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Satellite Driven Farming Equipment

ravenousbugblatter writes "An article at CNN discusses how Australian scientists are using GPS to automatically drive tractors and other farming equipment on predetermined tracks. The technology is encouraged because it can prevent water loss associated with the repeated compaction of soil from heavy farming equipment."

173 comments

  1. all hail John Deere! by sweeney37 · · Score: 4, Funny

    I, for one, welcome our new tractor overlords.

    Mike

    1. Re:all hail John Deere! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Not me. I'm installing a tinfoil tractor cab.

    2. Re:all hail John Deere! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      as funny as this is, I can't seem to remember the source of the original quote? Is it Monty Python?

    3. Re:all hail John Deere! by el-spectre · · Score: 1

      I'm thinking Dilbert... when the rumor that alien lizards from the planet Zorb were gong to buy the company (and Wally made himself a giant corndog...) but I dunno...

      --
      "Faith: Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel." - A.B.
    4. Re:all hail John Deere! by sTalking_Goat · · Score: 2, Informative

      OB Simpson's quote of course. No news story would be complete without one. Kent Brockman. Homer in Space episode.

      --

      My days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle...

    5. Re:all hail John Deere! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      I for one welcome our new joke-of-the-month overlords!

      (The Soviet Russia thing is passé for all the trolls now, I guess?)

    6. Re:all hail John Deere! by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 1
      as funny as this is, I can't seem to remember the source of the original quote? Is it Monty Python?

      The Simpons. The Episode where Homer flies on the space shuttle. During the struggle to land, an ant colony experiment busts open scattering ants all over the cabin. A few ants end up right in front of the camera (viewed by the audience on the ground), prompting that famous line from the Newscaster.

      Other memorable lines that made the rounds (especially on the last Columbia mission:)

      Now we will never know if ants can sort tiny screws.

      (Mulitple references to an inanimate carbon rod.)

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    7. Re:all hail John Deere! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      I like the Simpsons as much as anyone. But it is simply shocking that we all sit around on this messageboard, ignoring the shocking events that occur every day.

      A man is dead in Britain, probably murdered by the BBC, or possibly by Tony Blair.

      Why don't we talk about this? Why must we ignore it?

    8. Re:all hail John Deere! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      probably murdered by the BBC

      WTF? Why would BBC have him killed?

      It's either our government or the newly revived paramilitary wing of the US intelligence services (as in return for Blair's sycophantic support). Just like the Russians used to get their wet-jobs done by the Bulgarians.

    9. Re:all hail John Deere! by IWannaBeAnAC · · Score: 1
      Was he murdered or did he kill himself? I havn't seen an article that says one way or the other (which is weird in itself), but I got the feeling he was hounded to his death (ie, provoked suicide).

      Do you have any other links?

    10. Re:all hail John Deere! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Why don't we talk about this? Why must we ignore it?

      Mainly because people die all over the world all the time (several just as I wrote this). Death isn't anything special anymore...

      ...unless it maybe involves Soviet Russia, or a Beowulf cluster.

  2. YEEHAW by TheOnyx · · Score: 5, Funny

    It's the beginning of the Redneck Skynet!

    --
    "Do not hold strong opinions about things you do not understand."
    1. Re:YEEHAW by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The first thing the Redneck Skynet controlled was... Robosaurus! Half dinosaur and half robot this 42' tall, 30 ton fire breathing robot picks up and eats full size cars and airplanes at show sites around the world.

    2. Re:YEEHAW by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In Australia we do not have Rednecks. We have Yobbos. Small matter, but one which Id like to clear up ;)

  3. Too bad by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    They can't control the genetically modified crops with GPS. Then you wouldn't have to worried about your crops becoming infected with someone's IP.

  4. Collision Detection by rf0 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    This seems very cool and everything but I wonder how "automatic" these are and do they have any collision detection. I can't help but picture the tractor going along, hitting a kangeroo and then all hell break loose. Never underestimate the unexpected

    Rus

    1. Re:Collision Detection by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 1
      Hey, some of those Kangaroos might be equipped with beach balls (or in a funner version of the story, stinger missiles.)

      Long story, military simulation humor.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    2. Re:Collision Detection by Cromac · · Score: 1

      The large farming equipment my relatives use wouldn't even notice hitting a kangeroo. The article didn't say but any large scale farm uses BIG equipment, small animals - or people - wouldn't even cause a bump.

    3. Re:Collision Detection by temojen · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Fortunately, Kangaroos are already equiped with a collision detection and avoidance subsystem sufficient for avoiding slow moving objects like farm implements.

      Children and Pets, however may not be.

    4. Re:Collision Detection by vissy · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The driver is still required to turn the tractor at the end of each run. After this the driver hits the engage button and the system takes over to steer the tractor to about 2cm accuracy. The driver is responsible for collision detection.

      In the end the driver has reduced fatigue due to not having to make small steering corrections along a run and he can focus more on what his implement at the back is doing, i.e. is it the right height etc.

      As the article says, there are huge benifits to always driving on the same track. In addition to what the article says, the piece of dirt that you are driving along does get compacted because you always drive down the same piece, this means that it becomes more road-like which significantly reduces diesel usage and tracktor wear and tear. This makes the technology even more enviromentally friendly.

    5. Re:Collision Detection by f97tosc · · Score: 2, Insightful

      This seems very cool and everything but I wonder how "automatic" these are and do they have any collision detection. I can't help but picture the tractor going along, hitting a kangeroo and then all hell break loose.

      And hitting a kangaroo is of course impossible with a human driver?

      Even at Slashdot the demand for security in new technology seems to be 100%. The much more reasonable standard is to demand of new technology that it demands on par with humans. I bet a relatively simple motion detector could do the job of stopping if something unexpected shows up. At least to the point where they are as likely to stop as humans, which can perform relatively poorly when pulling long hours of monotonous work.

      Tor

    6. Re:Collision Detection by hpavc · · Score: 1

      Well they have been doing the 'non-automatic' version of it for years. People have the daily readouts of their fields and cane basically drive their equipment like it was a oceanliner.

      --
      members are seeing something, your seeing an ad
    7. Re:Collision Detection by vissy · · Score: 1

      True enough, fatigue is definatly an issue for farmers. When they want to soe they will do it 24/7 (GPS navigation makes it easyer for them to work at night of course, oh and for spraying there is less evaporation when spraying at night). As somebody else hinted at above, you do not see many animals get near these tractors once they start up. The only ones that do hang around are farm dogs.

      And as for Kangaroos, out on the farms they are a pest like rodents. Okay the numbers of big reds and so forth may not be huge. But the number of eastern grey Kangaroos keeps increasing. They cause more havock to crops than most things.

    8. Re:Collision Detection by reallocate · · Score: 1

      Haven't been near any farm equipment lately, eh?

      --
      -- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
    9. Re:Collision Detection by ncc74656 · · Score: 2, Informative
      Hey, some of those Kangaroos might be equipped with beach balls (or in a funner version of the story, stinger missiles.)

      Long story, military simulation humor.

      The story's not that long. It is funny, though.

      --
      20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
    10. Re:Collision Detection by theedge318 · · Score: 1

      This not exactly new ... or unique to the Aussies ... at the University of California at Davis they have an automated machine that goes around the rows of vegetation picking up the buckets of picked fruit.

      While this may seem silly, nothing treats the fruit as gently as the human hand ... but immigrant Mexican workers are getting really bad back problems lifting around these buckets, and they get screwed b/c they have no medical care or legal recourse. The goal of the project is to make the bucket picker upper automated and cheap enough to run, that it is actually cheaper to operate than having the buckets lifted and managed by hand.

      Yeah we all know illegal immigrants shouldn't be hear ... but boy would people complain if they had to pay 3 to 4 times the current price for their fresh produce.

      --
      Sig Nazi- "No Sig for you, come back 1 year."
    11. Re:Collision Detection by switcha · · Score: 2, Funny
      And hitting a kangaroo is of course impossible with a human driver?

      You say that like it's a bad thing. One of my greatest joys as a youth out combining grass seed, was watching mice try to run the "combine belt treadmill" and stay out of the spinning jaws of the thresher.

