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Virtual PC for OS/2 released
LordNimon writes "Who says OS/2 is dead? Not Innotek, apparently. They just released Virtual PC for OS/2 (aka VPC/2), which allows you to run any PC operating system inside OS/2. They also made available OS/2 "guest" support, which improves the support for running OS/2 under VPC for Windows. I just deleted my Linux partition amd reinstalled it under VPC/2, and now I never have to reboot again! I also heard that that OS/2 development team found a number of bugs in the core code, and the fixes were incorporated into the Windows version. Today is a great day for OS/2 users, especially those that want to try out Linux or run Windows apps that don't work with Odin."
The three copies of that Connectix will sell can fund their Mac and Windows versions!
CEE5210S The signal SIGHUP was received.
but its on the endangered list. like BeOS, Amiga (which is tring to recover).
I would love to try OS/2 but the problem is you cant find it or buy it anyplace. and nor do i want to pay for an OS that i would just play with to try it out.
Maybe it should be released free as abandoned ware....
My dad was a gung-ho OS/2 guy for a long time. This definatley sounds cool enough to pull out one of the old OS/2 copies and plop it on my PC.
Dozings.com -- Its kinda funny... If you're as crazy as me.
I've never used OS/2, but what about the performance???
Is it really the same as native Windows or Linux? THough it should work fine for testing purposes I guess...
Tend to post comments only when drunk
I was there last week, and it looked like their package and warehouse tracking system was running OS/2 warp.
for an April Fool's joke! heheh.
Ah, I still have my warp floppies floating around somewhere... Mebbie I'll try this out on an old pentium and emulate linux running vmware emulating windows 3.1 Just for the Uber-Geek Factor!
OK, I know it, I'm pathetic.
I'm done with sigs. Sigs are lame.
I used to run OS/2 Warp on my 386DX40 and my friend had a 386SX16, and his machine often seemed to run quicker under OS/2. I don't know if it was the microchannel bus or not. As far as I can remember both machines had similar amounts of ram.
Those Microchannel machines were pretty quick for their day. Too bad it was proprietary.
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
I've never been to Europe so I'm not familiar with what the majority of computers run for operating systems, but I guess I've never though OS/2 was still that popular that a european company would produce a product for it. Anyone care to enlighten me? Maybe this product will be sucessful in europe, but I can't imagine it making that much money in North America.
"I just want my stapler." --some innotek worker with an office in the basement.
Just checked scheduler! tommorow at 12:30 is a crusade of Jesus Christ!
Time must be running backwards, if not "/. started to suck to post something like that"
Ok, just kidding.
For all practical purposes it's dead.
Is this a follow-up to the time travelling article?
I mean, these guys are at least 7 years too late...
-- No sig today
...all seem to have a knack of returning from the grave more often the Dracula. Can't dead polititians and OS's just stay dead?
"Today is a great day for OS/2 users"
It sure is, by-golly! Today, they can finally use real operating systems from inside their limping, bleeding-from-the-gums, half-dead OS!
Break out the party hats! The sun is shining, the birds are singing! It truly is a great day for OS/2!
I'd love to finally move to OS/2 but I need my Windows apps. This might be the solution... except 239 euros+tax seems a little steep for a home user...
Also, has anyone got any idea what will happen when Windows crashes (as it is liable to do) while running on top of this?
I just deleted my Linux partition amd reinstalled it under VPC/2, and now I never have to reboot again!
:)
Are you sure you didn't get Linux confused with Windows there?
Random and weird software I've written.
Are we seeing the trend that one OS is always a M$ OS?
My workplace...
Linux running VMware running Win98
FreeBSD running VMware running WinXP
WinXP running cygwin with Xfree
WinXP running VMWare running Linux
Solaris running citrix clients.
-
I need the driver support, so Ill use WinXP. - me
This is a great day for OS/2 users
Yes, we are both very happy.
-Sean
(Come on, someone had to make that joke!)
Programming can be fun again. Film at 11.
(BTW...the file system monitor tools fam and imon add a feature to Linux that was missing for way too long; generic and instant update of file status for X. This effectively ties the desktop and the current file system state together eliminating the need to 'refresh' an application to find out what's really there. After having this under OS/2 and seeing how poorly it was handled under Windows (9x & NT forks), I was glad to see SGI port and support this for Linux and IRIX (other Unix-like systems can add this support as well if they don't have something like it already).)
