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In the US the most consistent roads are the interstates, but if you've driven in enough states, you know that the interstates aren't exactly uniform from place to place.

That's putting it mildly. I can tell when I cross the border from Ohio to Michigan with my eyes closed. Michigan's roads suck and are badly underfunded (only Georgia spends less per capita - they need to raise taxes but the republicans control the legislature and break out in hives when they hear the words "raise taxes".

We need to see how self-driving cars handle construction zones, rain, snow, and fog on interstates first.

I think they will figure it out but it's just going to take a lot longer than many people (including Elon Musk) are proposing that they will. I figure even best case we are at least 15 years away from a truly self driving car that could be sold to the public. And that is probably being wildly optimistic. I think the technology will make it's way in to use fairly steadily and already has but full autonomy is quite a ways off yet. I think it's a worthy goal but it's just going to take a while because it's not an easy problem to solve.

I agree with much of what you say, but "some people like to drive" isn't really an argument that they need to own a car outright, much like "some people like to bowl" isn't a reason that people need to own bowling alleys outright.

The question is: Why people would still buy cars? Your response conflates "needs" vs "wants". People purchase things almost purely based on want, not need. People who like to drive will still "want" own cars, so they will continue to buy them, whether they "need" to or not.

And yes, some people who really enjoy bowling do build their own bowling alleys in their homes.

https://www.mlive.com/living/g...

has now been strongly linked with more attacks on refugees in Germany

Do we really have to go to Germany for examples of Facebook helping violent racists spread their message? A homegrown Kill Whitey is right here, whatever they are about, their name is certainly encouraging racial hatred. Which needs no encouraging.

But, at least, Facebook have got Alex Jones off, so they have that going for them, which is nice.

He had gotten into trouble before. Looks like there is a probation violation involved as well. So, he didn't just get the long jail term for hacking, he got it for hacking while already on probation for stalking drug charges, and prior hacking charges.

"That hasn't happened since Reagan became president however."

Stop lying.

Here are examples of prison sentences that I easily found , one from during the Trump administration and one from the Obama administration.

http://www.mlive.com/news/bay-...

https://www.washingtontimes.co...

I quickly bored of trying to filter by each individual president, but this is enough to refute the "hasn't happened since Reagan" claim. In fact the turning point was in 1986, or not until 3/4 of Reagans's tenure had elapsed.

Please cite your evidence that shit posters on Twitter increased after Trump started running for President and that this problem didn't exist prior. I did a quick Google search from prior to Dec 31, 2015 and here's a few I came up with:

Shock Jock fired for racists Twitter Rant

Obama's Twitter Debug attracts hate-filled posts

Shocking racist tweets follow high school basketball win by all-white team

A brief history of people getting fired for social media stupidity

That last one was one month after Trump formally announced is candidacy in June of 2015.

So I've provided evidence this was happenging before Trump entered the stage, lets see if you can provide evidence of his presence making it worse. I can assure you the increased amount of vitriol coming from his opponents is easily measured, hell just look at how often people like you post on Slashdot - a news for nerds site - your vile hate for the man, but how about you show statistics of an increase in toxicity from his supporters?

Blame Quicken Mortgage Loans. They literally own Downtown Detroit.

I bet heavy money that they orchestrated this.

http://www.mlive.com/business/...

Done! Three years ago. And that's just the one I remember hearing about on the news, possibly not the first.
http://www.mlive.com/news/sagi...

WTF: "Teachers in government schools are rarely held to any standard."

I guess you don't live in Michigan.

1. 
   Tenure is gone.
   Pensions are gone.
   Seniority is gone.
   Teachers are evaluated yearly according to a state approved evaluation model and if they are not ranked proficient two years in a row, they can now longer teach their grade or subject.
   Salaries are flat and losing ground against inflation.
   Health care costs are skyrocketing. Try living on $20,0000/year with a $3,000 health care deductible and student loan debt.
   Teaching standards increase every year and the standardized tests are a constant moving target.

Then if your school doesn't perform well on standardized tests, the state will shut you down, unless you are a charter, then you get a free pass.

You need to keep up with the times.

There is so much accountability, that we are already in a teacher shortage situation and it is only going to get worse. The richer districts are already recruiting (stealing) the best from the poorer districts. Some schools will start the year tomorrow will long-term substitutes.

