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iWarez
asv108 writes "It seems that people are finding new uses for their iPod. According to this story in Wired, a Dallas area CompUsa employee caught a teenager transferring a fresh copy of Office for OSX to his iPod from a store demo machine."
And I thought CompUSA employees were good for nothing.
it was improper labeling. the sticker said "don't steal MUSIC"...
I used to do this in the late 80s - the BBC Micro had a system where you could buy add-on ROMs. I didn't have the money to buy them, so I wrote a program to copy them onto a 5.25 inch floppy. Then I'd go into stores and copy what they had.
Glad to see some things haven't changed...
This is news? =] It was bound to happen eventually. Give a person a way to get something out of a store and they'll do their best to do it.
I would think that connecting to Limewire or Hotline would be a heck of a lot easier than trying to get all of the files for OS X off of a computer, though. Sort of like stealing a stick of gum from one store instead of stealing the ingredients for gum from another store.
-Sara
You're telling me that a CompUSA employee caught the kid and knew what the kid was doing? Did the employee still try to sell the kid the extended warrantee?
under the DMCA for creating a circumvention device!
Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
The person featured in the story witnessing the theft a computer consultant in the Dallas area at a local CompUSA? I don't think he was an employee of CompUSA, else he would have stopped the little bugger.
Isn't that wonderful though? Can afford a $399 iPod but can't afford Office vX? Heck, maybe the iPod was stolen too?
GPL Deconstructed
There are plenty of pocket sized firewire and USB drives on the market that could be used to do the same thing. The iPod differs only in that it's got a really cool interface and can double as a nice MP3 player.
Lee
A satisified iPod owner.
Yes. They shouldn't have used compusa as the password on the demo machine.
"What is the sound of one belly slapping?"
You could have fun putting files onto computers at the stores... nice goats.cx background or something... hell maybe someone will come up with a way to install linux from the ipod!
--
Some weasel took the cork out of my lunch.
So instead of the traditional "Five Finger Discount" now it's the "Five Second Discount" ... interesting.
From teh article: Webb watched the teenager copy a couple of other applications. He left the kid to find a CompUSA employee. "I went over and told a CompUSA guy, but he looked at me like I was clueless," Webb said.
Isn't that a misprint? Should it not read: I look at him as though HE were clueless?
Sounds about right... CompUSA loser is thinking, "Yeah man, sure... the kids stealing apps off out machines with his Walkman. WHATever... don't forget your tinfoil hat on that way out!"
Just another moron who doesn't know his products or their capabilities.
(It's not just PC workers, even today's car salesmen don't know their product. I went shopping with a friend who wanted to buy a car in the same model that I own. My friend is an informed consumer; he and I had to correct the sales guy on model names, equipment on each, engine size and wheel size on three different cars.)
SlashSigTheorem: Humorous, Political, Critical, Constructive- If you have a
Someone hire him in bizdev!
"Old man yells at systemd"
You can copy many things to and from it.. It's really much cheaper to do so.
The REAL jabber has the user id: 13196
What you do today will cost you a day of your life
d'oh! Shouldve read the article first....
Ironically, Microsoft has pioneered an easy-to-use installation scheme on the Mac that makes its Mac software relatively easy to pilfer.
The One Rule Of Chess You'll Ever Need: Don't play someone who carries a kit in their bookbag.
Don't worry...there are no life forms aboard...
Rhymes that keep their secrets will unfold behind the clouds.There upon the rainbow is the answer to a neverending story
"I thought there's no point in getting any more involved in this imbroglio," Webb said. "Besides, this is Texas. You never know what he might have been carrying."
What a maroon. Way to stereotype both Texans and gunowners. Sure, like some kid is going to shoot you for ratting him out. Grow up, turn off the TV once in a while, maybe even read a book, and shut the hell up.
Thanks,
--
Matt
Actually, no, you don't need the CD.
I've done clean MacOS installs (which replace the system folder with a fresh one) and then, the next time Office ran, it executed the "first run" routine which placed the proper files back in the System folder -- essentially replicating the process of dragging an Office installation from one machine to another without the installer app. In fact, one of the install methods that the Office CD offers (at least, my Mac Office 2001 Educational Edition, since I work in a university) is to just copy a folder from CD to hard disk.
So yes, it will work when copied from the iPod to another Mac, at least if it's Office 2001 -- I don't know for sure if Office 10 does this as well, though we also have the educational edition of that. (I've never tried.)
i am a soviet space shuttle
Can't you take ANY external pocket hard drive or even a keychain USB drive and do similar things? WTF does this have to do with the iPod?
And you could take a camera into a museum or a movie camera into a theatre. But actually you can't because you'll get caught. So computer store employees should just make sure kids don't plug hard drives into computers.
Of course if software could be freely redistributed this wouldn't be a problem, but that's another long-running and tiresome story, isn't it...
There's no story here. NEXT!!!
Yeah but I'd MUCH rather make the transfer on firewire than on USB :) I remember the nearly 2 days it took to transfer 15gig of data to my nomad on USB.
"You can now flame me, I am full of love,"
Unsure whether the kid was a thief or an out-of-uniform employee, Webb watched as he left the store. "I thought there's no point in getting any more involved in this imbroglio," Webb said. "Besides, this is Texas. You never know what he might have been carrying."
