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The World's Most Dangerous Password

NonNullSet writes "Minutemen ICBMs were deployed in the early 1960s, and grew to over 1000 in number. They were allegedly protected from a "rogue launch" by an approach known as PAL (Permissive Action Link). The PAL required that the correct 8-digit launch code be entered by the missiliers before the missile would establish ignition. What if all the PAL codes had been set to '00000000,' and 'everyone' in the Strategic Air Command knew it? That is unbelievably what happened, as described in this article from the Center for Defense Information. Not exactly a great example for getting people to choose difficult passwords!"

155 of 696 comments (clear)

  1. Someone's gotta say it by Roland+Piquepaille · · Score: 5, Funny

    What if all the PAL codes had been set to '00000000,' and 'everyone' in the Strategic Air Command knew it?

    Stupid David played with the WOPR again!

    1. Re:Someone's gotta say it by JMandingo · · Score: 5, Interesting

      A flight attendant invited me to a party a few years back, and it was mostly pilots and flight attendants at the party. All getting sloshed, of course - pilot and flight attendants DRINK. Since most airline pilots started their careers in the military I got to spend a lot of the evening listening to 'war' stories.

      One pilot I talked to used to copilot one of the two big planes (747s?) that they send up that can launch all the missiles remotely in case NORAD gets knocked out. He told a story about how they would run all these drills where they would scramble, get in the air immediately, and then get transmitted codes from the ground. They would unscramble the codes as "do not launch" and then return to base without transmitting anything to the silos, drill over.

      According to him, on one of these sorties received the "launch" code in error. So they asked the ground to repeat the transmission. Which they did, and it was the same. So they took a chance and broke protocol and radio'd the ground and told them that they had just sent the "launch" codes, and did they really want them to transmit this along to the silos? Of course the ground told them to cease and return to base.

      Scary truth or dunken bravado? Who knows.

      --
      Vonnegut was right: Of all the words of mice and men, the saddest are, "It might have been."
    2. Re:Someone's gotta say it by ghostlibrary · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That's why 'man in the loop' is worth keeping. Fully automated systems are not just 'risky', but absolutely totally insane.

      You read about trying to cut people out of the loop to save costs, think about this and just pay the $40k/year salary, for goodness sake.

      --
      A.
    3. Re:Someone's gotta say it by netsharc · · Score: 5, Funny

      You were at a party with stewardess, ehm I mean flight attendants..? Who cares about the war stories, did you score???

      --
      What time is it/will be over there? Check with my iPhone app!
    4. Re:Someone's gotta say it by MagicDude · · Score: 4, Informative

      There is someone in the loop. The missle silo's in Colorado are manned by Air Force officers. A college buddy of mine was Air Force ROTC (Reserve Officer Training Corps, pronounced rot-see). In return for the Air Force paying most of his tuition, he serves 4 years active duty and an additional period of time in the reserves. He has been assigned to the "Space and Missiles" program, which means that after a year of training he'll either be sent to "Space" which is mainly research and development, or to "Missiles", which is sitting in the missile silos. Of the people assigned to this program, about 20% go to space, and 80% go to missiles. As my friend describes it, he'd work on a 3 day rotation, where every third day he'd have a 24hr shift in an underground bunker where his primary job would be to wait for the signal to come in and then do the thing with the two keys and entering the final launch code or however it works these days. So there are still people in the loop for the US's long range missiles.

    5. Re:Someone's gotta say it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'm going with drunken bravado. If such a thing occurred, you can bet that it would be pretty highly classified.

      I have a friend who is retired on disability (injured in an explosion) from the Air Force. He worked on classified stuff, and while I know what platforms he worked on, and that some planes can go a lot faster than their published ratings say they can (that is not classified), that's about it. In fact, even though the air frames he worked with are no longer in service and will never be used again, he still can't talk about them. Nor is he allowed to ever be hypnotized. He could be prosecuted for allowing anyone to hypnotize him.

      But what he did is a lot less secret than a screwup of the magnitude you describe here would be, considering that governments don't like embarrassing screwups involving secret and lethal programs to be widely known. I'm sure they would classify the hell out of something like that.

      Granted, that doesn't mean that a person can't get drunk and spill the beans, but I don't buy it. People know how stories get around. Heck, somebody might even post it on Slashdot :-)

      The number of people who have flown those planes can't be that large, so if they knew somebody leaked this story and that he claimed to have been the co-pilot, it wouldn't be hard for them to find him and have a little chat with him, or even prosecute him. My dad and brother both served in the army and I've had several friends who were in the military. None of them talks about anything that is secret, or was secret years ago.

      One of my friends is still an active reservist and occasionally disappears for long stretches of time and does stuff he can't talk about except to say that he was called up. All I know about his military service is that I'm pretty sure he was an active-duty seal but he won't even talk much about that. I've surmised it from a few things I've heard him say, plus knowing that he was in the Navy when he was active duty. I have no idea what his current reserve job is. He can't/won't say anything about it, not even when falling down drunk. He's quite security conscious (paranoid, even) even by the standards by which security admins (his civilian gig) are measured, and he speaks a language that is not commonly spoken by Americans, especially not native-born, native English-speaking ones from the midwest. Whether either of those traits has anything to do with his military work, I couldn't say. If he ever gets out from under stop-loss (he was under stop-loss even _before_ 9/11), I don't think he'll re-up. But even then he'll be an inactive reserve and they can call him up at need. He may be doing whatever it is he does for a long time to come, whether he wants to or not.

      Even though I haven't said anything secret here, I'm gonna post this one AC anyway. Heheh, my UPS just tripped for a few seconds as I was typing this. Voltage fell enough to dim all the lights. Coincidence? Maybe :-)

    6. Re:Someone's gotta say it by DerekLyons · · Score: 2, Informative
      I'm going with drunken bravado. If such a thing occurred, you can bet that it would be pretty highly classified.
      Not particularly. There were numerous instances across the years of screwups in the system where the safeguards built into the system prevented launch or release of the weapons. While the military doesn't like to talk about the incidents, only the details of the system are classified. (I worked on the recieving end of the system... My finger was on 'the button'.)
      In fact, even though the air frames he worked with are no longer in service and will never be used again, he still can't talk about them. Nor is he allowed to ever be hypnotized. He could be prosecuted for allowing anyone to hypnotize him.
      He's bullshitting you. I had a Top Secret clearance, and worked the SIOP, and worked sometimes in Sonar (and thus was cleared for acoustic signatures and intel). The only thing clssified higher was Crypto. And niether the Crypto or SIOP or Intel guys have any such provision in their exit interviews/security debriefings.
  2. At least they're default routers... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Username: cisco

    password: cisco

    'nuff said.

    1. Re:At least they're default routers... by ronsonal · · Score: 5, Informative

      While we're on the subject, and before this gets out of hand, just a reminder to everyone about

      The Default Password List

      Indispensible tool.

  3. trust by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This is why we trust politicians, ridiculous as they are, with our lives, and make the warriors answer to them. Because incompetent politics generally inhibits war, while incompetent warriors encourage it. And they're all incompetent - nobody knows the right way to do it.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

    1. Re:trust by geeber · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "Because incompetent politics generally inhibits war"

      As has been clearly demonstrated recently in Iraq...

      Oh wait, nevermind.

    2. Re:trust by TheGavster · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I think that the general case is mostly correct ... you have to allow for some deviation from the norm, especially with a politician as ... unique ... as the one in question.

