That seems distinct from remotely-controlling a machine without expressed permission. If the web server in question had been a poorly-secured private intranet server, rather than a public web server, I think the ruling would have been different.
You're saying that sending through a publicly accessible router is "remotely-controlling a machine" and that it is different from "remotely-controlling a poorly-secured public web server?" The wide open AP is the same as a unsecured web server, serving up pages. Don't put pages unsecured on your webserver, same as don't put up unsecured APs connected to your cable modem. The wireless protocols, just like with http, have ways of making your device private.
Having court precident that equates insecurity to permission to use seems dubious.
Why? They've already done that with "hidden" urls. There was the case posted on slashdot (last year?) where someone got access to earnings results early because the people put it up on the web named the same way as the report for the year before--report2004.pdf instead of report2003.pdf or something like that. They lost their court case when trying to say they were violated because they didn't publish the URL, so it was trespassing to view the document.
Would you call that "insecurity == permission to use or would you call that "permission to use" by design?
You seem to be under the gross misconception that if you haven't been physically prevented from using something, then it must be entirely legal and morally correct for you to use it. It's the other way round - by default, you can't do anything with anyone's private property unless they have expressly permitted you to do so - whether or not they have secured it.
Oh, so you ask permission before reading someone's blog? Just because you haven't been prevented from downloading pages from their webserver doesn't mean that you should be downloading those pages. Oh, and don't email them to ask them permission because then you are using their bandwidth without their permission. Oh, and don't call them on their phone either unless you have permission....
Technically this is security by obscurity, but it worked surprisingly well. Guess, as they say, it comes down to the people.
"Security by obscurity" has gotten such a bad rap because some many people have repeated it so often, but it isn't that bad. It's bad when it is relied upon instead of using it as a layer in defense in depth. Using it in conjunction with other security methods is not bad.
(Maybe you were saying it was the only method used, but my english parser broke trying to understand your paragraph.)
If someone accidentally used "nycwireless.net" as their SSID and then tried to got the police to arrest their neighbor the Judge would throw out any theft of service charge pretty quickly.
Why should it waste the judge's time at all? We just need some intelligent case law stating that any unsecured networks are equivalent to open networks. OS manufacturers have made it the de facto standard that unsecured networks are considered available networks.
Actually, i think i remembered wrong about the starting grade (should be gs-7 step 10), but they had a new policy of accelerated promotion. Move up 2 grades in 6 months, and then 1 grade in 12 months and the GS-12 1 year after that.
GS-13 was competively based but since the hiring freeze for the couple of years before me all my friends still in gov't got their GS-13 about 15 months after their 12.
I got real lucky, because I got the GS-7 Step 10 plus the 25% signing bonus, plus the alternate work schedule (1 day off every 2 weeks--which you aren't allowed to float to mondays but somehow they let me do it), plus i got into the lock-step masters program where they bring NJIT professors to the base and pay you to go to class every friday. So i had to work mon-thursday with class all day fridays, except every other week i worked tue-thur plus class on friday since i took my AWS day on those mondays.
Why did i leave? To go to a start-up and work 60/hr weeks of course. haha.
So it looked like this (note: when getting promoted up a grade they find the lowest step larger then your current salary and add 2 steps to it): GS-7 Step 10..........Day 0 $x GS-9 $x+2 steps.......1/2 years $y GS-11 $y+2 steps......1.5 years $z GS-12 $z+2 steps......2.5 years $a GS-13 $a+2 steps......~3.8 years
Paying for advanced degrees is done to retain top employees while gaining the advantage of them having advanced education. The patent office was seeing none of this, so they canned it.
It doesn't sound like they retain them anyway. At least they would benefit from the employee for those 3 years while they were getting their law degree since they are more valuable during the whole process of getting a law degree.
Now they just reduce the top talent they will get and/or retain for a couple of years.
GS-9 is for entry level with a high GPA. GS-9 step 10 pays $56,000 (PA-NJ-NY). Not bad for just out of school and possibly the 25% signing bonus. Don't forget your promotion in 6 months plus a promotion every 12 months until you hit GS-12 and a cost of living adjustment.
Besides it's gov't work. You CAN'T get fired unless you steal or drink on the job. And if you drink you can tell them you have a problem and they'll pay to send you to rehab and keep you on. You get 13 sick days, 13 vacation days, 13 federal holidays, plus using the flex hours if you work the 9 hour days you get 26 flex days off (every other week). After 3 years you get 19.5 vacation days a year (you accrue 6 hours every 2 weeks).
