Half-Life 2 NDA Lifted - Online Previews Available

captainstupid writes "The first Half-Life 2 previews are hitting the Web, and Shacknews seems to have the first post-NDA preview." There's also a preview at IGN.com, and another at Gamespy, plus yet another at Gamespot, giving us a whole cornucopia of different looks at what may be the most keenly awaited PC game of the year.

Comments

Hmm

[tomthebomb]

Hopefully, this game is a genre-changer, like Half-Life was, and not a flop, like Unreal 2 was. I have very high expectations for HL2, because HL was my favorite game for a very long time. Judging from screenshots I've seen, it will have very good graphics, maybe even Doom 3 class, but will probably require a powerful computer. Hopefully, this engine will be mod-able, as the original HL engine was, because the Counter-Strike and Natural Selection teams could do so much more with the HL2 engine judging from the screenshots...let's just hope this game isn't another Unreal 2.

Re:Hmm

[Anonymous Coward]

but will probably require a powerful computer.

Gosh, I hope powerful computers become available.

I might be overly-optimistic, but hopefully this will spur advances in microprocessor technology, which has been so stillborn and stagnant for the last ..... um ..... few days.

Re:Hmm

[niai]

What I want to know is when are we gonna see some new genres? as opposed to ANOTHER fps?

Hopefully Peter Molyneux will pull something out of the hat in the god game genre and his movie making business game. What other new games are coming that are actually based on NEW concepts?

Re:Hmm

[Fweeky]

Hopefully, this engine will be mod-able

The PC Zone preview stated on no uncertain terms that they're taking modding very seriously. Artists are the ones who are going to have to worry; they'll have much higher standards to live up to. Aside from that, though, they seem pretty confident that it's going to be easier than modding the original - especially for level designers.

Re:Hmm

[KDan]

Yes, they even say they'll have seminars in the summer before the release, for modders to get acquainted with the engine. It would be ridiculous for them not to support mods. Off the top of my head I wouldn't be surprised if over half of the sales of half-life licences are to people who bought it to play online mods like CS, TFC, DoD, etc.

Daniel

Re:Hmm

[Dot.Com.CEO]

Okay, since you are asking, I'll answer. If you are a true gamer, forget pcs for anything original. By the time they come out they are hyped to hell and generally not worth your time. They might be fun, but they are not original. Nothing comes close to consoles for an excellent gaming experience. So, if you are loaded get all 3 major consoles and the big hits. However, realistically, you should place your bets on one of them. Which one? Honestly, Gamecube. It might not have the names you are used to hearing, but you will be able to play two games that are truly amazing, for different reazons, the new Zelda and Metroid Prime. There is nothing on the PC or the consoles that can approach the experience you will have playing those two games, and, frankly, you will find it hard playing anything else after you get drawn to them. I own a PS2, an XBox, a Cube and a high end pc and I haven't touched anything but the cube for the last three months. Forget what you hear (kiddie games, kiddie graphics), if you are a gamer, you have to have a cube - actually, you have to have an Xbox and a PS2, but the cube is a brilliant start...

Re:Hmm

[ZaMoose]

If you are a true gamer, forget pcs for anything original.

Ummmm, wow. That might possibly be the most blinkered statement I've ever read on /., and that's saying a lot.

What you're trying to tell us is that The Sims, Black and White, Grim Fandango, Syndicate/Syndicate Plus, Masters of Orion, System Shock 2 and a whole host of other games that I can't even begin to list are "unoriginal"?

You, sir, should check with your doctor and make sure your dosages are correct, 'cause you've obviously got some misfiring synapses in that little head of yours.

Re:Hmm

[Dot.Com.CEO]

Sir,

I was refering to the current state of affairs. As much as I appreciate Grim Fandango, it did come about five years ago. The same timeframe applies to the rest of the games you so kindly present as "proof". I enjoy the occasional pc game but for originality I turn on my console.

I am looking very much forward to Doom III, Half life etc. but I very much doubt they will reach Metroid Prime and GTA Vice City in terms of innovation. And that was my point. Please note it before attempt it to further reply to my comments, making an effort to quote newer "innovative" games in doing so. Otherwise, kindly don't bother.

Re:Hmm

[ZaMoose]

What, precisely, makes Metroid Prime innovative, apart from the control scheme?

