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Transmeta OK'd for Mira Displays

viewstyle writes "eweek is reporting that Transmeta's Crusoe chip has been approved by Microsoft for use in the Mira smart displays -- a move that further edges out AMD and Intel from the mobile processor marketplace."

170 comments

  1. Interesting by Zebra_X · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Microsoft has been showing less and less interest in being an exclusive "partner" with our good friends at Intel... Maybe MS is taking the Tel out of WinTel.

    1. Re:Interesting by Daimaou · · Score: 0

      That's too bad because WinRusoe sounds pretty dumb.

    2. Re:Interesting by AlanS2002 · · Score: 1

      I certainly hope so. If some of the clientalist linkages between big companies such as M$ and Intel can be broken up hopefully we can get increased competition and thus inovation.

      --
      Not all conservatives are stupid,
      but it is true that most stupid people are conservative.
      - Hume
    3. Re:Interesting by Zebra_X · · Score: 1

      I think you have problems.

    4. Re:Interesting by Zebra_X · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Nah d00d yUr the 0ne with I$$UeZ!!!!!

      yUr a n00b!!!

    5. Re:Interesting by Zebra_X · · Score: 1

      All right that's enought I've had it with you other self - I'm taking my meds again!

    6. Re:Interesting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I believe we will refer to it as CrIndows

    7. Re:Interesting by Daimaou · · Score: 1

      I can't imagine Microsoft allowing themselves to be second billed, but the name does sound better.

    8. Re:Interesting by caino59 · · Score: 1

      you just forgot to check the anonymous box, admit it..

    9. Re:Interesting by Lussarn · · Score: 1

      Or maybe MS just start making their own hardware in the future. That would be the nail in the coffin.

    10. Re:Interesting by javiercero · · Score: 1

      I believe it would be WinMeta. Since Intel the "tel" part of the name is taken from a company not a product. Your name would be correct if the current windows intell alliance was name WinTium or something like that.

      Sorry I am an anal retentive SOB after I have been coding 3 days straigth

    11. Re:Interesting by Hoser+McMoose · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Good god! Do people STILL believe in this myth of some "Wintel" connection?! Microsoft and Intel have never been more than forced friends, and for the most part they've been more like advisaries!

      The only company that Microsoft can't push around in the PC business is Intel, and the only company that Intel can't push around in the PC business is Microsoft. For this reason alone the two have been trying their damndest to find alternative suppliers. Both companies realize that they are heavily dependant on the other for their own success, but given half a chance to support a third party, they always jump all over it. Intel has been a strong supporter of Linux, while Microsoft has gone out of their way to support AMD and now Transmeta.

      The whole "Wintel" thing exists only because Microsoft and Intel have pretty much been forced to work together, whether they like it or not.

    12. Re:Interesting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Agreed - the bottom line is: Intel and Microsoft are present in the same box because of one thing - IBM - who pulled both manufacturers parts off the shelf and said "you're gonna be in our new cheap PC".

      If it weren't for Compaq reverse-engineering the IBM PC BIOS, there would only be IBM PCs - running on whatever IBM saw fit to put in them.

    13. Re:Interesting by jonbrewer · · Score: 1

      For this reason alone the two have been trying their damndest to find alternative suppliers. Both companies realize that they are heavily dependant on the other for their own success, but given half a chance to support a third party, they always jump all over it. Intel has been a strong supporter of Linux, while Microsoft has gone out of their way to support AMD and now Transmeta.

      You have to admit that M$ seems to be married to Intel architecture. When NT 4.0 came out it included support for i386, Alpha, MIPS, & PPC. Win2K dropped all but i386 support. If they had really wanted to get away from Intel, they could have easily run with PPC. Remember CHRP? (Common Hardware Reference Platform) Imagine a 32-way Power^4 based Win2k server. (shudder)

    14. Re:Interesting by FuzzyBad-Mofo · · Score: 1

      If the PC hardware hadn't been opened up, I think it's safe to say that most people wouldn't be running x86 at home today. Perhaps the Mac or Amiga would have come to dominate. Perhaps we would be using thin clients or something.

    15. Re:Interesting by AlanS2002 · · Score: 1

      They already do, to some extent.

      --
      Not all conservatives are stupid,
      but it is true that most stupid people are conservative.
      - Hume
    16. Re:Interesting by NewbieSpaz · · Score: 1

      I was thinking "MiCrusoe"

      If spoken, it still sounds too much like Microsoft.
      Oh well, I tried. ;)

      --
      ------
      Random, useless fact: I type in startx entirely with my left hand.
    17. Re:Interesting by Daimaou · · Score: 1

      When I read your post, that Knack song My Sharona popped into my head. At least it sounds catchy.

    18. Re:Interesting by Zebra_X · · Score: 1

      Nah - i thought it would be interesting to click through an argument with myself - kind of amusing i thought. :-)

      The moderators apparently didn't like it all that much.

      Kind of artful in a split personility sort of way

  2. Who needs a smart display? by chevybowtie · · Score: 0

    What exactly is the purpose of one of these? Yes, I have benn living under a rock, but I don't see how a processor in the display will help anything, especially if it 'monopolizes the PC while it runs'

    1. Re:Who needs a smart display? by Sheetrock · · Score: 1
      It makes for more effective monopolization. The average smart display doesn't have the power to fully monopolize the PC, so it makes sense to have a Crusoe in the display to help it determine how best to monopolize the PC.

      I've heard they're working on an SMP setup of the Crusoe (following the O'Doyle Rules to achieve n-way monopolization) to improve even further the CPU monopolization process.

      --

      Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
      -- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.




    2. Re:Who needs a smart display? by ObviousGuy · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's like having VPN from anywhere in your house. It sounds like a dumb idea and for 95% of the people out there it probably is, but for the 5% who are left it is a real great technology.

      It's laptop power without the heat and power consumption of a full-blown system.

      --
      I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    3. Re:Who needs a smart display? by NoTildeQuestionMark · · Score: 1

      You are not alone in your curiosity. I haven't the slightest clue what one even is. And the article is no help.

      ~

      --
      If you need me, I'll be hanging my computer from the
    4. Re:Who needs a smart display? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Microsoft already does a good job of 'monopolizing' the CPU !!!

    5. Re:Who needs a smart display? by ShadowDrake · · Score: 1

      >It's laptop power without the heat and power >consumption of a full-blown system.

      Okay, why not export your X displays (maybe using IPv6?) from your big old Athlon in the basement to some old Pentium and PII laptops via 802.11?

      Plus, you can do some local processing-- I don't need to talk to my big machine to play simple games and run Mozilla.

      --
      It's just like a fascist dictatorship, without the punctual rail service!
    6. Re:Who needs a smart display? by TummyX · · Score: 1


      It sounds like a dumb idea and for 95% of the people out there it probably is


      I think it's the other way round. Most non-technie people (mums, grandmas etc) want to write their emails from their living rooms, beds etc and a Mira would be perfect. You could setup the PC in a spare room and access it through the Mira from anywhere in the house.

  3. hardly edging them out of the market by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    anyone heard of Centrino? I think the crusoe is definitely a niche market, due to its low power consumption, but the centrino and mobile athlons are much more powerful . . . i hardly think they're being edged out of the market

    1. Re:hardly edging them out of the market by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      current Pentium M (formerly codename "banias") CPUs that are the processor in the multi-chip "centrino" bundle draw ~25 watts of power. they are good chips (a 1.4ghz P-M is faster than a 2.2ghz P4-M!). crusoe's draw *much* less power (4-10w).

    2. Re:hardly edging them out of the market by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Centrino is not a processor!

      Why in the hell do people keep thinking that centrino is a processor?

      Centrino is a term for a Intel Mobile processor and WiFi. It's not this god-send great technology, it's just a liscensing requirement.

  4. Edges out? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    Yeah, just the way Linux is "edging out" Windows as a desktop OS, or intelligent comments are "edging out" mindless Linux zealous idiocy on Slashdot.

    Maybe "eeking out a small chunk of a large market and managing to stay afloat."

    1. Re:Edges out? by Narchie+Troll · · Score: 2, Funny

      You go "eek" when your boyfriend Bubba takes you from behind without asking. You eke out a living by making license plates.

    2. Re:Edges out? by Jameth · · Score: 1

      Sure, edging out is premptive, but this is a step in the right direction. Maybe it would be better to say that they're 'edging into the market'.

    3. Re:Edges out? by BiggyP · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      surely this isn't 5 points of funny, it's flaimbait if anything.

