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MS Tweaks Ill-Received Licensing Plan

ahooton writes "C|Net is reporting that Microsoft has updated it's Software Assurance licensing program. The company has admitted that it's initial approach angered a large number of customers. No huge difference in pricing or terms -- changes are comprised of bundling some training and support. The one interesting concession is that corporate licensees of Microsoft Office can now use that suite on a home computer as well." What a concession. (Paddo points to this similar article on Australian IT via News.com.au.)

34 of 263 comments (clear)

  1. Nice Dress! by Blackhalo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    You can put a dress on a pig, but it is still a pig.

    --
    "There is nothing to do it. But to do it." -Floyd Pepper
  2. M$ is being quite clever about this, IMHO by Bold+Marauder · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Between this, and all of the charity software donations that they're making, they're basically changing thier public perception, while maintaining their draconian licensing terms.

    I have to give them kudos, even if only for the sake of sheer diabolicalness!

    1. Re:M$ is being quite clever about this, IMHO by Red+Pointy+Tail · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, almost everybody I know brings home their corporate copy of M$ Office to install, so big deal to M$ eh?

      No I won't reveal who they are... even under torture... :>

    2. Re:M$ is being quite clever about this, IMHO by Daniel+Phillips · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Between this, and all of the charity software donations that they're making, they're basically changing thier public perception, while maintaining their draconian licensing terms.

      I agree that's what they're trying to do, but I don't agree it's working. Once burned, twice shy. Even the most clueless PHB can understand "costs more, does less".

      --
      Have you got your LWN subscription yet?
  3. I lay the blame on the pirates by ObviousGuy · · Score: 0, Insightful

    Software pirates are the main reason these draconian licensing agreements have come into existence. There used to be a time when it was possible to buy a piece of software and be assured that you could move it from machine to machine so long as you only installed it on one machine at a time. Not so now because disreputable companies have taken to installing a single copy of software on all their machines.

    What is worse is that there is a large group of people dedicated to making excuses for and promoting these software pirates.

    I'm not saying that I like draconian licensing agreements, but it's easy to understand where the impetus to create them comes from when the goodwill of the software publisher is exploited time and again.

    --
    I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
    1. Re:I lay the blame on the pirates by gadlaw · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Microsoft will be glad to hear that some of their propaganda/education money has been put to good use. Yes indeed, blame it all on the 'pirates.' Microsoft isn't a greedy company bent on controlling all aspects of your computer/entertainment/multimedia experience- everything bad or stupid they do can be blamed on those 'pirates'

      --
      Enjoy your Karma, after all you earned it. Feel your Karma Joe, feel it burn.
    2. Re:I lay the blame on the pirates by Billly+Gates · · Score: 2, Insightful


      No blame shareholder expectations. Remember that Microsoft has to grow 5% annually just to meet them!

      Also the piracy argument is mute. They bring demand aka prices down. The more expensive the more it will be pirated. Just look at 3dstudioMax and photoshop as an example. Balmer even admitted this. This is why MS sells the academic edition of MS-Office sam's club for $179 without checking for a student I.D.

      As far as I know only MS-Office and Windows are selling while every other product is losing money. Both Gates and Balmer are selling stock right now. VS.net is not selling well and making only slim profits because corporations are cutting budgets and will not pay for it. So its really Windows and Office supply the vast majority of its income.

      This means that MS must keep on continually raising prices in order to increase the stock prices or keep them from falling. There is no other way to increase revenue unless more of its other products sell beter.

      The irony is that Microsoft illegally does not pay dividends are releases sales information as requires by the SEC. Only units sold.

      But stupid shareholders who are dumb enough to buy ms stock without dividends except to buy low and sell high and actually make a profit.

    3. Re:I lay the blame on the pirates by Blackhalo · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think you lay the blame on the wrong suspect. The driving business reason for "Licencing 6.0" is to continue to grow revenue or at the very least to create a continuous revenue stream. With the market pretty much saturated in Microsoft's primary revenue generating bussineses (desktop OS and Office apps) they have little room for new revenue growth. Short of moving into new markets, X-Box (loss leader) and the Enterprise (Linix is the ecnomical choice in a down economy), Microsoft must use licencing stragegies to maintain income or the stock price will suffer. Over the years MS has gotten very large, and it is really hard to continue to grow a large company, big slow growth companies have relatively low P/E's and have to do things like pay dividends (a Microsoft first) to woo investors. Problem with MS is that they only have two notably, profitable businesses and they have only one directon to go with those.