Don't take this as a critique of MP, as it's one of the most enjoyable games I've played in a long time (excepting Wind Waker, which currently has a stranglehold on my precious gaming hours), but I'd say MP is hardly the first adventure/expoloration game born out in full 3D (Thief and Deus Ex come to mind as prior art). I'll grant you that the platforming/morph ball elements are unique, but I don't think they qualify as innovative.

As for FPS innovation: Planetside. Want arcade-y action mixed with your FPS? The upcoming Tron 2.0 looks very interesting. Battlefield 1942 is a recent example of getting a team-based FPS truly, terribly almost right.

A Tale In the Desert is a current example of a game that defies current MMO conventions and instead prides itself on being a virtual community simulation.

Enigma: Rising Tide is wicked fun, as is Moonbase Commander.

How about Mafia? Sure, it's seen ports to the consoles too, but it started on the PC. Or Freelancer?

So speak not to me of "innovation". It abounds on the PC platform.

Re:Hmm

[Dot.Com.CEO]

OK, that's much better. I actually realised that I exaggerated on my first message, but the tone of your reply managed to make me commit to my errant views. Well, worry no more!

Fact is, my personal opinion after being innundated with such excellent games as Zelda WW and Metroid Prime is that I will not find something as powerful on the PC judging by the E3 previews I've seen. I might be mistaken but I see the same old types of games being promoted, MMORPGs and FPS. I thoroughly enjoyed Freelancer (as I did Homeworld which I expected you to mention btw), and the previews for Tron 2.0 seem promissing. But look for a game that will give you the sensation that Metroid Prime did, and you will realise that you won't find it on the PC.

MP btw was innovative not just because of its control scheme. Think of what you felt when you got an upgrade, for example - so many things you could do back there if you could jump that much higher... I was completely immersed in the story. And Zelda, well, I don't know what to say, it only came out a week ago here in Europe and i truly think it is a work of love.

Don't know really, maybe I'm too much into Cube games this period that I cannot appreciate the finer points of pc games that are coming out, so I'm willing to accept your point since you profess a strong preference to Zelda :-)

Re:Hmm

[ZaMoose]

I didn't mention Homeworld, but I sure as heck should have mentioned Homeworld 2. That looks like it may have to go hunting in search of more butt to kick, as current supplies are simply too limited. *grin*

Re:Hmm

[srmalloy]

Hopefully, this engine will be mod-able, as the original HL engine was

The previews explicitly describe this, and from the description, there's going to be a lot more automatic support in the engine for object properties than in the original:

Similarly, while the Half-Life 2 engine might not have floored us from a purely visual standpoint, we were definitely impressed with Valve's intentions to release the engine and the "Hammer" toolset to the mod community even before the release of the game itself. Valve explained that the engine is designed in such a way that objects can automatically acquire the properties of their textures. For example, a mod maker can take a rectangular object and apply a bricklike texture to it, and that object will then automatically function like a brick of that approximate size. It will sink if dropped in water, shatter if shot, make an appropriate noise if stepped on, and so on. Basically, the engine will allow mod makers to quickly and intuitively construct environments using a broad range of realistic surfaces and textures.

So instead of creating an object, texturing it, and then having to define all of its properties, it appears that you will create a texture and define the properties that objects with that texture possess, so that you only have to define properties once unless you want to special-case certain objects. More work for the setup process, but once you've got the textures laid out, much faster on the downside end of things.

NDA lifted...

[stefanlasiewski]

NDA lifted, and slashdot ... curtain ... dropped ...

Good Lord

[Anonymous Coward]

A DX6 compatible D3D capable video card is required. The minimum system specs haven't been divulged but if I were to take a shot in the dark I would say an AthlonXP 2000 or P4 2.2GHz system with a Radeon 9500pro could get the job done reasonably

Translation: "yeah man, since I didn't get to actually play the game, I have no idea about it, but if I name pretty much near the top end of the hardware spectrum I bet that'll work for it. Go buy that."

Re:Good Lord

[eht]

My 3 year old system (700 mhz Athlon with a 64 meg GeForce2 Ultra) has a DX6 compatible card, so to recomend what he does based off of "A DX6 compatible D3D capable video card is required." he has to be nuts.

Re:Good Lord

[Anonymous Coward]

So can someone fill me in on what D3D is? I imagine the 3D part = Three Dimensional?

No idea. Also, the system specs that guy suggested are insane. "Just grab yourself a Radeon 9500." WTF? That's a very high end graphics card. Not to mention a 2Ghz processor.

Sheesh.

