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Cell Numbers To Be Added To 411
darthC0der writes "Looking for a friend but don't have her phone number with you? For now, you can call directory assistance for her home number, but her wireless digits are off limits from 411. Not for long. The cellular providers are now getting close to making the cellluar numbers available to 411 callers. Here's the link to a CNN article. I don't about you guys but I personally do not want my cellular number to be made available so easily."
The only number telemarketers can't call me at. The article says telemarketers will be banned, but they are one industry I don't trust.
I think cellular phone users should be required to display their cell numbers on a bumper sticker on their cars so I can call them and tell them how shitty they drive when they cut me off on the Dan Ryan. It would be a nice release for those road rage emotions, don't you think?
What's that sound?
It's the sound of billions of trees crying.
Je t'aime Stéphanie
One of the nicest things about having a cell is that only the people I give my number to have my number. They say telemarketers wouldn't get their hands on the numbers, but how long would it take before they paid someone off or obtained the list by some other not quite proper way?
I'll just have to stop answering this phone, too...
Jeremy Baumgartner
But where I am, this has been do-able for quite some time. It's actually an optional service for which the cellular provider here (yes, that's singular) charges the customer, to the tune of (iirc) $6.95 cdn PER MONTH. I work for a retailer that activates phones for the cell provider in my region, and I can't remember a single instance in which a customer actually wanted this feature.
It says, on the third paragraph down:
The centralized database of wireless numbers would be off limits to telemarketers, and consumers would be able to choose whether to have their numbers listed or unlisted, according to people familiar with the process.
I think the above makes their intentions clear
>Looking for a friend by don't have her number with you?
No actually, not. My mom maybe.
family situations? there are 4 of us on one account, all going to onw name. the head of that account is not going to be obvious to all who are searching for you. how do they plan on getting around that....or do they at all?
xao
xao
http://TheHillforum.hopto.org
i don't really mind if i'm listed on 411. having switched from my home phone to cell to avoid telemarketers, i would like for others to be able to get in touch with me without telling them my new number one by one. as long as there are laws in place for telemarketers to not be able to spam me with more crap on my cell phone.
Since cell phone companies won't let you keep your number when you switch providors, this will cause much confusion. It will thus be very hard to keep the directory up to date.
So does this mean that I have to now pay a per-minute charge for telemarketers? Who is liable for all the lost minutes that will accumulate? Also, does this mean text messaging will get even more spam filled? It seams that with this, marketing will actually cost consumers, I hope this isn't just the first in a long line of consumer-paid-for advertising. Also, I expect a lawsuit over this, once it's too late.
>I personally do not want my cellular number to be made available so easily.
Which is why the cellular carriers will probably let you classify your cellphone number as unlisted/unpublished once the numbers are available via 411... Though "unlisting" your number carries a monthly charge, of course! Don't worry, the telcos will always find a new way to charge^Wsatisfy you.
"BSD: Free as in speech. Linux: Free as in beer. Windows 10: Free as in herpes." --Man On Pink Corner in #52607549.
As an abortionist and a cell phone user I have had a large amount of stalkers and annoying prank callers all of which would probably like me to die. I can say this is very bad news as I recently disconnected my ground line and was only using my cell. I wish they would reconsider as now I have absolutely no privacy any more.
Even if they do, luckly in Missouri, we have a "no call list" law that has TEETH in it. In two years, I've had only ONE telemarketing call, and when I filed a complaint, about 9 months later, I received a letter from the Attorney General of Missouri (form letter) stating the amount they had been fined. Once in a while, they come up with a law that works :)
I don't about you guys but I personally do not want my cellular number to be made available so easily.
I'm curious to know if you read the article. I doubt most of the respondants here will, either, so I quote for you:
The centralized database of wireless numbers would be off limits to telemarketers, and consumers would be able to choose whether to have their numbers listed or unlisted, according to people familiar with the process.
Regardless of whether or not you believe the telemarketers won't get access to it, you can apparently choose not you have your number included. Now, what it doesn't say is if being listed will cost money, as unlisted land-line numbers do now.
According to the article cell companies may choose to charge people to have their number unlisted. That sounds like a privacy lawsuit waiting to happen.
Just because your number is a cell phone doesn't mean you're safe. All the marketers need is a prefix (like that's a big secret), then they set their automatic dialers to go down the list, starting with 0001 and on. Didn't you watch "The Simpsons"?
you insensitive clod!
