Slashdot Mirror
Anonymous Will Award $200,000 for Xbox Linux
An anonymous reader writes: "The X-box Linux Project at Sourceforge reports today that an anonymous donor will award nearly a quarter of a million dollars to the individuals responsible for the completion of a two-phased effort to run Linux on the Xbox. One can't help but wonder if this will help or hurt the community. On one hand, it is likely to generate additional interest in the project, on the other, some people may be less inclinded to share their discoveries with money on the line.
Then again, getting both Money and Glory sounds pretty good."
I pay you $50 to get Linux running on my TRS-80
The basic goal of the project is to find a simple and completely legal way to run Linux on the Microsoft Xbox.
Yes, and the basic goal of the MS XBox team will be to find any way possible to prevent it.
Sigs are out of style, so I'm not going to use one...oh wait..
Two hundred g's??? if only i could afford the 200 hundred bucks for an xbox.....damn college. :)
/me wonders why they're annonymous?
PS: I don't reply to ACs.
is $200,000 going to be enough for legal expenses when you accept the prize and Microsoft comes at you with all their legal guns ablazing?
xavii aka bob
Reading the press release: a hundred grand is for a distribution of Linux for a modified X-Box, and another hundred grand for doing it to a stock console.
Second, assuming someone succeeds, a large cash infusion has proved to be the downfall of many Linux companies. Roger Stallman was right, money is the "root" (ha!) of all evil, just look at companies like RedHat and VA Linux Something.
Third, even if they succeed and no one is killed in the process, what possible use could Linux be on an XBox? I heard they use some kind of proprietary game format that Linux won't be able to read anyway. "DVD" or something.
If it wasn't anonymous, I would say it was Larry Ellison. He's known for stunts like this, but usually he does everything he can to pull his name into it. Of course, if it wasn't anonymous, we'd know who it was anyway.
I bet's it's just some geek who got lucky and sold his stock before everything went bust.
Although, consider the option of someone looking to take advantage of MS's deep loss on each of these things and build a giant cluster at a fraction of the market price.
-Pete
Soccer Goal Plans
the anonymous donor, obviously Bill Gates. Now who is least likely to buy X-Boxes? Linux users/MS haters.... and now who will be snatching them up? Linux users who want 200 thousand dollars. And at the next meeting with game companies, they have a much larger apparent user base.... And it's all pointless, the 'legal' makes it impossible, I'm sure somewhere in the EULA for the X-Box it says 'by purchasing this product you agree to never ever run linux on it or else you will forfeit all your money and your first born child.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
-- Ken Kinder ken@_nospam_kenkinder.com http://kenkinder.com/
... if he/she purchased 1000 XBoxes and used them for something that would normally require a $400 Intel based computer.
Xboxes are are priced at $200, but really contain the guts of a typical $450 PC.
A cluster of 1000 Xboxes would be mighty cheap computing power.
Moneyed corporations, non-working 'poor' and criminal prisoners are turning productive citizens into tax-slaves.
Okay $200k is a hell of a lot; and we all know that MS loses money on every X-Box sale. A viable alternative development platform would hurt MS. This means it's somebody well-established (rich!) in the industry with a score to settle with Microsoft? Or a games company that wants to open up development for what I understand is a cheap PC platform without paying MS tax? Maybe even a potential coup by Sony or Nintendo? Completely intriguing; maybe we could have a sweepstake on who we think this anonymous donor is...
Matthew @ Bytemark Hosting
maybe this is a firmware competitor? maybe next year sony releases an x-box OS based on linux with lots of whiz-bang features to try to get people to switch.
sure, i might be reaching but it's still possible...
$200,000 from him if you can run linux on it, but them MS will probably pay you $400,000 to keep it hush.
Right now, "underground" work on consoles is fairly open. Whenever "closed" hardware and firmware gets reverse-engineered, the results are typically documented and shared among like-minded developers. Won't the $200K reward encourage greedy developers to hide their work and end up reducing the amount of sharing that goes on? In the end, this would hinder efforts to open up the Xbox. I wouldn't be suprised if MS was behind this "reward" :)
Slashdot: come for the pedantry, stay for the condescension.
sigh... i guess 1/5 of a million dollars just don't have that "zing" or "cha-chin!" to it...
hell... this is why we have enron scandals... 50 grand short and we are calling it "nearly"
My life in the land of the rising sun.
