you use the STABLE gcc and compile WITHOUT the unstable binary optimizations and you'll have a *far* more stable server environment that will STILL outperform win2k.
ALSO, your allegation about a lack of smp support is flat wrong, as well as the lack of journaled filesystem support; although reiserfs may (i don't remember) not have been in the kernel at that time, it certainly was stable, and if you're smart enough to go jerking around with gcc as you say you did (i'm just gonna assume for the sake of this argument that you did that part correctly) then you certainly should have been smart enough to go to freshmeat to get the reiserfs stuff.
and, btw: i could load any of a number of beta software programs onto a win2k box and have it crashing left and right in short order, without nearly as useful error information at that.
(note to moderators: at least READ the parent post before you mod me down. christ save the linux community from idiots like this.)
Imagine a whole army of renegade AIBOs released upon Sony's corporate headquarters, indiscriminantly humping and micturating all over everything in they're path.
so how do we fix this?
on
Lindows Reviewed
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
So the problem is that over-userfriendlyness breeds stupid users? Can't we try to educate the users? If i had several million dollars of venture capital and a one way ticket back in time to when the market boom was still high, here's what i'd do to fix the primary problem with desktop computing:
I'd create a linux distro designed to TEACH FUNDAMENTAL PRINCIPLES of computer use to the users... things like coherent file organization, user permissions, networking security... just some basic stuff, as well as how to actually use the linux distro that we (my company) would also spend a lot of time setting up to be more secure by default, and well-configured (read: easy to use, but not masking the actual functionality behind all the pretty widgets) so that not only could it be a quality operating system for experienced users, it would be a perfect stepping-stone for morons who are used to having they're brains spoonfed the babyfood that windows and macos feed them.
The result? A *significant* increase in the relevant education level of computer users exposed
to this operating system.
potential <subjective>positive</subjective> side-affects:
1)decrease in M$ desktop marketshare due to higher level of user-education (once you've used *our* OS you *know* why windows sucks... you've become enlightened enough to see past all they're FUD and marketing hype into the rotten core of the thing)
2)world peace. (oh yea... i'm on a roll now heheh) believe it or not, education is a good thing... teach people more about computers and get them more fascinated in the TECHNOLOGY aspect of the computing, rather than just the pretty colors and the ability to send instant messages to minors across the planet and you've actually awakened more of the thing this world needs the most: intelligent thinkers who make judgements based on integrity and quality and other high-minded concepts that joe-sixpack doesn't want to take the time to try to understand.
3)(ready for this) SECURITY... yes, the internet will become a SAFER PLACE. more people will understand WHY you don't run an exe that comes into your mailbox from a stranter (or often from a co-worker) and why email-hoaxes can't be real and...
*soapbox rant*
bah. i don't know, i'm just fucking around with those last two, but seriously though, there are IMPORTANT intellectual concepts that affect not only computing, but LIFESTYLE, that the Linux community has a FAR better grasp of than the "windows community"... and truthfully the ONLY salvation we have from Microsoft taking over the whole world has it's source in simply finding a way to impart this knowlege unto everyone OUTSIDE the linux community that we can, and we're not going to be able to do that by scaring them with our super-intelligent operating system, and we're not going to be able to do that by trying to get the government on our side (we'll get crushed like a kid getting picked on in the schoolyard for telling on a bully) and we're sure as hell not going to do it by sitting on our collective asses and looking down our noses at those who "just don't get it"
the common populace CAN be taught, as long as you present it in an easy-to-consume bright shiny fun-looking semi-affordable package. once you've done that you can teach them anything you want, we just need to pick the right thing to teach them.
i'm sorry, but does anyone notice that there's a hell of a lot of patents going up for trivially common or mundane concepts that are already in common use lately?
i suspect there's a gross misunderstanding of the purpose of the patent office somewhere, and i highly suspect that it might be at the patent office, not here on slashdot.
does anyone have any real info on what the process for accepting patents is? how is all this seemingly insane patenting happening?
but what would the the impact on the structure of the binaries? could you make a processor like this and have it actually function 136 times faster with binaries compiled for a single or dual processor chip? wouldn't compilers have to be massively re-written to take advantage of this type of architectural change?
