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Tivo 3.0 'Firebolt' Hits the Wild
James Evans writes "Tivo is rolling out version 3.0 of their software, including Ethernet drivers as well as the ability to download program data directly from a cable broadcast without using the phone line."
My guess is it'll be awhile before everyone gets it since these things come
in waves.
Now I can have phone sex while my porno videos are being recorded!
I never really saw what was so bad about it. I remember hearing that it had some spyware?
Can my Tivo serve as a server? can I connect it to my computer and let everyone download all my stored SouthPark and Lone Gunmen episodes? It would be neat if I could use this for information as well, if I need harddrive space temporairly. Can't wit for people to hack it, I want to know what can be done with the thing.
Sig (appended to the end of comments you post, 120 chars)
A small random group of subscribers will transparently receive the update followed by a slightly larger group.
Suggesting the users won't know they're beta testing, performing a service for Tivo? Can I get beta testers like that? They'd be much less uppity.
Neither 1st or 2nd generation Tivo hardware include an ethernet port, yet the 3.0 update includes ethernet support...
Does this mean that Tivo will be supporting folks popping their 1st gen. boxes open to install an ethernet card/kit like the one www.9thtee.com has been selling? Likewise, will Tivo be publishing a list of supported USB ethernet adapaters for the 2nd. gen boxes?
Or, is this simply Tivo being nice to the hacker community to by partially integrating ethernet support into their offical product?
(hey that rhymes :)
I'm disapointed that the haven't chosen this release to announce any sort of partnership w/ a company to get TiVo in Canada. I think they could really be sitting on a good market here. We like TV just as much as any American, and historically we've been quicker to adopt new technologies too. It's a real shame too, as the only thing that comes close is a PVR offered by Bell as part of their ExpressView satellite service (which, of course, requires the satellite service) and is a poor comparison to TiVo
My other sig is funny!
For some reason every store here (Best buy, circuit city, ultimate electronics ,ect.)is sold out of tivos and have been for months. Anyone know why? are they planning a new version or what
If Tivo could make a few bucks by lying to you about the information they reveal, would they?
Fed up of the phone ringing while you're watching TV - now you can watch TV and speak on the phone at the same time!
Video Game cheats, hints a
It is interesting that Tivo will be able to download program information from cable TV. I hope this means that I can disconnect the phone line and remain anonymous. Also, this would let me get rid of my phone line altogether and I could go all-cellular.
And if you don't understand, you'll never know...
The Right Reverend K. Reid Wightman,
the ability to download program data directly from a cable broadcast without using the phone line
So what exactly am I paying $9.95 a month for? I could understand the charge before because they had to pay for their 800 number, but now why should I pay for service when the box can do everything itself?
Chicago2600.net more than a lifestyle, its a survival trait.
Canadians are always tech-hungry, and that is why we have in excess of 60% of our homes having internet access, and HALF of those have either Cable or ADSL access. So figure that most of those with high speed access have the money and interest in TV to buy a Tivo...remember, something like 90% of homes have either Cable or Satellite TV service...
So, you have 30+ Million people, 27 million have cable ot satellite TV, 18 million have Internet access, and half, or 9 million of them have high speed/broadband access, and probably also have Cable/Satellite TV. That is a potential market of 27 million at it's high end, and maybe 8-9 million on the low end. Figuring at worst case, only half of the people with "everything" (C/S TV, Internet+Broadband) are potential customers, that is still 4 million customers! Do the math for yourself...that is a lot of money to be ignoring!
ttyl
Farrell
CAN-CON 2019 - Ottawa's only book oriented Science Fiction Convention! October 18-20, Sheraton Hotel, Ottawa, Canada h
The TiVo broadcasts I have been seeing on local cable channels at 2 am
a screen full of vertical blanking interval data with TIVO broadcast in the center of the screen and a "please excuse us this is a Tivo broadcast" voice over with corney music running in the background.
Cool.
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
I think you are paying for the *hardware*. Tivo boxen are sold below cost. With the Replay boxs, you have a choice of paying upfront for the box or paying monthly.
I am at 180 days uptime on my Tivo. I guess that is how long it has been since the 2.5.1 update.
My Tivo has been locking up due to the broken-download bug ever since the last upgrade. I got two choices: pay to "fix" it, or wait for another upgrade!
