I once went swimming with one in a lake because I forgot I had it on my keychain. I realized it halfway through the lake and decided that now it was too late anyway and didn't hurry out of the water. Left it in the sun to dry afterwards and it works to this day (although it's not being used anymore...it's a rather old 256MB Samsung stick).
Don't take it personally, but I can't have any respect for people (or their opinion) who use the phrase "epic fail"...makes one sound like those immature "cool" kids on the web.
Here in the EU it's not as simple. Not everything written in a contract (even if voluntarily and willfully signed by both parties) is legal. Unless the Steam TOS have been tried for exactly this case I'll withhold judgment.
For example: Some carriers here in Germany have a clause where they say they can just cancel your subscription if you've been using their service in a way that is impacting their service (i.e. excessive data traffic on an unlimited transfer package). Those have been tried and found to be not upholding before several courts. There has to be a _valid_ reason for them to enforce this, they can't just say "you've done something we just don't like, you're out".
Of course, trying the TOS means they have to shut someone off for a stupid reason first.
The only part of the Steam TOS I could find ergarding this is Section 13.C.2:
"In the case of a one-time purchase of a product license (e.g., purchase of a single game) from Valve, Valve may choose to terminate or cancel your Subscription in its entirety or may terminate or cancel only a portion of the Subscription (e.g., access to the software via Steam) and Valve may, but is not obligated to, provide access (for a limited period of time) to the download of a stand-alone version of the software and content associated with such one-time purchase."
While that sounds potentially nasty I know of noone who had problems with this. Also I want to see Valve enforcing this on their customers. Just because it is written in the TOS doesn't automatically make it legal.
However for the sake of the original argument that caused my reply I fail how you either buy or license a game using BitTorrent.
Oh great, the fucking comment system ate my post because one of my backspace strokes accidentally counted as "back".
So here's the short version: I understood what you were saying, but not what the huge problem with all of it really is.
You need Internet access for BitTorrent. You might not need it for actually installing the game but with Steam installing IS downloading. If you want to play it offline you still can, if you want to copy the Steam cache files you still can (to avoid the download) and you will need some minimal access to activate the game...which in this century shouldn't be much of a problem if one tries a little. Hell, I could probably do it through my cellphone without any bump in my bill. Also there's a good deal of non-steam games which start to require activation despite not being published online. I know, you won't buy these either...but it's coming whether you like it or not.
If you can't do the activation because you live in deep Siberia and your only Internet connection is a donkey that comes by every other week then get a crack for all I care...at least you paid for the game.
[...] I have maxed my connection using BitTorrent -- but also other methods commonly used by pirates (such as direct downloads from sites like RapidShare -- note that I have no idea how fast the HL2 torrent is, I never did get that, and have no intention to;)
That's not the point. The point was you claimed their distribution system was crappy. However the speed is nothing to complain about (of course P2P has the potential to be faster...it can also be much slower if the file is just available at a few nodes). Also I couldn't find the 'lengthy' other reasons why you find their actual download system so bad (except for the LAN party thing, which admittedly is retarded...then again how often do you see people grabbing 2GB at a LAN party, actual updates if they come out the day before are probably around 50MB...most of the time more like 10MB unless there's new content. Also if you really want the stuff faster: you can just copy the steam cache folder of someone who already downloaded everything).
The 'offline mode' might be a killer for you, I however don't really care for it since all relevant games I own on Steam are multiplayer anyway.
As for the 'horror scenario' of losing your games: I want to see Valve trying to shut me out as a user for some arbitrary and unjustified reason. They'd have to discuss that with my lawyer I suppose.
As for cheating: if you cheat in online games you deserve to be banned and not play that game again. I don't have sympathy for people crying over this. Your 'privacy implications' of Punkbuster and co are wildly exaggerated. Give me an example how VAC hurts your privacy when it's scanning your game files and game memory footprint for modifications? If that's a bad way then how would you do it? No cheat protection at all? You do realize that this has nothing to do with Steam but is a problem in general?
I'm not talking about playing online in that case. Nice try though.
Well, if you don't want the latest version for your single player games you can turn automatic updates off on a game-by-game basis if you want. They're not enforced unless you want to play online and your version is incompatible with the server's.
Oh, and if Valve ever goes belly-up I'm sure there will be a fix from somewhere in the community to enable 'offline mode' one last time once and for all.
I can't convince you to use Steam and I don't want to and don't care to. But your original statement that Steam is nothing but a pile of crap and BitTorrent offers better service is just bullshit.
Lots of text, but seriously: The only thing I can understand is the part about the LAN party.
"Steam lets you buy a game from anyhwere, anytime" Reasonably true. Anywhere with an Internet connection, anyway.
So you don't need an Internet connection for BitTorrent?