A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
Well, perhaps as a product directly available from IBM, or retail chains, but you can still get OS/2 under it's new name e-com station, from the people woh convinced IBM that it would be a good idea to continue selling it even if IBM wasn't the marketing force behind it.
That company is Serenity Systems, http://www.serenity-systems.com
Whether or not you or I consider it to be a viable product is not really relevent. If Serenity Systems can survive on it, then for them it is a viable product.
BeOS is the only PC based OS that I have used that has handled threads as well as OS/2 does. This is coming from a user running Linux for the most part now. Your own experience may vary. And if you have political arguments against OS/2, BeOS, et all, because they were proprietary OS's, that's fine. That is one of the main reasons I have converted almost completely to Linux. In my own opinion, proprietary does not necesarily mean does nothing right. But you may take that position if you choose.
Then again this in my opinion. I get the option of being wrong.
-Rusty
You never know...
This is good news, considering the effort Microsoft went to kill OS/2 when they released Windows 3.0, this is really funny, the thought of OS/2 users being able to run XP without rebooting...priceless.
And lest we forget...
If it wasn't for OS/2 development, the old Amiga would never have had REXX, that was one cool programming language.
OS/2 2.0 was a better Windows than Windows at the time, and using its Virtual Dos Machines it had the most stable version of Dos.
Wouldn't life had been so much easier if Windows had died, an everyone used OS/2, too bad its a legacy system now.
What on earth are you talking about? TPS=Turun Pallo Seura. A famous hockey team in Turku, Finland.
Word has it they are working on a new version of NCSA Mosaic for OS/2, considering they are living in a time machine.
Makes you wonder what ever happened to those Apple ][ developers...
Has anyone tried to boot FreeBSD from this?
FreeBSD is a great next operating system.
eComStation, NetLabs, Odin, Hobbes, UnixOS/2, XFree86. X on OS/2 is pretty cool. Pretty much everything(of consequence)in Linux has been ported to OS/2. If you can get past the sloppy install or use eComStation or eCommerce Warp Server they are solid as hell with a proven industrial grade kernel.
-- Ted tsikora@powerusersbbs.com
I've got $20 that says they won't recover their development costs. Hey, at least it would help them...
:)
It seems to me that whoever did this work
were bored former OS/2 engineers who are laid-off with nothing else better to do with their time, -- OR -- there is some IBM customer somewhere that still runs OS/2 -- on a desktop --who would buy enough licenses.
My $20 says they were bored with nothing else better to do... Most OS/2 customers used it as a server OS.
At least I know what former OS/2 engineers are like; I was one from '89 to '90. (I'm gainfully employeed and definately over OS/2
OS/2 has USERS?
BeOS's threads were really expensive. Just because they use a lot of them, and because people hammer it into your head that BeOS's threads were amazing, doesn't make it so. Yup, they used a lot of them, but they were less efficient than NT or linux kernel threads.
Normally I don't complain about the lack of checking of facts and figures for stories. Shouldn't Slashdot have checked to make sure there were multiple people with OS/2 installed on their system before pluralizing users in the story? Maybe they called both users to see if they were happy about the announcement....
"Freedom of speech has always been the abstract red-headed stepchild of the Constitution"
-Suck
That's no easy feat. At VMWare they use OS/2 as a part of the internal test suite. If you changed something in the monitor (the core of a virtualizer) you had to boot/halt OS/2 and a bunch of other operating systems before you could check it into cvs. Apart from the business case, the main reason OS/2 isn't supported on VMWare is because it is so damn wacky that it was considered too unstable to publically support. Virtual PC on the other had can support it because they have dual operation modes. They virtualize the processor until something breaks, you get a popup box saying the VM is going to reboot and then it starts up in 100% emulation mode (ie slow). I figure it must have taken a hell of a lot of effort to keep OS/2 running to be able to release it as a product, or maybe it is just especially dodgy/slow.
How we know is more important than what we know.
How similar is this to VMWare? I assume they have a similar function, but i tried VMWare out on Mandrake 8.0 and it does run windows faster than native, as advertised.
How does this functionality compare with VPC?
Are they architecturally similar?
