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Reading the article.. I think the reference to the fact that 5mW laser pointers can be dangerous is quite misleading.

There doesn't seem to be any evidence that such a laser was used in this case. (And it does seem rather unlikely)

The article mentions that there have been incidents in the past with aviation and laser shows. The wattage of those lasers is a completely different story.

So it's an old problem with a new post-9/11-paranoic "it could be a terrorist tool!" spin to it.

"Although definitions of LEO vary from source to source, MSL defines LEO as orbits having apogees and perigees below 3000 km"

Although in fairness this link says that the ISS has been orbiting around 250 miles up. I think I heard it called Low Earth Orbit, but the graph on the page indicates it's falling. Bil Bryson's A Short History of Nearly Everything comments that the edge of the atmosphere isn't that well defined, illustrating it that the ISS is falling a few thousand yards per week because of something up there equivalent to air resistance.

Take care.
love Ken.

They are essentially recreating the X-15 experiments made in the early sixties.

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/x15/cove r.html

Those missions a rocket plane would detach from a B-52 and fly to suborbit and then glide back to earth and land like a plane.

What is really important is that resently there was an article about there being more billionaire's in the United States then there ever was in the history of the United States.

http://www.fool.com/News/mft/2004/mft04092701.htm

And now Paul Allen and Burt Rutan are about to prove (I hope!) that these rich kids can have their very own space program for a mere $20 million. Which hopefully will lead to an increase in aerospace start-ups and maybe a boom in aerospace technology similar to the .com boom.

I hope this happens because not only will we finaly start seeing the promises made during the space race come to fruitation, but we can also learn from our past mistakes made during the dot com era and make a shit load of money by bailling out when the getin's good.

It's going to take a few years for this to start, Virgin is (assuming it's true and not a publicity stunt it's libel to be) not planning launches for another three years. That's time enough for everyone to change their major's and hit the books for the next big thing.

Of course if spaceshipone crashes and burns you can just forget about what I just said.

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Right here...

http://mars.jpl.nasa.gov/mgs/sci/msss27Sept04/R150 2643merA_1mA.gif

Dunno why they called it the Bonneville crater though...

(Note to mods: lame attempt at humor)

NASA was able to get a really good initial fix on the positions of the rovers using doppler measurements of the tones the spacecraft emitted on descent.

For example, from the journal of Michael Watkins, manager of the navigation team:

But we're also still working, and for Opportunity, the Navigation Team wants to get our first solution for the position of Opportunity as quickly as possible to help assess the condition of the rover.

Ten minutes after landing we get it - it's about 10 km further downtrack (to the East on Mars) from the last targeted point (which was about 10 km from the original target), due entirely to low atmospheric density on Mars. This is similar to Spirit, and well within specifications, and it looks from our maps to be an awesome landing site for the scientists. But we'll have to wait and see the first pictures...

This picture shows you the relative accuracy of the navigation. The big blue estimate ellipse is based on doppler data from the approach to Mars. The black ellipse is based on doppler data from the rover's status tones prior to chute deployment. And the white dot is the estimated position based on doppler from surface communications.

NASA was able to get a really good initial fix on the positions of the rovers using doppler measurements of the tones the spacecraft emitted on descent.

For example, from the journal of Michael Watkins, manager of the navigation team:

But we're also still working, and for Opportunity, the Navigation Team wants to get our first solution for the position of Opportunity as quickly as possible to help assess the condition of the rover.

Ten minutes after landing we get it - it's about 10 km further downtrack (to the East on Mars) from the last targeted point (which was about 10 km from the original target), due entirely to low atmospheric density on Mars. This is similar to Spirit, and well within specifications, and it looks from our maps to be an awesome landing site for the scientists. But we'll have to wait and see the first pictures...

This picture shows you the relative accuracy of the navigation. The big blue estimate ellipse is based on doppler data from the approach to Mars. The black ellipse is based on doppler data from the rover's status tones prior to chute deployment. And the white dot is the estimated position based on doppler from surface communications.

I was actually thinking about shipping oil and gasoline out there. :) Use bottled oxygen and use IC engines for transportation. That's a sure way to fill up the atmosphere with CO2.

Are we still talking about Mars here? Because Mars' atmosphere is already 95% CO2.

