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Live via Satellite: NATO Aerial Surveillance Video
Factomatic writes "The BBC is reporting 'NATO surveillance flights in the Balkans are beaming their pictures over an insecure satellite link - and anyone can tune in and watch their operations live.' All you need is a satellite dish. John Locker tapped into the NATO aerial surveillance feed over the Balkans from England and has been e-mailing, faxing and calling NATO since November to get them to fix the problem. NATO denies it is a problem at all. I wonder if this would work in Afghanistan, too?" No, the article notes that Afghanistan is taking up all the secure communications bandwidth, and operations in the Balkans are getting kicked over to unencrypted channels. We ran an older story about the military's growing bandwidth crunch.
how long until somebody starts a webstream of this stuff? that'll beat webcams any day of the week.
guess it's equally entertaining when the spice channel is unavailible....
Maybe what they broadcast are fake operations to confuse adversaries?
It won't be on for long. It's ratings are horrible.
... because they're bogus feeds designed to throw someone off?
This story reminds me of the movie..
If you paid taxes during the cold war, you ended up supporting terrorism. What's your point?
Why yes I am paranoid! Thanks for asking!
My question to NATO is: Why are any of the feeds not secure to begin with? Shouldn't all they have implemented all secure transmissions from the get-go?
At last, some real competition to Rupert Murdoch's crappy satellite-based PayTV service!
Now if they can just get a good looking weather-babe the military might be on a winner here!
Surely they could buy a $1000 PC at each end and do: /dev/video_capture | mpeg_encode | unexportable_munition_software <secret-key> | /dev/satellite_modem
cat
and: /dev/satellite_modem | unexportable_munition_software <secret-key> | mpeg_decode | /dev/video_out
cat
Can't you broadcast in something else?!?
Now showing on satellite TV: secret American spy photos
Encryption is a munition, remember?
--Patrick
I taped that BBC interview and they had included the feeds in their little piece. Most of the footage seemed to be from an airplane looking at an acute angle downwards at road traffic like trucks - perhaps it was from a satellite but the camera seemed to move laterally in both directions. I've never seen a satellite feed but the shots seemed to come from a shaky airplane than a satellite in orbit. I have to admit I'm skeptical that these are true feeds. I honestly think it's misinformation. The quality of the footage was much better than the public ever sees in those press conferences, as if they were begging for the "enemy" to use the feeds. In fact, it seemed much better than the footage from helicopters during police chases. On second thought...maybe this is high quality military grade stuff:-)
At least they're voluntary. Anything vital is still secure. I mean who wants to watch the decimination of food to poor people? So what they'll show is some simple peacekeeping missions, nothing's in danger really. But really.. with the money we spend on them, they could stand to get some more secure channels.
"Oh no, 3 horny women and only 2 condoms...Thank god I read slashdot"
that because the Balkans are relatively "stable" now, that NATO just doesn't care if someone's watching? Milosevic is on trial in the Netherlands, there aren't mass riots against right-wing government candidtates (eg. LePen in France), and while their economy isn't anything near that of mainstream Europe, they're not starving in lines or causing problems, either (Even Quaddafi learned to keep quiet back in '86). Granted, this whole Afghanistan thing has got to be chewing up a lot of satellite space, but I really doubt it's eating *all* of it. Especially when you think about how many satellites are up there (Take the ones we know about, then double or triple to taste to count for the ones we don't)
I suspect that one of these choices is incorrect. Correct.
"Ah, here's an interesting little number... This is a live feed from a 'bunker buster' bomb. If there's a Mr. S.H. of Baghdad listening, call now to pledge $50 million or this little beauty will turn up on the front steps of your presidential palace..."
dan
Of course, this could all be avoided if he knew "how not to be seen..."
Let me clarify the lateral movement. It didn't seem like intended movement by a camera operator but unintended jitter.
The BBC is broadcasting the report on BBC News24
Live news stream hereThe report is being shown approx every hour
I think someone is going to be in trouble
well doesn't matter if it's broadcast to the world if it's in real video format, i mean c'mon how much info can be gleamed from a 20 pixel by 20pixel box?
ahh, the egg in the basket..
The article makes it clear in the first sentence: Nato surveillance flights in the Balkans are beaming their pictures over an insecure satellite link - and anyone can tune in and watch their operations live.
It's that old butter versus weapons argument again. Now let's see if the military needs bandwidth or anything else and I have to forgo in order for them to go... then I forgo. The US military didn't purchase their bandwidth from Enron did they?
"Academicians are more likely to share each other's toothbrush than each other's nomenclature."
Cohen
I think the other end is a plane or a sattelite or something, kinda hard to get a pc on one of those i think.
