Slashdot Mirror
MIDI Keyboard/Computer: Neko64
An anonymous reader gushes "Just got back from NAMM, and saw the coolest thing for music geeks - it's a MIDI keyboard with a dual Opterons and a 15 inch touchscreen. While other vendors crow about 5 inch screens (Now With Color!) these guys have a beautiful UI on a live performance instrument that is also awesome studio gear. 4 interchangable control surfaces, and battery backup to boot! If the power cord gets yanked out in the middle of a performance, there's plenty of time to bitch out the roadie and get it plugged in without missing a beat. These guys truly Get It."
Yeah, but can I play Doom on it?
DROS - Open-Source Robot Software
...is the price.
How much is this thing likely to cost? And since it's essentially a server and a midi-instrument all rolled into one, will anyone outside of major studios and universities be able to afford it?
libertarianswag.com
These guys truly Get It.
and the reason nobody else got it or will get it is the price.
I am getting a casio keyboard on monday, but this keyboard looks really nice, wouldn't mind giving it a shot. What is the price?
That's how we pirated music a decade ago
looks like the thing that that Harold has on the red green show, if anyone here has ever seen it.. you know "if the women dont find you handsome they can at least find you handy"..
If i remember correctly, this thing has been demoed at at least the last NAMM, and possibly the one before.
From what I heard, it was pretty much an empty shell last year and was utter vapourware....
Did you see it on?
Did it boot?
Could you do anything with it?
i don't read slashdot anymore.
The only problem with this kind of high-end equipment is that traditional capitalistic methods cannot bring prices down through competition.
The only North American dealer is http://www.coastrecording.com/. In Europe, your only choice is probably http://www.electricsound.com/.
That being said however, I've read some great reviews of this keyboard, and it stacks up well against the Triton and Yamaha (potential competitors) in terms of features, quality, and price.
Here's my goal for next year:
1) Buy this thing
2) Become a rockstar
3) Get tons of ass
4) ???
5) Profit!
Background: 28/M/Bi-Sexual; Owner of a Linux company; MBA Harvard 2003; B.S. Comp Sci MIT 2000
The first time I ever played with Reaktor I thought to myself "damn when is somebody just going to put a PC in a synth with a lightweight real-time customizable OS (open source if possible), a big screen, lots of programmable control surfaces, and a something flexible and powerful like Reaktor?"
.. except for the OS. Still this is pretty damn cool!
..later..
And here it is
PS: Anybody else get a chuckle out of this:
NEKO 64? frees you from all of the frustrating limitations imposed by closed, proprietary systems, while still maintaining the virtues of an all-in-one keyboard instrument.
NEKO 64? is so versatile it can virtually run any plugin or application designed for the Windows XP operating system including products from Steinberg, Native Instruments, Synapse Audio, IK Multimedia and many others!
I guess their definition of "proprietary" is different than mine!
It's probably not so important for the average musician but I hope all the interfaces are MIDI or otherwise accessible by the programmer.
Thats the biggest microsoft smart phone ive ever seen!
Someone will need to mirror this soon.
I know there is this rift right now in the community. Some people hate laptops on stage, some people love it. I'm a big pusher of the "Powerbook"/build your own interface. I don't see particular use in incoporating my computer keyboard into my piano keyboard. I personally prefer just to put my laptop on the top. Mind you I also prefer to have 88 keys.
This is probably a very cool toy, but I don't think its a "must have" for anyone.
Some linux developers have developed a similar keyboard that is based on opensource software. I haven't compared specs in detail but I'm guessing the hardware is similar based on voice count.
http://www.lionstracs.com/
I'm totally linux-centric (unlike most slashdotters) so I wanted to make reference to those musicians who'd like to support *true* opensource development.
-ry
*anyway* what I wanted to say
is how could it be 64-bit computing, if they run 'Microsoft Windows XP Professional' ?
