Someone already said this quite eloquently. I'll be short and simple and maybe folks will read it:
Sun doesn't sell OS software so much as high end solutions. You pay them a buttload of cash for a mission critical-can-never-fail solution and it's just icing on the cake if they make any cash from the OS.
This is to increase mindshare and leverage open source as much as anything.
I do not condone his actions one little bit. I can understand a fine, or even jail time, but I think $125,000 is pretty steep. let's put it in perspective a bit:
The question it rasises is how much other stuff is in windows that has IP violations?
Any large corporation is going to have non-licensed software on their machines. You put thousands of folks in front of thousands of PCs and what do you know? They try to load software.
The poor bastards responsible for keeping desktops secure and warez free in any large corp. have got an endless, PITA job. It doesn't mean the company is promoting piracy if a few infractions exist.
From a managerial perspective, it is just plain dumb as well. I know I am not fully there if I have been working more than 12 hours straight, and you are fooling yourself if you think you can write/debug solid code with 4 hours sleep.
You nailed it right on the head. As I read this stuff (and yesterday's thread) I keep thinking "what the hell good is code written by someone who hasn't had a day off or a full night's sleep in weeks?"
Management doesn't know what the hell it's doing if it follows this business model. I think with most programmers, you can expect 20-25 solidly productive hours in a 40 hour week. Sure, you can make them work 80 hour weeks, but does it result in a net increase? Possibly, but only at the expense of quality/reliability/maintainability.
moral concerns aside, this is just bad business....
He also won't, for the life of him, trust hard drives, zip disks, CD-Rs, dedica...
two words: print it
I don't trust any storage media 100%. If something is really important to me, I print a hard copy. It's not that I don't burn backups to disk, or even ftp stuff to other machines, (I do) but nothing beats the trust factor I have for paper and ink.
My filing cabinet hasn't had a single crash or virus in all the years I've owned it...
Guess you custom application vendors didn't do their job either.
They were probably far far away when things stopped working. I work for a large company. Months before our last refresh/upgrade, I had access to test machines. I dutifully checked out every custom app in my sphere of responsibility. If I wasn't sure who owned it, I checked. I retired a couple apps, fixed some, and had a few minor changes made to the desktop build. None of the code I had to fix or retire was written by anyone still associated with our company.
Everything was done ahead of time, but I still got blindsided by some really well written, but broken code in an application I had never seen. No one owned the damn thing, and I ended up fixing it.
I know most people would fail this, even if you gave them all afternoon, but syntax errors aside, whatever they turned out would give good insight into their level of competence (or lack of) as a programmer.
Sadly, It would be faster than installing Gentoo....
Re:Alas those Days are Gone
on
Digital Retro
·
· Score: 1
we've traded in our hand-coded assembly language routines for pre-made GUI libraries.
Leave the pre made GUIs at work.
There's nothing stopping you from coding by hand at home, and it is a lot easier to do it now than it was in 1980... I mean we've all got hard disks now and fast machines. No offense, but do you remember how long it took to load a program from tape? or compile a few hundred lines on an XT?
I do, and it sucked.
I really miss those arcade games, but not the technology of the times.
Really, I've gotta agree with the parent here. The registration is about as non-invasive as a prostate exam, but fuck, you don't really need to give them all that info. Do what I did. Load the message thread to find a mirror or....
just lie.
If 10% everyone who had to fill out one of these bullshit registrations told huge lies, the data generated wouldn't be worth using...
If your data is correct "most of the time" it's undependable all of the time....
even though they've been legislated out of existence.
I own one of these and It's great for making lots of heat in a pinch. If they've been banned in your jurisdiction, it's because it can kill you in your sleep if it's not running right.
Strongly suggest buying a carbon monoxide detector if you plan on heating your home with a kerosene heater.
>>(Actually, it wouldn't suprise me if only a small portion of the system was actual 64bit (like the kernel). Utilities like notepad are probably still 32bit.)
some of the posters are joking about slashdotting echelon, but it could be done. Imagine if everyone reading this thread picked up a phone, called a friend and said five or six of the keywords.
I can remember getting up from the gaming table and finding that missing d4 with my bare left foot.
Those damn dice were small enough to hide in a shag rug and hurt like a bastard when stepped on, (especially the early ones, cuz the corners weren't blunted)
Slashdot Mirror
Someone already said this quite eloquently. I'll be short and simple and maybe folks will read it:
Sun doesn't sell OS software so much as high end solutions. You pay them a buttload of cash for a mission critical-can-never-fail solution and it's just icing on the cake if they make any cash from the OS.
This is to increase mindshare and leverage open source as much as anything.
We've taken care of everything The words you hear, the songs you sing The pictures that give pleasure to your eyes
Doesn't anyone think the fine is a bit excessive?
I do not condone his actions one little bit. I can understand a fine, or even jail time, but I think $125,000 is pretty steep. let's put it in perspective a bit:
these guys got fined the same amount
Makes me think of a sweet little girl
hmmm.
no service packs.
no virii/viruses.
phenomenal uptime.
I think you're onto something...