"Purchases are instant." Reasonably true. Once I download it using their extremely crappy download system.
So you don't need to download it with BitTorrent? Downloading from other users in P2P is faster than the Steam servers? I dobut it as I easily max out my 16MBit/s connection everytime I download something off of Steam.
"Steam lets you play your games on any computer at any time."
Bullshit. Big whonking bullshit. Steam lets you play your games on any computer at any time -- IF you have an internet connection active at the moment or "logged in" and selected that you will want to play "offline" in a bit. On single player games. SINGLE PLAYER GAMES. Not online games. I'm not prepared to "log on" just to play a single player game -- or indeed the single player campaign, for various reasons -- the chief one amongst which is that I am not connected to the net everywhere I go, and I see no reason WHATSOEVER to let Valve know when I consume my gaming fix. They have no reason to know.
If you're not connected everywhere you go all you have to do is set up offline mode once. Yes, you have to be connected to the Internet to do that then again you have to be connected to the Internet to even get your game. It's an online distribution system after all.
If I buy Portal, HL2, and another multiplayer game, and for some reason their system detects something amiss with my account while doing the multiplayer thing, they will suspend my account -- removing access to the single player games as well -- let alone the multiplayer. No refund, either. Fuck that.
No, all that their cheat detection (VAC) will do is ban you from any VAC secured servers. Which granted is the big bunch of them out there, but what use is an omnipresent cheat detection if there is no way to enforce it? Also your single player game experience is completely untouched.
"Steam keeps your games up-to-date automatically." Big whoop. This is not hard to do even without the "Steam" framework. And maybe, just maybe, I don't WANT to have the latest version, all the time. Not all updates are good updates. Some change gameplay to something you do not like at all, some introduce bugs that affect you adversely, etc. I very much like the control offered by being able to select whether or not I want to update a game.
Then have fun playing online with your non-updated game.
I don't see how your statement is true except for: a) your solution is free b) uhm...nothing
- Steam lets you buy a game from anywhere, anytime. - Purchases are instant. - Games are installed automatically just by downloading. - Steam lets you play your games on any computer at any time. - Steam is usually cheaper than buying in a store. - Steam keeps your games up-to-date automatically.
I agree that it's not perfect as it gives away control over some things. But it's not like it's all evil as some make it out to be.
Well, not always. Back when 3D cards were not very common ATI was actually the biggest low-end graphics card manufacturer. You would see their cards pretty much everywhere. Even at the beginning of hte 3D era you'd see a lot of Rage IIC chips in pre-built machines.
Curiously after your comment I tried the link again and the image was still down. So I tried with Konqueror instead and there it is...back to Firefox and I get a 404.
If I modify the URL in Firefox, hit enter, and modify it back it will finally agree to give me the image. But not if I follow the/. link. Weird.
It's very regularly below 60 fps in Wine while using VSync in Windows it's pretty much locked at 60. The fps I gave for Vista is when VSync is unlocked (which is unplayable to me because of tearing) and just meant as a comparison.
Also don't forget the difference in graphical details...
I recently cleaned out some old PC game boxes just to find out that my original copy of Worms had included a Worms-keychain...kept wondering how they'd had fit that into the DVD-sleeves...
As we're talking about games here let's just say that
for those applications that do work and from a purely subjective point of view, performance is good. There is no obvious performance loss
is total bullshit.
Yes I know it's a wonder and everything that I can play selected DirectX games under Linux at all. But those people claiming they run Half-Life 2 (or any source based game) through wine and it runs "the same as in Windows" kinda piss me off.
Personally if I run Team Fortress 2 in wine I see a huge performance loss. I play with DX9, FSAA and full details in Vista and get about 80-100 frames average. Using wine the game will only allow DX8.1, medium detail levels and using FSAA is right out...and it still runs with less than 60 frames most of the time. All this at 1680x1050 with an 8800GTS and a Q6600.
If we're talking about apps then yes, performance loss is minimal. Or at least performance loss is not apparent since modern machines are overpowered for most applications anyway... But games still run like shit a good deal of the time.
That wasn't all that was cut out. In the uncensored version if you were blasting some enemy from short distance you would get a lot of splatter effects (from bullets spraying out their backside). This was cut from the German release and critical hits were as bloodless as non-critical hits (as far as I can remember).
Slashdot Mirror
You can strike out the "American" and insert any country of your choice. In my case that would be Germany.
I'd like to mod you "+1 Infinite Loop" but I can't find the option.
Whow, most people bend over for a lot less...
...that's strange.
I once went swimming with one in a lake because I forgot I had it on my keychain. I realized it halfway through the lake and decided that now it was too late anyway and didn't hurry out of the water. Left it in the sun to dry afterwards and it works to this day (although it's not being used anymore...it's a rather old 256MB Samsung stick).