I did NOT learn everything I need to know in kindergarten.
consumers would be able to choose whether to have their numbers listed or unlisted
The question is, what is the default option? Will we have to tell them we don't want to be listed like we have to do with land lines?
Work sucked, until it became unemployment, when it became slightly more tolerable. -Tet
In Australia you have the OPTION to have your mobile number listed. I know a number of people who choose to do this, but the majority do not.
This is a sensible approach, as those people who want their number to remain private can keep it that way.
lounge around on the blue couch
The phone companies charge us for unlisted numbers on our land lines. On our cell phones, however, they've realized they have been giving away for free something most people want.
By switching the system as a so-called "benefit" - allowing people to find out our cells numbers to call us, which we have pay airtime for incidentally, they EXPECT that most people will say "hey! Keep my number unlisted!" To which they will happily say "Sure, we can do that for $6.95 a month." BAM! Instant stealth revenue enhancement in a very price competitive industry.
-Mp
yourself this. When is the last time you've ever used 411? I don't think I ever have.
But I could be wrong. Maybe a lot of people use it.
YOU SUCK BALLS!
If Verizon (my provider) want's to put my number on 411, they can pay for all incoming calls (or at least the first minute - Sprint _used_ to do this). I know that there are currently plans (from Nextel I believe) that only bill you for outgoing calls.
There is no longer anything that can be done with computers that is nontrivial and clearly legal. -- Paul Phillips
"I don't about you guys but I personally do not want my cellular number to be made available so easily."
Since when did what you want/not want become a primary factor with business today? I don't like it either, but I'm not naive enough to believe they have my interests at heart. I'm surprised at your surprise.
It's all a ploy to get another 4 or 5 bucks a month out of cell users that want to make their number(s) unlisted.
Trolling is a art,
I recommend reading this. It is illegal for telemarketters to call any number for which the callee is charged. I've put my cell phone on lots of forms and so forth and never gotten a spam call to it so I suspect the telemarketroids are sufficiently spooked by legality issues to not call it.
Read the next sentence: "Individual carriers would determine whether subscribers would have to pay to be unlisted." Want to guess what the carriers will decide?
If all the companies start charging for unlisted numbers, there's no competitive disadvantage to them, just as competition didn't protect us when the banks all decided to start charging for use of automatic tellers.
Verizon has already successfully sued text messaging spammers. I expect calls from telemarketers (if any) would be made during the day, aka peak hours (most expensive). Which carry a higher price (over allocated minutesper month) than text messages. I'd like to assume my cell carrier would bludgeon anyone who started doing unsolicited calls on their network.
Yep, that almost works.
From the article:
That's where it breaks down.
Critical thinking: it's not a talent; it's paranoia based upon extensive experience.
--K.
Sig: Bad people happen. Try to avoid being one of them.
Cell companies have such a monopoly because I can't switch carriers and keep the same cell number.
I can do this with my residential number though.
Anyone know if this will be changing in the future?
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
It is a bit vague on who could call, I really don't want charities, political organizations or other stuff not technically defined as "telemarketers"calling me everywhere on my cellphone that would be quite annoying.
"Guns don't kill people, bullets do."
To be honest I'm not sure what is required of a prepaid cell phone. They call them disposable phones so do they require your name in order to sign up. If it keeps you off the lists I'd be going to PrePaid.
Slashdot, home of supporters of free software, free music, and free speech.Except for Moderators that disagree with you.
BTW, I don't have a cellphone. I hate them, partly because even with people you don't mind calling you occasionally, it's so nasty when they can call you anywhere. A lot of people say "you can switch it off", but I see lots of the same people cursing at their phones ringing in inappropriate time. Apparently, it's not that easy to make one's self switch it off...
VKh
I'm still waiting for my cell phone to get normal caller ID for people who aren't in my phonebook. Anyone know of a provider who offers this, or why no one does?
Cell companies have such a monopoly because I can't switch carriers and keep the same cell number. I hate those monopolies. I mean, my ISP is such a monopoly. I can't switch ISPs and keep my same e-mail address! What is the deal with that! Also, are those datacenter monopolies. I am trying to switch data centers and keep my same IP address, but those freaks won't let me.
I have had a different cell number every 6mo to a year for the years I have had a cellphone. I rarely if ever get telemarketers or anyone else unsolicited. Between personal contracts and work supplied phones, the number to reach me at changes often.