Re:Good Lord

[Babbster]

Fortunately, it seems like the Gamespy people might have actually ASKED that very important question:

With all of these considerable graphical upgrades, we were pleased to hear that the minimum system specs are currently targeted at a 700 MHz PC with 128 MB RAM and a DX6-level video card, meaning you won't need a NASA supercomputer to run Half-Life 2.

Obviously, that will probably be running the game at its minimum detail but the success of Half-Life was never about the tech specs - it was about the fact that it's one of the best single-player FPS experiences released and the fact that modders loved it.

Re:Good Lord

[someguy]

It's the Microsoft 3d API in DirectX.

It stands for "Direct 3D"

Direct 3d was a competitor with OpenGL as a graphics API and has largely supplanted it as the standard.

Re:Good Lord

[bigman2003]

No offense...but (oh wait, you are an anonymous coward...take all the offense you can fit in your mouth) Obviously you are not a gamer, and don't really understand what goes on with these games. A 2gig Athlon and a 9500 are not 'high-end'. They are 'good-end' maybe, but nothing really special. Over on the green side of /. people like to remember the good ole days of Pong, but I hope that the bright purple colors mean that our gaming standards are higher. I've got an Athlon 1800+ with a ti4200. I get 60+ frames on UT2k3, (1024x768- highest detail, but no FSAA) and I want more. More detail, not frames. I expect that I'll be able to run the games I am looking forward to this year- Half Life 2, and Deus Ex 2- but by next year I'll need to upgrade again. Yes, yes, yes- you're right. It's a crime that so much emphasis is put on the graphics, and back when games were REAL, and Zork was king, text was fine. But Jurassic Park wasn't really that good of a movie, and it sold tickets. Do games need to have a higher moral standard?

Re:Good Lord

[TheOnlyCoolTim]

"Direct 3d was a competitor with OpenGL as a graphics API and has largely supplanted it as the standard."

Wait till Doom 3 comes out...

Tim

Re:Good Lord

[Anonymous Coward]

don't really understand what goes on with these games.

What's that supposed to mean? "Don't understand" in which way? It's a game, not a lifestyle, and it should be affordable.

If the HW specs are too high, the game won't sell very well.

Not all of us have a mommy and daddy who buy us a brand new shiney computer every couple years. Real people have trouble paying the rent these days, much less buy a 2.6gigaquad/Ti98787 machine

My c366 is working pretty well. I'll probably get a faster computer once I get a new job, but no need to rush.

Re:Good Lord

[mrpuffypants]

The original half-life was my first taste of having to upgrade my video card. I always figured that my old 2mb 3dlabs card would do it forever. Then I got Half-Life for X-Mas, loaded it up on the old K6-2 333, and wondered what all the fuss about graphics and stuff was.....all I saw was grey boxes everywhere: no textures, no nothing.

So I saved up all my money and bought a TNT2 that summer. That kicked ass for about 6 months :)

Re:Good Lord

[KDan]

What's the point of having another fps that plays on low-end computers? Progression for fps is to more realism. If computing power is what it takes, then so be it. Or are you going to start blaming Origin for making all those Wing Commander games that required beastly hardware? Or blame quake for making 3d cards a must have? It's a game, not a lifestyle, and it should be affordable. My arse. That's for Valve to decide. If you don't have a good machine this game's not for you, that's all. There's plenty of other games you can play that don't have such high requirements. Go play them and leave those of us with good machines to our better games.

Daniel

Re:Good Lord

[bigman2003]

"It's a game, and it should be affordable" Now games are part of some semi-socialist system?!?!? For many people, games are a hobby. Like any other hobby, there are different levels of involvement. You can compare it to bicycling for instance. Let's say you get some rickety old bike from your mom (c366). You can ride about 8-9 MPH and go about 15 miles. You are now playing Doom 1. Then, you go to Wal-Mart, and buy one of their multi-purpose bikes. Now you can go about 12 MPH, and go about 25-30 miles. Now you are playing Doom II. Finally, you go to the bike shop, and get a good bike. It's designed for you to ride fast, and for a long time. (Viagra?) You can ride 18 MPH, and go 100 miles comfortably. Now, you are playing Doom III. The guy who buys that better bike is just more involved. If you are happy on that rickety old piece of crap- good for you. But when we go riding together, your little Doom I ride just ain't gonna cut it for me. I want Doom III- and when I'm done with that, I'll want Doom IV. Oh- and REAL people have REAL jobs. We don't worry about paying the rent (mortgage) and dropping a few hundred $$ for upgrades really isn't a big deal. You can slap together a system that will outrun yours by at least 5 times, for about $500-$600 bucks. The rest of us really don't want to play games at your same crappy level, so get off your rusty old bike, get down to Wal-Mart, and get a new computer. Or, stop complaining that some of us really DO want better games, and are willing to pay for them.