Don't take it personally, but I can't have any respect for people (or their opinion) who use the phrase "epic fail"...makes one sound like those immature "cool" kids on the web.
This, however, is the same kind of thing I was talking about. Just in the United States.
Here in the EU it's not as simple. Not everything written in a contract (even if voluntarily and willfully signed by both parties) is legal. Unless the Steam TOS have been tried for exactly this case I'll withhold judgment.
For example: Some carriers here in Germany have a clause where they say they can just cancel your subscription if you've been using their service in a way that is impacting their service (i.e. excessive data traffic on an unlimited transfer package). Those have been tried and found to be not upholding before several courts. There has to be a _valid_ reason for them to enforce this, they can't just say "you've done something we just don't like, you're out".
Of course, trying the TOS means they have to shut someone off for a stupid reason first.
The only part of the Steam TOS I could find ergarding this is Section
13.C.2:
"In the case of a one-time purchase of a product license (e.g., purchase of a single game) from Valve, Valve may choose to terminate or cancel your Subscription in its entirety or may terminate or cancel only a portion of the Subscription (e.g., access to the software via Steam) and Valve may, but is not obligated to, provide access (for a limited period of time) to the download of a stand-alone version of the software and content associated with such one-time purchase."
While that sounds potentially nasty I know of noone who had problems with this. Also I want to see Valve enforcing this on their customers. Just because it is written in the TOS doesn't automatically make it legal.
However for the sake of the original argument that caused my reply I fail how you either buy or license a game using BitTorrent.
Oh great, the fucking comment system ate my post because one of my backspace strokes accidentally counted as "back".
So here's the short version: I understood what you were saying, but not what the huge problem with all of it really is.
You need Internet access for BitTorrent. You might not need it for actually installing the game but with Steam installing IS downloading. If you want to play it offline you still can, if you want to copy the Steam cache files you still can (to avoid the download) and you will need some minimal access to activate the game...which in this century shouldn't be much of a problem if one tries a little. Hell, I could probably do it through my cellphone without any bump in my bill.
Also there's a good deal of non-steam games which start to require activation despite not being published online. I know, you won't buy these either...but it's coming whether you like it or not.
If you can't do the activation because you live in deep Siberia and your only Internet connection is a donkey that comes by every other week then get a crack for all I care...at least you paid for the game.
[...] I have maxed my connection using BitTorrent -- but also other methods commonly used by pirates (such as direct downloads from sites like RapidShare -- note that I have no idea how fast the HL2 torrent is, I never did get that, and have no intention to ;)
That's not the point. The point was you claimed their distribution system was crappy. However the speed is nothing to complain about (of course P2P has the potential to be faster...it can also be much slower if the file is just available at a few nodes). Also I couldn't find the 'lengthy' other reasons why you find their actual download system so bad (except for the LAN party thing, which admittedly is retarded...then again how often do you see people grabbing 2GB at a LAN party, actual updates if they come out the day before are probably around 50MB...most of the time more like 10MB unless there's new content. Also if you really want the stuff faster: you can just copy the steam cache folder of someone who already downloaded everything).
The 'offline mode' might be a killer for you, I however don't really care for it since all relevant games I own on Steam are multiplayer anyway.
As for the 'horror scenario' of losing your games: I want to see Valve trying to shut me out as a user for some arbitrary and unjustified reason. They'd have to discuss that with my lawyer I suppose.
As for cheating: if you cheat in online games you deserve to be banned and not play that game again. I don't have sympathy for people crying over this. Your 'privacy implications' of Punkbuster and co are wildly exaggerated. Give me an example how VAC hurts your privacy when it's scanning your game files and game memory footprint for modifications? If that's a bad way then how would you do it? No cheat protection at all?
You do realize that this has nothing to do with Steam but is a problem in general?
I'm not talking about playing online in that case. Nice try though.
Well, if you don't want the latest version for your single player games you can turn automatic updates off on a game-by-game basis if you want. They're not enforced unless you want to play online and your version is incompatible with the server's.
Oh, and if Valve ever goes belly-up I'm sure there will be a fix from somewhere in the community to enable 'offline mode' one last time once and for all.
I can't convince you to use Steam and I don't want to and don't care to. But your original statement that Steam is nothing but a pile of crap and BitTorrent offers better service is just bullshit.
Lots of text, but seriously: The only thing I can understand is the part about the LAN party.
"Steam lets you buy a game from anyhwere, anytime"
Reasonably true. Anywhere with an Internet connection, anyway.
So you don't need an Internet connection for BitTorrent?
"Purchases are instant."
Reasonably true. Once I download it using their extremely crappy download system.