      Does this make me sick?

      --
      You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
  5. Much, much worse by creative_name · · Score: 2, Funny

    Repeated compaction and water loss might be a problem, but just wait until one of these badboys gets out of hand and ends up mowing down some precious kangaroo farm. Then we'll see who gives a damn about how compact their soil is.

    Just you wait.

    --
    Posting as directed.
    1. Re:Much, much worse by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 2, Funny

      Just imagine how many hooligans are going to be leaving compacted soil samples in their drawers after stumbling onto a field and having an automated farm equipment nearly run them over.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    2. Re:Much, much worse by FooGoo · · Score: 2, Funny

      ummmm...well....okay....here goes....

      If it where my kangaroo farm i'd be hopping mad. ...sorry

      --
      People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them
    3. Re:Much, much worse by Anthony · · Score: 1

      Kangaroo farm? Most farms in Australia are kangaroo farms by default. Red and Eastern Grey Kangaroos are generally at "plague" proportions due to increased access to water (dams, bores), increase in pasture lands and fertilisers. If we can develop a bigger market for kangaroo meat and skins, they indeed would become precious.

      I myself prefer to cook a 1.5 cm thick slab of roo meat in a pan with olive oil, cooking it to medium rare.

      --
      Slashdot: Where nerds gather to pool their ignorance
  6. Doesn't sound sophisticated by ls-lta · · Score: 1

    Does it detect when people or animals are in the way?

    1. Re:Doesn't sound sophisticated by dirkdidit · · Score: 1

      Most farmers won't stop the tractor for anything smaller than a cow anyway. The crop gets cleaned eventually anyway.

    2. Re:Doesn't sound sophisticated by tinrobot · · Score: 1

      Does it detect when people or animals are in the way?

      My guess is that it mows them down as well.

      Better keep old' Elsie locked up in the barn when this things going, or else you'll have some nice hamburger to go with your tomatoes...

    3. Re:Doesn't sound sophisticated by Tumbleweed · · Score: 1

      Isn't that called 'mulching'? :)

    4. Re:Doesn't sound sophisticated by reallocate · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why? Cars, trucks, trains, planes, boats don't.

      Remember, these things operate on farm, somone's property, behind fences. Someplace where stray humans are not supposed to be.

      Besides, serious farm equipment is big and noisy. If a person or an animal can't tell one is coming and get out of the way, they're already dead.

      --
      -- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
    5. Re:Doesn't sound sophisticated by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, all of the tractors still need drivers, they just don't have to steer until they need to turn around.

  7. (Groan) What sort of hole... by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 1
    ...are we digging ourselves into now with technology?

    As they say, as you reap so will you sow.

    --
    "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
    --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
  8. GPS Inaccuracies by paul248 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Now they'll have to figure out how to prevent property loss associated with the repeated compaction of buildings from heavy misguided farming equipment...

    1. Re:GPS Inaccuracies by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 1
      Now they'll have to figure out how to prevent property loss associated with the repeated compaction of buildings from heavy misguided farming equipment...

      Around my area the problem is the opposite: Farm loss from heavily misguided construction.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    2. Re:GPS Inaccuracies by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I have trouble shedding tears for "farm loss", with all of the massive subsidies we, the other tax payers, give them.

    3. Re:GPS Inaccuracies by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 1

      Try not to think of it as "Farm Loss." Think of it as overloading rural road, water, sewer, and education systems.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    4. Re:GPS Inaccuracies by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      I have trouble shedding tears for "farm loss", with all of the massive subsidies we, the other tax payers, give them.

      I agree, and the only thing we get is food, how lame is that.

  9. Bad idea... by aardwolf204 · · Score: 2, Funny

    This is a very bad idea. I hear GPS gives coords. backwards in the land down under. =P

    --
    Im dreaming ofa big bndwdth, That can resist the /.crowd.May ur days b merry & bright & may al
    1. Re:Bad idea... by rusty0101 · · Score: 1

      That's why the tractors follow the plows around, isn't it?

      -Rusty

      --
      You never know...
  10. we need satellites for this? by nunya_biznez · · Score: 3, Insightful
    "The technology is encouraged because it can prevent water loss associated with the repeated compaction of soil from heavy farming equipment."

    Couldn't the same thing be achived by simply not driving in the ruts?

    -- I stole this sig off some old git

    1. Re:we need satellites for this? by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Couldn't the same thing be achived by simply not driving in the ruts?

      Or by having a robot eye follow a white line.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
    2. Re:we need satellites for this? by tarquin_fim_bim · · Score: 1

      Or by having a robot eye follow a white line.

      Or by the fat operatives going on a diet.

    3. Re:we need satellites for this? by f97tosc · · Score: 1

      Couldn't the same thing be achived by simply not driving in the ruts?

      The engineering practice of only measuring differences from a starting position is dangerous because in the way errors build up. For example, if your 'route recorder' makes a 2 inch error every time the tractor turns around for a new run, these errors add up so that the at the end of the day your robot tractor may be a couple of feet outside of the field. In other words, you have no control of where you are, other than a long series of measured differences from a starting position.

      Also now you have the labor-intensive step of driving around across the field, rather than letting the computer lay perfectly spaced tracks.

      Tor

    4. Re:we need satellites for this? by f97tosc · · Score: 1

      Or by having a robot eye follow a white line.

      Which is...

      ...painted directly on the ground -> Easily washes away and is impossible to see when the crops are grown.

      ...Laid out on top of the crops each season -> wasn't the whole point of this to save labor by not having to drive around the field every year?

      Tor

    5. Re:we need satellites for this? by reallocate · · Score: 1

      I think the point is to drive in the same rut, over and over, rather than driving these multi-tonned rigs over new ground.

      --
      -- Slashdot: When Public Access TV Says "No"
    6. Re:we need satellites for this? by switcha · · Score: 1
      Certain crops are grown in rows (or furrows) where the dirt is mounded up in rows, the crops are planted in the mounded rows and then water is either applied, or in the case of dryland farming, captured from rain.

      When dealing with rowed crops, you pretty much have to drive your tractors down the rows. In fact, since some crops are planted at different row widths, one of the things I got frequently saddled with as a kid was helping Dad jack up the tractors, and using gigantic wrenches to widen and narrow the tires on the tractor axel, depending on which field he would be working.

      When it comes to crops planted on flat ground (wheat, grass seed, etc (I'm not familiar with common crops of Australia)), most of the time you are in the field is only when planting and harvesting. When applying fertilizer when the crop is young, we hired a "swamp buggy" to come apply sprays or liquid fertilizers. They are vehicles with huge, wide, monster truck-like tires that cause virtually no compaction. And the harvesters, or combines, also have exceptionally wide tires as well. With crops like wheat, you are rarely in the field with a standard tractor at any point in the crop cycle.

      So I'm assuming these reports are for row crops, and I still don't get how a modified regular tractor causes less compaction than a tractor driven by even a moderately skilled farmer.

      I'm not saying I doubt the numbers they are quoting for yield improvements, it's just that I doubt them.

      --
      You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
    7. Re:we need satellites for this? by timeOday · · Score: 1
      I don't think the Australian farmers have any plans to launch their own satellite constellation :)

      They're already there, accessible via commodity hardware, with no usage fee. I don't understand your concern.

    8. Re:we need satellites for this? by Rip!ey · · Score: 1

      We actually looked at doing that at one stage, but finding people who could paint a white line and outrun a tractor at the same time proved to be too difficult.

    9. Re:we need satellites for this? by Datafage · · Score: 1

      Then you guys need to learn how to run, because a tractor doing work is barely a brisk walk.

      --

      Nicotine free Amish .sig.

  11. until sadam acts up again... by edrugtrader · · Score: 2, Interesting

    during the war, my acura GPS would be off by a 1/5th of a mile or so... watch out for tractors gone wild in your backyard.

