cables in the ground. None of that should require FCC control over the Internet to address.

    70. Re:Not only the death of Internet by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Mountains make all the difference. satellite behind a mountain, most cell towers behind mountains and households spread out enough that running wires is not profitable and even the phone wires aren't much better then rusty barbed wire.

      Just like supermarkets not carrying products they don't like, bookstores carrying books they don't like, etc. This tends to be self-limiting.

      Unluckily internet is a lot more capital intensive then a supermarket or bookstore, so it is not simple to just go to a different provider. And just like it seems there are only a few supermarket operators, there are only a few ISP's and they keep merging. It's a flaw with capitalism, businesses grow by absorbing the competition and competition is part of what makes a market work.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    71. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Equal power is fine. Right now the executive holds more than congress. I didn't mean congress should have all the power but it should be at least equal the presidency.

    72. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Mountains make all the difference. satellite behind a mountain, most cell towers behind mountains and households spread out enough that running wires is not profitable and even the phone wires aren't much better then rusty barbed wire.

      Well, you have a choice where you live. I certainly checked Internet availability every time before I have rented or bought a house. With 90% of American households having two or more providers at >10 Mbps, it also doesn't seem to be a widespread problem.

      It's a flaw with capitalism, businesses grow by absorbing the competition and competition is part of what makes a market work.

      That's no flaw with capitalism, it's a benefit (economies of scale). And it's a myth that you need more than one provider for a competitive market.

      there are only a few ISP's and they keep merging

      You get many providers only if there is a possibility for product differentiation. In particular, if we were to impose net neutrality, there would be no product differentiation and you'd be pretty much guaranteed that there would fewer and fewer ISPs in every market.

    73. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Equal power is fine. Right now the executive holds more than congress. I didn't mean congress should have all the power but it should be at least equal the presidency.

      I have no idea why you believe that the executive holds more power than Congress. The abuses of executive power we have seen with the last half dozen or so presidents have been silently tolerated by Congress; Congress could have stopped them any time they liked with a simple vote.

      In fact, since Congress has the power to impeach, it really has the ultimate power over the president.

    74. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Congress has essentially granted more power because they don't push back against the executive when they could. For instance, they allow the president to essentially start military actions without a formal declaration of war. and those inevitably end up being full blown wars as the escalate. Congress is granted power in the constitution to impose tariffs and make foreign trade deals, yet they passed some laws that allowed the executive to do that starting around the great depression era. That was generally a good thing in that it improved free trade, but it's sort of backfiring now that Trump wants to put tariffs back in place and undo trade agreements. Presidents have also declared which parts of laws they will or will not obey (signing statements), and as well executive orders are often treated as having force of law, meaning that the executive is effectively enacting legislation. While I like the effects of DACA, it certainly was a side stepping around the duty of congress to enact that as legislation; but Obama didn't decide he could do this all on his own, instead he built upon a precedent from past presidents.

      Congress seems to forget that there's a revolving door in the White House, so that they love giving a president from their own party more power but then are dismayed when someone they disagree with inevitably gets into office.

    75. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      https://tech.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=12604372&cid=57298626

      History. Read it. Understand it. Try to understand what the people of the day were thinking, how they were thinking, where they came from, and where their parents came from from a historical, geographical and social standpoint, and what their experiences were.

      You're lacking so much context and generalizing so much you'll never get it right as it is.

    76. Re:Not only the death of Internet by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Congress has essentially granted more power because they don't push back against the executive when they could. For instance, they allow the president to essentially start military actions without a formal declaration of war. and those inevitably end up being full blown wars as the escalate.

      So then Congress actually holds the power, they just choose not to exercise it. That's why we say that Congress delegates these powers, it doesn't (and cannot) "grant" them.

      Congress seems to forget that there's a revolving door in the White House, so that they love giving a president from their own party more power but then are dismayed when someone they disagree with inevitably gets into office.

      That explanation doesn't make sense, since Congress could easily limit presidential power if someone they don't like is president.

    77. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I didn't ask for further proof that you're an idiot but you did provide it when you brought up the banana curvature myth. Real things include e.g. working time regulations which significantly improved the lives of doctors in the UK (but we shall see what happens...). What other deterrent than fines do you propose against corporations that break the law? Laws which protect consumers, I should add.

      I have tangibly observed that the EU improves the lives of its citizens and all you do is speak vague bullshit. Why am I not surprised that you don't have any real arguments?

    78. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Cederic · · Score: 1

      If you have evidence of serious sexual assault I'm pretty confident there are certain members of the FBI that would love to hear from you.

      What was that? No evidence? Libel much?

    79. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Hmm, what? How is this relevant. Trump spoke on tape claiming to do this. I didn't say he actually did this, though I would be inclined to belive so. I am not attempting to get Trump arrested and not claiming he committed a crime. I'm merely responding to the post that claimed all presidents go out and grab pussy and therefore if Trump had done this it's not something to criticize him over. I'm disagreeing and claiming this is most certainly not normal activity and not legal activity and bragging about doing this is a clear sign of major moral failings. Even just bragging about grabbing someone's genitals when you didn't do it is still a moral lapse.

      I have no compulsions about libeling the president, but I did no such thing in that post.

    80. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Cederic · · Score: 1

      . I am not attempting to get Trump arrested and not claiming he committed a crime.

      So wait. You're not claiming he did anything illegal, but

      this is most certainly not normal activity and not legal activity

      you're saying that what he did is not legal.

      I don't think you understand what you're claiming.

    81. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't think McCain is complaining anymore but your point is well taken.

    82. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      I'm saying that bragging that he did an illegal act is not illegal.

    83. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Cederic · · Score: 1

      You're only assuming that the act he was bragging about was illegal.

      As I said, if you have evidence, throw it to the FBI. No rush, I can wait.

    84. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure the act he was bragging about was grabbing a woman's person without her permission. And last I checked that was illegal. I don't know why you keep mentiongint the FBI. I never said I have evidence he did that, only that Trump himself claimed to do this. Not sure why the FBI would care about a misdemeanor either.

    85. Re:Not only the death of Internet by Falconnan · · Score: 1

      The intent of the Founding Fathers was that the Legislative Branch be the most powerful because it would be the slowest to act. The most important of these, however, was that the nature of the Legislature would guarantee it be the most deliberative and divided. This would prevent it from being too overwhelmingly of one voice, and tending to keep it a bit centrist. And while this hasn't worked out perfectly, it lacks the dramatic lurching nature of the Executive branch.

      The Executive branch was envisioned as primarily related to foreign affairs, but the veto power significantly beefed up the domestic powers as well. The ideas there were more complicated. We need to be able to react quickly and decisively to world events, hence a unitary executive. The veto power was intended to prevent a runaway legislature, just in case (because mob mentalities can occur in Congress).

      The biggest cession of power that has happened is related to use of the military, as presidents were not supposed to have the power to commit the nation to war. That there is no clause stating that military action not pre-approved by Congress can only be defensive in nature and solidly enforced is problematic. But of course, one would need to define "defensive".

  4. Comment removed due to license infringment. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As per the Articles 11 and 13 of EU law, this comment was removed.

    1. Re:Comment removed due to license infringment. by Cmdln+Daco · · Score: 0

      Next time say something original.

    2. Re:Comment removed due to license infringment. by NettiWelho · · Score: 2

      Next time say something original.

      You're saying that like you didn't know big companies regularly steal content from smaller outlets and then file copyright claims against the original creator

    3. Re:Comment removed due to license infringment. by unrtst · · Score: 1

      Your post should also be removed for copyright infringement: https://www.google.com/search?...

    4. Re:Comment removed due to license infringment. by chefren · · Score: 1

      Only works can be copyrighted. It's not like someone spent hours of creative effort coming up with the original "Next time say something original" phrase, therefore it does not qualify.

    5. Re:Comment removed due to license infringment. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      His post clearly falls under fair use. Good try, though.

    6. Re:Comment removed due to license infringment. by Cederic · · Score: 1

      Lucky you if you have the time, funds and energy to go to court to prove it.

      Trust me, the way copyrights are abused on existing platforms gives me no fucking faith that a law like this wouldn't be abused at least as badly.

      Shit, the EU are mandating illegal material gets taken down in an hour. Good fucking luck proving your comment isn't illegal inside an hour, assuming the ISP or website even lets you know they're removing it.

      The EU has seriously fucked up views of IP and it's going to lead to them completely losing control of the internet when they clamp down so hard everybody switches to less governable technologies.

  5. Oh please... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    1. Re:Oh please... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      To be fair, they already didn't sign part of the EHRC (the part banning debtor prisons, for one).

    2. Re:Oh please... by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      Yes, because the UK without kind-mother-EU to guide them will surely just begin to throw out all their human rights laws.

      Of all the arguments for staying in the EU, this has to be the most absurdly ridiculous one yet.

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    3. Re:Oh please... by lgw · · Score: 1

      The British Empire did a solid job of protecting the rights of citizens. Subjects, not so much. Be wary of any governmental body that acts as if you were a subject, not a citizen.

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    4. Re:Oh please... by LynnwoodRooster · · Score: 2

      And ignore the Spanish Empire, the French Empire, the German "troubles" (times two), Portuguese expansion, Italian expansion, etc... Yeppers, it's just those bloody brits who were terrible!

      --
      Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
    5. Re:Oh please... by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Uh, I said let's not get into whataboutism. Was that unclear to you? Also, most of those were also-rans compared to the British by any reasonable measurement.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    6. Re:Oh please... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The British Empire denied millions of people their human rights before anyone talked about human rights. The british government now give 'human rights'[ to rapists, murderers etc without thinking about the victims of their crimes. Sorry to be an AC but I'm not at home so not logged in.

    7. Re:Oh please... by Felix+Da+Rat · · Score: 1

      Since you decided to 'set aside whataboutism' - please tell me what culture you believe has a sterling record on Human Rights? Which you think come even close to that of the British Empire?

      While I object to the means used; the means were the standard in those times, but the ends were not. The ends wrought by the British Empire have exceeded those of almost any other culture you can point to, and I suspect will exceed in providing human rights to the greatest number vs any culture you can point to.

