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IBM, Intel Set Up $10m SCO Defense Fund
An anonymous reader writes that the "NY Times reports that a group of companies, led by I.B.M. and Intel, plans to announce today that it is setting up a $10 million legal defense fund to help pay for the litigation costs of corporate users of the popular GNU/Linux operating system if they are sued. ZDnet also has a story on this." otisaardvark points out that "The fund is to be administered by OSDL (Open Source Development Labs) and so, amongst other things, could bankroll legal costs for Linus."
Big, Rich friends :-))
:-)
Of course, IBM and Intel aren't doing this out of the kindness of their hearts, but it's still a nice gesture, 'cos it works for us (well, them, I'm not a kernel contributor
Simon
Physicists get Hadrons!
The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
Kudos to IBM/Intel for "doing the Right Thing (TM)". Also found it interesting how the ZDnet article words it "Anti-SCO". Harsh. I like it.
the timeing of this is interesting with today being the day that SCO has to show evidence in court of IBM's infringment on their copyright.
this sig intentionally left blank
This announcement should add a new dimension to SCO's nonsense about indemnification.
Megacorps are EVIL! EVIL I say! And they will bring DOOOM TO US ALL!!!
But... they are wasting $10 million on a legal defense fund to help Linus! YAY MEGACORPS!
In a weird way this is kind of adds 'validity' to SCO claims. I wish IBM would put a 1 million ransom for capture of McBride or something...
Since Lou Gerstner took control of IBM (although he is no longer at the helm), this has been a different company. Today they are doing everything possible to help Linux, but of course to that end they are also helping themselves. Still, it must be said that the IBM of today is one great company.
(I don't work for IBM or have any connections to them other than my Thinkpad T40 (NewEgg has them now for $1600 bucks!)
Someone should start selling a SCO/Microsoft-version of this.
; )
Can I bum a sig?
The SCO vs Linux legal battle took another turn today, as the SCO group plans action against Caldera, it's former self, for releasing their alleged IP. In a move that stunned the rest of the industry, SCO is effectively suing itself for initiating distribution of SCO IP as GPL code. SCO says they are assured of winning the case as they have all of the evidence and can present it in court.
SCO claimed that, to defend itself against such charges, it will be making gratuitous use of the OSDL defense fund.
nude mac desktops
IBM & Intel won't just throw all this money away would they. I think what this means is:
We're pretty damn sure that Linux is clean. You can be sure too, because if you get sued we'll pay the legal costs for the time being, but since we know that you (we, Linux) will win in the end, SCO will have to pay and so it won't cost us a dime.
And so our Linux bussiness can roll on. It's more than PR. It's saying we'll win.
They are making preparations to buffer their new role as being total service providers, providing OS helpdesk and contracting support to corporaions.
OS was supposed to be use at your own risk... but it seems they are now going to make promises above and beyond a general GNU contract.
The Custom Mary
Those $10 could be spent on more useful stuff, like doing a full audit of the source code to see what REALLY is in linux. The Linux source bz2s are over 35Mb in size now, who knows what is inside them? There is bound to be some old code laying around that may of been leaked in by an ex caldera/sco employee.
Nero-burning ROM for Linux!
This story seems to be about contributions made to the defense fund already discussed here in November.
- Brian
OSDL hopes to raise $10 million, Cohen said. So far it's raised $3 million from a group of companies that includes IBM, MontaVista Software and Intel.
What this may do is set the stage for killing SCO by bleeding them by laywers...
The idea is simple: Ring fence SCO from accessing customer license fees. Meanwhile, bleed them to death by keeping them entangled in the SCO/IBM, RedHat/SCO suits.
If SCO cannot extract a single license fee because it ends up in another court case, their business model is effectively dead, thus (hopefully!) devaluing their stock!
Does anyone know what happen with the 30 days given to SCO to produce evidence that ended... last week ? What's going on here ?
United States of America, good ol' backers of world peace.