One entry found for imbroglio.
Main Entry: imbroglio Pronunciation: im-'brOl-(")yO Function: noun Inflected Form(s): plural -glios Etymology: Italian, from imbrogliare to entangle, from Middle French embrouiller -- more at EMBROIL Date: 1750 1 : a confused mass 2 a : an intricate or complicated situation (as in a drama or novel) b : an acutely painful or embarrassing misunderstanding c : a violently confused or bitterly complicated altercation : EMBROILMEN
Found it here.
Can't say I'm stunned. Most employees are either like this or the Dilbert electronic salesman that pays to work at the store. Or better...
Comic Book Guy: I'm interested in upgrading my 28.8 kilobaud Internet connection to a 1.5 megabit fibre-optic T-1 line. Will you be able to provide an IP router that's compatable with my token ring ethernet LAN configuration?
Homer: (pause) Can I have some money now?
Does that mean that iPod and computer stores should be illegal as they both allow to steal software?
Opus: the Swiss army knife of audio codec
But [Mac columnist Dave] Horrigan didn't think the iPod presents a serious piracy threat to Microsoft, and doubted the company would take special measures to prevent in-store copying.
"If Microsoft puts in protection it almost always screws up and causes problems for them or their legit users," he said.
Since when has that ever stopped them?
Dennis Lloyd, publisher of iPod fan site iPodlounge, also said this is the first time he'd heard of an iPod put to such use.
"I can see how easy it would be to do," he said. "It's a shame someone has stooped this low to bring bad press to the insanely great iPod."
How is this bringing bad press to the iPod? It can be used to copy things. That's what it's designed to do. This is like saying that someone intentionally driving their car into a busy cross walk is bad press for the car. And even if we accept the premise that it's bad press for the iPod, I really don't think that's why the kid did it.
Nope, no sig
Part of being an Apple zealot is going into stores and fixing the Macs up. I don't get why Apple can run such terrific retail stores themselves, but doesn't try to persuade CompUSA and Sears employees that, no, iMacs shouldn't have smoke coming out of them.
What I'm listening to now on Pandora...
...because he sure has some huge balls to just walk up to a demo computer and try that!!
It's interesting to note that the article mentions Disk On Key. A few weeks ago, my friend's place of business had a meeting, and basically the whole premise was that any visitors to the company had to have their keychains checked for such devices, as they were worried about people coming in to visit, and leaving with a copy of a database. I wouldn't be surprised if other companies start adopting a policy of searching for those types of devices either.
Insanely great? Goddamn. They're all Stevebots.
I can see the headlines now
SOME CONSUMERS ARE USING APPLE'S PORTABLE FIREWIRE HARD DRIVE AS A PORTABLE FIREWIRE HARD DRIVE
EXPERTS SHOCKED
Admit it.. you're just annoyed you didn't think of doing this first
Maybe computer stores should just hire people who know how to tell when people are copying huge quantities of files onto portable hard drives?
Were there problems in the 80s with people copying programs off of computer display models onto floppy disks? What about with zip disks in the mid90s? What did stores do about that sort of thing then? Why is this so urgent now?
*gasp*
What kind of applications are you two lovebirds using in the bedroom?!
;-)
Webb watched the teenager copy a couple of other applications. He left the kid to find a CompUSA employee. "I went over and told a CompUSA guy, but he looked at me like I was clueless," Webb said.
Unsure whether the kid was a thief or an out-of-uniform employee, Webb watched as he left the store. "I thought there's no point in getting any more involved in this imbroglio," Webb said. "Besides, this is Texas. You never know what he might have been carrying."
CompUSA representatives didn't respond to requests for comment. Neither did Apple officials.
So basically the CompUSA people had no clue what was going on. Typical.
Also note that nobody was caught as the poster claimed. The event was merely witnessed, nobody was caught.
Lasers Controlled Games!
Okay, using your anti-criteria for news... Winchester touts their rifles' abilities to fire ammunition extremely accurately with immense force as one of their selling points. So when a person uses one to kill a president or a few dozen schoolchildren, is it newsworthy?
/.
Someone has discovered a new, ironic, and devious way to use an iPod for piracy. It's funny. And nerdy. And newsworthy. Especially on
Wait, a front page story on slashdot is a front page story on Wired that's entirely hearsay. A computer consultant says he saw a crime, CompUSA didn't believe him, and that's news?
When I was a kid, a friend and I used to go to a computerstore, he'd keep the shopkeeper busy while I was making copies of the games that ran on the demo-machines on disks.
Taking with you a empty cd to a shop can do the same, with the cdwriters getting faster and faster,you dont have to wait for a long time, isn't there somesort of cd-writing app standardly installed on XP or MacOS?
Even if they catch you, I don't think they're allowed to see the contents of your iPod, cdrom or other data-bearer, at least not in my country.
Here's a suggestion: Physically block the fucking I/O ports on display models. Put a locked metal bar across them or something. Cheap, quick, and effective.
-- kwashiorkor --
Leaps in Logic
should not be confused with
Jumping to Conclusions.
I've never used it, but supposedly it works well.