      --
      "Because Science" is one step from "Because old book". Try "Because of my experiment testing my falsifiable assertion".
    3. Re:trust by Tiro · · Score: 4, Insightful
      No, you're wrong;

      In the current political establishment in the US, it is the politicians & Pentagon civilians who are promoting war, and the officers were generally very skeptical of what they were doing.

      Basically one portion of the political elite has decided that we should start acting like Israel if we are to maintain political power in the world, and they have gone on the offensive, entering into many regional conflicts around the world. I would argue this goes back to the Clinton administration at least; Wolfowitz and Pearle have taken it to the logical extreme.

      Remember how skeptical retired General Clark was of the war when he became a politician? So was Eisenhower; he warned us of the military-industrial complex, which becomes dangerous because the big money/corporate side of it has lots of influence on Washington politicians. Guys with military experience often know better than the politicians, and this is why Kerry or McCain would be much better leaders than the wide array of war cheerleaders in power now who avoided the draft in various ways [see last couple of weeks of doonesbury].

    4. Re:trust by Zak3056 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Because incompetent politics generally inhibits war, while incompetent warriors encourage it.

      You, sir, are completely incorrect in your assertation. Once upon a time, you might have been largely correct--back in the days when those who had military power were the same people as those with political power (Napoleon for example) the warriors would be the ones to start the wars.

      OTOH, looking at the history of 20th century US wars, not one was started by soldiers. Politicians are the ones who lead us into wars. Soldiers are the ones who die fighting them. Learn the difference.

      --
      What part of "shall not be infringed" is so hard to understand?
    5. Re:trust by Jerf · · Score: 4, Insightful

      As has been clearly demonstrated recently in Iraq...

      Indeed; incompetent politics can start wars as well as prevent them.

      If Saddam Hussein didn't have WMDs, all he had to do was cooperate with the inspecters, verify he didn't have them, and there would have been no war. He'd still be alive, running the country, and killing whoever he pleased, whenever he pleased.

      Instead, he let his ego get in the way of his politics, he fought the inspecters tooth and nail, and it ended up running his regime into the ground.

      (There's some more to the story then that, such as how stupid it is to run a "shoot the messenger" regime if you actually want to survive, but that outline is true.)

      Incompetent politics can definately start wars.

      (Oh, you were trying to blame the current President? Maybe if he'd actually started this war that would make sense, but since there is an unbroken string of broken UN resolutions dating back to Saddam's invasion of Kuwait, I'd say it makes just as much sense to call this a continuation of that, Saddam's Greatest Mistake. Not saying Bush is blameless, just saying that if you want to point at one person who's utterly incompetent politics for over a decade started this war, it's much, much more rational to point at Saddam. One little thing he had to do to remove any pretense, and his ego wouldn't let him do it.)

    6. Re:trust by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No, that's competent politics in action - they want war in Iraq, they got it. And everything that comes with it. Their inability to spin is incompetent, but if that gets BushCo out of the White House, they'll still have the zillions they latched onto.

      And the incompetent warriors at the top of the Pentagon went in without an exit strategy - just an exit fantasy of slavish Iraqi gratitude. Their further incompetence at fighting a guerilla war, which has been standard warfare since their incompetence in Vietnam certified it, has kept the war going. To stave off the inevitable "support the troops" replies, I note that the troops actually fighting are tactically competent, topping the world in killing power. Too bad their strategy leaders in the Pentagon don't support them as well as we do.

      So we've got political competence combined with warrior incompetence, and a war. Probably the worst war the US has seen since WWII - and there's no limit to what's to come. I never felt so bad about being right.

      --

      --
      make install -not war

    7. Re:trust by Zork+the+Almighty · · Score: 4, Insightful

      "The reason we start a war is to fight a war, win a war, thereby causing no more war!"

      --

      In Soviet America the banks rob you!
    8. Re:trust by benh57 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Um, Saddam *DID* allow inspectors! In 2002 and 2003! Bush invaded anyway! (look it up)

    9. Re:trust by LPetrazickis · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If Saddam Hussein didn't have WMDs, all he had to do was cooperate with the inspecters, verify he didn't have them, and there would have been no war. He'd still be alive, running the country, and killing whoever he pleased, whenever he pleased.

      Yes, announcing that you don't have significant weapons and appearing weak is a good idea when you have a powerful and belligerent Iran next door.

      --
      Is this a sigs-optional kind of place? 'Cause I am totally down with that if you know what I mean.
    10. Re:trust by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 2, Informative

      Typical US-centric, head-in-the-sand bullshit.

      There couldn't possibly be another reason to prevent the UN weapons inspectors from having carte blanche access to secure facilities in Iraq, right? I mean, those guys are all about the inspections and are completely trustworthy right? They would NEVER abuse that level of access to go "beyond scope" of their charter would they?

      OF COURSE THEY WOULD:
      http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/iraq02 23.htm
      http://www.fair.org/activism/unscom-history.html
      http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,351 165,00.html

      As for punishing "violations of UN resolutions" shouldn't the UN be responsible for that? Just exactly whose resolutions are these anyway? As if the Bush league has any interest in enforcing UN resolutions against other countries that are routinely broken on a daily basis anyhow.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    11. Re:trust by DruggedBunny · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Except that Saddam finally let the UN inspectors in, and Bush kicked them out so he could start a war.

    12. Re:trust by sholden · · Score: 2, Insightful


      Instead, he let his ego get in the way of his politics, he fought the inspecters tooth and nail, and it ended up running his regime into the ground.

      And the Islamic Regime next door, three times larger than his country would just sit idly by and ignore the undefended neighbour with which they had a rather serious war with not so long ago.

      Or maybe he took the gamble that the US wouldn't be stupid enough to take him seriously or at least not stupid enough to inflict the occupation of a serious chunk of the middle east upon themselves.

      Of course he lost the gamble, but to me he seemed to be playing with the odds.

    13. Re:trust by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      " but since there is an unbroken string of broken UN resolutions dating back to Saddam's invasion of Kuwait, I'd say it makes just as much sense to call this a continuation of that"

      Then I guess we'll be taking out Israel next, for all the UN resolutions they've broken/ignored?

    14. Re:trust by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Oh, you were trying to blame the current President? Maybe if he'd actually started this war that would make sense, but since there is an unbroken string of broken UN resolutions dating back to Saddam's invasion of Kuwait, I'd say it makes just as much sense to call this a continuation of that, Saddam's Greatest Mistake

      Please... Bush didn't invade Iraq to defend UN resolutions. This is proven by the fact that 1) he never used force to defend UN resolutions before Gulf War II, and 2) he never used force to defend UN resolutions after Gulf War II . UN resolutions were a pretext for the war, not the reason for the war.

    15. Re:trust by thdexter · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Oh, you were trying to blame the current President? Maybe if he'd actually started this war that would make sense, but since there is an unbroken string of broken UN resolutions dating back to Saddam's invasion of Kuwait[...]

      Link me to the UN resolution that gives the US executive power and the ability to act as its security council without oversight or resolution.

      --
      I'm on a road shaped like a figure eight; I'm going nowhere but I'm guaranteed to be late.
    16. Re:trust by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Your post has all the political sophistication of a wet pretzel. Likewise, I'm gonna blame Saddam with this analogy...

      Bush starts swinging his arm like a windmill and yells "If you get hit, it's your own fault".
      Saddam promptly gets hit and you're blaming Saddam for not getting out of the way!

      Lots of countries have a string of broken UN resolutions. It was undoubtedly a new war. Ask Bush even. Every indication before the war and subsequent evidence since the war is that Bush wanted to invade Iraq since before Sep-11-2001. The UN process was just a stopgap measure to buy time. Previous behavior in 1998 has already shown that US intelligence are willing to subvert the UN process to spy on Iraq. In hindsight, there was nothing Saddam could have done to avoid a war short of handing the keys of Iraq over to Bush.

