For the record, I actually am on your side here (mostly). The following post is Devil's advocacy.
What if we were spying on the Pakistanis, and then traced their communications to the German group? We request the ability to place a few phone taps (we'd just tell them about it, but the Germans have not always been our allies, and we'd hate to give out more information than we needed to), and give the feed, which is incriminating, to our German allies, who swoop in and capture the dangerous terror cell. After all, it's not like we throw darts at a list of world citizens to decide who to phonetap. There was at least some information that led to this group, and it's not like they -were- innocent. Also, this story actually makes more sense if Germany had OKed this action first. You don't do things like spying on German citizens illicitly, and then go tell Germany. The fact that eavesdropping is actually being mentioned instead of "intelligence sources" seems to indicate that this was actually an aboveboard mission.
Also, I believe you were looking for hypocritical, not Hippocratic. Not to mention that the inalienable rights for everyone that the founding fathers believed in didn't stop more than a few of them from owning slaves. Either that's hypocrisy, or these inalienable rights are for U.S. citizens. Personally, I'd prefer the second, as that avoids us having to play world's police every time there's something going on somewhere in the world that we don't like. French prisons deemed cruel and unusual? War. Turkish police deemed too brutal? War. Either we absolve the U.S. of the duty to consider all the world under our protection, or we forfeit the right to complain when we send the army to visit some patch of desert.
Innocent until proven guilty does not apply here. We don't need guilt to search you or eavesdrop on you, we just need a warrant. If we didn't get one for this (which wouldn't surprise me a bit), it's still not leaving behind innocent until proven guilty. Due process may be violated, but even that might not apply for information released into the public domain (speaking in public, things that can be seen from public property, etc.)
Wiretapping phones at random is not acceptable. But it might just be possible that we asked Germany's permission, and that they might have the authority to authorize our activities in this case.
Not really, unless there were special circumstances like long-term effects from the space travel. Laika was just a random dog that happened to be put on a rocket. Likewise, I don't care about the death of Dolly the sheep, but I might care about the death of her clone, again, for genetics related reasons. Alex, on the other hand, was an active participant. He matters, by my reckoning.
Windows has the stupidest users. It's like the McDonald's of OSs. If I go to a nice restaurant around here, I can assume the other guests will be courteous, and the wait staff will be competent. When I go to McDonald's, those things may still occur, but it's not a valid assumption to make. There will probably be whiny brats and high school workers who just don't care. It's also much more widespread than any of my favorite restaurants.
People who use Linux, OS X, and Unix (and also BeOS and FreeBSD, etc.) are connoisseurs. They have specific desires, and focus on quality. They are likely to be courteous when they go to a restaurant. People who use Windows are everyone else. They may also be courteous about how they interact with others, but there's a better chance for them to be whiny brats and enraged parents. This is why they cause problems for the other guests, they just don't care.
Windows can be made secure. I run XP, but I do it politely, with an eye to not allowing my computer to piss off everyone else. I keep myself secure, and that makes everyone happy. But I am outnumbered by the failures, and am thereby lumped in with them. Don't blame the machines, blame the people.
That's from Shakespeare. I think I've heard it quoted more than any of his other lines. And every goddamn time it's being quoted by someone who thinks he's speaking against lawyers for the common good, not realizing that line was uttered because a bunch of lawyers makes tyranny a lot harder.
Thank you for knowing what the hell you're talking about. I don't see that enough.
For public locations owned by private citizens, the ability to enter is assumed, given some caveats. If the doors are locked, you don't get to pick the lock or break the door down. If you are asked to leave by someone with the authority to do so, you need to do that, or face trespassing charges. If it is requested that people not bring certain items (guns, etc.) onto the premises, and you do, there are likely criminal charges for that as well.
Once you have entered, they don't get to make up all sorts of new rules, and if they do, the worst they can do is throw you out.
To be fair, you can't expect the mods to know anything about Godwin's Law other than that Hitler==Flamebait. You really should have seen it coming though, given that your entire post was about lazy thinking.
You see no ethics in having the ability to cause damage for your own personal gain without getting caught, and not doing it? It's not exactly going above and beyond the call of duty, but I'd have to call that ethical behavior.
Build your own nation? I'm sorry, I'm afraid I left my private military at home, I'll have to put off the coup till next week. The land has been divvied up, and it's going to stay pretty much the way it is. Great Britain sent out the fleet just to retake the Falklands, for crying out loud. Tell me what existing nation is going to be amenable to you trying to carve out a piece of their land for your own use.
Hate: There are countries that claim that the only problem with the Holocaust was that it ended too early. Iran refers to us as the Great Satan.
Death: China kills more of its own every year than we do.
Weapons: Ok, you got me. I approve though, as having the best guns has a chilling effect on other nations going to war.
Fear: China. Venezuela. Israel.
Corruption: Bangladesh.
Patents: Yep, that's probably us. Japan has a pretty messed up patent system too, though.
Pharmaceuticals: I don't see anything wrong with being the worlds largest producer of healing. Not all pharmaceuticals are Viagra and Prozac, after all.
