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Nintendo's Mystery DS Portable Revealed
Thanks to GameSpy for its story revealing the first information on the dual-screened, portable Nintendo DS, the previously rumored 'mystery console' that's been lacking any concrete details up to now. According to the piece, the DS "features two separate 3" TFT LCD display panels, separate processors, and semiconductor memory of up to 1 Gigabit. It's scheduled to launch worldwide before the end of 2004." The article further explains: "Players can look forward to being able to simultaneously manage their game progress from two different perspectives, enhancing both the speed and strategy of the challenge. For example, players will no longer be forced to interrupt game play to shift perspective, such as moving from a wide shot to a close up, or alternating between a character's ongoing battle and a map of their environment." A concurrently released official Nintendo press release confirms this information.
Why not just a wider screen that the game can split into two??
if(!cool) exit(-1);
Can you say Game and Watch? Hopefully the graphics will be a little better.
On the one hand, that's my first response: What the Hell is Nintendo thinking? A portable system with two screens? I mean - what?
But on the other hand, I can look at this and say "Well, but - maybe." The idea itself is nothing new compared to playing, say, Descent, Quake, or Baldur's Gate with 2 monitors the way I've always wanted to play them - a menu or map on one side, and the "gameplay" on the other.
The screens sound about the size of a Gameboy Advance screen. Remember, Nintendo - back light, please Lord backlight. It will require a different kind of thinking for developers.
Nintendo isn't crash proof (Virtual Boy, anyone?) but this product is certainly interesting, and has some potential for RPG's, strategy games, maybe FPS kind of games. If nothing else, it certainly can give the PSP some interesting introductory challenges to face.
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
as I do not see that going down my pocket, two screens and all.
but again pretty neat, but it feels like an other VR-google for the GameBoy.
This may lead to the idea of Picture in Picture for high end game consoles. Wouldn't it be nice to have a bigger, more detailed map on those games like zelda, or have a list of objectives?
:)
Maybe this will lead to lower prices on other handheld systems which would be nice, even if this system becomes a dud
Jeff
As much as I applaud Nintendo for being innovative and taking a risk, I can't help but feel that this move will alienate 3rd party developers. On the other hand, Nintendo's first party games are usually very good and without a credible competitor for the moment in the handheld department Nintendo could pull this off. Regardless it's a risky move.
...hows the power consumption?
2 screens & 2 processors - thats gotta chew up the batteries pretty quick relative to a standard GameBoy...
Also how useful will the second screen be in a fast paced game where 'glancing at the second screen' = painful death?
Two 3 inch screens are less expensive than one 6 inch screen. And they probably have a large backstock of them from the GBA.
How much is going to cost me for a second screen? How is this going to be laid out? Seems like a two screened GameBoy would be pretty akward. And the most important question, will there be a game that use the second screen in a unique enough manner to warrant buying this thing. Please Niintendo, I want to love you. Why must you keep coming up with these retarded ideas?
Very cool. My first thought was of the old Game&Watch games, some of which had two screens. So not only do we get to have games like that, but we can also have games that use the two screens in different ways. In RPGs you could constantly have your stats/inventory open. In other games you could have the top window be a map and the bottom the area where your working. If they put a few more buttons on, you could head to head on one unit with someone else on simple games. I think this will be VERY interesting to see what developers come up with for this. Puzzle games alone (with two perspectives) could be very intersting.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
Try again. 1 Gigabit = 1024 Megabits. Divide by eight and you get 128 Megabytes.
"the new product will be a unique item that is different from any traditional machine", and will be "be [neither] a home console nor a portable machine."
:D
sounds a little like the virtual boy, doesn't it?
I work for a discount retailer and the nintendo representative said May as a projected release date.
it looks like NGage isn't going to be the king of handheld gaming for much longer...
lysergically yours
Um, wouldn't it be 128 megabytes, not kilobytes? That's not too terribly bad for a handheld. It's more memory than my old thinkpad 600 had when I got it.
I'm flipping over the idea of two screens, though. I assume they're going to be placed vertically, with the top screen as the "game play" screen, and the bottom screen as a menu/map/status reporter/whatever.