Am I missing something? do they run something specially licensed from M$? *something in those lines?, like 'they're running a beta of their upcomming 64-bit XP..'?*
I don't claim I know more than I know, and if you know you know more than I know, then by all means, let me know.
I make music for hobby, and am married to a musician - plus, I know lots of other people that make music for a living or for fun. I know that these people are put off by the slightest alien noise, when they "work".
And this device consumes a lot of power. Have a look at the specs: "Whisper Quiet Cooling Fans (Internal Chassis, Processor & Power Supply)"
Well, they may be whisper-quiet, but they'll annoy all the musicians I know. Some of them have chosen iMacs for the only reason that they were quieter than anything x86. I may not be that picky with regards to PSU fan noise, but all others certainly are.
Of course, I expect that such an expensive and complex piece of gear must have had some serious marketing and product management work done before they nailed the product specs, right? Therefore, these particular PSU fans are actually unhearable. I hope. Hmmm......
Sigged!
I'm intrigued to know what is open about this product, apart from the name. Am I missing something? Perhaps 'open' is just a term which is open (sorry!) to wide interpretation?
Maybe if by "music geek" you mean "guy who knows more about computers than music". Any *actual* music geek would prefer a good, straight up keyboard: 88 keys, hammer action, weighted (at least partially, preferably fully), and minimal other crap. Maybe a pitch bend wheel or a few programmable hotkeys, but not a gigantor LCD screen and a full qwerty keyboard: that's just going to get in the god damn way.
Is listed as a feature. It will give the musician the ability to blame a virus for a missed beat.
Did you update your keyboards anti-virus?
Does it require MS activation?
I do want a keyboard with DRM, just in case I need to pay some royalties for playing "Happy Birthday to You"
Get a free ipod.
What were you doing over there all this time?
Those who sacrifice security to condemn liberty deserve to repeat history or something. - Benjamin Santayana
Umm no XP.
Can a 32 bit OS use 16GB of memory?
Sorry, teleporters just kill you and then make a copy. A perfect, soul-less copy.
- "An anonymous reader gushes" ... this is news? I could like, hobble something like this together with a laptop and an old keyboard, ... could I be on Slashdot then? Please?
... please, break your hands now and spare my ears.
- "These guys truly Get It"
- Runs on Windows XP
- (No sound samples on the web site)
- (May just be a "shovel us money" prototype)
Um like
and last but not least...
It's all about the music for godsakes. If you need this piece of gear to sound good and can't do it on a freakin' roland juno-106 from the 1980s... or a piano
(Not flamebait, and/or troll... just a musician that is sick of crap like this. It is the opposite of inspiring.)
The specs say it can take 8gb but the product info says it can take 16gb of ram.
I understand how everyone loves to hate on XP, and I really hate it for daily computing, I use a mac/linux, but I have to defend XP for a musical platform.
I use an XP machine with Native Instruments Traktor (DJ software) as a professional club DJ 2-4 times a week.
This machine has nothing on it but Traktor and It has never crashes, starts up quick and just runs with out a hitch.
I could see how, if this thing actually works it could be pretty cool, as I have seen a lot of acts with a laptop and a midi keyboard.
sorry to defend microsoft,
The big deal is that you don't have to have a bunch of cables running across the stage to a computer to get real time audio effects processing done on your software instruments. You also don't have to have a separate computer. All the interface nicely collected at your fingertips.
And yes, a dual opteron will get a significant load once you start to pile up your effects.
And regarding the price: A computer is much cheaper than a large rack of effect modules.
Geek rants since like... 2000 or something.
It's much better to get a laptop and an MIDI controller. The point of integrating the two is silly, IMO. I could destroy that thing with my setup no problem, and it's MUCH cheaper. I can put whatever program on, and yes, it can run Linux! The only thing it wins in is portability, and even that is questionable. I'd rather carry around my laptop and a nice small light controller than that.