i don't think you're correct there. *porting* games to linux is not economically profitable. porting games to the mac has never been economically profitable. what makes windows the most popular gaming platform is the fact that there are really no new popular games coming out for anything that don't come out on windows first, usually with better support and higher performance.
if you read the interview, you'll notice that Draker points out it was never they're intention to make a permanent business out of porting linux games. they were merely testing the waters to find out if people would buy linux games at all... if there was a market to be had in linux gaming. they simply didn't manage to make it all the way to the eventual goal of creating new high-profile games for linux FIRST, something that may well have turned the tides and put linux into the gaming market (a market that honestly only exists for windows pc's at this point)
how many mac or linux games do you see on the shelves when you walk into an electronic's botiquie in the mall? not many. how many windows games do you see? walls of them. think that doesn't affect the judgement of anyone deciding what type of computer to buy for the first time? you bet it does.
i *weep* for the linux community at this tragic loss
but seriously. the point you're missing is the gaming industry is a MAJOR factor in Window's market share. if the industry simply waits around for a larger market share to magically appear just becuase Linux deserves it, it's never going to happen. if linux is ever going to "beat" windows (i'll leave the discussion on whether this is a proper idea or not aside for now) in the desktop market, then it needs to be given the same weapons that *got* windows the desktop market in the first place.
although i SHOULD mention that until VERY recently one of those boxes that happened also to be using an Aureal Vortex 2 soundcard (good soundcard... damn shame about the company) was experiencing lockups on sound play until someone discovered that you have to run this line:
/sbin/setpci -d '12eb:*' 40.B=ff
before using the soundcard in order to keep athalon systems with aureal vortex-based soundcards from locking up.
frankly, i'm not even sure what the hell that line
does, it's magic. i don't even know how you'd go
about figuring something like that out, but at least now i can use my soundcard in linux... damn shame about windows. heh.
what exactly is the percentage of chips affected? i've been personally in the presence of 3 different athalon-based systems for extended periods of time that did not seem to have this problem.
...and anyway, even if every single document being passed around your company is completely kosher and totally legal and can in no way be manipulated against your company in court, that doesn't mean that it *can't* be manipulated against your company in the marketplace, by other companies, many of which may be evil.
Microsoft put out a working implementation that's at least somewhat close to the W3C DOM.
i believe your'e wrong. i believe the w3c DOM that mozilla now tries to follow (which even IE is not much closer to than NS4 was) did not even really exist when netscape communicator was in beta. in fact, i'd be interested in any evidence to the contrary. remember the beta for netscape communicator came out in the summer of 97. at the time, the newest version of IE (still ie3 then) didn't even support *javascript*
furthermore, you're forgetting that netscape *created* javascript. if *anyone* had (and i say HAD because for all intents and purposes netscape is dead to the innovation world now) the right to make "proprietary" javascript (remember all DHTML really IS is just javascript handles to css properties of DOM objects) it was them.
What you're arguing is like accusing Ford of making proprietary automobiles.
Over the last couple years, the single thing holding DHTML back has been the 10-15% of stubbron Netscape 4 users. Putting the failure of DHTML on Microsoft is silly -- Netscape was the bigger criminal there.
And furthermore, if M$ had any dedication to the forwarding of actual technological progress on the net, when they built they're javascript enabled browser which came AFTER netscape's, then they damn well could have held to netscape's standard, insted of this "embrace and extend" tactic we see so often. Your argument that netscape's standard is to blame for the lack of a universal standard on the net is faulty, because when it was created, netscape had something like an 80% share of the net users on they're browser.
microsoft built a counter-standard browser first, with a tiny portion of the internet browser user base, and then used they're monopoly to CRUSH netscape out of they're 80% market share.
However the one thing we agree on is the important point. the casualty of war here *is* DHTML, and for what it's worth, i blame the large part of the big failures of the net on the lack of a universal standard for it, and thereby on Microsoft.
you know, it's really a tragedy that netscape didn't survive to see this day. i mean, sure AOL is obviously going to benefit from the war-crimes against netscape on they're behalf, but once upon a time this type of thing might have been enough to keep netscape from having been eaten by AOL in the fist place.
Let's get one thing straight here: However M$ managed to win with IE, it was NOT because it was a better piece of software. What the industry lost with the death of netscape was far more of a blow to
the technological progress of web technologies than
just the simple fact that IE is considered by most internet users to be the only acceptable browser. What the industry lost was JavaScript.