Ok, the Xbox-Linux team knows who the donor is. It says that clearly in the site that the donor is known to them.
Do you think they would partner up with Microsoft for it? I don't... but then again, that's just my thoughts..
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
I'd like to see that cash in escrow before I believed anything this "anonymous" donor said.
With an Xbox at $199, a bewolf Linux cluster of a truckload of these could be a huge slap in the face to Microsoft. Forget the cluster, the XBox with custom software I am sure could make some rockin broadcast quality graphics for next to nothing.
This anonymous thing could just be a big ploy to get even more publicity when the generous person or company is revealed. I was posting earier this might be Larry Ellison, if it were not anonymous...it's his style, but I would expect the money to be more. It could be him, and want the more publicity angle.
It could also be to shield the person from legal attack until after the goose is already cooked, so to speak.
-Pete
(above amazon link is an affiliate link...for full discloseure)
Soccer Goal Plans
And someone wanted to convince me that there is no money to be made with free software.
Note that the reward isn't all-or-nothing - it's partitioned into five distinct tasks, in two separate porjects. That also means that different people can claim the prize money for each task. If two groups solve the same problem, the "better" solution gets all the money.
Project A:
Task 1: Replacement BIOS - $55,000
Task 2: Kernel and XFree drivers
- 25,000
Task 3: Kernel logic: FATX and miscellaneous - 10,000
Task 4: XBE bootloader $10,000
Project B:
Run unsigned code on an Xbox without any hardware modification - $100,000
This is just some speculation on my part. But let's face it, it does make a little sense.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
even the "Full Software" implementation route allows for the use of a mod chip that will let the XBox read unsigned code.
The hardware modification route goes WAAAY beyond soldering 29 wires or whatever... like replacing the bios and stuff.
Whoever stated that signature sizes should be limited to one hundred and twenty characters can just go ahead and kiss my
The fine folks at Indrema pooled all the VC money they hid in the closet. A set-top Linux-based game console will come at last!
Or somthing. Maby I'm still bitter 'cause I bought an Atari Jaguar.
Moneyed corporations, non-working 'poor' and criminal prisoners are turning productive citizens into tax-slaves.
In light of the slick ps2linux kit (which for me, works great) where's the huge market in Xbox Linux?
There's a lot more ps2's out there and I don't see Sony going after what would have to be a $5mil market to make paying $200K worth it.
With the Sony kit, you drop 200 bucks and Akio's your uncle. And it's even without the obvious market delays that the M$ lawyers would bring.
But it's not exactly a hot item for Sony. Very, very niche sales numbers.
Maybe back a few years ago when money didn't care where it went, $200k was no big thing, but today?
Why the fuss? Because it's a x86?
I smell a fish.
nearly a quarter of a million, or exactly a fifth of a million? you be the judge.
Instead of Microsoft preventing this, they may want to quietly encourage this. If you look at it from the marketing standpoint, once this gets developed, it will most certainly boost Xbox (or as I call it, suXbox) sales to us nerds who want to install Linux on it.
/.
Although if the rumors are true and they lose a buttload of money on it, maybe they'll get extra game sales or even get some new game developers
I can just picture everybody racing to get the first "Web server run from Xbox!" headline on
There are only 10 kinds of people in this world... those who understand binary and those who don't
Now that would be a horrible fate: being forced to work in a job where you can only use a MS machine with MS development tools. I feel nauseous just thinking about it. Ok, back to my vi window...
I know i know, far fetched consipracy theory -- but at least hear me out here:
first of all -- why did SONY release a linux kit? I mean, people might say "oh yeah there is a community for it" or "there is a demand for it." i disagree. we know that SONY makes no money on the kits -- they don't expect to sell that many, definitely not enough to recover the man-hours poured into it; so even if the kit itself, hardware wise, makes them a few bux, overall it's a losing proposition. especially considering it's a custom chip, so that's a LOT of coding and debugging to get the thing working.
however, what it DOES do is on all fronts kill any reason you might have to own a mod chip. i mean, every argument you throw their way withers away when there is a linux kit. you want to do home-brew software? sure -- get a linux kit. you want to learn how PS2 works b/c you are a enthusiest (sp?) ? -- get a linux kit. etc etc. From now on, whenever they crack down on mod chip suppliers, we as consumers will have no argument toward them, morally or in court, because all the legitimate uses of the mod chip has been covered already.