    4. Re:Edges out? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Flamebait? Hardly. It's accurate.

      Slapdash really has become a rah-rah squad in recent times.

      "If it's Linux, it must be good" is order of the day, no matter what. Windows couldn't possibly do anything better, or even right. Even for the cases where Linux/Open Source has obviously copied Windows.

      And apparently, by extension, Transmeta.

      So yes, his comment was funny. It was also true.

    5. Re:Edges out? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You must be confused, the story summary is the flamebait here.

    6. Re:Edges out? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When linux reaches 3.0, you know proprietary software will be next to obsolete.

    7. Re:Edges out? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When linux reaches 3.0, you know proprietary software will be next to obsolete.

      Yes, they probably will put 'Linux 3.0' on the shelf right next to the proprietary software. They sell it there now.

  5. Not exactly. by ObviousGuy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    x86 is only one processor supported by the Mira platform.

    To say that Transmeta is edging out a giant like Intel who has the PXA255 is just wrong. Transmeta doesn't have any edge in this market whereas Intel certainly does.

    --
    I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    1. Re:Not exactly. by cookd · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Actually, this is still true.

      Transmeta is now "edging out" (or perhaps more accurately "edging in on") Intel's StrongARM processor, not Intel's x86. Transmeta is putting the x86-compatible Crusoe in places where previously only embedded chips like ARM and MIPs were thriving. (Though the NS Geode has already made some inroads...)

      To boldly go where no x86 has gone before... :P

      --
      Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.
  6. The irony is somewhat chucklesome... by JessLeah · · Score: 4, Funny

    Microsoft's company partnering with Linus Torvalds's company... hee!

    1. Re:The irony is somewhat chucklesome... by kmahan · · Score: 4, Funny

      It's good strategy. They keep piling the work up and Linus gets too busy to apply patches to Linux. Linux releases grind to halt. Microsoft succeeds at world domination. At least that's what the memo said.

      --
      Invalid Checksum. Retrying.
    2. Re:The irony is somewhat chucklesome... by cscx · · Score: 1

      (CafeShops runs Windows; not my choice.)

      I *know* I had given you flack for this once before ;)

    3. Re:The irony is somewhat chucklesome... by JessLeah · · Score: 1

      You see my email address. Email me. We'll talk. I'd love to learn about alternatives. But thus far, none have been proposed.

    4. Re:The irony is somewhat chucklesome... by rf0 · · Score: 1

      Microsoft are in this to make money and if that means partnering with someone on one front then fighting them on another they will. Pretty much standard business pratice

      Rus

    5. Re:The irony is somewhat chucklesome... by Dr.+Photo · · Score: 4, Funny

      Billg (in Dark Helmet): Linus! ... I am your father's brother's nephew's cousin's former roommate!

      Linus: What does that make us?

      Billg: Absolutely nothing, which is what I am about to make you!

  7. A bit optimistic? by Spazholio · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The Transmeta chip being approved for use in one device hardly qualifies as edging anyone out of the mobile chip market, much less "further" edging them out. Besides, what do we (read as: geeks) have against AMD? I thought we liked them, no?

    1. Re:A bit optimistic? by evilviper · · Score: 4, Informative
      Besides, what do we (read as: geeks) have against AMD? I thought we liked them, no?

      Obviously you've never used an AMD-based laptop. I have, and I've got the battle-scars to prove it.

      AMD makes decent stuff, but they don't seem to realize that putting out huge quantities of heat is a problem in and of itself... This hasn't made them a favorite when it comes to portables. Besides, it's not like AMD is a giant in the embedded market.
      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    2. Re:A bit optimistic? by Spazholio · · Score: 1

      Honestly, I'm writing this on a 1.2 Ghz laptop as we speak. And it's not one of those mamby-pamby low heat ones. This bastard burns. But most laptops I've seen nowadays get just as hot. Provided I don't try to rip many CDs at the same time, it stays just below scorching. I don't think the heat problem is limited to Athlons.

    3. Re:A bit optimistic? by CTho9305 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Check this out... a laptop cooling pad.

    4. Re:A bit optimistic? by dWhisper · · Score: 1

      I personally hold something against AMD for pulling up some great juxtaposition with Intel a couple of years back. When the Athlon first came out, they attacked Intel saying that MHz wasn't everything, and that you had to look at the performance of the product.

      It held true for a while, when Intel was stuck with Rambus. Then the P4 moved to DDR and higher-speed FSB, and the Intel was faster, MHz-and-performance wise. AMD responds by using the great power of Marketing, hack cough hack, to brand the XP+ Processors with needlessly-confusing part numbers, like the 1800, 2000, 2200, which was meant to show the relative speed, when the actual speed was slower.

      Intel actually tried to lower their bottom price while AMD inflated it, and somehow, they switched places.

      That and we're all still bitter that the 64-bit processor is still close to vapor. Don't get me wrong, I've been using AMD processors since the K6-2, and have loved them. But they're more insterested in Marketing than pushing the envelope and giving us cutting-edge products.

    5. Re:A bit optimistic? by rchatterjee · · Score: 1
      ...all still bitter that the 64-bit processor is still close to vapor.

      Wait, are you talking about AMD's 64-bit CPU?, the Opteron?

      Its been on sale since last week, already cheaper than an Intel Xeon, and way way cheaper than a Itanium 2.

      Unless you got a really wierd definition of vaporware (i.e. Duke Nukum Forever is vaporware, Opteron isn't) you've got your facts wrong.
    6. Re:A bit optimistic? by dWhisper · · Score: 1

      Sorry, I haven't been keeping up. It was supposed to be out a couple of years ago.

      And DNF is imaginationware. Team Fortress 2 is vaporware, because at least it has a screenshot every 6 months or so.

    7. Re:A bit optimistic? by chefbimbo · · Score: 1

      Where the hell do you live? Their performance ratings are entirely fair. It's not their fault that Intel can't build CPUs with an as good per clock performance and educating customers that MHz aint everything is impossible as we know. Furthermore, they also give adjusted their ratings when Intel was bumping FSB or RAM clock.

      As to 64bit CPU being vapor, I really don't think so. The fact that you can't yet afford it doesn't mean it ain't shipping. One of our consulting customers just got two dual Opterons and from all I hear, they kick ass (they rightly didn't let me mess around with them as it is far from my being my job).

    8. Re:A bit optimistic? by Hoser+McMoose · · Score: 2, Informative

      That's definitely true. Intel Penium 4 M chips max out at almost 35W! Just 5 years ago that was a LOT for a desktop chip! The hottest AthlonXP mobile chips come in a comparatively "cool" 25W, which is still enough to melt some components in the small confines of a laptop. Even Intel's new Pentium M, designed from the ground-up for low-power, consumes up to 25W of power at the top-end (though the slower speed/low voltage chips consume less than 10W).

      Generally speaking, power consumption of laptop chips has become rather ridiculous. Intel is definitely on the right track with their Pentium M chip, however even with this chip they could use some work, particularly with the 1.4 and 1.6GHz chips.

    9. Re:A bit optimistic? by borgboy · · Score: 1

      Beautiful sig. Why can't I post anonymously?

      --
      meh.
    10. Re:A bit optimistic? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I really hope they stop the stupid fake marketing numbers soon. I really want the 64-bit processor (yes, I do stuff that uses 64-bits), but I really hate deceptive advertising.

    11. Re:A bit optimistic? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      Their performance ratings are entirely fair.

      I could care less how fair or unfair the performance ratings are. What pisses me off is they use them in the product names.

    12. Re:A bit optimistic? by evilviper · · Score: 1
      Provided I don't try to rip many CDs at the same time, it stays just below scorching. I don't think the heat problem is limited to Athlons.

      I'm writing this on an Intel Celeron (P3) 1.2GHz Notebook... It runs for hours upon hours, with all sorts of programs running in the background, and it's just barely warm to the touch... That's with a very small fan that runs very slowly most of the time.

      The only time it gets rather warm is after a couple hours of maxing out the processor. But even then, it's never too hot to touch with bare skin, let alone hot enough to burn through a pair of jeans.

      Heat problems aren't limited to AMD, but they are the single worst offender, and the don't seem to care.
      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    13. Re:A bit optimistic? by mazor · · Score: 1
      Opteron is only a few months off the 2002 target date that AMD set 3 years ago when they first published the x86-64 instruction set spec.

      It would be rather difficult for a chip maker to be "a couple of years late" when the project started only a couple of years ago. AMD has brought Opteron to market in record time.