... now hear me out at least before you dismiss this post. The javascript i'm talking about isn't the cheesy mouseover-effect popup-annoyance ad-spamming tool that the industry knows today... the javascript i'm talking about is the client-side event-based windowing/navigation scripting language that the original technology could have evolved into before M$ crushed netscape and with it any chance of javascript growing past it's infancy.
i could see favoring a profitable buyout, especially in an unstable market... but truthfully, i think redhat has a duty to the community... (hell, why not?)... to society as a whole to continue to fight against corporate monsters like AOL rather than sell they're souls just so the exec's can have a secure retirement fund.
myself, i've had little problem with 2.4 on either the performance OR stability front... my problems have been with those stupid X drivers Nvidia has been releasing, with they're terrible adherence to the 2.4's "way of doing things" and almost complete lack of integrity when it comes to performance and stability.
microsoft is evil. someone needs to realize that they can't be proven guilty by any of our laws, because all our laws rely on the power of the courts to enforce them... what we need is the purifying all-powerful justice of the wrath of god; the only thing that can save us now!
of course there's just enough holes in this story to keep anyone from being able to determine whether it's even based on truth or not from only the information here, but i truly hope that either way, there ARE stories of this sort happening in Afghanistan, and that stories such as this aren't just a lot of well-intentioned hogwash designed to keep the american public from realizing that dispite the fact that we're about to win vietnam here, it's going to be a hell of a lot harder to live with afterwards this time.
i think those people at mastercard are fools. think of the untapped resource here!... they say copywrite violation, i'd say it's a goddamn good advertisement for mastercard.
Slashdot Mirror
you did WHAT with gcc 3.1?!?!?!?
no. no no no no no!
you use the STABLE gcc and compile WITHOUT the unstable binary optimizations and you'll have a *far* more stable server environment that will STILL outperform win2k.
ALSO, your allegation about a lack of smp support is flat wrong, as well as the lack of journaled filesystem support; although reiserfs may (i don't remember) not have been in the kernel at that time, it certainly was stable, and if you're smart enough to go jerking around with gcc as you say you did (i'm just gonna assume for the sake of this argument that you did that part correctly) then you certainly should have been smart enough to go to freshmeat to get the reiserfs stuff.
and, btw: i could load any of a number of beta software programs onto a win2k box and have it crashing left and right in short order, without nearly as useful error information at that.
(note to moderators: at least READ the parent post before you mod me down. christ save the linux community from idiots like this.)
Imagine a whole army of renegade AIBOs released upon Sony's corporate headquarters, indiscriminantly humping and micturating all over everything in they're path.
So the problem is that over-userfriendlyness breeds stupid users? Can't we try to educate the users? If i had several million dollars of venture capital and a one way ticket back in time to when the market boom was still high, here's what i'd do to fix the primary problem with desktop computing:
...
:)
I'd create a linux distro designed to TEACH FUNDAMENTAL PRINCIPLES of computer use to the users... things like coherent file organization, user permissions, networking security... just some basic stuff, as well as how to actually use the linux distro that we (my company) would also spend a lot of time setting up to be more secure by default, and well-configured (read: easy to use, but not masking the actual functionality behind all the pretty widgets) so that not only could it be a quality operating system for experienced users, it would be a perfect stepping-stone for morons who are used to having they're brains spoonfed the babyfood that windows and macos feed them.
The result? A *significant* increase in the relevant education level of computer users exposed
to this operating system.
potential <subjective>positive</subjective> side-affects:
1)decrease in M$ desktop marketshare due to higher level of user-education (once you've used *our* OS you *know* why windows sucks... you've become enlightened enough to see past all they're FUD and marketing hype into the rotten core of the thing)
2)world peace. (oh yea... i'm on a roll now heheh) believe it or not, education is a good thing... teach people more about computers and get them more fascinated in the TECHNOLOGY aspect of the computing, rather than just the pretty colors and the ability to send instant messages to minors across the planet and you've actually awakened more of the thing this world needs the most: intelligent thinkers who make judgements based on integrity and quality and other high-minded concepts that joe-sixpack doesn't want to take the time to try to understand.
