Slashdot Mirror
SGI to drop Irix for Linux
bpdlr (who admits
to being a PC Week writer) sent us a story that proclaims that
SGI Will Drop IRIX
in exchange for some little no-name penguin oriented OS that nobody
has heard of. I'm hearing rumors of a new Linux based mega server
coming out of SGI, as well as some hugely scalable systems. Interesting stuff.
I don't remember directly, but take a look at http://linux.sgi.com and ask there. SGI has funded development for Linux for Mips, but not for all platforms. Currently I know it's on the Indy, and Challenge/S
Open Source Ronin
Nobody prevents you to do that with Linux. At worse you just have to supply your own X server and libraries.
I can understand SGI wanting to get out of the OS business, but not to make their graphics software better.
Maybe competition with PC is the problem for SGI. If they switch to Linux they have the perfect upgrade path: Linux on PC (nowadays with numerous users, and just about every computer science student) -> Linux on SGI. Before: applications on Windows NT -> Irix (which not every one knows).
Well, lets see how long they still make these motherboards and so on.
The big pipes you are talking about are the 2.6? GByte/s connection between chipset and memory.
The don't control the cpu interface so this bandwidth is not seen by the processor only the video system.
The same way they lost the CPU war they will also loose the Graphics war. And when intel comes out with a new chipset with more bells and all,
people will go buy that instead of a SGI box that
offers less.
SGI Cabalt chipset - 2.6 GB/s
intel 840 chipset - 3.2 GB/s
Mind you all this is in the chipset not visible to
the processor.
if you want big pipes get a DP264 Motherboard
from compaq. it has an alpha that has a
5.2 GB/s connection to memory (aggregate for 2 cpu)
or an XP1000, it as a 2.6 GB/s connection to memory. and you can actually use that bandwidth
in programs.
What I see for SGI is that they need to use their
name and fancy designers. to make boxes just
like DELL, and maybe people will like their cool
colours and buy.
This is what you get when you have a ceo that bets his entire company on the future products of anohter company. (esspecially one that wants to kill your current products).
I work for SGI any you're post is completely inaccurate. SGI will continue to support MIPS and IRIX. SGI has NEVER announced dropping support for IRIX and it STILL doesn't intend to. Even this article points out that we have a MIPS roadmap for R12k R14k and R16k. The overall title of this slashdot article is completely misleading. The article isn't by SGI even it doesn't say SGI is dropping IRIX. I suppose to a salivating slashdot audience the notion of Linux displacing a grown up OS sounds exciting, but it just isn't ready to replace IRIX feature for feature so dropping that OS is NOT an option.
SGI has gone from making CPU's, OS's, chipsets, Video systems
to making motherboards, chipsets and video cards.
Soon they will only make video cards and then after that they will only sell prepackages systems from INTEL, and then after that they will be sold to some other company. maybe DELL.
And after that DELL will see its profits thin out
when INTEL starts making everything. and the
compute companies become intel's distributors.
Before that happens, SGI will die. the products
they have now that seem cool will fizzle out
soon just take a look at their VW.
The big pipes people talk about are the 2.6 GByte/s connection between chipset and memory.
The don't control the cpu interface so this bandwidth is not seen by the processor only the video system.
The same way they lost the CPU war they will also loose the Graphics war. And when intel comes out with a new chipset with more bells and all,
people will go buy that instead of a SGI box that
offers less.
SGI Cabalt chipset - 2.6 GB/s
intel 840 chipset - 3.2 GB/s
Mind you all this is in the chipset not visible to
the processor.
if you want big pipes get a DP264 Motherboard
from compaq. it has an alpha that has a
5.2 GB/s connection to memory (aggregate for 2 cpu)
or an XP1000, it as a 2.6 GB/s connection to memory. and you can actually use that bandwidth
in programs.
What I see for SGI is that they need to use their
name and fancy designers. to make boxes just
like DELL, and maybe people will like their cool
colours and buy.
This is what you get when you have a ceo that bets his entire company on the future products of anohter company. (esspecially one that wants to kill your current products).
actually its easier than solaris for admins and the screen res (1600 x 1200) is by default and a real pleasure to work with. of course if they got rid of nodelocked license servers and other shit i'd be a *lot* happier....
its also the first os where its harder to compile for 64bit than 32bit...the 64bit libraries are usually never around when you need em. :)
I have in the past seen slashdot and it's subscribers bemoan the accuracy of reporting in the mainstream media. Unfortunately here we have an example of the sensationalist inaccuracy worthy of the lowest tabloid.