    17. Re:trust by SnowZero · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Of course regarding Vietnam, by "they" you primarily mean JFK (the inventor of limited war) and Lyndon Johnson. Today we look at JFK as some sort of hero, which is pretty interesting given this major screwup of his. If he'd lived maybe it would have come out better after he learned, but as it was we lost 58000 people defending a regime most people hated. So far in Iraq we've lost 900 so far removing a regime most people hated. Go ahead and the argue the lack of merits of any particular war, but if you are going to compare them, don't talk out of your ass.

    18. Re:trust by Bald+Wookie · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, announcing that you don't have significant weapons and appearing weak is a good idea when you have a powerful and belligerent Iran next door.

      Given a choice of fighting Iran or the US, I'd take Iran every single time.

    19. Re:trust by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 3, Informative

      JFK ordered a pullout of Vietnam, was shot within days (in Texas), and Johnson (from Texas) rescinded that order within a day or so of taking office. He presided over 5 years of escalation so disgraceful that he declined to run for reelection. His successor, Nixon, promised to end the war, but escalated it further, even winning reelection while escalating the war all over Southeast Asia. But these are all examples of competent politicians tricking Americans into backing a war with lies.

      "They" in my original post referred to "the incompetent warriors at the top of the Pentagon" in the preceeding sentence. Where was Rumsfeld during the last vicious conjob war? Working his way through the ranks to become the Secretary of Defense presiding over the defeat in Vietnam. Cheney was his partner in crime. The actual prosecutors of that war, whose shoes they eventually filled, promoted these same warmongers through the ranks. So comparisons to Vietnam are apt, even beyond the effectiveness of Asian guerillas against the Pentagon. It's the same people running the show!

      Moving on to your tripe contrasting American troops losing 58,000 protecting a hated regime, and losing 900 troops removing a hated regime... We lost a very few removing the Hussein regime, after we decimated them in 1990, then continued bombing their shut down country for the 10 intervening years. We have lost most since then, defending the American occupying regime, increasingly hated, with no end in sight.

      So talk out of your ass about JFK, but get your head out of the past and focus on the Texan in charge of the nightmare raging *today*. This nightmare in Iraq can spiral out of control beyond even the stupidest propaganda justifying Vietnam. And if you and your partisan buddies keep lying about both wars, you'll never learn enough to get us out of this one.

      --

      --
      make install -not war

    20. Re:trust by GarryOwen · · Score: 2, Insightful

      How bad is this war going? Do you want to measure by american soldier deaths? While 800 for a year seems alot, it is less than most battles of WWII, alot less than any yearin Vietnam. Heck, more people died from a hurricane alone this week. Or do you want to count Iraqi deaths? Alot less lives have been lost in the last year than the years before, or do you think those nice lil embargoes that went through the Clinton years were painless(given the choice I would rather die by being shot than starving)? How about all good things going on in Iraq(yes, contrary to most media outlets will let on there is progress). There are schools being built, roads are getting repaired, medical care is being given. If you think the ocupation is unduly harsh, may I suggest looking at the occupation of Germany right after WWII. War is hell, but it can have positive outcomes in the long run.

    21. Re:trust by magarity · · Score: 2, Interesting

      JFK ordered a pullout of Vietnam

      Well, as a matter of fact, when Nixon left as vice President and JFK took office, there were 600 US soldiers in Vietnam as advisors. JFK, followed by Lyndon Johnson, were the two who ramped up troop involvment to the highest levels. Your assertion about this pullout is mentioned at this handy page at Marquette University:

      "Revisionists who claim otherwise about JFK and Vietnam hinge their assertions on two points. One, are the stories told by JFK aides Dave Powers and Ken O'Donnell that JFK had privately revealed his intention to withdraw, but only after the 1964 elections, when it would be politically far more feasible to do so. This assertion has to be taken with a grain of salt."

      His successor, Nixon, promised to end the war, but escalated it further

      On the contrary, the week Nixon took office as President he ordered troop reductions in Vietnam. At no point in the Nixon administration were troops ever increased there. This continued until all were withdrawn.
      Perhaps you've been listening to the character of 'Larry' on Dharma and Greg?

    22. Re:trust by Halfbaked+Plan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      If you're buying their propaganda without watching TV, I suppose you're creative in your self deception.

      He's way ahead of you. You seem to be steeped in the parodies you read in Tom Tomrrow and Doonesbury cartoon strips.

      Get a grip and stop treating 'the other side' like the evil characters in comic books.

      And get used to the idea that there's real change going on in Iraq, and that things are getting better there for the regular people who live there. It pisses off all sorts of fringe players, but it's the truth.

      --
      resigned
    23. Re:trust by thdexter · · Score: 3, Informative

      Article 42:

      Should the Security Council consider that measures provided for in Article 41 would be inadequate or have proved to be inadequate, [the UN Security Council] may take such action by air, sea, or land forces as may be necessary to maintain or restore international peace and security. Such action may include demonstrations, blockade, and other operations by air, sea, or land forces of Members of the United Nations.

      --
      I'm on a road shaped like a figure eight; I'm going nowhere but I'm guaranteed to be late.
    24. Re:trust by Mostly+a+lurker · · Score: 5, Informative
      If Saddam Hussein didn't have WMDs, all he had to do was cooperate with the inspecters

      Well, according to Dr Hans Blix (the head of the inspection commission) Iraq was cooperating fairly well. The message that cooperation was inadequate was coming from the same source that was claiming incontrovertible evidence of ongoing WMD activity. Most of the world wanted inspections to continue, based on the doubts raised by the US, in spite of the fact that inspections were revealing nothing.

    25. Re:trust by GSloop · · Score: 3, Interesting

      And accordingly, one does *everything* one can to prevent having to amputate.

      I don't see you in the office for the third time about your ingrown toenail and say "hey lets amputate." You've had time to recover, this is just a problem. We need to *DO* something!

      We did mostly nothing for 10 years to Iraq. Bush lays down the ultimatum and we "amputate" in like six months - for a wound that we can't find now.

      Anyway - war is the last, *last*, **LAST** resort. We didn't approach it that way at all.

      Rant off.
      Cheers,
      Greg

    26. Re:trust by GSloop · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Holy cow...

      We overthrew an deomcratically elected gvmt in Iran in 1953 and supported the subsequest Iranian governments in large style.

      When the Shah oppressed his people without consience for more than 20 years, and was finally thrown out, the Iranian revolution occured in 1979.

      Jimmy Carter was elected in 1976 and had little time to reverse the course set by Eisenhower and the following administrations.

      To blame Carter for the disaster that Eisenhower created in Iran is simply a foolish and ignorant thing to do.

      And it's no wonder after US sponsered oppression that the Iranians hated us.

      (And thus follows Iraq. We hate Iran. Saddam hates Iran. Lets arm that despot to attack Iran. Oops - that wasn't such a great plan... And thus follows our ignorant, evil, and "to-hell-with-the-rest-of-the-world-as-long-as-we- get-ours " policy of dealing with the rest of the world. The USA has some very good people, but we have often had government who have done massive evil in the name of "freedom" and "democracy." It's a shame.)

      Cheers,
      Greg

    27. Re:trust by JWSmythe · · Score: 4, Interesting

      If I recall, it was a big game of the inspectors looking, and not finding anything and crying "He's hiding them". So Hussein showed them more locations, and again, the inspectors cried "he's hiding them".