And what did the evil dewers say when they were able to tap into this? All your base are belong to us!
That's what they get for using WEP...
You: Senator, why did my tax money support terrorism?
Senator: I have no knowledge of that fact.
You: Is it not true that currently TV shows are running commercials claiming that drugs support terrorism?
Senator: That would be true.
You: Well, says that my taxes, taxes which you helped passed went to support Afgan freedom fighters who later became terrorist to us.
Senator: Umm.
You: Therefore if this is true, should I not stop paying taxes since they went to support terrorist?
Senator: umm... umm.. umm. Your un American!
Reserved Word.
Took forever to bring it up..
By Mark Urban
Newsnight's Diplomatic Editor
line
Nato surveillance flights in the Balkans are beaming their pictures over an insecure satellite link - and anyone can tune in and watch their operations live.
The discovery was made last November by John Locker, a satellite enthusiast in north west England.
Satellite enthusiast John Locker
John Locker tried to alert the US military
He told Newsnight that he spent months e-mailing and faxing US and other Allied military officers to warn them of the dangers before finally deciding to go public.
Our investigation produced responses from Nato and American spokesmen that the pictures were unclassified. They said they would reveal nothing of value to a potential enemy.
One officer even told me that the broadcasts contained no information about the position or types of aircraft conducting the surveillance missions.
Watch and learn
Having reviewed many hours of pictures from recent operations, I can say this is quite wrong.
Satellite image
The images contain a wealth of information
The symbols around the edge of the pictures show the aircrafts' position, altitude and heading. Omitting this information would make the broadcasts useless to Nato intelligence analysts.
What's more, regular watching of the satellite channels allows you to learn much about the technical capabilities of sophisticated spy planes like the P-3 Orion and unmanned drones such as the Hunter.
During broadcasts by these aircraft, the letters 'P-3' or 'Hunt' are helpfully included on the bottom of the picture.
I have seen some of these aircraft operating during my reporting from Balkan trouble spots, and would have assumed that the presence of aerial surveillance was usually revealed by the sound of an aircraft or drone overhead.
Reviewing the Nato footage, it is apparent though that planes like the P-3 can track a target from up to 20 miles away, through cloud, at night.
Why is this secret trap door open ? Since official spokesmen will not even concede there is a problem, it is hard to get them to discuss how it might have occurred.
New priority
Instead contacts suggest that the timing of the unencrypted pictures' first appearance, 11 November 2001 is significant.
America's response to the 11th September terrorist attacks was gearing up, and surveillance of Afghanistan began soaking up all the available military secure satellite channels.
The US military have not introduced encoding even of the type used by commercial broadcasters
Mark Urban
Shunting the Balkan operations onto an insecure transmission was a matter of priorities, say analysts. The problem is, that doing so endangers a whole host of Nato operations ranging from hunting for Radovan Karadzic to stopping Albanian guerrillas infiltrating into Macedonia.
It is surprising though that in all the months since John Locker started warning people that the signals could be pulled down by anyone using amateur equipment, the US military have not introduced encoding even of the type used by commercial broadcasters.
The military procurement bureaucracy apparently cannot come up with a set top decoding box quickly enough.
Who might be watching these transmissions, apart from retirees like Mr Locker ? Last month Nato raided two Bosnian Serb military installations, saying they were eavesdropping of the alliance's signals.
Those able to monitor the transmissions around the clock - like a military intelligence department or guerrilla group - will learn much from them.
At the very least the broadcasts allow a Karadzic or a smuggler to check before they step outside their front door whether any Nato surveillance aircraft are in the sky and what they are doing.
WATCH/LISTEN
ON THIS STORY
The BBC's Mark Urban
"A serious threat to Nato continues"
Newsnight
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Newsnight's diplomatic editor answers your questions on security breaches in NATO's military surveillance.
NATO security risk?
Just because you disagree doesn't make it offtopic or flamebait.
"Gee, Bob, ever since we started streaming those NATO satellite images over the web, our traffic has increased over 700%!"
..uh... think it means we'd better buy up m..m..mmore bandwidth... and pray the website doesn't go down."
"Hmm, looks like most of the traffic is coming from... Afghanistan, Serbia, Somalia, and Pakistan. In fact, that's where *all* of the traffic is coming from. What do you think it means, Phil?"
*Phil suddenly turns very pale and starts shaking and sweating*
"I
-- "Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else."
a government poll taken after the campaign against drugs using the "your supporting terrorism if you buy drugs" showed that the beginning stages of drug use had gone up 30%, not to mention our government shelled out over 2 billion dollars on the adds , paying for a professional director, and then airing them nonstop for several months. Maybe its me but i think its about time we legalized something
Righteousness postpones the inevitable
http://burningaureole.caveism.net
We ran an older story about the military's growing bandwidth crunch.