      -mazor

  8. Funny how... by cubal · · Score: 0

    an OK for Transmeta may be a KO for Intel and AMD ;)

    Ok, enough with the lame jokes, what exactly are these "smart displays"?

    1. Re:Funny how... by Sheetrock · · Score: 3, Interesting
      Essentially, they're displays that you can tote around the house/office that maintain a wireless communication with your PC. I imagine it's kind of like VNC on a tablet PC.

      What they're talking about here is giving the display some processing power of its own, so that it's more like a laptop that runs a terminal off of your main computer. If you're doing something on it, it won't cause your main computer to slow down (much), whereas the smart display uses a lot more of your computer's resources. Doesn't sound like a huge deal to me, except that it should be cheaper and more portable than a laptop.

      --

      Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
      -- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.




    2. Re:Funny how... by curious.corn · · Score: 1

      I had some workalikes too! ;-) I took some semi-dead oldish PC, told their GDM managed XServers to query the Application server and stuck a heap of ram on the one and only decent machine I had available serving the various XSessions. Shure, I had no crypto but, alas, behind a firewall I had little to worry and no intention to fiddle with ssh. Now BillyG takes us to the remarkably innovative world of remote XSessions, wow! Time to start saving to pick up one of these toys; hopefully the masses will craze for them, the prices will drop and us geeks can finally start playing with remoted X around the household without overhauling nasty old PCs... does GCC compile to Crusoe's native code? (if there is such a thing)

      --
      Mi domando chi à il mandante di tutte le cazzate che faccio - Altan
    3. Re:Funny how... by JayateMo · · Score: 1

      It seems to me that using vnc causes less load on the client (i.e X-server), than doing it the remote Xwindows way, what I would like to see is vnc on frambuffer. Can it be done?? it sure (not shure ^) should! That would be nicer (and using ssh on vnc is easy and with compression it's nice to the network as well), and it doesnt mess up my 8-color-bit display to bad ;), and my mouse on a flash in mozilla doesnt freeze up the scrolling and it's easy to have a script starting (pw protected httpd-dir) a vncserver through a cgi-script(from your local internet cafe and using a java-enabled browser(who are we kidding, its all damned IE), gives you a linux desktop that impress the lusers at the cafe!)

  9. Intel's Not Out Yet by rsmith-mac · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Don't count out Intel quite yet. The Pentium-M is still one of, if not the best mobile pure x86 processors out there. The rumor that Intel is additionally working on an ultra-ultra low-power version of the chip(600mhz, smaller L2 cache) would further prop themselves up in the Mira market, with their brand name tagging along for the ride. Transmeta has had a lot of problems so far breaking in to the US market, and I don't see them winning that easily so soon, especially with Chipzilla on the lookout.

    1. Re:Intel's Not Out Yet by mattdm · · Score: 2, Informative

      Rumor nothing. The stripped-down version of the Pentium M, called the Mobile Celeron 600A, is used in the Sony U101 subnotebook. See here or here (use babelfish or just check out the screenshot) for some info on the CPU. And you can order one in the US from Dynamism or Japan Rush.

    2. Re:Intel's Not Out Yet by Ratso+Baggins · · Score: 1

      Indeed, even if the centrino proves all the PentiumIII v Pentium4 "trolls" right all along ;)

      --

      --
      "we live in a post-ideological world..." - Billy Bragg.

    3. Re:Intel's Not Out Yet by mholt108 · · Score: 1

      Transmeta has had a lot of problems so far breaking in to the US market
      thats partly because the US market has been dry since Transmeta shipped in numbers. They are positioning themselves well when/if the economy picks up.

  10. Err, I mean "Microsoft". by JessLeah · · Score: 1

    Err... I mean "Microsoft". Just woke up, head groggy. Blluuuuuh.

  11. This could really help Transmeta out by SlashdotMirrorer · · Score: 5, Insightful

    With the dot-com bust giving Transmeta a hard time, an approval by Microsoft could be just what they need to get back on their feet and out of bankruptcy.

    Maybe this will be a lesson learned for the GNU/Linux community as well, to support the companies that use open source and contribute back to the movement. Everyone's all about freedom, but nobody seems to want to pay the price for it. Apparently Transmeta has seen this and is moving on to greener and more friendly pastures. Good for them I say, and I'm looking forward to the product.

    Think about that the next time you Bittorrrent the latest release of Redhat instead of purchasing it. What would you do if they decided to switch over to Microsoft? You'd all be screwed then.

    1. Re:This could really help Transmeta out by whereiswaldo · · Score: 1

      Everyone's all about freedom, but nobody seems to want to pay the price for it.

      That's quite a blanket statement. Open source advocates pulled Mandrake's ass out of the gutter once when they needed it. Red Hat is doing just fine with their subscriptions... they don't even _need_ the OS revenue IMO.

      Open source is open source. It's meant to be free as in speech AND free as in beer. Those trying to sell it realize that and take the associated risks.

      I've given money on several occasions to open source causes, but I'm not going to shell out for every upgrade since that would just defeat much of the incentive to use open source.

      What would you do if they decided to switch over to Microsoft? You'd all be screwed then.

      No, "we" wouldn't be screwed. Red Hat != Open Source. Red Hat is a definite asset to the community, but it is not THE community.

    2. Re:This could really help Transmeta out by SlashdotMirrorer · · Score: 0

      I've given money on several occasions to open source causes, but I'm not going to shell out for every upgrade since that would just defeat much of the incentive to use open source.

      Well my apologies to you. You're one of the good ones then. If there was a community full of people like you, the Open Source movement might have some momentum.

      What remains though is that most of this community you speak of are refugees from either a childhood of pirated "wAreZ" collection and "Peer to Peer" music stealing, who got started on Unixlikes from t-files on boards they found, or bearded terminal hackers who won't let go of the past. Neither of these have the money nor the will to support an undertaking of this size.

      However hopefully, the motivated ones such as yourself can come up with something better, that won't attract as many deadbeat members.

    3. Re:This could really help Transmeta out by d^2b · · Score: 1
      Think about that the next time you Bittorrrent the latest release of Redhat instead of purchasing it. What would you do if they decided to switch over to Microsoft? You'd all be screwed then.
      Err. Does not compute. Other people have pointed out (once again!) that one company is not going to make or break Linux. But really, the idea of Red Hat switching to linux makes to little sense as to not even deserve a response. Err, yeah, I'm ignoring you. So there.
  12. yes, edged right out ... by mattdm · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ... edged right out of their tiny 15% and 80% market niches. Tremble, AMD and Intel, tremble.

  13. Linus? by UnknownQ · · Score: 4, Funny

    Does Bill Gates know that Linus Torvalds works for Transmeta?

    --
    Wherever you go, there you are!
    1. Re:Linus? by dorfsmay · · Score: 1

      Of course not. The richest man in the world doesn't read new-paper, especially the ones related to his industry, he doesn't check the news on the web, he doesn't read /. (yeah right !), and he just invests in companies without doing any background research.

      How did you think he become that reach, by checking things out ?

    2. Re:Linus? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, Bill Gates, Super Genius, knows Linus works there. By keeping Linus busy with some actual paying work, Bill knows he can severely restrict the amount of spare time Linus has to work on Linux.

      Sheer genius!

    3. Re:Linus? by quantaman · · Score: 4, Funny

      Does Bill Gates know that Linus Torvalds works for Transmeta?

      Well he does now ya big tool! You know the big G reads ./ regularily, who do you think started the goatse trolls (Ballmer does most of the work but Bill's in it too). Well there goes the approval and AMD can't expect squat from M$.
      Thanks a lot!!

      --
      I stole this Sig
    4. Re:Linus? by Alan+Partridge · · Score: 2, Funny

      ./?

      ?!?

      --
      That was classic intercourse!
  14. Re:But the more important question is by ctishman · · Score: 1

    Thank you, Slashdot. Thank you for link subtitles.

  15. Swan Song? by butt-rock+camaro · · Score: 1

    I like Transmeta's product, but at this point one has to concede that maybe things haven't gone as well as Transmeta execs and shareholders had expected. The idea of putting Transmeta's low power product into embedded devices certainly has technical merit, but is this a well thought out approach, or a desparation swan song? Personally, I think Transmeta should have gone for the embedded market right off the bat. Or perhaps they did, and I simply don't know. Can anyone clarify?

    1. Re:Swan Song? by istartedi · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Going for the mobile market is indeed a mistake.

      They went for the blade-server market, which was not a mistake.

      Embedded (under certain circumstances) is not a mistake either, but it's a very competitive market.

      They've ignored the quiet PC market, and that was a huge mistake.