Gentoo Linux http://gentoo.org/
We'll just send the BSA after this kid, and we can all rest easy, knowing the world is a better place.
"Copy an entire CD worth of music in 10 seconds or a $459 office suite in under 3"
Anybody notice the cool 'aqua' look Slashdot logo and banner on this thread?
A) Cool Guys!
B) How you don't get Look'n'FeelSued!
"Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus."
kinda like the Kinko's that have Zip drives. Nothing like getting a bunch of Adobe fonts in my graphic artist days!
DO NOT DISTURB THE SE
Soccer Moms will drive 6000 lb SUVs to school meetings and town halls everywhere to urge that iPods be banned, "For the Children (tm)"
A National iPod database will be created to monitor the posessions of iPods. Yadda, yadda yadda.
While this was just a kid trying to steal some software, it's clearly a symptom of a MUCH bigger problem. Now is the time to act on this sort of potential, before the full scope of ramifications become clear.
1) We must legislate mandatory copy-protection into all commercial software. Perhaps all software, in fact.
2) All storage devices most especially portable ones, must have a double license verification check on all copy operations. If you copy a file from one device (a computer) to another (an iPod), _both_ devices must independently verify the vailidity of copying/running that software on both machines, through a central license authority.
3) Legislation must be introduced to require all new file formats to incorporate licensing checks. "Free" files (however you want to interpret free) must be so marked within the file.
4) All new applications will be required to write only in approved licenseable formats. Within five years after the introduction of these formats, new pplications should no longer read old pre-license formats.
5) Hardware must be legally required to support this licensing and copy-protection scheme. All non-compliant hardware will have to be turned into the appropriate depots for disposal, after a similar 'sunset' period (five years again, perhaps).
Only in this way can we foster software innovation, encourage development, and drive technology forward. Guaranteeing security for developers in this was is a necessity, and the only way we can prevent computer piracy.
Arresting criminals doesn't work--if it did, we wouldn't have crime anymore! What we have to do is eliminate any possibility of crimes being committed in the first place, at any cost.
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
Depending on the CompUSA you go to, you can get some free entertainment. In the one in Roseville, Minnesota, there's this older guy behind the "good stuff" counter(all the smaller merchandise that can be shoplifted, etc) this guy will berate any computer-clueless customer that dares to ask him a question day in, day out. Sometimes I just stood near him pretending to look at the PDAs and listen to this guy drill into ma and Pa kettle explaining the difference between USB and FireWire. This guy IS the comic book guy of computers.
"...copy this folder to your hard drive"
.dmg of the Office X CD from Hotline or Carracho, and registration keys are easy to find for almost anything online.
That's what it says on the Office X CD. You copy that folder, and when you launch an Office app for the first time it checks to see if that other stuff isn't there. If it's not, it copies it there to complete the install.
From the article: When installing Office, users simply drag and drop the Office folder to their hard drive. Everything is included, including a self-repair mechanism that replaces critical files in the system folder.
Chances are, just copying the Office folder worked like a charm. If not, it's not like he can't grab a
~Philly
Most Mac Applications do not need to be installed. They are just copied to the hard drive. Office X includes a utility to repair (well replace) files that are suppose to go to into the system folder. That's what makes a Mac so nice to use. If you need to install a program, you copy it to the hard drive. If you need to install Extensions or Control Panels, just copy them to the System Folder, MacOS will figure it out.
Also the article says he did pull it off. He was not caught. This act was only witnessed. The slashdot summary is very incorrect.
How's this for a scenerio. Rip a dvd. Copy it to your iPod, trot over to CUSA, UPLOAD the file to their G4, tell your friends which computer it's on, share away. This could be done with anything of course, not just a DVD. While CUSA is busy password protecting M$ Offal, "enterprising" youths are taking advantage of plenty of storage to create some easy and quick offline storage. Why wait hours for the big stuff to download even over a cable modem. Just drag and drop whatever files you want. It'd be easy enough to hide the files/directories on the Macs, and since their demo machines, they're likely to have tons of space free. Bit more dangerious of course, but oh so convenient.
It makes me sad to see stores limiting this kid's ability to innovate.
JET Program: see Japan, meet intere
The clueless salesman reminds me of the joke:
Q: What's the difference between a used car salesman and a computer salesman?
A: The used car salesman knows when he's lying.
Ah, but it's nice and easy with Mac apps because they don't generally sprinkle files all over the disk. You just drag'n'drop a single icon. It'll take longer for Microsoft to fix that than for USB2 to become common :-)
Quentin
About 10 years ago I used to hang out in the mac lab at a local university while my Mom went to classes. I used to have a 2GB external HD the pluged in to the wall and used a huge scsi cable to hook up to the back of the Mac. I had copies of everything and they (computer lab guys) watched me do it, and said nothing. Times have changed (a little)and I became an adult. Yes you can get in a significant amount of trouble *if your caught*. It is very easy to steal anything regardless of how you physically do it, thats why we laws that say if your *caught* you will be punished. If you are over 18 and you pulled this stunt, *I* would have no problem reporting you as a shoplifter. this kid is the reason/excuse we have for crappy laws like the DMCA. IMHO if your moral standards are such that you *know* your stealing from someone and say its ok because they didn't lock it up good enough, then your sliding down a very slippery slope. (but I'll still visit you in jail when you get caught)
"Get them before they get....