It would be neat if this thing had the ability to add extra peripherials, like a GPS with moving map or movie players.
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It seems Nintendo management hasn't learned anything at all from the Virtual Boy fiasco. It looks clever and innovative at first blush, but if it's huge, overexpensive and adds nothing to gameplay, then guess what Nintendo --- it ain't gonna sell. A ten-year-old could've told them this. Nobody wants fancy new controllers and displays --- the basic gaming hardware has essentially all been invented. Just focus on cranking out good games: IMHO, there's still plenty of innovation to be made in that department.
Heh, reminds me of some of the old dual screen game and watch... ...well, better that than Virtual Boy!
SO YOU'RE GOING TO DIE: The Comic for Dealing with Death
Here's a novel idea - have a different perspective on each screen, hold the unit three inches from your face and go crosseyed! Instant 3D! :-)
they mentioned that this thing uses dual processors. Could these possibly be the long waited for cells? You would think they would have mentioned this in the article if that was the case.
A side note:
To me, the dual screen thing does make sense. Someone must have realized that you can't increase the screen size on a portable past what is is without making the form factor unreasonable and realized that a bottom part on a folded portable has more screen real estate. Personally I'm a little disapointed they didn't just increase the resolution, I was looking forward to playing certain snes games that need high res to look nice (Chrono Trigger) on future GB hardware.
So yeah. Maximum size of a GBA game is 256 Megabit, and that's PLENTY for a portable, considering what you can pack into a GBA rom already. *that* is what will really draw people to this console -- at that size you could easily fit any SNES game and if you re-did them, most PSX games.
Ever played a gameboy emulator on a 19" monitor? Trust me, you could fit four displays on the screen and they'd still be significantly larger than a GBA screen.
Plus there's the 'horde of nerds' factor, who take it as a challenge to emulate/hack/install-linux-on the next big thing.
I ran a benchmark on my quantum computer, now I can't find it anywhere!
Although I can't really see a good reason for doing this at present (because there are no games), there is a perfectly good reason that Nintendo is doing this. INNOVATION.
N64 used carts because the load times were a lot better than optical media of the day. Seriously. Look at load times on an N64, then at the PSX. Sure they might have been more expensive than a PSX disc, and didn't hold enough data, but from a purely technical standpoint, it was a far better idea.
When the GameCube came about, optical discs had gotten to the point that Nintendo could use them without compromising load times. The smaller form factor was used to create a smaller console, faster seek times, and the anti-piracy that you mentioned. Anti-Piracy was not the SOLE reason for the smaller form factor as you make out.
The same goes for the new console. There are many ways of using two separate displays. I don't think that anyone is really qualified to judge it until we start to see some of the killer apps for the console.
I haven't seen this asked yet. I see shock and confusion, and speculations of Nintendo's demise. It would be good to remember that Nintendo has had only one unprofitable quarter in the last 30 years. Microsoft has pissed $2bns down the drain to become a viable competitor in the home console arena. Sony is upset that the biggest threat to their games division is GBA, and wants to compete on that front with their PSP. Nintendo knows what it's doing better than you do. Let it do what it does best, and reap the happy gaming benefit that is your due as a fan. Or not. But if you're one of Iwata's 'Ten percent', make it known.
psnxdc
The emacs religion: to be saved, control excess.
You'd think they'd learn from their Virtual Boy mistakes. While for the most part I'm agreeing with "What the hell", there are two things that I like about this, that were sparked by your mentioning innovation.
1) It's a break from the whole "Supremacy through system specs" scheme that Nintendo's never been a fan of (Gamecube's no hardware monster, just knows what it wants to do).
2) This is going to force game designers to be a little creative, unless the designers just reject it and the system bombs. Still, it's good to see some forward-thinking minds in an industry driven by sequels upon sequels.
I'll say it right now, I'm going to buy one of these. It's great having Nintendo around for reasons like this and though this looks like an obvious bomb, I want to support them all the way. It looks like they're carrying the torch that Sega dropped, and nobody looks fit to taken from Nintendo if they fall. Let's turn video games into an art medium, not a commercial playground
Look it's a joke about my sig IN MY SIG! LOL!