Of course you have to work in an environment with people who can't get fired so you have a "survival of the worst" situation because the people that stay can't cut it any where else. -- why i left the gov't. Luckily, I worked in a great department where our 2nd level manager bent the rules alot to keep qualified people on board.
Oh, yes. Agreed. I posted in response to him expanding upon his example and *concluding* that the parent to his post had committed assault with a dangerous weapon when the situations were very different.
Not a very good idea. You might not be guilty of a traffic violation, but you are guilty of assault with a deadly weapon, and if something really bad happens, you might just find yourself charged with murder.
Assault with a deadly weapon for stopping your car and being plowed into from behind? Hmmm. Who said there is no justice?
any more than most musicians are deeply interested in the physics of sound, or the physiology of hearing.
I guess you haven't talked to any trained opera singers or advanced vocalists. The one I know has books analyzing the physics of sound, the physiology of creating sound, and the physiology of hearing.
Can I preorder just the paper book under this program?
No, the rules of our credit card processor stop us taking preorders more than 30 days before we ship something.
Notice that you cannot buy just the book at this time.
My main problem with the offer is the fact that they are charging for the Beta PDF on top of the preorder. When I saw the deal I naturally assumed they would be giving out the Beta PDF in exchange for a preorder of the finished book--not using it to squeeze out additional money. I was extremly disappointed when I saw that they are charging for both, even though I would be paying up front for an unfinished product. I don't care if the PDF gets updated later, since I would have the book at that time.
Well, why shouldn't the Disney Corporation retain those rights? They developed and nurtured the character over decades.
Because they agreed to have limited term rights on it when they "created" their "property." They knew going in that they only had a limited term. Why are the rules changed at the end of that term? They've been given a gov't granted monopoly on the "IP" against competition. Why should they own it to the end of time? Especially when you consider that they built their IP on top of other people's IP!
If it did happen as described, I think she has a legitimate complaint both against Yahoo and against her boyfriend.
What duty does Yahoo owe her? Did the boyfriend take the picture and own the copyright? What type of agreement exists between her and Yahoo? If you can point out a legal requirement that Yahoo has to follow, I'm sure there is a way to force them without claming a 3 million dollar lawsuit.
This is a good example of the dangers of making decisions based on parables. Yes, with the numbers as exaggerated as you indicate, the appropriate decision would (probably) be to purchase outside. But no such disparity could exist if the government were buying at market price.
If there is no disparity in price then there is no need to buy from a far away location and thus no need for such a law. Obviously there are disparities in prices or else we won't be discussing this. Besides the market price is influenced by gov't interference like in this case.
Don't make the decision based upon a parable, make it upon introspection of what the parable is illustrating. This Broken Windows parable is like an anti-pattern in software design. This anti-pattern still comes up. Do a google search for Florida Hurricane "Broken Windows" for some recent articles on this fallacy still coming up. Somehow people things jobs are created when objects of value are destroyed.
Wealth is determined by value creation. Limiting purchases to only in-state sellers ignores the opportunity cost of only choosing in-state sellers and money as the only metric.
Your explanation contains some of the same fallacies that the Parable of the Broken Window illustrates. Value and the flow of money are not always intuitively related.
Suppose for example the that state of Indiana can purchase a load of widgets from out of state for $1000 but if it purchases them in-state it costs $4000. The state of Indiana saves $3000 if it purchases them out of state and then has that money to spend on other items, whether or not those items are manufactured in-state or not.
Keeping money in the state is less important then maximizing value inside the state. For example, is the state better off it spends $4000 to buy one load of widgets from in-state suppliers or if it spends $4000 to buy 4 loads of widgets from out of state suppliers?
Of course these numbers were exaggerated to prove a point; however, the principle stands. Total value is much more important than simply tracing money flow.
Capitalism, communism, and all the other systems have their pros and cons. Anyone can argue their system of choice and make valid points. Whether you consider one system "better" than another just depends on what your values are.
Everyone knows that Democracy is better in peace time for doing research and economic advancement, but communism is much better for fighting wars.
Under communism you can draft a lot more civilians and your civilization will remain happier.
Slashdot Mirror
emegency
link
That seems distinct from remotely-controlling a machine without expressed permission. If the web server in question had been a poorly-secured private intranet server, rather than a public web server, I think the ruling would have been different.
