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Cheap, Rugged, Multiplayer Gamepads for Linux
IceAgeComing writes "Anyone interested in exploring multiplayer games under Linux should know: you can now pick up a four-way gamepad hub, with four gamepads, for under $15. It is known as the Gravis Multiport, and now it is supported under Linux. The link describes patches for Linux 2.4, but the drivers are now included in Linux 2.6. This input system used to cost more than $100, but it has been abandoned by Gravis since Windows 98. Now it's possible to pick them up extra cheap. Four-player Gauntlet under XMAME, anyone?"
that actually sounds better than those [console]-to-usb adapters, especially for the price.
Moderation Totals: Flamebait=2, Troll=1, Redundant=1, Insightful=6, Overrated=1, Underrated=1, Total=12. (not mine)
Now I can play Microsoft flight simulator...oh wait.
Does anyone out there know of any Linux games that require a joy stick? I'm a keyboard/mouse junkie myself...
If my answers frighten you, stop asking scary questions.
with perhaps the exception of xmame, gaming on linux is almost as fun as,well, typing in an xterm while picking one's nose.
Actually, I find the d-pads on these things horrendous, especially after a month or so of use.
Your better bet by far would be to get several Dual-Shocks (PS1 version would be fine) and some -$10 USB adapters from Radio Shack. I did, and it works great.
But that would involve prying three friends from their own computers and convincing them to come to your house to play a game when it's more convenient for them to stay in their own homes and play over the internet... Or if you're partial to the whole "physical presence" thing, have a lan and don't worry about the annoying 4-way split-screen...
Every piece of info except where to get the stupid things at that price? Helllo? McFly?
Is it me, or does nobody use gamepads for computer games anymore?
Sports titles, racing titles, action titles fill the catalog of PS2 and XBox. Adventure and party-style titles grace the inside of a GameCube. These are suited to the gamepad.
But on the computer, what are the usual games? FPSes, RTSes, first person adventure/role-playing games, games that use the mouse to its fullest (The Sims). The sports titles exist... but I don't believe they are best sellers.
Why? Gamers simply don't play those kinds of games, gamepad games, on computers. Yes I'm sure that SOME do. Most do not. And it's for a reason, computers lend themselves to keyboard-and-mouse games quite nicely, and consoles lend themselves to gamepad style games.
So to me, this is no big deal. I love computer games, but I can't think of one computer game I have played in the last 5 years that I would have liked to play with a gamepad. And I love my PS2 also.
Also... Gauntlet on XMAME? 4 people crowded around your computer desk... I can imagine the comfort level there. 3 people probably can't see the screen well enough, and even if they can, the crowded space will make this interesting for about 20 minutes of gameplay... a novelty.
Nothing against the poster, but use the medium for what it is best at... one player and online multiplayer games, and leave the gamepad games to the consoles...
Mark
Tomb Raider series
Thief
Max Payne
Prince of Persia
007: Nightfire
Keyboards are hell with these type of games.
How long until there's good support for these in EMacs?
Mmmmmm, ScummVM...
When I first tried Tomb Raider on keyboard, it was like "ARGGGG, this is useless". Let's compare technique with this game.
To move using a keyboard, I'd have to utilise 3 fingers, a joypad only required my thumb. This left my other thumb for actions on the pad. The keyboard would require a thumb too. Now for stuff like creep, sidestep, special actions, these were mappable to the 4 shoulder buttons on the pad, and I could use 4 fingers for each button. The keypad neccesitated me to do some fancy perpheral vision looking to make sure I hit those keys.
Then there's the case of ease. With the keyboard I'd have to give quick looks to make sure I didn't hit the wrong key. Plus my wrists were at awkward positions. With a gamepad, I never had to look at it, my eyes could remain on the screen 100%. Every button was immediately accesible and I knew what it was by pure feel. Both of my hands were my eyes, in essence.
There's no contest between a pad and keyboard for this game. Anyone who claims otherwise is lying, or just trying to start shit.
I got one of these -- just the controllers, not the gamepads -- back in the day when I was looking for a good emulator controller. It looks like it has 8 buttons, but it actually only supports the old standard of 4 -- the extras are just "turbo" buttons. Even though that's good enough for NES, they're still unwieldy due to the crooked cross controller, making Contra hard to play when you have to aim down -- it keeps running forward.