... a better windows than windows. That was actually one of their slogans, and it was so true! Apps ran usually a lot faster and more stable than under dos/win3.11!
Alot of banks seem to run OS/2 and even Lotus software. Too bad they wouldent have all that much need for software like this though.
"The United States has no right, no desire, and no intention to impose our form of government on anyone else." - Bush 05
I knew there was a reason I kept my OS/2 CDs ... I got it for my birthday one summer about 7 years ago (approx) and eventually killed it as soon as I discovered Trumpet Winsock for Windows 3.1. Alas, I did not know very much about partitioning and had to trick its own installer into killing its own partition so I could use Windows again (since fdisk would not kill off that autocratic OS/2 boot manager.)
I don't mean to start a fight or offer flaimbait... but what exactly is the point of "hanging on" to an outdated operating system?
Or maybe I'm mistaken. Is OS/2 still a big deal and is widely used? If so, where is it being used so much?
From my perspective this is "cool" I guess but not necessarily too useful...
The next comment I write will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and see it early!
I beleive those two OS/2 Warp users out there will be pleased to hear this.
I beleive they're still waiting for Quake II to be ported for them.
Excellent point. Also, in most BeOS apps, you'd have 10 blocked threads, and one thread doing all the work. Forcing a thread per window didn't do anything to take advantage of SMP, since most of the threads spent all their time blocked.
So if I make a new hat for Napoleon does that mean he is not dead?
could somebody explain why odin seems to have made more progress than wine? is it somehow easier to emulate win32 api under os/2? can wine and odin share work?
do that and then i'll be impressed..
Karma: Bad (mostly affected by moderation done to your comments)...Now i know why.
We have a small kiosk type Bank of America ATM at work. (they never want you to leave :) One day I went down, and found it crashed with an odd error message, fiugring it was just like any other computer that was crashed I tried to pull the power and reboot. After WAY too much debug information on the way up, an OS/2 warp banner comes up, it then launched into the gui, then started a remote dialin app, then shot some additional debug info, then started the ATM app, and prompted for a passcode. I wonder how many if not all BOA ATM's are running it. I also wonder if the app is native, or OS/2 is just the host OS, and it runs out of a secure hardware card ala IBM.
Fun stuff.
Actually, I saw a retailer selling OS/2 five years ago. It was in a place that was easier to see than the Winblows section. I took a peek, but it really wasn't something I needed(or could run). IBM wants to get rid of OS/2, probably. They probably don't even use it anymore on any major machines. IBM would probably want everyone to drop OS/2 in favor of POSIX-compatiable systems.
Slashdot is a waste of time. I enjoy wasting time.
For most americans OS/2 IS used in Most ATM's, Several Brands Of Gas Pumps, And A healthy Chunk of All Point of Sales Apllications. Any Update to Such a stable OS Is definatly Welcome.
Looking at the storys that are posted today, with the exception of John Katz, who is always foolish ;) These stories all sound like pranks.
These people and companies taht keep telling OS/2 IS not dead are like people who insist Elvis isn't dead. Why don't you guys see the reality? I Have to say that i used os/2 and it was in fact my favorite OS. But IBM's mistakes killed it and it is dead now. A couple of days ago I also saw a company that was making something called Free DOS. They also stated that DOS isn't dead.
Though I haven't seen anyone stating that CP/M isn't dead; I wouldn't be surprised to see one!
Stability and near POSIX compliant shell support were strong draws for OS/2 seven years ago, but free UNIXes and NT/Cygwin (and more recently, Mac OS X) have caught up in these areas. It's surprising to find that OS/2 has still got a relatively large following.
About says it all doesn't it>
When OS/2 WARP 4 first came out, I wanted to try it out. I checked plenty of computer stores but they didn't have it. Then one of my friend's father had won a copy of OS/2 WARP 4 in a tournament. Only problem is that my friend lived pretty far away and I didn't have a car. So I took a three hour bus/subway/bus/bus ride to get there.
Yes, I wasted a whole day just to get my hands on OS/2, an impressive OS especially at the time. Unfortunately, IBM killed OS/2. I vowed to never trust IBM. They don't give a damn about marketing. They don't take risks.
Peter Gibbons: He's going to ask me to work on Sunday and I'm going to do it, because I'm a pussy, which is why I work at Innotek in the first place.