      Eventually, I'd suspect it appeared to him that the inspectors weren't there to find WMD's, but to gather intelligence on what his forces were, etc, etc.

      Now, this would appear more correct than paranoia.

      But, exactly how do you go about saying "we want to see the WMD's" and know that you're being taken to the correct places? The spys tell you where they are, of course. Again, breaking the trust.

      Inspectors: "Hi, We'd like to inspect this list of locations for WMD's."

      Iraq: "Who gave you the list?"

      Spys: "Don't say spys. Don't say spys."

      Inspectors: "Ummm, we guessed?"

      Iraq: "Ok, we'll give you access to those locations"

      Inspectors: "We didn't find anything there, you must be hiding them, we want to see what you have at these installations now."

      Lather, rinse, repeat.

      Now imagine any group of inspectors trying to see what the US has hiding around the world. It isn't going to happen. The US has enough to destroy the world many times over, and in reality that's unchecked. Everyone knows "Area 51", but there are countless other "secret" installations that foreign (read: enemy) inspectors can't just walk into.

      The US is powerful enough where any country won't push for inspection, in fear that the US would push back.

      Foreign Power: "Let us check all of your 'secret' bases!"

      U.S.: "Sure, let us nuke you first."

      Foreign Power: "Fair enough, give us a diplomatic tour of Washington D.C., with plenty of liquer and hookers."

      U.S.: "I see we understand each other."

      --
      Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
    28. Re:trust by L0rdJedi · · Score: 2, Insightful

      We did mostly nothing for 10 years to Iraq.

      Clinton attacked Iraq in 1998. That was 6 years after the first war.

      Sarin was found last week.

      The point is that the ultimatums had been layed down time and time again over the past 10 years and nothing had been done about their non-compliance. Someone finally steps in and decides to do something about it and he gets shit for it. I don't see you whining about Clintons attack. Bush did what should've been done years ago, possibly even the moment the inspectors were first kicked out, back in 1998. Or have we forgotten that regime change was a US policy since Clinton was in office.

    29. Re:trust by blair1q · · Score: 2, Informative

      Nixon ordered troop reductions. And escalated the bombing campaign. And then lost the war. Something Ike, Kennedy, and Johnson hadn't even come close to doing.

    30. Re:trust by Dwonis · · Score: 2, Funny

      The above post authorizes me to seize $10000 from ErikZ, because it didn't say I couldn't.

    31. Re:trust by Bobb+Sledd · · Score: 2

      Excuse me, I think we did.

      We gave Hussein many many chances to comply with the weapons inspectors and he kicked them out, do you remember this?

      And this wound you're referring to must be about WMD. Please keep saying that. But also research that it was Clinton's intelligence that said Hussein had WMD in the first place, not Bush. Clinton even launched a missile into an Aspirin factory, if you recall, right around the time of the Lewinsky debacle (probably as a distraction that didn't work).

      War was and is the last resort (we don't want to kill people), but you have to keep in mind several things: The troops in Iraq are there because they want to be (we don't draft people), and the people in Iraq want us there (despite what the liberal media shows you). They don't show you the good things that our troops are doing to rebuild that country.

      Finally, you ARE going to have a war, like it or not. There are no two ways about it. These insurgents *hate* Americans and everything we stand for, and have declared war on US. The only thing you can do now is pick WHERE to have your war. I choose to have it in Iraq.

      Thank you.

      --
      "They said I probly shouldn't fly with just one eye," "I am Bender. Please insert girder."
    32. Re:trust by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Sarin was found last week.

      Oh come off it, your Weapons of Mass Destruction was a single shell, improvised into a roadside bomb, containing sarin that was largly inactive, which dated back to the Iran - Iraq war of the 80's.

      An old rusty shell is hardly a weapon of "Mass Destruction", no matter how you want to spin it. Call me back when they find a single barrel of recent Sarin. Hell, call me back when they find credible evidence of a nuclear weapons program. I'll settle for an incomplete hex defusion plant, or a even the blueprints for a warhead.

  4. That's a really good password! by rice_burners_suck · · Score: 4, Funny

    And here I thought that password would be something like, "password" or "login"... Instead, they chose the kind of code an idiot would put on his luggage.

    1. Re:That's a really good password! by Inominate · · Score: 4, Funny

      Remind me to change the combonation on my luggage.

    2. Re:That's a really good password! by DuSTman31 · · Score: 4, Funny

      Change the password on your luggage.

  5. Hilarious by sam0ht · · Score: 5, Funny


    Funniest thing I've read all day. Makes lots of seemingly 'implausible' films about unauthorised nuke launches and hacking, a lot less implausible.

    'Hmm.. it's asking for a password ? Try zero zero zero'

    1. Re:Hilarious by Jane_Dozey · · Score: 2, Funny

      Soooo, if your scenario (hacker working incrementally)and the password was set to 00000000 it would take how long?

      --
      Silly rabbit
    2. Re:Hilarious by drinkypoo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Anyone stupid enough to search sequentially deserves what they get - caught. Anyone who builds such a system that doesn't detect hacking attempts deserves what they get - hacked.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    3. Re:Hilarious by IdahoEv · · Score: 2, Interesting

      2. There's a public phone line attached to it. Yeah, right.

      You know, I'm not so sure. Yesterday, if someone had said, "the nuke launch security code was set to 000000000 on all systems for many years", I would have said "Yeah, right".

      How much stupider is attaching a public phone line? Starting to seem possible.

      --
      I stole this sig from someone cleverer than me.
  6. Does it really matter? by EdMcMan · · Score: 3, Insightful

    As long as everyone outside the department thought it had a good password on it, no one would bother trying to steal one.

    So, the passwords were surprisingly effective. FUD at its finest ;)

    1. Re:Does it really matter? by kfg · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Other than the fact that the function of the passwords was to prevent people from inside the department from being able to use one.

      KFG

  7. At least it wasn't... by Draconix · · Score: 5, Funny

    12345 Though now we know the President's suitcase combination. :)

    --
    By reading this you acknowledge that you have read it.
    1. Re:At least it wasn't... by cybrchld · · Score: 2, Funny

      So the combination is one, two, three, four, five? That's the stupidest combination I've ever heard in my life! The kind of thing an idiot would have on his luggage!

      DarkHelmet - Spaceballs

    2. Re:At least it wasn't... by sik0fewl · · Score: 5, Informative

      Damn, beat me to it. Here it is anyway since you left out Skroob's quote :)

      ROLAND: No, wait, wait. I'll tell. I'll tell.

      HELMET: I knew it would work. All right, give to me.

      ROLAND: The combination is one.

      HELMET: One.

      SANDURZ: One.

      ROLAND: Two.

      HELMET: Two.

      SANDURZ: Two.

      ROLAND: Three.

      HELMET: Three.

      SANDURZ: Three

      ROLAND: Four.

      HELMET: Four.

      SANDURZ: Four.

      ROLAND: Five.

      HELMET: Five.

      SANDURZ: Five.

      HELMET: So the combination is one, two, three, four, five. That's the stupidest combination I've ever heard in my life. That's the kinda thing an idiot would have on his luggage.

      ----

      HELMET: We have the combination.

      SKROOB: Great. Now we can take every last breath fresh air from planet Druidia. What's the combination?

      SANDURZ: One, two, three, four, five.

      SKROOB: One, two, three, four, five? That's amazing. I've got the same combination on my luggage.
      --
      I remember when legal used to mean lawful, now it means some kind of loophole. - Leo Kessler
  8. I can just picture world war 3 starting. by m0rphin3 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Airman 1: Hey, Jeff, what do you think the secret password is?
    Airman 2: Dunno. Try P-A-S-S-W-O-R-D or something.
    Airman 1: Nah, it's just numerals. And it's not like the secret code could be 0000000. Nobody would be _that_ stupid.