This is good as like any other powerful keyboard. It's good for lame session players doing lame comping, IMO; and who can't be assed to learn about all the various softsynths that are available and to get them to work.
As someone mentioned before about studios and universities. I would serverly frown on any music institution that took this over a good computer and a controller.
last time i checked - winxp is not a real-time os. so keyboard with spaceship control panel and pc inside can't be with "...near-zero latency even under high processor loads". and while processor is highly loaded, latency is "low" but midi in/out starts to drop notes...
...MS(tm) DRM(tm) Clippy(tm): It looks like you're trying to play happy birthday, a tune that is still (?!?!?) under copyright. Shall I:
;o)
a) Shut down the keyboard you filthy copyright stealing musician/terrorist (delete as appropriate, with extreme prejudice).
or b) send $350 from your online bank account to ASCAP.
Reminds me of that simpsons christmas special where the family are carol singing outside the lawyers house, who promptly comes out and tells to "cease and decist" as the songs they are singing are owned by his clients.
I am NaN
This is a dual Opteron, with 350 watt power supply. They claim "quiet cooling fans," but as a practical matter, dual Opteron in a small, enclosed space will not be that quiet. For a piece of audio equipment, wouldn't it make more sense to cut back a bit on the processing power, and go for completely silent? Or alternatively, one could physically seperate the noise from the source. I don't think this would matter much on-stage with mega amplifiers, but in a recording studio, or for quieter music in a smaller environment (for use at home, etc.), do you really want the humming of a fan? Personally, I'd take a 1GHz C3 chip, running fanless, on a MicroITX motherboard probably, one of the quieter hard drives, in an acoustice enclosure. If I really need the high-end speed, I'd blow the money on making the case into a large heat sink, and use heat pipes.
From Bach, Mozart and Sor.
KFG
does it make good homebrewn coffee, like Tweek's dad does ?
...They're actually going on tour.
I could buy a good musical keyboard, and a good PC. Actually I could do so for less than this. Other than the "wow" factor is there any real advantage to this (other than perhaps musicians who really find it inconvenient to lug both keyboard and computer around).
Anyone here know why the high cost? Any particularly extra-special redeeming features that would make you buy it?
how could it be 64-bit computing
Depends how you define bitness. PC data buses have been 64-bit ever since DIMMs first became popular as a RAM form factor. I'm guessing that some of the signal processing is done in IEEE double-precision floating-point, which is 64-bit. And no, pointer size isn't everything; even "16-bit" MS-DOS apps used pointers with 20 significant bits.
As a someone who has worked as a roadie, I'm curious how much this thing weighs. I couldn't find it listed on their webpage.
Luckly I don't think many musicans would take such a contraption to a live gig. Too complex -- too much could go wrong.
Yes, but until the release of kernel linux-2.192.367-test54283.tar.bz2, only the 'F', 'A' and 'G' keys work.
To enable the other keys, you have to compile and install a kernel module Neko64, but this will also break the framebuffer support.
Don't have any Gershwin. I've got Luiz Bonfa though, Vince Guarldi, Henry Mancini, Herbie Hancock, Cole Porter, Alan Arkin (yes, that Alan Arkin), Dave Brubeck, Benny Goodman and even some barrelhouse and stride piano stuff that's still under copyright.
And technically, yes these are all pirate recordings. The only ones on my box.
Parent poster made a funny, but it was a funny with a cutting edge to it.
KFG
The main issue with a synth is sample size.
A high quality sample of just a grand piano can be 128 megs right there. That is a single note.
Having a 64-bit processor means you can have several gigs of samples and not have to swap them to disk. They can all be in memory.
I don't read or respond to AC posts
PAE in Windows provides a set of APIs called AWE so PAE aware applications can use more than 4GB at a time. And of course the OS can put multiple applications in their own address space so standard 32-bit apps can all be fully memory resident even if they allocate an entire address space to themselves.