      --
      "There is nothing to do it. But to do it." -Floyd Pepper
    4. Re:I lay the blame on the pirates by mdwong · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Exactly. Microsoft did not introduce the Assurance program to counter piracy, they did it to increase their revenue stream. If all their large scale customers paid a yearly fee to keep their software current, MS could cite those sales as money in the bank when they report their earnings.

    5. Re:I lay the blame on the pirates by maxpublic · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Software pirates are the main reason these draconian licensing agreements have come into existence.

      Argh, matey! Blame it all on us nasty high-tech pirates! Certainly the woes of Microsoft fall entirely upon our shoulders!

      Funny, I do remember something about an anti-trust suit, illegal business practices, unethical conduct, etc. I also have a vague recollection of a conviction. Might as well blame all of that on the pirates too!

      What is worse is that there is a large group of people dedicated to making excuses for and promoting these software pirates.

      Although it's not nearly as large as the group of people dedicated to making excuses for and promoting Microsoft. Nor as large as the group of losers who worship Bill Gates in the hopes that his divine favor will somehow magically rain down upon them, like manna from the heavens.

      I'm not saying that I like draconian licensing agreements, but it's easy to understand where the impetus to create them comes from when the goodwill of the software publisher is exploited time and again.

      It's even easier to understand the frustration of the consumer after he/she has been exploited by Microsoft time and time again. It might just be that every once in awhile you *really do* reap what you sow.

      Sailing the digital seas since 1980,
      Max
      (insert skull and crossbones here)

      --
      My god carries a hammer. Your god died nailed to a tree. Any questions?
  4. Assurance? by mao+che+minh · · Score: 5, Insightful

    There really isn't any beneficial changes here. People's gripes were largely with prices and restrictive measures that were associated with the new scheme, not what kind of "assurances" they were recieving ("assurances" that they thought they were already getting for free with older Microsoft products and that they usually get for free with other venodrs' software products: real support, limited training, and manufacturer accountability).

    I still don't understand why Microsoft calls their scheme "Software Assurance". This implies that by being forced into expensive licensing schemes you are entitled to an extra degree of software security and performance.

    Security and performance should be qualities that sell your product initially, something to be proud of as a manufacturer, not aspects of a product that you get only after paying annual fees.

    Large companies end up paying tons in license fees for a plethora of different software products that fit individual needs. They could instead find a few open source products and pay the salaries of a few programmers to customize them to their needs, or outright integrate them. Lotus Notes for mail, Novell for meta, People Soft for CRM, Windows clients, etc. Instead, you could take one strong open source CRM, expand upon it, integrate web based mail (or even make a quick client), and integrate their features to work flawlessly, all running in an open source browser that is running on Linux terminals (which removes the need for de-centralized administration) - instead of forcing the admins to find ways around making all of these closed products work together in hack jobs, with expensive tools like Zen Works deployed just to install and configure software on expensive Windows workstations - or worse. Oh well - I'm being a square headed open source zealot again. I'll go lay down.

    What's really ironic is that I'm using WIndows 98 right now, because I screwed my Linux kernel and don't feel like fixing it. My girl just bought me "Enter the Matrix" for the Game Cube man....been busy.....damn agents.

    1. Re:Assurance? by Hangtime · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Large companies end up paying tons in license fees for a plethora of different software products that fit individual needs. They could instead find a few open source products and pay the salaries of a few programmers to customize them to their needs, or outright integrate them. Lotus Notes for mail, Novell for meta, People Soft for CRM, Windows clients, etc. Instead, you could take one strong open source CRM, expand upon it, integrate web based mail (or even make a quick client), and integrate their features to work flawlessly, all running in an open source browser that is running on Linux terminals (which removes the need for de-centralized administration) - instead of forcing the admins to find ways around making all of these closed products work together in hack jobs, with expensive tools like Zen Works deployed just to install and configure software on expensive Windows workstations - or worse. Oh well - I'm being a square headed open source zealot again. I'll go lay down.

      Your kidding right...go find a couple of open source packages and pay some developers to integrate them together. I'll take this one at a time.