3)(ready for this) SECURITY... yes, the internet will become a SAFER PLACE. more people will understand WHY you don't run an exe that comes into your mailbox from a stranter (or often from a co-worker) and why email-hoaxes can't be real and
*soapbox rant*
bah. i don't know, i'm just fucking around with those last two, but seriously though, there are IMPORTANT intellectual concepts that affect not only computing, but LIFESTYLE, that the Linux community has a FAR better grasp of than the "windows community"... and truthfully the ONLY salvation we have from Microsoft taking over the whole world has it's source in simply finding a way to impart this knowlege unto everyone OUTSIDE the linux community that we can, and we're not going to be able to do that by scaring them with our super-intelligent operating system, and we're not going to be able to do that by trying to get the government on our side (we'll get crushed like a kid getting picked on in the schoolyard for telling on a bully) and we're sure as hell not going to do it by sitting on our collective asses and looking down our noses at those who "just don't get it"
the common populace CAN be taught, as long as you present it in an easy-to-consume bright shiny fun-looking semi-affordable package. once you've done that you can teach them anything you want, we just need to pick the right thing to teach them.
*getting off soapbox now*
thanks for your time
i'm sorry, but does anyone notice that there's a hell of a lot of patents going up for trivially common or mundane concepts that are already in common use lately?
i suspect there's a gross misunderstanding of the purpose of the patent office somewhere, and i highly suspect that it might be at the patent office, not here on slashdot.
does anyone have any real info on what the process for accepting patents is? how is all this seemingly insane patenting happening?
or has it been patented already?
mabye i can get a patent for patenting patenting!
i rule!
but what would the the impact on the structure of the binaries? could you make a processor like this and have it actually function 136 times faster with binaries compiled for a single or dual processor chip? wouldn't compilers have to be massively re-written to take advantage of this type of architectural change?
Linux gaming is just not economically profitable.
i don't think you're correct there. *porting* games to linux is not economically profitable. porting games to the mac has never been economically profitable. what makes windows the most popular gaming platform is the fact that there are really no new popular games coming out for anything that don't come out on windows first, usually with better support and higher performance.
if you read the interview, you'll notice that Draker points out it was never they're intention to make a permanent business out of porting linux games. they were merely testing the waters to find out if people would buy linux games at all... if there was a market to be had in linux gaming. they simply didn't manage to make it all the way to the eventual goal of creating new high-profile games for linux FIRST, something that may well have turned the tides and put linux into the gaming market (a market that honestly only exists for windows pc's at this point)
how many mac or linux games do you see on the shelves when you walk into an electronic's botiquie in the mall? not many. how many windows games do you see? walls of them. think that doesn't affect the judgement of anyone deciding what type of computer to buy for the first time? you bet it does.
i *weep* for the linux community at this tragic loss
but seriously. the point you're missing is the gaming industry is a MAJOR factor in Window's market share. if the industry simply waits around for a larger market share to magically appear just becuase Linux deserves it, it's never going to happen. if linux is ever going to "beat" windows (i'll leave the discussion on whether this is a proper idea or not aside for now) in the desktop market, then it needs to be given the same weapons that *got* windows the desktop market in the first place.
isn't this obvious to anyone else out there?
although i SHOULD mention that until VERY recently one of those boxes that happened also to be using an Aureal Vortex 2 soundcard (good soundcard... damn shame about the company) was experiencing lockups on sound play until someone discovered that you have to run this line:
/sbin/setpci -d '12eb:*' 40.B=ff
before using the soundcard in order to keep athalon systems with aureal vortex-based soundcards from locking up.
frankly, i'm not even sure what the hell that line
does, it's magic. i don't even know how you'd go
about figuring something like that out, but at least now i can use my soundcard in linux... damn shame about windows. heh.
what exactly is the percentage of chips affected? i've been personally in the presence of 3 different athalon-based systems for extended periods of time that did not seem to have this problem.
...and anyway, even if every single document being passed around your company is completely kosher and totally legal and can in no way be manipulated against your company in court, that doesn't mean that it *can't* be manipulated against your company in the marketplace, by other companies, many of which may be evil.