now back to M$. we know M$ loses more money per box than sony on the consoles. and when the mod chip business REALLY opens up (like for the PS1), oh boy will we see some profit figures bleed. They are already starting to legally crack down on mod-chip teams, and before they go-to court, it would be really nice for them to have some arguments (like sony above) lined up.
to do this "contest" thing would cost them chump change (200k max) -- versus getting their highly compensated programmers on this -- most probabbly knows little in the ways of LINUX anyhow. note the last part said "no hardware mods"... hmmmm....
again, just conspiracy theory here; but you have to admit -- there might be some very valid reason M$ would want to do this.
My life in the land of the rising sun.
He's still pissed about the whole GUI thing... Is that funny to everyone, or just me?
Business News and Resources: www.usasource.net
1. Microsoft loses money per machine.
2. If the BIOS was flashed, you wouldn't be able to run any XBox content on it. So no games network.
3. What developer licenses? That's the whole point of circumventing the OS on it.
My bet comes down to two possibilities. Geek (Or geeks) who want to kick MS around for a little bit, or a competitor that simply wants to see Microsoft lose money like Sony. I kinda doubt Sony would go that low, even if I do think its a great idea.
My own pointless vanity vintage computing page
i wonder WHO would give someone $200,000 to crack the MICROSOFT xbox that has MONEY, and an INTEREST IN THE XBOX... maybe HE wants to build a better xbox2 ?
Runnin' On Empty
But then my buddy Steve put in another 100k.
Good luck,
Larry E.
The whole project is divided into two sub-projects, the first one consisting of four tasks.
Project A: Porting Linux to a modified Xbox:
Task 1: Replacement BIOS (software/hardware)
Task 2: Kernel and XFree drivers
Task 3: Kernel logic: FATX and miscellaneous
Task 4: XBE bootloader
Project B: Xbox hack without any hardware modification
A total of US$ 100,000 will be awarded for the completion of each of the two projects.
Well, I hope someone can do this, it would be very interesting to see, but I don't get how they can do all of this 'legally' as the anonymous donor wishes. To complete project b, are going to need to find out how the Digital Rights Management (tm) system works on the Xbox, and that would violate the DMCA as far as I know, but im no lawyer. I hope they clear that up soon, unless they expect this person to deal with microsoft lawyers to license DRM somehow, but i doubt they can if they have to disclose the reason why they want to license the technology.
Best of luck to all those capable of doing this though.
I still think that =\
Attack its weak point for massive damage!
I'm sure there are people at MS who know enough about the device to do this. And since they probably make $45k a year plus stock options (which are in the toilet right now), there's probably a high probability that an MS developer is going to claim some of that cash, especially if he's able to remain anonymous.
Need Free Juniper/NetScreen Support? JuniperForum
This person hasn't heard of RentACoder.com. Ex silicon valley
hackers have relocated to Bangalore India and are now taking massive devlopment projects for 65 cents.
I have been monitoring the site for quite a while, I want someone to port my
classic DOOMs to the PDA and no one showed up to take the job except for some
newbie called jcarmack. I will probably pay him the 70 cents he is asking for
just to give him a shot, no one else shows up.
And yes, my fur carpet is 100% coder skin, we hunted that from Java-ONE.
YEah, they should've just said:
Whew, fourteen seventieths, that's SOME SERIOUS DOSH! Personally, I'd settle for a mere three twenty-sevenths.
And as soon as you submit your code, you see it on KaZaa the next day with the file description, "The check is in the mail"...
A cluster of 1000 Xboxes would be mighty cheap computing power.
I'm too lazy to actually calculate this, but I have to wonder about the $$ feasibility of an XBox cluster. Okay, I could believe it's a better value to hack an XBox than to buy a PC for gaming, if you don't take future upgrades into account. (GeForce 6's and Radeon 12000's probably won't have a USB or ethernet interface; just a guess.)
But if you want to make the ubiquitous Beowulf cluster of XBoxen to crunch numbers, is it really more cost effective? Even if someone figures out how to put Linux on there without a hardware mod, you need to consider that the graphics and sound capabilities built-in won't be used in the cluster.