      1. Besides packages like MySQL and Open Office that are dual-use meaning can be used in the home, name me five "business" open source packages out there? Better yet name me this elusive "strong open source CRM." Please tell me that product that bests Peoplesoft or Seibel, or duplicates 60% of the functionality, where can I find this elusive piece of software. It doesn't exist. I can't name you five Linux/Open Source packages that function as business applications but I can name you five off the top of my head in my niche of Builder's Mortgage Banking.

      2. Hire a bunch of Developers to Integrate It All: Problem, I'm not in the business of building applications, I am in the business of making loans to home builders. We only build things if its not already done. I looked 12 months for one software package even though we had developers in the bullpen waiting for a project because I have to then maintain that software! Chances are if your not in the mainframe world or you don't run a company like Disney or GE where turnover is minimal; your going to have turnover. That means maintenance, new releases, new features for a product that's already built and maintained by someone else! A complete waste! Its called a real option. If I build one piece of software I sacrifice building another. I would rather build software keeping us on the cutting edge of business then duplicating the functionality of another package.

      3. That hodgepodge of programs you referred to is Best-of-Breed buying its their to ensure that I get the most bang for my license buck. Yes integrationn is tough but if you go into the purchase with integration as a checklist item in criteria your less likely to be burned.

      4. Large companies end up paying tons in license fees...over a time span. All software can be depreciated over three years and based upon your tax strategy and the purchase maybe even longer. Its just like buying furniture and computers, yes its an immediate cash outlay but its affect on income can be spread over multiple years.

    2. Re:Assurance? by runenfool · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You make some good points, but one thing about maintaining open source projects is that you can always just release the code under the GPL (which you probably should so you can be a good member of the community) and then if its a good start you will watch it grow and improve on its own. Particularily if you spend the money you would have spent on licensing you will continue to improve the product - and your people will know it inside and out. Add to that the 'free' development of other companies and before you know it you have an excellent product that exactly fits your needs, that your vendor will never drop support for, and that you will never need to wait for a vendor supplied patch (although you may have to crack the whip on your programmers :) ). You gain control and flexibility, and to many of us, thats worth the costs.

      Of course if your software sucks then you were better off buying bad software that came with support and maintenance (which of course isn't perpetual anyway) in the first place.

      Im not telling you to do this, Im just pointing out that this is really how its supposed to work in the open source world.

    3. Re:Assurance? by dirk · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Whether it grows depends on the interest in the software. If he were to write and release a Builder's Mortage Banking software (fully complete version 1) under the GPL, it would not grow substantially because there would be little interest in it. Most programs who work on GPL project do so because they have a vested interest in the product, and that product would not appeal to most (if any) people. So it would sit mainly stagnant. If programmers did latch onto it, they would probably want to change the program to be more useful for something they are doing (say adding other types of loan features). While this may be good for the software in general (or bad because of bloat) it doesn't help the releaser at all, because they have no need of these features.

      The GPL is a fine idea, but it only truely works on projects that will have wide and varied support. Niche projects won't flourish under the GPL unless it is a niche programmers like.

      --

      "Information wants to be expensive" - Stewart Brand, the same guy who said "Information wants to be free"
  5. Of course they're letting home users have it by SirTwitchALot · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Allowing Office users to use the product at home with a corporate license will just help to keep people using office. People who want to work from home are either going to pirate office or install open office (a lot more people are learning that it works well enough for most uses.) This is a good way for them to keep their domanance in the productivity category.

    --
    Go away, or I will replace you with a very small shell script.
    1. Re:Of course they're letting home users have it by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 2, Insightful
      In fact most computers sold today come with Office pre-installed. There is no reason for these people to pirate the software nor install workalikes like OpenOffice.

      You're saying that as if it's free or something. Check out a typical midrange Dell desktop. Base price with WordPerfect = $1239. Cheap MS Office adds $150. MS Office Pro adds $350.

      How many potential pirates or Open Office users are going to add $150 or $350 to the price of their new computer so they can get a bundled copy of Microsoft Office? Not many. That's why Microsoft realizes that the most that they can get in this situation is to promote customer lock-in with a freebie.

  6. Tomorrows M$ Press Release by VagaDragon · · Score: 2, Insightful

    A Microsoft spokesman says they have informed their OEM partners that it has become illegal to ship computers designed for home use without Microsoft Office. The company says it is responding to a report that says 95% of computers shipped without Microsoft Office on them end up having a pirated copy installed on them within 90 days.