So you don't need to download it with BitTorrent? Downloading from other users in P2P is faster than the Steam servers? I dobut it as I easily max out my 16MBit/s connection everytime I download something off of Steam.
"Steam lets you play your games on any computer at any time."
Bullshit. Big whonking bullshit. Steam lets you play your games on any computer at any time -- IF you have an internet connection active at the moment or "logged in" and selected that you will want to play "offline" in a bit. On single player games. SINGLE PLAYER GAMES. Not online games.
I'm not prepared to "log on" just to play a single player game -- or indeed the single player campaign, for various reasons -- the chief one amongst which is that I am not connected to the net everywhere I go, and I see no reason WHATSOEVER to let Valve know when I consume my gaming fix. They have no reason to know.
If you're not connected everywhere you go all you have to do is set up offline mode once. Yes, you have to be connected to the Internet to do that then again you have to be connected to the Internet to even get your game. It's an online distribution system after all.
If I buy Portal, HL2, and another multiplayer game, and for some reason their system detects something amiss with my account while doing the multiplayer thing, they will suspend my account -- removing access to the single player games as well -- let alone the multiplayer. No refund, either. Fuck that.
No, all that their cheat detection (VAC) will do is ban you from any VAC secured servers. Which granted is the big bunch of them out there, but what use is an omnipresent cheat detection if there is no way to enforce it? Also your single player game experience is completely untouched.
"Steam keeps your games up-to-date automatically."
Big whoop. This is not hard to do even without the "Steam" framework. And maybe, just maybe, I don't WANT to have the latest version, all the time. Not all updates are good updates. Some change gameplay to something you do not like at all, some introduce bugs that affect you adversely, etc.
I very much like the control offered by being able to select whether or not I want to update a game.
Then have fun playing online with your non-updated game.
And will make your USB power fall over and die and blow something up, very creative and "performance art".
Ever seen one of those adapters that are basically plugs with an USB outlet? Ever heard of powered USB hubs?
Noone suggested you have to blow up your PC connecting all those devices at once.
I don't see how your statement is true except for:
a) your solution is free
b) uhm...nothing
- Steam lets you buy a game from anywhere, anytime.
- Purchases are instant.
- Games are installed automatically just by downloading.
- Steam lets you play your games on any computer at any time.
- Steam is usually cheaper than buying in a store.
- Steam keeps your games up-to-date automatically.
I agree that it's not perfect as it gives away control over some things. But it's not like it's all evil as some make it out to be.
Well, not always. Back when 3D cards were not very common ATI was actually the biggest low-end graphics card manufacturer. You would see their cards pretty much everywhere. Even at the beginning of hte 3D era you'd see a lot of Rage IIC chips in pre-built machines.
That doesn't solve the audible problem.
So now in your head imagine Crossfire.
It's two cards, which with fglrx probably means twice the amount of work to get it running.
The basis of this sounds a little like Galaxy Quest :P
doh :P
Curiously after your comment I tried the link again and the image was still down. So I tried with Konqueror instead and there it is...back to Firefox and I get a 404.
If I modify the URL in Firefox, hit enter, and modify it back it will finally agree to give me the image. But not if I follow the /. link. Weird.
Amsterdam's toilets look like a 404? What, do you have to piss into the hole between the two fours?
To quote Homer Simpson:
"It's funny because it's true."
It's very regularly below 60 fps in Wine while using VSync in Windows it's pretty much locked at 60. The fps I gave for Vista is when VSync is unlocked (which is unplayable to me because of tearing) and just meant as a comparison.
Also don't forget the difference in graphical details...
I recently cleaned out some old PC game boxes just to find out that my original copy of Worms had included a Worms-keychain...kept wondering how they'd had fit that into the DVD-sleeves...
As we're talking about games here let's just say that
for those applications that do work and from a purely subjective point of view, performance is good. There is no obvious performance loss
is total bullshit.
Yes I know it's a wonder and everything that I can play selected DirectX games under Linux at all. But those people claiming they run Half-Life 2 (or any source based game) through wine and it runs "the same as in Windows" kinda piss me off.
Personally if I run Team Fortress 2 in wine I see a huge performance loss. I play with DX9, FSAA and full details in Vista and get about 80-100 frames average. Using wine the game will only allow DX8.1, medium detail levels and using FSAA is right out...and it still runs with less than 60 frames most of the time. All this at 1680x1050 with an 8800GTS and a Q6600.
If we're talking about apps then yes, performance loss is minimal. Or at least performance loss is not apparent since modern machines are overpowered for most applications anyway...
But games still run like shit a good deal of the time.
That wasn't all that was cut out. In the uncensored version if you were blasting some enemy from short distance you would get a lot of splatter effects (from bullets spraying out their backside). This was cut from the German release and critical hits were as bloodless as non-critical hits (as far as I can remember).