      OK, here comes the clarification. The power savings of TMTA chips don't matter much for mobiles, because the power profile is dominated by the monitor and other devices, not the CPU. The one advantage the chip does offer for mobiles is low heat disipation, but they didn't pitch that. Instead, they marketed enhanced battery life and when that (predictably) didn't materialize, they started to look like Enron execs.

      The power savings matter a great deal for server farms, because when you jam 1000s of CPUs into a room, all those watts add up quickly, and you also reduce the cost of cooling the room. In general, when TMTA's chips are scattered all over the place, the heat dissipation and power savings don't matter that much. When the chips are packed together in small spaces, then it matters, which brings us to...

      ...The quiet PC. The low heat allows TMTA chips to run FANLESS. This wasn't emphasized enough by their marketing or engineering departments, and as a result there are virtually NO PCs being made with TMTA's chips, and there are no inexpensive motherboards using a TMTA chip. That market has been conceded entirely to VIA's mini-itx boards. This is a real shame, because apparently the TMTA chips can (in theory) perform better than VIA's chips and do so without a fan. Also, TMTA squandered its geek appeal by making it very difficult for anybody to experiment with their chips. I haven't seen any SBCs with a TMTA chip in them for under $600. The chip itself is available for $90 in single units, but there is nothing to plug it into. Since Intel chips cost about the same, I don't see any argument for why TMTA can't get somebody to make inexpensive MoBos. That is an oversight that must be corrected.

      If you look at the mini-itx.com site, you'll see that most of the projects are hobbiest kitsche. I imagine that most of the projects at the original Homebrew Computer Club were like that too; but one of them was the first Apple. Unless TMTA gets its /\55 in gear, it will end up like Zilog instead of Motorola.

      It's very, very ironic that Linus works for a company that has failed so miserably to understand the importance of hackers and the "garage" in driving the industry. I haven't heard him say anything about advocating within TMTA to make their hardware more open. Notice, I mean open in the sense that you should be able to buy components separately and tinker with them; I'm not asking TMTA to give up any copyrights or patents.

      For example, in theory, you can emulate any CPU by writing your own code-morphing software. Now, I defy anybody to find the documents that tell you how to do that.

      --
      For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
  16. Re:What about Linux? by ausgnome · · Score: 1

    Probably the same person who takes the doh out of windows

    --

    I had a pet once
  17. One option out of many by oaf357 · · Score: 1

    It's good to see Transmeta making it's name more common but there are many options out there and (sad to say) Transmeta's name up against Intel and AMD is unlikely to sway consumers away from the two giants. But it's good to see more competition (it's the best part of capitalism).

    1. Re:One option out of many by ObviousGuy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What they need to do is forget about getting their brand name out there. Just get the chips into the devices and let the ODMs worry about their own brand name. Especially for a thin client like Mira, processing power is the least of the problems; any chip will do. Transmeta will never win going head to head with Intel in the consumer market. They've got to make their chips attractive to ODMs and that's through pricing and production capacity. Unfortunately Transmeta fails it on on both accounts.

      --
      I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    2. Re:One option out of many by oaf357 · · Score: 1
      Where's a moderation point when I need one.

      You're absolutely right.

  18. What is Mira? by ObviousGuy · · Score: 5, Informative

    It seems like this question has been asked several times in this thread.

    Here's the short version:

    Mira (Smart Display) is a small, tablet-like device that becomes a remote terminal to a Windows XP machine. It uses wireless networking to create a Virtual Private Network (VPN) with the XP host. When connected, the Mira device can use all functions of the host PC.

    Here's Microsoft's version:

    http://www.microsoft.com/windows/Embedded/ce.NET/e valuation/news/fromms/mira.asp

    --
    I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    1. Re:What is Mira? by rosewood · · Score: 1

      Except stream video, right? I mean, I cant take a Mira (is that like an italian saying Mirror? Hey ma, bring me the mira) and go watch FMV while off the stand?

      Ive seen the omfg thats sooo cool videos but I have to wonder about it. It seems I couldnt have it on my primary PC and I would need a compact PC w/ a Mira display to be worth while. Also, doesn't it use 802.11b + windows remote desktop action to do what it does?

      And arent they available for sale? I coulda sworn when I was masturbating to all the Tablet PCs I accidently looked at one of these. I realize there is a big price difference but id rather take a tablet PC that I can run the remote desktop client on over the smart display any day.

    2. Re:What is Mira? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sort of like a mirror?

  19. That won't happen by Andrew+Carlssin · · Score: 1

    Before you know it, this site will become exclusive to subscribers ... until April 12, 2005. By then, the trolls will have long since discovered the virtues of throwaway accounts.

  20. Isn't it Paul Allen's company? by mdfst13 · · Score: 1

    I thought Paul Allen (cofounder of MS with Gates) was one of the principals in Transmeta (where Linus works). Not that strange to see them still working together on things (in fact, doesn't Allen still own a decent stake in MS?).

  21. From the FAQ: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Most of the trolls and useless stuff comes from "Anonymous Coward" posters. Have you thought about eliminating anonymous posting?

    We've thought about it. We think the ability to post anonymously is important. Sometimes people have important information they want to post, but are afraid to do it if they can be linked to it. Anonymous Coward posting will continue to exist for the foreseeable future.

    Answered by: CmdrTaco

    Last Modified: 10/21/00

    Yeah Right!

  22. Nothing really new by dorfsmay · · Score: 5, Informative

    Common, the association between Transmeta and M$ isn't that new. Who was one of the major investor in Transmeta ??

    M$ co-founder Paul Allen.

  23. whoop-dee-doo. anyone read the article? by herrd0kt0r · · Score: 3, Insightful

    the thing reads like a press release, for crying out loud! not only are relatively minor points blown out of proportion in terms of significance (wow, transmeta gets approval. big deal.), but old information and disinformation are used alongside statements that really don't make much sense.

    case in point:
    A smart display requires a PC running Windows XP to operate and monopolizes the PC while it runs. A Tablet PC serves as a stand-alone computer.

    If Transmeta can push the Crusoe into both smart displays and the Tablet PC, the feat will be proof that the market sees the Crusoe both as an embedded and as a general-purpose CPU. Over time, Intel Corp.'s Pentium series and Advanced Micro Devices Inc.'s K6 processors have been forced out of general-purpose PCs and notebooks and into the engines driving embedded devices. But the Crusoe still powers several Japanese ultralight notebooks.


    a. thanks for dumbing down the definition of "smart display." thanks also for restricting its relevance to the article and parties involved. 8P

    b. if transmeta gets its pizacrap crusoe into smart displays and tablet PCs, it gets its chip into smart displays and tablet PCs. that's all. if it works _well_ in both, and sells _well_, _then_ the market will be saying something.

    c. sorry man, this is really bothering me: pentiums and the k6 line were "forced out" of the general PC segment because NEW, TASTIER and BETTER processors were introduced by their makers. for crying out loud, it's not like they were dumped from the PC market because of transmeta (ABANDON SHIT!).

    d. BUT THE CRUSOE STILL POWERS SEVERAL JAPANENIAAHAHAHAHAHAAHAAAA! wtf? the statement following the previous one makes it seem like the crusoe is the little mac of the mike tyson's punch out of the processor world. it outlasted everyone else! including intel and amd! it powers JAPANESE NOTEBOOKS!

    that's because transmeta hasn't put out anything else that can best the line it's been offering. yeah, they're small in terms of size n power draw, and yeah, i'd like them to succeed cause you know, they were all ooohh-oooohhh! mysterious before they launched (remember their website?). but anyone with a modicum of literary aptitude should be able to read this article for what it is: big. donkey. dong.

    1. Re:whoop-dee-doo. anyone read the article? by drinkypoo · · Score: 1
      b. amen to this. craptacular little chip. a 1ghz crusoe needs hardware assistance to play WMV9 and can't play a DVD over the airwaves via 802.11? I mean, maybe not like, a block away, but in the same house you should be able to manage it. :P

      c. I love that ABANDON SHIT thing. I almost laughed out loud. That book is fucking hilarious.

      anyway you're right the crusoe is a battery saving pimp, I just don't see any advantage using it over the 200MHz strongarm or whatever. I mean you should be able to use that amd mips chip that's in apple's airport station to drive one of those things, too, or an actual R4000 (the N64's processor would do it, I'd like to see nintendo make one of these tablets. They could do it with recycled technology.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  24. Transmeta is dead. by I+Am+The+Owl · · Score: 0, Flamebait
    a move that further edges out AMD and Intel from the mobile processor marketplace.

