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Area 51 Hackers Map Buried Surveillance Network
advair writes "There's a story on SecurityFocus about a pair of Area 51 'hackers' who discovered a buried network of wireless motion sensors on the public land surrounding the "operating location near Groom Lake, Nevada." Using a frequency counter and a GPS receiver, they tracked down and logged 30 - 40 of the sensors, before the FBI and Air Force raided one of them, and questioned the other. Now one of the guys has been charged with a federal crime for allegedly removing one of the devices that was protecting a base that doesn't officially exist."
My bet is area 51 is just a deco, think about you set up a "base" you plant a few "good" stories for the conspiracy theorist to love, you play the whole thing up. you have a real base some where else. Every one will flock to area 51, then you do your real work at area 52 (or what ever they might call it) I also doubt there are any extra terrestrial research going on in the government, think about it you need the best of the best to even think of starting it, and the government well its the government what other insult do I need to lob at it.
Area 51 is probably just a few buildings there to keep the amount of people to perpetuate the image that area 51 is real.
This people probably have fallen for it, and the government might have just planted the motion sensors to keep them busy, they the person steal one I don't know, but either way the government sorta unofficial clams it, and the conspiracy theorists will go wild.
Hasn't that base been officially declared as real, and that it has been unused for some time?
a pair ... discovered a buried network of wireless motion sensors on the public land surrounding the "operating location near Groom Lake, Nevada."
:)
Upon their arrival, hundreds of vents opened up and millions of alien-virus infected bees immediately started swarming around them...
Oops, wait, sorry... wrong movie.
Area 51 is a hoax by the goverment
Hast thou learned nothing from the x-files?...
"All great things are simple & expressed in a single word: freedom, justice, honor, duty, mercy, hope." --Churchill
If there ever was anything at Groom Lake, it won't be there now. The SECOND anyone knew that UFO nuts had got wind of it, anything interesting would have been moved somewhere else.
At a tangent - whatever happened to Bob Lazar?
The base exists. Clinton signed it into existance when the workers sued for being exposed to pollutants which the goverment didnt want to disclose. As of 2002 all of the John Doe's are now dead and the foverment still didnt explain what materials they were exposed too.
* Large playing area
:)
* GPS coordinates are mapped
* Public land (hey, the taxpayers _pay_ for it)
* Who knows what goodies are at each site to be traded
Sounds like a good place for some geocaching to me!
Nowhere does it mention that one of these things was seized from the guy. What happened to assumed to be innocent until proven guilty? For all they know the thing could have broken, batteries run flat, someone drove over it, etc. Or for the conspiracy nuts - they removed it themselves just to accuse the guy.
Oh wait, it was just /. ed ...
Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life, son.
There's no such thing as "public land" -- the government owns every single bit of land in the country that's not owned privately (and even then -- there's property tax)
It also doesn't matter if the DOD name was on it or not, it doesn't belong to you, so why take it? Basic theft.
During the Clinton era it was acknowledged that Area 51 (Dreamland, Groom Lake, etc) existed. This was about the same time that Area 51 buffs reported a dramatic decrease in activity at and around the base. It was acknowledged in a very generic manner, but was acknowledged none the less.
Supposedly, the reason for the abandoning of the base was because the radiation from atomic tests wasn't going the "China Syndrome" way, back into the earth, but coming back up (area 51 was the 51st grid on a map used for nuke testing).
I haven't followed it for a while, but last I heard, the experts were pointing at Arizona and New Mexico as the new locations for many, mini, Area 51s.
END OF LINE.
"If you or I accidentally kick one of these hidden transmitters, should the feds be able to seize our Macintosh and photos of Aunt Betty?"
They took his Macintosh?!? Those bastards!
I'm in the hole of the broadband donut.
Lot's of military bases have perimeter security and sensors. Try getting into Camp Peary in Virginia. Or any one of a number of other places.
oooo....But it's Area51! Obviously they are hiding something behind those sensors.
Ha. If there ever was anything alien there (highly doubtful), it's long since been moved. Hangar 18, maybe?
There was a television special recently about this. What I found even more interesting was a different security compromise.