Don't compare an XBox cluster to a cluster of Linux gaming machines but to a cluster of bare-bones dual-cpu boxen or rackmount servers with no or minimal video, sound and i/o capability. Plus compare the power consumption, cooling and space requrements of the two since this becomes nontrivial with a cluster.
Plus, who with such high number-crunching needs would put up with the dearth of hardware support for Linux on XBox. You can't just swap out a motherboard, power supply or ethernet card on those puppies, at least not as easily as a desktop, tower or rack PC.
I don't think an XBox cluster is reasonably feasible beyond the geek in me saying "that's so cool that someone did that!" However for us Linux geeks and gamers I'd love to have Linux on XBoxes. (Not necessarily to own one, before you Linux Dreamcasters jump on me.)
It can be done. It's already running a stripped down version of Windows 2000, as an MS engineer mentions in his "Inside the XBOX Launch" talk here: http://www.technetcast.com/tnc_play_stream.html?st ream_id=666
Fill your hard drive with music, movies and pictures while you sleep.
Athlon XP 2000 - 150$
Cheap mobo with etherent 100$
128MB DDR SDRAM - 25$
Case and PSU - 50$
8GB HDD - 75$
----------
Total 400$
Yep, it's twice as expensive. But in a clusternode it's usually the the CPU that counts and XP2000 is 2-3 times faster than what is in an X-Box. A cluster node doesn't need a DVD drive or a top of the line Gforce4. You may not even need the harddistk. With 200,000$ you can get 500 nodes like this, or a linux distribution that boots on X-Box - but you still need to buy the 1000 X-Boxen to run that distro for another 200,000$. And of course 6 months from now the the Athlon config will be ~50$ cheaper, while the X-Box is steady at 200$.
I bet that any Microsoft dev with knowledge of the BIOS would find these tasks trivial. Place $200K in front of one of the devs, and it'd be interesting whether they may "creatively" find ways to solve all these tasks.
I thought it was that guy named C. Taco.
You say things that offend me and I can deal with it. Can you?
...given Sun's dedication to making life hard for Microsoft at any price. $200k will be a lot cheaper than StarOffice was, and will be hit-for-hit value against MS when only about the 3000th Linuxified XBox hits the streets, given how much MS are losing on each one.
They'd make Xcellent LTSP terminals, with splendid graphics and more than enough RAM. You'd need to pay for a mouse, keyboard and mod chip for each, but they'd still be cheap.
And since `Linux is for people who hate Microsoft,' the value in unhelping MS with each sale can't be overlooked. (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
I spent a year in Iraq looking for WMD and all I found was this lousy sig.
I've had Mandrake 8.2 running perfectly happy on, oddly enough, a Dell 8100 _and_ a Dell 7500. I didn't have use for IR, but the code _is_ in there. The 8100 was deleriously happy playing 3D games, but the built-in speakers, as you might expect, aren't much chop.
Conclusion: the original poster is a troll. Can we moderate him down to -5, clueless wonder?
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
It's low if it's a competitor. That's a shitty business tactic... which Sony likes to pull on its customers. It's a great idea if it's a consumer. A geek. Someone in the computer world who wants to give a push to the only way the community has to slap MS in the face. There's only one Sony, and there're lots of people out there who want to see this happen. I think it's a geek.
I spent a year in Iraq looking for WMD and all I found was this lousy sig.
...the girlfriend's dad with the sense of humour.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
I'd rather see FreeBSD on it, I wonder if that
would be worth any money.
'Coz I can do it the other way around fairly easily...
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Since Linux for XBOX isn't going to run without defeating Microsoft's security one way or another, you're talking about a DMCA infraction for which the $200k donor becomes an an accomplice, at the very least...
I predict some bumps in the road of this plan!
That's almost a {0r73r #17710n $, isn't it?
I spent a year in Iraq looking for WMD and all I found was this lousy sig.
Y'know, it sounds a lot like something Larry Ellison would do. Not because he'd stand to benefit from any success, but more likely just because it would irritate Gates. After all, these people dig around in each others' garbage, for pete's sake. They're not in it for the money anymore, they're in it for the game.
It's a game. It's just a game. And this stunt is not much more than the infield heckling the batter in a ball game.