I had been hoping for either a portable Gamecube or possibly some sort of VR/holographic wonder thingy that Satoru Iwata was teasing us with. This is just confusing... maybe once I see an actual product, I'll understand.
Heck, I thought they were going to use the 8cm discs in thier newer products and for it to be a "de facto standard". Looks like they are sticking with solid state.
My first thoughts on the dual screens is so that the device can be closed with the screens touching, thus being protected. However, there may also be other reasons... observe:
* Playing Battleship the way it was meant to be played. One screen has your ships and the other has where you fired.
* Flip the screen around and use it for two player games. The unit may even have a second controller for this purpose.
* Hook up to special headgear that would position device right in front of eyes to recreate Virtual Boy experience. (my favorite)
* Plug two Pokemon cartridges (1 screen for each game) into device to trade Pokemon back and forth. It is all about the Pokemon after all.
These are just a few unique gaming concepts I can think of at the moment. Anyone else care to speculate?
Here's some conecpt art thanks to ign
The notion of 2 screens is nothing more than a gimmick, but what's most important about this announcement is the specs: 2 processors and up to a gigabit of memory. If the DS is far more powerful than the GBA, it might be worth consideration.
-==- Buy a Mac and leave me alone!
they trying a bit too hard?
|/________
|\A|ALYS|
I just wanted to ad this if any one was looking for the info
ARM9 Family:
32-bit RISC processor core with ARM(R) and Thumb(R) instruction sets
5-stage integer pipeline achieves 1.1 MIPS/MHz
Up to 300 MIPS (Dhrystone 2.1) in a typical 0.13m process
Single 32-bit AMBA bus interface
MMU supporting Windows CE, Symbian OS, Linux, Palm OS (ARM920T and ARM922T)
Memory Protection Unit (MPU) supporting a range of Real Time Operating Systems including VxWorks (ARM940T)
Integrated instruction and data caches
Excellent debug support for SoC designers, including ETM interface
8-entry write buffer -- avoids stalling the processor when writes to external memory are performed
Portable to latest 0.18m, 0.15m, 0.13m silicon processes.
Related links:
The ARM7 family:
Established, high-volume 32-bit RISC architecture
Up to 130 MIPs (Dhrystone 2.1) performance on a typical 0.13m process
Small die size and very low power consumption
High code density, comparable to 16-bit microcontroller
Wide operating system and RTOS support - including Windows CE, Palm OS, Symbian OS, Linux and market-leading RTOS
Wide choice of development tools
Simulation models for leading EDA environments
Excellent debug support for SoC designers, including ETM interface
Multiple sourcing from industry-leading silicon vendors
Availability in 0.25m, 0.18m and 0.13m processes
Migration and support across new process technologies
Code is forward-compatible to ARM9, ARM9E and ARM10 processors as well as Intel's XScale technology
2nd equal in home consoles and an iron grasp monopoly in the handheld market. When will dim witted morons like you get a clue and realise Nintendo is doing what is does best? Making games and gaming hardware. And they're making a pretty penny out of it too.
Looks can be deceiving. Or CAN they?
The very first thing I thought of with dual screens was Nintendo's Arcade Punchout, Super Punchout, and Arm Wrestling game. I'm almost betting that the dual screens will be vertical, ie. stacked right on top of each other... with the controls to the left and right of the bottom one (exactly like the "Game&Watch"). Unique concept, IMHO.... but I think taking advantage of the dual screens will be difficult. My guess will be that the extra screen won't be taken advantage of by most game developers because they are simply not original enough, and there's only so much you can do with it. It will probably be typically used for a "status" display, scoring or radar in most games.
The other question I beg to ask, is will it be backwards compatible with GBA? If so, what will happen with the other screen? I'm hoping it won't turn on, and drain the batteries.
Worked excellent.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
The single best reason for Dual screens, info panes.
I'm guessing most of you who are trouncing this idea are PC game players or people who have never used a hand held game system. In any game with a large amount of information, say every RPG or RTS there is a lot of time spent bring up extra menus or pausing the game to hit a sub menu system. With two screens, one probably located directly below the other near the controls, now you just have to glance down to grab additional info. The LCD screens being used here don't have very high resolution to keep the costs reasonable so a second screen is an easy way to add much more feedback to the game player.