Keep on bashing teachers and schools, just look forward to a day where you can't find one for your local government or charter school. It won't matter though, the state will just allow alternative certification and it will allow anyone to jump into the classroom.

There is also a shortage of bus drivers and substitute teachers.

I believe and I do believe I am right, that a strong democracy is built on strong public education.

Unfortunately, our teachers and schools are under constant attack but Besty DeVoss has a plan, unlimited for-profit schools and vouchers. If we keep going, we can transform into a bigger mess than the healthcare system!

WTF: "Teachers in government schools are rarely held to any standard."

I guess you don't live in Michigan.

1. 
   Tenure is gone.
   Pensions are gone.
   Seniority is gone.
   Teachers are evaluated yearly according to a state approved evaluation model and if they are not ranked proficient two years in a row, they can now longer teach their grade or subject.
   Salaries are flat and losing ground against inflation.
   Health care costs are skyrocketing. Try living on $20,0000/year with a $3,000 health care deductible and student loan debt.
   Teaching standards increase every year and the standardized tests are a constant moving target.

Then if your school doesn't perform well on standardized tests, the state will shut you down, unless you are a charter, then you get a free pass.

You need to keep up with the times.

There is so much accountability, that we are already in a teacher shortage situation and it is only going to get worse. The richer districts are already recruiting (stealing) the best from the poorer districts. Some schools will start the year tomorrow will long-term substitutes.

Keep on bashing teachers and schools, just look forward to a day where you can't find one for your local government or charter school. It won't matter though, the state will just allow alternative certification and it will allow anyone to jump into the classroom.

There is also a shortage of bus drivers and substitute teachers.

I believe and I do believe I am right, that a strong democracy is built on strong public education.

Unfortunately, our teachers and schools are under constant attack but Besty DeVoss has a plan, unlimited for-profit schools and vouchers. If we keep going, we can transform into a bigger mess than the healthcare system!

Also a bit older event in a different part of the country: http://www.mlive.com/news/inde...

Here in flyover country most of the people encountered in Walmart are decent and ordinary.

Uhm, no. Most of flyover country is redneck. The characterization of the GP is dead on correct; angry, goateed, tattooed, shirtless redneck trash walking around looking for trouble, surrounded by a passel of morbidly obese women and filthy kids smelling of pets and urine, shamelessly yelling at each other. They can't make it from the exit to their neglected, clapped out vehicles without a squabble and if you make eye contact while not wearing an MC cut you stand a non-zero chance of getting assaulted. If they find out you own anything they can carry off and trade for a hit of meth they'll dwell on it till they think you've left the place unoccupied and come through a window. Have a traffic altercation and you'll end up shooting a couple to survive, so you best get a CCW.

I live in it bro. Same shit for 50 miles in every direction.

You snowflakes best stick to your urban jungles and find someone to deliver your groceries.

http://www.mlive.com/news/gran...

In 2013 to be in the top 1% of US earners you had to earn over $1.15 million per year. That's quite a bit more than $100,000 and even $700,000 a year. See here:

http://www.mlive.com/news/inde...

I'd guess the top 1% is even higher now.

This is not correct. The article says that $1.15million was the AVERAGE income. Bill Gates et al.skew this a lot.

The threshold for the 1% was $389,436. This is household income, not individual income, so in many cases, this represents two incomes.

Now techies, many of whom are among the highest 1 percent of earners, are complaining that they, too, are being priced out. The Twitter employee said he hit a low point in early 2014 when the company changed its payroll schedule, leaving him with a hole in his budget. "I had to borrow money to make it through the month." He was one of several tech workers, earning between $100,000 and $700,000 a year, who vented to the Guardian about their financial situation.

In 2013 to be in the top 1% of US earners you had to earn over $1.15 million per year. That's quite a bit more than $100,000 and even $700,000 a year. See here:
http://www.mlive.com/news/inde...
I'd guess the top 1% is even higher now.

Agreed on the libertarian thing. A lot of people seem to have libertarianism as a whole confused with anarchy, probably with the help of anarcho-libertarians.

