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Eheh, I noticed it was sarcasm right after pressing submit when I finally read your signature, but it was already too late and I'm sorry for that.

The PDA is a Yopy YP-3700. Unfortunately G.Mate has discontinued the international production line two weeks ago, therefore the project in which I am involved is nolonger as relevante as it used to be.

The Yopy runs X11 and is a proper Linux PDA, at half the price of this new Zaurus.

uk reseller

I've had mine for a few months and it's great!

zodiac

It's a PalmOS device that's been optimized for playing games. Since it is a Palm device, you can play Palm games on it, and they are also coming out with Zodiac optimized games. Oh, and it has all those PDA features he could want, too.

You could also get him a Samsung Yopy:

Yopy

Check this out

http://yopy.com/engrish/products/yp3700_overview.h tm ;)

Whoa! It comes with a Colorful LED Indicator!!! I can't wait until they make one with a 4" Touchscreen LCD !

Oh yah also - First Post!

I had a Zaurus 5500. I loved it, and the web experience was great (with your choice of Opera, that comes pre-installed, or Konqueror, which you can download and install) but mine broke, and when I sent it in to Sharp for repair they told me nothing was wrong with it and sent it back to me. I'm returning it for a refund.

I'm still trying to decide what I want to replace it. The Yopy looks great but as they don't take US credit cards, that means I'd get no additional protection on my purchase, and given that I'd be ordering it from Korea that doesn't seem to be a good thing. So, they're out, sadly.

Otherwise it looks like my choices are the Tungsten C, or some kind of ipaq with Linux installed. I don't want PocketPC.

You can argue Open Source and not lose. It can be like the argument for Democratic, Free Market, Open Societies; these are things that can not be easily contended, when debated in a forum open to Peer Review. It is difficult to overcome the fact that even Microsoft has gone Open Source with its largest clients. Microsoft Operating Systems ARE Open Source to NATO, the Chinese, British, & Russian governments; governments demand it -- there are reasons for this.

Trust & Security:
The principle of Trust Services is based on Peer Review. You cannot be Secure without Trust in your Systems. Peer Review is an incarnation of Adam Smith's Invisible Hand. Without Peer Review, what kind of Government do you have ? What kind of System do you have ?

Flexibility:
Milton Friedman's theories on "The Role of Government in Education" & how to introduce flexibility into school systems, could be employed to solidify the point that there is merit in Systems designed with Flexibility in mind. The fact that Open Source solutions run across all levels of computing, from PDA to Supercluster, should be sufficient to quell any questions regarding its Flexibility. [ref: YOPY & SGI Altix 3000]

Support:
Peer Review & Peer Support are very similar.

Cost:
IT'S FREE !!!

You may ask your foe: Why would you want to implement a System model based on central planning & subject yourself to countless regulations, restrictions & licenses ? [ref: MS EULA & how it changes] What would Hayek say about that ? Is that not "The Road to Serfdom" ?

This may also be a good time to reference Hayek's "The Use of Knowledge in Society".

Or even beter, get yourself a real Linux PDA: http://www.yopy.com/

I was looking and I noticed something that I hope isn't just a wierd thing on Dell's site. When you click to configure the handheld, the price of the higher-end model is 329. Now, $329 - $50 should equal $279, which would be the actual price, NOT $299. So, the nice model is even cheaper than stated, or so it seems.

The other question would be backlighting. I've seen lots of color PDA's, but the problem is always backlighting. The Yopy for example has a nice display, runs Linux, but without backlighting it's hard to read. With backlighting, battery usage goes way up. Dell's site says something about "backlit powerbutton", but I see nothing about a backlit screen. However, either way I wonder how long the thing can continuously run, with or without backlighting. That's another thing missing from this site. Good on price, bad on details. I'll have to wait till a bit more information is out.

Last note - it's hard to compare these to the Compaq iPAQs. Though more expensive, the iPAQs are solid pieces of machine with a good history. It's unknown yet how these perform, and whether these have all the "features" that iPAQs have. This goes back to that backlit question.

First, it's big--even PocketPC machines have gotten much smaller. Sharp sells a Zaurus in Japan that's much smaller (no keyboard, no CF), and they should bring that to the US.

Second, while they have managed to create some decent apps in it, the use of Qt/Embedded causes problems. Qt/Embedded eats up lots of memory (much more than X11+XLib+FLTK) and it makes porting software to the Zaurus a lot of work. Also, it has some annoying bugs, for example, locking up the GUI with focus problems. I thought I could live with Qt/Embedded, but I can't. Having a standard Linux command line environment on the handheld has turned out to be great, and I want the same convenience for the GUI, not some oddball hack.

The main reason for getting a Linux PDA for me is to have something that it's easy to port software to, and something I can carry with me, and the Zaurus just falls short on both accounts. I think the iPaq running Handhelds.org or a Yopy may be a better choice.

I searched with Google, so I'm smarter than you.

Infomart is in exalted company. Kaii is only the second product of its kind in the world. The first one happens to be the Zaurus PDA from Sharp of Japan, which has recently become commercially available.

Only the second linux pda? what about the Yopy? And though it now seems to be defunct, the Agenda pda that was around awhile back?

The Yopy was Dropped by Samsung, but was re-designed by g.mate the comapny that was in cortrol of the unit all along. It's got just about the same specs as most of the pda's coming out now, but with and odd keyboard layout. check out or Personally I'll be getting the Zaurus shortly, and from what I've seen this is the Linux PDA to get.

I asked the same thing of the Yopy and and Agenda people, with exactly the same response... none.

Their loss, not mine.

It's not that these tools don't exist, it's that the vendors don't see the target market clearly enough to want to use them.