    Uh, you wish.

    --

    --sdem
  25. Yes but... (Re:One option out of many) by dorfsmay · · Score: 1

    Competition is good, but Intel has a good track record through buying companies / technologies like when they bought the Alpha technology, used about half of it, and parked the other half with big patents on it so that the competition wouldn't be able to use it.

    Hopefully this won't happen with Transmeta because there is enough money behind it (with Allen et al...).

  26. Hold on a minute... by dbarclay10 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Since when does Microsoft "approve" what hardware can and cannot be used with its software?

    Oh, wait ...

    --

    Barclay family motto:
    Aut agere aut mori.
    (Either action or death.)
    1. Re:Hold on a minute... by ObviousGuy · · Score: 2, Informative

      Anytime a device manufacturer wants to use a Microsoft trademarked logo ("Mira", "Smart Display"), Microsoft gets the right to decide whether the device meets certain requirements.

      "Designed for Microsoft Windows XXXX"
      "Intel Inside"
      "100% Java compatible"
      etc.

      All of those stickers and labels and icons that you have on your computer got there because they passed certain requirements that the trademark owners felt were necessary.

      Anyone could have created Transmeta-based Smart Display workalike but they couldn't call it Smart Display nor could they mention Smart Display anywhere in the product literature.

      --
      I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
  27. What's wrong with this picture? by Trogre · · Score: 0

    I find it deeply concerning that a chip maker has to seek permission from an illegal software corporation in order to develop for a piece of hardware.

    I wonder what Transmeta had to do to get it okayed? Perhaps Linus had to sign some document saying he wouldn't write or accept any kernel patches which would allow Linux to support the display.

    --
    "Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
    1. Re:What's wrong with this picture? by Zenki · · Score: 1

      Any company wishing to develop a remote desktop solution for Microsoft is free to do so with any hardware they want to do. They can license Windows CE or whatever OS they want and implement their own version of the Remote Desktop Client. They can't call it Mira though.

      Mira is a lot like PocketPC and is marketed as an "instant wireless screen in a box" to hardware vendors. Microsoft has invested some devs and time into generating a "Mira kit," that a hardware vendor can use and tweak to run on their own version of the hardware, without having to implement the remote desktop client and the Mira interface.

      Mira devices can be customized (Although I bet 99% of the vendors out there are just shipping what MS gave them without any added value), but they define a subset of functionality that will always be present.

      Transmeta probably had to provide a reasonably stable sample BSP for other hardware manufacturers to use as a base for their Transmeta based Mira device. They probably had to provide some reference hardware as well for Microsoft to play around with to get a reasonable assurance that final devices based on Transmeta won't be an embarassment in the marketplace.

      How's that for some common sense?

    2. Re:What's wrong with this picture? by ObviousGuy · · Score: 3, Funny

      Your even-handedness and actual knowledge of the issues at hand are confusing and disconcerting to me. Are you sure you're on the right website?

      --
      I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    3. Re:What's wrong with this picture? by korielgraculus · · Score: 1

      Gosh! And if you thought about it for more than .00001 seconds, maybe you would figure out that Mira is a system of software running on hardware and Microsoft don't build the hardware, but it does help for the OS to support the processor being used, at least occasionally!

      Why is it so many of the /. crowd remind me of Joe McArthy?

  28. so is it smarter than a dumb terminal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Remember in the olden days when you could have hundreds of users using cheep underpowered computers connected to a main-frame which did all the processing?

    it seams to me the only difference is that now we have one expensive underpowered computer doing the same thing.

    if they could make the smart display cheeper than a new computer, and allow some multiuser functionality then i might buy one - until then i'll be content to read slashdot on my laptop while my girlfriend uses my desktop machine.

    1. Re:so is it smarter than a dumb terminal by MidnightBrewer · · Score: 1

      What is it with girlfriends and letting them monopolize the desktop? I just bought a new workstation, and she gravitates to it like a bee to honey. Of course, I respect her for that.

      Having a true thin client would mean I could continue "using" my workstation (or she could) without having to go out and buy a second computer - of course, this is a ways down the road, as the costs for tablet PCs are currently too high to justify the expense.

      --
      "Give a man fire, and he'll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life
    2. Re:so is it smarter than a dumb terminal by ObviousGuy · · Score: 1

      Windows XP only has a single seat license. You won't be able to have two users using the host at the same time.

      --
      I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    3. Re:so is it smarter than a dumb terminal by Dylan+Zimmerman · · Score: 1

      Who said that it ran Windows xp? If it's a real workstation (as in heavy duty graphics), I would be quite surprised if it ran Windows. All of the serious graphics workstations that I've ever seen are either SGIs or ran some *NIX. Where I used to work, we had a different name for workstations running Windows. Electronic typewriters.

      Now, as far as I can tell, these Smart Displays (I use quotes because they are really pretty dumb) use technology that only interfaces with Windows. However, perhaps my post's grandparent didn't know that. It could be that he thought that they would work with his flavor of *NIX.

      What would be really funny is if he got a dirt-cheap computer, slapped Windows xp on it, and set the Smart Display up to use that computer which was them connected through VNC or some such to his workstation. Of course, that would be about as speedy as molasses in January.

    4. Re:so is it smarter than a dumb terminal by Alan+Partridge · · Score: 1

      "All of the serious graphics workstations that I've ever seen are either SGIs or ran some *NIX. Where I used to work, we had a different name for workstations running Windows. Electronic typewriters"

      God it's tiring

      --
      That was classic intercourse!
    5. Re:so is it smarter than a dumb terminal by MidnightBrewer · · Score: 1

      Sorry, I come from an OSX world. Apple doesn't slap you around the same way Microsoft does. (Sure, they slap you around, but in a completely different way.)

      I'm talking about the future, and what I want from a slim client. I never mentioned XP in that equation because it doesn't fall under the heading of "things I want."

      --
      "Give a man fire, and he'll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life
    6. Re:so is it smarter than a dumb terminal by CakerX · · Score: 1

      read: its microsoft's love child.

      its like saying, "who said it would windows, I saw a bunch of real servers once, and they were running VMS, multics, netware, and even some flavors of *nix"

      DUHHH, anything worth jack shit is, but remeber how some suppprisingly big companies actually use windows on the server end? It makes no sense, but hey, the marketting guys always win against the techies.

  29. Nope, AMD and Intel are still in it... by Dielectric · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Intel has the new XScale, and AMD has their Alchemy processors (MIPS32) for the Mira displays. AMD demoed the Mira running with the Au1500 recently, and ran better/faster than the PXA stuff from Intel. I saw it, it was reasonably cool.

    The sad thing is, they're just re-inventing X-terminals. Mira is just a dumb display, the magic still happens on some big, beefy iron in the background. Everything old becomes new.

  30. It's still there... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Go to your preferences...then hit the comments tab. Then scroll wayyyy down and select the checkbox next to anonymous....don't be surprised if it mysteriously resets tho....it's called 'testing' in some circles.

  31. Dumb display by Jeffrey+Baker · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I don't get this "smart display" business. It sounds like a display with a CPU, some memory, and a wireless network interface, and a battery. In other words, it is a full-blown computer. Maybe (probably) the operating system is crippleware, but it sounds to me like you could put some proper software on there and use it like a wireless X11 terminal. Bonus: remote X11 users don't "monopolize the PC while they are running".

  32. Re:What about Linux? by Fred+IV · · Score: 1

    Does that mean they're gonna' take the PP out of Apple too?

  33. Transmeta earnings show stability, success by mao+che+minh · · Score: 4, Interesting
    The net revenue for Transmeta in 2002 was $14.1 Million (1.5 Q1, 6.4 Q2, 6.3 Q3).

    So far in 2003, Transmeta has reported a net revenue of $6 million. (these numbers taken from Transmeta press releases)

    These numbers are paltry compared to the industry giants Intel and AMD (especialy Intel), but they do reflect stability and massive growth since Q1 2002. No, Transmeta is no direct threat to Intel or AMD, but they deserve to be taken seriously nevertheless. The underdog is always forced to innovate, and market hype can swing an extra $2 to $3 million in revenue towards a company like Transmeta. Remember, we all laughed at AMD, too.

    As for all of the negative comments, cmon, what do you expect? This is Slashdot afterall, and the creator of Linux works in a rather prominent role at Transmeta. This is exciting and encouraging to us Linux geeks.