Hmmm, the same people that brought us the Macintosh with a DOS prompt are now bringing us Windows in OS/2.
Oh wait...
In other news, here in Texas the state ordered an OS/2 solution for their license plate services. Partly because it was cheaper than a proposed UNIX solution (good, because it was OpenServer), and partly because they figured people wouldn't attempt to install software from home on the machines (OS/2 does not run most Windows stuff now).
Click here or here.
Once I worked as admin in a company near my home. OS/2 was the OS on the servers and I always thought if was a great product... it almost never crashed (I saw it crashing once and i dont even remember how it was... BSOD? :)))... ok, it was almost a decade ago I really dont remember) we used to compile some unix softwares on it... it was great... our system was a dual-boot of OS/2 and windows NT (i dont even remember de version, one of the first maybe) and OS/2 was hell lot faster! much more reliable (in terms im not even going to mention)! and much, much, much more easy to deal with!
:)))
great product!
Fabio - Sumare/Sao Paulo/Brazil/South America/Earth/Solar System/Milky Way/Universe
http://www.morroida.com.br
In my 'every pc I have needs to triple boot' days, I took a P200, purchased OS/2 Warp 3 and then installed it. I was able to boot, and use it. To get it to work on the network, I had to 'hack' the OS. Luckily the network card was one of the 3 that were supported by the hack. I could get onto the NT network, and map drives. Internet? Nope. So I would download files to one computer and then xfer them to that computer. Within about 3 days it was completely tripped out with UI enhancements, Star Office, Netscape, etc, etc.
I wasn't a big fan of it. I didn't like the CDE like bar it used. Plus, it has 2 versions of DOS on it- one DOS and one OS/2 DOS. The windows 3.1 compatibility package was cool, but I hate windows 3.1. I simply yelled 'gyaaaah!' and closed it....too many GPFs that still haunt my memory.
There is a lot of software out there, and it seemed at the time that there were a lot of linux hackers that also played with OS/2. Warp 3 was worthless without the internet, and unless I spent another $100 on either Warp 3 Connect or Warp 4, I was SOL.
Nah, back to windows, linux, beos, bsd, solaris, and whatever I had then.
They stuck me in an institution, said it was the only solution, to...protect me from the enemy, myself
...all two of them.
...and and don't foget, we wouldn't have the glorious OS/2 PM GUI if it wasn't for Amiga (this was the trade IBM got for them porting REXX)!
There are almost always copies of OS/2 Warp 4 for sale on eBay, and most of the time the price is under US$50.
:-)
If you get a copy and need help (or have any other questions), stop on by the comp.os.os2.misc newsgroup on USENET and ask. We'll be glad to help you learn more.
Mainframe/UNIX Bit Twiddler and long time Windows/Linux Hobbyist.
The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
(1) OS/2 still runs all of the programs I've been collecting for the past 10 years. That includes a fairly sizable collection of DOS, Windows 3.x, and OS/2 software.
:-)
That lets me avoid the upgrade treadmill that so many Windows users are stuck on. Why should I have to upgrade an old version of Quicken, ABC Flowcharter, or StarOffice if it still does the job I need? Answer: I don't.
(2) OS/2 is relatively stable, it has a fairly small footprint (by today's standards), and its kernel is a very smooth multitasker compared to Windows and perhaps even Linux/FreeBSD.
That lets me continue to be able to do almost everything I want to do on my 64MB PPro/200, including burning CDs in the background while doing most of my normal stuff in the foreground. That's what I'm doing right now: There are currently 58 processes with 222 threads, all only using 57MB of RAM right now. Not bad, considering I'm also running a copy of Hummingbird Exceed in the background.
(3) With all of the software being ported from the Unix/Linux world, there are a surprising number of things an OS/2 user can still do.
Remember that OS/2 (while somewhat old now) is still a 32-bit operating system with an excellent command line. I regularly use programs like Leech and either LAME or Bladeenc to rip CDs and convert 'em to MP3 format, CDRecord to burn them, GIMP to do work on graphics files, etc.
The cost makes it a hard operating system for me to recommend to others nowadays except in special cases, but for those of us that have been using it for a while (in my case almost 10 years), there are surprisingly few reasons to leave...
Mainframe/UNIX Bit Twiddler and long time Windows/Linux Hobbyist.