Linux's USB Sidewinder Pro support is perfectly fine, and they're not longer made and cheap. For $15, you get a controller with 9 buttons and good handling, more than enough for any console emulation.
So Linux finally got around to supporting a crappy gamepad setup that was released almost six years ago and isn't even supported by the manufacturer anymore, and we're supposed to...what? Help me out here. In what way could this even be remotely considered news or something that matters?
where the comment ends and sig begins
I swear by the EMS USB2 adapter. it allows you to use 2 Playstation Dual Shock pads per adapter. fully supported under linux, and recommended by the PyDance authors for those who crave Dance Mats. Works wonderfully in every emulator that supports the kernel joystick driver, and especially rules for XMame's fighting games The PS2 Dual Shock is the best controller ever made, other than the Japanese Saturn controller. Why use a crappy Gravis "good enough" pad if you already have the real thing?
Its going to get a bit friendly unless you've got a big monitor on a low res allowing everyone to see. Of course 4 person TuxRacer would be fun but I don;t think its supported
Rus
Cheap UK and US VPS
Yeah, I can't wait until we can emulate Linux on PC's. Then we'll be able to play Quake!
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I've played those same games the dude listed, and I agree. Yes, your arguments are valid, FOR FIRST PERSON SHOOTERS. None of those games (except 007 and *maybe* Max Payne) would qualify in the Quake realm of gaming technique. The biggie in the list is Tomb Raider. You obviously have never played this game on both methods, if you did you'd agree that a pad is superior.
And even in the case of Max Payne, this game is more Tomb Raiderish than Quakish. So yes, for your Quake/Doom/etc type of gaming, have at it with the mouse. But when you get into adventuring a pad is the only way to go.
> Also... Gauntlet on XMAME? 4 people crowded around your computer desk... I can imagine the comfort level there. 3 people probably can't see the screen well enough, and even if they can, the crowded space will make this interesting for about 20 minutes of gameplay... a novelty.
What, somewhere in the world there are still groups of geeks of whom nobody has access to a decent video projector? Not much problems seeing the screen when your entire wall is one. Tried it with Gauntlet 2 (sadly with only two players) and it was a great fun. If you didn't mind head-sized pixels, of course.
Digital Tits(tm).
Not trying to be flamebate but is there any reason someone has taken time to write new drivers for hardware that is 6 years old. I can understand legacy code, which is why linux will still boot on a 386 however this just seems a bit off. Is this bit of hardware really that good?
Rus
Cheap UK and US VPS
I have no connections with Maplin, I'm just a satisfied customer.
--
I found ONE for $40 at Half.com NONE at eBay.
BTW, what is it with Gravis abandoning everything they start?
I think the USB chip in them costs like $5 bucks or something. So it's an added $5 bucks per controller that doesn't really have to be there.
Well, ok it has to be there, but why doesn't gravis make some sort of multitap USB device so they can crank out cheaper joysticks that don't need USB chips in them. Since USB i've noticed most true analog joysticks are using cheaper potentiometers, probably to offset the cost of the USB chip.
Thanks in advance.
Maybe it's because the first computer games I played were on the Atari 2600, but I've never been able to get used to the gamepad. It's always HELL on my thumbs! I really LOVED the old Atari Joystick! Especially after you broke it in. Does anybody know of one of those that could be modified to work on a PC?
Does anybody else out there feel the same way?
My preference might not be specifically tied specifically to the 2600 game controller. Epyx made a 2600 controller (I think it was the 500XJ?) that was a 2600/C64 type controller with ergonomic design and "clicky" precision when you moved the stick into the right position.
With the Epyx controller I DESTROYED people in the Bitmap brother's "Speedball deluxe"!
Like cowbutt said, you can get cheap USB pads like Logitech in the $5 price range. Also, beware the cheaper PS2-USB converters, I bought a pair and they have a very noticeable delay between button-press and game response. Try before you buy...
USB natively supports up to 127 or so devices in V1, not sure how many in V2.
That's a lot more than four controllers.
Why bother with some obsolete and oddball hardware when you can just get a bunch of usb controllers?
May we never see th
I don't understand a thing..
Do we really need an article like this in late 2003?
/. advertisment BTW...
Come on, everyone knows that the usual PC-controller simply sucks! I killed so many of these expensive pieces of crap that using a decent controller (yes.. like that one for the playstation) with an USB adapter is a blessing!