    --
    MARIJUANA, SHROOMS, X: ONLINE?! - E
    1. Re:until sadam acts up again... by Darken_Everseek · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I took a course in surveying a couple years ago at university; the US gov't has a masking signal they can apply to gps satellites to give purposely inaccurate data. It essentially changes the coordinate values by a random number, and the results can put you out by as much as 200 m. As soon as this signal was switched off, you were good to a mere couple meters. I don't, however, know how they're getting accuracy to less than an inch.

    2. Re:until sadam acts up again... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the signal your getting is not the signal the military gets.

      a

    3. Re:until sadam acts up again... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      I don't, however, know how they're getting accuracy to less than an inch.

      They would use a technique called Differential GPS. A GPS unit is placed on a known point and received signals from the same satellites as the GPS unit on the tractor. Both receive the same intentional errors, so the error can be calculated and sent to the tractor so that its coordinates can be fixed.

      Note that there are often base stations set up for regions, so the farmer wouldn't have to set up his own. He'd just have to subscribe to such a service to get the corrections.

    4. Re:until sadam acts up again... by inteller · · Score: 1

      listen do-da....these tractors are using N00b brand GPS units from Wal-Mart. They use $60k+ equipment using a realtime corrected signal, either from WAAS or Omnistar. Contrary to popular belief, non-military GPS isn't in the stone ages anymore and we can get a lot closer than a football fields margin of accuracy.

    5. Re:until sadam acts up again... by switcha · · Score: 1
      during the war, my acura GPS would be off by a 1/5th of a mile or so... watch out for tractors gone wild in your backyard.

      So, is that better or worse than "girls gone wild" in my backyard?

      --
      You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
    6. Re:until sadam acts up again... by eth00 · · Score: 1

      actually you ARE getting the same signal but do not have the encryption codes and stuff necessary to make it show the correct position. All of the GPS satalites are owned by the US government and they can do whatever they want with them. Its possible to have all the gps units suddenly show us we are in china then in japan. This might be usefull during war to perhaps make the enemy go the wrong way ;) Anyways none of us mere mortals are allowed acess to it but if you have all the encrption info (I do not know what it is exactly) you can get the same accuracy but they don't want civialians having that good of units...

  12. Wait a second... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    ...Possibly this can explain those crop circles coming in from outer space...

  13. Crop Circles by zachster · · Score: 5, Funny

    This innovation should advance the artistry of crop circles immesurably. No longer must we risk capture and incarceration in persuit of out artistic dreams. Now our wildest imaginings can be realized all from the comfort of our satelite relay stations.

    I offer a $100K reward to the first hack who can build me am etch-a-sketch driven combine.

    1. Re:Crop Circles by cK-Gunslinger · · Score: 1
      I offer a $100K reward to the first hack who can build me am etch-a-sketch driven combine.
      Unfortunately, they will have to become "crop-squares" as drawing circles with an etch-a-sketch is near-impossible.
    2. Re:Crop Circles by zachster · · Score: 1

      Now, now. Let's not rob our friend the etch-a-sketch of it's artistic due:

      http://www.etch-a-sketch.com/html/artgallery.htm

      Had Michaelangelo such a versatile tool, who knows what the ceiling of the sistine chappel might look like?

    3. Re:Crop Circles by EvilTwinSkippy · · Score: 2, Funny
      Had Michaelangelo such a versatile tool, who knows what the ceiling of the sistine chappel might look like?

      I'm picturing a monochromic gray, accented with thin black lines.

      --
      "Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
      --Dr.W.Edwards Deming
  14. not surprising by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    They have already been using GPS to distribute seed/fertilizer/pesticide/etc. in varying amounts in a given field for quite some time. Now they are just letting it drive I guess.

  15. I never thought by efishta · · Score: 1

    I'd hear the phrase "space age tractors" in my lifetime... but we've reached such great technological innovation I marvel at future possibilities.

  16. Fatigue by jimmer63 · · Score: 5, Informative

    This could also be a great help to reduce fatigue related accidents on farms. I have friends that are farmers and during harvest times they routinely work 18+ hours driving harvesting machinery. Often a worker falls asleep at the wheel and has caused thousands of dollars in damage, not to mention the potential for human injuries or death. These tractors could keep these routine tasks safer and maybe in the long run cheaper too.

    1. Re:Fatigue by mxn · · Score: 1, Insightful

      And your friends will be be able to sleep all day long, for they will no longer have jobs.

    2. Re:Fatigue by ruvreve · · Score: 1

      Yeah this should reduce the potential for human injury because the people that use to drive the tractors/combines will be at the local bar drinking away the sorrows of losing their jobs.

  17. nothing new by chipster · · Score: 3, Informative
    this has already been in use in the Midwest for some time now...at least experimentally.

    GPS has been used in farming for a decade, and is fantastic for saving $$$ on fertilizers (liquid) and other farming tasks.

    1. Re:nothing new by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Um, didn't Cat have a project like this (actually identical) about 8 years ago? Wasn't CMU involved in something like this as well (maybe even with Cat)? Seems hardly like news, just someone being payed to place advertising as news.

    2. Re:nothing new by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      My father is a professor at Iowa State and has been working and building with these concepts for the last 15 or more years. It really does take a long time for Slashdot to pick up a story.

  18. ... Even more purposes for GPS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    If it automatically categorizes collection rates, bakes bread, and has a SheepTracker de-collision GPS system energy> then I want one! And it better be yellow!

    Oh, and do they come with a free keyring, Sir?

    And what about a free laser to automatically kill anything not wearing a GPS tracker. Ah, technology :-)

  19. Questions! by jinglecat · · Score: 0

    Does it account for when a tornado is near?

    What good is this if some 14 year old rural Kansas kid can drive already with a farmers permit?

    How do those water-wheely thingys work that are on a pivot axis?

    1. Re:Questions! by Thunderstruck · · Score: 1

      In South Dakota, folks start driving at 14, and don't need to be farmers. (Well actually its free driving from 6am to 8pm at 14 years and 6 months, or 14 years and 3 months if you take drivers' education class.)

      Remember, to have a car accident, you need something to hit.

      --
      Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
  20. That's not a satellite, it's the Death Star!!! by Eberlin · · Score: 1

    Alas, we may see Darth Vader controlling farming equipment with his tractor beam.

    Man, I can't wait until they use this to make a bigger version of Robot Wars. :)

  21. Information Please? by Buzz_Litebeer · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I was looking at this, and despite the funny jokes about a redneck skynet, and all hail the rise of the john deer overlords, I do have a couple serious questions.

    In kansas a lot of the farmed land in the north western parts of kansas is non-uniform. People tend to have this idea of kansas as being a flat area, but the land is actually quite hilly in the western parts.

    What happens if a tractor slips or loses traction? Or do the tractors simply not operate when it is muddy? How much error detection and fixiing do these tractors have. What happens if it finds itself on a part of a field it shouldnt be on, IE its transmitter goes out for a short period of time due to electrical disturbance (say freak lightning or something else).

    Does the tractor drive across tilled land to get back to the spot (possibly destroying crops) or does it know to re-orient itself, drive along the right path, and then proceed about its task.

    What happens if there is a hardware failure, is it possible to set a new tractor right where the last one set off, or does it need to go through the entire process again?

    these things werent answered very well in the article, but are very obvious questions i think that should pop up to someone who read the article.

    --
    If you don't vote, you don't matter, so don't waste your time telling me your opinion
    1. Re:Information Please? by jethro200 · · Score: 1

      I have read about this technology somewhere else before. If I remember correctly, this technology would for the most part drive the equipment by itself, but that tractor/combine/whatever would still have a person in it to take over or do anything that had to be done manually.

    2. Re:Information Please? by holla2040 · · Score: 1

      Its called feedback. The tractors know where they are and where they should be, the difference is call ed error. The tractor merely moves in a direction to minimize the error. It doesn't matter that there is mud along the way. If for the some reason the error becomes too large, the tractor will probably enter an 'error' condition where it just stops and waits for help.

      --
      Dr. Craig Hollabaugh
      craig@hollabaugh.com
      Author of Embedded Linux, www.embeddedlinuxinterfacing.com
    3. Re:Information Please? by wuzzeb · · Score: 1

      I have heard about this type of technology before (not any real research tho). These are just thoughts on how this could work, not actual facts.