Less than 5 hours!
Wow, I'm impressed.
I'll buy an iPod as soon as they add PDA or cell-phone (or both!) functionality. Firewire has its uses.
I was going to say that it looks real ugly. But I guess some people have different (bad) tastes.
CompUSA eh? I'm surprised they even knew it WAS a Macintosh. Honestly, I've gone into that store to look for accessories for my mac and had them try and sell me a Compaq. Hello? Dumbass? I *HAVE* a mac, and I'm trying to purchase accesories for it. I don't want to buy a third rate PC with an updated "model number."
Incidentally, I'd like to point out that the ease with which you can pirate software from a Macintosh raises an interesting point with Apple's vision. You install OfficeX by copying it where you want it...similar to the way you installed software on PCs before the invention of the "install wizard." Somebody realised that a single motion (drag program to applications) was easier than clicking through a dozen confusing menus. Somebody realized the time to ask for a serial number was when you tried to run a program, not while the install CD was in the drive.
Oh, and I'd like to mention in this anonymous forum that I steal bandwidth from the Apple store all the time. That lovely open (well, i consider 128bit WEP pretty open) Airport network is perfect for chilling in the mall with my palmtop, comparing online prices to b&m.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
"Webb watched the teenager copy a couple of other applications. He left the kid to find a CompUSA employee. 'I went over and told a CompUSA guy, but he looked at me like I was clueless,' Webb said."
If this isn't a wake-up call to stores like CompUSA, I don't know what is. If you treat and pay your employees like Wal-Mart employees, you're going to get people with the computer knowledge of Wal-Mart employees. Hand-holding employees through training isn't the answer because all that will give you is employees that require somebody else to do all their thinking for them while making them believe that they already know everything.
The reason the employees in stores like these don't have half a brain is because those that DO have half a brain can make far more money doing something else. Hell, people who answer tech support calls typically make more money than retail employees.
This is nothing more than CompUSA getting what it pays for.
You can't even breathe in that place without getting sold a warranty or some sort of extended plan. The reason for this is that margins are so slim on large purchases (like computers and DVD players) that retailers either break even or *lose* money on them. Cables and accessories are marked up to try to make up the loss.
I do hate that. I have argued with a CompUSA employee who insisted my mother *had* to have a $30 printer cable or her printer "would print on different pages and stuff". I wonder how long CompUSA and Best Buy can last?
Apple has a program where they put Apple employees in the Apple "store within a store" at CompUSA stores. Clearly the author of the story went to a generic CompUSA employee, and not the Apple employee. The stores in Dallas keep their Apple stuff up-to-date as a result. I'm not sure what the scope of this program is, but where it's in place, it rocks!
My other sig is extremely clever...
I bet that CompUSA would prosecute here as well.
Could CompUSA prosecute? Microsoft owns the copyright on the software, not CompUSA... And since the total value is less than $1000, in order to prosecute criminally you have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that there was willful intent for purposes of commercial advantage or private financial gain.
Of course, it's possible that CompUSA could press charges alledging computer trespass, or something like that.
Not in English. A criterium is a bicycle race.
Just a small note, the OS for the iPod is a cellphone OS that has PDA capabilities built in. Apple actually stripped those out to make the iPod so it's a product that's just waiting to be made, just add industrial design...
The article talks about how the iPod can stay in your pocket as you steal the software, but you still have to plug the cable in.
When high speed wireless protocols become standard (Bluetooth is probably still too slow), this kind of stealing can be done without ever revealing that you have any device at all. It'll just show up in the Wireless Neighborhood when you walk up to the machine, you drag-copy the files, and walk away.
What do you mean they cut the power? How can they cut the power, man? They're animals!
Ok, so I am a little paranoid, but by offering it in such a way that it is easily copied (and thus easily propagated), that would help to reinforce it as the standard for office software. This would help drive out competitors on a system that has historically been unfriendly to microsoft. Then, when all good threats to it are gone, they put in a version w/ strict control.
"Blake is an idealist, Jenna. He cannot afford to think." - Kerr Avon, Star One, Blakes 7
Each ROM was about 32K, and each floppy did hold about 160-320K. You do the math.
Slashdot using an Aqua-ish theme poses no threat to Apple in any way; why would Apple sue Slashdot?
Aqua and the Aqua look and feel elements are trademarks of Apple Computer Inc. In order to protect its trademark rights under the Lanham Act, Apple must either sue or license others who use the mark. (This is not true of copyrights or patents.) Licensing and suing are the only options; ignoring enough infringers could convince the courts that you intend to grant an implied license to all comers.
Will I retire or break 10K?
That's almost correct. Some people are storing serial numbers in the preferences file though which can be stored elsewhere, often under Library/Preferences either off the root or off the user account.
Another neat feature of Mac OS X's bundling is that if you follow the Apple guidelines and put all your strings in a separate plist file, it should be pretty easy for an end user to actually take your application and add a language without you having to do anything.
I have a website. It's about Macs.
Umm... I hope you complained to his manager about his unacceptable behavior.
I'm so tired of rude, inconsiderate, and downright stupid sales clerks!