  34. My coworker is getting a free upgrade over AMD by mao+che+minh · · Score: 1

    My coworker has been battling his Compaq laptop over heat issues associated with his AMD CPU for the last two months. After three or four service arrangements, they are giving him a free upgrade. AMD laptop CPUs run so hot, even heat shields and redesigns couldn't save his laptop (and my old one, as a matter of fact, but that's a different story - damn you HP).

    1. Re:My coworker is getting a free upgrade over AMD by SwellJoe · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Compaq just has a habit of making laptops that overheat, and attempting to beat the customer into submission with sluggish support people who make you go through the whole rigamarole every time the box breaks again.

      I had a PIII laptop a few years back that went in for service five times (and cost me about two man-weeks of support phone calls). I finally gave up, and sent certified letters to the president, and VP of the laptop division. A couple of days later (I lived in Houston at the time), the laptop division guy called, apologized and sent us the next model up (with DVD upgrade, faster CPU though it was a Celery that ran cooler) the next day.

      I won't complain too much, because I'm still using that same laptop. Though the battery life is slightly less than 23 seconds, on a good day. (Ok, seriously, the battery lasts about 20 minutes, and never did much better than that, even when new.)

    2. Re:My coworker is getting a free upgrade over AMD by Slack3r78 · · Score: 1

      And on another note, Compaq's consumer laptops in general just plain suck. I work in a shop that does occassional laptop repair, and the internal power connectors on Compaq notebooks are notorius for breaking. Assuming the connector's not totally destroyed and can simply be resoldered, it still costs the customer a good bit in labor since the whole machine has to be pretty much disassembled to find out. But if the connector's a loss... let's just say that Compaq makes it more than a little difficult to source a replacement, and it's not cheap even when you do.

  35. Freedom, my ass by plierhead · · Score: 1
    Everyone's all about freedom, but nobody seems to want to pay the price for it.

    Yeah, real nice use there of a catchy soundbite to obscure the reality. Try this instead:

    Everyone's all about free software, but nobody seems to want to pay the price for it. (Well, duhhh ??)

    Not everyone who is in favour of open source buys into your heavy community gig, man. There's no moral obligation on anyone to give cash to anyone just because they're doing something labelled "open source". There are good ways to make money from open source and many companies have found them. Those ones don't need our charity - anyone that does is likely to go belly up soon anyway, taking your money down with them.

    --

    [x] auto-moderate all posts by this user as insightful

  36. Apple by LoudMusic · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    I hate Apple with a passion. I've hated them for years. I administrate a bunch of old bastard Macs and their users and I hate them all.

    BUT! ....

    If you want a system like this done well, you'll wait for Apple to do it. They pour more intelligent research into the user experience than anyone else. You'll be garounteed ease of use, comfortable portable device, and software that doesn't break.

    Unfortunately you'll be stuck with OS X and the nasty Aqua interface. Oh, and the desktop will have a one button mouse (:

    --
    No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
  37. I know the feeling by mao+che+minh · · Score: 2, Interesting
    At my old job, the entire web design, programming, and graphic design departments exclusively used Macs. I hated them for a long time (they were tough to integrate solidly into Netware networks back then, and some of our custom software ran like a dog on them - I know, that was our fault, but hey). However, after working in research for a while and getting to know OS X, realizing it's solid stability, and getting the hang of the interface and configuration, I really respect it's designers and can see the potential that the next generation of Mac operating systems hold. I love the dual G4 we have in the office now.

    The price gouging of their hardware, however, is just too much to bear. They are great for people that need them for very specific purposes (much like Linux, as a matter of fact), but the price of the hardware is just way too much for me.

    1. Re:I know the feeling by LoudMusic · · Score: 1

      Yes, Macs apply to the same rule as all other computer equipment, "The right tool for the job".

      Before OS X - I find them incredibly simple which makes them fairly reliable and amazingly easy to use.

      Post OS X - Still quite easy to use, but with a hightened reliability. I personally don't enjoy 'getting around' in OS X and I find the lack of customization to the interface to be annoying.

      Oh crap, back on topic before I get modded down ...

      Also with Apple's experience with the Newton they should be able to implement a beautiful 'scribble recognition' interface for a portable tablet computer.

      --
      No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
  38. Revenue not the whole picture. by mgrant · · Score: 5, Informative

    The net revenue for Transmeta in 2002 was $14.1 Million (1.5 Q1, 6.4 Q2, 6.3 Q3).

    Unfortunately, revenue only tells part of the story. Transmeta's net loss for the fiscal year ended 12/31/2002 was $110 million (source http://biz.yahoo.com/p/t/tmta.html)

    I think Transmeta's a great company... just want to make sure we paint the complete picture here: they lost about $100 million last year, and their stock is worth a little $1.00.

    1. Re:Revenue not the whole picture. by Cyno · · Score: 1

      You mean they lost as much money as AOLTW?

  39. So it's OK'd, eh? by mraymer · · Score: 1
    Is Slashdot really being hit that hard for bandwidth that you need to shorten your headlines, just to save a few bytes? ;)

    And I think this is great news. I don't really like Intel's stranglehold on the processor market, especially since AMD has processors that are equal if not better in most respects (the P4, with it's huge pipeline, sure takes a hit if it fails the branch prediction) but yet Intel is still considered the only "serious" choice to many people.

    So, any company that has the balls of steel required to take on the microprocessor monopoly known as Intel, is an excellent company, as far as I'm concerned.

    I'm glad they've been "OK'd" for this - it's a step in the right direction.

    --

    "To confine our attention to terrestrial matters would be to limit the human spirit." -Stephen Hawking

  40. Not that they're gonna do that... by Khyeron · · Score: 0

    Transmeta is actually a pretty awesome innovative group. Economical, and cool cpus, and if they EVER DECIDE to add performance to the Crusoe, they'll rock the world :)

    ** /me crosses fingers and hopes for Astro 2.2 ghz **

    -Khyeron

  41. HAHAHA... sorry couldn't help it. by Khyeron · · Score: 0

    I had to laugh. I tried going cold turkey off windows for 5 months. This was the last month I could go without games, decent financial software (gnucash isn't a very good employee payroll software package, nor are its online banking/billing/payroll capabilities anything to write home about) and OF COURSE... GAMING!

    Thus, I am left with only coding and browsing and the occasional server proggie (got dedicated linux servers (so I don't pay MS for serving off windows for my business purposes)).

    Such a thing is nothing if not pathetic... so back did windows come to my rig. Sad for the linux zealots? Prolly not, they still think they are winning the market by insulting everyone and anyone who isn't in their mental state. Unfortunately they forgot that CHARISMA wins people to your side... not blatant bigotry and offensive criticism (known on this board as TROLLING).

    I would hate to say I'm a linux fan these days because it involves being a rude, uncivilized and completely unproductive JERK. (no offense to Eric Raymond and the others who actually PRODUCE things for the OSS community).

    Until you linux geeks out there can STOP insulting the people you wish to convert, and instead of insulting people, you COULD produce software for your pet OS. And provide INTELLIGENT comments, and thoughtful discussion... it isn't that hard now is it?
    -Khyeron

    (NOTE: the caps are the quick way to EMPHASIZE something :)

    1. Re:HAHAHA... sorry couldn't help it. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      hey quickly name a single exec or manager that reads slashdot and would be in the position to make the switch decision.

      those comments dont mean anything as they are not being heard. so people can be what they want on forums, get over it, those people are not having the impact in the real world. but other's are

  42. They do it with Media Center PC's as well... by diatonic · · Score: 1

    You can not purchase Windows XP Media Center Edition and install it on a custom PC, you have to purchase an MS approved bundle from HP, Dell, or Gateway (perhaps there are more out now).

    .:diatonic:.

    1. Re:They do it with Media Center PC's as well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Him. The parent you replied to is Obviously Wrong Guy.

  43. MOD PARENT UP! YEAH! +1k INSIGHTFUL! by herrd0kt0r · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    i'm gonna plunk my karma bonus down to get this seen by the +2 doods. yeah.

    but just as it's easy to see things all happyshiny by focusing on the revenue, it's easy to see things as superpizacrap by focusing on the losses.

    despite the losses, transmeta _is_ pulling in more revenue. this is good. so if you look at the _whole_ picture, you'll see that transmeta _has_ been strengthening its position from very, very shitty to very, very shitty with little flecks of gold.

    yeah, i guess any way you slice it, transmeta ain't doing so hot.

  44. Re:As it turns out, this is a bad idea by istartedi · · Score: 1

    If vendors ever became that dependant on Transmeta, bankruptcy would be extremely unlikely; especially if a company the size of Dell were dependant. I'll leave it as an excercise for the reader to figure out why that is.