Nowhere in the article was dropping Irix or it's support announced. There is even less which attributes any statement even similar to an SGI representative.
In future at least read the referring article before choosing a title.
yes..but i'd challenge you to find a $10K IRIX which would run rings around a $10K alpha box running linux.
But people, let us not weep over the death of
IRIX and the terminal illness that afflicts SGI,
let us rejoice that SGI has seen if fit to bequest
us with their technology.
Let us stand up and cheer. Shout as loud as you can and pour libation for the good deeds of our
passing friend.
There is still hope in Alpha.
We shall walk tall and sing merry songs when
EV68 arrives.
So mates sing with me EV68 EV68,
70 SpecINT, 120 SpecFP, now that is merry song.
www.alpha-processor.com
Of course not. But they are transitioning their *workstations* to IA-64.
And as far as IRIX goes, they have a good reason NOT to port it to IA-64. It is much too reliant on the underlying hardware for primitives, and likely would not perform as well on a large IA-64 box (that is assuming that IA-64 will scale to 64+ CPUs).
The truth is out there... Now go find it!!
Go get yourself a kernel book or two and READ about why Linux won't scale well. Then let us know what you learn.
If changes aren't necessary, they are better off not making them (otherwise they might as well stay with IRIX). If they are necessary, it is always better to have a hacked Linux than a closed IRIX.
SGI controls the OS as much as anyone else does if that OS is Linux. One simply doesn't need to be the sole owner. They can just concentrate on those parts of the OS that people would buy their hardware for.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
IRIX was also the first 64b OS that fully and transparently supported 32b apps. No recompiling, no massive performance degradations... davemc
Open Source Ronin
Don't forget system accounts with no passwords!
Computers are useless. They can only give you answers. -- Pablo Picasso
As much as I love Linux, IRIX beats the heck out of linux when it comes to scalability. Ever see a 64 processor Linux box? I think Linux will get there in the future, but why would SGI kill IRIX now?
Sounds like a rumor to me...
SGI bagging IRIX/MIPS? Doubtful, to say the least.
Although I am thrilled that they are participating in the Linux Revolution (tm), they have much bigger fishies to fry.
According to www.top500.org, SGI is owning the supercomputer market. They account for over 1/3 of the world's installed base, and almost 1/2 of the world's supercomputer horsepower.
To even think that they'll push Linux in that direction is a stretch, since they already have IRIX doing it, and doing it well. Its not that I think its a bad idea; its just not practical for SGI to do it.
I also seem to remember reading in one of the trade rags, (infoworld?) that SGI was designing hardware that would scale as high as 16k processors. (I might be wrong...this was about a year ago)
SGI used to be the coolest company around; everybody wanted to work for them, as they had hardware and software that nobody could beat.
But look at them now. They're going to be selling Merced/Linux systems. They don't make the hardware and they don't make the software. I'm sure the systems they sell will be high-end and quality systems, but we've seen a giant fall. (They still make really cool cases, though.)
If I had to guess, SGI isn't looking to focus all of their efforts just on graphics -- if they were, they'd probably stick with IRIX rather than trying to get Linux up to shape.
What seems more likely is that SGI feels like they're being locked out of larger, more lucrative markets like web serving and databases. This seems to be the main reason why they officially droped the name "Silicon Graphics" and adopted "SGI" as their name -- they don't want to be associated with just graphics anymore.
As it is now, IRIX is probably too specialized for graphics and they'd rather move to a platform (one which, being open source, they can exert some creative influence on) which has a more general user base and application support.
Just my $0.02
Thanks, I think you're illustrating the main
problem I have with Linux -- it's zealot users.
(Actually, I have a problem with zealotry from
any OS camp, including my beloved BeOS.)
-WW
--
Why are there so many Unix-using Star Trek fans?
When was the last time Picard said, "Computer, bring
..it scales up to 256 processors
2048. Go read the latest supercomputer list. A single image IRIX-based Origin 2000 supercomputer is number six on the list. But the claim about IRIX being the first 64-bit OS is true if you are talking a *single image* system.