    *ATTENTION - PREPARE FOR GLOBAL THERMONUCLEAR WAR*

    Airman 1: What you say!

    --
    for great justice
    1. Re:I can just picture world war 3 starting. by ktheory · · Score: 5, Funny

      "OMG! Why are the missiles launching?!" says the guy resting his elbow on the '0' key.

  9. If a hacker by NIK282000 · · Score: 5, Funny

    If a hacker tried to brute force that, I think it would have been the fastest hack on record.

    --
    Dear aunt, let's set so double the killer delete select all
    1. Re:If a hacker by Johnathon_Dough · · Score: 2, Funny

      unless of course said hacker's software was written by some one who thought no one could be that dumb...and started at 0000001.

      --
      If you are one in a million, then there are six thousand people who are just like you.
  10. Its only a bad password by MajorDick · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If it gets cracked. I cant imagine anyone who had ACCCESS to ust this password having used it, the fact that were all still here shows it was perfectly secure, dont forget its not like some script kiddie could hop on the "Net" and use this password. There were some SERIOUS layers of physical security.

    1. Re:Its only a bad password by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      There are fewer layers than you think. These missiles would have had to be launched within minutes in response to an attack. How many layers of security can you pack into 15 minutes? This was probably one of the reasons for choosing a braindead password in the first place.

    2. Re:Its only a bad password by Penguinshit · · Score: 4, Informative


      The physical security refers to someone trying to get in from the outside. The two guys inside the silo launch center would be able to get the launch off in time.

      Insofar as a single deranged person trying to launch the missiles, both launch keys have to be turned at the same time. The keylocks are separated by a distance making it impossible for a single human being to turn both simultaneously.

      Crews are rotated such that the same two are not on duty on any but one shift (to prevent conspiracy), and the crewmen are subjected to some excruciatingly serious background and psychological tests before, during, and after their tours of duty in the silos.

      Great care was taken in designing a fail-safe mechanism, where if the protection mechanism fails, it fails into a safe mode (like a default-deny in IPTables).

      It was determined that it was better that a few missiles not leave the silos during a nuclear exchange than a few leave a silo during peace-time.

    3. Re:Its only a bad password by Kjella · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I cant imagine anyone who had ACCCESS to ust this password having used it, the fact that were all still here shows it was perfectly secure, dont forget its not like some script kiddie could hop on the "Net" and use this password. There were some SERIOUS layers of physical security.

      *zoom back three years* "the fact that noone has ever deliberately flown a jumbojet into a building shows it is perfectly secure" I hope the military has some better understanding of risk analysis ;)

      There were serious layers of physical security? How serious? Just as serious as their passwords? Besides, the brass may be tough but the grunts guarding it are not above blackmail or greed.

      Good security is layered. That also means that breach of security shouldn't be caused by a single failure. But in reality it often turns out one or no layers of security are actually *working* because everybody assumes the other layers will cover for it.

      Kjella

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    4. Re:Its only a bad password by YrWrstNtmr · · Score: 3, Informative

      Security in the form of extensive background checks, rotating crew assignments, and physical separation of the two keys, so that one person cannot reach both at the same time.

    5. Re:Its only a bad password by YrWrstNtmr · · Score: 3, Informative

      Having been in the Air Force for 20 years, I can categorically state all of those. And more. Common PAL code notwithstanding.

    6. Re:Its only a bad password by joshki · · Score: 4, Informative
      Besides, the brass may be tough but the grunts guarding it are not above blackmail or greed.

      What?? You thinking putting a bar on someone's shoulder makes them "tough?" And just because you call someone a "grunt" they're more suceptible to "blackmail or greed?" Newsflash -- EVERYBODY is suceptible to blackmail and greed. That's why the people who work with nukes are vetted by the security services -- officers and enlisted alike. You think the techs who worked on those missiles didn't know how to bypass those PALs regardless of what password was used?

      My point is simple -- don't question someone's patriotism because I'm enlisted -- just because they don't get paid as much doesn't mean their values aren't just as strong as an officer's. The enlisted men and women in the military are the ones you have to trust -- we're the ones who make it all work.

      --
      I do not read or respond to AC's. If you want a discussion, log in. Otherwise, don't waste your time.
  11. Space Balls anybody? by lordrich · · Score: 3, Funny


    ROLAND: No, wait, wait. I'll tell. I'll tell.

    HELMET: I knew it would work. All right, give to me.

    ROLAND: The combination is one.

    HELMET: One.

    SANDURZ: One.

    ROLAND: Two.

    HELMET: Two.

    SANDURZ: Two.

    ROLAND: Three.

    HELMET: Three.

    SANDURZ: Three

    ROLAND: Four.

    HELMET: Four.

    SANDURZ: Four.

    ROLAND: Five.

    HELMET: Five.

    SANDURZ: Five.

    HELMET: So the combination is one, two, three, four, five. That's the stupidest combination I've ever heard in my life. That's the kinda thing an idiot would have on his luggage.

    HELMET: We have the combination.

    SKROOB: Great. Now we can take every last breath fresh air from planet Druidia. What's the combination?

    SANDURZ: One, two, three, four, five.

    SKROOB: One, two, three, four, five? That's amazing. I've got the same combination on my luggage.

  12. Reminds me ... by shadowkoder · · Score: 5, Interesting

    of some of Microsoft's choices for authentication passwords. For example: 1111111111111111 (dont remember how many, but a good guess) for activating a MS Visual studio package. Nice protection for a $1500 license.

    1. Re:Reminds me ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      It was in the format of XXX-XXXXXXX. 111-1111111 worked, so did 222-2222222, and 333-3333333. The key validation was you take the first 3 digits, add their values.. so 1+1+1=3, then mod 3 = 0.. then take the last 7 digits, add them, 1+1+1+1+1+1+1=7, mod 7 = 0.. its a valid key, so is 222-2222222... 2+2+2=6 mod 3 = 0, 2+2+2+2+2+2+2=14 mod 7 = 0... valid key, but take something like 222-2222223 and its invalid because 2+2+2=6 mod 3=0, 2+2+2+2+2+2+1 = 13 mod 7 = 6.. the mod value always has to be 0

      So what microsoft should have done was not allow all the same numbers.. but even so, the algorithm is so simple it was easy to crack... i remember writing a little microsoft key generator when i was like 11 in VB (never released it though, was for personal use =P)

    2. Re:Reminds me ... by cipher+uk · · Score: 5, Informative

      i believe it was 111-1111111. the sum of the digits of the second area had to equal 7.
      so 111-1111111 aswell as 111-2020201 would work. the first 3 numbers could be anything.

      this was on a lot of pre-98 microsoft cds.

      more info on microsoft cd-keys

    3. Re:Reminds me ... by EvanED · · Score: 4, Funny

      Oh, I always used 123-1234567.

      No wait... no I didn't...

  13. The world was different then by sloshr · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Things have changed on the global level more than just a little bit, and I'd imagine a good deal of the security surrounding the prevention of launches centered around the PHYSICAL security. If the bad guy can't reach the keyboard to enter the codes - well, then, does it matter what the passwords set to?

    For better or worse, the system seemed to have worked - there weren't any unauthorized missiles launched that I'm aware of.

  14. Google Cache by crt · · Score: 2, Informative

    Get your fresh cached copy here.