Re:Good Lord

[Doodleman3]

Babbster wrote,
Obviously, that will probably be running the game at its minimum detail but the success of Half-Life was never about the tech specs - it was about the fact that it's one of the best single-player FPS experiences released and the fact that modders loved it.

The sucess of Half-Life was about tech specs in the fact that people like me with my sorry assed Pentium II and ATI Rage Pro were able to run Half-Life in 800x600 resoulution but I havent been able to run any first person shooter since. This sounds nice because it will probly only cost me about 200 bucks to upgrade my system to minimum specs. I've been looking for an excuse to upgrade my system and I think I just found one :)

Re:Good Lord

[Anonymous Coward]

"It's a game, and it should be affordable" Now games are part of some semi-socialist system?!?!?

I never said that. In fact, my argument was quite capitalist:

If the HW specs are too high, the game won't sell very well.

It is we, the consumers, who control the market. If the manufacturer doesn't give me something that we're willing to spend the money on, then the manufacturer failed. I'm not going to go blow $1000+ on a brand new computer just to play games. The economy is in the shitter, our priorities become real clear: Rent, food, utilities, savings, retirement, & family first, computer games come afterwards.

The days of buying a brand new super computer just to play games are over. It's mostly just a penis fight for little boys...

Re:Good Lord

[bigman2003]

Anonymous Coward-

When you say games 'should be affordable' how is that capitalistic? Maybe you should say "I wish games were affordable". Capitalists know that you can price something by what the market will bear. Perceived value is what drives the capitalist economy. Enough people think a game is worth X dollars, and the company will sell it for that.

Obviously you feel that your own experience speaks for the rest of society. MY economy is not in the shitter. I have plenty of money to spend on a computer and games. (If 50 bucks for a game is stretching your budget, either you are very young, or B- you should take a good look at the choices you have made which have landed you in the position are are in now) I don't mind if they charge a lot for games, as long as they keep producing them.

You are right about the priorities. But, you should be able to cover the basics, and have some left over. AND save money too. If you can't do that, you should apply yourself, and earn more money. If for no other reason, make sure you can bank some cash, so in case you die, your family is taken care of.

Re:Good Lord

[junkgrep]

That's kinda weird: HL had a really decent software renderer, probably one of the best. It wasn't as smoothed over as a D3d or GL version, but it was still very playable and very good looking for its time. But then, I haven't even heard of your old graphics card. :)

Screenshots...

[Joseph Wharton]

The screenshots look amazing. That last one looks almost REAL. I can't wait to see what Valve has in store for E3...

Re:Screenshots...

[kupo zero]

Except for the fact that you don't see masked, armed guards walking around daily.

Re:Screenshots...

[Joseph Wharton]

That depends on where you live. :-)

how old is the reviewer from shacknews?

[Tibor the Hun]

he needs to take some composition classes, or have someone proofread his material. i couldn't even finish his article, it was terrible...

Anything New?

[niai]

From what I've read of the previews and seen on the screenshots, this game has nothing new. Just another FPS....

or it'll have a kickass story-driven dialog that scares the shit out of you and some other stuff. Who knows?

Hopefully if Valve keep up with their "if you show the player a really big bomb, you HAVE to let them blow it up" stance that made Half-Life such a fun single-player game to play (Xen aside) this'll kick ass. Just gimme something to do apart from shooting things, collecting keys, hitting switches and f'ing jump puzzles (like pissing on peoples faces ala Postal 2).

Bad reviewer...

[zoobaby]

Shacknews reviewer was horrible!!! First starts off saying that he was going to be objective, then all he did was kiss valves arse! Better make sure you wipe that brown off your face buddy!

As for the game itself, I am stoked, it should be cool. It may be the first game (of many to come, Doom III, etc...) that really uses the technology of yesterday's hardware, not last centuries.

Screenshots

[Intruger]

The screenshots don't look bad. They have high poly counts/texture, but the lighting model looks too primitive (compared to some of the upcoming game eg. Stalker,Doom3,DeusEx2,FarCry,etc), as if it supports only diffuse shading. The thing that would be really great is if it could play Half Life 1 mods, so I can play Counter Strike on it, till I wait for Team Fortress 2.