I'm starting to make a habit of filing complaints on these morons - because in the current economy, there's really no excuse for keeping some of these people employed. Much better individuals are out there, trying to find a job.
Just a few weeks ago, my wife got one of the people fired who worked at a Long John Silver's fast food place not far from here. They completely screwed up our order after we waited nearly 20 minutes for it (and while they served some friends of theirs first, even though they arrived after us) - and then copped an attitude when we just asked for a refund.
Is that a violation of DMCA for Slashdot to provide information on how to circumvent copyright protection devices? (I'm half joking)
_______
2B1ASK1
Webb said. "Besides, this is Texas. You never know what he might have been carrying."
now that is reasurring... a Mac user packing heat.
Now if every computer user carried a weapon, you think the RIAA and MPAA would be fucking with us?
:)
this isn't an iPod thing. users used to do this by putting a floppy into the machine to rip their warez, then it was ZIP disks, next its the iPod (just so handy...
Anyone know if there is a way to quickly reset the ipod? If you get caught borrowing software, it would be nice to be able to quickly and easily delete all the evidence.
In my own case last week I was visiting my parents, Dad wanted me to burn a bunch of pictures to a CD for him to send out to relatives. Now, he's got an iMac without a burner and I live 6 hours away in another country. I could have sent them online (we've both broadband) but with the rate caps it would have taken many hours to send the 300-some MB of files and the AppleTalk IP I've got running on my wintel boxes is a bit unreliable for big long slow stuff like that.
The solution? We both have Canon PowerShot cameras (S100 & S110), both with their shipped small CompactFlash cards and both with 3rd party 128MB CF's we've each added. Grabbing his CF's and clearing mine out I was able to load everything onto the CF's though the cameras, bring them home and burn to CDs.
Worked fine, the CDs have been sent out and his CFs are in the mail on the way back to him loaded with some mp3s of radio shows I know he and Mom will enjoy listening to. Now I'm looking at investing in one of those small USB "hard drive" devices for storing my emergency software/system tools on. Easier to carry then a CD, hand it off of the keychain and pull it out whenever I've a need for a PGP key, repair utility or favorite bit of software.
I don't read ACs: If a post isn't worth so much as a nom de plume to its author then I wont bother either.
This thing can be used to snarf up to half of a DVD's capacity. That translates into at least 4-6 full-sized applications- and it does it fast. 200Mb in about a minute. USB based HDs are slower and tend to not hold as much. Keychain USB drives don't hold much more than 512Mb and usually are something on the order of 64-128Mb and are SLOW.
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
OK, let's take seriously the idea that Windows uninstallers usually work as advertised. If you want to kill the preferences file, you check in, ooh! two places /Library/Preferences or ~/Library/Preferences
According to the rules, those are the only things that should be outsid the application bundle except for saved files which would be normally saved in ~/Documents.
An application bundle is a folder that looks like a signle file application but is in reality a folder. Nobody puts their files inside an app bundle. That would be as asinine as trying to save everything on the root level of your hard drive in windows.
Nobody seems to be asking how a $400+ Office app appeared on the Apple demo machine?
Get a clue boys and girls, CompUSA stole it first and that's why nobody wanted to do anything about it.
"It's a shame someone has stooped this low to bring bad press to the insanely great iPod."
Isn't this the kind of convienence that computer people have wanted for years? I think it's fantastic. Bragging rights go to Apple. Now I can easily go around to my 250 desktops and load, or re-load, office in minutes.
Bravo Apple!
Sigh.
This would be a lot more funny if Jack Valenti wasn't selling the Senate Commerce Committee precisely this line of reasoning right now.
- jon
Ganymede, a GPL'ed metadirectory for UNIX
...when people decide it's time to move on from Windows. Do you know how many people switch to Linux when XP came out, just because of the XP Home Edition license stink?
Zodiac Survey
Yeah, he really deprived them of income by "stealing" those 1s and 0s.
In the eyes of law, the intent of that young man was to steal property (office XP) of the owner (CompUSA). And By leaving the store with property he had not paid for (shoplifting and grand theft). I am not even getting into the DMCA, this is common law. If you walk out of a retail establishment with services/property/etc without paying, you are a thief. period.
Now, what would be interesting is if the young man had asked permission to copy OfficeXP on to his iPOD (which you could probably sweet talk a CompUSA employee into letting you do) and then CompUSA would be up shit creek with MS for breaking the A)Liceneces and Retail Distribution agreements and B) the DMCA.
"Get them before they get....
That's what the RIAA and MPAA needs Judge Death! All crime is committed by the living, therefore life itself has been declared illegal. Maybe Jack Vallenti can be the first to receive judgement.
development.lombardi.com
I needed to buy a replacement Lexmark printer, because they're cheap and I do a lot of printing in b/w format, and did some shopping at Best Buy and CompUSA for price comparisons.
At one Best Buy, they had a Z52 as a store display, as Z53s had just come out. There were no more Z52s left, and they had yet to receive the Z53s for their stock.
Asking a manager, I got the price reduced to almost half the retail, and still got their crappy service plan thrown in for a year. When they opened it up to check for any products inside in case I was trying to smuggle them out, the cashier removed the ink cartridges and ran them across their demagnetizer.