Thank you. About time somebody said it. It's the *IGNORANT FOOL* users that spread their misinformed opinions about Linux that actually hurt it. Rather than *acknowledging its weaknesses* (HINT - even LINUS does - read the kernel mailing list) - those zealots are the ones who only hurt Linux as serious users point to them and say "ha, I'll be damned if I'll run an OS if people can only spout off such garbage."
I used to say the same thing when I ran OS/2. I've used them *all*, and I know the advantages and disadvantages as well as the architectures of each. Now if only everyone else did and could remain civilized...
Where does this live their high-end graphic applications?
"Dogs and cats, living together...it's mass hysteria!"
You don't even know what SIMD, MIMD and MISD mean, do you?
Simple point of clarity. Also a minor goof in the article:
"Linux is a 32-bit operating system and does not scale beyond four processors."
A suppose those alpha types have just been wasting 32 bits this whole time, eh? =)
How's my programming? Call 1-800-DEV-NULL
An educated opinion is a well-informed opinion. The following is my list, in order of decreasing complexity and (what I think) are admirable design characteristics and flaws:
1. IRIX - fully multithreaded, very scalable, but VERY expensive (prohibitively in most app areas)
2. WinNT - fully multithreaded, flexible, not too scalable, though it has a large learning curve and suffers from backward compatability
3. Tru64 (formerly Digital UNIX) - microkernel based, flexible, fast, scalable, great networking OS
4. QNX - microkernel, RTOS, small footprint. Main drawbacks are expense, copying overhead in the OS and only (currently) runs on X86
5. BeOS - microkernel, fast, efficient, great development tools, portable. Doesn't scale to really big boxes.. At least not yet.
6. Solaris - scalable, though it's too close to classic UNIX architecture for my taste and ships rather broken until you apply a gazillion patches.
7. Linux - older architecture kernel, over-hyped, doesn't scale well for the lack of fine grained kernel locks, not fully POSIX compliant (yet). Is easy to develop on and has a wide base of portability; it's also cheap and supports a lot of lower end hardware, which makes it great for clustering (MIMD supercomputers) and research.
8. FreeBSD - fast, efficient, but supports only X86 and doesn't scale very well. With Alpha support, it's winning some of my favor.
9. VxWorks - great for embedded stuff, not much use to the average consumer; it's a RTOS.
10. LynxOS - another RTOS, POSIX compliant, runs on PPC and X86, but it's rather broken unless you're reserving it for a dedicated application.
11. MacOS - it's pretty but it's reminiscent of Win 3.1. MacOS X will change that.. But for now the Apple OS is rather worthless IMHO.
12. HPUX - it's a kludge; it's a miracle it works. HP makes good printers. That's about all I give them credit for.
13. Win95 - it's not an OS, get over it.
VMS would be close to the top of my list, but it's dead.. Anyway WinNT is largely based on the good things of VMS from a computer science perspective, as is Tru64; hence they're on the top of my list.
This opinion is based on ease of use, flexibility, scalability, TCO, portability, and of course- adherence to classical OS theory of each OS. My two cents.
Shouldn't the language be "claims" rather than "proclaims."
An official with the company "proclaims" things. A journalist just "claims" them.
I'm not denying the possibility that the rumor is true, just pointing out that it's, um... a rumor, isn't it?
SGI sent me a IRIX 5.3 CD (only, no manual) free of charge after I called them because I had a hard time finding IRIX for my R3k box. I was suprised, cool company.
It's common knowledge that, when a team is doing poorly, the manager is the first to go. It's no surprise that the Yankees went through quite a few managers in the late 80's. Name me a few teams who keep managers longer than the Yanks have held onto Torre. however.
- A.P.
--
"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
"Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
- A.P.
--
"One World, One Web, One Program" - Microsoft Promotional Ad
"Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
This is great news.
mental ray , the renderer that most Softimage shops use, is already ported to Linux (x86 and Alpha) as well as many other flavors of Un*x. It lets a master machine farm out tiles to worker machines and it is multithreaded (takes advantage of SMP) as well.
"Yeah well
Well, considering what I have been reading in a few newsgroups recently about how badly some 32-bit Linux apps port to Linux Alpha, yes.