The few calls I dont want that I get are people calling for whomever previously had that number. Strangely enough they seem to be non-english-speaking mexicans. Fortunately, yo hablo un poco espanol, so I let them know... spanish in a minnesota accent... Su nombre esta malo, me llamo no es Juan, dontcha know?
back in spanish class I was known to interject: "?Te gustas me penga grande peludo? Pendejo?"
Paying for only outgoing calls would be quite a stupid thing to do for a wireless provider, as what people would do, is call person X, say "Hey person X, call me back." then hang up.
You can do that only with your close relatives. For example, my wife has a plan at 40 a minute, and land calls pay only 10. We do exactly what you say, but the telephone company still gets money.
i submitted this story because my bank wellsfargo couldnt seem to stop calling me on my cell. i tried in good faith many times to get them to stop. i received over 5 calls from them. when i contacted my cellphone provider at&t on getting help on getting the numbers of the person calling because under the tcpa solicitations are not allowed to be made to phones. you guesed it though. att was about as much help as, well, dead flash light batteries when the power goes out.
-- botsex is {grep;touch;strip;unzip;head;mount}
By being unlisted, you are costing them money. They will get it back one way or another. Believe it or not, telephone service among other things is a private enterprise! You don't own your number, you just purchase the right to use it for a time. The phone company actually owns the rights to that number and can do with it as they please.
I am interested to see what happens when telemarketers call however, since it's true about them not being able to call a number where the called party pays. Either the telemarketers won't buy a shitload of useless numbers, or cell phone providers will start shelling out free incoming calls to everyone since they can sell the number that way. Of course then a telemarketer would know which calling plan you're on which has to be some kind of invasion of privacy... Hmm, very tricky. Watch and see what promo's they come out with...
In other world news I'm going to copyright my phone number! Unless someone can prove prior art, given the complete idiocy of our patent system I should be able to get away with it. Then under the DMCA, I can sue anyone attempting to use my number by calling it since they would be entering copyrighted material without my permission. Brilliant I tell you... =)
Looking for a friend but don't have her phone number with you?
"friend?" "her?" This is slashdot, buddy. Our dear readers are gonna think yer talkin' about their moms.
The neutrality of this sig is disputed.
When I worked for a telemarketing company, a regular feature of the sales campaigns was cold-calls to cel-phones. The data-gathering systems they had were crazy intrusive - every last bit of number indicative data buyable or attainable through any method was in the massive databases, and refreshed as soon as a call cycle was complete. I always remember this converstaion I monitored: Sales Rep: Hello Miss, this is Shelly on behalf of yadda yadda yadda Called Lady: You know that this is a cel-phone, right? Sales Rep: I understand that this is a cel-phone, right? And that's why we're calling today with this great offer, RIGHT! Called Lady: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! (hangs up) *Shudder* 411 means nothing, they already have your number (unless you're from Missouri, heh)
Sig master! Sig master! Sig... faster?!
In the United States, it is a FEDERAL CRIME for a telemarketer to call your cell phone. Your number being "listed" does nothing to change that.
This is a "non-issue", at least with regards to telemarketing....
siri
In November, you'll be able to own your cell phone number. Expect a VERY high churn rate when that comes.
Ok, I actually happen to work for a company that provides directory assistance (411) and I am currently a directory assistance and toll operator (0). I have learned that from my experience with directory assistance customers are that they are generally the stupidest people you will ever have the privelege to speak to. So... adding cell phones to the database is going to be horrific not only from the consumer point of view, but from my point of view as well!
People already think I can find phone numbers from license plates, social security numbers, and other stupid things. I haven't had too many customers request cell phone numbers in the 10 months I've been working there and about half of them get pissed off when I tell them we do not provide such information.
There are already limitations on our searching, as in we need to know an area to search for... searching the United States for something is just insane! This is one reason your directory assistance operator may refer you to toll-free directory assistance (800-555-1212) if you ask for a toll-free number. However, some companies like Delta Airlines actually lists their toll-free numbers in seemingly ever major city in the United States... so a simple statewide search usually finds a toll-free number for Delta. It's too difficult to search the entire United States for a toll-free number, that's why there is a toll-free directory service available.
Now before you people think I've went off on a tangent, I'll put things together here. Many people who have cell phones do not live in the area in which their cell phone number is located. This creates a problem... a big problem. Even though software can search "surrounding cities" it is no guarantee that it searches all of them.