Why? Because they put anti-theft tags on the cartridges. People actually walk into stores and try to swipe open inkjet cartridges which have been used quite a bit as demonstration products, and are already open.
So they're aware that people try to steal innards, but as to how far they can go, who knows? RAM may not be protectable in these methods, but other items could be.
Human nature is the same everywhere; the modes only are different. -- Earl of Chesterfield
Yeah okay so those have the Vise installer, big deal. If you just copy the executable from one machine to another, they'll work just fine. In the case of Office, you just copy the folder that says "Copy this folder to the hard drive" from the CD. If you want the office shortcut bar and stuff, you might have to run an installer that'll put the necessary files in the System Folder. Another example is IE 5.0. Again, you just copy the folder to your hard drive and its "installed."
This is the first I've heard of this use - obviously illegal. But think of the possibilities for data transmission for these things. They're 5G floppies that play music. If all computer usage was as easy as the article makes it out to be, the world would be a better place.
Last post!
I mean to be forced to get his warez at CompUsa instead of getting a copy from a friend... He probably has no internet connection either since he could have easily downloaded office if he had. This is a very sad story.
True warriors use the Klingon Google
Here's a suggestion: Physically block the fucking I/O ports on display models. Put a locked metal bar across them or something. Cheap, quick, and effective.
It's already done. I saw the I/O ports on some computers at Fry's Electronic blocked with chewing gum. Obviously, Fry's is more clued than CompUSA.
As for stealing the software, I know Wal-Mart used to disable to floppy drives to keep people from copying (and installing) software. Makes you wonder though, with a lot of these places having PC with a high speed net connection, if people aren't dumping stuff to an ftp site. Who needs and iPod?
"Da ist ein Technölüst in mein Unterpanten!"
Not just keychains.
I recently bought an IBM microdrive for a digital camera. The microdrive came with a pcmcia adapter. It lets you plug it into an laptop pcmcia port, and the drive instantly pops up as a 1gig disk. Copy to and from it just like any normal drive, at the speed of the pcmcia slot. (about 5MB/sec? Equivalent to firewire speeds.)
The microdrive and pcmcia adapter will easily fit in my wallet. Or loose in a back pocket. In my daytimer. For smokers, in a pack of cigarettes.
There are lots of ways to do removable large-capacity small-form-factor storage that companies don't look for.
This gets to a matter of access control, not searches. You don't necessarily search every visitor. You have visitors be accompanied by a company representative, if possible.
If that's not possible... The easier way to handle this is to have employees screenlock terminals any time they aren't in active use. No, this doesn't help for a store display demo machine, but it can work in office environments.
This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is... Oops. Frank, I've got your sig again! Where's mine?
...Block access to all I/O ports on a computer.
Honestly, this is as stupid as the Pentagon adding 802.11b wireless to its computers and network. Just don't allow people to have any kind of access to copying the data from the computer, and the easiest way to do that is to lock down the USB / Firewire ports on the computer. It doesn't stop anyone from being able to "preview" the computer, but the company doesn't have to worry about kids "breaking in and taking."
Same thing would go with the CD-RW or whatnot. I'm sure the clueless employee would have a better idea of what was going on if the kid came along and plopped a CD-R into the Apple's burner and then burned the software...maybe. Why not just have plastic see-through cases for each of the computers people have on display.
Do you know how many people switch to Linux when XP came out, just because of the XP Home Edition license stink?
Dozens? Perhaps hundreds?
Compared to the number of computers that have already shipped with XP pre-installed, I doubt anyone in Redmond is sweating it.
I admit I did something similar a few months back...
:P
One of the CompUSAs in NYC was actually on the ball enough to set up a half-assed "Mac Internet Cafe" in their store, with lots of Macs to play with, some of which even had net access through Airport.
It's not common knowledge, but all new Macs these days come with a collection (legal) MP3 files, for showing off iTunes and such. All the networked cafe Macs had had these deleted, except one of the iBooks.
So of course I waited until I could grab it, logged into my iDisk, and started uploading. I could only get a few since the iDisk is limited to 20MB and was going pretty slowly, but when I got home they were waiting for me, on Apple's own servers too
iPod- pah! Back in my day, when we wanted to steal software from the Apple Store, we didn't buy a $400 piece of equipment to steal a $500 piece of software. We went in with CD-RWs and burned $3000 worth of software over a period of about an hour and a half. If you want to test your bravery and/or your espionage skills, go in and try that!
By the way, when an employee asks why you just put a CD in the drive, tell him that you're installing Office. They like that...
Lack of eloquence does not denote lack of intelligence, though they often coincide.
How about this? Since OS X runs on top of a unix file system, just create a few choice device files in the directories, like ones that have the same major/minor numbers as /dev/random so that firewire device fills up real fast, or make a few fifo files so the copy program hangs soon as it hits it (since there is no process pumping info on the other side of the pipe).
So infest the demo PCs with viruses, if the downloaders haven't done it to themselves already.