      And taking your other point - remember the British Empire - which did more:
      * To abolish slavery in the world than any other civilization has in it's past
      * Has brought more nations and human beings out of poverty than any other civilization on a world scale
      * Has done more to advance science over religion around the world than any other culture in history.

      So 'To be fair' - tell me what nation has done more good for human rights in this world than the British Empire - or the USA - which was brought forth from Britian.

    8. Re: Oh please... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      EHCR is nothing to do with the EU, and predates EU and EEC. You are confusing it with the ECJ.

    9. Re:Oh please... by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      So 'To be fair' - tell me what nation has done more good for human rights in this world than the British Empire - or the USA - which was brought forth from Britian.

      The USA wasn't "brought forth from" Britain, the USA fought for and won its independence from Britain. I know that Britain is still a bit touchy about having its ass whooped by an upstart, but there's no reason to mince words.

      Britain also did more TO all of those countries than any other nation except perhaps the USA. They don't get a medal for partially cleaning up their messes.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  6. Worse possible outcome by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    them how come they all voted for it?

    1. Re:Worse possible outcome by theM_xl · · Score: 1

      Because graft gets punished less the higher you're up.

  7. You surrendered your guns, now what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Your shity socialist leaders have taken it upon themselves to do something that isn't in your interest and undermines the very fabric of democracy. While I won't hold my breath that people in the US fare much better or would even do anything even with there guns at least they have not entirely surrendered power to those who will ultimately use it against us all. This is the danger socialists pose to society and any other right wing nut jobs that want to press there morals, values, and beliefs onto others for nonviolent acts. No law should ever be valid without there being a victim of violence. As otherwise we end up giving bad people power to do shit like this.

    1. Re:You surrendered your guns, now what? by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      No worries. The people shall write a harshly-worded letter to the EU leadership detailing their grievances! And, if necessary, follow it up with a very harshly-worded letter!

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    2. Re:You surrendered your guns, now what? by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure you can point out how having a gun would change anything.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    3. Re: You surrendered your guns, now what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Correction, fascist leaders. Socialism is about putting welfare of the people before the interests of business. Fascism is where government works for the business and people are just the cattle to be used as the business sees fit. Both EU and US put business first...and so do most of other countries. We are heading back to feudal like system where top class is above the law and the rest of us are just plebs fighting for the crumbs and even the entertainment served to us to distract us is now a tool for the top class to squeeze more wealth out of us. Best we can hope for is to die before the world becomes too much to bear.

    4. Re:You surrendered your guns, now what? by Mashiki · · Score: 1

      I'm pretty sure you can point out how having a gun would change anything.

      In the same way that lords at one time feared the armed mob dragging them out, finding a tree and grabbing some rope. I understand France did a much better job with guillotines, and guns did tip that in the favor of the reformers.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    5. Re:You surrendered your guns, now what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In the same way that lords at one time feared the armed mob dragging them out, finding a tree and grabbing some rope.

      Except the mobs back in the day didn't have any god given right to bear arms either. They just stole weapons if they needed them, in the same way determined criminals are still able to procure guns despite gun control.

      I understand France did a much better job with guillotines, and guns did tip that in the favor of the reformers.

      As above, the French didn't have a 2nd amendment either. They just stole weapons if they needed them. Another thing is that during times of unrest, some of the military may defect to the side of the people. That's another way to get weapons for the rebellion without giving the people some constitutional protected right to weapons.

      In short, the lesson from history isn't that we need to preserve guns to protect liberty. Rather, it's the opposite: that it doesn't matter how much we restrict guns. If things ever get so bad that the people are determined to rebel, they'll find guns somehow, no matter how hard you try to keep guns away from them.

    6. Re: You surrendered your guns, now what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The reason that is possible is explicitly because people think they can make government good or get something from it. They can't. The 2nd you start permitting laws be passed that have no victim nor involve violent acts you open the flood gates to tyranny. Those with social and political objectives should not be able to usurp the masses wealth or freedom for the objective of solving different social and non-violence related problems. This is why I am a principled libertarian and not a libertarian, democrat, republican, socialist, "democratic" socialist, or believe in any other political philosophy. It's not that I want to see the poor people suffer. I just don't want to be ruled over in the process of helping people out of poverty or suffer from insanely inefficient systems for getting people out of poverty.

    7. Re:You surrendered your guns, now what? by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      You might notice that the French didn't have the right to bear arms back then either. Neither did the Russians in 1917. What happened in both cases was that they were SO pissed that they didn't give a fuck whether they were shot, they simply stole some guns and the soldiers refused to fire at their own people. Neither had anything to do with the right to have arms. If anything, Russia was before WW1 a brutal dictatorship where as much as thinking you could possibly consider having weapons was a capital offense.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  8. About that whole copyright thing by bobstreo · · Score: 1

    Everything created (at least in the US) unless released under something like creative commons is copyrighted automatically. Everything.

    Books, stories, articles, video, music...

    1. Re:About that whole copyright thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Can GitHub even exist in this brave new world?

    2. Re:About that whole copyright thing by dwywit · · Score: 2

      The general approach is that once you have put your idea in material form, you automatically have copyright over "that particular expression" of that idea. No problem there. Creators deserve a chance to exploit their creations.

      The stupidity of current practice as lobbied for by large conglomerates however.........

      --
      They sentenced me to twenty years of boredom
    3. Re:About that whole copyright thing by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      GitHub may have problems operating in Europe, but it can certainly operate in the US.

      And subversive European developers can connect to it from Europe, at least until Europe follows in the footsteps of China and implements its own Great Firewall.

    4. Re:About that whole copyright thing by ooloorie · · Score: 2

      The general approach is that once you have put your idea in material form, you automatically have copyright over "that particular expression" of that idea. No problem there.

      That is actually a huge problem. In the US, it used to be the case that you only got a copyright if you registered it with the government. That created legal clarity. The crappy system we have now is the result of bad European copyright legislation.

      Creators deserve a chance to exploit their creations.

      The justification for copyright in the US is purely utilitarian. In any case, "creators" had that right under US law before adoption of the Berne convention.

    5. Re:About that whole copyright thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless you're talking about this shit, the it only requires a byline and a date to give copyright protections...

    6. Re:About that whole copyright thing by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Actually github and wikipedia are explicitly exempted from this directive being in the non-profit encycloperdia and opens source software development categories.

      Article two gives the definition of "Online content sharing service provider", which identifies the subjects who must abide to most of the articles in the directive. In particular only subjects in this category need to respect Article 13. (the one about checking for copyrighted uploads)

      The definition has explicit exclusion for such entities. Quoting from the text of the directive, article 2, comma 5, second paragraph:

      Providers of services such as non-for-profit online encyclopaedias, non-for-profit educational and scientific repositories, non-for-profit open source software developing platforms, as well as internet access service providers, online marketplaces and providers of cloud services which allow users, including businesses for their internal purposes, to upload content for their own use shall not be considered online content sharing service providers within the meaning of this Directive;

      As a side note this would not exempt wikipedia or github from removing copyrighted material uploaded to them after the fact when informed by the copyright holders. This, in fact, has always been the case.

    7. Re:About that whole copyright thing by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      The crappy system we have now is the result of bad European copyright legislation.
      Hae?

      What is crappy there? You create something, you have the "copyright", why the funk would you want me to register my creation somewhere?

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    8. Re:About that whole copyright thing by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      Why would github have any trouble operating in Europe? Or connecting to European users?

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    9. Re:About that whole copyright thing by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      As I pointed out, it shouldn't have any trouble, even with these new laws.

    10. Re:About that whole copyright thing by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      What is crappy there? You create something, you have the "copyright", why the funk would you want me to register my creation somewhere?

      Because the purpose of copyright is to help society and create works that eventually go into the public domain. Registering creates legal certainty and ensures that works actually go into the public domain when their copyright expires. Registering was very simple: you just sent your works to the Library of Congress with a tiny fee.

      The Berne convention was largely a power grab by European publishers and privileged elites.

    11. Re:About that whole copyright thing by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      But under the old systems creators had a very good chance to expolit their creations as well. All that they had to do was to declare that they wanted copyright on their works, it did not require an overload of paperwork. There was no practical reason for the change to make this automatic.

    12. Re:About that whole copyright thing by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Because now you're required to do the extra work if you don't want copyright and instead you want to share with the world. Not everything is worthy of copyrighting, such as my letters I wrote in college to my family.

    13. Re:About that whole copyright thing by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      Because the purpose of copyright is to help society and create works that eventually go into the public domain.
      In the US ...

      The Berne convention was largely a power grab by European publishers and privileged elites.
      No it was not. It was a way to let the US aknowledge that European creators have copyrights, too!
      So the US copyright pirates could no longer exploit the creations of other countries citizens!

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    14. Re:About that whole copyright thing by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      No it was not. It was a way to let the US aknowledge that European creators have copyrights, too!

      Given that the US didn't join the Berne convention until 1988, until 100 years after it was created, that makes no sense.

      So the US copyright pirates could no longer exploit the creations of other countries citizens!

      What profound irony then that by the time the US joined the Berne convention, most of the valuable copyrighted works come out of the US, with very little of international relevance being created in continental Europe.

    15. Re:About that whole copyright thing by angel'o'sphere · · Score: 1

      Given that the US didn't join the Berne convention until 1988, until 100 years after it was created, that makes no sense.
      Before that the US had bilateral agreements with individual countries.

      most of the valuable copyrighted works come out of the US,
      By what metric?

      The US dwarfs the rest of the world by every metric, except perhaps in making money from copyright works like showing american movies in Europe.
      As soon as it comes to music or books the US is close to insignificant.

      --
      Cost free eBook I read (by iBook/Kobo/Amazon/ObookO/Gutenberg etc.): "The Green Odyssey" by Philip Jose Farmer.
    16. Re:About that whole copyright thing by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Before that the US had bilateral agreements with individual countries.

      You said "[The Berne convention] was a way to let the US aknowledge that European creators have copyrights, too!". Obviously not if the US only joined it in 1989.

      As soon as it comes to music or books the US is close to insignificant.

      The US and China are the top two book publishers in the world, and US books get exported around the globe.

      What books or music of international significance has continental Europe produced recently? As far as I'm concerned, continental Europe has become a cultural wasteland. It's not even worth going to Europe for theater or opera anymore because even the performances are bad.