On a related note, according to scocountdown.com, SCO should hand over whatever evidence they claim to have to the court....TODAY!
"Backups are for wimps. Real men upload their data to an FTP site and have everyone else mirror it." -- Linus Torvalds
I know I cannot give as much as Intel or IBM, but I was wondering if there is anyway I can contribute $$ to the fund?? Admitedly my 10$ may not pay for 1/10th of an hour to pay a lawyer, but I would like to feel that I helped destroy SCO in some way. And this isn't a troll, I'd give anything to be part of the reason SCO had to shut it's lying trap!
Ofcourse, it is yet another news article with SCO's name in it, but it also seems like IBM and Intel think they need a crapload of money to defend people, which in turn suggests that there is something to SCO's claims.
SCO really wants to go to court, but ofcourse they know they don't stand a chance. This amount of money on both sides could make for a spectacular trial.
At the same time, some people, who hadn't figured it out yet, might realise that there is no way on earth SCO is actually going to win.
Besided that, i wonder if IBM and Intel did return-on-investment calculations on this. Maybe they figure the kudos will be worth more than 10M.
The question of users being sued for running Linux has got me thinking. Now that RedHat no longer offers a free desktop version of their product, would it be possible that a Linux-running site could be sued by RedHat for illegally running a 'pirated' copy of Red Hat Advanced Server? Would this be any different to Microsoft calling in the BSA to investigate a site running unlicensed copies of Windows? What if the RedHat site was running a hybrid type of installation, with portions of the distro taken from the unlicensed 'illegally obtained' version of RHAS, but others, such as package management (apt-get, for example), taken from the free GNU/Debian distro? Are there any lawyers out there that would care to comment. Thanks.
It's encouraging to see that some of those who benefit from Linux are prepared to defend it against predators. But it may mean that they think there is a significant probability that SCOX will not implode before they can file any new lawsuits (as opposed just to threatening to file new lawsuits).
Just another wannabe fantasy novelist...
There is a good chance that there maybe a code. Just because the slashdot crowd is anti-sco dosen't mean I'm wrong. ouThe Kernel is huge, and does need a proper audit. If it was properly audited and the Kernel was found to be clean, SCO would go out of business, which is what you all want? Right?
Please moderators don't take your anger out on me, because there is 0.1% chance that SCO could be right.
Nero-burning ROM for Linux!
They are doomed... again. nuff said.
There's a growing sense that even if The Future comes,
most of us won't be able to afford it.
-- Lemmy
IBM & Intel won't just throw all this money away would they.
For these companies, this is not a lot of money. What they really are putting on the line (and have been for a while) is their prestige and reputation.
By the time the situation is resolved, I doubt that anyone will be able to get any damages from SCO. It will have been completely gutted by then.
John Sauter (J_Sauter@Empire.Net)
help pay for the litigation costs of corporate users of the popular GNU/Linux operating system if they are sued.
That leaves grandmas, 12 year old girls, and nerds in parent's basements out in the cold.
I guess we now know who SCO is going to target next.
Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
It will be interesting to see how much of the code for X86 that sco is claiming as stolen actually came from intel. Either intel reference code for talking to the bios or for talking directly to the chipset peripheral controllers tends to show up everywhere. Plus there is intels own work on SMP operating systems. Hypercubes were an intel specialty.
Now if adaptec joins in sco could be in for a ripping the like of which has never been seen
$10 million? Thats enough money to fund OSDL for three or four years! More proof, as if needed, that this case is principally about lining the pockets of the legal community.
Donate to groklaw - www.groklaw.net
PJ is doing some AWESOME unpaid work uncovering and collating all the information about the case and the history of unix, sco, novell, the copyrights etc. Many journalists are looking and linking to groklaw already. If there's one person working against SCO who needs support from the community, it's PJ.
In other news:
Microsoft has set up a defense fund to cover
the legal costs for SCO. The initial fund
balance is $100,000,000
"... a group of companies, led by I.B.M. and Intel, plans to announce today that it is setting up a $10 million legal defense fund..."