I guess if you get drafted it gives new meaning to the phrase "Will work for bandwidth?"
In college, really poor, need a flatscreen.
not anything to do with the plane. If you watch the news report, you'll have found out that it's the link sending the data back from the US to Europe for analysis.
Spy plane >> Military Satellite >> Virginia, USA >> Civilian Satellite >> Europe.
Of the four transmission paths (represented by a '>>'), the last two are unencrypted as they're leasing a civilian satellite. Put an (en/de)cryption PC at both ends, and it should be quite do-able.
>to stopping Albanian guerrillas infiltrating >into Macedonia.
Wait, you meant the same guerillas that the
CIA called the biggest and best armed terrorrist organization in the world? The ones the US trained and armed? The ones that the US bombed a country for 3-4 months non-stop (New Yorkers would have shit on themselves if there were exploding buildings for 3-4 months!)?
In case you missed it last summer (well, most of the Europe heard about it but the 'free' US press, when the Macedonian police surrounded a few hundred Albanian terrorist, the US flew into Macedonia with helicopters to airlift these trapped troops for 'supposedly' humanitarian reasons (interesting..i wonder if they have the same atittude towards AL Quaeda or is this just compassion for terrorrists who work/worked hand in hand with US forces) and flew them back to Kosovo.
Maybe the dozen US military 'observers' that were along with the Albanians had something to do with it|?
You have to forgive the Macedonians if they think that the War on Terrorism is full of shit
Of course this is the same government which is letting the Albanian drug lords still control 60-80% of europes heroin traffic.
Check out a map of yugoslavia,, then check up the American protectorate of Kosovo which is a small part of it. Youre gonna tell me that the US army is that pathetic that they cant keep taht small swath of land from being used as staging ground for terrorist attacks?
C'mon...you truly belive that BS?
And they said that the people who believe every word in Pravda were sheep. CNN'ers are much worse.
The Soviet peoples knew they were being lied to, you revel in your own ignorance.
I worked in satellite communications in the army for 8 years. This story is hard to believe. Everything I worked on in the Army was encrypted up to 3 different times before it was transmitted to the satellite. Even GI's phone calls to their wifes were encrypted. There was an bulk encryption stage after the voice to digital encoding/multiplexing. This stream was fed into a data multiplexer and multiplexed with incoming data circuits. The output of that multiplexer was encyrpted again. The other incoming data circuits were probably already encrypted when they got to us. This is all before anything is modulated so it's not like they can't encrypt the data because they are using civilian satellites.
It's either counter-intelligence stuff or just real stupid.
I've got a C-band dish... so where can these feeds be found? W4/24? C7/8?
--
I don't want to rule the world... I just want to be in charge of mayonnaise.
Maybe this is the C-SPAN for the military. 24/7 surveillance footage of Eruope!
So where's the NATO Wish List?
I wanna see the good stuff.
I think the government should pass a law that good folks who point out security vulnerabilities in the government's stuff get a huge reward... I'm talking something in the seven digit range, not including decimal places. It would be an amount like 3,001,526.72. (Kind of like the $271 fine for running a red light--why 271, as opposed to a round number?) Then, if you suggest how they might fix the problem, you get another 5 million or so (or a lifetime supply of Negra Modelo, at your option), even if they don't take your suggestion. And furthermore, if the vulnerability isn't fixed within 24 hours, you get an additional 10 million or so, and written permission to f*ck with the systems that contain the vulnerability, as a punishment to the government for its negligence.
Hey, the government punishes people when they do stuff against the government. It should punish itself for doing stuff against the people. That's only fair. This program would be given a short and coherent name like the the Government Computer Systems Security and Vulnerability Repair and Rewards Act.
Oooooooooooooooh well.
An acquaintence in NASA once told me all of the satellites he's worked on for NASA (3 of them at the time) were controlled via unencrypted communications. They felt secure with this "security through obscurity" because it's a little harder to actually transmit the commands up to the satellite than it is to simply put up a BUD and start listening to all the data streams out there.
Might this not be NATO trying to get into the entertainment industry?
(after all, how else can new members pay for their new defense expenditures?)
.
-
My hotel in Bangalore has the "worldwide" CNN and BBCNews, but they both loop after about an hour. I've seen this story about three times now with live footage. The worst part is that the footage also contains the aircraft's location. It's just silly that the live footage isn't encrypted at all. I mean, how hard could it be?