A private investigator was hired to watch the airport in Las Vegas and he observed which cars came and went on a frequent basis. He was eventually able to deduce which cars' owner were spending the day at Area 51.
At that point, it became a simple matter of just following the cars to a plush neighborhood. When he went to knock on the door and asked about Area 51, they said "no comment" and shut the door in his face. One would think that just mentioning Area 51 would be enough to inspire curosity from the non-involved.
An once-insider agreed to secretly meet with them doing the whole inside-a-hotel with blured-face and altered-voice routine. He examined maps and photos and said they were accurate. He also said that there were no UFOs at Area 51, and that the big secret was the abusive politics and unsafe worker conditions.
Guess Area 51 scooby gang missed the television special on S4, where the anti-gravity from borrowed UFOs go on.
Several years ago the Sec. of Defense admitted its existence in a press conference. Hell, I can tell you what goes on there: nothing exciting. They test secret missile systems and secret aircraft.
Derek Greene
Now, granted he did rebury the devices, and granted, they were in the public park, not Area 51 itself, but it's not hard for the average person to see why this is a bad idea. There's a lot of stuff in "public" areas you're not allowed to monkey with. If a public park provided restrooms with those annoying motion-sensor faucets, does anyone think they would be within their rights to repeatedly take them apart?
Sure, there is a worry in this case about the government monitoring private citizens in a public place, but "approach" sensors invade privacy a lot less than swarms of armed guards peering through binoculars from the fenceline 24x7.
In short, this guy crossed the line. I understand being intrigued, and even outraged by these devices, but making a map is one thing, and once he figured out what the devices were he never should have touched them.
(Just had a scary thought on preview: what if the odd buried device he found had turned out to be a errant landmine? Of course it's massively criminal for it to be there, but there is a reason you don't got poking unknown military hardware...)
Area 51 is probably just another detention camp where alien terrorists are being tortured^Wquestioned. Govt. denies the existence of this camp to protect the red cross inspectors from the awful sight of ugly aliens nursing their greenish wounds. Ever seen an alien with sleep deprivation? Uh oh...
cpghost at Cordula's Web.
Now one of the guys has been charged with a federal crime...
If you absolutely, positively must be raided today - illegally enter a restricted area.
I mean, come on, you know they're motion sensors - what did you think would happen?
-Adam
The Federation of American Scientists has a nice description of what is on Area 51, as well as many links to provide more info.
There is no denying that there is much about the place kept under wraps, but the crazy UFO stories need to come to an end.
Sunny Dubey
Here is the link from the article to the photos of the sensors. Sensor Photos
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." -Albert Einstein
Karma? There's a serial modder out there.
President Bush gave the area an exemption from EPA regulations on waste disposal in 2002:0 020918-9.html
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/09/2
Read any good sonnets lately?
For added excitement:
*Armed patrols
Ripping an new rectum in the fabric of spacetime.
In this post on the Area 51 site linked to from the article, Joerg Arnu (one of the "hackers" in the article) claims that Poulsen lured him into the interview under false pretenses, then refused his requests not to use the interview, hung up on him, and didn't return any further messages. I haven't read much of Poulsen's stuff, but is this typical of him?
Juiced? Or Not?
Area 51 is real and is used everyday. There are planes that take off everyday from McCarran Airport in Las Vegas bringing employees to Groom Lake.
"Another area of interest is the EG&G terminal on the Northwest corner of McCarran International Airport. Every weekday morning, about 500 people arrive at the guarded terminal with one destination, Groom Lake. When I was in Las Vegas observing the activity of the EG&G terminal, I counted six EG&G owned 737-200s. The aircraft are easily identifiable; they are white with a red strip running the total length of the plane. They fly out to Groom Lake about every half hour in the morning but things slow down in the afternoon with about two to three aircraft always sitting outside. Starting in the late afternoon (I noticed one coming in at 2:30 PM), the 737s start coming back to Las Vegas. At about 6:00, all of the aircraft (6 of which I counted, there could be more) were back to the EG&G facility for the night. Below are the photos that I took when I was out to Groom Lake and observing the EG&G terminal." From sr-71.org, and a picture here.
Also for the "new" Area 51, Popular Mechanics had an article a long time ago that is located here.