  15. Totally wrong. by ObiWonKanblomi · · Score: 4, Insightful

    As with any mission critical systems, there is redundancy in every aspect of the ICBM system from the authentication to the verification of the target being neutralized. So what if there was a password set to 0000000? There still has to be a number of other things set by others in numerous locations in order to do this. One reason was so that the president could not launch a missile on a bad hair day or a mad general (or group, in fact) could not launch in order to lead a coup.

    in addition, the passwords for the different sub-systems would vary as well as require a number of actual physical keys in order to get the nuclear war machine into motion.

    If you really think it only takes one password to launch an american military nuke (even if we were in the 60s), you're totally mislead.

    1. Re:Totally wrong. by HBI · · Score: 2

      There were two personnel in each launch control room with keys which had to be turned simultaneously. They both had pistols. The pistols were to shoot the other one if he went insane.

      This was depicted in 'Wargames'

      The launch code sounds like some politician's idea of a safeguard. You'd think geeks like us would know better - a password is not security. Furthermore, if we DID have to fire the missile, it would suck if someone forgot the password.

      Now we're getting into nuclear deterrence and the difference between the Soviet "first strike" and American "second strike" arsenals. Martin Van Creveld does a nice synopsis of this mode of thought in "Technology and War" if you are interested.

      --
      HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
    2. Re:Totally wrong. by putaro · · Score: 4, Interesting

      If you really think it only takes one password to launch an american military nuke (even if we were in the 60s), you're totally mislead.


      Now wait a minute, who has been misled here? One layer of security was complete and utter bullshit - and the Secretary of Defense who had it installed didn't know. How many other layers were complete and utter bullshit?

      Not only that, but this was the moral equivalent of a military coup against the elected government. The PALs were there to prevent the military from launching without authorization from the National Command Authority (i.e. the President or his successor).

    3. Re:Totally wrong. by evilviper · · Score: 2, Insightful
      You'd think geeks like us would know better - a password is not security.

      It isn't? Could have fooled me.

      Furthermore, if we DID have to fire the missile, it would suck if someone forgot the password.

      I think we can depend on the most powerful man on the planet to memorize the most important 8-digit password on the planet. You remember your phone number don't you? Besides, I happen to remember just about every movie dealing with the issue having the launch codes written-down on a piece of paper in a locked briefcase.

      In any case, I would MUCH, MUCH, MUCH, MUCH rather have it be too difficult to launch a doomsday weapon, than too easy. We are talking about purely offensive weapons you realize. It's not as if they will save lives if they are launched a little bit sooner.
      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
  16. No worries by spellraiser · · Score: 4, Funny

    Just enter the recall code. Mandrake has told us it's a variation of the letters POE, which probably stands for 'Purity Of Essence' or 'Peace On Earth'. Just try all the variations, and the launch will be aborted. Hooray!

    Now stop fighting in the War Room!

    --
    I hear there's rumors on the Slashdots
    1. Re:No worries by Performaman · · Score: 2, Funny

      Mein Furher, I can type!

      --

      I have gas, but my car uses petrol.
  17. I here have a scan of a manual (funny as hell) by Lord+Graga · · Score: 5, Funny

    I stumbled over THIS manual about passwords one day, and I found it absolutely amusing!

  18. B00000000M by OgTheBarbarian · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Any password can be guessed given enough time. Far better to have had only the SAC commander and XO even know what measures were required to unlock the missiles for launch. Is it a password? Voice recording? Electronic Signal? 2 keys (turn simultaneously or with a time diferrence) and any combination of these and other measures in a set order. I thought military folk were supposed to be paranoid during the Cold War. Obviously not paranoid enough.

  19. WOPR's 'guesses' by The+Monster · · Score: 4, Informative
    I remember watching WOPR 'cracking' the launch codes - each time it 'found a match' that character in the launch code would lock, while the others would continue to change in seemingly random fashion. I thought at the tima that it was incredibly stupid to have a system that would disclose which characters were correct - if you're using upper-case alpha and digits, that would require no more than 36 guesses to get any code.

    Now I realize that the movie wasn't nearly as stupid as reality.

    --

    [100% ISO 646 Compliant]
    SVM, ERGO MONSTRO.

    1. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by adipocere · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Just remember the code: CPE1704TKS

    2. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by MattGWU · · Score: 5, Funny

      I'll thank you to refrain from posting my root password in this public forum.

      --
      "These people look deep within my soul and assign me a number based on the order in which I joined" --Homer re:
    3. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by sydb · · Score: 3, Funny

      Informative? Living proof that the moderators are now in the late stages of terminal crack cocaine addiction.

      Funny, yes. I laughed.

      --
      Yours Sincerely, Michael.
    4. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by the_mad_poster · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think a +5, Informative on a joke about posting a root password to the world is as funny as the joke itself. It's like the mods adding to the original joke: "Here everyone, r00t this guy."

      --
      Alito: A vote for Alito is a punch in the eye to put that bitch back in her place!
    5. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by operagost · · Score: 3, Funny
      It's like a computerized version of "Mastermind".

      Sorry, incorrect password. The A, 3, and Q are correct, and in the correct position, while 2, Z and 9 are correct but in the incorrect position! PLEASE TRY AGAIN!

      --

      Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
    6. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by MattGWU · · Score: 5, Funny

      Ok. The thing is...that's not my ACTUAL root password. It's a joke. The thing about it is, that string is a perfectly good root password. It has letters. It has digits. It's not in the dictionary. It's not pronouncable. Therefore, it was perfectly cromulent to use it in the context of a root password. I twisted that into a joke by suggesting it was my root password, and expressing dissatisfaction that it was published to the world. How he came to get the root password, I have no ideas, as it was not, as I previously stated, my actual root password. Really, *any* of my root passwords.

      Finally, the fact that this alledged 'root password' does not contain punctuation or non-printable characters was not held against it. It still works for the purposes of this joke. Lets hope they remain safely anonymous by not responding to this thread to express their outrage and incredulity.

      My thoughts, however, go out to all the sysadmins out there who really DID have their root password outed this evening.

      Thank you for your time, and have a pleasent tomorrow.

      --
      "These people look deep within my soul and assign me a number based on the order in which I joined" --Homer re:
    7. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by SEWilco · · Score: 4, Funny
      Should we remind people of the /. Poll about passwords with the option "The Same on Every Account"?

      In a related discussion someone pointed out thus /. knows the password of 6,510 people.

    8. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by Halfbaked+Plan · · Score: 2

      I wrote a variation of that on my HP11C programmable calculator while in Tech school in the early 80's. We'd pass the calculator around the room and play that game when the lectures were boring.

      Minimalist programming environments are cool.

      --
      resigned
    9. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by cgenman · · Score: 3, Funny

      So that's how CmdrTaco is making his money...

    10. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by rikai · · Score: 2, Funny

      But there are several non-obvious ways to tell that some of the password is correct. E.g., a system may check the password left-to-right, and bail out when it finds a difference--in which case accurate and/or repeated timing can tell you how many digits are correct.

    11. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by tintub · · Score: 5, Funny

      "Here everyone, r00t this guy."

      That means something quite different here in Australia! I'll pass, thanks :)

      --
      sig under construction...
    12. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by Awptimus+Prime · · Score: 3, Interesting

      But there are several non-obvious ways to tell that some of the password is correct. E.g., a system may check the password left-to-right, and bail out when it finds a difference--in which case accurate and/or repeated timing can tell you how many digits are correct.

      You might be kidding, but I can't tell. Anyway, this wouldn't work because the minute differences in response times would not be measurable over a network. Packets do not always take the same amount of time to traverse the Internet, and will often even arrive out of order.