  9. It will still apply to UK by aepervius · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Until Brexit all laws voted apply to UK. And if you think for a SECOND that the UK government will remove that particular one post-brexit, when they will be lobbied left and right to keep it by content holder, I have a bridge to sell you in London. Cheap.

    --
    C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
    visit randi.org
    1. Re:It will still apply to UK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      This isn't a law yet. It is a Directive. Each member state must implement it via their own laws into their legal system. Most member states take their time in doing so with directives. I doubt the UK will be in a hurry passing such a law before BREXIT.

    2. Re:It will still apply to UK by elrous0 · · Score: 1

      When it comes to Brexit, the UK government is like the car I had back in university: forever stalling.

      --
      SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    3. Re:It will still apply to UK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      We already bought one.
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Bridge_(Lake_Havasu_City)

    4. Re:It will still apply to UK by Joce640k · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That's not a bad thing when the only roads lead you off a cliff.

      --
      No sig today...
    5. Re: It will still apply to UK by Dripdry · · Score: 1

      Oh I do so hope it's the one that's falling down!

      --
      -
    6. Re:It will still apply to UK by mjwx · · Score: 1

      Until Brexit all laws voted apply to UK. And if you think for a SECOND that the UK government will remove that particular one post-brexit, when they will be lobbied left and right to keep it by content holder, I have a bridge to sell you in London. Cheap.

      This.

      If you want to see madness coming out of a parliament in Europe, look no further than Whitehall.

      My take on this is that it will become yet another EC regulation that isn't at all enforceable because the internet does not operate solely within the EEC. Just a bit of legislation that has been passed at the behest of some special interest group or another that no-one will bother enforcing.

      Meanwhile the coming economic disaster that is Brexit will mean that Britons wont have enough money to have the luxury of worrying about what European laws we do or don't keep. The Tories will fiddle whilst London burns.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
    7. Re:It will still apply to UK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The Leavers have been asked time and time again to provide their own solutions to the difficulties faced during negotiations, but amazingly, they don't have any. None at all. After deciding to leave, and after years to think about it, they still haven't got the faintest idea at all how we should go about it, it's all a fantastical pipe dream with absolutely no grounding in reality.

      The closest we've got to touching base with reality by the Leavers is "crash out with a hard Brexit, because thinking is hard"

    8. Re:It will still apply to UK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      aepervius offered:

      p>Until Brexit all laws voted apply to UK. And if you think for a SECOND that the UK government will remove that particular one post-brexit, when they will be lobbied left and right to keep it by content holder, I have a bridge to sell you in London. Cheap.

      Is it the Tower Bridge?

      Please say it's the Tower Bridge! It'll make such a nice bookend with that one in Arizona ... !

      (Posting as AC only so as not to undo prior upmods in this thread.)

      --

      Check out my novel ...

    9. Re:It will still apply to UK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      This isn't a law yet. It is a Directive. Each member state must implement it via their own laws into their legal system. Most member states take their time in doing so with directives. I doubt the UK will be in a hurry passing such a law before BREXIT.

      And so far some member states are already disregarding it. Sweden, for example, doesn't appear to have any intention of implementing it at all given how their MPs voted.

    10. Re:It will still apply to UK by The+Cynical+Critic · · Score: 1

      It's not just stuff the U.K has ratified pre-Brexit, because the U.K wants to stay in the EU common market they have to keep ratifying EU laws like this even after leaving the EU itself. Brexit with staying in the common market really is one of those things where there's little practical change apart from no longer having much of a say in what laws the EU passes apart from trying to lobby other member states and members of the EU parliament to vote one way or the other.

      As for leaving the common market, that's practically economic suicide as not only is about 40% of the U.K's exports to other common market countries, that have to negotiate as a single common market block, the common market block has way more leverage and can thus negotiate way better trade deals than the U.K can ever hope to negotiate on it's own.

      --
      "Why should I want to make anything up? Life's bad enough as it is without wanting to invent any more of it."
    11. Re:It will still apply to UK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And if you think for a SECOND that the UK government will remove that particular one post-brexit,

      They will remove it almost instantly to align themselves with the North American market.

      Contrary to the present wisdom that the EU is better off seeing them fall off a cliff, there WERE in fact significant benefits to allowing the UK into the fold. Thatcherite and class ridden as they are, the British (outside N. Ireland) do not suffer from the diseases of authoritarianism or oppression to anywhere near the extent of continental Europeans. Their presence did curb the worst excesses of the central European mandarins, albiet at the expense of the usual anglo-american economic derangements.

      Now that the english are one, there is nothing standing between the French, German's, etc and their usual contempt for the citizenry. You still have to carry ID cards in their countries. The english capitalist might pissed on you from his Bently, but at least he didn't ask for your papers please.

      I give it 5 years before the EU embarks on creating a segregated version of Internet, for no other reason than they cannot imagine not controlling it.

    12. Re:It will still apply to UK by F.Ultra · · Score: 1

      It's not even a directive yet. It have to pass the European Commission first.

    13. Re:It will still apply to UK by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      The Brexiteers best plan for exit so far is to have no plan at all. Cut the offending limb off first and then hunt around for a tourniquet after. And they bitterly criticize those politicians who are attempting to gracefully perform the difficult task of amputation.

      Much of the entire reason for the existence of the EU is to provide stability in Europe which previously had been the focal point of two world wars and countless perennial local wars. Now that peace within Europe has broken out it seems the brexiteers are now disgruntled. That's why they want a fast exit with no plan, because they do not consider Europe to be their friends and neighbors.

      The UK is an identical twin of America in this aspect - they want to be an isolated land where they can ignore that fact that people exist on the other side of the walls.

    14. Re:It will still apply to UK by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There will be a trilogue, whereby the European Parliament, the European Commission (the executive), and the European Council (heads/members/representatives of governments) will have a go at it. If it's based on consensus at all, then I hope at least one European Council member will vote it down.

  10. Who cares they hate Trump so they're PERFECT! by CajunArson · · Score: 0, Funny

    If I've learned one thing, it's that as long as you hate Trump you literally are a super-being of pure energy descended from a higher plane of existence and anybody who criticizes you is automatically evil fascist filth.

    So given Europe's superior Trump-hating attitude, this must be a perfect law! Stop being fascists by disagreeing with people who have the politically correct anti-Trump emotional reaction!

    --
    AntiFA: An abbreviation for Anti First Amendment.
    1. Re: Who cares they hate Trump so they're PERFECT! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My favorite part about being Antifascist is that I've now got the MORAL power to silence my opponent when I disagree with their stance

      It's ok when I do it, because I'm ANTI fascist, it's right there in the title

    2. Re: Who cares they hate Trump so they're PERFECT! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, that is the model that the anti fascist army 'the allies' circa 1940s operated under. They just silenced fascists permanently and with extreme prejudice. It's as American as NASCAR.

  11. big deal by ooloorie · · Score: 1

    could have significant repercussions on the way we use the internet

    I'm not sure what "repercussions" restrictions on European content is supposed to have for "us" in the US; it's not like there is a lot of interesting content coming out of Europe.

    Unsurprisingly, these parts of the bill have been met with opposition from digital rights groups, computer scientists, academics, platforms such as Wikipedia and even human rights groups.

    A bunch of hypocrites.

    1. Re:big deal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If Google has to pay to link to EU sites, the obvious answer is that EU sites just fell off of google.

      If your income depends on google linking to your site, and you have copyrighted material on your site-- you're screwed.

    2. Re:big deal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL if you don't think that we won't immediately update our copyright laws to match. First off, because we've done it before, and secondly, because The Mouse is about to enter the public domain, so we're due for a new copyright extension act, and might as well kill two birds with one Act.

    3. Re:big deal by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      If Google has to pay to link to EU sites, the obvious answer is that EU sites just fell off of google.

      Yes, and how is this a problem? You can't read The Guardian anymore?

      If your income depends on google linking to your site, and you have copyrighted material on your site-- you're screwed.

      Large publishers and government media in Europe won't have a problem, so Europe is going to kill a lot of its small and medium sized online publishers; sites like Facebook and Twitter will experience severe restrictions in Europe. All of that is bad for Europeans, both politically and economically, but I don't see any significant effect on the US.

    4. Re:big deal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      LOL if you don't think that we won't immediately update our copyright laws to match

      It took many decades for the US to adopt the Berne convention. And as the non-election of Hillary and the disgust for mainstream media shows, Americans aren't as easily pushed around as Europeans.

    5. Re: big deal by datavirtue · · Score: 1

      It is likely that most content owners will just grant a blanket license. That will be difficult to automate unless Google works it into thier bot somehow. Perhaps it would search for a license file with standard language or a guild that links to a standard license that you opt in to on thier site for your domain.

      --
      I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
    6. Re: big deal by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      It is likely that most content owners will just grant a blanket license.

      They may not have the option of doing so. Often, the way this works in Europe is that fees are collected by national licensing organizations and then apportioned to their members.

    7. Re:big deal by ledow · · Score: 1

      Because the US is not the world.

      http://www.worldometers.info/p...

      Because the European market is more often bigger than the US, depending on what/how you measure it and what you're looking it.

      More people than the US, more money than the US, more trade than the US, more production than the US.

      You keep forgetting that the US is only a *country*, the EU is a *continent*. You just lost access to an entire *continent* of potential customers. Suppliers. Importers. Financial Services. All because they don't appear on your Google.

      Think of it like this... if the US was to disappear off the radar for all of Europe and not show on Google, would we be affected? Answer: Yes. The other way round is not only the same - it's actually WORSE.

      You might like to think that the US stands alone, needs no-one else, and you don't need to care about EU law, trade, visitor eyeballs, etc. but they likely form a much larger percentage of the visitors and income than you might think.

      If it happened on Slashdot, you'd lose at least half the articles, half the commentors and half the advertising revenue.

      You think that happening on Google wouldn't affect you just because you don't personally go to a www. .co.uk site very often?

    8. Re:big deal by ooloorie · · Score: 1

      Think of it like this... if the US was to disappear off the radar for all of Europe and not show on Google, would we be affected? Answer: Yes.

      Correct: Europeans lose a lot.