Like $400 for 6.x _media_ (not _license_ or _support_)?
berate SGI now? The only real mistake I see lately is their logo change. They still support MIPS in their other systems. The Visual Workstations are a step in the profit direction. Instead of having to use all of their own software (having a hardware and software division gets very expensive) they can now use Windows or Linux on their workstations and servers. They're doing their best to port their IRIX stuff to linux, which is much easier than porting to NT because linux is entirely open source. Their hardware is nothing to scoff at either, a 64bit PCI bus isn't something Amptron offers of their motherboards, and their total memory bandwidth is very high. Yes I know the 810 will get 3+ gigs of bandwidth, but will people really use it? Having a completely locked down motherboard is something I thought might be going away. SGI's board is expandable as any other 440BX board.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
In a couple weeks at SIGGRAPH, SGI will be demoing hardware acceleration and IRIS Performer under linux.
Y2K patches for IRIX are available for free download. Just because you cant go look for them, doesnt mean they arent there. The Linux cult is just always to quick to slam any thing not linux. As for not being able to get an actual version of Irix,that can only be laziness. Nice to see a company betting their future on nothing but hype a nd the steamroller effect of the linux cult.
Yeah, but it still required IRIX. They trapped system calls to do X, and last time I checked it seemed like SGI wasn't going to help them with the Graphic Cards info so they could write an X server. Not that it mattered so much, before my indy's power supply died, Irix ran like a charm, and I would never of changed it over to linux since all my lovely video capture stuff would have been useless.
>they are also porting IRIX to IA64
? st.ne.fd.gif.f
No they are not. This was killed. You are correct that MIPS is still to be irix and they are still developing future versions of irix for mips cpu's but they have offically canned the port of irix to ia64.
This cnet article confirms it:
http://www.news.com/News/Item/0,4,38162,00.html
complete with quotes from sgi senior executives.
I don't know if its me, but somehow the article comes up blank. All I get is what looks like the bottom where it asks to comment on the article or e-mail it to a friend. Whats up with that?
great! now open up the source to Irix so we can use the good parts in Linux
He makes it sound like an irrevocable fact that SGI will drop Irix AND Mips. I'd like to see an independent confirmation on *THAT* one. Would SGI jettison 2/3 of its sales, and leave the supercomputer market for good? Not too bloody likely!
>I can't think of many other teams who have only had two or three managers in *this* decade.
Um, what about Tommy Lasorda? Until he retired for health reasons a couple of years ago, he managed the Dodgers for DECADES. Through thick and thin, Tommy didn't get tossed for a few bad seasons. This is the kind to team spirit, comradary, and loyalty that's being killed out of baseball these days. Sad.
I think the truth is SGI realise they haven't got a chance of establishing Irix as the standard UNIX on IA-64. Linux's popularity on x86, however, will provide the software base necessary to sustain it as a viable platform on IA-64, even if it's unlikely to become the standard.
The other UNIX vendors are still vying fiercely for the top spot, and really are contenders. To abandon their operating systems at a time like this, with control of UNIX market on the Intel 64-bit platform at stake, would be madness.
I'm afraid your line of questioning misses the point entirely. In the UNIX market today, the money is in the hardware, and each of the major vendors provides a different and incompatible hardware platform. If the UNIX market moves to IA-64, these hardware fiefdoms will disappear.
Remember what happened to the PC market in the 1980s, when IA-32 established itself as the standard platform: the PC vendors were either driven into the ground or transformed into packagers of commodity systems. At the same time, the collapsing hardware prices and exploding volume of shipments became a gold mine for the software companies (especially Microsoft, which owned the dominant OS on the IA-32 platform).
It presumes that SGI is capable of making a decision.
Isn't Multics 48 bit ?
I've been an IRIX user for a long time (own
an Indy), and must admit this might actually
be a Bad Thing. Now, don't get me wrong, I
also have a Linux box, and use it most of the
time, but IRIX really is amazing. I hate to
see it go. I'm hoping that ALL Irix software
will be ported. If that happens, then I'll
switch this over to a Good Thing. Irix is
by far the most stable operating system I
have ever used. I would love to see the same
software minds who came up with it now focus
on Linux. We're in for a fun ride!
--- witty signature
So maybe they do themselves a favour not porting it to IA64.
Thanks for the hint!
;-) Hopefully
The WWW-Site at http://www.linux.sgi.com indeed
is a good starting point to get informations
about Linux on SGI/Mips and SGI/Intel. There
is a distribution called "Hard Hat 5.1" derived from RedHat 5.1.