Of course, if it started to look like fighting was imminent, and the short term knowledge of what NATO saw or missed during yesterday's flight becomes dangerous information, then I would expect then I would expect NATO to secure the video feed, or perhaps even at any point when a few more fighting words than usual were emerging from Serbia.
What VCD group is encoding and releasing this? What's the quality? It's not on vcdquality.com for some reason.
So far I think Bush has done a good job on the American side of things when it comes to this current war on terrorism. He is keeping all live feeds out of the loop and not letting anyone know what is going to happen next which was his fathers mistake during Desert Storm.
Sun Tzu preached in all his teachings about war, that knowing your enemey and knowing yourself would result in countless victories. Yet these teachings seems to have been disregarded over the course of 2000 years. They are still legitimate.
If there is the potential of a leak or a security hole, there should be no denial of it but an active investigation on to why it is allowing this to happen. It is the equivalent to having a security hole in your OS yet denying its existence yet it seems to be getting taken advantage of. It is slow death. You can't let the enemy know what you are doing.
This just seems like a hard story to believe yet if true is beyond silly. Oh well, I am not a military leader, I just base this off common sense and a few books. (i.e. Sun Tzu's Art of War and the Art of War II)
~Char Lander
Brothers and sisters I have none, but this mans father is my fathers son
Satellites broadcast to anyone on their path, so anyone with a small budget and some spare time can toy around with them -but crypto is the hard part.
.wav for processing.
A beginner's shopping list:
- A PC-controlled ICOM PCR-1000 SSB receiver ($300)
- A turnstile or better, double-helix antenna ($150)
- Satellite tracking software to know when to listen (eg NovaWin from Northern Lights Software, $60)
- Frequency lists, grab them on the web.
Plug the receiver's audio out into your soundcard's audio in, and voila ! save transmissions as
http://www.gravitywell.org/ is a good example.
Have fun!
Denis the menace
The Goelette Project
Now that would be good tv.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
The video or though not visible on the streamcast but visible on my TV (BBC) are overlayed with a fine transparent Airscan text logo which a quick google turned turned up a "Airborne Surveillance Security" company based in Murrell Road, Rockledge, FLorida
presumably its their equipment/responsibility/fault as they seem to be a 3rd party contractor for the US Army/Security, below is taken from their About page
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
AirScan was created in 1989 to provide airborne surveillance security for US Air Force launch facilities. During seven years of surveillance missions, AirScan supported every mission on time. AirScan has in-depth knowledge of the space launch program and the vital service airborne surveillance provides in supporting this program. Sensor aircraft equipped with infrared, TV, LIDAR, and multispectral and hyperspectral sensors operated by experienced crews using innovative tactics combine to form a responsive, dedicated airborne surveillance operation. The result is proven capability based on operational expertise, thorough planning, and carefully chosen mission objectives.
Over the years, AirScan has greatly expanded its capabilities to perform a wide range of airborne surveillance missions. We are currently conducting surveillance and remote sensing missions in Africa, Europe, and throughout the US in support of diverse governmental and private projects. We also remain under contract to NASA and the US Air Force in support of the space and missile programs. AirScan is under contract to the National Response Corporation to respond to any major oil spill in US inland or coastal waters. We also conduct maritime surveillance, ground security, wildlife surveys, research and development, and aircraft modifications and systems integration.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
So is this their fault or the Armys or both ?
Now that gives new meaning to:
Suprise by the obvius
I supose that means big brother realy is waching
of course so is half the globe
if it were GPL'd we could stream it to, well almost any place realy
we cam anyone body or is the pure genius of the RIAA stoping you slashdoters again?
- If you buy drugs you're providing justification for the 'war on drugs'
- The 'war on drugs' has resulted in US money being paid directly to terrorist organisations in Columbia, Afghanistan and South America.
QED: If you buy drugs, you're supporting terrorisim. The conclusion is logically sound.455fe10422ca29c4933f95052b792ab2
This takes the cake, what a pack of ignorant fools they are.
Sure, I'm in a lot of crap with those people for merely wishing to maintain the illusion of privacy of private information, but if this isn't straight out of "Planet of the Apes", then I don't know what is.
Are these people in contact with their inner monkey, or just shaking about with it ?
- Kaos games and encryption systems developer
was here Google's Cache is still here.
UK Laptops
It makes absolutely no sense to talk about "secure communications bandwidth".
According to the guy they interviewed last night about this (someone from the US army), the planes send their surveillance to a ground station, which then sends the data to Virginia (?) via an encrypted link. The surveillance footage is analysed in Virginia, and then anything rated unclassified is sent back unencrypted; the implication being that anything rated classified is sent back encrypted.