Ever heard of this concept? The simplest explanation is probably the best one. Let's start out with Area 51 being a "secret military base" that "doesn't officially exist". Area 51 exists, is acknowledged to exist, and is generally known as an Air Force base. So what could their motivation here be?
Probably that they're tired of a bunch of crazy conspiracy theorists trying to get a photo of the "aliens" on the base. The idea that Area 51 is a government hoax is ridiculous. Anyone who works or has worked for the US Federal Gov't knows the insane levels of bureacracy that you have to deal with on a daily basis, and you don't get thinking anywhere near that creative from the federal government.
Let's stop making such a hugely asinine deal about this. Get out of your basement and stop wearing your x-files t-shirts around.
-- K
Site slow, freecache doesn't work on files less than 5mb (and I am not letting my webserver feel the wrath of slashdot), so here's article text:
Area 51 hackers dig up trouble
By Kevin Poulsen, SecurityFocus May 25 2004 1:03PM
To the Area 51 buffs who travel to the Nevada desert in the hopes of catching a glimpse of unexplained lights in the sky or to bask in the mythic allure of the region, 58-year-old Chuck Clark is almost as much a part of the local color as the Black Mailbox.
A resident of tiny Rachel, Nevada -- 100 miles north of Las Vegas along the Extraterrestrial Highway -- the amateur astronomer and author has spent years keeping an eye on the spot the government calls the "operating location near Groom Lake, Nevada." He's said to be a frequent presence at the Little A'Le'Inn, where you can purchase post cards and tee shirts, enjoy an "Alien Burger," and walk out with a copy of Clark's "Area 51 & S-4 Handbook" to guide you on your journey into the desert.
But this self-appointed military watchdog is harder to find these days: messages left for him at the Inn go unreturned, and his media appearances have dried up like Groom Lake itself. "I think he's really not as motivated to talk to the media anymore as he used to be," says friend and fellow base-watcher Joerg Arnu. The reason: it turns out the truth really was out there, and the government didn't appreciate Clark digging it up.
Clark didn't find the Roswell craft or an alien autopsy room -- in fact, while officially shrouded in secrecy, the 50-year-old base is generally believed to be dedicated to the terrestrial mission of testing classified aircraft. "The U2 spy plane, the SR-71, the F-117A stealth fighter, all were flight-tested out of the Groom Lake facility," says Steven Aftergood, director of the Federation of American Scientists' Project on Government Secrecy. The myth of Area 51 memorialized in films, T.V. shows and novels is a function of the secrecy that surrounds it. "It is a concrete manifestation of official secrecy at its most intense, and that invites a mixture of paranoia and speculative fantasy that has become ingrained in popular culture," says Aftergood.
Even without aliens, the facility has its secrets, and last year while roaming the desert outside the Groom Lake base Clark stumbled upon one of them: an electronic device packed in a rugged case and buried in the dirt. Marked "U.S. Government Property," the device turned out to be a wireless transmitter, connected by an underground cable to a sensor buried nearby next to one of the unpaved roads that vein the public land surrounding the base. Together, the units act as a surveillance system, warning someone -- somewhere -- whenever a vehicle drives down that stretch of road.
Similar devices had been spotted in the area in the early 90s, but they were crude and bulky, stashed in the bushes and easily spotted. They were later withdrawn. The new road sensors are more clandestine, given away only by a slender antenna poking up through the dirt. "They're very, very hard to find, because there's just this little wire, like a blade of grass," says Arnu.
Sniffing Out Surveillance
Arnu, a Las Vegas software engineer, has shared Clark's preoccupation with the Groom Lake base since 1999, when he made a trip to the area to see what all the fuss was about. "I thought, okay, I'll give it a try, see what's out there... A couple of days turned into a couple of weeks and before I knew it I started developing a website about Area 51," says Arnu.