It should be possible to use Linux on a large
number of R4x00 and R5000 SGI machines. For other
brands of R3000 (DEC 2100 etc.) linux ports have
been done.
Freely available patches for Irix (according
to A.C.)
- Are you sure about Irix 5.3?
- We are talking about R3000 Indigo for which you
can't get an Irix 6.x
- Never change a running system
they will at least be usable as terminals,
with or without Linux
Don't worry.
SGI is migrating down to linux the features they think linux needs to move up to the type of hardware SGI wants to build (think Origin and Onyx with Merced in place of MIPS). XFS and the direct rendering infrastucture are the most visible of these.
It will take time for these, and other less visible, Irix features to migrate to Linux - which is why SGI is still commited to supporting Irix on MIPS through two more processor generations (R14K and beyond).
I can't comment on the state of XFS for Linux, SGI said they would need some time to put the source in a releaseable form - they need to make sure they don't release copyrighted code etc.
Anyone else have trouble viewing the page? All I get is what looks like a frame asking me if I want to comment on the story.
As a result, an updated version has been posted here.
The errors corrected are:
- Linux not being only 32-bit
- IRIX being the first 64-bit UNIX (OSF/1 was).
- The MIPS processors are R12000, R14000, R16000 not just the numerics.
-JeffWinNT strategy: You can get a box with Linux, and install NT over it. But why would you want to hobble your k-rad SGI hardware like that?
(j/k)
Seriously, however, they'll still be offering NT. There's still a lot of demand for it-- lotta Microsoft-only shops out there-- and it'd be foolish to turn down that customer base.
Look at it this way: The money they make selling NT solutions will help them develop even better Linux solutions };-)
iSKUNK!
..to give an perspective to Your comments..
Thomas Berg
Mundus Vult Decipi
This is the most interesting spin on this article I have seen yet. The idea of Linux being a unifying force in the Unix world. This could be the thing which really brings Unix to be THE dominant OS for business.
Imagine if Solaris, HP-UX, IRIX, etc. were all to be replaced with Linux. A single Unix which has the developement efforts of not only the Linux community, but all the major computer companies. I think this is something which could actually make M$ sweat.
Unfortunately, I do not see this as being a trend. IBM, HP, SUN all have way too much invested in there commercial Unix variants to drop them. As several others have pointed out, this is simply the end of Irix on Intel, not on MIPS. This is still a wonderful thing for the Linux community, and will undoubtedly lead to significant improvements to the Linux kernel, and hopefully the XFree project also.
Good for SGI. Good for Linux. Hopefully, bad for M$.
I think I would be in heaven if only I could find a Linux job.
The first 64-bit microprocessor, perhaps.
Nothing against MIPS parts -- my main workstation at home and my main games machine both use 'em (the latter is faster, of course) -- but 64-bit machines existed well before that.
Just wait; when Merced-based PCs become available, the idiot press will tout them as the first 64-bit computers.
SGI is already going to bag MIPS (eventually)
because it is such a niche chip. The super
computers that SGI "owns" are Crays, not SGIs,
and they run Unicos, not Irix. I'm sure Unicos
will be around for a while, but it makes total
business sense to drop Irix in favour of Linux.
Any hardware that "SGI" is designing to run 64k
processors will run Unicos, not Irix.
Another thing that this may aloow is for linux users to see ports of some killer apps such as softimage, maya and others along those lines. This, in combination with the killer graphics speed of SGI hardware, would make linux a viable replacement for CG. Something else that might benifit is improvment of the tcp stack. MAny apps such as softimage and what not allow beowulf style rendering. This of course, is depending if the apps get ported.
"Fighting the underpants gnomes since 1998!" "Bruce Schneier knows the state of schroedinger's cat"
Merced in an Onyx? Won't they need like 4 of them? Where are they going to find room for those huge slabs of steaming slag? Do they know how they will duct all the smoke and dripping oil out of the case?
Ever heard of clustering?
Adding layers of middle management is a good solution, see what its done for them in the last couple of years.. Get to hiring those pointy haired boss types. And if you go over personell budget? Fire some engineers and replace them with contractors!
(If you dont get the joke: SGI has the largest percentage of middle management compared to the rest of the tech industry and silicon valley)
Slashdot, would a spell-checker for posting be too much to ask? It's not rocket science!