Do something to make sure the store pc doesn't crash.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
If you are talking about xplay, then no it does not work well. The biggest problem is that MS in their infinite wisdom decided that external hdd's would get wright back cache enabled regardless of the registry setting. This is bad because when transfering files to the iPod it is very frequently seen that the user gets a buffer underflow message in regards to the writet back cache. When this happens the hdd in the iPod is left in an inconsistant state and needs to be reformated from an OSX mac. It wouldn't have been a huge problem once the bug was discovered, but MS ignores the registry setting to disable the cache for external hdd's!!!
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
Newbies. We were *grateful* to be able to run stacks of cards through the reader, after wlaking 47 miles through the snow, each way.
That was a *huge* improvement over popping the lid to look at core planes, then memorizing the pattern, which we'd go home and enter on rocker switches (except for the rich kids; they're families had toggle switches!)
hawk
Right before I started to work at Best Buy (a long time ago, when I was still young and naive) one of the other employees had been caught.
It appears that he was taking the cases of laser printer paper, unloading the reams onto the shelves for sale, and then packing the empty cases with high-end merchandise, sound cards, hard drives, etc., and putting the plastic bands around the case to 'seal' it back up.
He would then stash the box at the back of the shelf of printer paper, and the next day walk into the store, put the case of 'paper' in his cart, pay the $25 for a case of 'paper' and walk out with hundreds of dollars of equipment.
At the time, Packard Bell was having a deal - buy a PC, get a free Creative Labs Sound Blaster sound card. There was a case of 100+ OEM packaged sound cards (no boxes, just card and disks) that all grew legs and walked out of the store that way...
A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing -- Emo Phillips
Well, I like bouncing icons, but I raided that site for most of the other utilities it had. Transparent windows and real windowshading - aaahhh! And no shadows to bog my RagePro Lombard - aaahhh!
Thanks for the link!
i am a soviet space shuttle
Not so funny, considering that the President of the Grammies, Michael Greene, actually called .mp3 swapping a life-or-death matter at last night's Grammy Award presentation. Seriously.
There are two kinds of people: 1) those who start arrays with one and 1) those who start them with zero.
Definition of warez heaven: Imagine the iPOD with broad band wireless. Then walk into a CompUSA store... *sigh*
Wow, things change, and things stay the same.
:-)
I suppose I can admit this publicly, since the statute of limitations has run out now...
Way back in something like 1983, I worked for a computer store that sold PC compatibles (a "Corona" if anyone remembers those!), and we had gotten some ethernet cards to try out some simple networking. Only problem was that all our machines ran MS-DOS 1.25, and the networking drivers required the new device structure in version 2.0. We ordered the new system, but I didn't want to wait the 2-3 weeks to receive it before playing with the new equipment, so I made a trip to the local IBM store (yes kids, IBM set up entire stores for selling the IBM PC) with a disk. I told the guys in the store that I had an IBM PC, and was having problem with this disk -- could I try it out on their computer? Hmmmm... sure seems to read fine here -- wonder it it will re-format? Wow, that worked too. Can I write to it (...copies some file...). Well, I guess this disk is ok, and I need to figure out what's wrong with my system. Thanks guys, I'll get back to you!
And then I had a floppy with PC-DOS 2.0 on it (which worked fine on our non-IBM machines until the version we bought came in).
Sigh... maybe I'm just old, but I think I'd have a hard time having the audacity of doing the same thing today...
I installed MS Office on my iPod two weeks and Excel still doesn't work. No matter how many times I jog the dial. But I've got to admit, the talking paper clip really does have a beautiful singing voice.
then again, it beat the 100k transfer over cat net--transmission easy, but reception is tough--sometimes "Meow" and "WROWRR" are hard to distinguish . .
hawk, still not correcting this stack of papers
This kind of thing has been going on forever. People used to do it with floppies, and I'd be surprised if it hasn't been done with plain USB or Firewire drives before this.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
"Never underestimate the bandwith of a warez kid carrying an iPod. But the latency sure sucks..."
Bringing you the freshest iso's since we changed our name from "SoftWarehouse."
I worked in the past for that lame (now extinct) company formerly known as Egghead. What a crock of crap that place was. A hole-in-the-wall strip mall store that sold krap at ridiculous prices. But it was cool though, you could "try" out any piece of software you want and get discounts. A dirty-little secret: they re-shrank opened and returned products. No wonder they went out of business.
Still, I wonder how in the world is Software, Etc. still in operation? Prices > all, stores == suck.
BestBuy, don't get me started....
It's all about the buy.com price mistake of the day, hehe.
The biggest trick the devil pulled was letting lawyers become politicians so they can write the laws.
What if someone kills a president by lobbing an iPod against his/her head? Now that'd be news...
Slashdot has sections, like apple.slashdot and bsd.slashdot, much like a newspaper has Sports and Fine Arts sections. I consider http://slashdot.org to be the "front page." I thought that was obvious, sorry.
Funny how if your only tool is a hammer, all your problems start to look like nails.
Cave, wreck, and deep diver.
And this isn't the first time something like this has been done. I remember when Windows 95 was being released. People would write virii to floppy disks and then go to stores just to crash the new operating system. I even think their was a rumor about IBM OS/2 programmers doing this as well.
If offered, never take the display model.
Whatever..... and how much money do you suppose it's worth to exhibit respectful/professional behavior?