Microsoft put out a working implementation that's at least somewhat close to the W3C DOM.
i believe your'e wrong. i believe the w3c DOM that mozilla now tries to follow (which even IE is not much closer to than NS4 was) did not even really exist when netscape communicator was in beta. in fact, i'd be interested in any evidence to the contrary. remember the beta for netscape communicator came out in the summer of 97. at the time, the newest version of IE (still ie3 then) didn't even support *javascript*
furthermore, you're forgetting that netscape *created* javascript. if *anyone* had (and i say HAD because for all intents and purposes netscape is dead to the innovation world now) the right to make "proprietary" javascript (remember all DHTML really IS is just javascript handles to css properties of DOM objects) it was them.
What you're arguing is like accusing Ford of making proprietary automobiles.
Over the last couple years, the single thing holding DHTML back has been the 10-15% of stubbron Netscape 4 users. Putting the failure of DHTML on Microsoft is silly -- Netscape was the bigger criminal there.
And furthermore, if M$ had any dedication to the forwarding of actual technological progress on the net, when they built they're javascript enabled browser which came AFTER netscape's, then they damn well could have held to netscape's standard, insted of this "embrace and extend" tactic we see so often. Your argument that netscape's standard is to blame for the lack of a universal standard on the net is faulty, because when it was created, netscape had something like an 80% share of the net users on they're browser.
microsoft built a counter-standard browser first, with a tiny portion of the internet browser user base, and then used they're monopoly to CRUSH netscape out of they're 80% market share.
However the one thing we agree on is the important point. the casualty of war here *is* DHTML, and for what it's worth, i blame the large part of the big failures of the net on the lack of a universal standard for it, and thereby on Microsoft.
heh. i wonder if they'll be around long enough to announce having paid back all that investment capital....
but the question i have is this:
is this really proof that amazon's business model is sound?
i'm amazed by the amount of effort that has gone into this apparently completely useless post.
you know, it's really a tragedy that netscape didn't survive to see this day. i mean, sure AOL is obviously going to benefit from the war-crimes against netscape on they're behalf, but once upon a time this type of thing might have been enough to keep netscape from having been eaten by AOL in the fist place.
this is proof that in an infinite amount of time, the quantnum probability of anything happening is at least 1
Let's get one thing straight here: However M$ managed to win with IE, it was NOT because it was a better piece of software. What the industry lost with the death of netscape was far more of a blow to
the technological progress of web technologies than
just the simple fact that IE is considered by most internet users to be the only acceptable browser. What the industry lost was JavaScript.
... now hear me out at least before you dismiss this post. The javascript i'm talking about isn't the cheesy mouseover-effect popup-annoyance ad-spamming tool that the industry knows today... the javascript i'm talking about is the client-side event-based windowing/navigation scripting language that the original technology could have evolved into before M$ crushed netscape and with it any chance of javascript growing past it's infancy.
i could see favoring a profitable buyout, especially in an unstable market... but truthfully, i think redhat has a duty to the community ... (hell, why not?) ... to society as a whole to continue to fight against corporate monsters like AOL rather than sell they're souls just so the exec's can have a secure retirement fund.
myself, i've had little problem with 2.4 on either the performance OR stability front... my problems have been with those stupid X drivers Nvidia has been releasing, with they're terrible adherence to the 2.4's "way of doing things" and almost complete lack of integrity when it comes to performance and stability.
microsoft is evil. someone needs to realize that they can't be proven guilty by any of our laws, because all our laws rely on the power of the courts to enforce them... what we need is the purifying all-powerful justice of the wrath of god; the only thing that can save us now!
mabye mesa 3d will save us all from the eventuality that it will be illegal to play games in non-microsoft operating systems?
of course there's just enough holes in this story to keep anyone from being able to determine whether it's even based on truth or not from only the information here, but i truly hope that either way, there ARE stories of this sort happening in Afghanistan, and that stories such as this aren't just a lot of well-intentioned hogwash designed to keep the american public from realizing that dispite the fact that we're about to win vietnam here, it's going to be a hell of a lot harder to live with afterwards this time.
yea, i've met his wife... could be a stand-in, but i think he's got a kid with her.
explosion nothing, that "nightscope" shot is a washed out picture of someone shining a flashlight into a camera at night.
i think those people at mastercard are fools. think of the untapped resource here! ... they say copywrite violation, i'd say it's a goddamn good advertisement for mastercard.