Sean

To quote this article to give an idea of the amounts data we get:
"The Mars Orbiter Camera's narrow-angle camera has now examined nearly 4.5 percent of Mars' surface, including extensive imaging of candidate and selected landing sites for surface missions."

4.5 percent! At high resolution, a reasonably small area can rapidly contain lots of pixels, for example if we were to image a 20kmx20km area *known* to hold the lander, that would mean 400 million pixels at 1m/pixel, or 1.6 billion at 0.5m/pixel. Oh, and you want multiple sun-angles, too. And you can only send about 20 megabytes/day, if I'm correct. Such an endevour could easily take a year, and for what?

And in any case, if anyone should be looking for Beatle2 it should be Mars Express. Not that I wouldn't appreciate it, but as a European I don't see the use of asking NASA to find a failed probe for us. Just let it rest in peace, and build a next one, one that reports back during landing.

........BBBB
PPPPPPPPRRRRPPPPPPPP
........GGGG

Where the middle layer three CCDs deep are the "Blue", "Red", and "Green" (approx.) CCDs, while the others are the panchromatic (really the same as the "Red" in the color portion of the array). Each of the CCDs is something like 1024 pixels across, with a 6 pixel overlap on each side.

Check out:

http://hirise.lpl.arizona.edu http://marsoweb.nas.nasa.gov/hirise

Not only that, but according to space.com, the mission is an orbiter, not a lander. The US sent Clementine to the moon for $75 million dollars ten years ago. Chandrayan will be more capable, and I'm all for it, but this isn't exactly a revolution in lunar exploration.

Without a stable magnetic field to deflect the solar wind, any attempt to increase the atmospheric density on Mars is never going to work. It would be like trying to inflate a balloon with a hole in it. Deatils here.

But can you see the carcass of the little bunny that NASA cruelly murdered?

BTW, there's a very interesting video about NASA and Parawings here.

Yes there is.

Engineers still have to do math in the English system because parts are made to English unit standards in the US. Forcing a changeover would not only make lives easier for engineers, but make it easier to teach phyiscal concepts such as the difference between weight and mass (did you know that in English units, there are units of pounds for both weight and mass? Metric is much more straightforward).

I'm not sure that outweighs trying to fight the ingrained culture of English units, but I thought I'd just throw in my two cents.

The link goes to a nasa page with more info about the molecular structure etc

the parent poster was right though, the shuttles do have heat resistant ceramic panels on them. I got to hold one once when I was in grade school, they are very lightweight and remind of a hard sort of styrofoam.

In the early 1990s research was done on quick turn around vehicles for low cost space access. Two very good articles by Dr. Jerry Pournelle are The SSX Concept and SSTO Revisited.

You may or may not agree with Dr. Pournelle, I sure don't, on a lot of things, but he's spot on about what happened to the SSTO concept, NASA got control of it, let a contract out to Lockheed to develop the X-33, spent a whole bunch of money and didn't produce any real hardware unlike the SSX project which spent 60 million dollars and produced a prototype that was able to take off and land twice with a 26 hour turnaround with a support crew of 14 and which also managed to land safely after a hydrogen explosion tore off part of the aeroshell.

yes ... as long as that orbital outpost is an asteroid headed towards earth.

Rockhound : You know we're sitting on four million pounds of fuel, one nuclear weapon and a thing that has 270,000 moving parts built by the lowest bidder. Makes you feel good, doesn't it?

Well...I can only hope there will be none. There is enough waste in orbit already

The only way I see NASA TV carrying coverage of the X-Prize competition is if there is a horrendous failure. Then they'll replay the disaster over and over, with the reminder that "we told you so."

Rutan's already made many public statements about the liability that the NASA culture has become. NASA used to be the premiere space program, but degenerated into a self-serving bureaucracy.

We can't expect substantial innovation out of NASA until something changes. Rutan's thrown down the gauntlet, and given them the big "you're Number One!" If he's successful, the budget-minded politicians are going to start asking "why are we funding NASA when the commercial entities are doing a better job?" As soon as the budget's on the line, NASA will be forced to change. But until then, expect the same lackluster performance out of NASA.

Go Burt!

btw, I checked the NASA TV Event Schedule, and there's a conspicuous gap between 27 September and 1 October. On the 29th, you'll be able to watch regurgitated videos of the ISS and other NASA programs.