THE most keenly awaited game?

[rasteri]

what may be the most keenly awaited PC game of the year.

What, you mean OTHER than Doom 3?? Or for that matter - Deus Ex 2, GTA: Vice City et al...

Re:THE most keenly awaited game?

[bigman2003]

A lot of people in the Unreal camp aren't really looking forward to Doom III. Unreal II will kick ass! (Whoops, I heard it sucked.)

Deus Ex and Half Life, and whenever Diablo III comes out. I'll pay $60 each and be happy.

Re:THE most keenly awaited game?

[$rtbl_this]

And don't forget Duke Nukem Forever! Oh, what, you meant this year? Sorry.

Specs

[szyzyg]

Need an update to run this, meanwhile you can watch the slashdot effect on the shacknews server here ;-)
http://www.shacknews.com/docs/amd.x

massive polygon count?!

[(H)elix1]

With all of these considerable graphical upgrades, we were pleased to hear that the minimum system specs are currently targeted at a 700 MHz PC with 128 MB RAM and a DX6-level video card, meaning you won't need a NASA supercomputer to run Half-Life 2.

Rejoice! I've got some decent hardware, but it is SOOO nice that the focus is not on a massive polygon count. My god, they might have spent time on -oh, level design, story, and a few other things that actually make the game fun. Half-Life was worth every penny - including additional copies I've picked up over time (bundles were cheaper, go figure). I hear folks drooling over Doom III, but hearing the insane hardware requirements it is rumored to need, I suspect I'll pick it up when it hits the bargain bin. I avoided C&C Generals because I hear others had issues with 'low end' cards like my (new for me) ti4200. Unreal II came and went because it sounds like the AI and levels stunk. I'll be plunking down cash for this one because the previous version was such a blast. I figure the mod scene will pick up on this one as well.

One of the few good things to happen today. What is next, Starcraft II?

Re:massive polygon count?!

[gmhowell]

Whoever told you they had issues with Generals on a ti4200 is full of shit. I've got a GF3 and it ran Generals just fine.

Re:massive polygon count?!

[swv3752]

C&C Generals runs fine on my Radeon 7500. Of course it is paired with an Athlon XP 2100+.

Re:massive polygon count?!

[(H)elix1]

Nice to know... at ~$50 each, it does not take much to say no these days.

Re:massive polygon count?!

[gmhowell]

Just so you don't go running out too quick to pick up Generals:

It's in an AMD 1800+ with 768 MB RAM running WinXP. And the single player story sucks ass. All in the interests of complete disclosure.

Tech

[Terminal Saint]

If the technology keeps advancing at its current rate, it's only a matter of time before game companies will be forced to concentrate on plot and gameplay because they won't be able to wow people with graphics anymore. I can't wait.

Graphics and hardware

[CaffeineKills]

Man o Man do I want to get this game, but I think that the minute that I put the cd in the computer would blow up from considering the possibility that graphics as good as this exist, just like Doom 3!

TROGDOR!

[TheSHAD0W]

We are now that much closer to the creation of the Strongbad HL2 mod.

Re:TROGDOR!

[Anonymous Coward]

Will a few moderators please burninate the parent post? Thanks.

Counterstrike 2?

[big-bad-buddha]

The screenshots for HL2 look impressive, but the real question is what becomes of of the retail products that started as mods? Is Valve, knowing they have a rater large cash cow on thier hands, going to charge for Counterstrike 2 and Day of Defeat 2? Seriously, the appeal of Half Life ran out along time ago. The mod scene is what kept it going for as long as it has.

Re:Counterstrike 2?

[mrpuffypants]

well, counter-strike is being spun off into its own game, so that will saturate a large part of the market probably. My question is: will CS being sold standalone make HL2 irrelevant? To play CS, people either had to buy Half-Life and download the mod or buy the retail box, which was essentially Half-Life with the mod preinstalled.

In the end this furthered the brand of Half-Life and kept it important as the engine behind the most popular online game in the world. Now that CS is separate I'm afraid that more n00bs will just buy that so they can get out on the internet and start wallhacking ASAP.

Re:Counterstrike 2?

[KDan]

I doubt that they will miss out on the opportunity to make HL2 just as moddable as was HL1. Off the top of my head I would guess mods got HL more than half its sales (probably a lot more). Valve would have to have a gun to their head not to make mods even easier to make in HL2 (while still keeping that CD key monopoly!). They will make insane amounts of money all over again that way. If CS has decided to spin off in its own direction rather than remain a free mod, then too bad for them. Someone else will make "Uberstrike" which will be a free mod for HL2 and kick some ass (and maybe all the CS lamers will stick with CS!)