I am just looking forward to the day where this SCO's legal challenge gets thrown out of court...I am interested what would happen to all these companies that setup these defense funds worth millions of dollars. I sure hope thy donate this back into the OS community in some form (eg donations, code contributions, OS marketing) etc etc.
--rhad
Slashdot needs to interview Natalie Portman.
So the only thing that is "validated" here is, that SCO might (threaten to) sue you if you use Linux. We know that already, nothing new there. It's in IBMs (and other Linux-Distributors) best interest to put up a good defense in the first SCO vs. Linux-end-user case since the outcome of such a case will have high publicity value.
"By the way if anyone here is in advertising or marketing... kill yourself." -- Bill Hicks
Sure, it's nice to have corporate support, but is anyone else a little worried about big businesses real interests in Linux? We live in a capitalist society : the interest is money and profit. Just makes you wonder what kind of support linux is going to need from these boys in the future, and how dependent they are going to be.
And I for one welcome our new lawyer overlords.
Say, remember when the Romano-British employed one lot of maurading Saxons to protect them from another lot of maurading Saxons? How did that turn out? As I remember, the Saxons won by default... and then decided to pay one lot of maurading Vikings to protect them from another lot of maurading Vikings...
Tort. Reform. Now.
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
Partner link for the NYT article.
This is bad news, not good news. Before this announcement, SCO legal hound dogs were chasing only the big game; small firms and users were safe (what is the point in sending a 1000$/hr lawyer against a 50$/hr one-man ISP?). Now this fund changes everything: expect to see many more of those faxes rolling.
By reading all the posts we are talking somewhere between 3 and 10 million dollars. Thats really NOT a crap load of money in todays laywer-controlled system. NOW if they stary throwing numbers like 20 - 30 million$ around, it's time to be concerned about SCO.
3-10 mill is just a pittiance to make thier PR people happy.
So Long and Thanks for all the Fish.
Well, so much for that.
This begs a couple thoughts/questions though.
First, $10M US is not that big a pinch really. IBM could throw that kind of cash around without even a blink (kinda like MS throwing $6M to SCO for a "License",) so $10M really shouldn't be too hard to come up with.
In fact, I would like to see a list of people who are contributing to this, and would like to see some big names on that list (hello Red Hat!)
Also, this would be an EXCELLENT time for Novell to step up and put their money where their acquisition is, and back their SuSE purchase by getting in on this as well.
And someone earlier made an excellent comment: where can someone in the general OSS community donate to such a fund? I mean, its one thing for "We the People" to piss and moan about SCO, and then rely on major corps to handle the legal stuff for us (Which is fine for now, but with the way SCO has acted over the last few months, who knows WHO they are gonna sue next), but it would be a much better show of solidarity if we also contributed to this fund, or sone like it, above and beyond the usual contributions to groups like EFF and such.
"Our funds have never taken part in toxic or death spiral convertible financings of any sort" -BayStar's managing partne
Of course, it's better not to do it this way, because you probably will get confused with all the licenses, and you can't give your linux(plus GNU plus other stuff) to someone else. It is the other stuff that is making problems.
I'm still trying to figure out what people mean by 'social skills' here.
Would it be safe to say that SCO vs. IBM (and now Intel) is almost like "death by cop" or, more appropriately: "death by train"... SCO just wants to step in the way?
Since SCO approached Google about (SCO)Linux licencing fees, google no longer produces results on searches on "SCO". It has been addressed that any search result in concern with SCO will require Google to pay $695x10000servers=$6,950,000 per result. Therefore Google reprogrammed their search engines to ignore searches on "SCO".
Is the humour lost on everyone?
haha, "all this money"? $10 million is a drop in the bucket compared to what IBM could make once it clears this legal bull up and goes on selling Linux workstations/servers. They're not looking out for anyone but themselves.
Sorry, my karma just ran over your dogma.