Well, I cannot reveal my sourced, but:
/.
* SGI plan to modify Linux to run on 64 & up processors..
* They're porting Linux to MIPS (not just the R3000, think MUCH bigger numbers - R10000 & up)
* And some more surprises.
As soon as I'll have more info, I'll post it on
Hetz (Heunique)
aah, bite me.
Just chill, man. We're not competing here.
Or did you need to justify your inflated
ego?
--- witty signature
This was about time, if these manufacturers haden't screwed up so badly with their very own incompatible proprietary unix varients there would probably never have been something called windows, and micros~1 would still be trying to sell that crappy QDDOS to IBM. But noooo we had to compete by screwing over our customers now hadn't we? I'm glad to see that at the very least some of these high and mighty corporations have come to their senses before micros~1 burries them!
I guess no one wants all that 'mathy stuff' anymore. Serious computing is at an end.
IRIX 6.2 with IDO:
sgi3 10# apropos matrix | wc
1006 24627 153747
sgi3 11# apropos eigen | wc
244 6123 42143
Redhat 5.2:
stupidpc:~# apropos matrix
matrix: nothing appropriate
stupidpc:~# apropos eigen
eigen: nothing appropriate
But why reinvent the wheel?
When all you need is the valve stem....
The URL in the story doesn't seem to work, but this one does:
s earch_mo.right_frame?p_story=87942
http://webserv.vnunet.com/www_user/plsql/pkg_vnu_
This is nuts. Linux is many years away from hitting the high end. I find it highly unlikely that HP or Sun will be casting off their OS's soon.
I think people tend to underestimate just how far we have to go with linux to get into the higher enterprise market area.
You still have the wrong logo.
The 'sgi' one is for the new
silicon graphics.
What you say above is exactly was SGI states if you ask them. They seem to have a bit more insight than some of their competitors (or perhaps arrive at the insight a little quicker?).
But look at them now. They're going to be selling vendor-lockin/one size fits all systems. They're going to be broken up by the Federal Judiciary and they cannot decommoditize the open standards and protocols in time. I'm sure the systems they will sell will be really expensive and improving with each delay, but we've seen a giant fall. (They still have really pretty packaging, though)
Just sharing the love.
Why is everyone so confrontational here on
/. anyways? Sheesh. Must be all the caffeine
in the systems.
I read the article, too.
Fascist.
;-/
--- witty signature
Yes the high-end supers are crays, but the Origin 2000 series scales as high as 512 procs (although the NCSA one says it has 1024) and it runs IRIX.
The NCSA's is #27 on the top500 list.
www.sgi.com/origin/2000_specs.html
Either way, it is most likely that IRIX and UNICOS will merge to become one high-end solution.
I see this as good news for SGI because a Linux community will strive to make their hardware look even better. This could be a wake up and smell the coffee situation as the Linux community works with systems that show the power of SGI graphics!
I think that if SGI is going to drop Irix, it would be wonderful to see them release portions of their code under a BSD-license, especially since Irix grew out of BSD (and became the first POSIX certified BSD-derived OS).
Read the article closely (and others that deal with the subject)! SGI is not killing Irix. They just opted to not port it to IA64.
At the end of the article it is spelled out clearly that there is MIPS CPU roadmap for R14000 and R16000. For a few years minimum, we will see MIPS/Irix systems alongside with IA64/Linux systems being sold and supported by SGI.
Now that we are talking about the top500 list anyway, maybe you have forgotten the fact that Linux can run on almost any hardware out there, which probably includes most of the hardware on that list!
:)
It sounds like you are expecting Linus to start designing his own hardware especially for linux.
(Now that might not be a bad idea, it would probably rule
>the winningest team in baseball, baby!!
They only win more because they CHEAT!!!!!
Example: '77 World Series, Dodgers and Yankees: Reggie Jackson sticks his *ASS* out to deliberately get hit by a pitch and draw a walk. Fscking NY umps choose not to notice that. Dodgers lost game 1 by 1 run. This is just one example. Truly the Yankees are the Raiders of baseball. Pathetic!
Yankees also have no sense of team loyalty among the players. And managers go in and out like a revolving door. Just business right? The spirit of baseball is DEAD within the Yankees. dead, Dead, DEAD!!!!!
-Dodger Fan (we may be in last place [this year], but at least we don't cheat.)