What does the US have left, in the area of actual productive industry? Sure, there are successful investment firms, etc., but most actual manufacturing has long been lost to other nations. There are basically two fields that are actually producing goods, Big Content (symbolized by the RIAA/MPAA) and software, and by software I mean basically Microsoft. You forgot high speed pizza delivery.
No one is innocent. Also, no one knows what all they are guilty of. Hang jail time over their heads for some crime, either real or imagined. Hell, with the Patriot Act out there, you could kidnap someone, torture them, and put them back, and they might never tell a soul.
Also, kiddy porn is probably the easiest thing to refute if planted. It'd be simpler to plant a crying "rape victim" and a bottle full of rohypnol. As long as police are searching your house thanks to the probable cause of the police report being filed, they might accidentally find your stash of heroin. If they just want you gone, all it takes is an anonymous informant to get you an early morning SWAT raid, which is not unlikely to end with your death. Even if you live, it'll ruin your life.
Every place I've worked, policy has been, "If they claim they have a bomb, you do what they tell you to do." Suppose they actually did have a bomb, and they blew it up when you didn't do what they said. The store is now liable for a shitload of lawsuits from the victims' families. Not to mention you're dead.
Wal-Mart would send the money. Taco Bell would send the money. Any place that had the option of sending the money would send the money. You could take the case off an old digital clock, put the whole thing in a suitcase, and threaten them with that, and you would get the money. When a McDonalds manager decides to strip search an employee based on an anonymous phone call, you know that you can get away with anything.
Some cultures say that very specific things should be done with the dead to help them on their way. The Egyptians had the whole canopic jars and mummification thing for the people who were important enough to matter in the afterlife. India used to burn their dead (along with the living wives of the deceased.) It is not inconceivable that the Chinese government has the ability to disrupt whatever death rituals the peasantry believes are necessary for reincarnation.
Disclaimer: I know very little about Buddhism. It may not work in this way.
I have the freedom to censor myself, just as TorrentSpy does. I can choose not to say certain things to certain people. TorrentSpy has decided not to tell U.S. IP addresses about the results of their search query. They have not deleted torrents, or blocked torrents from being downloaded by the U.S., they have only stopped helping us find them. I seem to remember a bunch of/.ers saying that TorrentSpy and TPB were not liable for the things they link to in the same way Google isn't liable for the things it links to. I find this attitude irreconcilable with the attitude espoused here.
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For the record, I actually am on your side here (mostly). The following post is Devil's advocacy.
What if we were spying on the Pakistanis, and then traced their communications to the German group? We request the ability to place a few phone taps (we'd just tell them about it, but the Germans have not always been our allies, and we'd hate to give out more information than we needed to), and give the feed, which is incriminating, to our German allies, who swoop in and capture the dangerous terror cell. After all, it's not like we throw darts at a list of world citizens to decide who to phonetap. There was at least some information that led to this group, and it's not like they -were- innocent. Also, this story actually makes more sense if Germany had OKed this action first. You don't do things like spying on German citizens illicitly, and then go tell Germany. The fact that eavesdropping is actually being mentioned instead of "intelligence sources" seems to indicate that this was actually an aboveboard mission.
Also, I believe you were looking for hypocritical, not Hippocratic. Not to mention that the inalienable rights for everyone that the founding fathers believed in didn't stop more than a few of them from owning slaves. Either that's hypocrisy, or these inalienable rights are for U.S. citizens. Personally, I'd prefer the second, as that avoids us having to play world's police every time there's something going on somewhere in the world that we don't like. French prisons deemed cruel and unusual? War. Turkish police deemed too brutal? War. Either we absolve the U.S. of the duty to consider all the world under our protection, or we forfeit the right to complain when we send the army to visit some patch of desert.
Innocent until proven guilty does not apply here. We don't need guilt to search you or eavesdrop on you, we just need a warrant. If we didn't get one for this (which wouldn't surprise me a bit), it's still not leaving behind innocent until proven guilty. Due process may be violated, but even that might not apply for information released into the public domain (speaking in public, things that can be seen from public property, etc.)
Wiretapping phones at random is not acceptable. But it might just be possible that we asked Germany's permission, and that they might have the authority to authorize our activities in this case.
In eight days when the new season of Heroes starts, I do...
Not really, unless there were special circumstances like long-term effects from the space travel. Laika was just a random dog that happened to be put on a rocket. Likewise, I don't care about the death of Dolly the sheep, but I might care about the death of her clone, again, for genetics related reasons. Alex, on the other hand, was an active participant. He matters, by my reckoning.
Windows has the stupidest users. It's like the McDonald's of OSs. If I go to a nice restaurant around here, I can assume the other guests will be courteous, and the wait staff will be competent. When I go to McDonald's, those things may still occur, but it's not a valid assumption to make. There will probably be whiny brats and high school workers who just don't care. It's also much more widespread than any of my favorite restaurants.