Of course there must be SCO IP in Linux, because the bz2 tarball is over 35 MB. Golly, there probably is *shitloads* of SCO IP in Windows XP - it's supposed to be over 60 million lines of code. I'm sure the bz2 tarball of the XP kernel is over 35 MB too !
The Internet's nature is peer to peer - 20050301_cs_profs.pdf
for 1 of the lawyers for 1 day. Yay!!
Is the juice worth the sqeeze?
MS is floundering, and Intel's fate is too tied to them now. Perhaps they want to free Linux of the SCO cloud so that they can continue to rocket into the mainstream. = more diverse markets for Intel and a shot at re-charging the flatlined processor market? Also maybe a way to cozy up to the OpenSource community to perhaps steal some light from AMD? Like you said - they aren't doing this for free.
Is the juice worth the sqeeze?
>> $10 million legal defense fund
Translation: $10 million Google defense fund
It's a shame this money has to be spent in this way and that it couldn't be used to pay for programmers and bandwidth. Hopefully it won't have to be used.
Hopefully, the nightmare possible scenario I outlined as the possible SCO strategy can't and won't happen now this has been done. See the link to my JE below for an explanation.
Oolite: Elite-like game. For Mac, Linux and Windows
...said it best when he wrote this entry in "The Devil's Dictionary":
CORPORATION, n.
An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility.
In short; whatever the acronym, they're all in it for the green and the Holy Ego.
"The only clear view is from atop the mountain of our dead selves." - Peter Carroll
Just googled SCO and the top of the list is sco.com.
I guess it would be funny if it was actually true.
Stay tuned for new sig...
For now, this is the right thing to do. However, Americans never seem to remember that money to pay lawyers must come from somewhere. Why do Americans pay astronomical sums for health care? Easy, to pay the legal costs and damages from all the loony malpractice actions. Well, at the end of the day, corporations supporting open source software solutions will also need to pay for the weaknesses of the US legal system -- and the only place they can get that money is from their customers.
As far as I understand, Red Hat Advanced Server is protected by tradmark law, not copyright law. This means that if someone redistributes RHAS without removing Red Hat trademarks, they may be sued for tradmark violation. I don't believe an end user will be in any risk, trademark law is supposed to protect trade, not use.
A typical legal strategy for a battle like this is for the side in SCO's position to tackle a bunch of little guys first to build up precedents without actually having to prove their case against an oponent equipped with a like legal force. IBM and Intel are simply serving notice to SCO that that isn't going to fly here. They will put on their defense wherever SCO goes instead of waiting for SCO to come to them.
If they're going after 800lb gorillas...
Exactly how much money does SCO have though? 10 million isn't a huge sum to companies like IMB and intel, but surely SCO cant have that much money behind them? They must have to pay out as much in legal costs as Intel/IBM
*International* Business Machines.
Enough said for the Indiaphobes around here.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
This comment does not deserve a +3 Interesting
Lou might have turned IBM around, but so did all the layoffs of the early 90s. In fact, today IBM has been returning to their old, internal ways.. and in part this is why Lou V. may have left. The new guy is bad news and enforces the department/empiring building ways and spending games with Blue Money and ignoring external customers and market pressures.
I love IBM for what they are doing.. and I love much of their hardware and software... But don't forget too quickly that IBM's name was as muddy as Microsofts about 6 years ago.. they were known to be real bastards when they want to be...
"Consider how lucky you are that life has been good to you so far. Alternatively, if life hasn't been good to you so far
m = 10^-3; $10m = $0.01
track7.org has all kinds of interesting stuff!
The article continues:
Davey "Idaho" Boise, in response to the measure establised by Intel and IBM, was quoted as saying, in a very solemn tone, "Oh fuck..." without further comment.
You are, of course, totally wrong.
IBM is looking out for itself, yes, but it's also looking out for the source of one of its business arms that it apparently feels has a potentially strong future - Linux.