So when Clark found the new generation of road sensor, Arnu drove out to help investigate further. The pair found that, at close range, they could use a handheld frequency counter to pick up the wireless signals given off by the devices as a car passes. Over the following month and half, Clark and Arnu engaged in a kind of geocaching game with the Men in Black, systematically sniffing out the road sensors with the frequency counter, exhuming them, and opening them up. They discov
Founder of Mirror Moon - Tsukihime Game Trans
While I know that often plea deals are important in order to garner testimony about organized crime or other criminal activities this sort of case illustrates (or at least might illustrate since I don't actually know who is telling the truth) the potential dangers. Bizarelly I find myself in agreement with Ashcroft, plea bargains should be *only* be offered in return for becoming an informant, it should be banned (legally and not just by the AGs rules) otherwise.
For instance in this case the government has *every* encouragment to file suit against this guy even if they have no evidence. The threat of prison time is scary enough that any normal person will take a plea agreement accomplishing what the government really wants, stopping them from investigating area 51 (it would not surprise me at all if part of his probhation is not to even passively map the sensors, or even go close to area 51). The plea bargain allows the government to exercise considerable power by the threat of legal action without any real chance of court review.
Moreover, as far as I'm concerned giving someone a deal for pleading guilty should be a violation of the 5th ammendment. After all a plea bargain is a reduced sentence in return for not insisting on your innocence. Or put another way in the presence of a plea offer there is a penalty for insisting on your innocence. Sure it isn't technically punishing someone for refusing to incriminate themselves but this is certainly within the spirit of the ammendment, if the implicit privacy argument is considered a valid constitutional principle than this sort of broad interpratation of the 5th is perfectly reasonable as well. I really can't see any pragmatic difference between a law which penalizes someone for not testifying to their guilt (which presumably could only apply if the individual was convicted) and a general practice of giving significantly reduced sentences in return for the admisson of guilt.
Some people will protest that my position would rob the judicial system of discretion. Not at all, judges would still have plenty of discretion to give a light sentence. The change would just stop penalizing individuals for insisting on innocence. I also think it is only because upper class white kids always recieve plea bargains in drug cases (while poor black ones often don't) that the public is willing to stand for things like mandatory minimums and extreme drug sentences. I doubt most of the prosecutors are overtly racist but many people's gut reaction to seeing a well dressed white kid busted for drugs is a good kid who screwed up while a black kid in baggy pants and so forth is far more likely to be thought of as a bad person. Sure, the problem will still exist in sentencing but at least the system will be a little better and more open (it is easier to see that a judge is racially biased in his deciscions because everything is public record while often the surrounding facts to a plea bargain aren't so publicly accesible).
If you liked this thought maybe you would find my blog nice too:
All those people being flown in an out are CmdrTaco's chefs.
As for President Bush signing an excemption for waste disposal.......well, I'll leave that to your imagination.
And if you thought that was boring you obviously havn't read my Journal ;-)
I would have been pissed if some yahoo started messing with them, too. After all, they are there to ensure that no one vandalizes the equipment or gets fried by the 21,500 volts that exist across the base insulator of the antenna. We were most afraid of some BASE jumper getting killed while trying to climb the tower. In LORAN the whole tower is "hot" instead of a small radiator at the top.
And if they broke one, I'd have to fix it.
It is easy to argue that the govnt employs common people, who cannot handle some info. The truth is, that the secret stuff gives the feds an advantage over spooks in other countries. If you can keep the fact that you have a fleet of F-117s on hand, you get the advantage of Saddam Hussein not buying the latest anti-stealth shoulder launched rockets from Serbia at $zillion a pop for a few more years. Simple. Military advantage. I can handle knowing that the USAF has rocket powered toilets just as well as the next guy, but may be in USAF's advantage not to let ANYONE know about it.
It's logical that if they publish this in the USA, then Osama is going to read all bout it the same day. It's not that regular people like us can't know about it, it's that us not knowing about it is the only way to guarantee that Osama won't know either.
They have full right to do this in the name of security, and it is also their duty to judge what information may be released. Remember, if they release something which allows Osama to level New York tomorrow (i.e. "suitcase thermonuclear bomb for $100 HOWTO"), it's THEIR ass on the line.
And just to drive the argument home: Foreign spies would be out of work if stuff like that was public. What's the harm? Why do you think other countries spend so much money on intelligence, if this info isn't crucial to security?
The funny thing is how much businesses come to believe that FedEx can do no wrong. Mostly they're excellent, but there are some areas of the country where they're NOT the best, and some businesses refuse to listen to you when you tell them what the "conditions on the ground" are.