But as far as self-driving cars, I can tell you this objectively right now: software fucking sucks, but the Google car as far as I know only screwed up once even if it seems to have a propensity for being rear-ended. It would seem to be prudent, nay conservative, for governments to pass some modern equivalents of those laws that required somebody to walk in front of those new-fangled horseless carriages until they were proven technology. The reason I'd put that in the government's bailiwick is that we're talking about a ton of metal travelling at speed being controlled by software that could or could not prove fallible. If it fails, people will get hurt and killed. On the other hand, all it has to do is fail less frequently than humans do, which I think will be the eventual outcome once the technology is proven.

Michigan is also trying to get in on the self-driving car thing, and while this would be a better post if I knew enough off the top of my head to compare and contrast with California, at least we have two different regulatory frameworks to observe in the short term. I believe Michigan's is less restrictive, and the winters there should be good enough to answer the objections somebody always needs to bring up about winter driving.

I mean, I could be wrong in urging caution. Plenty of people were convinced that the zombie apocalypse was going to happen in Colorado when they decided to poke cannabis prohibition in the eye, and it turns out that while it hasn't been wildly successful, there's yet to be any reports of stoners literally eating brains. (Two incidents I remember where drinking and edibles led to death, blame cannabis and ignore the alcohol component as usual, and probably a few more I haven't heard of simply because those first two weren't the start of the zombie apocalypse after all.) We should be cautious, but we shouldn't freak out every single time a self-driving car gets rear-ended or goes oops. Just has to be better than humans.

tl;dr I'll hop in my time machine, grab the data you need from the priests of the Temples of Syrinx in 2112 when self-driving cars are proven technology, and be right back.

"It makes Michigan a place where particularly for the auto industry it's a good place to do work,"

Yeah except for the shitty roads, expensive labor, unsupportive government, hostile unions, etc. Other than that it's awesome. I find it hilarious that the state most closely associated with the auto industry has some of the worst roads in the country. Good place to test handling and suspensions I guess. Anyway this doesn't really matter much unless they can keep the companies that own the technology doing it in Michigan. Who cares if Google develops self driving tech in Michigan if Michigan doesn't see any of the financial benefit from that.

The thing that Michigan (particularly SE Michigan) has going for it is that the auto industry has a lot of residual talent left in the area. There is a ton of engineering and production capability. Michigan can be a great place to work on some really interesting technology. Seriously, it's hugely underrated as a tech hub but Michigan is one of the best places to be for high tech jobs. Too bad the state has dropped the ball in so many other areas. It's a beautiful place to live and work (outside of Detroit City proper anyway) and it's kind of a shame what has happened to the state in the last several decades.

The Michigan state house and senate are both Republican controlled. Who do you think approves the budget for new voting machines?

Michigan's aging voting machines a 'catastrophe waiting to happen'

They knew about this in advance.

Oh, and I suppose they collude to only put the good machines outside of the city. Seriously, wtf does that have to do with voter suppression? Tin foil hat much, or do you have actual evidence you can link to?

The Michigan state house and senate are both Republican controlled. Who do you think approves the budget for new voting machines?

Michigan's aging voting machines a 'catastrophe waiting to happen'

They knew about this in advance.

http://www.twincities.com/2016...
http://www.mlive.com/news/ann-...
http://www.denverpost.com/2016...
http://www.azcentral.com/story...

BTW, I only keep hearing about "rigged" elections, fraud, stealing votes etc. from two kinds of people. Political dilettantes and Republicans.

Only difference being that as far as I can tell, while political dilettantes have always been partial to conspiracy theories because they are... well...dilettantes...
Republicans seem to have built their myth of "being cheated" around that time JFK beat their "not a crook" sweatball Tricky Dick.
Who just happened to be running multiple schemes to rig elections just as his party was busy implementing the "Southern strategy" in order to woo southern whites.
Who were at the time all hot and bothered about losing their "legitimate" ways of rigging elections against black voters, they went around dressed in nothing but dresses made out of bed linen.
Sorta like what ISIS folk do.

You realize that your salary is pretty much the same if you work on one side of Lake Washington or the other at a given company... right?

You realize that I've been talking about cheaper land, not cheaper workers?

I could have, yes, but I wasn't.

More so, I'm sure all have done the math, just as how many Silicon Valley or San Francisco based company has as to if they would be better off relocating to... Detroit (cheap land and homes, and a police force needing some subsidizing, etc).