Daniel

Whoohoo! No Xen levels.

[BinBoy]

Best part is no xen levels. Technically it sounds like they've done everything one could hope for. If the story is good and the game runs smoothly, this is going to be an excellent game.

Voice Communication...

[actor_au]

In almost all the articles they mention that the NPCs(esspecially Alyx) will be speaking to you in a realistic fashion(IE their mouths will move realistically inrelation to what they are saying) it also says that this is done 'On the fly' ie Realtime.
The Implications for online gameing are staggering, if they can traslate this into the voice communication system they choose too use in HL2 multiplayer then we can finally get a truly immersive experiance in online gaming.
Just my two cents, although thanks to the exchange rate its worth only one.

Video

[IvyMike]

Anybody have the gamespot video available for download? The page is here, but you can't download unless you're a Gamespot Complete member.

Linux?

[riggwelter]

I've recently got into FPS games as a distraction from MUDs as a result of the Linux version of Unreal Tournie 2003, does anyone know if there's a Linux version of HL2 planned (or rumoured)?

Re:Linux?

[KDan]

With any luck it will be supported by WineX. HL is.

Btw, re: MUDs, get away from those. They're the worst time sink ever invented (whether graphical or not). Here's a trick: MUDs really get you because they're an 'infinite' game (as opposed to a finite game that you play to win). That's how they get you addicted for such long times. To get out of it, my method was to change them (in my head) from an infinite game to a finite game. Once in the mindset of playing to win rather than playing to play, I played really intensively for a few weeks, and figured out how I could completely beat the one MUD I had found was really worth playing (Arctic). At that point, there was no point in playing anymore, as that would have been just a mechanical application of what I had figured out, with no 'new stuff' anymore, and at that point I stopped playing and never got back to those again.

Daniel

Re:Linux?

[riggwelter]

I think after I dread to think how many years playing MUDs, I know how much time the consume if you let them. The key with MUDs is not that you can carry on playing them for ever, and as MUDs like Asylum keep adding more and more great quests, this becomes more true, it's the fact that they can become real communities. It's slightly off-topic, but in a western society, where communities no longer really function on a geographical basis, most people don't know the people who live on their street, or in their building, MUDs are one area where actual "real" contact can happen, albeit in cyberspace.

Re:Linux?

[KDan]

Sure, that's definitely one very addictive factor in MUDs. However, communities can be built with forums and irc and such, which at least have the advantage that you don't sit and play for hours on end because there's a game as well...

Daniel

any bets on...

[GldisAter]

.. what game will be the next Sin?

Don't remember Sin? It was the game that Activision kicked out the door before it was finished in order to get it on the shelves before the original Half-Life. After Sin was released there was a huge patch for it that fixed such annoying things as having to walk over to an enemy and clicking on the 'use' key to activate the AI. :)

Screen Shots

[Slime-dogg]

Hey, anyone notice that the screen shots for this game across all sites are pretty much the same? It makes me think that the thing that Valve handed out was just a demo movie that ran on the engine, and that there was a limited number of sequences.

I like to see more than just 4 shots of a huge spider thing with four legs walking over a fence, or 4 shots of the scientist dude's face. I wanna see more schtuff!

how about Linux? no? how about a GameOS?

[danalien]

my only question (which they haven't answered) is if there will be a linux compatible version (and not just for the server, I want to play it on my debian box aswell...)

And as a side note, *just wonderig* why don't game companies work together and code a OS simply for their games to run at full speed. So folks like $me who don't have to spend aditionall money buying Windows. Yess, I'd rather boot into "GameOS" than an illegal copy of windows, plus look a the plus side if they code it well, we could get rid of having $windows freezing/hanging the game, more resources to the game it self... etc etc

This might sound like a console, I can agree to a degree, but how many console out there (as in present time) could you update it's hardware? xor install your favorit OS on it? without requiring a degree in science and soldering skillz? *hmm* - anyway, a console is simply a computer runing software. Back in the old days consoles ran faster more exotic hardware then the "personal computer" did, and I understood why they where around. Nowadays it's the other way around, I can build a faster "personal computer", and the xbox proves my point, it allready runs on "Personal Computer" hardware (which $ms don't want you to fiddle with)

- Mac is a PC, "Personal Computer" get that into your head.