You're saying that sending through a publicly accessible router is "remotely-controlling a machine" and that it is different from "remotely-controlling a poorly-secured public web server?" The wide open AP is the same as a unsecured web server, serving up pages. Don't put pages unsecured on your webserver, same as don't put up unsecured APs connected to your cable modem. The wireless protocols, just like with http, have ways of making your device private.
Having court precident that equates insecurity to permission to use seems dubious.
Why? They've already done that with "hidden" urls. There was the case posted on slashdot (last year?) where someone got access to earnings results early because the people put it up on the web named the same way as the report for the year before--report2004.pdf instead of report2003.pdf or something like that. They lost their court case when trying to say they were violated because they didn't publish the URL, so it was trespassing to view the document.
Would you call that "insecurity == permission to use or would you call that "permission to use" by design?
You seem to be under the gross misconception that if you haven't been physically prevented from using something, then it must be entirely legal and morally correct for you to use it. It's the other way round - by default, you can't do anything with anyone's private property unless they have expressly permitted you to do so - whether or not they have secured it.
Oh, so you ask permission before reading someone's blog? Just because you haven't been prevented from downloading pages from their webserver doesn't mean that you should be downloading those pages. Oh, and don't email them to ask them permission because then you are using their bandwidth without their permission. Oh, and don't call them on their phone either unless you have permission....
Technically this is security by obscurity, but it worked surprisingly well. Guess, as they say, it comes down to the people.
"Security by obscurity" has gotten such a bad rap because some many people have repeated it so often, but it isn't that bad. It's bad when it is relied upon instead of using it as a layer in defense in depth. Using it in conjunction with other security methods is not bad.
(Maybe you were saying it was the only method used, but my english parser broke trying to understand your paragraph.)
If someone accidentally used "nycwireless.net" as their SSID and then tried to got the police to arrest their neighbor the Judge would throw out any theft of service charge pretty quickly.
Why should it waste the judge's time at all? We just need some intelligent case law stating that any unsecured networks are equivalent to open networks. OS manufacturers have made it the de facto standard that unsecured networks are considered available networks.
Actually, i think i remembered wrong about the starting grade (should be gs-7 step 10), but they had a new policy of accelerated promotion. Move up 2 grades in 6 months, and then 1 grade in 12 months and the GS-12 1 year after that.
GS-13 was competively based but since the hiring freeze for the couple of years before me all my friends still in gov't got their GS-13 about 15 months after their 12.
I got real lucky, because I got the GS-7 Step 10 plus the 25% signing bonus, plus the alternate work schedule (1 day off every 2 weeks--which you aren't allowed to float to mondays but somehow they let me do it), plus i got into the lock-step masters program where they bring NJIT professors to the base and pay you to go to class every friday. So i had to work mon-thursday with class all day fridays, except every other week i worked tue-thur plus class on friday since i took my AWS day on those mondays.
Why did i leave? To go to a start-up and work 60/hr weeks of course. haha.
So it looked like this (note: when getting promoted up a grade they find the lowest step larger then your current salary and add 2 steps to it):
GS-7 Step 10..........Day 0 $x
GS-9 $x+2 steps.......1/2 years $y
GS-11 $y+2 steps......1.5 years $z
GS-12 $z+2 steps......2.5 years $a
GS-13 $a+2 steps......~3.8 years
Paying for advanced degrees is done to retain top employees while gaining the advantage of them having advanced education. The patent office was seeing none of this, so they canned it.
It doesn't sound like they retain them anyway. At least they would benefit from the employee for those 3 years while they were getting their law degree since they are more valuable during the whole process of getting a law degree.
Now they just reduce the top talent they will get and/or retain for a couple of years.
GS-9 is for entry level with a high GPA. GS-9 step 10 pays $56,000 (PA-NJ-NY). Not bad for just out of school and possibly the 25% signing bonus. Don't forget your promotion in 6 months plus a promotion every 12 months until you hit GS-12 and a cost of living adjustment.
Besides it's gov't work. You CAN'T get fired unless you steal or drink on the job. And if you drink you can tell them you have a problem and they'll pay to send you to rehab and keep you on. You get 13 sick days, 13 vacation days, 13 federal holidays, plus using the flex hours if you work the 9 hour days you get 26 flex days off (every other week). After 3 years you get 19.5 vacation days a year (you accrue 6 hours every 2 weeks).
Of course you have to work in an environment with people who can't get fired so you have a "survival of the worst" situation because the people that stay can't cut it any where else. -- why i left the gov't. Luckily, I worked in a great department where our 2nd level manager bent the rules alot to keep qualified people on board.