THIS again? I've got karma to burn so why not. He who writes the code chooses the license. Get over it. Don't like GPLed code? Don't use it. There are strings attached to commercial SDKs and libraries that are far more obnoxious than the GPL. And I don't see you charging any of Microsoft's windmills.
Most of us here are fully capable of seeing when the GPL is appropriate and when it isn't. For that matter, many of us don't give a crap about RMS' polemics either. The GPL is an often useful tool. Yes it is for some people. Get over it. The last time I checked, I didn't start hemorraging internally the last time I fired up a shell linked against readline. So much for the viral thing.
And no whinging about how it hurts somebody's development business. That is sooo annoying. Any idiot who can't be bothered to read COPYING should be canned anyway. You want the functionality of some GPLed code? Don't like the terms? Tough. Find or write a replacement. This is no worse than the terms on the commercial code you seem so concerned about.
Oh yeah, in case anybody missed it. Not all GPLed code is owned or controlled by the FSF. The GPL lends itself to agendas other than theirs. So spare us the stuff about RMS' integrity or lack thereof. It's a non-issue when one chooses a licence whose properties are certainly well understood by now.
As for that hurt coming to Linux you're so pleased about, do you think that if Microsoft somehow succeeds in driving a stake through Linux' heart that it will cause a migration to BSD code? I doubt it. Once Microsoft scavenges all of the BSD code they have a use for, that development model will be targeted next. That's right. Once target numero uno is taken out (if they can that is), they will come for BSD. Better watch out for the frag damage. Sheesh! RMS is justifiably a target of derision. You don't have to be as well.
Oh yeah, the main point of all this. He who writes the code chooses the license. Licences are merely tools. Can we expect polemics against chainsaws just becuase some psychotics like the mess they can make?
Perfect, I can see the headlines now:
1. Open Source community ports Linux to Xbox
2. Gartner reports that actually over 10% of Xboxen sold are used by individuals and companies who install and run linux on them.
3. Microsoft cries foul play, DMCA is brought down upon the porting team.
4. The "Anonymous Donor" of the prize money is rumoured to be some terrorist organization......
5. Microsoft then touts the importance of "Paladium" to root out all evil in the world.....
We are doomed.....
Real men don't need signitures!!!
Why does anyone care?
Let alone care enough to spend $200,000 on it?
If they lose $200 and they sell it for $199 dollars, it costs them 199 +200 = $499 to build it.
That's a really weird way of saying $200,000: "nearly a quarter of a million dollar"
Damn the hard drive marketing folks. If you figure 1024 rather than 1000, it comes much closer...
+++ UGUCAUCGUAUUUCU
The above post is an editorial, the poster cannot and will not be held responsible for all or in part for it's contents
Here's the real story...
In the year 2003, the Microsoft empire begins its downfall. Amongst the world
begins a separatist action that forms an alliance in an attempt to destroy
the Microsoft world once and for all. Headed by the leaders of open source
community, the alliance begins to lure the povs into using free software.
Companies begin to get tempted into the idea and sign off contracts with
Microsoft.
The ruthless Lord Gates has foreseen these events. Being the student of the
evil Senator Pulpentine, Lord Gates creates a dark force across the alliance.
In 2002, he anonymously puts out a $200,000 reward for anyone who completes
the quest to run Linux on his empire's Xbox. The alliance named this generous
rewarder of money Sir BiG. It was through a secret company
that Sir BiG had established to create Open Source software. A company that directly
competed with Microsoft. A company that supported the initiatives of Mozilla
and OpenOffice. It was one hell of a company, yet was so quiet amongst the
alliance. Its purpose was to wreek havoc amongst the alliance and bring back the
Microsoft order that once was.
With the lack of understanding of the trap, the alliance's strongest
programmers enter the quest. Slowly they managed to crack open the doors of
this Xbox machine.
Knowing what is about to come, Lord Gates orders Senator Balmer to begin
creating an army of clones for Microsoft. The army was a new strand of the
Xbox, but seemed like an exact replica of the original machine. It was named
the Xbox v1.0001.fucklinux internally at Microsoft. The machine was capable
of detecting unsigned MS operating systems and M-O-D (modification of darth-X)
on it. When this happened, the Xbox v1.0001.fucklinux would signal to
MS coporation through its embedded encrypted wireless adapter - hidden so
deep that no alliance member knew about.