Ah, you've heard of that plan!

That problem exists anywhere. All a tech reporter has to do is know where some employees from this company or that eat lunch and sit near... as alas far too many talk shop, even in public with each other.

You've quite convinced me, we must not only keep them from the public, we must force them to have separate mental identities!

It's the only way to be safe.

Nobody got poisoned or sick in the end.

How do we know, what the mid- and long-term effects will be? There is no one obviously poisoned by tap water in Flint, Michigan either.

Should we apply the same spin to people responsible for that, as the submitter applied to hackers because he sympathizes with them?

Do people in Japan suddenly feel better if they know they person they killed by running over them did it on purpose? Killing someone in the US, whether accidentally or not, comes with the potential for biiig civil liabilities. If they meant to die, that nicely nips any frivolous wrongful death suits in the bud.

There is a difference between legal iability and psychological damage.

So if you killed someone, and it turned out to be a suicide, you'd be happy? I'd assume not. People who accidentally kill someone often need counseling afterward. Nightmares where they re-live the killing incident, flashbacks, PTSD, and stuff like that.

http://www.experienceproject.c...

Even people who kill someone justifiably in self defense can have problems afterward. http://www.mlive.com/news/inde...

The shooter appears to have been an insurance adjuster.

He very easily could have gone on the killing spree without Uber being involved at all. The only thing I can speculate from Uber's involvement is that perhaps he had financial problems.

You'll see more of this kind of thing the more the middle class gets squeezed. I can't see many other ways that a family man who's been married for 21 years decides one day to go kill a bunch of random people. It's not just jihadists (both Christian and Muslim brands) and mentally unstable butthurt guys who can't get laid any more.

Also, he wasn't really a good shot. I forget if the article I linked (there's plenty of them on mLive covering different aspects) mentioned it, but the guy fired 30 bullets all in all. This really looks to be a completely spur of the moment desperate lashing out until more details arrive.

I'd also speculate that he wanted to be convicted. Doesn't Uber track the location of their cars?

But then again, one of the things I love about flyover country is the background radiation of batshit crazy we have around here! I must have jinxed it when I openly wondered the other day why there hasn't been more violence in Michigan.

The clickbait has to be it. Insurance adjuster goes on shooting rampage isn't something that the media can really sell.

The best I can guess at this point is that this guy was having a financial or marital problem of some kind and decided that a jail cell would be the best place to live out the rest of his years.

How the hell did this get to +5 insightful? Why is the AC who provided the link to mLive still at 0?

From mLive:

Here's what we know about [the shooter]:

- The father of two children, Dalton has been married since 1995.
- Neighbors said Dalton was an insurance adjuster.
- There is no known criminal history or mental illness, authorities said.
- Dalton was an Uber driver, apparently taking fares between shootings.
- He was a "car-guy" who liked to tinker with old vehicles.

(Emphasis mine.)

Insurance adjuster, family man married for 21 years, no background to check, etc.

I was going to go for a car analogy, but the shooter's already provided me one! You might as well label car enthusiasts who like old vehicles as freaks!

I mean, I'm sure I could construct an equally tortured line of reasoning that no normal person would enjoy working on cars without computer controlled fuel injection, TCS, ABS, a CAN bus, emissions monitoring, or even an OBD system, etc--only freaks.

But no, it's all totally Uber's fault.

Ironically, only a month earlier someone who had an unlicensed car murdered an innocent woman only a few miles away from the shooting: http://www.mlive.com/news/kala...

No, one person went to Facebook because the asshat was driving 80mph in a 45 and sideswiped another vehicle.

Updates on the stories that matter. Anyone want to make a submission?

Will the Trans-Pacific Partnership Force Us to Fund the Paris Climate Agreement?

Saginaw [Michigan] County Board calls on Congress to oppose Trans-Pacific Partnership

Poll: Donald Trump trails Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders in matchup

(This one may seem random, but is perhaps the most on-topic to this discussion of the bunch. People got killed but she didn't join Daesh at least? USA #1!) Suspect in Vegas crash said she was stressed living in car

Sanders Campaign Suspends Two More Staffers Over Data Breach

Global Trade Faces Fragmentation Risks From TPP, TTIP, TiSA

if the lead is coming from the local pipes in people's houses, then how come the lead poisoning started when they switched water sources? That sounds like bee ess.

pH changed when they switched the source of water, the now acidic water dissolved lead in solder joints and thus ends up in the water in people's houses...

http://www.mlive.com/news/flin...