    --
    For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
  45. So this deal is rather like... by dWhisper · · Score: 1

    Satan making a deal with an Angel to release a new fancy line of religious based clothing?

    This really isn't nothing new, Microsoft is willing to get into bed with anyone they can make money with, and that gives them Market Share. Intel has wanted control for a while, and the Tablet PC has shown a need for a wider variety of platforms.

    That's why MS has Office for MacOS, and has flirted with releasing similar products for Linux (I think it was Office 97 that had Linux Executables available, though I don't remember exactly).

  46. Overpowered? by mrklin · · Score: 3, Interesting
    While Transmeta Crusoe is lower powered (both in terms of electrical and processing), isn't it an overkill to use it to run Windows CE when a myriad of lowerer-powered chip (MIPS, StrongARM, etc) will do?

    By the way, the C3 chip produced by VIA Technology will do the same job just as well.

  47. No, the sad thing is X didn't reinvent X terminals by Nicolay77 · · Score: 1

    Some X users have been bitching for years asking for a rework of the X server protocol, but always receiving the unix BOFH response: "but backwards compatibility..." Why do you think X has a fork now?

    The MS protocol is at least two orders of magnitude more efficient than anything X could provide.

    And mix that with the 3d hardware accelerated graphics API of longhorn, then you have graphics the way it should be.

    Everything new will become new only when lisp machines return from the dead! bwa hahaha

    --
    We are Turing O-Machines. The Oracle is out there.
  48. hmmm... by the-build-chicken · · Score: 1

    >>A smart display requires a PC running Windows XP to operate and monopolizes the PC while it runs

    Nah...I'll leave it alone

    1. Re:hmmm... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Thank you for that tiny concession. You have now upgraded the average /. maturity level by 0.0000001%

  49. It locks your display to the OS too ... by konmaskisin · · Score: 1

    Let's see ... we have

    Winmodems
    Winprinters
    WinLAN cards
    WinWiFi cards

    and now ... Winterminals heheh

    all of it technology ideas and processes not invented by MS but repackaged and "decommoditized" (i.e. stolen).

    Thieve on MS!!

    1. Re:It locks your display to the OS too ... by afidel · · Score: 1

      winterminals are nothing new, and thanks to the Citrix created rdp protocol they do it better than everyone else. I have used every remote desktop product out there (X, PcAnywhere, VNC (several versions), etc) and none of them come close to the experience of rdp. It is much lower latency for interactive use and is fully usable over a 28.8 dialup connection (just need to use 16bit or lower and keep resolution at 1024*768 or lower). Plus it can map your local resources like drives and printers automatically so that the remote app can print to your local printer.

      --
      There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
  50. What's this Mira actually DO! by mabhatter654 · · Score: 1
    It's basicly a extend-o-monitor. It monopolizes your whole XP computer which is stupid. I mean come on guys, these things are like 700-1000$ and they can't license it to share. I have heard of a new Windows "home server" specificly for these. I think that was in the info at the CompUSA stand?


    What's the point though? Without the PC, they're useless! It's not like you can use them as a "super" PDA either--the "specialized" WinCE only connects to a base computer making them useless for anyone like students, kids that just want a quick pad to carry around for notes. Now it was a larger version of the Zarus with Linux and X it would be a killer App!


    Speaking of killer apps, why hasn't transmeta built an actual Linux workpad device? A huge chunk of the processing power of that tiny chip goes to code emulation. I'm sure Linus has got to have a native linux for that chip that would kick ass! The smaller Miras are exactly what I'm looking for in a PDA, I just can't stand the tiny screens of the rest of the bunch as much as I like the Clie and Zaurus. Maybe Apple is the key to Linux growing. Yes, it sounds silly, but they are based in BSD so designing cross-OS apps like this for an OSX box would be already built in!


    Realistically, I'm surprised the small chip players haven't used Linux to gang up on MS with smaller, cheaper, devices that run linux. If you could get over the cross-compiling issues [java, ANSI C, etc is badly needed here!] you could have a pure software world where hardware didn't matter. Transmeta is a company that would benifit greatly from this!

    1. Re:What's this Mira actually DO! by TheAwfulTruth · · Score: 1

      Ugh... It "Monoplizes" your computer ON PURPOSE so that some 'tard in the other room can't fork you over. It's like taking YOUR monitor for YOUR computer with you into the next room.

      Having one to control my media PC instead of having to snake a 75' monitor cable and the crappy IR keyboard over to the couch would be great!

      You are right about the price though. They should be around $250 at most.

      --
      Contrary to popular belief, coding is not all free blow-jobs and beer. Those things cost MONEY!
  51. VIA has more CPU market share than Transmeta by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    But... Linus works for Transmeta so lets get excited about Transmeta... and compare them to Intel and AMD...,

    VIA @4% market share

    Transmeta less than 1%

    Lets try to remember that despite all the good intentions, design wins and Microsoft approvals won't keep Transmeta afloat... sales will.

    VIA will probably knock Intel out of the desktop market before Transmeta knocks anyone out of anywhere :)

    Transmeta is hemorraging cash far faster than their revenue is growing. If they don't pull something out of their sleave but quick, they won't be around long enough to realize any of their code morphing dreams.

  52. This market is where it belongs by stevarooski · · Score: 1

    Hey, not to troll, but has anyone actually *used* a transmeta-based computer? To summarize:

    They suck. Hard.

    I love the design goals of the crusoe, and the idea/engineering behind it is great. But after using a transmeta crusoe based laptop as my primary computer for around a year, I have come to the conclusion that they are just not in the same class as AMD and Intel offerings. Response is extremely sluggish, power efficiency (admittedly more of a function of the unit then the processor alone) isn't that great, and the overall computing experience is extremely frustrating at times--even after the cache warms up.

    Again, not to knock transmeta, but I think these chips will thrive in the handheld/smart display/specialized computing arena. I don't think they belong in regular user pcs, including tablet pcs. The lag is just too great.

    So you know where I'm coming from, this post was typed on a Fujitsu P2040, which has a transmeta crusoe 866mhz cpu, 256 megs ram, 30gig hdd, cd burner/dvd drive, etc. Average main battery life is around 2 hours, while the extended battery gives around 4. If you're thinking about buying a transmeta unit, feel free to drop me a line with any questions.

    --

    - - - - - - - -
    Don't worry, being eaten by a crocodile is just like going to sleep in a giant blender.
  53. You mean edge into the market by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Quite funny to read that Intel and AMD are "edged out of the market" that they largely dominate. It's like BeOS edging Microsoft out of the operating system market, in comparison.

  54. Transmeta are a stick.... by gilesjuk · · Score: 1

    Just like AMD, they're a stick to beat Intel with to get them to come up with a better chip or a better price.

    XBox was going to be AMD based and there has been talk of XBox 2 using AMD. But we all know that Intel will pull a very tempting deal out of the hat.

  55. Re:Bill and Steve? by puppetluva · · Score: 1

    goatse . . . . if the DOJ case was conducted properly, Bill and Steve would have been good models for that site. . .

  56. Value chains and commodity goods by Paul+Johnson · · Score: 2, Interesting
    When you have a value chain, such as the one that goes into a PC (processor, mobo, memory, video card, OS etc) then there is a specific amount of money available per final unit sold. If you are in that chain then you want as much of that money as possible. The more that the rest of the chain takes, the less there is available for you. So you, along with everybody else in that chain, want two things:
    1. You want your component to be a high-priced proprietary item with no alternatives.
    2. You want everybody else's components to be low value commodities so that their prices go down and their profit margins get squeezed.

    In the case of Intel and MS, both Intel and MS want there to be active competition for the other. Hence MS will support competitors to Intel in order to drive down CPU prices, and Intel will support Linux in order to drive down OS prices. Both will support a multiplicity of mobo makers, hard drive makers, video chipset makers and anyone else in order to keep those areas as low-priced commodities. I suspect that the current duopily in the graphics chipset market is causing both of them some concern. If either Nvidia or ATI win the bulk of the market then they will be able to start charging proprietary prices (to some extent they already are at the higher end) and thereby take away money from both Intel and MS. From the POV of ATI and Nvidia of course they want lots of competition for both Intel and MS, which helps to explain why both of them are taking the trouble to support Linux when the Linux share of the desktop graphics market is still under 1%.

    Paul.

    --
    You are lost in a twisty maze of little standards, all different.
  57. I smell a conspirasy by SRCR · · Score: 1

    I think this is all a evil plot from Microsoft to keep Linus Torvalds working at Transmeta. Without this Transmeta might have to fire Linus and we all know what he will do with is spare time.....