What happens if you print in B&W and empty out your yellow ink?
Come on, stick up for yourself, Randy Waterhouse.
I think this page explains it all.
If it becomes a large enough of a problem, i can see people firewalling based apon a list of tor nodes.
Oh, yes. Agreed. I posted in response to him expanding upon his example and *concluding* that the parent to his post had committed assault with a dangerous weapon when the situations were very different.
Not a very good idea. You might not be guilty of a traffic violation, but you are guilty of assault with a deadly weapon, and if something really bad happens, you might just find yourself charged with murder.
Assault with a deadly weapon for stopping your car and being plowed into from behind? Hmmm. Who said there is no justice?
yeah, without an ethernet it's harder to connect to and pwn.
Hey, what are you doing quoting sources? That's not playing fair. Do you see the GP using sources?
any more than most musicians are deeply interested in the physics of sound, or the physiology of hearing.
I guess you haven't talked to any trained opera singers or advanced vocalists. The one I know has books analyzing the physics of sound, the physiology of creating sound, and the physiology of hearing.
Why is that modded Informative? You can't buy just the book.
From their Faq page:
Can I preorder just the paper book under this program?
No, the rules of our credit card processor stop us taking preorders more than 30 days before we ship something.
Notice that you cannot buy just the book at this time.
My main problem with the offer is the fact that they are charging for the Beta PDF on top of the preorder. When I saw the deal I naturally assumed they would be giving out the Beta PDF in exchange for a preorder of the finished book--not using it to squeeze out additional money. I was extremly disappointed when I saw that they are charging for both, even though I would be paying up front for an unfinished product. I don't care if the PDF gets updated later, since I would have the book at that time.
Well, why shouldn't the Disney Corporation retain those rights? They developed and nurtured the character over decades.
Because they agreed to have limited term rights on it when they "created" their "property." They knew going in that they only had a limited term. Why are the rules changed at the end of that term? They've been given a gov't granted monopoly on the "IP" against competition. Why should they own it to the end of time? Especially when you consider that they built their IP on top of other people's IP!
I would think about ordering the book, if you got the Beta PDF, and then they sent you the book when it comes out.
But they want to charge for the book and charge for the Beta PDF? WTF?
If it did happen as described, I think she has a legitimate complaint both against Yahoo and against her boyfriend.
What duty does Yahoo owe her? Did the boyfriend take the picture and own the copyright? What type of agreement exists between her and Yahoo? If you can point out a legal requirement that Yahoo has to follow, I'm sure there is a way to force them without claming a 3 million dollar lawsuit.
This is a good example of the dangers of making decisions based on parables. Yes, with the numbers as exaggerated as you indicate, the appropriate decision would (probably) be to purchase outside. But no such disparity could exist if the government were buying at market price.
If there is no disparity in price then there is no need to buy from a far away location and thus no need for such a law. Obviously there are disparities in prices or else we won't be discussing this. Besides the market price is influenced by gov't interference like in this case.
Don't make the decision based upon a parable, make it upon introspection of what the parable is illustrating. This Broken Windows parable is like an anti-pattern in software design. This anti-pattern still comes up. Do a google search for Florida Hurricane "Broken Windows" for some recent articles on this fallacy still coming up. Somehow people things jobs are created when objects of value are destroyed.
Wealth is determined by value creation. Limiting purchases to only in-state sellers ignores the opportunity cost of only choosing in-state sellers and money as the only metric.
Whoever modded you up is being sillier then you.
Your explanation contains some of the same fallacies that the Parable of the Broken Window illustrates. Value and the flow of money are not always intuitively related.
Suppose for example the that state of Indiana can purchase a load of widgets from out of state for $1000 but if it purchases them in-state it costs $4000. The state of Indiana saves $3000 if it purchases them out of state and then has that money to spend on other items, whether or not those items are manufactured in-state or not.
Keeping money in the state is less important then maximizing value inside the state. For example, is the state better off it spends $4000 to buy one load of widgets from in-state suppliers or if it spends $4000 to buy 4 loads of widgets from out of state suppliers?
Of course these numbers were exaggerated to prove a point; however, the principle stands. Total value is much more important than simply tracing money flow.
Capitalism, communism, and all the other systems have their pros and cons. Anyone can argue their system of choice and make valid points. Whether you consider one system "better" than another just depends on what your values are.
Everyone knows that Democracy is better in peace time for doing research and economic advancement, but communism is much better for fighting wars.
Under communism you can draft a lot more civilians and your civilization will remain happier.