      First off, the local radio stations are used to get really acurate positional information. (do a google search for Differential GPS). I heard they were trying to place the fertalizer directly in the furrows and not between them. For this you would need accuracy to 1/4". But at a max the error with Differential GPS would be around a meter. Hence the tractor knows where it is EXACTLY and any error will not be noticable. Since the tractor isn't relying on how many times the wheels go around to find its location, it wouldn't matter if the tires slip since it will always know where it is. Also, presumably the tractor would have a map of all the hills and terrain and would take that into account.

      Second, I would assume that if the tractor was unable to get a GPS or local radio signal, it would just stop moving and wait until someone came to drive it or until a signal was restored. The tractor would only move if it could tell exactly where it was. It would need to have a map of the fields so it would never drive across tilled fields. In the event of an electrical storm or something, the tractor would stop and wait for a signal.

      Finally, the tractor must have a manual override, so say a hardware failure happens. You the operator get a new tractor, drive the tractor into the field where the old one stoped, and basicly push go. The tractor then uses GPS to find its location and continues. You would probably want to ride on the new tractor for a few rounds anway to make sure eveything is working.

    4. Re:Information Please? by aaronhurd · · Score: 1

      All of the systems that John Deere sells under the "AutoTrac" flag require someone to be in the tractor. I don't remember the statistics off the top of my head, but I believe that, if you are out of your seat for more than six seconds, the auto-steer system will shut off. The system assists you; it doesn't do the job for you.

      Now, a good question is . . . if you have a GPS receiver (which is essentially at a point, usually on the top of the tractor cab), how does one compensate for slopes, etc? If you're in fairly hilly territory, and your tractor is on an incline perpendicular to the direction of travel, your GPS coordinates may be shifted a foot or two to either side (depending on the direction of the incline.) Compensation for that really doesn't happen right now, but there are a number of companies (including John Deere) that will soon be releasing methods to correct for hilly terrain.

    5. Re:Information Please? by eallison · · Score: 1

      Research on this was done at Stanford a few years ago. The guy who did it was named Dave - don't remember his last name, but he was my TA in a class taught by Brad Parkinson - the guy who was the program manager for GPS when it went up (who was also Dave's advisor). The gist of the research was that they used GPS, and then augmented it with an inertial system, or they used an inertial system and corrected it with GPS every few seconds. It's related to the research they're still doing here on linking GPS with a bunch of other systems - one of the applications is increasing reliability of systems like that so they can be used to land planes.

    6. Re:Information Please? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Your concerns are dead on. In fact, another issue is how high to place the GPS receiver on the tractor body. For example, when we made use of John Deere's Accutrack GPS solution, the recommended placement is at the top of the tractor cab. Problem is, when pulling tillage or planting equipement on a hill with a big four wheel drive tractor, that position atop the cab is not taken into account by their guidance system -- and thus spacing between successive passes contracts or expands depending upon the direction of the pass. Clearly, these sorts of issues can be answered with proper refinements and placement procedures, but agricultural vendors aren't there yet. Finally, an aside: compaction is a problem for our farm as we've adopted ridge tillage strategies so as to minimize our water loss. --- a kansas corn/soybean/milo/wheat farmer. PS. If there is an industry crying out for interoperable solutions, it is the farming industry. As it is, vendor lock-in and proprietary solutions kill the opportunity for individual farmers to innovate by mixing and matching the best technologies for their solutions.

  22. Not exactly new... by leshert · · Score: 2, Interesting

    My former boss worked on something like this years ago, although if I recall correctly, it was based on dead reckoning and computer vision, not GPS.

  23. SA? by outernet · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Hmm, what happens when Gulf War III starts, and the US turns SA back on? (Selective Availability, undetectable errors added to readings). Could be interesting...

    1. Re:SA? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All military is switching to the L2 (encrypted P(Y) code, 1.2 GHz) GPS frequency.

    2. Re:SA? by Mr_KnowItAll · · Score: 2, Interesting

      SA introduces an error, but it's not undetectable if you have a reference station in the vicinity. This two-station Differential GPS (DGPS) approach is pretty much essential for any precision work such as earth moving, and these systems are quite common these days.

      The autonomous vehicle technology described in the article is not very interesting compared to something happening stateside, the DARPA Grand Challenge. On March 13th, 2004, vehicles will set out on a race from a point near Los Angeles and head for Las Vegas, completely under autonomous control. They must also carry sufficient intelligence to avoid collisions and obstacles, and they need to move fast! Visit the DARPA Grand Challenge site for more information. This competition is pretty much open to all, and the prize is $1 million. Watch for my team's entry, it will be the one with a plush Tux the Penguin strapped in the driver's seat!

    3. Re:SA? by thogard · · Score: 1

      The new sats may not be able to turn it back on the way it had been. S/A is pointless anyway the way it was done since there are much better ways of keeping the other guys from using GPS such as local area jamming. Modern recivers can all do DGPS which bypasses the SA induced errors. Remember the US Air Force took out a russian jammer in Iraq with a GPS guided bomb. Also with WAAS now live, there is no way they AF will turn on SA and risk the political mess that would cause. They have better ways and SA is gone forever.

  24. GPS guided machinery by Pompatus · · Score: 2, Insightful

    As great is this might be to farmers in australia, my question is how long will it take to automate my lawn care?

    It's great fun to spend half a day getting drunk to ignore extream heat while mowing your lawn, but i'll bet people would buy lawnmowers that would do it for you.

    This might also eliminate that neighbor that has the fortitude to wake up at 7:00 am on saturday to cut his lawn.

    --

    ----
    Squirrel ... It's not just for breakfast anymore
    1. Re:GPS guided machinery by binaryDigit · · Score: 1

      As great is this might be to farmers in australia, my question is how long will it take to automate my lawn care?

      There is already something like this. It doesn't use gps (it uses wires similar to pet invisible fences) and an algorithm that produces a "random" path. But it effectively does what you want, to mow the lawn for you so you don't have to.

      RoboMower

    2. Re:GPS guided machinery by thogard · · Score: 1

      How many times can you hire someone to mow your law for $32,000?

  25. How soon for a personal version? by xtrucial · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I wonder how soon we'll see an automated lawnmower for ordinary yards and lawns. I've seen the vacuum cleaner that senses obstacles, allowing it to vacuum a room unattended. Seems like mowing a lawn wouldn't be too much different. Of course, you'd have to define boundaries, because, unlike an indoor room, there might not be solid walls at the edge of the lawn.

    1. Re:How soon for a personal version? by binaryDigit · · Score: 2, Informative
  26. Rollin' in the Hay. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Picture this. Billy and Sally sneak in to the field for a little hanky panky in the chest high throngs of wheat.

    [Distant whhhrrring getting louder.]

    Billy: oh! oh! uh.... what's that noise?
    Sally: I don't know.
    [they stand up]

    B&S: Ack! The cleaners!

    [They run for their lives lest they be chopped up by a combine!]

    How would this system prevent death the way a real diver would?

    1. Re:Rollin' in the Hay. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Do you have any idea how fast a combine is moving while harvesting? Judging by your comment, no.

  27. clouds? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Better hope there are no freak storms...

    Stop! .. I said Stop!

  28. advantages of using GPS by BlueTrin · · Score: 5, Informative

    I used to work in a farm and I can say that adding altitude can give you a whole new perspective about what's going on in your fields. Over the years, there have been a number of attempts at using images gathered from airplanes and satellites to enhance scouting

    These images provided some interesting views, but were never timely enough to be useful for making management decisions. Plus, the equipment was not readily available to make a pass when you needed it made.

    The only option growers had for aerial scouting that provided immediate information was to learn to fly themselves. For most, the cost of flying lessons and airplanes meant that wasn't a very practical option.

    Now new technology is opening the door for more immediate, more useful aerial information about your crops. And if you just want to fly over your fields to see how they look from above, that's becoming easier and more affordable, too.

    After years of promise that satellites would revolutionize crop scouting, recent developments are turning promise into reality.