I had a friend who was a pharmacist at a hospital in northern Michigan (UP, Keweenaw area). He ordered some medical supplies from a place, and said "ship them UPS overnight. *DO* *NOT* ship them FedEx." Well, they shipped them FedEx overnight.
About 5 days later the boxes were still not there. He called them and said "You shipped them FedEx, didn't you?" They had, and (as he knew) FedEx in that area is not guaranteed. They weren't going to drive 180 miles round trip from the depot to deliver one stinkin' package. They put all the boxes on a pallet, and when there's enough to bother, then they send out a truck.
UPS, OTOH, has a local depot, and plenty of packages come into the area, so they have no problems delivering overnight (though there is a cutoff line, way out on the peninsula, where they don't guarantee 10:30 delivery anymore).
This was 20 years ago, I'm betting FedEx has a local presence now, but I know there are still parts of the country where there are better choices than FedEx.
This story always comes to mind when I'm watching the commercials where the guy didn't use FedEx, so the package is delayed.
Not ever again...I'll tell you *that*.
Anthony Papillion
Advanced Data Concepts, Inc.
"Quality Custom Software and IT Services"
It is reasonable to assume that military science is extremely advanced in many more areas than simply aerospace. Indeed, with even the slightest use of reasonable thought, it is perfectly logical to assume that almost all of the technology which Slashdotters and the public at large consider 'New' and get all excited over, is really stone-age by comparison to what could be available if only it were allowed. --That in fact, the reality we all live in is a total farce -which for some reason- nearly everybody seems happy enough to play along with.
.
.
"Oooh. Digital paper." "Oooh. Bigger hard drives." "Oooh. Internal combustion."
This stuff is only impressive in the way that withheld candies are impressive to children. To pretend that we are actually pushing the boundaries of human knowledge and capability with any of this crap is nothing short of willfully stupid.
"Yeah? So what?" --Some might ask. "We know this is how it is, but there's national security to consider."
Er. . . Well, no, that's a very thin excuse. This goes far beyond secret planes which fly faster. Technological advance has happened in areas and directions which go amazingly far beyond a simple question of keeping the better airplanes out of the hands of the commies. (Which in itself is an incredibly stupid concept which again, everybody on the planet plays along with.)
The war in Iraq is an excellent example.
Saddam and his forces could have been removed with very few soldiers with much greater efficiency and cleanliness than was done. The kind of technology available and in use today makes it possible to shut down a city or a stronghold, walk in and murder or abduct the people you want to murder or abduct with ease and simplicity. The only reason to commit giant forces with archaic weapons and broken, (and some would say, nonexistent) tactics to a giant overseas ground war is this. .
To create a huge, infernal endless war designed to kill millions of people and absorb billions of dollars in goods. --There is a LOT of money and power to be had from big messy wars. Understanding how this is true and where the power comes from and goes to, who it benefits and why, is the first step to grasping how the real world works.
Consider this. .
One of the other directions military research has gone in has been toward that of mind control and mood altering. In fact, this could easily be considered the holy grail of military science; when you can control a population, then the need for guns and tanks is instantly nullified. --And anybody who has any level of competency in research, and who has the courage to look at frightening possibilities rather than seek comfort in ridiculing others while avoiding the pain of being ridiculed themselves, (and geeks have strong sore spots regarding this given their experiences through life; and isn't it curious that those most able to see through the veil are also those targeted with some of the most deliberate and cruel social programming?) --Anybody who knows how to question and has the balls to do so, knows that the holy grail of mind control was discovered long ago, and is widely implemented today across all strata of society in many different forms.
Secret planes that go fast?
The military industrial complex, (to use an old but accurate term), has more than secret planes in its bat belt!
The 'other' effects of cell phones upon the human brain and cognitive function were not only well understood, but were deliberately designed and were the primary reason for the proliferation of the wireless technology. --And population control through EM is only one way; combined with chemicals in our food, the direct psychological programming in advertising, music, television and movies -through all strata of media- combine to provide a means of near total control of humanity.
Many of you laugh. Would it be mind control if you feel that knee-jerk desire?