People who use Linux, OS X, and Unix (and also BeOS and FreeBSD, etc.) are connoisseurs. They have specific desires, and focus on quality. They are likely to be courteous when they go to a restaurant. People who use Windows are everyone else. They may also be courteous about how they interact with others, but there's a better chance for them to be whiny brats and enraged parents. This is why they cause problems for the other guests, they just don't care.
Windows can be made secure. I run XP, but I do it politely, with an eye to not allowing my computer to piss off everyone else. I keep myself secure, and that makes everyone happy. But I am outnumbered by the failures, and am thereby lumped in with them. Don't blame the machines, blame the people.
Never used it, no time to now. Is it anything like Celestia?
"First thing we do, we kill all the lawyers!"
That's from Shakespeare. I think I've heard it quoted more than any of his other lines. And every goddamn time it's being quoted by someone who thinks he's speaking against lawyers for the common good, not realizing that line was uttered because a bunch of lawyers makes tyranny a lot harder.
Thank you for knowing what the hell you're talking about. I don't see that enough.
Vaccines.
For public locations owned by private citizens, the ability to enter is assumed, given some caveats. If the doors are locked, you don't get to pick the lock or break the door down. If you are asked to leave by someone with the authority to do so, you need to do that, or face trespassing charges. If it is requested that people not bring certain items (guns, etc.) onto the premises, and you do, there are likely criminal charges for that as well.
Once you have entered, they don't get to make up all sorts of new rules, and if they do, the worst they can do is throw you out.
To be fair, you can't expect the mods to know anything about Godwin's Law other than that Hitler==Flamebait. You really should have seen it coming though, given that your entire post was about lazy thinking.
You see no ethics in having the ability to cause damage for your own personal gain without getting caught, and not doing it? It's not exactly going above and beyond the call of duty, but I'd have to call that ethical behavior.
Build your own nation? I'm sorry, I'm afraid I left my private military at home, I'll have to put off the coup till next week. The land has been divvied up, and it's going to stay pretty much the way it is. Great Britain sent out the fleet just to retake the Falklands, for crying out loud. Tell me what existing nation is going to be amenable to you trying to carve out a piece of their land for your own use.
Maybe he has a cert from EC-Council
Nice troll.
Hate: There are countries that claim that the only problem with the Holocaust was that it ended too early. Iran refers to us as the Great Satan.
Death: China kills more of its own every year than we do.
Weapons: Ok, you got me. I approve though, as having the best guns has a chilling effect on other nations going to war.
Fear: China. Venezuela. Israel.
Corruption: Bangladesh.
Patents: Yep, that's probably us. Japan has a pretty messed up patent system too, though.
Pharmaceuticals: I don't see anything wrong with being the worlds largest producer of healing. Not all pharmaceuticals are Viagra and Prozac, after all.
What kind of nerd doesn't just say pi/18 radians instead on 10 degrees?
Write it on the back of a high res wide angle of the night sky. It will never be exactly the same.
No one is innocent. Also, no one knows what all they are guilty of. Hang jail time over their heads for some crime, either real or imagined. Hell, with the Patriot Act out there, you could kidnap someone, torture them, and put them back, and they might never tell a soul.
Also, kiddy porn is probably the easiest thing to refute if planted. It'd be simpler to plant a crying "rape victim" and a bottle full of rohypnol. As long as police are searching your house thanks to the probable cause of the police report being filed, they might accidentally find your stash of heroin. If they just want you gone, all it takes is an anonymous informant to get you an early morning SWAT raid, which is not unlikely to end with your death. Even if you live, it'll ruin your life.
Every place I've worked, policy has been, "If they claim they have a bomb, you do what they tell you to do." Suppose they actually did have a bomb, and they blew it up when you didn't do what they said. The store is now liable for a shitload of lawsuits from the victims' families. Not to mention you're dead.
Wal-Mart would send the money. Taco Bell would send the money. Any place that had the option of sending the money would send the money. You could take the case off an old digital clock, put the whole thing in a suitcase, and threaten them with that, and you would get the money. When a McDonalds manager decides to strip search an employee based on an anonymous phone call, you know that you can get away with anything.
Some cultures say that very specific things should be done with the dead to help them on their way. The Egyptians had the whole canopic jars and mummification thing for the people who were important enough to matter in the afterlife. India used to burn their dead (along with the living wives of the deceased.) It is not inconceivable that the Chinese government has the ability to disrupt whatever death rituals the peasantry believes are necessary for reincarnation.
Disclaimer: I know very little about Buddhism. It may not work in this way.
Where is TorrentSpy located? Is there any reason they need to listen to the judge on this?
Then the solution is to plug in a great number of other devices on that same circuit, until you blow the breaker. Accidents happen, after all.
I have the freedom to censor myself, just as TorrentSpy does. I can choose not to say certain things to certain people. TorrentSpy has decided not to tell U.S. IP addresses about the results of their search query. They have not deleted torrents, or blocked torrents from being downloaded by the U.S., they have only stopped helping us find them. I seem to remember a bunch of /.ers saying that TorrentSpy and TPB were not liable for the things they link to in the same way Google isn't liable for the things it links to. I find this attitude irreconcilable with the attitude espoused here.