    Aerial photos can be especially useful for mapping fields in remote areas. A group of ranchers and groups interested in resource management in Wyoming have been working together the past five years to gather aerial images of rangeland in areas that are not readily accessible by ground.

    It can be used like in WHIPP program, the Natural Resources Conservation Service (NRCS) and Lake DeSmet Conservation District are using aerial imagery to map leafy spurge locations in a 54,000-acre area.

    Leafy spurge is a perennial noxious weed that's spreading on rangelands. Cattle won't eat it and herbicides provide inconsistent control so they're trying to develop an integrated weed management program.

    --
    Don't you know it is now both immoral and criminal to think beyond the next quarterly report?
    1. Re:advantages of using GPS by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Aerial photos in the past five years?

      In South Dakota we were getting aerial photos of the farmland 30 years ago.

    2. Re:advantages of using GPS by JET+666 · · Score: 1

      Camera mounted to a kite or R/C plane

      --
      De sig boss de sig
  29. How odd by Nidhogg · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I work for Cat dealer and I was told about this some months ago by our Agriculture Manager. It's already offered in the Challenger MT700 models. In fact there are already quite a few in operation. And oh by the way, John Deere (enemy!), is also offering it in some models.

    Depending on how much you want to spend on these tractors you can have an accuracy down to 8 inches per pass in the field.

    Of course when he told me this all I could think of was Evil Plan #234.

    1. Hack the Omnistar system.
    2. Assume control of all Challenger tractors in Indiana.
    3. Plow under Terre Haute.

    Hey we all have our own little dreams...

    1. Re:How odd by Tumbleweed · · Score: 1

      Strange, my Evil Plan #234 is nothing like that. Mine involves using all those remotely controlled farming machines to carve/plow/mark giant paid ads into the arth visible from airplanes.

      Step 2: Profit!

      Okay, either ads or profanity. Anything but 'first post'.

    2. Re:How odd by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Of course when he told me this all I could think of was Evil Plan #234.

      1. Hack the Omnistar system.
      2. Assume control of all Challenger tractors in Indiana.
      3. Plow under Terre Haute.


      .
      .
      .
      .

      Of course when I read this all I could think of was Evil Plan #234-r.

      1. Hack the Omnistar system.
      2. Assume control of all Challenger tractors in Indiana.
      3. Merage Cat and John Deer into the ultimate tractor.
      4. Plow under ms at Remond.....
      5. ?????
      6. PROFIT!!!!!

    3. Re:How odd by hdc · · Score: 1

      Oh yah the Challenger. My Dad's been a Cat mechanic for years now and has been around to see some of the wicked new Ag and Off-highway tech Cat's been working on. The Challenger got a roll out akin to Win 98 when it was launched. As far as tractors go it's pretty amazing. Wait'll you see some of the stuff they're working on! But right now they're already shipping GPS controlled, navigated, monitored equipment for mining and other extreme environments. This isn't all that new.
      Some of the stuff in pipe is pretty cool. Remember that trick forklift equipment mover Ripley used in Aliens? Not too far off from reality.
      Oh and if you happen to live anywhere in the vicinity of Peoria or Aurora, Ill Cat needs tech people who don't suck! Check 'em out and send 'em your CV. Tired of writing code for lame applications? How 'bout getting to work on the code that controls a 100 ton off highway truck? Far cooler if you ask me.
      Just about everything in the Cat product lines will eventually be software dependant, if it isn't already. Check 'em out!

    4. Re:How odd by Knacklappen · · Score: 1

      Well, the Agriculture & Off-highway business is as hi-tech as all those fancy car manufacturers. Add a higher demand for reliability. In the R&D dept of the company I am working with (competitor to CAT - and we are better of course... lol)... well anyway we calculate with that no serious repair must be necessary within the first 10,000 hours.
      For cars, whis would mean no serious repair within the first 500,000 miles... A slight difference to what we are used to in everyday life, ehhh?

      In related news: I wonder whether it is helpful for your dad when you are telling us others of CAT secrets? But keep telling, I surely don't mind. Just don't expect me to tell you some of our's... :)

      --


      Excellence: Moderate (mostly affected by comments on your karma)
  30. yep by lurgyman · · Score: 1

    I'm holding out for Farm-driven satellite equipment.... dust your crops from space!

  31. You obviously never heard of... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    the famous Japanese Band, "Space Combine".

    http://www.soundinfo.jp/artist/s/space_combine.h tm l

  32. Old news... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    They were doing this probably ten years ago. Of course growing up on the farm you hear about that kind of stuff.

  33. Exodous by Thunderstruck · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I come from a long line of farming folk. I've farmed with my folks, they farm, their folks farmed with other farming folks....

    Modern farming folks, armed with this system will need fewer folks around the farm. Fewer folks in the area means a smaller demand for services, so more folks will leave. Finally, fewer and fewer folks will fill the rural landscape.

    Will this technology be the nail in the coffin of rural life in the midwestern states, requiring only a few folks to farm for everyone?

    What happens to the rest of the folks in more populated states when the system crashes and there are too few farmers to farm fields the hard way?

    --
    Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
    1. Re:Exodous by irontiki · · Score: 1

      Modern farming folks, armed with this system will need fewer folks around the farm. Fewer folks in the area means a smaller demand for services, so more folks will leave. Finally, fewer and fewer folks will fill the rural landscape.

      Will this technology be the nail in the coffin of rural life in the midwestern states, requiring only a few folks to farm for everyone?


      I think you're right about fewer farming jobs hastening the exodus from rural America. But don't underestimate the effect of run amok tractors plowing under midwestern houses and roads.

    2. Re:Exodous by Scrameustache · · Score: 1

      What happens to the rest of the folks in more populated states when the system crashes and there are too few farmers to farm fields the hard way?

      That's why the government keeps a secret stash of Amish folk in suspended animation.

      --

      You can't take the sky from me...

    3. Re:Exodous by Mr.Sharpy · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure where your family farms, but in the Miss. Delta where we do our farming (cotton, soybeans, rice) it's getting very difficult to find reliable farm hands. I for one would welcome the opportunity to dismiss half of the crystal meth monkeys we employ.

  34. Hot! Hot! Hot! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Gaah! It's too hot in Finland! The computer hall I'm in is fortunately air-conditioned, so I guess I've got to stay here and post stuff all night long to survive. Oh, the humanity!

    1. Re:Hot! Hot! Hot! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      CS at HUT? Care to sample a German exchange student cock? I'm happy to be a top or a bottom - whichever floats your boat.

  35. Yep by heli0 · · Score: 1

    This story, covered by slashdot last week, is a lot more detailed.

    --
    Whenever the offence inspires less horror than the punishment, the rigour of penal law is obliged to give way...
  36. unintended consequences... by sstory · · Score: 3, Funny

    Be careful about how the "Home" button's programmed.

  37. redneck SkyNet by Tumbleweed · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    "Ahyl be back...with some beer!"
    - The Terminatorsaurus!

  38. Weee! by Ridge · · Score: 1

    It's all fun and games until little Billy and his pals are playing Children of the Corn and get chopped up by a combine or somesuch. A human should probably be left in the loop...

  39. Son In Law II by jwriney · · Score: 1

    It's all fun and games until Pauly Shore hacks the guidance system and writes "Crawl" in 50 foot cursive letters across the back 40...

    --riney

  40. Please explain more... by switcha · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I, for one, didn't see anything in there about how it improves over an experienced farmer who can drive a tractor well.

    From the article i got the sense these were just modified regular tractors, not some lightwieght version that reduces compaction.

    I invite you to go look at any farmer's (try my dad) row crops. The furrows on fields of row crops such as carrot seed and garlic are laser straight, and they travel the same furrows when working the field all season long. Growing up, Dad used to let me try to cultivate a row at the very edge of the field (where it was easy for him to fix) and it was always a disaster. However after years of doing it, my dad and many of the farmers in our area had it down to where you could look all the way down a 1/4 mile field and see only inches of deviation.

    Furthermore, even if someone had some wandering furrows, it's just a matter of staying in them when doing work in the field as the crop grows (spraying, etc).