It has nothing to do with "poor teenagers getting punished". It has everything to do with refusal to reward incompetence and a bad attitude.
I don't expect that the teenage sales clerk at Best Buy, Circuit City, CompUSA, or wherever be a computer or electronics expert - expecially for the low wages they get paid. I do, however, expect they'll do their best to be helpful - and certainly not insult customers or give out incorrect advice. (If you don't know the answer, just admit you're "not sure" and offer to go find out!)
And just what would he do with "Office XP" on a Mac?
Steve M
so they could show prospective buyers all the windows compatibility they get with there new iMac?
I think it is you who needs to get a clue.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Be thankful he gave you accurate and normally helpful advice. Had you actually been intending to BUY M$ Office he would have saved you some serious dollars. Had you explained your reasons for wanting the higher price you would have probably the info you needed.
:)
Sounds like somebody that is at least trying to help the customer, just needs to improve the 'ol people skills. Probably a geek type.
Democrat delenda est
I wanted to see if I could easily do this with a MultiMedia card. They're the postage-stamp sized Flash memory cards.
Anyhow, I walked into Business Depot, stuck this thing into a Palm, and copied away. There wasn't really anything worthwhile to copy on the demo at the store, I mainly wanted to see if it would read my digital camera images. Point is, MMCs are yet another good strategy for this (but not office, it's too big!)
Do you know what the difference between a car salesman and a computer salesman is?
The car salesman knows when he's lying to you.
.. has a price tag?
Why should how much you get paid change what is right, and what is wrong? That sux!
Microsoft did NOT pioneer this. This is how nearly all Mac software has always been installed. For the most part, Mac software doesn't have chains of dependancies and special settings to be made as part of an install... and if it does, those are drag-and-drop files as well. Let's just put it this way... you don't have to fiddle with keys in a registry. :)
Careful... take that one too far and you end up with Fry's. I did a Linux demo day at Fry's once (ok, twice, but I had to). In one of the back rooms they had a huge poster explaining the company policy of "Team Knowledge".
Basically, Team Knowledge has one rule: You never say "I don't know" to the customer, you instead go find someone who does know.
Problem is, nobody knows. Anything. You will literally cycle through half the staff in the store (who, incidentally, drag their feet every step of the way because they know it's a hopeless endeavour), one person asking the next, until you get back to the first employee you asked. At this point, the original employee will mutter something about "the back" and vanish forever. *poof*
Looking at it another way...
You are deriving benefit from your spoils, without compensation to its owner. Another thing...there's something (though unrelated to this) called theft of service. This can happen, for exmaple, when you pull up to a commercial dumpster and toss in the roll of used carpeting you just removed from your last job. Stealing and theft aren't concerned solely with material objects - they deal with instances where one party deprives another of something that is rightfully theirs, be it a car stereo, professional services, or even licensing revenue.
And to further clarify, copyright infringement is something else entirely.
All of my good articles never get posted
/. editors.
Yes, I know the feeling too.
I just don't understand why some story I submit gets rejected, then an identical type submission makes it.
There is no consistency to
Michael
There is no cryptographic solution to the problem where the intended receiver and the attacker are the same entity.
Oh, and I'd like to mention in this anonymous forum that I steal bandwidth from the Apple store all the time.
Clue time: When you post using your ID, which matches your DOMAIN NAME of all things, which is displayed right next to your post, then you are no longer anonymous. Ever heard of "whois", Mr. Matthew Miller?
Want your address and phone number as well?
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Heh... that's pretty funny and pathetic at the same time!
But really, the core problem is how they're going about "finding out" whatever "it" is that they don't know. Researching the problem should mean going to an outside source. Perhaps it's the Internet... or perhaps it's a matter of calling up the manufacturer's support line and getting more information.
Sure, you can't always provide an immediate answer to the customer - but you don't have to. If the customer knows his/her options (AKA. I'm sorry sir, but nobody here has that information. I can put in a call to the manufacturer for you, and have someone get back with you - but we probably won't have an answer until 48 hours from now.), he/she can choose to say "Yes, I really need to know this. Please have someone get back with me." Or more likely, "Oh, don't worry about it then. I was just curious."
Yep - it works both ways. You'll always get some real "winners" as customers. I know... I did a lot of retail computer sales in the past. Wouldn't want to do it again, either. I had my share of putting up with idiots pretending to be "experts", yaking for close to an hour with incorrect information on new products coming out soon, and on how cool their setup at home was.
No matter what you price your stuff at, some people will make snide remarks on it, saying it's a "ripoff". So what? Just politely suggest they go buy the product(s) at the other store they know has a better price, and point out that you've had "no problem selling them at the price marked, so it doesn't make sense for our store to sell them for any less". Chances are actually not too bad the clown will come back and buy one from you, despite his ranting!
(I actually had that happen more than once. They'd show back up with some line about "I guess I *have* to pay your price... the other guy is out of them now.")
From my personal experience with CompUSA managers, they would never consent to the 400+ dollar hit of officially putting a full working copy of office on the sales floor.To get that full copy of Office on there, that's what they would have to do.
Others have noted that the demo version of Office is *very* insistant about announcing its demo status. You'd think a computer consultant (the author) would know the difference. Though maybe...
DB