      The other way round is not only the same - it's actually WORSE.

      Individual Europeans can still come to US platforms under US law.

      Because the European market is more often bigger than the US, depending on what/how you measure it and what you're looking it.

      This directive doesn't make it any more difficult for American companies to sell in Europe. Disney and Hollywood will love it: more opportunities to sue European bootleggers. And Google and Facebook will love it because it makes life far more difficult for European competitors and gives them an excuse to put more censorship tools into their platforms.

      If it happened on Slashdot, you'd lose at least half the articles, half the commentors and half the advertising revenue.

      You mean we would be subjected to less ignorant drivel from Europeans? Sadly, this directive won't accomplish that.

    9. Re: big deal by batukhan · · Score: 1

      That's probably it

    10. Re:big deal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The US is not the world, but neither is the EU.

      So if you think not being visible in South America, North America and Asia is OK for the EU, well, you're as arrogant and myopic as most other Europeans.

    11. Re:big deal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You mean we would be subjected to less ignorant drivel from Europeans? Sadly, this directive won't accomplish that.

      Yes, you'll be free to use all the Brawndo you want on your crops, without any feedback from the entities that actually make your ignorance possible without you drowning in a puddle of your own drool. The US wouldn't even last 10 years without resorting to a cannibalistic society.

    12. Re: big deal by PrimaryConsult · · Score: 1

      A modification to the robots.txt convention, if google finds an approval in there, proceed as normal.

  12. Cold comfort by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    to see that EU legislators are bought and paid for just like U.S. counterparts.

  13. Pay to link? by stealth_finger · · Score: 5, Insightful

    News sites will be rubbing their hands in glee at the prospect of being paid to be linked to, in reality what's going to happen is those links will stop when news aggregators etc decide fuck this. Then we'll be in for the crying that their business is going even further down the pan.

    --
    Wanna buy a shirt?
    https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
    1. Re:Pay to link? by dwywit · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Exactly. Google et al response will be "we'll pay you for links to your content, here's an invoice for putting your website on the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, or nth page of search results"

      --
      They sentenced me to twenty years of boredom
    2. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      in reality what's going to happen is those links will stop

      Maybe. But I'd guess the reasoning is that this had to happen eventually, because someone has to get paid for everything, and that it was acted on now because the Internet is considered to have reached the level of being a social institution.

      This is directly connected to the net neutrality issue: Can we have public spaces and public resources, or are the forces of corporatocracy to rule?

    3. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Indeed.

      I wonder how this is compatible with the ECHR. Article 10, 17, 18 of the ECHR, Article 1 of protocol, dare I say Article 2 of protocol.

      https://www.echr.coe.int/Documents/Convention_ENG.pdf

    4. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is directly connected to the net neutrality issue: Can we have public spaces and public resources, or are the forces of corporatocracy to rule?

      Indeed it is. And the people who think that net neutrality equates to internet freedom are like the idiots who run around with signs saying "keep government out of my Medicare".

    5. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not only that.
      Fact check sites are going to be a problem if they want to link to articles, which means it could become harder to verify news, which is great for all the fake news sites out there.

    6. Re:Pay to link? by Gilgaron · · Score: 1

      Will this open a market for 'black market' indexers/search engines? Instead of file sharing, it'll be links to sites that otherwise would require compensation to link to. Although, I suppose depending on how it is implemented, clearing referral tags and a browser plug in might do well enough. I fail to see how it results in anything aside from a technical end run, as described.

    7. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Google and FB can hire their own journalists and generate as much news as they want.

    8. Re:Pay to link? by AHuxley · · Score: 1

      Dont link to the EU.

      --
      Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
    9. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      from the summary: the provisions are merely intended to give creators and smaller outlets the opportunity to reclaim the value of their work.

      That is a straight-up lie. It's purpose is to win hearts and minds, by deceiving the public. Smaller outlets are completely dependent on sites like Google to drive traffic to them, and that is about to vanish. Huge outlets, however, get plenty of traffic without the help of search engines, and they want people to come to their site directly and drive through it to get to traffic.

      The only ones who benefit here are the huge already-entrenched content owners (and NOT the creators, who merely work for the owners as employees).

      This bill is here to secure the wealth of the rich, to the detriment of everyone else, and nothing else.

    10. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or simply removing active links from the search results until the pay-to-link results naturally disappear as a consequence of not being linked from other pages.

    11. Re:Pay to link? by stealth_finger · · Score: 1

      Had enough of fake news? Get ready for pirate news!

      --
      Wanna buy a shirt?
      https://www.redbubble.com/people/stealthfinger/shop?asc=u
    12. Re:Pay to link? by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Nope. Because this has already had a "test phase" in Spain. Google news doesn't exist there because of it and has no plans coming back, don't be surprised if they simply fold up shop and don't service EU users on it.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    13. Re:Pay to link? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      News sites will be rubbing their hands in glee at the prospect of being paid to be linked to

      It's about people having to negotiate with them, not about getting paid. If anything, the negotiations will end up where you have to pay to get linked. This is going to result in money flowing from the publishers to Google. The copyright lobby is always trying to harm their own revenue streams, and they've done it yet again. They simply aren't serious businesses, all the way from Hollywood to Germany.

    14. Re:Pay to link? by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Except that the proposal is specifically designed to make linking and using snippets free, so while they could in theory get paid in Germany and Spain right now (if anyone was willing to give them money) the EU is taking that away from them.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    15. Re:Pay to link? by eth1 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Exactly. Google et al response will be "we'll pay you for links to your content, here's an invoice for putting your website on the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, or nth page of search results"

      Actually, Google's (and other search engines, at least) response to this should be, "we're never paying for links. If you ever bother us about paying for links, we'll handle it by removing your base domain from our database completely, and you can languish in obscurity until you die because no one can find you."

    16. Re:Pay to link? by Pentium100 · · Score: 2

      I think Google could do a test run of this by only providing news links to RussiaToday and similar sites. That should be fun in the EU.

    17. Re:Pay to link? by gchat · · Score: 1

      Actually something entirely else will happen. Rather than being opted-out, they want Google to include their links and demand from them a share of the revenue (11%). Not a joke (see Axel Springer lawsuit against Google in Germany).

  14. Blocking of Github in Europe in 3, 2, 1.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It won't be that Github updates their firewall with the correct IP Blocks.

    It'll be that some small outfit will get in a hissy-fit about this American company posting code similar to theirs online, and will compare them to Pirate bay but for code piracy because hey, what's the public domain and why do we need it? And they will get a "staydown" court order blocking it because the Judge has no idea what Github is or what it does.

    And then people try to use the git command, find out it fails, and then, all hell breaks loose. Red Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire all over again, but this time, the body count is 5-6 figures instead of 3.

    1. Re: Blocking of Github in Europe in 3, 2, 1.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then microsoft throws a few lawyers at it and github is back.

  15. Well it was nice while it lasted by elrous0 · · Score: 1

    Back to AOL and strictly walled gardens, I guess.

    --
    SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    1. Re: Well it was nice while it lasted by datavirtue · · Score: 2

      At this point I am longing for the AOL days.

      --
      I object to power without constructive purpose. --Spock
  16. This is what happens when young people don't vote by Kiuas · · Score: 2

    I've been saying this for a long time: this is the kind of result one expects to see when most of the people who vote in EU elections are over 50. I mean, voter turnout has been low in EU elections consistently (43 % in the last elections, pathetic really) because people would rather nitpick about the Union than do anything to affect it, but it's especially low among the younger generations. (source. "Turnout was again highest among the oldest respondents. Some 51% of the 55+ group voted in the European elections, while only 28% did in the 18-24 age group.") Is it any wonder that when most of the people sitting in the parliament have little to no understanding of what the internet actually is, the lobbyists are able to spoonfeed them all kinds of bullshit and we end up with sub-par legislation like this?

    Obviously we're still a long way from implementation, from the article:

    Clearly, this confusing back-and-forth hasn't instilled much hope in those the directive affects. Speaking to The Verge, executive director of digital rights association EDRi Joe McNamee said, "The system is so complicated that last Friday the [European Parliament] legal affairs committee tweeted an incorrect assessment of what's happening. If they don't understand the rules, what hope the rest of us?"

    Despite today's outcome, though, we're still a long way from actual legislation. Today's decision will be subject to even more negotiations between politicians and member states, with a final vote by the EU Parliament in January. Individual member states can then interpret the directive as they see fit before turning it into law. If these provisions make it through the next round of debates, though, the internet could soon look like a very different place."

    So whatever impact this will or will not have is still to be seen, and I personally hope the coming debates and negotiations will make it clear just how absurd the law in its current shape is and how hard (if not impossible) actual implementation and enforcement would be and reason will win, but we'll see.

    We've got slightly over half a year to next EU elections people. To paraphrase Obama's recent speech to anyone else here in Europe who doesn't like it: 'If this pisses you off, don't hashtag, vote!"

    --
    "It is the business of the future to be dangerous" -Alfred North Whitehead
  17. Shows who those overpaid idiots really work for by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've said it before, I'll say it again: Burn the whole thing down. Its ideals are bankrupt and its representatives are corrupt. To say nothing about the EU's unelected commissars, king drunkard on top.

  18. Google, if you would, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    please make sure your search results no longer include links to any news outlets in the EU. Please don't acquiesce and pay the fees.

    You have weight. Throw it around a little, will ya?

  19. bah, silly by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    It's fairly sad, really.

    This could have been handled in a much, MUCH better way. Such as...

    - If you are a news/media outlet, the onus is on YOU to place a "MEDIA OUTLET" tag in your page headers

    - If you want to be listed on Google News / etc, you have a summary snippet in your header .. that's what is automatically linked to / parsed in search results. That precise text

    - If you have no summary, you aren't listed.

    And, no 'link tax'.

    Boom. Done. That means you control the summary, and that means that you decide how much a Google user can read of your article. Want to know more?

    CLICK!

    Now the media outlet can control how the revenue stream works. It benefits Google too, they only have to examine summary texts for malicious content, but don't have to 'parse' a webpage hoping to get a good snippet.

    Everyone wins.

    Mandate that, and you're done.