Or so they say... Or it all could be bee ess of course...

Fuck, are you stupid? I know shouting big nasty chemical terms makes you feel justified in hating on corporations and republicans, but, even the most cursory reading of an easily-found news article explains (emphasis mine):

Mailed Friday, Jan. 2, the customer notices come after the state Department of Environmental Quality issued a notice of violation of the Safe Drinking Water Act for maximum contaminant levels for trihalomethanes -- or TTHM -- a group of four chemicals that are formed as a byproduct of disinfecting water.

As city water plant operators used additional chlorine to fight bacteria in the Flint water system this summer, disinfectant byproduct levels also likely increased, city officials said Friday.

Source: http://www.mlive.com/news/flin...

Seriously, you fucking tard. Get your facts straight before you start shouting about how big businesses are evil poisoners of the poor folks in Flint. The treatment of the water with disinfectants is what's causing the fucking spike in trihalomethanes. It's NOT industrial pollution.

In fact, if you read this, you'll find that ALL of the shit you're shouting about here is caused by infrastructure & treatment problems - the water coming in from the river is not at the pH it needs to be - the acidity of the water is causing it to leach lead from pipes and other plumbing infrastructure at an accelerated rate, and the treatment that they're doing for microbial contamination is causing the increase in trihalomethanes - probably also because they're not buffering the water pH properly.

According to this article, when the water leaves the treatment plant, it is lead-free (within an acceptable margin of error). The problem comes from old (ie, still being built in the 1980s) pipes that used lead solder to connect the copper. The older pipes are around the city and inside homes, and will take 15 years to replace.

The water from the river has higher levels of chloride, and chloride is corrosive to iron, which caused the lead to leach off into the water.

Anyone who thinks in-home pipes will be replaced in 15 years is being optimistic to the point of the ridiculous. They will be replaced when they break (because very few people know how to work with lead any more), but if they're behind a wall nobody will replace them until the wall has to be opened. And even then, they often won't replace more than they need that day because plumbing is so damn expensive.

Check it out, not just lead solder, but also actual lead water pipes. It's amazing they don't all have brain damage.

On the other hand, Mitt Romney's from that area (I kid, I kid).

Yes. I don't know how long ago people stopped using lead solder in water pipes, but apparently they were using lead water pipes as well, so they really should have known better.

Stories like this though, tempt me to get a toxicity test done on my water.

Just like GM, Michael Moore moved his contribution to Flint's tax base away from Flint long ago.

According to this article, when the water leaves the treatment plant, it is lead-free (within an acceptable margin of error). The problem comes from old (ie, still being built in the 1980s) pipes that used lead solder to connect the copper. The older pipes are around the city and inside homes, and will take 15 years to replace.

The water from the river has higher levels of chloride, and chloride is corrosive to iron, which caused the lead to leach off into the water.

Activists rightly claim that sexual assault is one of the worst things a victim can go through. So why would anyone want to put someone through that?

Several months ago, the University of Michigan released a flawed survey claiming 22.5 percent of undergrad women at the university had been sexually assaulted. That's not actually the case — the study, like others, offered a broad definition of sexual assault guaranteed to elicit a high response.

Now, the researcher behind that survey is saying he was surprised that the number one write-in response from students as to why they didn't report the alleged sexual assault to an official was because "it was no big deal."

Activists rightly claim that sexual assault is one of the worst things a victim can go through. So why would anyone want to put someone through that?

Several months ago, the University of Michigan released a flawed survey claiming 22.5 percent of undergrad women at the university had been sexually assaulted. That's not actually the case — the study, like others, offered a broad definition of sexual assault guaranteed to elicit a high response.

Now, the researcher behind that survey is saying he was surprised that the number one write-in response from students as to why they didn't report the alleged sexual assault to an official was because "it was no big deal."

...consisting of 250,000 items. Think of the mylar! http://www.mlive.com/lansing-n...