OK, so now that problem number one has been identified, I'll go on to explain problem number two. People are stupid... beyond stupid. If you think I'm joking or exagerrating then you are sadly mistaken... I honestly had no idea people were this stupid until I started working there; it's really bad. Knowing that, people will expect directory assistance operators to give them the cell phone number of a person in a certain city... not the city they live in or the city their phone number is located in, but the city they are currently in! I can already see it "give the number of the guy on such and such street, he's doing 90!" Me: "I have no idea who that is." Them: "Well there aren't too many people on this street, it can't be that hard!!". I only wished I was joking...
So here it is, two problems which are going to aid in the difficulty in finding cell phone numbers and when directory assistance can't find a number... people are highly pissed. If customers are highly pissed with our inability to find correct cell phone listings, then all kinds of crap happens.
Oh, and who is going to maintain this database? If it's anything like the national telephone database then it's going to be about useless for residential listings. The national database seems to always be on the slow side of updating things and if we find errors (and yes, I find a good many errors) noone fixes them! The company I work for has no way to force corrections to be made! So if the national database sucks... is this one going to be any better? Most likely not.
Ok, this post is pretty long, I should probably end it here.
its called prepaid cellular, no one knows who you are, and if you value your privacy, its the only way to go.
I hate sigs.
For years my local phone company had a policy stating you could _spell_ your name any way you wanted for the phone book.
So, for years I was listed in the phone book under an alias.
...Me: "Here's how I would like my name listed."
...Phone company rep: "Um, is that a roommate, or something?"
...Me: "Um, yep."
At least the "or something" part was true. This was quite a deal, since unlisted numbers cost an extra $1.25/month (something like that), but an aliased name was free. Now the phone is listed as [spouse's name] (she wants to be listed).
The alias method instantly identifies telemarketers, who can then be dealt with as you wish:
..."Is this Mr. [alias]?"
..."Add this number to your do-not-call list." [click]
..."May I speak to [alias]?"
..."Oh!" [adopt somber voice] "I'm so sorry, he died a week ago."
..."Um -- "
Method A)
Method B)
Email: slashdot3@FreeMars.org (Address will be abandoned when it gets spam.)
I don't know about the American cell phones, but my phone always displays who is calling or, if they have set up their phone to prevent their number being disclosed, says "Private Number". If I give out my number to someone I have typically received their number in return and they are filed away in my address book, so when they call their name comes up instead of a number.
My point is, if you are really that concerned about getting phone spam then maybe you should treat your mobile like your e-mail account: if you don't recognise it, don't answer it! And if you do answer it doesn't cost you anything to hang up the phone. Really guys, there are bigger things to worry about than whether someone is going to ask your opinion about your favorite brand of milk.
My 2 cents
Hmm. Listing my number (unless I submit to extortion) is a signifigant change in my service. This would void my one year contract and exempt me from any early termination fees, I'd think... There is probably a clause in the contract that allows them to change their obligations without allowing me to change mine on a whim, but it would be fun to see them defend several thouseand individual consumer fraud actions against them...
Call waiting is rude. Voicemail and answering machines allow for us to be polite.
Answering machines are for when you are not near your phone. They cannot be used with cell phones. It is a nice way of saying "I am not here, but your planned interruption of my life is important so I'll listen to your message later."
Voicemail is for when you are not near your phone, or are on the phone. It is a nice way of saying "I am busy at the moment, but your planned interruption of my life is important to me so I'll listen to your message later."
Call waiting is for when you are busy. You tell the person you are with that they are not the most important person in your life. You check the new caller. Then you probably tell them that they are less important to you than the person to whom you were already speaking. It is almost impossible to use without being rude to at least one person. There are exceptions, such as interrupting gossip to take a call from work, or interrupting work to take a call while your child is at the hospital, but they are rare. Most people think that an incoming call must be answered. Many people seem confused if you are not waiting patiently when/if they remember to switch back to you. The answer to "Can you hold a moment?" should usually be "No."
I am sorry that you believe that hearing your voice at the moment you decide to allow it to be heard is the most important action any of your acquaintances could possibly do. Maybe if you dealt with more people you would understand the uses of technology. Maybe if you understood modern technology you would deal with more people. And if you have a system for receiving messages, and never retrieve them, then you are incredibly rude: having the system implies that you will listen to the message, so you are lying to your acquaintances. (Of course they probably will not "deal with you" again because they are still waiting for you to call back.)
I spend my life entertaining my brain.