Geez! I use Linux where I see fit. It's been extremely stable in my experience. But I also use the Mac OS, Be OS, Win 98, Win NT... whatever platform which has the tools to complete the project I'm performing. And it's completely valid to point out that the linux community has some percieved shortcomings. Those need to be addressed in order to achieve the World-Wide Domination that is so often stated on these message boards.
Um, they already gave us XFS, didn't they? We just haven't used it yet.\
------
umm... somebody want to tell them that it supports up to 16 cpu's (on the 2.0, don't know about the 2.2).
oh yeah and what about ultra pengiun? a few more bits there, 64.
damn e-zine writers... don't want to read the howto's.... just like a newbie.
hi =)
Irix the _first_ 64-bit OS? I tried to find out where to research the truth of this, but besides memory I don't know. So, does someone here remember if there was a 64-bit OS before IRIX?
Irix will still be top o' the heap on MIPS.
Shouldn't that be 64-bit? Alpha? Hello...
And the Ford Probe was gonna replace the Mustang
What, no
MPE/ix,
OS390,
OS400?
Get a little outside the mainstream, Darth. Sheesh.
And read the article next time.
Yours doesn't work either. (It works if I select it and cut&paste, but not when I click it. It looks like the URL you put in the HREF=... part doesn't match what you are showing on the screen.) What you show on the screen was right, though. Here's the corrected correct link.
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
Uhhhhh....
They have the same record, bub...
Yankees 62-41
Indians 63-41
and considering how the Yankees completely clobbed Cleveland last week...
this will change as more users & developers get 64-bit systems. I remember the annoying transition from a mips R4400 processor running irix 5.3 (32-bit) to a R10K on an O2 running irix 6.2 (64-bit)....It was painful but relatively short as everyone began to modify their programs or release 64-bit patches. The mips pro compiler which does both 32 & 64 bit compiles (as does gcc) really helped the transition.
Okay, what of Alias|Wavefront? I've heard no rumblings about a Maya (or Composer, etc) port to Linux. This is the 'killer app' for a significant market segment... and it's *owned* by SGI. We know it's portable -- I mean, it runs on IRIX, HPUX (that was the port that the commerce department required when SGI bought Alias and Wavefront, IIRC), and NT. I've heard rumours of a Houdini port... I can't believe SGI would ignore this apparent hole in their corporate strategy -- I mean, it's looking more and more like they're moving from 'Linux as a Visual Workstation server solution' to 'Linux as a total desktop solution'. And smeggin' tanj, Maya is just *cool*.
-spc
<A HREF="buncha stuff here">
buncha stuff here
</A>
And it deleted the stuff after the HREF= when I submitted it.
Rob, something is broke on your site I think.
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
Does this thing run on the Lithium chipset, like the VWs do, or a similar crossbar implementation? It seems that would give it a distinct advantage over typical bus-based Intel architectures.
Is every anti-linux sentiment a Troll? This guy made some valid points that linux users should probably heed. I'm not a Linux fan either by the way. I have my own reasons which I won't get into, but it disturbs me to see such blind Linux worship around here.
OS/360, MVS, Plan 9.
take that.
Like I said, VAX/VMS
Wow, if this is article is right, then this is great news.
But I'm wondering, how will their WinNT strategy fit into with this (if indeed it is true)? Not that I'll use NT ever again, but I'm curious.
it deals with Intel, not MIPS. MIPS will still be IRIX. they are also porting IRIX to IA64 (no new info there) and wil help make Linux 64 bit on IA 64.
why is this news again? seriously, this is nothing new, except the misleading idea that IRIX/MIPS is dying.
jose nazario
jose nazario jose@biocserver.cwru.edu
"We are looking at getting chunks of Irix technology into Linux," said Shiffman.
/bin/eject!
setuid
*duck*
All rights reserved, all wrongs reversed.
Is is already possible to install Linux on these
old systems being an ordinary Unix admin? It
really would be nice if SGI would do some
polishing and make a linux distribution for their
old day systems.
We have four Indigo systems with an R3000 for
which we can't get an actual version of Irix and
therefore no Y2K support.