That really depends: (If the enemy still has an air defense system of any sort) the A-10 is completely and totally useless, because they're death traps if they might encounter a missile of any kind.

Like this one did, taking a hit and still flying 120 miles home? http://www.mlive.com/news/kala...

Or this one? http://www.womensmemorial.org/...

Or, best of all, these A-10s that were able to neutralize the threat with tactics and flares: http://theaviationist.com/2015...

The A-10 is loved because it fights despite the threat environment. When the F-35 shows it can do that, perhaps there will be a comparison.

I know I'm late, but there was a 4.2 earthquake in Michigan on Saturday 5/2.

I hope you realise that Shatner is an idiot, Detroit gets a significant portion of it's water from lake Huron through a 120 inch pipe and sells a portion to Flint, additionally Flint is putting in another pipeline north of the DWSD pipeline, an 80 inch pipeline; Shanter's 48 inch pipe is meaningless.

Male teacher bangs student? Male and female alike want his nuts cut off.
Female teacher does the same? Well, the boy was lucky... where were female teachers like that when I was a boy?!

You need to get with the times.

Male teachers who have sex with underage female students are viewed as statutory rapists or creeps; women who do the same are perceived as doing the boy a favour or providing a rite of passage, evidenced by the inevitable “Where was she when I was in high school?” cracks.

Sound familiar? The "no harm done" attitude people have towards male victims isn't right, and people's attitudes are changing, albeit slowly.

But it does happen. And it gets pretty bad.

Women have successfully put total strangers behind bars with nothing more than words, and no evidence at all. It should not happen, but it does, and far too much for comfort.

.

The unmentionable.

Companies like Synagro and WeCare Organics take municipal waste and deposit it on farm fields where your food is grown.

There is a lot of money in this - the kitty is so rich, sometimes back room deals are made to keep the gravy train rolling and sludge hauling contracts active.

Powerful lobbies, such as the WEF and AWWA "educate" the political establishment to keep nutrient standards low.

Look up what happened in the Chesapake Bay....

Algae blooms are the inevitable result.

On the other side, people have been trying for years to get labeling standards improved so consumers can make informed choices as to if they want to eat food grown in sludge, but year over year the bill dies in committee. The opposing side doesn't have the money to counter the powerful WEF lobby, so congressional masters kill the bill in committee every year its introduced.

One can only hope is that now that algae blooms are happening with greater frequency and more people are being impacted, that new nutrient standards will become the norm and this sludge spreading nonsense will end.

Speak for yourself; I'm saving up for one of these awesome new Chinese cars: http://www.mlive.com/grpress/b...

(I thought this reply got posted, but it hasn't appeared after 15 minutes.)

The Kleargear.com address at 2885 Sanford Ave. SW in Grandville MI is really a mail forwarding/disguised address popular with companies doing horrible things to people, and is run by a company called Mailbox Forwarding, Inc.: The mail-forwarding service is not unfamiliar to the BBB. “Over the years, we’ve had many issues with businesses that use that address”

Here's another address for them, thanks to this press release through United Business Media's PRNewswire. If they try to retract it, here's a copy at The Sacramento Bee:

Christophe Monette, CEO of Kleargear parent Descoteaux Boutiques, has been pleasantly surprised...

Margaux Banet
2885 Sanford Ave SW #19886
Grandville, MI 49418
United States

Descoteaux Boutiques
ZAC Paris Rive Gauche
118-122 Avenue de France
75013 Paris
France

And this press release also says "Kleargear is donating 2% of net sales between November 17th and December 17th to The American Red Cross in support of our friends and neighbors affected by Sunday's devastating tornado outbreak across the Midwest." Who wants to bet any of their money gets to anyone who's ever seen a tornado? Best to check on the legitimacy of these charity solicitations of course. Michigan Attorney General Bill Schuette has been making charity fraudsters one of this pet projects lately: See "A Michigan Crackdown On Charity Fraud". I'll bet Schuette's office would be more than happy to hear about any problems from companies that happen to officially give their state of residence as Michigan and claim to help Michigan tornado victims. The Michigan Attorney General has a specific phone number for Questions About Charities.

Of course, maybe the French address is fake too. They're a bit pickier about that in France though, I think. Anyone have the contact info for the corporation regulators or charity regulators in Paris?