The alliance members finally finished hacking the Xbox and posted their results.Sir BiG generously pays the reward to the great hacker that is, Jedi Fuxnix.
Seeing Fuxnix as a potential threat, Lord Gates tempts him to become a Council
member of the order with the other great Jedis who sit there. Fuxnix finally
agreed after seeing all the money that Lord Gates was raking in.
After this time, the alliance runs in to chaos. They had all by now seen an
Xbox running Linux and began buying themselves their own Xboxes just to run
Linux. Little did they know that these were fucklinux models. Sir BiG's company
finally reveals itself, but is sued by Microsft for MegaMillions. The alliance
members began to get sued one by one by the evil Microsoft Empire. Members
began fearing the dark force, not knowing what to do they discarded their
greatest weapon of all time - their PC - and ran out to buy Xbox games just
to avoid legal action.
Lord Gates looked upon the world and laughed and laughed, . He had brought
back the power of Microsoft and forced all geeks to use Xboxes with legit
Xbox games. Microsoft finally is able to reap profit from the Xbox and bring
itself back to forefront of the commercial enterprise. Sir BiG was never to be
heard of from that day, but Lord Gates wasn't upset at losing that position.
It was well worth the effort. He looks at his minions and says, "we shall
continue the order with Xbox fucklinux 2"...
These things usually don't come from mass projects, rather just some guy, releasing working code in the middle of the night, so the 'hoard' effect of a cash prize won't hurt.
;-)
Just look at the X-Box emulator
Seriously, though, a cash prize will just serve to encourage things like the emulator fiasco.
-twb
I know this sounds a bit stupid, considering it was awful generous of the donor to give that large a sum of money to this project. However, who is -really- going to care about Linux running on an Xbox? A few people may, but in my opinion, that's not enough to give $200,000 for. Why didn't this person/group of people donate the money to the actual Linux development project? Why don't they use the money to make the operating system better, instead of trying to get it to run on a game console?
I for one, don't care at all for this project. Attempting to run operating systems on game consoles sounds like a hobby, not a career. It is something geeks do with their free time, and they shouldn't be given $200,000 for it.
Just my rant.
void women (int money, time_t time);
No, no, the XBOX looks nothing like that, it's more like:
P-III 750 - $60
N-force mobo - $70
GForce3 Ti 500 - $250
64mb SDRAM - $10
8GB HDD - $75
the prices are made up, but thats pretty much the xbox, also one should concider the possibility that the gforce could also be used to crunch some numbers, sort of like a really fast MMX.
-Jon
this is my sig.
Recently, Richard snuck an exemption into version 3.0a of the GPL which allows Roger to continue using GPL'ed code as if it were a BSD license. The caused quite a stirr amongst the insiders in the Free Software GNUvement and Richard nearly lost not only the FSF position but maintainership of EMACS.
And, most recently, Roger has again slapped Richard in the face with his friendship with Eric Raymond, which blossomed as the pair worked on CLM2 in preparation for final submission to Linus.
-- @rjamestaylor on Ello
Its just a matter of reverse engineering the ROM & reformating the hardrives (who's got a PC caddie setup?)
I'd have as a guess that standard Linux (X86) NForce chipset drivers for Nvidia's EV6 (Athlon) NForce chipset would work fine for the XBox's GTL+ (P6) NForce chipset. Just like VIA's 4in1 drivers & VIA's embadded graphics drivers work with all VIA SS7 (P5, 686, K6), GTL+ (P6,C3), EV6 (K7, ie Duron, Athlon) & Netburst (P7 aka the 'P4') boards.
Plus, I gather, the XBox joystick ports are just USB with a different plug.
I can see the donar being one of two people:
A very anti-Microsoft person.
This person figures that if you can make the X-Box run Linux, then you can get people to buy X-Boxes at the rediculous price that MS have set for them. This will hurt Microsoft in the short term.
A very pro-Miscrosoft person.
This person figures that if you can make the X-Box run Linux, then you can get people to buy X-Boxes at the rediculous price that MS have set for them. This will help Microsoft in the long term.
The problem as I see it is that I can't decide who is right.
What if the cluster is used to composite images.
I'm not sure what you mean. Do you mean something like a 3x3 arrangement of 27" TV's set up to make one big picture?