And even if your PS pad is broken... Hell, I don't give a fuck. I just look at ebay or run down to the chinese shop at the corner and get a new one for a fragment of the price Gravis want's me to pay for their poor crafted, poor in handling, poor in almost every aspect PC-Gameport(!??)-Joystick-Crap.
Nice
hehe debian sucks
I have some to give away (the hub and four gamepads). They were bought unused from a reseller.
If anyone manages to help out in these ways, I'd be more than happy to mail you one.
Now you can play old games with older hardware! Ins't Linux just the best gaming platform?
Good god, I hate Microsoft.
I normally just bite my tongue, but this is a big story because ...
"This input system used to cost more than $100, but it has been abandoned by Gravis since Windows 98."
everyone gets excited that linux finally has support for some ancient piece of hardware? Wake me up when most vendors support their latest video,raid,direct-to-disk-DVD+-RW,... by providing linux drivers & utilities.
-- Instant Karma's gonna get you! [320848 = 2*2*2*2*11*1823]
I've been using the multiport and driver off and on for a year or so now. I haven't had any issues with the gamepads at all, in fact, they're some of the better PC gamepads I've used. Could be better, yes, but all in all they're worth every penny I paid for them ($20? :) That's about the price of a single USB or console controller.
I'd like to see a DirectX version as well.
I like to use the USB cable that comes with a usb memory disk to do this mod. The cables are expensive when purchased on their own but they are virtually free with most flashram drives. HAve a look around you (not the parent) probably have one or two lying around.
p ://members.cox.net/lazerman/downloads.html
Assembling the cable is childs play, all thats required is chopping the female plug off one end of an usb extension cable and wiring it up colour matching colour with the cable on an xbox controller.
To get it working on a PC Windows drivers are needed which can be found at:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/xboxhid/
or
http://grooveyardfunk.com/projects/xid/
or
htt
The drivers are made by different people so find the one that works best for you. some are picky about the version of windows. I do not know if there are Linux drivers.
I always thought the inline release on the xbox controller a marketing gimmick but it comes in quite useful when you do this mod because if you have another unmodified xbox controller cable you can still use the xbox controller on the xbox just by plugging the unmodified cable into where the inline release is.
At least that's what I thought the whole USB Human Interface Device thing was for.. to eliminate the need for drivers for every simple device..
What the hell is XMame?
Me and my flatmates acquired 5 USB gamepads for around 7 and a USB hub for 8 from www.dabs.com (UK). Then we downloaded ZNES and loads of games, and we play Super Bomberman 3 multiplayer (5 people together throwing bombs at each other) far too much. Well well worth the investment.
Gravis was, is and always will be the king of gamepads for the pc. Not king of joysticks, but king of gamepads. The gravis gamepad pro USB is the newest incarnation and is perfectly supported in linux. It's got a very similar button layout to the Playstation controller but no analog. Just about the only thing wrong with it is that all the buttons are digital, even the axis. Not so good for racing games and such, but excellent for emulating the classics.
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
Check out this page here for adapters which work, and perhaps the forums for ones which work under linux.
They "should" just be USB HID devices, so they "should" work, but there are some caveats...
Anyway, hands down, the best gamepad is the playstation 2 gamepad. Before that, it was the playstation gamepad. It is amazing how much all gamepads in the console industry suck, except for the playstation ones. Nintendo started out pretty good, the NES and SNES pads were nice, but the n64 on up sucked.
I have an "emulation station", a computer hooked up to my TV, with NES, SNES, sega, etc emulators on it, and it's controlled via ps2 gamepads, and playing on it is absolutely awesome.
if you already have Playstation controllers lying around, I can see how the adapters would be economical.
However, I recommend getting the $16 EMS USB2 adapters that support two PS1 controllers because of something else they support, namely PS1 dance pads. Dance pads will send Up+Down or Left+Right presses for certain jumps, and adapters that map the + Control Pad to axes won't register them. The Radio Shack adapter always maps the + Control Pad to axes. The EMS USB2 adapter, on the other hand, maps the + Control Pad to both axes and buttons 13-16.
Four-player Gauntlet under XMAME, anyone?
Blue Valkyrie... needs better technology... badly.
Anybody want a peanut?
I've read the Yellow wire (strobe wire as you called it) is used for light guns and the like. Possibly including Xbox Music Mixer Mike?