The question it rasises is how much other stuff is in windows that has IP violations?
Any large corporation is going to have non-licensed software on their machines. You put thousands of folks in front of thousands of PCs and what do you know? They try to load software.
The poor bastards responsible for keeping desktops secure and warez free in any large corp. have got an endless, PITA job. It doesn't mean the company is promoting piracy if a few infractions exist.
I don't see how Microsoft is any different.
From a managerial perspective, it is just plain dumb as well. I know I am not fully there if I have been working more than 12 hours straight, and you are fooling yourself if you think you can write/debug solid code with 4 hours sleep.
You nailed it right on the head. As I read this stuff (and yesterday's thread) I keep thinking "what the hell good is code written by someone who hasn't had a day off or a full night's sleep in weeks?"
Management doesn't know what the hell it's doing if it follows this business model. I think with most programmers, you can expect 20-25 solidly productive hours in a 40 hour week. Sure, you can make them work 80 hour weeks, but does it result in a net increase? Possibly, but only at the expense of quality/reliability/maintainability.
moral concerns aside, this is just bad business....
He also won't, for the life of him, trust hard drives, zip disks, CD-Rs, dedica...
two words: print it
I don't trust any storage media 100%. If something is really important to me, I print a hard copy. It's not that I don't burn backups to disk, or even ftp stuff to other machines, (I do) but nothing beats the trust factor I have for paper and ink.
My filing cabinet hasn't had a single crash or virus in all the years I've owned it...
Guess you custom application vendors didn't do their job either.
They were probably far far away when things stopped working. I work for a large company. Months before our last refresh/upgrade, I had access to test machines. I dutifully checked out every custom app in my sphere of responsibility. If I wasn't sure who owned it, I checked. I retired a couple apps, fixed some, and had a few minor changes made to the desktop build. None of the code I had to fix or retire was written by anyone still associated with our company.
Everything was done ahead of time, but I still got blindsided by some really well written, but broken code in an application I had never seen. No one owned the damn thing, and I ended up fixing it.
I am not looking forward to SP 2....
Am I the only one that read it as BuggerCon III?
yeah, I thought so.
mebbe they have you flagged in a database somewhere for 'excessive submissions'
just a thought...
On the day of the most US deaths in Iraq, more people died in Detroit, Michigan alone.
So how many folks do you suppose are planning to move from Detroit to Bagdhad?
just asking...
I think a better test would be:
"write me a linked list"
I know most people would fail this, even if you gave them all afternoon, but syntax errors aside, whatever they turned out would give good insight into their level of competence (or lack of) as a programmer.
Sadly, It would be faster than installing Gentoo....
we've traded in our hand-coded assembly language routines for pre-made GUI libraries.
Leave the pre made GUIs at work.
There's nothing stopping you from coding by hand at home, and it is a lot easier to do it now than it was in 1980... I mean we've all got hard disks now and fast machines. No offense, but do you remember how long it took to load a program from tape? or compile a few hundred lines on an XT?
I do, and it sucked.
I really miss those arcade games, but not the technology of the times.
perhaps it was a duplicate post and the editors deleted it along with all the comments making fun of it?
just a guess....
I pulled 10% out of my ass. I'm interested that you've done work on this in particular. What do you think the real number is?
Really, I've gotta agree with the parent here. The registration is about as non-invasive as a prostate exam, but fuck, you don't really need to give them all that info. Do what I did. Load the message thread to find a mirror or....
just lie.
If 10% everyone who had to fill out one of these bullshit registrations told huge lies, the data generated wouldn't be worth using...
If your data is correct "most of the time" it's undependable all of the time....
I can access it just fine from Canada.
>> This leads to bad projects and code by people who had no business getting into this sort of thing
But it'll look nice...
in all seriousness, this looks interesting. I'm going to pull it down and build it. Object oriented and extensible is very cool.
even though they've been legislated out of existence.
I own one of these and It's great for making lots of heat in a pinch. If they've been banned in your jurisdiction, it's because it can kill you in your sleep if it's not running right.
Strongly suggest buying a carbon monoxide detector if you plan on heating your home with a kerosene heater.
I'm just glad they let me, otherwise I'd probably have committed suicide through boredom.
You were blessed with good instructors then.
Some 20+ years ago, when I was in my first CS class, any forays into "cool things" would be rewarded with a stern "That's NOT the assignment!"
Yes, I was expelled from the class eventually...
>>(Actually, it wouldn't suprise me if only a small portion of the system was actual 64bit (like the kernel). Utilities like notepad are probably still 32bit.)
notepad is 32 bit????
somehow, that takes all the joy out of using it.
I wonder what the list of 'hotwords' is?
some of the posters are joking about slashdotting echelon, but it could be done. Imagine if everyone reading this thread picked up a phone, called a friend and said five or six of the keywords.
So much for real-time analysis.
oh the pain...
I can remember getting up from the gaming table and finding that missing d4 with my bare left foot.
Those damn dice were small enough to hide in a shag rug and hurt like a bastard when stepped on, (especially the early ones, cuz the corners weren't blunted)