1) For the most part the user interface is the same. The update seems to have focused on improvements to the core app. For example the now playing list draws much faster.
2) It records many more shows from the suggestions list which is good. I bumped my tivo up to 100+ hours a while back and it used to record only 3-4 unscheduled shows a day. Now it graps something like 10 and really makes use of all that space.
3) TivoNet warning: it will overwrite all of your setup files if you installed a network card. Looks like its time to open the box again. :(
Here is what Tivo has to say about the update.
Improvements to TiVo's Suggestions
TiVo's Suggestions has gotten even better at finding programs you might enjoy. If your TiVo automatically records TiVo's Suggestions, you may notice improvements soon.
If you have chosen not to automatically record TiVo's Suggestions, this is a good time to try them again. You can automatically record TiVo's Suggestions again by going to TiVo Central > My Preferences > TiVo's Suggestions.
Even if you don't automatically record TiVo's Suggestions, you can always browse through them (and set up your own recordings) by going to TiVo Central > Pick Programs to Record > TiVo's Suggestions
Improved Data Downloads
Your TiVo can now record TiVo Service data from specially broadcast programs. It receives these programs automatically and will never cancel or delete your shows to get them. This means shorter Daily Calls. If you do not have cable as your program source, TiVo will use the phone line as always.
The special programs will be recorded about once a week, usually between 2am and 5am. If you watch TV at these times, the TiVo Service may ask to change the channel to receive a special program. While the TiVo Service will work if the special programs do not record, it's a good idea to allow such channel changes whenever you can.
Record All Episodes with Duplicates
Season Passes will not record a program if the program's description is long enough and matches the description of another program recorded within 28 days. This is called the "28 day rule" and is used to avoid duplicate recordings.
However, you may want to record shows with identical descriptions. You might want to do this if your child expects a certain program to be recorded every week, or if a program is pre-empted (e.g., for news or a ballgame in overtime) and the broadcaster airs the same program a week later.
You can now turn off the 28 day rule and record duplicate episodes by selecting a new recording option, "Show Type: All (with duplicates)." Just go to TiVo Central > Pick Programs to Record > Season Pass Manager. Select the Season Pass, then select "Change Recording Options." Change "Show Type" to "All (with duplicates)."
Comment removed based on user account deletion
There's an article in either this or last month's Computer Shopper about how to build your own DVR for about $250. With an Athlon 950 and MB running for around $100 (including NIC, sound, no video), you could probably put together a non-subscription DVR for under $500.
About a month ago CompUSA had the cheap (in both senses) ATI TV-Wonder for about $20 after rebate. It can record decent quality with a fast drive and processor. The included Windows software includes some limited programmability, guide, and a multimedia center, so it's an inexpensive way to get your feet wet.
Unfortunately, the Linux drivers aren't quite there yet. I'm using Mandrake 8.2 with the xawtv package but am limited to watching TV and AVI/WAV capture.
Instead of spending money on a tivo, go to http://sourceforge.net/projects/openpvr/
and get involved. when this is done, you'll be able to turn your linux box into something like a tivo for only the cost of a tv tuner card and possibly another hard drive.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Is it encrypted?
The guide data probably isn't copyrightable. Phone directory data isn't copyrightable, nor are databases of facts. ("The standard of originality for copyright is low, but it exists." - U.S. Supreme Court)The formatted data may be copyrightable, but you probably want to get it out of TiVo's format into something more useful anyway.
The subject title says it all.
You need a FREE iPod Nano
- They offer just the hardware without requiring subscription (or huge up front fee) and the unit is mostly functional without it.
- It becomes a general purpose multimedia machine which I can do what ever the heck I want to with.
1 may eventually happen but 2 will not likely happen do to legal problems even though it should be perfectly legal. See more for my reasons at my home page.Isn't Tivo the same product that changed their product to something worse via those uncontrollable "updates"? If I remember right, more than a few people were upset because the product they bought all of a sudden lost the functionality they had originally purchased it for. kinda like the forever "New and Improved best yet hyper attack" version of AOL X.0
You need a FREE iPod Nano
hell has froze over or it can fetch me a beer. Whichever happens first.
Who cares about the onboard ethernet controller? If all it's doing is downloading program listings from the internet instead of the phone line, I am not impressed. My current Tivo does this at night basically.