The ems usb2 works pretty easily under windows, and both under linux and windows, Stepmania will autoconfigure the pads correctly on it. Very reccomended for fellow ddr junkies.
I picked mine up about 2 years ago for $3 plus
shipping off of a surplus site. The were also selling a box of 500 misc video cards for $300.
It works well but the pads feel cheap and I had some
problems under the 2.6.0-test series with the kernel hardlocking when I removed one of the pads from the controller.
Well, at least one of their controllers was not garbage. I've lived very happily with a pair of Gravis Xterminators for the past five years (gameport connector, not the more recent USB thingies by the same name), used mostly for successive generations of extended sessions of EA Sports NHL '99-'04. Exuberant, hard-gripping, sweaty sessions of that game. And they offered a passthrough on their connector so you could chain two controllers to a single gameport. Not quite as good as Microsoft's gameport connectors on the back of their original Sidewinders, but acceptable. The Xterminators were really my ideal gamepads. They have both digital and analog D-pads, offer the usual 6 buttons on the right, plus a hat switch, right/left triggers, throttle, start & select buttons, and paddle switches perfect for pinball-style games. They remind me somewhat of Xbox controllers in form factor--but I haven't played an Xbox, so that's purely a visual connection. I can say that I was always comfortable plaing games with the Xterminators for hours on end. I paid something like CDN$90 per controller when I bought them, but I was hapy to pay that because I had used their controllers ever since my Amiga-owning days, and they had never let me down with faulty units. (The first Gravis joystick I purchased offered customizable stiffness for the X & Y axes, which was pretty cool for late eighties technology). The Xterminator combo has lasted extremely well, and only yesterday did the combination of tempting holiday rebates, rumblepad allure, consistently top ranking in PC Game magazine, and easy connectivity to friend's computers seduce me into purchasing a pair of Logitech Wingman Rumblepads (USB). I had contacted Gravis months ago telling them that I was looking at purchasing new gamepads and interested in finding a Canadian distributor for their new USB Gravis Xterminator Force Feedback gamepads, but they never returned my email... and in the mean time, I did read some very negative reviews about the quality of the new units. Finally, the lack of analog input would limit my capabilities in the new EA Sports franchises--so my choice was made to abandon Gravis with this generation of gamepads. If they had simply updated their original Xterminators to add force feedback and USB connectors, I would have been playing hockey with those last night instead of the new Wingmans. Ah well...
I just got a couple of these joysticks from ebay, and am going to build an adapter so I can use them with MAME. I found two circuits on the net for this purpose:
This link has a wealth of information on older game controller hardware.
This one has another (perhaps simpler) circuit design, with diagrams in postscript format. (Use gsview to view them on Windows.)
You can always depend on the Linux community to put the cart before the horse, thats for sure.
Manipulate the moderator system! Mod someone as "overrated" today.
I used to have a pile of joysticks and pads during the days of Atari 2600 and the Commodore64. We used to break them, open them and fix em, then break them again, then buy a new one...
Gaming has changed enormously since. Quake2, half-life etc need the keyboard and mouse for a full-level of control (I prefer a trackball to the mouse), which cant be had with a gamepad. strategic games too cant be really played without all the keyboard buttons like Warcraft III. Games that were ported to consoles without a keyboard like duke nukem and counterstrike lost out for the lack of such precise controls there, and playstation 2 made good headway by introducing a keyboard and mouse.
Just as flightsims have died on the PC just because not many people have joysticks and flying an F16 is tough with the keyboard and not much fun, joysticks and gamepads are losing out in the market because most games require the precise control of a mouse and many keys. Gamepads are still really useful for older games through mame etc, for the games that were designed for joysticks, but not everyone plays those.
One thing to explore is kgens for windows which allows sega genesis games to be played across the Internet or a LAN, multiplayer.
"Give orange me give eat orange me eat orange give me eat orange give me you." -Nim Chimpsky
However they now have a newer one WITH a disk and with force feedback support at the same price. And it works with dance pads if you go and select the mode in the drivers.
Is the disk a CD or a floppy? CDs are compatible with newer "legacy free" PCs that lack a floppy drive. And does the disk contain only Windows drivers? If so, then users of StepMania for Mac OS are out of luck.