The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
About 5 years ago, I saw the OS/2 prompt on a cash register at Sears.
Looks like OS/2 still has enough life to die a few more "deaths."
In the near future all computers will be OS/2. Prepare to be absorbed into the collective.
"PS/2, OS/2, is half a computer or half an operating system?"
Why are linux users so scared of alternatives? Reading through these posts shows an awful hostile attitude towards OS/2. Is that because OS/2 runs more software than Linux?
Of all the os's I've used, OS/2 Warp 4 had by far the best GUI(Exept for maybe XP). If IBM were to opensource the GUI we would finally have a good looking linux.
IBM haven't withdrawn it, and won't anytime soon. You can buy it directly from their website.
I posted this about an hour ago in response to the same misunderstanding in part of the poll dialog. It's rare where posting the same comment to two separate discussions makes perfect sense.
OS/2 is available in 16 different language sets and actively supported by IBM. Some death.
It's disturbing though, given that these facts aren't hidden, that I seem to be the only one in the world who knows this.
give me a
Forget OS/2 for me. I want it for my iBook so I can run OS X and Win98. Now granted some may say "If you want windows just use windows." But I like an all-in-one kind of thing. My iBook is my only portable and I like all the many features of OS X, but there's sometimes I just want to play Descent 1 (yes, I said Descent 1, old 3d dos game), use the old win 3.0 copy I got for $1, or something like that. But sadly, even though I have an extra copy of win98 lying around (thru my university's deal with MS) I don't have $100 for the DOS version of VPC :/
Wasn't Innotek the name of one of the slave-driving software companies in Office Space? The one where Lumberg used to work and where Michael and Samir get jobs after they're laid off?
Some of the key troublemakers have been quiet. :-)
Mainframe/UNIX Bit Twiddler and long time Windows/Linux Hobbyist.
The Theorem Theorem: If If, Then Then.
From "The OS/2 Programming FAQ"
"""Q: How big should my stacksize be?
A: It is critical to avoid stack sizes where byte 2 has a value of 2 or 4, e.g.:
* 0x00020000 (128k)
* 0x00040000 (256k)
* 0x33023678
* 0x11041111
Otherwise, when executing under OS/2 2.0GA there may be various and always differing runtime error behaviors. """
Can OS/2 be run as a guest OS inside any version of VirtualPC on any version of MacOS?
I read in the VPC 4 release notes, that it can only run OS/2 4. What about 3, since that's what I have?
And since I only have 3 on floppy disks, how can I use Linux (my only system with a floppy drive) to read that odd floppy format as image files that I can feed into VPC so as to install it?
The worst problem regarding OS/2 is, that there are some processes which can't be killed - for example, one of the two PMSHELL.EXE processes.
...)
Any user process can override KILL signals sent by the OS/2 kernel. Unlike Unix operating systems (where you can intercept all signals except KILL (9) and STOP (23)), OS/2 allows user processes to intercept kill signals. There is actually no way to enforce termination of a user space process.
Just take a look at OS/2's DosKillProcess() API:
DosKillProcess is used to kill a process by its process ID. What happens is that a KILLPROCESS exception is sent to the given process or group of processes. This by default will write all file buffers, and handles opened by the process will be closed. It is possible to intercept the exception with the use of DosSetExceptionHandler, and then the process will do its own nice exit and call DosExit.
I'd be interested in how this is implemented in other IBM proprietary OS kernels (OS/400, OS/390, VME,
kind regards,
octogen
Yes, I have VPC/2 and I am running OS/2 @ home. I only need Win32 if I get an application (like tax application in Germany or a library application) I can not use with ODIN.
This happens only five times a year and for all other my wife and myself use OS/2!
Some examples:
My source is www.os2.org and as long as I can work with OS/2 I will do it because it is fast, rock solid and it has a nice GUI the *nix community could learn from!
Jogi/2Get rid of
Maybe this is something most OS/2 users would rather not remember, but if it weren't for OS/2, we wouldn't have Windows NT or its spawn either. When Microsoft and IBM divorced, IBM got to keep the Windows 3.1 code (which it altered and put in OS/2 for the "a better Windows than Windows" effect), and MicroSoft got to keep the OS/2 1.x code, including 1.3, which was basically an IBM rewrite of Microsoft's poorly performing 1.2, and which was the basis for NT. In fact, the NT name had been considered by IBM before they decided on OS/2.