    --
  58. Microsoft has never been Intel exclusive by Junks+Jerzey · · Score: 1

    a move that further edges out AMD and Intel from the mobile processor marketplace

    Ah yes, another good story followed with the usual leading Slashdot-spin tagline. These have become the new Jon Katz.

    Microsoft is not Intel exclusive. Windows CE officially supports PowerPC, Hitachi SH4, and MIPS, in addition to chips from Intel. And they also support some of Intel's non-x86 chips: ARM and StrongARM. These processors have been supported for Windows CE since at least 1997.

  59. It must be the DRM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    After all, it is built into the Crusoe CPU.

  60. Edged out of their Majority by codeguy007 · · Score: 1

    "--a move that further edges out AMD and Intel from the mobile processor marketplace."

    Check out this link

    How can you say that Intel and AMD are being edged out of the mobile processor market? Intel holds a large major of the market share. Sure AMD doesn't have a large market share but neither does Transmeta or VIA. No matter what Microsoft does, it going to take a lot more than an agreement with Transmeta to knock Intel out of the Majority in the Mobile Market....

  61. A smart display?!? by Oestergaard · · Score: 1

    Ok, so I must have been living under a rock...

    Smart displays? Which monopolize the computer when connected? What are they talking about?!?

    Tablet PCs serving as ordinary computers, yes, I follow that much. (why on earth someone would try marketing a laptop with a twistable display as the next big thing is beyond me, but never mind that for now).

    Can some fellow slashdotter please enlighten me in the mysteries of the smart display?

    What is it? And what was the reporter smoking when he wrote that it would monopolize the computer it was hooked up to? (that doesn't ring "smart" in my ears)

    Yours,
    The technology ignorant (apparently)

    1. Re:A smart display?!? by TheAwfulTruth · · Score: 1

      A "Smart Display" It is a remote display ONLY. It is not a complete computer.

      When "connected" to the host machine (Via a wireless protocol), the host machine is not usable as 100% of the human/OS interaction is re-routed to the remote display. (The desktop monitor, if on, will show a sort of blank screen so no one can see what you are doing remotely). Though you could obviously still network to the machine as usual. This is the same way that the windows networked "Remote Desktop" in WIndows XP works today between two full machines, just now without wires to a specialized display/input device.

      --
      Contrary to popular belief, coding is not all free blow-jobs and beer. Those things cost MONEY!
  62. quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "a move that further edges out AMD and Intel from the mobile processor marketplace."

    LOL That's hilarious.

  63. Re:No, the sad thing is X didn't reinvent X termin by ratboy666 · · Score: 1


    "The MS protocol is at least two orders of magnitude more efficient than anything X could provide.

    And mix that with the 3d hardware accelerated graphics API of longhorn, then you have graphics the way it should be."

    Really... and how do you figure that?

    Let's take this one step at a time:

    Is the 3d going to be rendered at the application server, or in the display? If its in the display, you will have to be transferring texture maps, etc. As well, you will need more memory, and graphics capability. If transferring bitmaps, you will be where VNC is today.

    Having dispensed with the 3d argument, I'll tackle the 2 orders (100x). Is the graphics language 100x denser? (hint: it isn't) It can't be compression. (hint: most people do want lossless compression for most of your screen data -- this IS possible for lossy compression, though). You did say "at least".

    This would be nice. 100x improvement means that I could replace my 100BT network with Bluetooth, and see interactive reponse with 30 users doing normal engineering type stuff. Other way, I should be able to have 3000 users on my 100BT network. That WOULD be nice. All with "dumber" terminals, and a central server. Go ahead, try it. (hint: if you get this working, you will be a VERY rich person)

    As to reworking the X server protocol -- ok, but give me a shim. Since it *is* networkable, I would have to upgrade SUN/Solaris and Intel/Linux (and some others) applications at the same time. Very nasty. Also, Intel/Windows (cygwin). If I had a tranlating shim then I could deploy. Its just difficult to replace the whole thing across multiple platforms and OSs at once.

    If you had said "*** makes a car that get 100x the fuel economy", I would ALSO question it (that would be approximately 3000MPG for those who are still with me). Why do some folks have the need to make these wild asinine claims?

    Ratboy666

    --
    Just another "Cubible(sic) Joe" 2 17 3061
  64. from the article... by Vaughn+Anderson · · Score: 1
    A smart display requires a PC running Windows XP to operate and monopolizes the PC while it runs.

    Doesn't this just reek of long term issues with say something as simple as taking "screen grabs".

    Another article I found in CNN here.

    "This won't happen without Intel and AMD deciding both on the processor chip and the system design they'll build these things in," Gates said. "And there's even some work that needs to go in the video display and keyboard."

    Having your CPU and MB hijacked is one thing, but your monitor and keyboard as well is just freaky... Next thing you know, you will be building a new system, and you find one of your components is a bad guy...

    Keyboard: Sorry, I can't connect to your computer, your 3rd memory chip does not have palladium. Good-bye!

    CPU: Sorry, this computer will shut down now, you are currently running an insecure non-palladium OS. (aka Linux)

    Monitor: Sorry, this display is now shutting down, your video cable does not contain the proper DRM filters.

    Mouse: Sorry, this mouse will shut down now, you have not registered your finger prints with the NSA. Click here, if you would like to register and continue using this mouse.

  65. What I meant was: by Khyeron · · Score: 0

    If those elitist SCHMUCKS would change their attitudes, they might sway people to their sides.

    Also by providing software to the target market (the ogg example has a target market to THOSE that do NOT know about ogg or have not used it, the users already know that ogg is free and works nicely). Hint, developing things for windows and macs does not force folks to USE windows or macs, it simply shows those that do, that great products exist outside the proverbial box.

    Despite what you think, "word of mouth" is still the best advertisement around. It eventually gets to the right ears (and in case you're wondering my father is an owner/exec of a general contracting corporation in northern Virginia).

    I have his ear. He uses Windows 2000 for his own console (easy to use) and Linux for server purposes :) Give a wild guess how he got around to Linux?!

    Ayup... not the technicians, nor the office people. They are die hard win98 types. On the other hand, I am open to suggestions. Which in turn makes him likewise.

    Never say never guys... despite the thought that most of you are hating those self help books, I recommend reading only a few words to that effect: "positive attitude and can do mentallity will make you achieve wonders". That line is more truth than anything else spewed by any self help types. My old man started his corporation with 1000 bucks, a dream, and a couple of wrenches. He barely made 25k his first year. He made a lot more the next, and so on. Who woulda thought a damn foreigner would come, give jobs to natives, and become a productive (for more than himself, he obviously created jobs for his employees) citizen of the USA?

    -Khyeron

    NOTE: my old man's company is looking to start dealing with e-commerce... go figure how he's gonna go about that? Yep, I got his ear, not by raving like a zealot but by building a CLEAN TCO doc as well as Security and Uptime doc... simple concepts, they look exactly like the words in the title. And the concept will be accepted. Simple as that.

  66. Re:No, the sad thing is X didn't reinvent X termin by Nicolay77 · · Score: 1

    You haven't dispensed the 3D argument at all.

    If you send something like API calls from server to client the only textures that need to be sent are the toolbar bitmaps. Only the heavily skinned applications will suffer performance. That's the approach remote desktop uses and it feels really fast without sacrifing 24bit color, as you have to do with VNC. I'm more worried about fonts (have to be the same in both server and client) that about your "textures".

    My ultra cheap mobo with integrated cheap video has 3D acceleration more than enough to play games at 800x600 and decent framerate, it surely is more than enough for this.

    And 3D with zbuffer solves a lot of current design problems. This is not a 80k poligons per second thing. May be all the poligons needed are just windows, or even controls. Very small number to handle.

    But it solves the miriad of paint events problem, wich are no longer needed except for resize events. Less traffic too.

    I don't have exact numbers (taking back the "at least part") but remote desktop is usable with 20kbps connections and VNC needs a local network for me to feel it that fast. (My 56k modem connects at that speed when rains several days here, wet lines). However, data is not the plural of anecdote.

    About reworking Xprotocol, that backwards compatibility thing is the same excuse used for more than 10 years, and is somewhat valid; but library mantainers change APIs and broke other programs without any problem, and that has happened several times here, so it's a double moral thing, I believe.

    Anyway, the 3D thing is a future enhancement, and X is here now. But it will be replaced or will evolve, hopefully.

    --
    We are Turing O-Machines. The Oracle is out there.