You don't get it, do you? The Linux Legions are advancing ever closer, ever nearer to World Domination. Linux floats my boat. I hope it sinks yours. Have a good day!
uh, well.. speaking as someone who regularly develops on alphas, whoever is spouting that garbage is wrong. it sounds like someone has not been enlightened to the path of "long int" yet. porting "32-bit" applications to alpha is easy, but only if you have 0.5*(clue).
The mega scalable Unicos, which powers the Cray super computers was first.... (on the commercial level) there probably was some little unknown that beat them... But cray knew how to get the $$ to power such huge ventures... (by selling them to the govt...
Welp, since Linux is even less scalable than NT, this implies that SGI will be pouring cash into kernel improvements--good news, whether SGI stays afloat long term or not.
The word 'disaster' is completely wrong. Overall, SGI have a pretty good record in transitioning to new API's. IRIX64 works quite well.
I can believe they're thinking twice about the port to IA64, however.
'Diabolical enough'? - No.
'Proprietary'? - some. I'd say that would be the hardware though. Not the software.
SGI really want to sell their hardware, above all. There will be no 'fork', why should there be?
It is dying... along with every other UNIX derivative except Solaris. NT continues to eat away UNIX marketshare, and Linux and Solaris continue to grab larger chunks of the UNIX sub-market.
And, frankly, anything on the MIPS processors is going to die, with SGI having already complained that delays in Merced production have forced them to delay discontinuing MIPS processor development.
By MY measure I am a bigger SGI fan than you.
By MY measure the new logo is appropiate for
Intel/Linux Boosters.
By MY measure the cube is for the pre-new logo
machines (excluding the VPC, of course)
So I should be commenting here, and I do.
Btw: any SGI fan would know that 'SkyWriter'
is the name of such a machine that is appropriate
for the cube logo, and as such, rightly bears it
proudly.
if sgi is really going to drop irix (which i SERIOUSLY doubt), they are going to be making a BIG mistake. irix has features (such as guaranteed io bandwidth) that linux doesn't. i think this rumor is pure bullshit.
Go check at ebay. I always see a few IRIX cd's for sale at reasonable prices.
Does anyone else here think that SGI might be diabolical enough to make a "better" Linux-based graphics platform that is largely proprietary? Maybe they wouldn't/couldn't do that, but I'll have to say it makes me a bit nervous. A distro is fine, but massive changes could start a fork.
- Do you make your money off of hardware, support, consulting, and add-on software, or on your proprietary OS?
- Are there unique strengths your company has? (IBM=global enterprise services, SGI=visualization, Sun=network is the computer)
- In the short or medium term, are you shifting to an Intel hardware strategy (ia32, ia64)? (SGI, HP, IBM?)
- In the short term, can you live with less than enterprise level? (SGI)
Why spend oodles of money developing the OS whose only function is to create a market for your hardware, services, unique value, if you can spend less money developing those features into Linux? In the final analysis, your competitive strength is not your OS (especially SGI, IBM, HP; Sun seems to be more tied to Solaris), and it is defocusing to pretend that the OS does anything more than help you get into the market where you strengths show.The problem for the moment for IBM, Sun, HP, is that Linux is seen mostly as an Intel solution, and that it doesn't scale up to enterprise levels. But it makes perfect sense for SGI to phase out Irix in favor of a Linux with all the support for visualization that plays to SGI's strengths. And it makes sense for the rest to shift R&D from proprietary OSs, into Linux, to develop the enterprise level features and strength on non-Intel platforms to allow them to phase out AIX, HP-UX, Solaris, etc.
This is a clear win for Linux (witness XFS, etc.), and we ought to encourage this as much as possible.
The Linux filesystem is the one place where NT continues to beat us over the head. I was thrilled when I heard SGI was going to port their journaled filesystem, xfs, to Linux. Now I'm worried. Anyone know the xfs status?
It's probably just very expensive for big vendors to maintain their own flavour of unix, so just put the best bits of their own unix into linux, and allow the open source community to look after it, with allthe other bebefits linux brings (multi-platform compatibility etc).
Maybe if more vendors do this (competing to add technology to linux ???) then we'll see it improve much further than it already has.
Wow, your posting is very concrete.
Nevertheless, I haven't run into problems using Linux on Alpha for about a year now. The so-called "32-bit Linux apps" can be easily compiled on Alpha without any trouble. Of course, some authors make such great assumption as sizeof(int) == sizeof(void *), but more and more people seem to realize that this is not true. 32-bitism - die!