     

  20. The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Max_W · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The EU accepted the rule that the FPV, first-person-view, transmitter of an RC aircraft, or a drone, cannot have the power more than 25 mW, while a smartphone can have the transmitting power of 1000, or even 3000 mW.

    It basically destroyed the emerging UAV & FPV market and the industry in the EU countries. It made existing FPV drones unreliable and dangerous, while the FPV videolink starts to break at about 100 meters.

    1. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Because they can be weaponized. Or so, that's the rational behind such legislation.

    2. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So what if I control my RC aircraft via my cell phone?

    3. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Simply use a phone as FPV Transmitter.

    4. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Max_W · · Score: 1

      In real world we see that over-powered cars are mostly used by terror groups, but not UAVs. Still the EU does not try to limit the power of a car by say 200 hp and the weight by say 1500 kg, what is more than enough. On the contrary we see new personal cars with more than 500 hp and the weight more than 3000 kg.

      So it should not be this concern which you mention. In my opinion it is kind of liberal self-righteous populism.

    5. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Errol+backfiring · · Score: 1

      Mobile phones are weaponized. I read somewhere that most "suicide" bombers are detonated remotely by mobile phone, because too many of them were too afraid of committing suicide.

      --
      Nae king! Nae laird! Nae yurrupiean pressedent! We willna be fooled again!
    6. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless it's substantially different than the EU, those cell phones are transmitting on bands that are reserved for their use where the UAV are using shared frequency and need to be more careful of stepping on other devices/users. 25mw is pretty low though.

    7. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by havana9 · · Score: 1

      What stops you to get an amateur radio license and modify a TV sender to operate in HAM bands an daad an amplifier, or Buy an already-made module?
      Are these modules cosidered line LPD systems os similar unlicensed systems? I remember that to control model aircaft one needed to pay a CB tax because was actually used the CB band to transmit.

    8. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by swilver · · Score: 2

      Good. Fuck off with those drones.

    9. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's about preventing cheap weaponized OTS (Off the Shelf) items from being explicitly used to assassinate a head of state. If nothing seems rational, it's only because you haven't been understanding it through the lenses of elected officials - ie those in power that will to remain in power.

    10. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      With standard private use driving license there is an actual limit at 3.5 ton for cars.

      To drive bigger vehicles you need to take a specific driving exam for trucks.

      Some countries also have actual limits to the HP for newly licensed drivers. Since such rules have been enforced when I already have had a license for 10 years, so I did not care to check the details. I'm sure wikipedia has all the details anyway. Unless they decide to obscure an entire site whose 95% of content has no copyright problems just in protest.

    11. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The law stops you. An HAM license is not a loophole to ignore other frequency regulations.

      I agree that law enforcement would probably not notice such an infraction though.

    12. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "In real world we see that over-powered cars are mostly used by terror groups" - citation needed.
      Maybe you meant to say that terror groups mostly use over-powered cars - that might be possible.
      Of course terror groups mostly use mobile phones - want to ban those too?
      And I'm pretty sure terror groups mostly use groceries and money - ban them too.
      You see where this is heading?

    13. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Opportunist · · Score: 2

      Yeah, because someone planning to use a drone as a smart bomb will give half a shit about the transmitting power of his drone.

      If someone has a drone that transmits at a gigawatt, do you think that someone could stop it before it slams into its target? Hell, I'd be surprised if anyone even noticed.

      So drop the charade, what's the real reason?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    14. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Again, what keeps me from using a more powerful transmitter? You think you can shoot my drone down before I shoot your prez?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    15. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Simply use a phone as FPV Transmitter.

      If you attach a phone to a drone, now it's arguably part of the drone.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    16. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by houghi · · Score: 1

      So use a phone instead. Problem solved.

      OTOH I doubt that a phone is that great in flying, so comparing the two is a bit of a strange thing.

      I also think that they looked at the distance and that resulted in the 25 mW. The issue was not the wattage, but the distance.

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    17. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by thegarbz · · Score: 1

      It basically destroyed the emerging UAV & FPV market and the industry in the EU countries.

      Thank god. There's so many of the things flying around as it is I don't think I would be able to see the sun anymore if it handn't been "destroyed".

    18. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Fly two drones. One that keeps within a few meters of the first that contains a high power signal repeater and the other with the camera. In fact, I bet if you programmed the software properly, the second drone would automatically follow the first drone.

      Twice as annoying and possibly with much greater coverage area!

    19. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by danomac · · Score: 1

      Still the EU does not try to limit the power of a car by say 200 hp and the weight by say 1500 kg, what is more than enough.

      That would also remove all pure electric cars from the roadways. Even the Tesla Model 3 is ~1800kg. The Model S is even heavier, it's just as heavy as a 1/2 ton truck due to the batteries (~2200kg).

      Ahem, be careful what you wish for. Electric cars that only go 30km on one charge won't be very useful.

    20. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In real world we see that over-powered cars are mostly used by terror groups, but not UAVs.

      Well there it is, the stupidest thing I'll read all day.

    21. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      Phones are heavily regulated. They don't just turn on their transmitters at 3000mW and start screaming to get maximum range and speed, they carefully follow a very strict and well defined set of rules laid out in the standards.

      The spectrum that FPV drones operate in is multi-standard and so uses power and duty cycle limits to ensure it can be shared properly.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    22. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by DigiShaman · · Score: 1

      That's a valid point. I mean, banning guns never prevented criminals from using them to murder anyone. And the fact they're criminals means they never adhered to the law anyways.

      The solution? President Boba Fett needs to use his weapons to counter-attack the incoming drones.

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
    23. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All but one type of encoded transmissions on civilian bands are illegal. Transmissions are natural language, Morse code, or a crime.

      I'd be impressed if you can transmit realtime video with either of those two methods.

    24. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well gosh, it's a good thing they made it illegal, so nobody will even try! We really dodged a bullet there!

    25. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then I'm sure glad they knew that nobody would ever take the receiver for that 25mw and the control signal and, say, hook them up to a wired connection that could safely be controlled from outside a blast radius!

    26. Re:The FPV industry was destroyed in EU already by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      I have to ask, wouldn't it be cheaper for the country, both in terms of saving cost for the defense as well as dealing with the general fallout he produces, to just let the attacker get through?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  21. Congratulations, EU! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You just became a second-class citizen on the internet. No one will host your content, or link to it. Good luck!

    1. Re:Congratulations, EU! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it applies to _any_ content served in EU, I believe. Thus somebody will bid for the market. youtube isn't going away, believe me (even if I would be happy to see it).

  22. The Berne Convention was a European creation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You realize that foolishness started in Europe and we stiff armed it for a few decades. Not until an actor for president had 8 years to amass power did we succumb to it.

    1. Re:The Berne Convention was a European creation by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      Right now I'd rather have the movie star actor back instead of the reality TV star. Right now I'd even be happy to have the Quaker back.

  23. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    You have it all wrong - the young vote progressive / socialism. They're not adult enough to make their own decisions, so they force everyone to have the guberment make it for them. Good ol washing the hands of responsibility.

    And so society decays until "Venezuela" happens all over again.

  24. Oh Europe, you're just as dumb as everyone else. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Shining example of regulation, meet stupid morons who don't understand how the internet works.

    Europe is good at many things, but they have this penchant for protectionism. They really like protecting one company from another by passing legislation that accomplishes this.

    Maybe you should start looking in the mirror when you get so mad at our idiot man-child president, and his dumb tariff?

  25. It will come down to who has more influence, by dwywit · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The content owners, or the content indexers?

    Content owners like large media companies are still desperately clinging to the past.

    Google and other online gatekeepers hold sway over large percentages of the audience.

    I eagerly await a final smackdown for Murdoch & friends, when the reality of distributed information finally hits home. Hits home to them of course, the rest of us already know.

    Google and others have no obligation to list anything. If they decide that it costs too much to link items to media websites, well... tough. The other media companies will gladly waive costs if it means their content gets listed at the top of page 1 while Murdoch & co are relegated to page 2 or 3.

    --
    They sentenced me to twenty years of boredom
    1. Re:It will come down to who has more influence, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some Indian English newspapers are not bad and updated almost instantly . Russia pushes its English version. Kinda like VOA in radio days. Also India has some special copyright laws, such as affordable books (Indian consumption only).
      I expect Google of whatever will link to other continent weblinks, the general population will get used to it, then the American and EU politicians will get all upset and outraged about slanted stories- and voters seeing the truth, not PR lies,.

      For English speaking countries this will not work well (Free Govt public TV stations in Au Canada etc. It may cause a lot of native speakers to adopt English -thus France will loose out big. A VPN will further kill off local offerings.

    2. Re:It will come down to who has more influence, by micahraleigh · · Score: 0

      How is Murdoch going to get smacked own without harming Turner and his crew?

      Unless someone passes a law that says, "All people named Rupert Murdoch are doth hereby ordered to hand over all assets to their enemies in the spirit of revolutionary activies... etc".

      Sounds like corruption. Among other things ...

    3. Re:It will come down to who has more influence, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      >The other media companies will gladly waive costs

      Funny. There's an article in the proposal which forbids exactly that. All media companies are forced to charge a non-negligible price.

  26. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by misexistentialist · · Score: 2

    think this is really about censorship, which the young people all support

  27. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by ooloorie · · Score: 1

    Why should anybody waste a lot of time trying to oppose this at the level of the EP? People understand full well that their vote is pretty much worthless. As I understand it, the EU can adopt these rules without the EP.

    Furthermore, what makes you think that European youth would vote to oppose this?

  28. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by alvinrod · · Score: 4, Interesting

    You assume that young people will do any better or that they have a "real" understanding of the internet. If you look at some of the groups of young people that are screaming the loudest, they'd seem to be the biggest censors of the internet with their demand for safe spaces and a ban on any expression that hurts their feelings. There are also a lot of young people that are going to throw in with the right-wing anti-immigration parties that are starting to spring up because they see that as more important than something going on with the internet. I don't know if those groups even have any opinion on this particular topic, but I don't think getting the younger voters involved will do anything.

    In the U.S. the joke (from about two decades ago) about younger people voting was that it was the younger college voters in Minnesota that got Jesse Ventura elected. If you're not familiar with him, he's a bit of a conspiracy nut among other things. Probably an okay guy to be friends with, just not what I would consider governor material. I think the youth vote was also up in the 2016 election and we ended up with Trump, so I don't see it making a difference in this case either.