If you're running a Windows NT variant, look in the registry and you'll even find the "OS/2 Subsystem for NT", and an OS2LibPath key.
Which begs the question: Has Microsoft ever actually written an operating system? I think they wrote WinCE from scratch.
Great Product have had the opportunity of
seeing and using both the OS/2 version
running WINDOZE and the Windoze version
running OS/2.
Great idea, even to run OS/2 versions on an
OS/2 desktop. There are presently 6 YES SIX
currently supported versions of OS/2 and
testing a new version before implementing
using VirtualPC/2 seems a great way of
testing a new version before implementing
it!
Also with hardware manufacturers being slow
to provide OS/2 drivers for their hardware,
VPC/Win running OS/2 gives at least a
temporary way to get around the problem as
the "guest" OS, whatever it is, always see's
the same basic hardware,(sound, video, HD,
network etc.) irrespective of what it actualy is - as long as the Host OS supports
the hardware, the Guest OS can run on the
system.
Ed Durrant
Sydney, Australia,
P.S. for those who don't believe - the
current 7 versions of OS/2 are:
OS/2 Warp Client FP15/16.
OS/2 Warp Server for e-Business FP3
OS/2 Warp Client - Convenience Pack 1 FP2
OS/2 Warp Server for e-Biz - Conv Pack 1 FP2
OS/2 Warp Client - Convenience Pack 2
OS/2 Warp Server for e-Biz - Conv Pack 2
eCommStation from Serenity Systems.
call me when they support Solaris. Being a computer and electrical engineering student I have seen four operating systems in common use, (not in any particular order) MacOS, Windows NT, Linux, and Solaris. On plant tours and at places I've worked I have also seen HP-UX, VMS, and IRIX but always with a mention of how they will be replaced soon. A number of people I know would love to have VPC run Solaris so they can run it on their home Mac or WinPC and work from home when needed (usually involving some afterhours damage control or the occasional snow storm that keeps them snowed in for the day).
If you check Connectix's FAQs you'll find that they have been asked about support for *BSD, Solaris and BeOS enough to put it in their FAQ list. I guess I (or even "we" if I dare speak for others) shouldn't rag on them too much. After all they have created an impressive product that without I might not be running Linux today. They go where the money is, as do all companies.
OS/2 support is nice but I'm waiting for support for OSes I'd actually use.
My OS/2 machine (prior to my cross/'up'grade to FreeBSD) was Warp 4 Client on a 300MHz K6-2 with SCSI disks and 128MB RAM. It was much faster than the Win98 partition on the same box. (Microsoft appears to have some unusual latencies/bugs in the '9x code, which prevents it from scaling well to larger systems. My '98 box is now a Pentium 200MMX, and I can't say I notice any difference between it and an Athlon for basic UI tasks- viewing a directory list, starting IE, etc.)
Basically, OS/2 will fly, if you keep in mind that the specs on the box were basically minimum boot-at-all numbers. If you want to rejuvenate a 486 for the desktop, you'd best look to Linux/BSD (with framebuffer or text apps, rather than X) or QNX.
Keep in mind that versions of OS/2 prior to Aurora (Warp Server 5)/eComStation have a large (>4gb?) disk limitation that requires a patch to one of the installation disks.
Also, it will be fairly annoying to patch at first, given the need for a FixPak to run a browser capable of accessing IBM's FixPak site.
If you do get into installing patches, remember that FixPaks are all-inclusive (you only need the latest), and learn to use the "Install on Demand" (IIRC) feature - that's a native installer IBM built to allow you to patch over a running system, in the same manner as the later Windows Update. Most OS/2 hands I knew were still dumping 40MB patch sets to floppies- they were idiots!
I've seen it running everytime I update my car tags.
I know I'm coming in kind of late, but I'm trying to get some help getting Cygwin to work under WINE under SuSE 6.0 under VPC/2. I don't really have any other way to work with Cygwin in a Windows environment, but would really like to contribute to the development. Any pointers? (I have to continue to run OS/2 for security reasons).
Synopsis: Even talking about OS/2 is a waste of time.
yet you feel the need to do it anyway. Hmmm... interesting.
Most likely on an os/2 server. More than half the atms through out the world are still using os/2.