I still think that the Yopy will be better.
So, it's probably a good time to wait and see .. before a good jump :)

I want this instead:

Yopy

So if you are listening Santa...

This way, the YOPY could operate as a flippable PDA, or a PALM-like screen in front (no keyboard) type PDA.

Can't wait till one of their designers comes up with a sturdy enough design to make this feasible!

yopy.com

gmate.com

And the announced that it's shipping end of November on the 'gmate' site.

• Symbol Technologies licenses the Palm and creates several units which can do RF, 802.11, and include a barcode scanner (high-output LED)
• Handspring invents the Springboard slot and implements pseudo-USB support for connecting the devices.
• Sony mimics that with the MemoryStick, but adds VFS support, and takes Handspring's USB protocol, changes one function, and makes their own spin on it.
• Handera, formerly TRG builds upon that with a sliding graffiti area (thanks for incorporating my idea from #palmchat back in 1998 on that one), and adds CF and SD slot architectures (still serially connected storage though, can't "run apps" from each card concurrently)
• Palm comes out with the replacement to the Vx, called the m505, and includes the Sony VFS extensions, the Handspring hardware port design (internally) and the Handspring USB modifications, but changes it enough to make yet a third fork of this pseudo-USB protocol. They also make sure to make every single thing about this new device completely incompatible with every single other thing available for their devices, even down to a 2mm change in the stylus length (I have a more detailed enumeration of those changes found here).

Why does Palm think they're about to, in any way, create a new hardware device that they think will surpass these existing innovative devices? Palm is ALWAYS behind the curve on hardware advances in this area. We're not even talking about comparing them to the iPAQ, VTech Helio, Agenda, Yopy, and the other dozens of non-PalmOS, non-WinCE handheld PDA devices.

Currently, Palm's OEMs for the PalmOS® software include:

• Sony
• Handspring
• Handera (formerly TRG)
• Qualcomm (bought out by Kyocera)
• Kyocera
• Symbol Technologies
• ...and others.

They get licensing from each and every one of these OEMs. Their hardware is the last thing to ever be updated. It is without a doubt, the least innovative portion of their business.. and they're choosing to keep it?!

I don't quite understand the motive behind this decision on their part. I suppose I'll find out at Palmsource in February.

I'm a poor student

Dears, have you got your answer so far? Don't just ask the question, how about contribute to the society by giving us a detail comparison on the following Linux PDAs for us?

4P DAT500 rugged handheld
Agenda VR3
HNT Exilien 00101/00201 Handheld PC and HNT Exilien 00102 Multimedia PDA
MiTAC CAT
Yopy
SK Telecom IMT2000 WebPhone
VTech Helio

My boss told me to do so but I am just a poor employee and can't afford to make a mistake here. Thanks.
&nbsp_
/. / &nbsp&nbsp |\/| |\/| |\/| / Run, Bill!

The samsung Yopy runs Linux. check out /. and /.
----- --- - - -

Well, for the PDA market this might work out very well. I'm actually quite excited about the new interest companies are showing for Linux based PDAs. (Compaq, Samsung, Sharp to name a few).

Palm made it easy to develop software for its OS and the number of available Palm applications made it a success. Linux enthusiasts will likely replicate (and maybe even exceed) this number for a Linux PDA.

The interesting thing about this perspective is that Linux won't come over the server onto John Smith's desktop, but maybe over PDAs. It will be the first time that 'normal' people (the majority of computer users) will see Linux doing the job.

But then again, they won't really care. :)

Check www.yopy.com for the latest.
The kind folks at Gmate/Samsung will sell you a dev kit for a trifling $790. Granted, the unit has some nice specs, but that's a hell of a price for a beta model PDA and some free software on a CD. Compared to that, $180 for an Agenda looks pretty cheap.

Can one even buy a Yopy in the US today. I've been waiting since who knows when and it would be a lot easier to go buy a palm at this rate (already bought two since February). The old Fan page Yopy fan page is gone and now the useless official page gives next to no info. Any info from anyone out there ?

You're probably referring to running Linux on WinCE machines (pbsdboot). I'm not talking about that; I'm talking about PDAs that run Linux as shipped. E.g. the Yopy.

Commerical Applications - www.netbsd.org/gallery/software.html Also note that NetBSD can run Linux binaries due to the compatibility layer, so the BSD's have access to not only Linux binaries, but SCO, Solaris, and even Windows binaries (via WINE)

Yes, I know that... I was talking about native NetBSD commercial applications. There are many more commercial Linux apps.

So, as far as facts go, thanks for playing. When you take off the pro-linux rose colored glasses you will see that what you said is not backed up by facts.

Actually, they are backed up by facts. Linux PDA exists? Yes. NetBSD PDA exists? No. More commercial Linux software than commercial NetBSD software? Yes. And what pro-Linux rose-colored glasses? I don't like Linux, and I don't use it. I'm a NetBSD user and occasional developer (see the copyright line of this file? That's me.)

As for mine being a 'cheap ripoff', mine was a tasteless parody of a tasteless post. Scatalogical humor of someone using scatological humor. Humor via goring the sacred cow that is /.

Not much of a parody... not particularly tasteless either. well-done parodies involve some creativity. Running the original through sed to change a few names around does not make a good parody.

So rather than wasting time slamming other opensource projects, wouldn't the rising tide for OpenSource work better when ALL boats get floated?

When did I slam any open source projects? NetBSD is the best OS for me, but I know it's not perfect. I know its shortcomings. Even NetBSD's core developers recognize that NetBSD is just not gonna have a lot of apps compared to Linux and FreeBSD, and that NetBSD should make it's emulation good enough to run Linux and FreeBSD apps (and the emulation's not perfect yet; for example, I can't run the Linux version of the Pervasive.SQL 2000 database server).