What would impress me if I could download all those juicey mpeg-2 vdieo files (or better yet, compress them to Divx) and share that stuff on Kazaa or WinMX. Unfortunately, Tivo won't play that game. Since the 2.5 software, my 9th tee Ethernet controller won't work.
Doh!
but then won't tivo be losing that $13/month you pay for the ability to download schedules, subscribe to TV shows and whatever else? i don't own one, but from what i understand (my brother has one) your tivo dials in to get a schedule so it knows when to record the list of shows you program in. i underastand you can program it like a VCR anytime (like: record channel 17 at 22:00 Tuesday), but to go to a grid and pick "Buffy" you have to pay the monthly fees, right?
I have been interested in TiVo for a while now, but I have heard from several people that you have a life, or you have TiVo. Because it records things you might like to see, you spend most of your time trying to watch them. Is this the case for most TiVo owners, or only those with no TV willpower?
You can find the the best information on this subject on the TiVo Community forums thread called "3.0 will (UN-)Support Broadband Connections. Its linked below.
. ph p?s=&threadid=54620
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread
I have two DirectTivo units and one regular Tivo unit. I primarily use my cell phone for everything and work did pay for my home phone line. When I lost my job I didn't replace the phone line thinking I could just program the one TiVo and let the DirectTivos get their information from the DirectTV. When I got a new job or Tivo released an update I figured I would get another phone line.
This worked fine for the standard TiVo. I had to program it to record like a VCR by time, but it continued to record manually. The DirectTivos however after 30 days of not connecting to the TiVo service refused to record anything even though they had TV listings! I was/am very mad at this and ended up having to get a phone line. They wouldn't even record manually. How stupid. I love my Tivos, but this was uncalled for.
I plan on writing Tivo but I doubt they will listen.
Anyone thinking of buying a Tivo or competing PVR should read:
o rt.asp?id=62&action=0
http://www.privacyfoundation.org/privacywatch/rep
If you opt out, they still collect every single remote control key click, and the time it was pressed. The current privacy policy simply promises not to do anything with the information. The aggregate information is very useful. Advertisers can trial some ads on a few hundred people who watch various combinations of programs, and use those results to target the sucsessful ads to everyone else who watches the same (or similar combinations). They KNOW whether you skip the ads or not.
A useful PVR would allow you to skip ads completely (not fast-forward) and would not require the phone-home. They all have phone-home. Remember, the TV is the ads. Ally McBeal and so on is just the rubbish they have to transmit as well to make you watch the ads. If you're interested in this sort of invasive stuff see:
http://www.spyinteractive.com/issue/iss_front.asp
and the book "Spy TV" ISBN: 1 899866 25 6
When it finally hits cable, I can digitally record Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone without the commercials on a gen-u-ine Firebolt! W00t!
MacOS, Windows, BeOS, GNOME, KDE: they're all just Xerox copies
You are an idiot and you don't know what you are talking about. You don't have a clue about what TiVo does, how it works, or how to run a business. Why the fuck would TiVo want you to buy hardware that they sell at a loss? If the service is over priced and not necessary, why do people buy a box to get it? A TiVo box without TiVo service is as useful as a telephone without phone service.
I find it strange that everyone wants tivo to give away their service without a monthy/annual fee.
We're not cheapskates; we know we're not going to get something for nothing from TiVo. We just want to know how the box works so that we can hack it to use guide data sources other than TiVo's, such as Gemstar Guide Plus (from the makers of TV Guide).
I paid for my phone, why do I have a monthly fee?
More like "I paid for my Lucent phone, why do I have to subscribe to AT&T long distance instead of another company's service?"
Will I retire or break 10K?
Just when I got the Tivo 'Nimbus 2001', they release a new version!
http://www.talknerdy.org
i've had a hard time getting a straight answer about this:
is tivo useful without cable, without satellite, with just plain old over-the-air reception?
(that means for those of us in sf, no nbc)
thanks in advance
1) Suggestions are now produced using collaborative filtering technology, much like the way Amazon produces suggestions. Example: 68% of people who like Twilight Zone like the Outer Limits, and so on. This is a VAST improvement over the way it was before. Yes, they're putting that anonymous data your Tivo sends back to them to good use in this way.