Also: The BBB gave Kleargear.com an F rating, before Kleargear.com inserted this ruin-your-customers-lives clause in their terms and then faked the A+ rating on their website. For those of you who can't see popups on the BBB site: As of November 28, 2012, the BBB became aware that the company's website is displaying a BBB Accredited Business logo and BBB Rating A+; however, the company is not a BBB accredited business and the BBB rating is not A+. The BBB contacted the company regarding these issues and this matter is pending the company's response. As of November 28, 2012, the BBB discovered that some pages of the company's website display the BBB Accredited Business Logo and state "BBB Rating A+", when neither is true. The BBB contacted the company at the Michigan mail drop address instructing the company to immediately remove the incorrect BBB logo and reference from their site. This matter is currently pending.

The Kleargear.com address at 2885 Sanford Ave. SW in Grandville MI is really a mail forwarding/disguised address popular with companies doing horrible things to people, and is run by a company called Mailbox Forwarding, Inc.: The mail-forwarding service is not unfamiliar to the BBB. “Over the years, we’ve had many issues with businesses that use that address”

Here's another address for them, thanks to this press release through United Business Media's PRNewswire. If they try to retract it, here's a copy at The Sacramento Bee:

Christophe Monette, CEO of Kleargear parent Descoteaux Boutiques, has been pleasantly surprised...

Margaux Banet
2885 Sanford Ave SW #19886
Grandville, MI 49418
United States

Descoteaux Boutiques
ZAC Paris Rive Gauche
118-122 Avenue de France
75013 Paris
France

And this press release also says "Kleargear is donating 2% of net sales between November 17th and December 17th to The American Red Cross in support of our friends and neighbors affected by Sunday's devastating tornado outbreak across the Midwest." Who wants to bet any of their money gets to anyone who's ever seen a tornado? Best to check on the legitimacy of these charity solicitations of course. Michigan Attorney General Bill Schuette has been making charity fraudsters one of this pet projects lately: See "A Michigan Crackdown On Charity Fraud". I'll bet Schuette's office would be more than happy to hear about any problems from companies that happen to officially give their state of residence as Michigan and claim to help Michigan tornado victims. The Michigan Attorney General has a specific phone number for Questions About Charities.

Of course, maybe the French address is fake too. They're a bit pickier about that in France though, I think. Anyone have the contact info for the corporation regulators or charity regulators in Paris?

Also: The BBB gave Kleargear.com an F rating, before Kleargear.com inserted this ruin-your-customers-lives clause in their terms and then faked the A+ rating on their website. For those of you who can't see popups on the BBB site: As of November 28, 2012, the BBB became aware that the company's website is displaying a BBB Accredited Business logo and BBB Rating A+; however, the company is not a BBB accredited business and the BBB rating is not A+. The BBB contacted the company regarding these issues and this matter is pending the company's response. As of November 28, 2012, the BBB discovered that some pages of the company's website display the BBB Accredited Business Logo and state "BBB Rating A+", when neither is true. The BBB contacted the company at the Michigan mail drop address instructing the company to immediately remove the incorrect BBB logo and reference from their site. This matter is currently pending.

You're talking about an individual student; I was talking about how the typical outcome expected for an entire school faces impacts the outcome for everyone. The motivated, involved parent is important. But they may not have the ability to elevate a student that far above the average outcome for the school they're attending. And those averages all depend heavily on the income of the parents.

Income, parent education, and parent involvement are not disconnected. Table 3 here tries to map how related they all are to each other. For any one parent, yes getting involved can be the most important thing to improve outcomes. But a child placed into a low income school will be surrounded with children of parents without much parent involvement or education. All of that drags down the whole school in a way that's tough to overcome.

There's some useful data from Michigan that shows the trend here. As usual there are people there who believe that "support from parents is the most important way to improve the schools". But when you look at test scores, the biggest correlation is with differences in family income and the corresponding education of the parents. The University of Michigan spelled it out quite clearly: More Money, Better Grades. That cites a Harvard study that breaks the phenomenon down into small parts.

Guess all those exploding Jeeps that NHTSA bullied Chrysler about aren't getting fixed for free: http://www.mlive.com/auto/index.ssf/2013/06/jeep_recall_chrysler_avoids_lo.html