  7. Isn't this really just a part of... by VTS · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ...their whole "Stop people from moving to OSS" strategy we have seen lately ?

    If they weren't scrared of loosing their market I doubt they would change anything.

    --
    --- No 16-bit support in Vista? Half of our modules still use it! ---
  8. M$ - the disease by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    IMO: Here we go, our daily dose of M$ on /. Remember folks, any publicity can be good publicity for the company being discussed. Whether you love M$ or hate them, consider how many times you look at the word "Microsoft" every day on the internet. It is in your mind, millions of minds. An article about M$ on one website that's negative, another that's positive. It doesn't matter anymore, the lines have been blurred in most people's minds.

    Hey, listen. What's that?
    Another coin drops in the M$ cup.
    Render unto Gates.

  9. Remember... by Faust7 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Security and performance should be qualities that sell your product initially, something to be proud of as a manufacturer, not aspects of a product that you get only after paying annual fees.

    Security is hardly a static entity. What's the more convincing sell, the idea that the product is already secure, period, or the idea that the product was as secure as possible when released and can be continually upgraded to maintain that level of security?

  10. Re:Linux Helping! by SN74S181 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Microsoft has always only had good products (relatively speaking) when they've been in a competetive market. It took the 'threat' of Netscape for them to get their act together on the Browser scene. A lot of the quality of Windows 2000 can be attributed to them feeling the heat from competing x86 operating systems being forced to come out with something at least as good. Lord knows why things cooled off enough that the best they could do after W2K was XP, though....

  11. Well... by Faust7 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    People who want to work from home are either going to pirate office or install open office (a lot more people are learning that it works well enough for most uses.)

    Actually, I'd wager they're just going to pirate Office, period. The ongoing corporate perception is that documents produced with non-Microsoft Office suites still stand a moderate-to-slight chance of not fully working with the officially sanctioned applications. When critical company information and timetables are involved, who but the most enthuastic advocates of alternative office suites, or the most technically adept workers who know exactly what's compatible, both of whom are very much in the minority with respect to the whole corporation, would ever consider using a non-standard office suite?

    1. Re:Well... by WNight · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Who, except sales and marketing, or secretarial, has a job that hangs on the presentation of a word document? At my company I'm fine as long as I can open the ms-word attachments that the PHBs send out in email. I don't care if their memo is properly formatted.

      Ditto with everyone else in tech, except the tech writers.

      If this was just me at home, well I have VMWare running to let me check web pages in IE for compatibility, so I'd just pirate MS-Office and be done with it. But it's for a business who might be audited, they can't just pirate it. If they realize that it's a $500 savings per developer if we don't get MS Office they'll probably gladly accept us using a "substandard" package.

      Right now they have licenses for everyone, but when it comes time to "upgrade" from Office2k I'm sure they'll go along with, if not insist that, the techs run Open Office.

    2. Re:Well... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      There are lots of companies that are almost entirely about properly formatted memos and pretty presentations. You have 6 engineers doing the real work, and 180 "managers" managing eachother.

  12. You are off topic for this thread by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    This thread is about licensing, not about pricing models or Microsoft stock.

    Everything being equal, Microsoft could make the same amount of money and charge the same prices as they do now with a simple "book" license or an "all your base" license.

    But all things are not equal because some people are not willing to pay the price of the software, or are only willing under threat of legal action. That's where the draconian licensing agreements come from.

  13. useless concession... by Archfeld · · Score: 3, Insightful

    How many people, who work from home on a regular basis, DON'T use a laptop with docking station set-up these days, and carry the ONE device back and forth ?

    As a hardware support monkey that is the general setup where I work.

    --
    errr....umm...*whooosh* *whoosh* Is this thing on ?
  14. Again and Again by moehoward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    MS gives stuff away to schools = EVIL!!!
    MS eases licensing plan and gives stuff away = EVIL!!!
    CEO diversifies his stock portfolio = EVIL and End of MS!!!
    MS loses a sale in Germany = End of MS!!!
    MS releases earnings = They are too successful. EVIL!!!
    Gates donates to India = EVIL!!

    Jesus Christ!