2) TivoNet/TurboNet/USB on Series2/PPP over serial (un)support built right in. If you have a TivoNet/TurboNet card, or a USB->Ethernet device using the Pegasus chipset, plug it in, turn on the Tivo. It auto detects and configures it, gets an address from a DHCP server on your network. Then you can put ",#401" in the dialing prefix to force it to use the ethernet for daily calls. PPP over serial is built in too, but a bit limited. You can tell the unit to skip dialing the modem and try to connect to another computer on the serial port via PPP during the daily call, where it expects to be able to route to the internet. This is really easy to setup and get working with Linux or XP/2000. But it's not an "always on" connection. Only connects at dial time.
3) Disable the 28-day no re-record rule for Season Passes and Auto-Record WishLists. Just a new option in the recording options: "Show Type: First Run Only, First Run and Repeats, All". All disables the 28 day rule for that one SP/ARWL.
4) Data Downloads from broadcast: They have downloaded video via broadcast before, now it can get guide data/tivolution magazine/showcases via the same mechanism. They show a program on various channels (Discovery only for now) late at night. The Tivo automatically records it and decodes the data contained within. Saves dial time.
Not a lot of new features in this upgrade, admittedly. Mostly it's a release designed to bring all the flavors together into one. Most of the changes are on the backend (a lot of the code that was TCL scripted is now in C, for example).
Stupid slashdot lameness filter! A # was in front of every line of the following...
It's (un)supported.. Which basically means it works, but don't call Tivo's customer service about it. It supports TivoNet and TurboNet cards on series 1 boxes, USB->Ethernet devices on series 2 boxes (that have the Pegasus chipset), and serial over PPP if you can get it working.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Wrong. If you opt out, the data, including the remote press data, never leaves your box.
Even if you don't opt out, the data is sanitized of any identifying marks before it leaves your box. The privacy foundation makes incorrect conclusions based on flawed methodology.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
See http://cheema.com/vcr/
I cannot release the source because I am doing some
related stuff at work and dont want to make them
unhappy.
Until the subscription becomes optional and you can get the same functionality by just buying the box and paying nothing per month I will NEVER buy a Tivo. It's fucking bad enough to pay the cable company's "rent" every month for my cable box. I refuse to purchase a box for several hundred dollars and then pay a fucking fee to just get programming information to use it. Make it free or you don't get any of my money. Besides, I have a VCR which is just as easy to use. Duh. Since Tivo can only record one thing at a time anyone from digital cable boxes there are NO advantages over a normal VCR for me.
Surprised no one posted this yet...
TurboNet Adapter $69.25
Works with Series 1 and DirectTiVos, slips right in, then the new 3.0 will autodetect it and install the right drivers. After installation, put ",#401" as your phone number and it will use the net connection from now on.
"TK-421, why aren't you at your post?"
Tivo spent a good bit of time ensuring that 3.0 works with TivoNet, TurboNet, and AirNet (or whatever the 802.11b thing is called).
Its rudementary support right now -- just allows your daily call to go over the net, instead of dial up. When Tivo "officially" adds support for interactive and multimedia content via a USB adapter to the Gen2 units, they will also support that functionality on the Gen1 units that have been hacked.
didya catch the playoffs last night? Fuck the Red Wings!!!
Nothing TiVo does requires a cable or satellite connection. In fact, it uses some kludges to enable it to work with a satellite box (and, I assume, a set-top cable box for digital cable).
The basic kludge enables the TiVo box to pretend it's a remote and control the satellite box. This greatly simplifies the process of synchronizing the two pieces of equipment (the TiVo unit and the satellite box).
But with over-the-air reception the TiVo box doesn't need any special tricks like that. (The same thing is true of non-digital cable, which just uses radio-frequency signals coming in on a coaxial cable, emulating over-the-air reception.)
Just think of TiVo as a digital VCR. It records shows just like a regular VCR. The advantages start when you want to play something while you're still recording it...or want to back up the tape without stopping recording...or want to continue recording while you watching something you've recorded at another time.
And then there's the TV guide features, which are more useful to over-the-air viewers than cable viewers (who probably have some similar service from their cable company). The guide allows a number of features which are not possible in a standard VCR, like choosing to record a show rather than a time. This means that if your local station changes the air-time of your favorite show TiVo automatically changes what it records.
I recently switched from satellite to cable on my TiVo and found some interesting features: As best it could, TiVo figured out how to record all of the shows I had previously recorded even though they had different stations and even different times. This saved me a lot of reprogramming time.