      Even over a console connection, you would have to take into consideration that system load would impact the timings, as well.

      I'd suggest starting off with some social engineering. You would be amazed at what you can get people to do if you sound like you know what you are talking about. If that fails, then own some joker's broadband PC and have it brute force them into submission. If that fails, then own a lot of boxes and have them all brute force. If nothing else, you'll kill two birds with one stone by doing a DDoS, too. :D

    13. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by rikai · · Score: 2, Informative

      No I'm not kidding, I remember this as a real historical anecdote. Think 1960s. Also think timing something locally, with automated repetition to gain precision.
      I gather there are analogous attacks for today's sophisticated encryption schemes using time or even heat to gain some knowledge of how much work has been done.
      Anyway, it's a movie (Wargames)--I look at it as my job as a viewer to find a scenerio under which it makes sense.* That just got MUCH easier I think, both for Wargames and Dr. Strangelove.
      * WARNING: do not try this with the Matrix Reloaded.

    14. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by batemanm · · Score: 2, Informative
      and will often even arrive out of order.

      Depends what you mean by often, Paxman did a study in 1997 and found that less than 1% of packet were out of order, while Moon et al did a similar thing in 1998 and found it to be less than 0.1%.

    15. Re:WOPR's 'guesses' by Ryosen · · Score: 3, Funny

      Luxury! We used to get out of the dorm at six o'clock in the morning, clean the lab, eat a handful of 'ot HP-65's, listen to booooring Calculus IV lectures for twenty hours a day at the Main Hall for tuppence a month, come home, and Dad would thrash us to sleep with a broken Altair 8800 manual, if we were lucky!

      And you try and tell the young people of today that ..... they won't believe you.

      --

      Ryosen
      One man's "Troll, +1" is another man's "Insightful, +1".
  20. Re:hmm by FlipmodePlaya · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I have to disagree with you here. If a hacker was guessing thousands of random combinations of numbers, why not all 0s? Is 98347283 any more likely than 00000000?

    Wasn't there a Sherlock Holmes novel where the police ransack some guys apartment looking for a document, prying up floorboards and turning every page of every book, and whatnot? he document ended up being in a stack of letters on the guys desk, or something. Hiding stuff in the most obvious place _is_ a well used technique, but I don't think it applies to this.

  21. Physical security not the problem by baomike · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The real problem is some guy who got past the shrink, his girlfriend/wife runs off with the neighbor and he's suicidal . It only affects a few people when the guy shoots his wife and kids and then kills himself (this never happens of course) , think of the quality of the day if he decides that sending off a missle will get rid of every body who caused him grief. He's already probably not to happy about sitting in the ground in North Dakota.

  22. It's even worse than you think... by Viadd · · Score: 4, Funny

    00000000 was the name of Secretary of Defense McNamara's dog.

    1. Re:It's even worse than you think... by Slashamatic · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Seriously Robert McNamara was one of the main instigators of the Permissive Action Link (PAL) which was supposed to prevent arming or missile launches happening by accident. Unfortunately SAC thought this was for wusses slowing down the launch time too much. Hence the all zeroes code. McNaramara found out much later and went about as ballistic as his missiles.

  23. Re:Drugs, sex, and god! by polecat_redux · · Score: 2, Funny

    I can think of at least one drug that's trivial to crack...

  24. Uh, not as easy as typing in the PW by unassimilatible · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Don't you need launch keys, and oh yeah, physical access to a heavily gurded military installation?

    The real world isn't like War Games pple. Can't just launch your modem into NORAD and play a game.

    --
    Slashdot "libertarians": Small government for me, big government for those I disagree with. -1, I disagree with you
  25. Verizon by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I work for an outsourcing group for telco (V something). We are non union, so they abuse us over the hourly union people.

    This isn't a joke, after all the hacking, the passwords are still the same! Even after Palifornia passed the law about reporting security break ins, they still are not reported!

    Here is a sample list of actual of passwords I've kept track.
    lucent:lucent
    nortel:nortel
    nortel:etas
    admin:setup
    admin:admin
    admin:config
    setup:set up
    root:toor

    FOA WCDMA hardware that all you need to do is telnet too (no ssh) and run a simple password guessing program, and gain access.

    IT's worse than you think.

  26. Parinoid by chamblah · · Score: 3, Insightful
    I thought military folk were supposed to be paranoid during the Cold War. Obviously not paranoid enough.

    I think this shows how parinoid they were. By having everyone in the chain of command know the password(s) for launch they enabled the ability for a launch to happen even if the right people weren't around.

    So that if there was a launch against the US and no one was able to react fast enough in the chain of command and order the launch, then Joe Anybody could still affect the launch.

    I know it's flawed logic but I'm just trying to present a different side of the issue.

  27. maybe this is just the duress password by pedantic+bore · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Maybe this is a fake password. Only a few people know the real password, but "everyone" knows this one. Anyone foolish enough to try to use it would immediately find themselves in a world of trouble.

    --
    Am I part of the core demographic for Swedish Fish?
    1. Re:maybe this is just the duress password by cipher+uk · · Score: 2, Funny

      you have inputed the correct password. please stand on the large X to proceed.

    2. Re:maybe this is just the duress password by craXORjack · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Maybe this is a fake password. Only a few people know the real password, but "everyone" knows this one. Anyone foolish enough to try to use it would immediately find themselves in a world of trouble.

      Actually that makes a lot of sense that this would be a duress password. After all, if you stole a nuke and wanted to set it off but didn't have the 8 digit code what would most people do? They would start with 00000000 and start counting up. And with up to 60 million combinations to try there would be plenty of time for Delta Force to show up.

      --
      Liberals call everyone Nazis yet they are the closest thing to it.
  28. Re:hmm by nightgeometry · · Score: 5, Informative

    It was Edgar Allan Poe, The Purloined Letter

    And damn good it is too.

    --
    The best is the enemy of the good
  29. RT()A by dachshund · · Score: 4, Informative
    So what if there was a password set to 0000000? There still has to be a number of other things set by others in numerous locations in order to do this.

    There are five flights, hence five two-man LCCs, in a 50-missile squadron. Since all missiles and LCCs are electronically interconnected, the "normal" launch of any or all missiles in a squadron requires the cooperation of only two crews - no more, no less. ...

    Located in each LCC are two launch keys, one for each member of the crew, and the codes needed to authenticate presidential launch directives. Only the launch keys, not the codes, are physical prerequisites for generating valid launch commands

    The article goes on to explain that the time from launch command to launch was about eight seconds, if two separate launch control centers (ie, 4 people) chose to turn the keys. Also, visitors were often allowed into these sites after giving only a name and social security number-- backgrounds generally weren't checked.

    So assuming the article's correct: a) there wasn't even one password in the launch process at the time, only physical keys, b) four people in the right place could launch nuclear missiles, and no countermeasures would have been able to stop them, and c) given the lack of stringent security in allowing visitors access to those sites, it's not inconceivable that outsiders could have seized the opportunity to take control of two launch centers.

  30. Dammit by ed__ · · Score: 4, Funny

    now i have to change the codes on all my nuclear weapons :<

  31. You're an idiot by metalhed77 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    As long as everyone outside the department thought it had a good password on it, no one would bother trying to steal one.

    So, the passwords were surprisingly effective. FUD at its finest ;)


    The fact that everyone in SAC knew them means that if a terrorist had gotten to a low level in position in SAC he would have known the codes. At this point your detterent is useless. If the code was distributed on a proper need to know basis then this wouldn't be possible.