    I'd really like to know just what would be considered a positive for/from Microsoft around here. Really. What would it take for them to get an iota of respect beyond Gates saying that he runs Linux at home?

    OK. I've been karma whoring again. But this post should take care of that. I can go to bed with a clean soul and neutral karma.

    --
    "If you want to improve, be content to be thought foolish and stupid." - Epictetus
    1. Re:Again and Again by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful
      I'd really like to know just what would be considered a positive for/from Microsoft around here.
      • Do something innovative
      • Develop an OS that doesn't crash every month or is not loaded with viruses
      • Quite breaking the law at every turn

      Any one of these items would be interesting
    2. Re:Again and Again by Soko · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'd really like to know just what would be considered a positive for/from Microsoft around here. Really. What would it take for them to get an iota of respect beyond Gates saying that he runs Linux at home?

      How about the following:

      - Work with others in the industry instead of trying to destroy them at every turn. There's lots of business to go around.
      - Stop being so fucking paranoid about Windows/Office. Make Windows 'play nice' with everything else out there, or show people how to make it 'play nice' - for free. Microsoft doesn't have all the best ideas all the time.
      - Follow standards like they were law. If they find a better way, propose changes to the standard with no IP strings attached.
      - Try to compete on technical merits and value, not on spin and conjecture. IOW, stop paying attention to the faults of others, pay attention to the faults that you yourself have.

      I'm sure I'll come up with more later. Right now I'm too busy tring to get this VIA ITX board to play DVDs properly in Linux to bother.

      BTW, I have no great hatred of Microsoft - they do make some good stuff. It all goes bad when they try to help the Marketing Dept. out in what should be purely technical. If the MS developers could shoot the MS marketroids when they came wandering in to the development meetings, I bet things would be a lot better. Hell, I'd even take a job there then.

      Soko

      --
      "Depression is merely anger without enthusiasm." - Anonymous
    3. Re: Again and Again by Black+Parrot · · Score: 2, Insightful


      > My Windows XP box runs for at least a few months at a time.

      The sad part is that MS users think that is something worth mentioning.

      > Most of the time I reboot is only because some stupid software being installed wants it.

      Why should anything short of a kernel upgrade require a reboot?

      --
      Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
  15. Re:Why do linux users always obsess about Microsof by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful
    You will find that the voices of dissent come vastly from Microsoft customers, not users of other operating systems and products. Also (and obviously) Linux users have made the switch and are therefore quite vocal about it, and likely rather critical of Microsofty and/or Apple and/or Unix. Open source is not just a license or development model, it's a movement. All movements have their advocates and critics. You are in the realm of the advocate. This is fucking Slashdot, for Christ's sake. What do you expect?

    This is like asking why Unix programmers always down-play the success of Linux on a Sun developer's forum, or asking why Puerto Ricans always want the US out of Vieques (spelling?).

  16. Re:'Release under GPL' by Darkninja666 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Umm, No one said you "HAD" to release it. Just that IF you want to sell/give this out, you would have to release it under the GPL. You can keep it locked away in your basement if that warms your cookie.

    --
    Secure multi-mediation is the future of all webbing...
  17. Re:'Release under GPL' by mbogosian · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm in a particular industry, with competitors. Let's say I spend $150k developing something over a 6-12 month period (multiple developer pay and proj mgt, etc). I then 'release it' under GPL, my competitor picks it up, spends about $6k 'learning ' the code and integrating it with their business processes (again - it's my competitor) and they start to undercut my pricing. They've got the benefit of my software, my knowledge that's gone into my software, and have shelled out a small fraction of what I've had to to gain that knowledge and benefit.

    Tell me again why this is a good business move?


    This happens without the GPL (or OpenSource in general for that matter). The first to market always spends the most by at least one order of magnitude. It is not rare to spend several million dollars and two years on a new product and then have a new competitor pop up and reproduce the work for a few hundred thousand in three to six months.

    The nice part about the GPL is that if the competitor takes any of your code, they have to release their additions under the same license.

  18. Re:Staying Afloat by hesiod · · Score: 2, Insightful

    > people who get their news from anywhere but Slashdot know what's up with .NET but

    Well, I get news from all over the place and have no idea what .NET is really supposed to be. The meaning of it has changed so much since it was first announced that I'm surprised anyone would know. But, of course, that's mostly because I don't care.