If you have some skill I need, it behooves me to look out for you even if I don't care about you. Of course, we're hoping that IBM is in this to nurture and grow Linux rather than just exploit it. But, either way, they're still looking out for Linux AS WELL AS themselves.
Alito: A vote for Alito is a punch in the eye to put that bitch back in her place!
IBM comes off looking like a hero, combined with the Linux commercials all over TV this weekend and it's a huge PR win. I'm not easily impressed but this was brilliantly conceived, timing and execution nearly flawless.
With everything else they've done so well one would have to believe that somewhere inside the folds of the cape there is a sword ready to strike the killing blow.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
Google is in the throws of an IPO - I suspect that in part this is to calm them and make sure they wont cave to SCO because they are in this very sensitive position (and unable to publically comment because the IPO is ticking) - on the other hand Google can point to this indemnification on their prospectus right next to the listing of risks that must include SCO
Paula Jones- GROKLAW and not 'he'
It's already happening!
z =m &q=l&c=
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=SCOX&t=5d&l=on&
SCOX is on a steady downhill slide. Bye Bye Darl!
We all know big blue will support Linux.
The big news here is INTEL.
Since SCO runs on Intel CPUs, we can reason that Intel are saying this to SCO:
"Up yours, Darl. Linux is going to crap all over you and your sh*tty OS. We are backing the winner. We are backing Linux".
Next, consider these observations:
Microsoft OS' also use Intel CPUs
Microsoft are "involved some way" with SCO
This being the case, can we infer that Intel are saying this to Microsoft:
"Up yours, Bill. Linux is going to crap all over you and your sh*tty OS. We are backing the winner. We are backing Linux".
I wish at was Friday, but I dont want to wish my life away. So I wish it was last Friday.
I thought Intel was part of the infamous Wintel Consortium?!
And I thought their evil new replacement for the BIOS (EFI, I think?) was a transparent ploy to destroy Linux?!?!!!
Really, you people have the memory of a mayfly. Next time some "Intel/Microsoft try to destroy Linux and other Free OS's" article comes up, try to focus all 50 of your brain cells and remember this.
I doubt the money will be needed as SCO can't possible afford to open another front at this point.
I hope there is some provisions that the money will be kept in trust and used as a deterent for any company that feel inclined to go after Linux/ FOOS on patent claims.
Help fight continental drift.
http://moneycentral.msn.com/scripts/webquote.dll?i Page=lqd&Symbol=scox
As of this writing:
Last 15.95
Change(%) -1.15 (-6.73%)
High 17.18
Low 15.77
Volume 216,036
It doesn't even bear predicting (because it's a sure thing) that Darl will vomit forth more bombastic FUD today or tomorrow in response to this.
SCOX stock is the only currency they have. They pay their lawyers in it. If it collapses, they are done.
But, their bubble can't have much longer to run though... For all the threats, intimidation, spin, etc, SCaldera has YET to take any action on their copyright claims...
Sooner or later, the Emperor will be exposed for the streaker he is.
Corporatism != Free Market
Why do people ignore IBM's past? They're so easy to forgive IBM , and yet so quick to jump down Microsoft's throat for any little thing.
Imagine if Microsoft was doing team-ups like this. Slashdotters would be all over them for the "unfairness" of it all.
"Sufferin' succotash."
For what it's worth, if SCO sues and loses, their stock price immediately hits the shitter, and there will be nothing to recover for IBM/Intel. So whatever money they use for defense is lost...if there is any.
That said, it's money well spent because they could easily lose that much money in sales from timid IT managers/legal departments. So it's worth their $10M purely as an advertisement.
That said, I don't believe SCO will ever end up in court against IBM anyway, because they get more money from keeping their stock price up as long as possible. I see Canopy looting SCO right before an actual court date (probably one with Red Hat they can't avoid) in case they lose. If they accidentally win, well, that's a nice unexpected bonus for them.
And so our Linux bussiness can roll on. It's more than PR. It's saying we'll win.