  29. Contrarian Opinion: Good. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "It's hard" shouldn't be an excuse for protecting the people who are your bread and butter. If this puts the onus of protecting copyright on the pipeline providers, I say that's a good thing. They've made billions by blindly winking at violators and creating buggy software that does either more or less than it's supposed to do- but never 'just enough."

    And if nothing else, maybe this will reduce the number of shiatty "reaction videos" that are nothing more than original content with a pic-in-pic of two dudes mouthing "dayyyummm" in mock suprise.

    Maybe it's time to fiddle while Rome burns.

    1. Re:Contrarian Opinion: Good. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And if nothing else, maybe this will reduce the number of shiatty "reaction videos" that are nothing more than original content with a pic-in-pic of two dudes mouthing "dayyyummm" in mock suprise.

      Yes, we should allow for even more draconian copyright laws because a certain type of content you don't like is allowed to exist. Or perhaps you could just skip those and watch other content, god knows that there's thousands of hours worth posted every second.

    2. Re:Contrarian Opinion: Good. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If this puts the onus of protecting copyright on the pipeline providers, I say that's a good thing.

      That's absurd. You should be protecting your basket of eggs. Asking the fox to protect your eggs just means you're going to have fewer eggs.

      This change, though lobbied by publishers, will financially harm those publishers. Google's business just got a bit more profitable, since now you'll have to negotiate with Google and pay them to get linked.

      "Fox, watch my eggs for me."

      "Ok, I'll do that, in exchange for 6 eggs per day."

      "But I used to lose 1 or 2 eggs per day!"

      "Now it'll be a predictable 6, by contract. You'll have the certainty that you always wanted."

      "Why am I hiring you, again?"

      "That's what I kept asking you, when you were voting to enact a law requiring that you hire me. Now here we are."

  30. This will stop piracy.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    just as effective as banning guns, and violence.

  31. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I only support censoring you.

  32. No YouTube for the EU? by Only+Time+Will+Tell · · Score: 1

    I'll admit I'm ignorant on the ramifications of this regulatory change in the EU, but couldn't sites like YouTube get around changes to their business by setting up location blocking for the EU nations and effectively say they no longer operate in the jurisdiction of the EU? As it sounds from the summary, these social media sites would have to confirm the millions upon millions of videos and photos uploaded are not breaking copyright. I don't see how any sort of automated bot could handle the task, since it would have to be able to pick up on things like someone recording a movie or song on their phone where it is not exactly the original quality, and the volume of work would be beyond any reasonable human staffing capability.

    1. Re:No YouTube for the EU? by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Youtube should essentially redirect all videos to one detailing how to set up a VPN to a server outside the EU when called from an IP address inside the EU, lean back and enjoy the tantrum.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:No YouTube for the EU? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      While pulling out from EU could be an option, but not an easy one anyway. A simple IP check could be accounted as not sufficient by a judge, no big tech corporate is going to do that anyway.

      YouTube or social networks pulling completely out of Europe would leave a big and lucrative market open to newcomers, who would have free reign to create their new platforms, maybe even better ones, and the compete. No big tech firm can take such a risk, so they will have to stay in Europe and in some way live with new laws.

      Some minor company could accept the risk of pulling out, but I don't see that coming, for such a minor thing like this, from YouTube of Facebook or Twitter.

      I think the fact that all these companies are accepting to jump through much worse hoops in china and partly Russia is proof enough that they don't want to leave any markets uncovered by their services.

  33. Hey They are a private organization.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They have the right to restrict the internet however they want. Don't like it? Go make your own internet!

    We all knew the internet was going to become cable TV one day.

    1. Re: Hey They are a private organization.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well....they don't have the right to restrict the internet all they want since they don't own it

      Thst would mean they get to force their will on YOUR internet also

      Their whole plan is to control other companies through this legislation

  34. Easy by TJHook3r · · Score: 1

    Cut off the EU from Google. As though anybody wants to see French cinema anyway!

    1. Re: Easy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Destroy copyright all together and we won't have to worry about any of it

      Not sure what this tyranny level copyright actually does for people today anyway

    2. Re:Easy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      At this point I think we should just shut down the internet completely in the EU - wait until they come back grovelling on their knees, then dictate the terms.

  35. Start over by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Internet 2, keep it secret this time...the public will just muck it up again

    1. Re:Start over by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      We're already way ahead of you, Mr. Public.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  36. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by lucasnate1 · · Score: 1

    Another thing that young people support is the idea of "all or nothing", things like "either we can't censor anything at all or "we must censor both pedophiles and copyright violators and close the internet down". In real life, most people believe that there's a place for in-betweens and this is how laws are enacted.

  37. They are both bad by aepervius · · Score: 1

    Google is about as evil as murdoch, it is just in its infancy and still mostly goes the way the user so they ignore the shadows looming. But there has been enough stories in the last years even on slashdot to show google is not better, it is just new. As long as the page are indexed I am OK with it personally. I always found "news scrapping" as google news seem to do to be borderline or even fully copyright infringement.

    --
    C. Sagan : A demon haunted world:
    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0345409469/
    visit randi.org
  38. Re: This is what happens when young people don't v by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How does one solve this issue? People much under 50 are too stupid.

    What you need is a system that is made up of WELL EDUCATED elders, with their people's best interests in mind

  39. millions of mindless internet-informed zombies ... by gDLL · · Score: 1

    YES COMRADE, only the members of vanguard party of the proletariat should have a vote in the running of the country !!!!

  40. Time to get out. by Deathlizard · · Score: 1

    I don't know why these internet companies still do business in the EU.

    If Facebook alone pulled out of the EU (let alone Google or Wikipedia) because they didn't want to deal with this BS, these laws would be rescinded in days.

    Of course it would never happen because investors.

  41. great idea - back to basics by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    get search engines back to doing just one thing --

    index the website using:

    title
    description
    keywords

    and get rid of the ads above the search results PUUULLLLEEEEEEEZ

  42. Rrrrrrrrrr... by hyades1 · · Score: 1

    Now EVERYBODY can be a pirate!

    --
    I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
  43. Removing Copyrighted Material by Jason+Levine · · Score: 1

    Article 13, the "upload filter", would force them to check all content uploaded to their sites and remove any copyrighted material

    And how are these companies supposed to 1) know that a piece of material is copyrighted and 2) know that the uploader doesn't have the right to upload it?

    For example, I wrote and published a novel. The novel is protected by copyright. When writing the novel, I used Google Docs. (It's handy for writing initial drafts wherever I am. I later exported that into a more full fledged word processor for final formatting.) So there's a copy of copyrighted material in my Google Docs account. Should Google remove that since it's copyrighted content? How do they know that I'm the one who wrote it? As far as they know, I just re-typed something from someone else's book and that text on Google Docs is a copyright violation.

    --
    My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    1. Re:Removing Copyrighted Material by swilver · · Score: 1

      Easy, they check the special copyright bit that is magically set on every byte you transmit.

    2. Re:Removing Copyrighted Material by wvmarle · · Score: 1

      And how are these companies supposed to 1) know that a piece of material is copyrighted and 2) know that the uploader doesn't have the right to upload it?

      1) is easy. All material that's not ancient is copyrighted, by default. Everything. Blogs, books, news articles, song recordings - all of it.

      2) is the hard part. The US DMCA got that one correct, though: if uploader says they have the right to upload and publish material for distribution, the host is in the clear, and other people that claim copyright over the same material will have to battle it out with the (by then known!) uploader.

    3. Re:Removing Copyrighted Material by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      no need for magic just have the uploader set the bit.

    4. Re:Removing Copyrighted Material by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Just reuse the evil bit, it's actually reserved for malware but since copyrighted material should also not be routed, I guess it's ok to reuse it. Anyone not having permission to use content has to set it and that should take care of the whole mess.

      I would actually suggest it to the EU, but I secretly fear they'd seriously implement it, considering they just showed how much they really understand about the internet...

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    5. Re:Removing Copyrighted Material by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think I have a better solution. Once you have your website built, but before you open it to the public, you simply have to write a letter to the collection societies (BMG, ASCAP, etc. see here for a bigger list: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_copyright_collection_societies ) and tell them that you've built a copyright filter and that in order to prevent the upload of their copyrighted works, they'll need to send you, at no charge, a digital copy of every work that they expect your filter to block. Tell them that if they don't expect you to block a particular work, they should withhold it from you.
      Sign them.
      Date them.
      Drop them in the mail.
      If they don't send you a couple of trucks full of dvds, you're free to allow your users to upload anything that they've refused to provide you with.

    6. Re:Removing Copyrighted Material by Jason+Levine · · Score: 1

      I'm fine with the DMCA system for copyright infringement. That's how it should work. Party A uploads material. Party B contacts Party A's host and says it infringes their copyright. Party A's host sends the notice to Party A. Party A either takes down the material or asserts that they have the right to upload it. At that point, it becomes a battle between Parties A and B. The host is out of it entirely. What the EU seems to want is for the host to automagically know that the content that Party A is uploading is copyrighted and that Party A doesn't have permission to upload it. There's no way to effectively do that.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
  44. Remove *all* copyrighted material? by mark-t · · Score: 1

    So in other words, uploads are effectively like copying to /dev/null?

    Because even if it doesn't infringe on copyright, it's all copyrighted... or at least probably mostly copyrighted. Hell, the uploader might even own the copyright on it. After all, it's copyrighted, isn't it?

    The question to be asking is if the uploaded copyrighted content infringes on copyright law, or if the copyright holder might want to claim copyright infringement (whether or not they actually did do so).

    Computers cannot currently do this without a lot of human intervention on a case-by-case basis, however, so this law is asking companies to do something that is technologically impossible today.

    So what, exactly, did lawmakers have in mind with this kind of law? What sort of magic do they think computers have to make this sort of thing even *remotely* achievable?

    1. Re:Remove *all* copyrighted material? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sorry, I have a copyright on /dev/null.

    2. Re:Remove *all* copyrighted material? by Pfhorrest · · Score: 1

      I think they don't expect the hosting companies to be able to actually do the filtering, they just want them to be legally liable for failing to do so in case a copyright owner finds their stuff on the site and wants to sue them over it.