I was skeptical of Rutan's true goal (ooo, black sky), but after hearing rumors, I think he and others are going to do what NASA couldn't; bring cheap space access to the masses.

Things pass the earth all the time. You can check them out here: http://neo.jpl.nasa.gov/ca/

" But, he says, ask the same question of Nasa now and the answer is the same as 30 years ago. Nasa is working on it and it will be affordable in 30 years' time."

Yeah tell me about it, on the 27th NASA is going to do a dress rehearsal for the X-43 flight in October. Next month they are going for a new world record in the fastest jet powered aircraft in the world. The X-43 could have led to an airplane that can "fly into space" like Rutan mentioned as wanting to do in the article. However, from what I understand, NASA decided to cancel the successor of the X-43. Which is a shame because it is a very solid concept for finding a cheap way into orbit.

This reminds me of the X-20? The successor of the X-15, that was planned to go into orbit. If Rutan, can succeed with a spacecraft that resembles the X-15 and enter orbit, I think that would show that NASA, in all it's wisdom, has held us back as far as manned space travel is concerned.

" But, he says, ask the same question of Nasa now and the answer is the same as 30 years ago. Nasa is working on it and it will be affordable in 30 years' time."

Yeah tell me about it, on the 27th NASA is going to do a dress rehearsal for the X-43 flight in October. Next month they are going for a new world record in the fastest jet powered aircraft in the world. The X-43 could have led to an airplane that can "fly into space" like Rutan mentioned as wanting to do in the article. However, from what I understand, NASA decided to cancel the successor of the X-43. Which is a shame because it is a very solid concept for finding a cheap way into orbit.

This reminds me of the X-20? The successor of the X-15, that was planned to go into orbit. If Rutan, can succeed with a spacecraft that resembles the X-15 and enter orbit, I think that would show that NASA, in all it's wisdom, has held us back as far as manned space travel is concerned.

NASA's NEO (Near Earth Object) program tracks many different objects, though I wish they had a bigger budget, then they could handle even more.

A post on the World Wind Forums. Go console the poor sysop.

Oh dear,

My beautiful server! Noooooo! I assembled it last winter and now it has been reduced to slag... doh.

learn.arc.nasa.gov - Main info web site barely up.

opensource.arc.nasa.gov - Main download site has been hit pretty bad.

onearth.jpl.nasa.gov - Main LandSat7 server has been pummeled. Tiles will be loading in very slowly.

USGS 1m & topo servers are still up, problem is they don't belong to us.

A post on the World Wind Forums. Go console the poor sysop.

Oh dear,

My beautiful server! Noooooo! I assembled it last winter and now it has been reduced to slag... doh.

learn.arc.nasa.gov - Main info web site barely up.

opensource.arc.nasa.gov - Main download site has been hit pretty bad.

onearth.jpl.nasa.gov - Main LandSat7 server has been pummeled. Tiles will be loading in very slowly.

USGS 1m & topo servers are still up, problem is they don't belong to us.

Unfortunately, porting to linux and osx isn't going to be a simple task. In their infinite wisdom, the developers decided to write worldwind in C# and use directx. They do throw out some arguements defending their choice, but its not going to be a mere afternoon's work getting a linux variant going.

http://qtss.arc.nasa.gov/worldwind-1_2.zip is working at about 175k for me...

FYI ... This is from their webpage:

We are online again the WorldWind application can be downloaded from the following mirrors:

BEST :

http://128.102.102.126:9080/mirror/worldwind-1_2 .z ip
http://128.102.102.129:9080/mirror/worldwind-1 _2.z ip
http://kiosk.arc.nasa.gov:8090/worldwind-1_2.z ip
http://ic.arc.nasa.gov/archivetmps/worldwind-1 _2.z ip

Mirrors to the download file

http://opensource.arc.nasa.gov/archives/worldwind- 1_2.zip

Nice page title too :) We slashdotted NASA... pwn3d.