It's certainly putting their money where their mouth is. But I think all they did is call SCO's bluff. The only other thing they accomplished is blocking the possibility that SCO could have gone after small companies, hoping to establish a precedent before they go after the big (blue) fish. By IBM telling SCO they won't get an easy victory against a chump defendant, I think they keep SCO out of court as a plaintiff altogether.
All in all, good move.
-Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat
Or the Scodown as I like to think of it.
Everything I've read today says that *OSDN* has set up the fund, and that their *goal* is $10M, but they currently have $3M which includes an *unspecified* amount by each of Intel and IBM. How does that translate into "Intel and IBM set up $10M fund?"
Or did I read the wrong sites?
Between "not a large amount of money" and "not a significant amount of money."
A corporation may be worth hundreds of billions, but budgets for departments/projects may still be tight. I'd gauge the significance of the amount by the profit margin of the company...
tasks(723) drafts(105) languages(484) examples(29106)
Here is something clever that I saw last week on Groklaw.
SCO has this backwards....
First they fight you.
Then they laugh at you.
Then they ignore you.
Then you lose.
This is a smart move, in helping others to resist SCO's shakedown they undermine SCO's ability to fund additional litigation and limit the impact of their legal intimidation. Companies who otherwise might have given SCO some money and furthered SCO's PR campaign are now likely to refuse and they'll be backed by the slush fund put in place to defeat SCO.
"The SEC believes IBM may have aided and abetted Dollar General when it misstated financial results in the fourth fiscal quarter of 2000."
Like FreeBSD.
Causing Chaos Everywhere,
Nik J.
The strange world of a loner, in a populous city, drowning in society
Why can't the US repair it's legal system so as to do what happened in for exemple Germany and Poland where the courts told SCO to "Put up or Shut up", i.e. shut up untill you SHOW the problem.
Regretfully the present situation reflects baldly not only on the flawed US legal system but on a once great nation (and people!) as a whole.
"The likes of Facebook and WhatsApp are free to those whose privacy is of zero value."
So then IBM and Intel can help out Google via ODSL! Not that Google needs any help...
Previous data, 11:44 10 January 2004: SCO Approaches Google About Linux Licenses.
And let's see, SCOX stock is down 5 points at noon.
I guess this fund has investors now scared that SCO will never collect on any licensing fees.
Causing Chaos Everywhere,
Nik J.
The strange world of a loner, in a populous city, drowning in society
All Hail Discordia. Hail Eris. Fnord.
Bad timing, Darl. You see, IBM and Intel did exactly that a few hours before your release.
In short, even their internal communications are breaking down. They're sliding quickly toward a defensive position, and at their legal department's burn rate, this shouldn't last much longer.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
$10m is less than IBM's monthly electric bill.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
Is this correct:
(emphasis mine)
I thought we knew that they purchased some licensing rights from Novell, but that basically Novell still owns licensing rights (and the IP).
If so, it appears that the NYT hasn't exactly stated the situation correctly. Correct me if I'm wrong.
There is no need to use a SlashDot sig for SEO...
Hmmm, interesting. I suspect you're right, that corporations have different legal positions in the USA vs. the UK, but I don't know. To be honest, I tend to think of a corporation as being the sum of its employees (or at least its board members!) Thanks for the info.
This is where the serious fun begins.
IBM and Intel lawyers win $10 Million.
"There is no defense fund for Linux users. Linux users will fall into a quagmire and will kill themselves at the gates to our corporate headquarters. We shall be victorious."
Oh wait - that's that other guy who was spreading misinformation in the press last year...
Slashdot still doesnâ(TM)t support Unicode after it was added to the HTML standard in 1997.
That Intel has contributed to the fund is HUGE NEWS. I've wondered where Intel's play would be because they seem to be tighter than ever with Microsoft. THat Intel sees Linux as an important enough part of it's market to protect does not bode well for SCO who so far has made most of it's money by selling Oses that run on Intel processors.
Intel sees the value of having more than one way to use their microprocessors. This is a very good vote of confidence!
-- $G