      It's another case of laws that make more people into criminals because you can't avoid breaking them, so that you always have an excuse to crack down on people when you already wanted to, not necessarily every time they violate law.

      --
      -Forrest Cameranesi, Geek of all Trades
      "I am Sam. Sam I am. I do not like trolls, flames, or spam."
    3. Re:Remove *all* copyrighted material? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is not just about uploading. This is about linking to copyrighted content. You basically will have to have a contract with a content provider to link to their URL's. Most sites don't involve third party uploading of content. Since the biggest linker is Google, this is essentially and anti-Google bill designed to support local search engines. Basically, it makes the entirety of Google's business model illegal.

    4. Re:Remove *all* copyrighted material? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So what, exactly, did lawmakers have in mind with this kind of law? What sort of magic do they think computers have to make this sort of thing even *remotely* achievable?

      TV 2.0

      Media companies hate the internet with a passion. It obsoletes their entire business model. They want a broadcast system that they can control absolutely. The internet gives the masses a voice and allows them to congregate in numbers higher than ever before. So to the media companies the internet is a threat and must perish.

      Also, the west has been in decline for years. The single biggest reason is their "moral requirement to make money" that has them desprately destroying everything just to make a quick buck like a dying old fart trying to catch their last breath. The Imaginary Property "holders" have nothing but air in their pockets and treat it like gold, while simultaneously transferring everything of value to the third world nations in exchange for more air. Then they turn around and market that air to the masses at ever lower prices so that every last bit of worth can be sucked out of society and turned into more air.

      That's not to say the air is completely worthless. Obviously, the internet allows that "air" to be copied and reused and people are willing to spend the time and resources required to do so. Therefore that "air" has some worth to it, but that worth is no where near the worth of what's being sent to those third world countries. The great leaders of the west cannot see that though, and so their decline continues unabated.

    5. Re:Remove *all* copyrighted material? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The West and the EU are not in decline, but the United States and Russia certainly are. Serves them right. The European Parliament makes stupid laws, but then I hope, that the trilogue will stop that. This is where the European Council could play a role.

  45. Millennial hyperbole by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's not going to be the death of anything but millennial entitlement. Their classic butthurt in response, on the other hand - I don't think anything can remedy that. Say it with me: you are not allowed to co-opt the hard work of others anymore than I am allowed to collect your paycheck at the end of the week for the work you did. Deal with it.

  46. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Young urban europeans only know the internet from Reddit, imgur and facebook. Most cant see further than their noses, and are in on censoring differing opinions due to the general echo chamber climate which has been fostered by social media through their upgrowing. They couldnt stand on boring forums and sites such as slashdot, and would vomit if they ever visited the bad sites on 4chan. And young rural people dont care because they have other stuff to do.

    Also free speech has never really been a huge concept, because oh my god, fascist/socialists/ do indeed sometimes have a point and that would just be counterproductive to the common good, wouldnt it?

    And old people dont understand shit and are also pro censoring poltical opinions because thats what they are used too (especially in germany).

  47. I do not get it... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... Those links are driving traffic to their sites... Don't they want that?

    Maybe Google can charge them a link service of 2x the link 'tax'...

  48. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    MEPs are elected by proportional representation (party lists). Unless a mainstream party takes a stance against this policy, or a single-issue party gets a large share of the vote, no amount of voting by anyone can solve this.

    If you care about this issue, contact your MEPs and let them know.

  49. Time for a search add on by AHuxley · · Score: 1

    Create a search add on for a browser that does not find any results in the EU.
    -site: and list the EU nations.
    Move around the censorship and link to nations that support freedom of speech. Support the ability to link and talk about a link.

    --
    Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
  50. Stop publishing links by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Just paste the link as plain text and force Europeans to copy-pasta it.

    Google should do this in their search engine for the EU. Perhaps even ROT-13 it for a bit more difficulty.

    A few years of that and Europeans might change their mind on whether their country should remain in the EU. Especially older Europeans who use tablets, since it's a pain in the ass to copy the link and paste it in on a touchscreen interface and they're exactly the type that won't know how to install a browser extension to re-linkify that text.

    1. Re:Stop publishing links by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      The Europeans know that this is bullshit, don't worry. We're no more in control of the goofballs that rule us than you are of the annoying orange.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Stop publishing links by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The orange that reduced black unemployment to historic lows, and is pulling minorities out of poverty in record numbers?

      I could understand how a racist like you wouldn't like that. You need to have blacks "know their place" so they vote for your guys, right?
      Anyone else tired of liberal bigots posting here?

    3. Re:Stop publishing links by Opportunist · · Score: 1

      Can they feed a family with those "jobs"? Because if they can't, you can stuff your "job" where the sun doesn't shine. I don't need an occupation, I need money, I can keep busy myself just fine.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  51. here come the trolls by sdinfoserv · · Score: 1

    Sounds like a perfect environment for a patent troll explosion.

  52. The end game... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    In case you were wondering about the end-game...

    Copyright is a state controlled thing. In order to have a copyright, ultimately you have to go to the state and register.

    Control copyright and you control the content creators, not the content consumers. You control what is allowed to be said, and you have full awareness of who said it.

  53. TRUMP WILL WHIP THOSE PESKY 'PEONS INTO SHAPE! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Touch Googlie and Trump will be on your ass faster than you can say, Do You Want Fries With That Abortion?

    1. Re: TRUMP WILL WHIP THOSE PESKY 'PEONS INTO SHAPE! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are they freedom fries?

  54. Re: This is what happens when young people don't by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    you're chinese, right?

  55. False equivalency by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Google is about as evil as murdoch, it is just in its infancy

    Google at present is nowhere near as evil as Murdoch. Google isn't peddling lies and filtering truth. It isn't interfering directly in elections by, say, distributing free papers laced with lies about the EU and Brexit for 10 days before the vote, covering for Trump's atrocities and feeding their viewers a false reality, etc.

    They may get there in time, but there is no evidence that that is their intention, their business model, or their fate.

    The two are certainly not equal in their misbehavior and detrimental impact now, and likely will never be, so stop engaging in false equivalencies. It makes you look and sound like a Trump/Putin sock puppet.

    1. Re:False equivalency by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Google isn't peddling lies and filtering truth. It isn't interfering directly in elections by, say, distributing free papers laced with lies about the EU and Brexit for 10 days before the vote, covering for Trump's atrocities and feeding their viewers a false reality, etc.

      Oh boy have i news for you.

  56. The internet litmus test by cordovaCon83 · · Score: 1

    I think perhaps the proper litmus test for this law might be to ask oneself "How does this affect Wikipedia?" I'm not saying that Wikipedia is like a bastion of good facts, but it's always been heavily moderated, seems to respect most copyright law, and is non-profit. Since most sites are for-profit, they all have a dog in the fight about the application of copyright law. IANAL and welcome your interpretations in this context of these new copyright laws.

  57. Europe tech scene must be lame. by TheZeitgeist · · Score: 1

    I've mentioned this before; but seems only times I hear about 'Europe' and 'tech' is in context of EU bureaucrats peeing in some cheerios somewhere. Never hear about the proverbial Next Big Thing coming from Europe, always another dumb law or lawsuit or fine.

    1. Re:Europe tech scene must be lame. by ArchieBunker · · Score: 1

      I think its hilarious how liberals talk about how wonderful and progressive the EU is and how they are leading by example. Well your progressive EU just royally fucked up the internet because they don't understand it.

      --
      Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    2. Re:Europe tech scene must be lame. by Brett+Buck · · Score: 0

      Europe has been parasitic on the world since WW I, and heavily so since WW II. Partly because the world powers have long since learned that they cannot be trusted with any significant power, otherwise, they start killing each other over trivia. The EU in particular is a failing social experiment, this is just the latest symptom.

    3. Re:Europe tech scene must be lame. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This law in particular is mostly popular among libertarians and conservatives.

  58. Yes! by DogDude · · Score: 1

    Right. Leave the EU because you can't post copyrighted stuff on Youtube. Brilliant!

    --
    I don't respond to AC's.
  59. So.. only one question remains, by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How will we route around this kind of damage?

  60. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by caseih · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Nah the Trump vote came mainly from grumpy old white people. The youth vote would have gone to Bernie Sanders, but I suspect most of those who would have voted Bernie ended up not voting at all. The ideals of socialism seem to appeal most strongly to the youth, who are still idealistic, with a strong sense of morality (as they see it).

  61. Re: This is what happens when young people don't v by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The young are doing that because they joined the game of Monopoly too late. No one enjoys that. Time for a new game.

  62. Not unfair really by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    So people cannot steal other people's images, video or music anymore.

    That is not unfair. If I spend time and money to create something, why would others be allowed to freely copy it?

  63. Will hurt the 'media companies' more than anyone by Rick+Schumann · · Score: 1

    Article 11, also known as the "link tax", would require online platforms such as Google and Facebook to pay media companies to link to their content

    Sure. So rather than do that, Google, Zuckerbook, and whoever else, will just not link to any of those anymore -- or at least threaten to. Suddenly the 'media companies' see their traffic fall off by orders of magnitude, followed by their stock value dropping, and boards of directors and stockholders screaming bloody murder.

    Also meanwhile you really think any of this is going to stop 4channers and redditors from creating and spreading new memes? LOL no, that horse left the barn a long long time ago now, and it's a game of Whack-A-Mole against ferrets on bad biker meth at best to try to stamp them out or stop them.

    I'm sticking by what I said about this yesterday: It's UNENFORCEABLE and TOOTHLESS.

  64. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Mashiki · · Score: 1

    Watch the vote. The MEP's were clapping and cheering as it was passed, this isn't a case of voting. They were clapping and cheering as each amendment was defeated. This is a case of politicians being so bought and paid for, that they went along with what special interest groups told them to do. People like to complain about how bad it is in the US, there's no comparison.

    --
    Om, nomnomnom...
  65. I don't see the problem by Roger+Wilcox · · Score: 1

    So, under this new legislation, nobody links to people who are looking to collect. These media companies who want to charge for links are essentially are cutting themselves off from their audience. This changes nothing for the Internet as I have known it. It just tempts "content providers" to shoot themselves in the foot. I don't want their shit content anyway, so BAU continues for me...