This console sounds like it is a direct result of the GC-GBA link system. When done right (see Zelda, Final Fantasy Chronicles) it is an amazing thing. The GBA link actually gives us what Sega promised with the dreamcast VMU except in colour and with a lot more than just basic, bland static information.
Sheesh just imagine a RTS game like Advance Wars where the secondary display shows a zoomed out map area and other random stats but automatically changes over to an info pane when you move your selector over one of your own or an enemy unit. That's not cool?
--- I do not moderate.
Excellent point.
I've gotten used to 2-screen gaming (GCN w/GBA, DC w/VMU, 2 monitors on my computer). It has great potential.
Actually, all of the above were launched for strategic reasons.
The ROB was released to get the NES out of department stores and into electronics stores, and at that it succeeded admirably (they never intended to support it, sadly). The GBA-GC link was an attempt to use the success of the GBA to drive sales of their new system. The SuperGameboy took some of the edge out of the criticism that the Game Boy was not actually a color device, during a time when it was under a very real attack from the Lynx, the Game Gear, and the TurboExpress. It also attempted to leverage the success of the GB to the SNES, in the same way that the GBA-GC link would later fail to do. The 64-DD was an experiment in optical re-writable technologies, as a response to criticisms of the storage capacity of cartridges and the then obvious future for networked gaming. The e-Reader sold and still sells well in Japan. Selling barcodes for 5 bucks sounds like a good idea to me. The SuperScope was Nintendo's attempt to make and promote a gun to shed their kiddy image, but to make is so laughably non gun-like (and ergonomically challenged) as to not offend parents. Gunpei Yokoi, who helped found Nintendo's interactive ambitions with light gun shooting galleries and created the original zapper, was responsible for the SuperScope. He also (ill)concieved the VirtualBoy was during a time where JaguarVR and the Genesis/SegaCD/32X VR system was perceived as a threat.
You did miss a few, though. There was the Power Pad, the Game Boy Camera, the Game Boy Printer, the Super Mouse, the Play Choice 10, the Nintendo Super System, the entire Wizard movie, Killer Instinct for the SNES, the years-too-late mini NES. Some of them, like the RAM expansion pack, or the Satellite, were handled surprisingly well overall. Most of them were just swept under the rug.
I think we can all guess what the fate of this system will likely be.
The ______ Agenda
It's almost the same arch. as a Compaq iPaq or Jornada, for gods sake. It's like 1/6th clock speed though, to preserve battery.
Not entirely untrue, but I think you took me entirely too literally and missed the bigger point...
The GBA has an ARM-7 chip clocked at 16Mhz. For comparison, the original SNES had a 16-bit 65c816 at 3.58Mhz. Better than 4x as fast, you might say, and that doesn't even consider the far superior chip architecture involved. Fair enough.
Now, for a quick glance at the PS2... It has a 36.864 R3000 CPU just for handling its I/O... Already, it whomps the GBA, and that only considers its least powerful subsystem.
Except, of course, that double-neck guitars have their purpose [snip] There's still no better way to move between string layouts
;) Otto, certainly, had no futher use for it apart from the fact that it was more kewl in his mind, and I can't help but wonder if that's the case here.
Interesting. I knew that they must have had some purpose, aside from looking a bit silly
Still, 2 screens is a hardware change based somewhat in the PC world that has been mostly unused
I suspect that, like the double guitar, there's only a very small niche for this kind of thing. Will developers even be interested in coming up with worthwhile uses for it, or will it just be relegated to "map" or "menu" stuff? I don't believe the average hand-held game player is going to get too excited about that. Then we get into the UI design issue that your attention can only be focused on one thing at a time anyway.
As you say, we'll have to wait and see what they intend this for, but given how something like wireless multi-player gaming, done well, could change the nature of hand-held gaming, it had better be more interesting than "maps and menus" to make anybody care enought to buy one.
Of course, if it does indeed have wireless support, and the multi-screen thing is really not the focus, that's a different story.