Most people have an PS 1 Dual shock laying around and the usb adapters are cheap. Beyond having to buy and hack a usb cable, Xbox controller are much more expensive then a Dual Shock 1 controller.
;)
Both controllers require an adapter/cable to hook up to a PC so I don't know why your saying its much easier to connect.
Lastly IMO the PS1 Dual Shock is just flat out a better controller and these things last for years and can take a real beating.
Like all things controller choice can be subjective, but considering price, availability, and feel, the Dual Shock is the one to get. Plus as an added bonus you won't be giving money to the Great Satan.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
I also like to use gamepads and my wife won't play games that don't use them.
We like to play multiplayer games. My "multi-tap" is a nice STANDARD inline usb hub. My gamepads are all usb, including a PS2 pad with a usb dongle.
Without resorting to emulators or Wine (which are perfectly good ways to run tons of games on Linux), I can think of at least the following native Linux games...
Alpha Centauri - Alien Crossfire
Civilization - Call to Power
Descent 3
Enemy Territory
Heavy Gear 2
Jagged Alliance 2
Kohan - Immortal Sovereigns
Quake 3
Railroad Tycoon 2 Gold Edition
Sim City 3000 Unlimited
Soldier Of Fortune
Tribes 2
Unreal Tournament 2003
Progress as per definition 1: Movement, as toward a goal; advance.
is there any reason someone has taken time to write new drivers for hardware that is 6 years old
True most would not call writing code for a device long dead progress. However, two things stand out here:
A] The fact that someone developed this shows that they had a goal in mind.
B] The original post suggests 4 player gauntlet. A damn fine goal...
So the question really is; Why ask why?
you can now pick up a four-way gamepad hub, with four gamepads, for under $15.
Pick one up where? I just spent a half an hour googling and couldn't find a one. I also checked shopping.yahoo.com, shopping.com, froogle.com, amazon.com, outpost.com and several others. Looks like this product was dead a long time ago.
it's tubgirl. you've been warned.
Or you could just run Gauntlet2 with MAME on an xbox with four controllers.
Been usin these here 'puters fer nigh on
22 years now and I hain't nevah haid me wonna
dem dere joythingamajimmies.
Never stopped me from beating the games on your list.
Wussies use a joythingamabobber.
Real gamers use a mouse and keypad!
Just get a USB to Playstation adaptors from ling sang or whoever your favotite supplyter is. works great.
The Gravis GRiP pads are good for emulating fighting games, because they have a good six-button layout and a nice rocker. It's a pain in the neck to find good six-button controllers for USB or even PS2. Any of the modern style curvy rockers are just no good for making fighting game motions. Sure, you can drop big cash on an arcade-style controller, but dragging one (or more) of those things out for casual play is a bear (and I know because I have a massive 2 player one). You can get USB adapters for Saturn gamepads (third party Saturn gamepads are still the best fighting game pads out there), but each adapter is at least $25 from online retailers. (On the plus side, you can get nice Saturn controllers dirt cheap.)
Oh, and seeing as how the supply of these kinds of pads is mostly via ebay and other low-supply retailers, this is probably no longer a low-cost solution now that it's been slashdotted.
I don't know how well the device works, but I seem to recall that, for some oddball reason, the device uses a "standard" Sega Saturn controller. This controller, btw, still seems to be one of the favorite controllers of the shmup crowd, as well as a lot of 2D fighting game fans.
Not only was the 3 screenfuls of webpage about this multiport thing a complete waste of time. The slashdot post about it was a complete waste.
I hope this response isn't a complete waste, I hope it sends a message that it's not worthwhile to focus your efforts on utter garbage.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Two years ago I sunk 20 bucks into a very small ( about 1/5 the size of this hulk mentioned in the article ) powered USB hub, and 4 cheapo USB gamepads.
I've been enjoying 4-player MAME for years now, where has the author of this "story" been? The whole point of USB was to do away with complicated, proprietary gadgets like this one that nobody will buy.
Man is the animal that laughs.
And occasionally whores for Karma.
I'm not affiliated with the person selling this:
G ra vis%20GrIP%20MultiPort
http://gametz.com/?x&A=Games&attr=PC&availitem=
Just trying to help out those who might be looking for one.
When I first announced the drivers (a little over a year ago), they were much easier to find online. I hope the slashdot article encourages some people to make them available to retro-gamers. For SNES emulators, these gamepads are pretty ideal.