I worked at NASA last semester. Judging by the URL, this isn't NASA's main cluster of servers (note that nasa.gov loads briskly). This is probably just some SGI in a server closet in whatever building this was made in at Ames.

don't forget about the jpl image archive. they have some nice shots of most planets (in our solar system at least), including earth.

from http://opensource.arc.nasa.gov/archives/worldwind- 1_2.zip

We are sorry but the slashdoting of a 250MB file was a bit more than we had planned for. We will re-post this file later in the day or this evening once the initial rush cools off. Thank you for your patience.

When will these government agencies learn to stick to their knitting?!?!?

Nasa is the "National Aeronautics and Space Administration." The surface of the earth is neither aeronautical nor space (duh, it's a surface).

Now if the Department of Homeland Security were offering this, I think it would make sense!

you can still download the program from here

Here is a direct download link for the software-- "World Wind".

Download away!

Recommended Specifications

* Windows 2000, XP Home, or XP Professional
* Intel Pentium 3 1 ghz or AMD Athlon or higher
* 256 MB of RAM
* 3D Graphics Card
o nVidia GeForce 2 Ultra
o ATI Radeon 7500
o Intel Extreme Graphics 2
* DSL / Cable connection or faster
* 2 GB of disk space

http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Newsroom/BlueMarb le/
This site has some absolutely stunning still shots of earth. Available as several hundred K JPGs, 1-2 meg JPGs, and up to 30 meg TIFFs.
-nB

Personally, I found the discovery of alcohol in space clouds a lot more interesting.

Sugar? Boring.

Has anyone had sex in space yet? The Russians and US have both been sending up women for awhile. I'm sure someone must have joined the 100 mile(or however high it is) club by now.

Actually, it would be the 200 Mile High Club (station orbits at about 350 km).

I highly doubt that the astronauts have. The only time it would be likely is during a long-term Space Station stay, since shuttle missions are too short. And considering the psychology of three people crammed into a tiny space for months at a time, I seriously doubt that anybody would be feeling particularly excited. Astronauts by nature are not very impulsive people (at least the ones we have now; not true for the Mercury/Gemini/Apollo crews) and would understand the impact of such an encounter on their ability to work together professionally.

Although, I think I feel a reality series coming on...

Coming this Fall to Fox:
We took 8 people and stranded them 200 hundred miles above the ground. Watch as they struggle with life, love and the vaccuum of outer space on...
SPACE STATION SURVIVOR.
The losers get the airlock...

http://www.jsc.nasa.gov/Bios/htmlbios/foale.html

From what I understand, it wasn't directly a money related problem, it was a weight related problem. As in, they had a set size limit for the rover itself, which was set by the size of the transport, which was set by the size of the rocket used to get it from Earth to Mars. Since it was assumed the lower inclination of the Sun after about 90 days would make the rover unable to hold a charge, they didn't figure it was worth the effort to include a broom. Of course, then, after they got it there, somebody had the idea to park it with the southern side uphill, so the panels would be more directly hit by the sun. Of course, now other stuff is starting to fail...

From what I understand, it wasn't directly a money related problem, it was a weight related problem. As in, they had a set size limit for the rover itself, which was set by the size of the transport, which was set by the size of the rocket used to get it from Earth to Mars. Since it was assumed the lower inclination of the Sun after about 90 days would make the rover unable to hold a charge, they didn't figure it was worth the effort to include a broom. Of course, then, after they got it there, somebody had the idea to park it with the southern side uphill, so the panels would be more directly hit by the sun. Of course, now other stuff is starting to fail...

Obligatory rover home page link

That was a fascinating article???

Whoah... you'd better stay away from here.

You just might have a coronary thrombosis.

.

As early as 1895, a Russian scientist named Konstantin Tsiolkovsky suggested a fanciful "Celestial Castle" in geosynchronous Earth orbit attached to a tower on the ground, not unlike Paris's Eiffel tower. Another Russian, a Leningrad engineer by the name of Yuri Artsutanov, wrote some of the first modern ideas about space elevators in 1960. Published as a non-technical story in Pravda, his story never caught the attention of the West. Science magazine ran a short article in 1966 by John Isaacs, an American oceanographer, about a pair of whisker-thin wires extending to a geostationary satellite. The article ran basically unnoticed. The concept finally came to the attention of the space flight engineering community through a technical paper written in 1975 by Jerome Pearson of the Air Force Research Laboratory. This paper was the inspiration for Clarke's novel.