  66. Darknets go mainstream by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    I think this means there will be increased demand for things like i2p, Tor and other darknets to get "mainstreamed." If everyone (not just pirates anymore) has to constantly worry about crazy copyright, then everyone has to use darknets to dodge the problem. The situation will be: if you're not on darknets, you are cut off from a majority of culture. Obviously we're not anywhere near that yet, but this looks like it might have what it takes to push us there.

  67. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    There is a place for compromise, and this isn't it. Net neutrality is similar; either the network is neutral, or it isn't. Encryption is either secure, or, well, compromised. Processors either have facilities (like IME) for back doors, or they are absent. "Net neutrality" with loopholes like prioritization or "reasonable network management", undermines innovation and the incentive to grow the network. "Encryption" with back doors is worse than useless, and ensures that only bad actors and oppressive states have secure communication.

    Automated systems for censorship, mass surveillance, back doors, and such, are inevitably abused, and may have catastrophic results. Such systems should never be implemented, and those developing technology should take care to make it resistant to such efforts. If such systems are implemented, it is a moral imperative that citizens tear them down. If we are going to legislate on such topics, it should take the form of prohibiting such mass abuse, or guaranteeing the right to end-to-end secure communications, so that critical services aren't left wide-open with their communications harvested by abusive entities like FaceBook, Google, ISPs, etc.

    If law enforcement wants to surveil, it should be targeted; ie. bug the phone, not the network or encrypted channel. If personal or other unauthorized information is published in the open, complaints should go through a court, and the source should be shut down, not filtered. (Copyright should just be abolished along with other forms of intellectual "property", but until then, it should be treated the same.) Networks have no need for prioritization; for applications that need better service, dedicated links are available. Indeed, they are the only means of guaranteeing service, as there will never be agreement over priorities across the Internet.

    Operating in this way may be more of a burden, but the potential for abuse is absolutely horrific. It is beyond foolish to afford such tools to the one entity with a monopoly on legal violence. It is only slightly less bad to leave them in the hands of entities purely motivated by profit.

  68. The EU thinks that 1984 is an instruction manual by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    as opposed to a third rate novel.

    This is how dissent will be crushed by the totalitarian EU commissariat. Everybody has to break the law, when it gets through (which looks likely)

  69. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I vote for the pirate party every year.
    I blame the retards who fall for the "lost vote" meme.
    And don't pretend any of the other parties are against this shit.

  70. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

    I don't know what this guy's agenda is but it's not hard to understand at all. Here is the wikipedia article that explains it very well: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...

    Look at Article 11, for example. The supposed "link tax". Oh look, the EU studied the situation, realized that a link tax won't work and that stopping the use of small portions of copyrighted works on things like news aggregation sites is a terrible idea, and put in specific exemptions that actually remove restrictions in a couple of countries (Germany and Spain).

    A lot of the changes were due to feedback from the public. You know, democracy. Elections are not the only way to participate.

    --
    const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
    SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
  71. Government gonna Government by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This surprises exactly no one that understands the nature of the state.

  72. Unintended consequences? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "link tax", would require online platforms such as Google and Facebook to pay media companies to link to their content

    So why wouldn't Google and Facebook just stop linking to media companies to avoid paying the "link tax"?

  73. Re:Will hurt the 'media companies' more than anyon by Areyoukiddingme · · Score: 1

    I'm sticking by what I said about this yesterday: It's UNENFORCEABLE and TOOTHLESS.

    It's selectively enforceable, same as MP3 uploads. There will be more Joel Tenenbaums, more Jammie Thomas-Rassets, more Mark Shumakers. This time in Europe. Random meming kids will get sued and lose and get saddled with gigantic judgements they'll never pay off, and will never work again because of it.

    And nothing else will change much.

  74. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nah the Trump vote came mainly from grumpy old white people.

    Not really. The old and/or white vote for Trump is about the same as previous Republicans. If it was grumpy old white people who put Trump in the WH, those same old white people could have helped Romney or McCain win.

    No, to win, you need more than that, especially in a United States where white people are slowly becoming a minority.

    One demographic that set Trump apart is the male vote (simply males, not counting age or ethnicity), and even then he isn't the first president to have a strong male vote. What's also noteworthy is that Trump actually did better than Romney amongst blacks and latinos (still pales to support for Democrats, but hey an improvement is an improvement)

    I wouldn't blame or credit Trump's victory to any one group. The guy ran on a populist platform, appealing to as many demographics as he can. America as a whole elected for him (yes yes, even though he didn't win the "popular vote", which isn't really a thing as the US voting system doesn't work on popular vote)

  75. Ironically you brought up _good_ regulation... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ...in your attempt to bash it. Transmitting devices are a perfect example of why societies cannot allow complete laissez-faire to everyone to do as they wish even within the confines of their own property. You inadvertently affect others.

    Oh, and btw. the limitation only applies to amateur operated drones. Licensed operators can have much longer ranges.

  76. Google, Facebook and ... by Qbertino · · Score: 1

    Apple and maybe some others should simply completely deactivate their services in Europe on the day this law takes effect.

    Then we would see how consequent the EU Parliament really is. If they say:"well ok then, of Google FB and Co can't comply they really should shut their services off in Europe" then I'd be impressed. But they'd probably backpedal as fast as they humanly could. Cowards.

    However, what Google an Co should do right away is deranked/remove all traces of any content provider anywhere as to have them disappear from the interwebs. That'll teach them.

    --
    We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
  77. This might be interpreted ina reasonable way? by schweini · · Score: 1

    Although I think this legislation is silly, one COULD argue that getting linked to by google causes quite the additional cost in traffic an server resources (never mind that getting traffic is usually a good thing).
    So I guess in the end the smarter content creators will put up some policy like robots.txt and allow indexers like google to link to their content as they pleasem ehich doesn't seem too unreasonable.
    Come to think of it - doesn't robots.txt already do exactly this?

  78. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    While you address two right wing perspectives, don't forget about the constant growth of the left, especially in Europe. The young dumb people may head to the far right with it's censorship and safe spaces, but as they grow older and wiser they will lean to the left, as history has shown.

  79. No debate by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As a loyal European Union citizen I have no opinion on this but I fully support all decisions made by the European Parliament and obey all the directives by the European Commission. Anyone disagreeing is a malfeasant and a traitor and I will gladly inform the authorities on these people, even if they happen to be my friends and relatives. Europe can only prosper if we all think and act the same.

  80. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Hispanics unexpectedly came out to vote for Trump in large numbers.

    Wrap your head around that. Next time let your constituents decide who your candidate will be, and don't simply declare it to be Her Turn.

    CAPTCHA: blamable

  81. Oh well by fyngyrz · · Score: 1

    If you want to see madness coming out of a parliament in Europe, look no further than Whitehall.

    Sorry mjwx, I'm far too engaged watching the madness come out of the US congress, executive, and SCOTUS. You're on your own for this one.

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  82. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by cmdr_klarg · · Score: 1

    What got Ventura elected was that his opponents were both terrible. I've never liked Norm Coleman, and Skip Humphrey was a joke. The die-hards in the GOP and the DFL both voted for their guy, and anyone independent voted for Ventura. From what I remember it was mostly a three way split, with Jesse narrowly taking the win.

    He might be a nut, but he was a damn side better governor than the idiot who succeeded him.

    --
    THE SOFTWARE, IT NO WORKY!!!
  83. Time to consider.. by Sqreater · · Score: 1

    Google and Facebook should seriously consider "kill buttons" for various parts of the world or countries. When doing business there becomes too onerous they should just hit the button and remove service there. Let the governments deal with their citizens over it.

    --
    E Proelio Veritas.
    1. Re:Time to consider.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Google and Facebook should seriously consider "kill buttons" for various parts of the world or countries. When doing business there becomes too onerous they should just hit the button

      The United States Government already has this feature.

      and remove service there.

      Well. A similar feature, anyway.

  84. Good luck with that EU by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    How does a "link tax" even work? I creates a boatload of questions:

    Is that just by having a link, or is that for just clicking through the link?
    Does it assume that whoever clicked the link actually read the content?
    Does the "content owner" assume that because a link is there that people will read the content?
    Do they expect Google to provide the click through numbers? (I somehow doubt it)
    Will a content owner say "We got X click-through's from Google, therefore they owe us $Y", Google says "Show us the numbers" - Mexican standoff ensues.
    Who gets the money generated by the link-tax?

    And people wonder why Brexit is occurring - because the EU seems to do nothing but make up ways of taxing/extorting/extracting/shaking-down people and corporate entitites instead of dealing with the real issues at hand.

  85. Youtube- new model for the internet by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They're trying to turn the entire internet into youtube, where any piece of content can be flagged and taken down, but not just from one site, from the entire web. This isn't about protecting copyright, it's about content control.

  86. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Young people are the biggest fucking snowflakes who take offence at the drop of a hat, usually on nehalf of somebodyt else - they are more likely to demand censorship of things that they consider to be "micro-aggressons" that I care to think about.

  87. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by F.Ultra · · Score: 1

    The EP can block any proposal from the EC, thinking that voting for the EP is worthless is just propaganda from people who want to take away your rights. Here is how the decision making in the EU is done: https://europa.eu/european-uni...

  88. Re:This is what happens when young people don't vo by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That is not true where I live (it is an EU state).

  89. Oh dear. What a pity. Never. Mind. by RockDoctor · · Score: 1

    How this will affect regular internet users is still subject to debate, but it could seriously limit the variety of content available online

    Oh dear. What a pity. Never. Mind.

    and it could pretty much spell the end of memes.

    Oh dear. What a pity. Never. Mind.

    The upsides have been described. Is there a downside?

    --
    Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  90. Laws made by idiots ! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This is exactly what happens when laws are made by people that have no clew of how the internet works and interacts.

    But hey Copyright has always just been a legal form of monopoly and have always benefited big companies over smaller companies why would this be different?

    The fact is that this law will hurt content creators and copyright owners more than the search and interactive websites. Having to negotiate a contract with each copyright holder will simply create bigger companies holding many copyrights and push the independent content creators to the fringes. Think the music industry.

    But hey this is human after all making life difficult for ourselves.