What TiVo is NOT useful without is the subscription to the television guide service. This is a little obnoxious, since it should be able to record by time, even if you are not paying the $10/month fee. Some of the more powerful features require the info provided by the subscription service, but those which do not require it should not be shut off if you decide not to pay the subscription.
TiVo works fine with POOTA (plain old over-the-air) television. In fact, it probably provides more benefits to people without cable or satellite. But don't expect that because you have antenna-based reception you can avoid the subscription. It just doesn't work.
Eternal vigilance only works if you look in every direction.
Due to it's ability to pause live programming, a real PVR records all the time, 24/7.
I doubt that your $600 homemade PVR will be able to do much of all those other things very well while it's pumping a GB/hour to disk.
So you are paying a lot more for less functionality. But at least you're not supporting the people who invented the product category and blazed the trail for the open source copy cats.
There is far more to this than just stealing your viewing habits for the Evil Empire(tm) to exploit in bad ways.
Well, I finally got my DirecTivo system - nice dish and a Philips DSR6000. Then the guy came over to install it and went "Nope, this won't work."
It's like in those Cable anti-dish commercials. "Yeah, you can get 150 channels for cheaper than cable. But first you have to chop down that 300 year old maple tree for us."
I personally think there's plenty of places I can get a decent view of the southern sky from, but apparently putting up poles or something doesn't work for the installers.
Oh well, I guess I'll send it back and get the much lamer IMO Series 2.
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is kinky.
That the serial over PPP method is a dial time only thing, not an "always on" thing like it was before.
But, you can still do the old way of setting up an always on PPP, then use the ",#401" code to force it to go out over the always on PPP. Takes more effort though.
We got Tivo/DirectTV at the beginning of the year. Now my wife is constantly finding new 'interesting' programs (Mortuary school, bug shows, more Oprah and Rosie than I ever thought possible.)
I sure miss her..
guzziJohn
Will users be able to download the mpeg files stored on their tivos via the new ethernet drivers? Or will Tivo making this "official" remove that particular abililty?
Actually, I watch the same shows I always wanted to watch, they're just 1/3 shorter without the commercials. And I don't ever watch the last 5 minutes of something that's on before what I want to see, or watch a show that's between two shows I enjoy just to kill the half-hour.
Plus, the TV fits *my* schedule now. For example, I'm usually out doing something on sundays now, rather than watching the simpsons or futurama (and the crap in between). I watch 10 minutes or so of the shows while i grab breakfast or with dinner (and finish the rest the next day, etc...), rather than watching whatever's on and then later also watching the shows i really want to see.
So, I watch slightly fewer shows, no extra "filler" i don't really want to see, and everything takes 30% less time to watch. All in all, I'm pretty damned happy with it.
Will you still be able to do this with the new drivers?
Fucking dickass moderators.
...maybe someone will be kind enough to answer them.
I don't subscribe to cable or satelite television. All of my television comes over the air. Does TiVo work with off the air reception?
Another thing is that one of the three shows I'm interested in watching (Greg the Bunny) is broadcast in widescreen through DTV. Can TiVo record DTV (and/or HDTV) broadcasts? The other two shows are regular NTSC: The Simpsons (they aren't going to draw animation widescreen until 80% of the people have widescreen sets) and Friends (NBC is a bunch of idiots).
mbbac
I have a RCA TV with Guide Plus Gold. The TV is plugged into a cable signal (coax) and nothing else (ie. no phone line)
... the tv controls my VCR (through the grid), but i can't watch it until its done taping
It gets the listings from the cable, and organizes them based on my zip code (which channel is which station).
I don't have a phone, don't want a phone, and REALLY want a tivo....i'm hoping that the new software operates like my current TV.
If it wasn't for the fact that sometimes i come home during a show, i wouldn't even care
Powerpuff Girls is cool.
I'm very interested in the evidence for this. If your source is Tivo, do they specifically say this or merely imply it?
Two sources. One is Tivo's privacy policy, which probably only implies that.
However, the second source is the source itself. Hack yourself a shell on the serial port and take a look at the dialing scripts. If the status of the box is set to "OptedOut" then the remote keypress data is wiped, not sent. Makes no sense for them to spend time sending something they can't use anyway.. saves them modem fees. The debug log is sent, but there's nothing of consequence in there anyway.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.