Since (I guess) anything rated unclassified is probably available to anyone anyway, this means that this whole story is a storm in a teacup.
Weren't people told to grow hemp and marijuana to help with the war effort in WWI? Mind you, that was for ropes and clothes, you can't fight a war stoned... Hmmm, now there's an idea.
No suprises there then!
Previously in the Balkans, the Uk troops couldn't afford encrypted radios. The soultion to this was to employ troops from one on the Welsh regements as radio operators. They chatted away in the Welsh language as a means of "security".
Thus, the fact that NATO can't set up a secure sattelite link dosn't suprise me in the least!
Anyone quoted by a reporter knows how little they understand
Don't believe what you read is the truth.
could someone with a sat dish and a big pipe set up a stream of this? If they deny there is a problem, then they cant get mad if you setup live streams of it.
They are letting us see the Balkans so that people are less interested in seeing what's going on in Afghanistan. They've set up a honey pot. Or at the very least, they really want to hide what's going on in Afghanistan. I wonder what they consider the security threat model to be from a bunch of desert nomads with a lot of plastique and too much time on their hands?
Why bother.
Awww are you upset because I called you stupid. Maybe you should watch the video again to hear where they mention the airplanes over and over and over.
In Soviet Russia...michael would be rotting in Siberia!
Yeah, so let's help them out with that bandwidth crunch by /.ing their servers... :)
Nato broadcasting this stuff in the clear is proof that military intelligence is a contradiction. Their claim that the footage shows nothing the enemy can use is the kind of arrogance that causes the west to get caught with it's pants down every time terrorists strike.
How ya like dat?
This isn't any different than the Americans using the native Cherokee language during WW2 to throw off the Germans :)
I suspect that one of these choices is incorrect. Correct.
I wouldn't suppose Bush's ties to the oil industry (and thus Osama Bin Ladin) explained in detail in a recent issue of High Times magazine means that if you drive a gas-powered car you support terrorism...
2 billion dollars? I wish George "Dubbi" Bush would get a clue.
-EvilMonkeyNinja
Mild Mannered Host by Day
Wild Hammered Programmer by Night
Check this out: http://www.public-i.org/dtaweb/report.asp?ReportID =189&L1=10&L2=10&L3=0&L4=0&L5=0
:(
This site has stills and videos. Unfortunately I cannot get the videos to work. Looks like they may be some kind of Windows Media Player format
--Jon
I don't use Microsoft/Real products.. can someone convert/provide a link with another format? (MPG/AVI/etc)
Until someone can explain what use ariel photos of various parts of the Balkans are to our 'enemies' and who those enemies might be I'm going to assume that this isn't really classified information. This is a non-story. Ther is a wealth of non-encrypted information available by monitoring military transmissions. Also... anyone can order their own satellite pictures of the balkans from various private satellite companies.
Think about it. What better way to keep the peace than to prove that you're watching?
Dump the IRS - http://www.fairtax.org
If the USA not #1, then who is? China, EU, Russia?
Someone has to be #1.
Can you install Linux on it?
"The two most abundant elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity." -Harlan Ellison
Legalize terrorism? I'm game if you are...
First the barracks are coed
second the when I was in the army there wasn't a handful of wome I wanted to see naked (shudder)
Third In every barracks I ever lived in there was some sort of wierd jamming field in place that made it so that nothing wireless worked unless it was in the same room as the base. no radio, no pagers, no cordless phones, no....(etc)
I used to have a cool sig, back when I cared
The website of the guy who pulled these pictures out of the ether now has a black hat shoved really close to the lens :( http://www.satcom.freeserve.co.uk/
that's why we lost
you're supporting terrorism. If drugs weren't illegal, terrorists wouldn't be making money from it.
than one of the most effective way to win a war is: - to know your enemies and to give your enemies guided/controlled/manipulated/(all you can think about) informations
The Balkan's dog of war and his goons are sitting in a jail in Den Haag. A domestic government is chasing the rest of them. A domestic army is loyal to a new president who has no such genocidal, mad ideas like the prevouis one.. Who, in your opinion, exactly is the enemy in Balkans ? In newspapers read some articles sometimes, on political conditions over there. The war is over in Balkans, three years ago.
It was the Navaho, and they were used in the Pacific theater, not Europe. Their language is particular problematic to translate or learn.
"The Code Book" by Simon Singh has a good chapter about this.
I believe the Cherokee were considered but not used. The need in the Pacific theater was primarily for extremely rapid encryption of transmissions by forward air controllers for strikes, and for whatever reason this was not a tactical need in the European theater.