If you're proposing using 1 XBox per TV for such a display using 3D rendering I think you'd need to have the master 3D model on one box, thereby using only one XBox CPU for real-time modelling (of course all GPU's would be jammin'); I can't imagine offhand how to implement a distributed 3D model and distributed display, or even if that's possible that the inter-XBox communication would be fast enough. Without the need for a mod chip and with using real-time high-performance 3D rendering I might imagine this working out cheaper than PC's with high-end 3D cards. (Not counting if you grab used PII's with AGP motherboards.)
However, if you're just using such an array for a 2D display I would imagine--since I'm too lazy to investigate--there exists a VGA-to-NTSC adapter that would drive a TV array from a video card, and I would suspect that it would be cheaper than 1 XBox per TV. (9 Xbox * $200 = $1800. Throw in hub and network & power cabling.) Add PC's, dual-head card or 2nd video cards as needed to scale up.
I'm not sure what else you might mean by "composite images." I was imagining a collage or blend of some sort, but that can be done before feeding it to a display adapter [array].
Nevertheless, to do it with XBoxes would be a geeky cool achievement if not necessarily "the best way".
I'm curious about your project. Do you have a link or description?
The anonymous donor is Microsoft. The $200k isn't a reward per se, but the price they're offering to the first devleoper of the kernel for exclusive licensing rights. This is actually an attempt at an end-run around the Linux community, where they'll sue anybody else out of existance for "obviously reverse-engineering" Microsoft's kernel. They expect to make the money back and then some in these lawsuits.
Will they actually release the code? Only in some impossibly handicapped form that won't let you do much more than play Minesweeper. And five pages of fine print.
http://www.xboxhacker.net/
The BIOS hacking forums there is a focus of efforts to reverse-engineer the X-Box for the purpose of allowing Linux to run on it.
In the last few weeks we have successfully recovered the RC4 key used to encrypt the second bootloader in the BIOS, this has led to discoveries about the PIC chip that have allowed a minimal clean BIOS to run for the first time.
I also run a site at http://warmcat.com/milksop which has a variety of GPL hardware designs that are of use in getting the X-Box to run Linux (although they have many other applications).
On the prize, I worry it will change the ethos of people working towards this goal, which until now has shown the best side of people with a common, righteous purpose working together.
Two different brain processes decide they want to solve the problem. One decides to round 199 up to 200, add the two numbers, then subtract 1. the other recognizes that the 100's position is the only position that need any work done... They get in a fight and hillarity ensues.
I've used IR on other laptops and desktops, no worries. If by `dual head' you mean flatscreen and external monitor at once, yes, it worked the once I tried it. I've used wireless on a variety of laptops and seen no problems.
My USB works better than under Windows. I plug my Sony DSC-F707 in, Linux sees it, sucks out the pictures, and scrubs the camera all automagically. No DLL and system conflicts, no bluescreens, not even any keys to hit, never dropped the ball.
Considering how hard Dell and co strive to make things non-standard and incompatible, this is pretty amazing. Especially so since nobody in the Linux community is holding a legal or financial gun to Dell's head and saying `it better work' like Microsoft do one way or another.
Yes: clueless wonder.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
But I say `wait and see.' (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Sounds like a Bushism to me...
If you're cheap enough to use an XBox, you'd use chopped-down COTS before you bought Sun.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Think it through people. Independent game devs are reported to be paying $10 per shipped game in royalties for games developed with the the official XDK. There is plenty of settled case law saying you CAN release a title without paying up and that you can break any obstacles the console vendor throws up, including adding the trademarked Nintindo logo if it is required to get the machine to execute your code. Since it IS settled case law I can think of a few game shops who might be tempted to add that $10 to their bottom line instead of Microsoft. A $200K inventment goes into the black when unit #20,000 of the first title goes out the door, which will be in the initial production run.
Wanna bet BioWare had a secret reason for doing a Linux port of Neverwinter Nights? Or if not them there are a dozen or so equally good suspects. It probably isn't a huge shop that does a lot of console biz though. Screwing M$ out of their royalties would scare Sony & Nintendo that they might be next so there is enough risk that I'd doubt it is somebody on the scale of EA and such.
The big shops need the good relationship with the hardware vendors as new hardware comes down the pipe.