    I can see a system that uses lighter machinery or allows few passes over a field in a season, but if we're talking about driving the same tractors by different methods, aside from the convenience, I don't see how it would yield the spectacular result quoted. Unless they were comparing their tractors to one driven by complete novices who wander all over the field (too much Fosters?)

    --
    You know what? ... A little club soda *did* get that out!
    1. Re:Please explain more... by thogard · · Score: 1

      The point with the new systems is that the rows are in the exact same spots every year. Since most of Australia's farm land is qucikly turning into the Oklahoma dustbowl (isn't it great to see history repeat?), they have to do whatever they can to keep the soil from blowing away. What they are doing involves alternating rows of crops so you have a row of food, then a row of some plant that takes little water and provides wind resistance sort of like mini-treelines. The result is you need to harvest the crop out of the middle of another crop. This also allows you do crop rotation in the same field.

      The water and soil erosion problems in Australia are getting to the point where something drastic must be done soon or there will be no more crops in many places. Many areas have pumped all the fresh water out of the aquifers and they are being replaced by salt water. The massive fires last summer also manged to transfer several trillion liters of water back into the oceans. The major cities are growing without bound but the two largest cities are nearly out of water. Melbourne is sucking its water reserves at 200 billion liters a year but its population keeps growing and there are no more new water reserves. If the rain stays the same for 5 years, there won't be any more water. The goverment's plan right now it encourage people to store the rain water that falls on their roof and they collect all the water from upstream. The problem with that is that its needed in the ground and in the trees. (for reasons why see Okla in the 1930s). water saving faucets not only aren't requireed, but you can still buy shower heads that aren't water saving. New shower heads in Calif are 1.5 gal/min. The best you can buy here are 2.5 gal/min (9.5l/min) and they are next to the very popular ones that are more like 15 gal/min. The only place Aussies are ahead on water savings are the dual flush toilet.

  41. I predict beer & DVD sales will go up! by Tumbleweed · · Score: 1

    So the farmer rides around in his remotely-piloted tractor/combine/whatever all day, and since he doesn't have to steer, he can just sit in there in his air conditioned vehicle drinking beer and watching DVDs. Sounds nice! It's almost enough to make one become a farmer...except for all the alien abductions and their anal probes and heyheyhey that hurts me!

    The downside to this automation: It makes the premise of Maximum Overdrive that much more plausible. I mean, if it was just confined to homocidal soda machines, that'd be one thing, but this makes it possible for SkyNet to mow us down - literally. Automated Soylent Green factories. Eep!

  42. Re:Why is this bad? by John+Hurliman · · Score: 1

    Does everyone who went through the military computer simulator know about the infantry kangaroos?

  43. don't badmouth anal probes, dude! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    except for all the alien abductions and their anal probes and heyheyhey that hurts me!

    I've never quite understood why an anal probe would be a bad thing. I mean I'd love to have someone who would probe my colon thoroughly. Aaaah! Even thinking about it makes me erect. Where can I satisfy this urge?!?!

  44. Watch out, it's a rabid tractor! by pj737 · · Score: 1

    http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/11.05/start.htm l?pg=6

  45. Cool by pHsHsTK · · Score: 1

    Now if i can just find a way to inter-link them to SimFarm, I can just stay inside on my computer all day and read Slashdot posts!

  46. The peasants R revolting by madpierre · · Score: 0, Troll

    One of the biggest farm exporting nations in the world, Australia is at the
    forefront of a drive to take broad-scale agriculture back to the precision of
    peasant farming.

    Doh ... ?

    So get some peasants to drive the tractors.
    No need for satnav. But then again ...

    Oz might have reeely stoopid peasants.

    --
    siggy played guitar
  47. All your tractor belong to Gene Simmons! by JoeSilva · · Score: 1


    Ahh, takes me back to those halcion days of 1984 with the fine (uh, yeah) movie "Runaway".

  48. Similarly by eskimoboy · · Score: 2, Informative

    I recently read an article in MIT's Technology Review discussing something similar. It looks like NASA is working on something similar, and for a similar purpose, although different in implementation. Finally, agriculture is getting into advanced new electronics with great ideas backed by government.

  49. Re:(Groan) What sort of hole...Holy farm. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "(Groan) What sort of hole...are we digging ourselves into now with technology?

    As they say, as you reap so will you sow."

    Mob boss: We have a farm that's doing poorly. See what you can do about it?

    Mob enforcer: OK, godfather.

    *on the farm*

    Mob enforcer: OK father, were's the money?

    Priest: I'm sorry my son. I can not say.

    Mob enforcer: OK boys let's plant him.

  50. train my mower with gps? by tbaggy · · Score: 1

    What I want is a way to "train" my lawnmower with a GPS...then once trained (mow one week or two), I could just fuel up the mower and let it do its work...automatically, without me sitting on the thing for 3 hours.

    Anything like that out there??

  51. Re:yep-Inhale THIS! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "I'm holding out for Farm-driven satellite equipment.... dust your crops from space! "

    Drug dealers are also holding out. Dust your customers from space.

  52. similar projects by weeroona · · Score: 2, Informative
    the NREC at carnegie mellon has been working on automated tractors for a while now.

    I worked there in 2000 and the best part was the big red button on the front. it was a little odd having my computer space 20 feet from a tractor with gizmos.

  53. Saw this at Disney World, Orlando, FL by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When you get out of a specific ride ( I think Space Mountain) they've got some nice displays, one of them with robotic farming equipment being serviced. Pretty precognizent, eh? Or maybe something more sinister? ;)

  54. Remote hijackings? by grwufwuf · · Score: 1
    What happens when someone hijacks the control signal and sends 50-100 combines down main street or through the county fair whacking as they go?

    Not that one can't dodge a combine (trust me on that one) but...

  55. Alamo Group 1995 by phrostie · · Score: 1

    i used to work for a company that was working with this in the mid 90s. it was called alamo group. they were in Seguin Tx. the local Aggies would tell us about how this was the rage at school.

  56. Motivation by femto · · Score: 2, Informative

    At least part of the motivation for this research is that Australia generally has the poorest soils in the world. The rocks and soil are so old here that for the most part, there just aren't many nutrients left, since they've been leeched out over the millennia. Consequently, soil degradation, salinity and erosion are big topics here. Slowly our argicultural industry is realising they need to address these issues (with things like GPS tractors) otherwise there wil be no soil left for them to farm.

    1. Re:Motivation by cdn-programmer · · Score: 1

      Very good point. Australia also has some of the most arid agricultural regions in the world. Consequently irrigation is critical and this leads to excess stress on systems like the Murry/Darling as well as serious salinity problems.

      Now - if Australians could harness the torrential rains that sometimes inundate Sydney and Brissy as well as some of the NT then maybe some of these problems could be solved.

      But this would sort of consitute "terraforming a sub-continent" I suppose and the Aussie tree huggers would of course strenously object! Ah well!

  57. My brother does this in Illinois by whoda · · Score: 1

    My brother works for a large seed/research company.

    Their tractors have for years been equipped with GPS.
    They plot entire fields, and keep a record of things like: average soil moisture content, average amount of nutrients in the soil, elevation changes, and subjective human inputs on conditions, etc...

    When they go to plant seed, the computers are connected to the data, and the GPS receiver, and the planter.

    When seeds start going into the ground, the seed density AND fertilizer amounts/mixture's are changed on the fly to accomodate the growing conditions of that area of the field, with no operator input.

  58. This is an interesting idea .. but.... by Recovery1 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I have to say I think this is a pretty good idea... but...

    Farm machinery and computers just don't mix. It sounded like a great idea when they started to put computers into tractors, but it has been nothing but a nightmare to farmers. Wires get too warm and fry or make contact all the time under the hood blowing out chips, dirt gets into the electronics themselves and causes them to quit working. When this happens, can Mr. Farmer fix it? No, it is like a modern vehicle. Mr. Farmer usually has to pay some programmer from 300KMs away to drive down and fix a $5 computer chip. People have lost days due to down time and at a critical time in the year this can mean tens of thousands of dollars a day, not to mention the cost of getting someone to fix it out to the tractor. The cost and problems these computerized tractors have is why no farmer considers it, or if they do they soon realize their mistake and trade the sucker off quick.