PAE generally isn't available in the retail Win2000/XP Professional. But - it's a simple request for an OEM (like the keyboard manufacturer) to enable the kernel and memory management features found in the server products for the OS they ship.
Basically they've packaged a software synth into a cheap keyboard. I'd rather spend the cash on a decent dedicated, properly weight keyboard and connect it via midi to whatever. Software synths have been around for ages, this is nothing but bells and whistles.
"Semi-weighted?" What the hell is that? A euphamism for "cheap piece of crap?"
Whatever. No professional will be impressed. Oooh, a $1500 computer with a $500 keyboard for $6,500. Wow. I'm thrilled.
Let's see, a fully weighted proper 88 key Korg SP-500 is about $1,500. That leaves me $5,000 for rack mounted synth modules and computers. Considering rackmount Triton modules go for about $1,400, you could have three of 'em plus a decent keyboard AND a proper computer with scoring software for the same price.
Screw these guys. This is crap.
What about the noise of the dual opterons ? You're gonna need a heavy amp if you still want to hear your music ;)
If you are to build a musical instrument keep those in mind:
1- If I turn it on I need to be able play with it without configuration or setup or opening apps, nothing, turn on->play
2- I do not care what processor is used, I expect to read audio and musical specs not computer ones when I buy a musical instrument, I need to know about polyphony, tracks count, effects count, sync, bits count and sample rate, number of ports, etc. And to be honest 128voices is rather ridiculous for a dual Opteron setup, I really do believe it is able to produce a lot more or else this is the pure confirmation that it doesn't even compete with the G5.
3- I care about the design (not the look but the way every controls are layed out), I need to be able to reach the controls in a logical, musical manner, having the rotary bank away from the fader bank isn't natural to anyone used to audio gear for example.
4- If I am a musician with limited ressources (mostly every musician) I'll be better off with a PowerBook and various controllers in a road case than with this (or a SmallFF-PC for the PC inclined).
5- If I'm a wealthy musician I'm better off with a PowerBook and various controllers in a road case...
5- If I somewhat am a geeky rock star (no rock star yet playing any keyboard workstation but one can hope...) I can always use an XserveG5 with various controllers in a road case...
Bottom line is, great idea, poor design...
They are targetting musicians, with x86 hardware.
. html
Good luck.
Let's ignore the consumer level crap, Bose computer speakers, Sonic Foundry, Creative's Audigy 2 for a moment.
If you get into real audio production, professional quality: Mackie/JPL monitors, MOTU Digital Performer or Logic, and MOTU/M-Audio sound interfaces... it's best to have a Macintosh becuase your options are very limited without one.
Problem with that keyboard is that all the bells and whistles are going to raise the price through the roof. Professional musicians or sound engineers might want to take advantage of it's computer interface, and wish to run their favorite software; which likely only runs in MacOS X/Classic.
It's price tag is ~7k. http://news.harmony-central.com/Newp/2003/Neko-64
Making it nothing more than a super-expensive conglomerate of consumer level crap. Who's likely to buy it? A keyboardist would rather spend that money on a real keyboard that has all the keys, this one only has 60 keys. With that money, a real savvy person might buy a new G5, some MOTU equipment and have enough for a nice Yamaha keyboard and be assured he's got the beef for studio quality mixes.
I predict this machine, will become yet another obscure piece of equipment/technology for a slashdotter to refer to years from now. The only picture of one, then, being on Geocities.
Yes, but my point still stands -
You have to lean over it to use it, pretty much guaranteeing you back- or neck-ache!
If it's a PC in a nice grey box you want, get a Carillon (for a lot less than $8,000 I might add).
There are TONS of huge, complecated, expensive, synthesizers out there and they do get bought and sold. This one is the same, but features teh ability of have software synthesizers and the like loaded on it. Those have become rather popular, and in fact some companies sell nothing but soft synths.
There is plenty of market for this sort of thing.