Democrat delenda est
Who wins from this? Here is my educated guess...
Some people have suggested "Microsoft"; others have suggested "Larry Ellison"; still others have suggested various X-Box competitors, based on the idea that the hardware retails for $200 but has a COGS of $350 (are you ready to spend 1.3 times $X just to cost Microsoft $X?).
Microsoft is right out; discrediting their digital rights management scheme in place in the X-Box would be bad news for them; success in phase "B" of the project does just that.
Larry is a good guess... the deadline date is obviously there so that this can be claimed against a tax bill. But as has been pointed out, Larry is unlikely to be anonymous on purpose.
The X-Box competitor angle is also a red herring, do to the economics of trying to outspend Microsoft, at a sub-1 (.75) value multiplier for each dollar spent.
A good option might be someone competing with Microsoft for the Digital Rights Management pie. This is actually not that likely: eventually, if it works out to have value for this purpose, the hand signing the checks will become public knowledge. A failure of Microsoft in this arena will also tar anyone else trying to enter that market with the same brush of impossibility. So that dog won't hunt.
So what's left?
My odds-on favorite for this is... drumroll, please... hidden in the rule:
"To be honored, work must be submitted to the
"xbox-linux" project at Sourceforge. It is not
enough to publish information/code somewhere
else. We want people to work together, so
there has to be a central point where all work
concentrates."
That's right... Sourceforge. They get to prove that their site "works" for creating and maintaining a successful, highly visible Open Source project. They get a lot of geeks trained up on using it, and they get press release rights, among "other valuable considerations".
Remember: you heard it here first.
-- Terry
Is it just me or does this sound suspicious?
Perhaps this anonymous doner is someone planted my Microsoft.
Then when the people come forward to claim their price Microsoft slaps them with a suit.
Either that or offers them a job.
Leaving aside my disagreement with your view of the GPL, which I think sometimes is just purposefully wrong-headed, your post still doesn't make much sense.
Microsoft's motives in this matter will be entirely about how much this project can hurt their own bottom line. They may *act* as though software can't ever get written without a financial incentive, but we all know better. If a volunteer, unpaid effort started to get close, you *know* they would be just as hostile to it.
And although they can certainly adopt technical counter-measures, legal ones are unlikely to be effective. Prize or no prize, once the code is out there, they can't make it go away.
Your second paragraph is just a non-sequitur. Assuming there is some "cause of Linux" that can be hurt (which I don't myself perceive, any more than I see a "crusade of screwdrivers" or a "jihad of pencils"), it can't be hurt by providing it with resources, a big fat unpopular target and the chance of notoriety.
(The advocates of Linux that *you* seem to be thinking about will still count it a victory even if all you can get on the Xbox is a bash prompt and the developers end up in jail.)
-- What do you need?
-- Gnus. Lots of Gnus.
10 print "booting leuk_he/linux ont trs80 Model A"
20 print "No HD detected"
30 print "No FD detected"
40 print "entering runlevel 0"
50 print "starting lsh"
60 print #
70 read b
80 goto 60
I donate this program to open source.
In decending order of likelyhood:
a) Hoax.
b) Crazed flaming libertarian (John Gilmore?), who sees XBox as a dry run for Palladium and wants to establish a precident and/or scare vendors off from trusting it.
c) Crazed MS-hater who wants XBoxen sold below cost. (Ellison?)
d) Insane conspiracy theory. (M$. Sony. NSA).
Any other possibilities?
Ooooh, that's a good one. Yeah, you right. Didn't such a break happen for one of the older Nitindo consoles?
...to my very first non-anonymous /. post: a conspiracy theory with BillG held captive by a Ballmer-Myhrvold-led cabal.
And now I'm stuck with a nick which nobody can understand except in about every 100 posts (like this one!).
Thanks, I needed that.
Eternal vigilance only works if you look in every direction.
In other words, they'll still lose $125 per box, but they'll make it up on volume.
(And yes, I know it's an old joke.)
GPU's are designed to render, rotate, etc. polygon models with bitmap skins, "tactile" textures, light, shadow and fog in real time. I'm not sure offhand if you can actually get the results of their mathematical calculations directly.
>>>>>>>>>
Not any more. These newfangled GPUs are programmable, so you can write some code for the vertex and pixel shaders that does arbitrary calculations.
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...