    Sounds like a great idea until these automated tractors start shutting down and then you start to see the real cost of this venture. Leave the driving to the farmer. Technology still can't compete against the flesh and blood farmer.

    1. Re:This is an interesting idea .. but.... by cdn-programmer · · Score: 1

      I don't think you know very much about tractors and farming in general. All farm equipment breaks down. It isn't more likely to break down because it happens to have a computer in it unless the computer is not rugedized enuf for the job.

      You also reveal your ignorance when you suggest that a "programmer" would have to drive 300KM's to replace the chip. I can assure you that most farmers I know can easily deal with a "chip" that needs to be replaced. If the "chip" only cost $5 bux they would keep some on hand.

    2. Re:This is an interesting idea .. but.... by Recovery1 · · Score: 1

      I DO know a far amount more about tractors and farming then you give me credit for, being a grain farmer who in fact does repair tractors as part of my operation. As I stated - it sounded like a good idea BUT this hasn't panned out. These computers in tractors are like the ones in your vehicle. It controls everything and they are a "black box" that can only be fixed by a "Programmer" with the right parts and a diagnostic computer. (they don't sell these kits or parts to us 'arrogant farmboys' I have tried to get them.)

      Also, don't be so quick to pass out "arrogance" to people. This is a true story, that has been repeated over and over to many farmers in this area. Our closest repair centre is in fact that far away. We can't take them to there when the computer goes down, so they have to come to us.

  59. Kansas Is Flatter Than a Pancake by A+nonymous+Coward · · Score: 1

    It has been scientifically proven. I refer you to The Annals of Improbable Research, for research that can not, or should not, be reproduced.

  60. This isn't that beneficial by icleprechauns · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I honestly can't see how this will help the farm industry in preventing soil corrosion, seeing as how farmers barely run their tractors over the same area twice. Although the labor benefits are obvious.

    You'd think there would be a simpler solution that doesn't implement GPS, kinda like those robot lawn mowers, except smart...

    --
    I'm a signature virus. Please copy me to your signature so I can replicate.
  61. Bubba Says by Arbogast_II · · Score: 1

    I find that fascinating. I was visiting relatives in South Georgia, USA. I was checking out the Roundup Resistant Cotton. Amazing stuff, makes weed control real easy when you can get Herbicide on the crop.

    It's crystal clear that advances in Genetics combined with advances in things like automated machinery are gonna make agriculture alot more efficient, and make it where less people have to do the mind numbing work of an agricultural laborer

    Cool Stuff

    --


    HenryJamesFeltus.com
  62. Only a couple people got why this is so important by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    After reading all the replies, the impact on employment was discussed, but only in relation to farmers. Jeez folks, perhaps you should consider that soon, most heavy equipment will be automated. As well, so will cars and trucks.

    Quick, what's the number one job for men in North America ... yup, truckers. So, think of the resulting massive unemployment levels that will result from going to autonomous, automated machinery.

    By the way, you can already buy robotic vacuam cleaners and lawnmowers.

    My advice, start saving your pennies ...

  63. Some more info by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I work on a farm and have been to field demonstrations of this style of equipment, and we are on the verge of purchasing.

    1) The tractors still have drivers, who are aways in the tractor.

    They are fitted with a deadmans switch that you have to press every few minutes. If the button isnt pressed, the tractor goes into a hard (either left or right) turn.

    2) The driver controls groundspeed, implements, and can override the steering (a pressure sensor in the steering lets the computer detect input from the wheel)

    3) They use a beacon for high accuracy, if they lose contact with it it informs you and tells you to stop driving.

    4) Most modern tractors use hydraulic steering, so a valve is installed for the gps/controller to interface with

    5) Trimble do a fair bit of this sort of stuff, have a look on their site

    SafT

  64. Other questions... by jrsimmons · · Score: 1

    I was a bit disappointed by the lack of serious consideration for this technology. I grew up working on a farm, and this type of technology raises some different questions for someone of my background.

    1. Labor. Currently tens of thousands of wage workers make their living working these machines. If some day, and I mean some day way into the future, the tilling process is truly automated, what will these often low-education workers do instead? Not to say it is a bad thing to improve the efficiency of an industry, just something to be considered.

    2. While I'm sure most of you cannot imagine such a life, I contribute much of my success in the collegiate and business worlds to my upbringing in a farm atmosphere. The number of households leading this type of life is growing smaller at a considerable rate (sorry, no stats...). Will this have a lasting impact of small town America?

    3. With the advance in the technology used to grow and harvest crops, how will this affect technological advances in the crops themselves. Europe today is especially resistant in some areas to genetically modified crops. The US is more receptive, but still very cautious. I believe this will happen eventually, but not in the near future.

    --
    If you would like to be a leader with a large following...drive slowly down a windy two-lane road
  65. Sounds like a Trimble AgGPS Autopilot by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    Automatic tractor driving was in test at Stanford for John Deere a decade ago. It's been available for John Deere tractors for a while now. You can buy a third party system (Trimble AgGPS Autopilot) and add it to an existing tractor. This works especially will with the Caterpiller Challenger, because that's drive-by-wire.

    These things currently don't have collision avoidance or good hill-handling capabilities. You still need an operator, although they don't have to do much. Full automation is coming, but it's not really here yet.

  66. This is already available in products... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ... from Trimble Navigation (NASDAQ:TRMB). Have a look at http://http://www.trimble.com/agriculture.html for more details on their agricultural products that allow GPS to guide agricultural machinary.

    The cool thing about these systems is you can use them to put in a crop then use the logged positions from the planting to guide future visits to the field to weed, spray etc. The systems guidance is accurate enough to till earth beteen rows without fear of root damage to the crop. The operator can spend their time looking out the rear window admiring how well the system works!

  67. GPS and Farming by farmerboy1967 · · Score: 1

    Finally A reason to subscribe ;)

    I actually have some experience with this, being that I grew up farming and have several relatives who still do.

    #1 These tractors are WAY too expensive for a farmer that plow 1 and 3 hundred acres. the people that are going to use them are the peeple who plow 1 to 3 thousand acres at a time. And these farms always have somebody on hand that can fix a tractor at a moments notice.

    #2 farms have been using GPS for years, I have a cousin who is a Crop Duster. Those planes have military grade GPS units on them thanks to the Cotton Industry and the "Boll Weevil Eradication Program". If he strays as much a a foot off course the goverment gets a report of it. and flying 6 feet off of the ground at 100 MPH, in a high performance, turbocharged, custom built and maintained by the pilot, airplane doesn't leave any room for error. Especially when there are power lines that have to be flown under and trees that seem to always be at the end of the field that needs to be sprayed the most.

    I for one applaud the use for GPS, since it was usually me at one end of the field measuring over a dozen or so feet and flagging the pilot of the plane so he could line his prop up with me and another person on the other end of the field and start spraying just as he flew over me. Several people have lost heads to this antiquated way of doing things not to mention to all of my family and friends who now have cancer because of the poisons. Luckily, I do not.

    #3 Automation must come to farming if it is going to survive. How much do you pay for Catfish in the store? $3.50? $5.00? a pound. I can tell you that those farmers don't make but 45 to 50 cents a pound (in a good year). and it cost 42 cents a pound and two years to raise them. Those farms are now highly automated with oxygen sensors, floating paddle aerators, automated feeders, and backup power generators since most everything runs off of electricty, and in the country, the power goes out frequently. (D&#N AUTOMATED TRACTOR! it just ran over another power pole !!)

    #4 NASA is helping out because it is technology that can be transferred to/from other projects. How much do you think the have LEARNED from all those probes sent to Mars and into deep space?.
    Remember, It was NASA that came up with the "microwaves as a cooking source", "micro sensors" used in pacemakers, various different forms of plastics and adhesives, "improved manufacturing ideas", along with countless other pantents. (and dont forget "thermal forming cushioned seats" ala Tempur-Pedic(r) ) ;)

    People want good food, but most don't want to pay good prices for it. That is why a lot of our food comes from Mexico, Central, and South America where the growing time is shorter (time to market) and labor costs are nil. A portion of our seafood comes from China and Viet-nam. where they can pull it out of the water with almost no regulations, and dump it on the open market at a rate below American production costs.