Yes, big, thick phone books are a waste of paper in better neighborhoods like yours. To us they are convenient, free booster seats for our children. Further, are handy temporary jack blocks for our trailers.
Harpo Tunnel Syndrome--my wrist feels funny.
From the article:
For example, wireless phone users might choose to be unlisted but willing to receive a short text message, sent through the directory service, from someone trying to contact them.
I can see this situation:
411: We cannot give out that phone number because it is a cell phone.
Telemarketer: But I really need to contact them.
411: You could send a message to 4841234567@attws.com.
Telemarketer: Thank you. I will do that.
The only text messages I receive are from ATT advertising their text services. The only text messages I sent were little romantic sayings to a girlfriend, but they did not do well because she could not discover how to read them. This was not entirely her fault: it was her first cell phone, she only had it one month, and Nokia buried the messages 3 levels into the menus.
--
Someone asked why cell phones do not have true caller ID. They only display the phone number, unless the number and name are in the phone book in the cell phone. I had asked ATT about this. They said that Verizon was refusing to let them into the local phone directories. I will believe anything evil about Verizon, but this seems silly:
1. Verizon cell phone customers have the same poor caller ID as ATT customers.
2. Every telemarketer, phone book publisher, and 411 operator has access to that list.
I believe that the cell phone companies are just too lazy to build the system properly.
--
And good news for me:
Verizon turned off my land line on WED MAR 12. On FRI MAR 14, I received a snailmail notice that they would shut it off on MAR 24 if I did not pay the $60 that was 20 days overdue. Today (MAR 21) they are probably trying to leave me a voicemail about the proposed shutoff.
I warned them last year that if they ever shut off my service again it would not be turned back on. Last year's shutoff was due to Verizon's computer problems. I was on auto-pay at the time, but they charged me to have the phone lines restored. When they would not refund the charges, I turned off one phone line and made the threat.
So they are permanently losing a customer. No more land lines for me. Yeah!
--
The Slashdot quote for this article was appropriately:
The more crap you put up with, the more crap you are going to get.
I believe that summarizes the entire telecommunications industry.
I spend my life entertaining my brain.
A friend in the locksmith biz operates almost exclusively by mobile phone. He has a yellow pages ad, of course; it costs him a fortune. The yellow pages company (same as the phone company) won't let him list his mobile number in his yellow pages ad. So, he has to get a (more expensive) business land line, which he forwards to his mobile phone. When he's "closed" for business, he stops the land line forwarding and lets the voice mail answer the business line. After all, he only gives out his land line number, and nobody can get his mobile number, right? Well, now he will (likely) have to pay extra to have that mobile number be unlisted. For essentially the same service, he will have to pay both to be listed and unlisted.
Sometimes I worry that I'll develop Alzheimer's disease, but no one will notice.
I don't want my cell phone company giving out my name/number to a directory. How much do we value having a dedicated phone number for our cell phones mapped into the locality of area codes and prefixes? We don't need it. Much like people use NAT on the Internet, we don't need dedicated telephone numbers for everyone. If a cell phone provider were given a 3-digit identity (###) for every 2-5 million subscribers with their own 7-digit phone numbers (xxx-xxxx):
1. 1-877-700-0### xxx-xxxx - The cell customer pays toll charges if not on a nationwide plan). A mobile phone company might make money letting people use vanity toll free numbers like (87-SLASHDOT) to access their customers.
2. 700-0### xxx-xxxx - Configured from within each LATA.
If I make an outbound call, the caller ID (without extensions to Caller ID) is the 700-0### phone number. If you don't like getting calls from mobile phone users, block it. If I want to have a caller-ID when I call, I can pay my phone company extra money for a random 7-digit number in some area code (think of it like a static IP address).
1. It gives customers more flexibility in choosing their vanity mobile numbers.
2. It helps prevent further area code depletion.
3. It can map well to Internet services (eg: xxxxxxx.###mobile.us). (Make ###mobile.us a reserved name at NIC.US).
4. It gets us out of the locality mindset that the phone companies were found upon and maps better to today's nationwide phone service. It's not just cell phone companies, other virtual phone companies like Vonage (www.vonage.com) are springing up.
I would be a customer of the mobile phone corporation that would not list my information in a public phone company directory. If I want to advertise my number in a directory, I can get my mobile number mapped to a static land line number for the local ILEC to publish in their white pages. Yellow pages are another thing entirely (not an issue).
-ez
8 6 7 - 5 3 0 niiiiiinnne