  68. Precision Farming at John Deere by aaronhurd · · Score: 1

    I currently work at John Deere, doing technical support for their "GreenStar" line of precision farming products that were briefly mentioned in that article. I had very little experience with agriculture before I started with John Deere, (I grew up in Iowa, but in Des Moines) but since starting there, I've actually gotten excited (if you can imagine that) about the things that they are doing with their Ag Management Solutions division (their precision farming group.)

    It's important to note right now that there are a number of solutions offered by companies other than John Deere, but as I work for them, I am most familiar with their products.

    Precision farming system serves three primary purposes:

    1. Reduce costs - If you're overlapping when you're spraying a chemical to ensure that you have full field coverage, you're essentially wasting the amount of product which you're using to ensure overlap. Think about it . . . one additional foot of a chemical application, times one half of a mile per pass, times however many passes per field, times however many fields . . . you see how the cost-savings can add up. Chemicals aren't the only cost associated with doing operations in a field. When you're leasing a tractor for so many hours, paying by the hour for labor, and paying for fuel, eliminating one pass per field each time you perform an operation can mean huge cost savings.
    2. Make intelligent decisions about where to irrigate, or how to change planting varieties - John Deere's GreenStar Yield Mapping system can tell a operator what values of yield and moisture were achieved at any point in a field, so he can alter his irrigation system, plant different varieties across a field or plant different rates
    3. Variable Rate Seeding and Spraying - Almost impossible to do without a computer, a farmer can alter the rates at which he applies seed or a chemical throughout the field, based on GPS coordinate maps.

    Obviously, these benefits will not outweigh the costs of precision farming systems during the short-run, or for the small farming operation . . . but for larger operations over the long run, the benefit can be huge. Ultimately it boils down to making farming more efficient and more profitable for the farmer (while providing additional revenue to Deere and Company, of course) and ultimately, this is a good thing.

    In addition to John Deere's GreenStar product line, they also offer a product called JDLink, which allows owners to monitor usage of their equipment in the field. (This is really nice if you have a huge farming operation or are in the business of renting equipment.) It's not really precision farming, per se, but it's worth checking out. http://www.jdlink.com/

    Of course, what people are doing today is only the beginning. I can't give too much detail, but there is a lot going on at Deere and Company in their precision farming group; it looks as though they believe precision farming in "the next big thing" in farming.

    If you are interested in learning more about John Deere's flavor of precision farming, visit the AMS web site (http://www.deere.com/en_US/ag/servicesupport/ams/ index.html) or stop by your local John Deere dealer. While you're at your John Deere dealer, if you're interested in tinkering with some software, pick up a copy of the JDOffice desktop software. It's only about $5.00 and you may get to talk to me when you activate it. ;-)

  69. Safer? Hah. by SuperBanana · · Score: 1

    This could also be a great help to reduce fatigue related accidents on farms. I have friends that are farmers and during harvest times they routinely work 18+ hours driving harvesting machinery. Often a worker falls asleep at the wheel and has caused thousands of dollars in damage, not to mention the potential for human injuries or death.

    Okay. Now, for a dose of reality. Ever seen on TV how they have the machines lined up in a row, one after the other? Now, remove the driver, put in a GPS-navigation system. So far so good, right?

    Now put yourself 20 feet in front of that cluster of combines. Better run like shit, my friend- because that computer has no clue you're about to get chewed into little bits.

  70. so this explains... by spike+it · · Score: 1

    So this explains the mystery behind crop circles! Aliens, my ass...it's those damned GPS driven tractors! Does the National Enquirer know about this?

  71. This is news? by juventasone · · Score: 1

    Maybe I'm the one who's mistaken here, but with the little knowledge I have on the subject, the writer of this article, and the slashdot community, both look grossly uninformed about GPS in agriculture. I know in my small hometown in Canada, they have been using GPS to guide farm equipment (namely for spreading fertilizers) for at least 5 years now. The equipment is provided by one the largest industrial GPS companies around, Trimble, who has an entire division for agricultural applications, which they dub "AgGPS".

  72. Similar Project by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Some of my friends worked on a smaller-scale project for their senior design at Rochester Institute of Technology. Apparently it worked fairly well, even in inclement winter weather!

  73. TMD by Sage+Gaspar · · Score: 1

    We have recently received reports that the Al Qaeda remenants are planning to smuggle Tractors of Mass Destruction into the country. We do not want to cause any alarm, but advise citizens to look out for any suspicious unmanned farming equipment moving down 5th Avenue.

  74. Yay for GPS.. by Large+Green+Mallard · · Score: 2, Interesting

    No joke, just yesterday, I was standing on the greenwich meridian (a big steel line in the ground in Greenwich England) and my eTrex GPS said that the meridian was about 100 metres away, even after staying in the same spot for about 10 minutes, and it claiming accuracy of 7 metres from 6 satellites.

    As handy as GPS is, I don't entirely trust it :>

  75. I've always considered ... by torpor · · Score: 1

    ... Christmas Island a pretty good place for a space terminal. I'm West Australian. I am a space freak.

    What interests me about this story is the notion that with that much accuracy and control over soil degeneration, this technology is ripe for space farming.

    Give Australian farmers any piece of equipment designed for super accuracy and high-duration work, and they will find a way to break it, fix it, and make it better. Somehow. Australian farmers have learned many modern lessons - it wasn't so long ago that nobody could figure out how to grow stuff properly on that land. CSIRO and other Aussie science institutes continue to do very interesting stuff in crop research, soil health, water control, etc.

    Anyway - about the space thing. When we get into space, and need to start growing food, I'll bet that there will be an interesting market for crop-growing machinery which works in extreme conditions. In fact, if these Aussie robots go into interesting design directions, I would imagine they'd have applications for experimental crop-growth facilities in LEO, soon enough.

    Australia is as good a place as any to test all this. It is hot, dusty, and extremely tough land, some of it. Machines that can grow things and survive that environment untended with good control have all sorts of applications.

    --
    ; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
  76. Build Your Own GPS Tractor by cmcginty · · Score: 1

    This design has been tackled recently by a person at my engineering school. The results were good considering it was done with only a few grand. A lot of documentation on how it was completed is posted.

    GPS Tractor

  77. MOD PARENT UP! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    MOD PARENT UP!

  78. Been available for a while by ElderKorean · · Score: 1

    One of my friends actually worked on these systems.

    Beeline sells systems for fitting into all sort of agricultural systems.

    They are GPS based with 20cm or 2cm accuracy depending on system.

    I don't think the systems are sold as being driverless, but rather hands-free.

  79. gateway has been doing this for years by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    gateway has been experimenting with this for years. theres even a few systems already in use in kansas and parts of missouri.

    it works *pretty* well *most* of the time...

    altho its my understanding that its usually only used on certain *huge* fields with very few obstacles.

  80. For the rong reasons by cdn-programmer · · Score: 1

    It is so amasing how much total CRAP the media puts out. This story is no exception!

    First off, driving a tractor is rather boring and even more so when you consider that tilling the soil can take 12 hours per field. So a GPS driven tractor is valuable for one reason and one reason ONLY! It largely removes the need for an operator. Drive by wireless would also do the job and for instance INCO is using this in its underground mines. Surface mining systems are also under development.

    The downside of the technology is that if something screws up you literally can have a 20 ton tractor wander into a slough or into your neighbours feilds. Of course, human operators wander into slough's sometimes too in spite of the fact that the water is perfectly obvious as are the consequences. haha.

    -------------

    Yet the artical states that somehow this is going to reduce soils damage. Why? Where do these idjots get ideas like this? How about salinity? Tilling the soil does not introduce salinity. Irrigation does as do certain fertilizers such as KCl.

    It would be really nice if some of the reporters would educate themselves beyond a grade 3 level.