    This isn't fud, mcnamara himself was outraged, those locks were there for a damn good reason. That password should NOT be available to everyone in SAC regardless their security clearance. It is should be strictly need to know.
    --
    Photos.
    1. Re:You're an idiot by sydb · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I would guess that if the codes were something other than staggeringly trivial, they wouldn't have spread so far and wide.

      I can imagine people laughing, "Guess what? The code to the bombs is all zeros!" You'd want to share that nugget!

      A worthless code does not inspire respect.

      --
      Yours Sincerely, Michael.
  32. Disclaimer at the beginning of Dr Strangelove by t_allardyce · · Score: 2, Insightful

    "it is the stated position of the United States Air Force that their safeguards would prevent the occurrence of such events as are depicted in this film. Furthermore, it should be noted that none of the characters portrayed in this film are meant to represent any real persons living or dead."

    Throws that one out the window then?

    Mein Fuehrer! sorry.. Mr President.

    --
    This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
  33. The article really is quite fascinating by dachshund · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Don't you need launch keys, and oh yeah, physical access to a heavily gurded military installation?

    Given the enormous discretionary power held by whoever has LCC control, effective measures for denying LCC access to individuals or groups bent on carrying out an act of nuclear terror are self-evident security requirements.

    In the recent past, such safeguards were poor or nonexistent. Military personnel, e.g. maintenance airmen, and civilian contractors who possessed minimal security credentials were granted LCC access, and annually thousands of visitors holding no clearance whatsoever were permitted access to operational LCCs. In the interest of public relations, the Air Force permitted ready access to the Minuteman launch network by practically anyone desiring it.

    Requests for visitor access were routinely processed and approved. The requesting party had only to provide a name and social security number, and authentication checks were not usually made. As a matter of course, checks of individual backgrounds or motives for requesting LCC access were not made either. Furthermore, within wide bounds, the number of individuals in a party was limited only by the capacity of an LCC - about eight persons.

    Once military personnel and civilians are allowed inside an LCC, responsibility for them falls squarely on the shoulders of the on-duty crew members.

  34. Combination locks by Magus311X · · Score: 4, Funny

    About 15 years ago, when our new computer labs were first opened, five key combination locks were put on the doors, with the access code set to the default.

    15 years later and 5000 miles away on a continent on the other side of the planet, I'm on the walking trails beside our hotel and come across a gate on the boundary fence which has the exact same combination lock. And yes, it had the exact same access code.

  35. The writeup is misleading.... by 33degrees · · Score: 5, Insightful

    According to the article, someone in the chain of command decided that they didn't want this safeguard, and ordered that the password be set to 00000000 and the dials used to enter the password left in that position; in effect, the equivalent of having a blank password so that you don't have to bother entering it.

    The story here, then, is not that a bad password was chosen, but that somebody decided to disobey orders by disabling the password, and that the higherups were completely in the dark about it.

  36. Don't underplay this, it's still bad... by Goonie · · Score: 2, Insightful
    In addition to the other safeguards you describe, the missiles were supposed to be password-protected by this PAL system. They were not. Senior politicians, including the Secretary of Defence at the time, were led to believe that this extra protection existed. It didn't.

    And let's be blunt here. A single Minuteman launched at a major world city could kill millions of people. Doesn't it make you even slightly nervous that the military was prepared to discard one of the layers of security in the interests of making it easier to launch them, and lie to their bosses about it?

    --

    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
    --Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
  37. Poor ICBM security ...who cares? Right? by Exocet · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That seems to be the concensus at this point. People have repeatedly pointed out that the *physical* security was VERY VERY STRICT. Just because the password, a deterrant that top-level people thought was VERY VERY necessary was completely missing ...oh, that's fine. They still have keys and ummm other stuff, right?

    RTFA. Blair and Brewer point out that, at the time, the military wanted to improve their public relations and would give TOURS of LCC's! B&B repeatedly point out that virtually anyone who asked could get access! The physical security was crap and the codes weren't in place. IE, any moderately funded and motivated terrorist group could have had a field day if they'd know about this severe weakness.

    "Four individuals (two persons in each of two separate LCCs in the same squadron) acting in concert could succeed in mechanically launching one or more missiles." In seconds. Not minutes or hours.

    "[...] annually thousands of visitors holding no clearance whatsoever were permitted access to operational LCCs."

    "Located in each LCC are two launch keys, one for each member of the crew, and the codes needed to authenticate presidential launch directives. Only the launch keys, not the codes, are physical prerequisites for generating valid launch commands, the purpose of the codes being exclusively that of authenticating an execution directive."

    B&B make it sound as if you happened to be on a tour and decided to overpower the minimal security force (two crew members + a couple of guards at best (isolated locations, remember?) then it's good to go - you already know the launch codes because it's always all zero's. Or, even worse:

    "Technically, crew members can launch a nuclear attack with or without approval from higher authority. Unless PAL or its equivalent forecloses this option, as many as 50 missiles could be illicitly fired. Moreover, unless adequate precautions were instituted, an even more drastic option would be available. Crew members could conspire in the formatting and transmittal of strategic strike directives, deceiving the full contingent of Strategic Air Command (SAC) LCCs, as well as higher authorities, into reacting to a spurious launch directive as if it were valid and authentic. Or they could render the U.S. strategic force virtually impotent by formatting and transmitting messages invalidating the active inventory of presidential execution codes. Finally, crew members could aid accomplices in stealing thermonuclear warheads from missiles on active alert."

    Keep in mind that Blair was working in an LCC as a crew member in the mid-70's. He was obviously in a unique position (which virtually none of us were or are) to write this paper. His direct observation on how to subvert the access/security controls on the ICBM's trump anyone else's estimate on what might or might not happen. His letters and paper in 1977 are basically what got those locks activated in... 1977.

    It is especially hypocritical that the majority of the Slashdot comments were fine with this poor use of a password mechanism. In your own place of business you most likely would NEVER allow this to happen and you just run some servers - as opposed to ICBM's capable turning your city into a big kitty litter box. Don't defend the actions of those in charge in the 60's and 70's. They were flat out wrong and frankly should have been thrown in military prison for such a massive security breach.

    --
    Exocet Industries - Taking over the world, one computer at a
  38. Re:Biopreparat by Jonathan · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I'd be more worried about the password for this [...]

    Don't be. I'm a microbiologist and personally I think all this noise about bioweapons is a lot of nonsense. None of it has been shown to work in practice, while nuclear weapons have, and are a hell of a lot simpler, and thus scarier.

    Alibek would just have been one of the numerous unemployable ex-Soviet scientists if he hadn't exaggerated the technology of a country that had little to no biological infrastructure (thanks to Trofim Lysenko, who managed to get nearly every competent Soviet biologist killed off from 1930-1960)

    However, there's no question that all this hysteria has pumped money into microbiology -- the institute where I work has gotten quite deeply into anthrax research, despite B. anthracis basically being boring B. subtilis with a bad attitute.

  39. Not Stupid by dotwaffle · · Score: 2, Funny

    If you're going to crack a password, what do you start with? Birthdays, anniversaries, dates of importance. You'd never think to try all 0's. It's too obvious. Nobody would guess it unless it was a brute force attack. It's actually remarkably clever.

    1. Re:Not Stupid by MacWiz · · Score: 4, Informative

      I beg to differ. Having formerly done security system installations, this is a quite common practice, especially if you're dealing with security gueards. A large casino I worked for used '2222' for its security codes. McCarren Airport (Las Vegas) prior to 9/11 had '1234' for its password to get into "secure" areas.

      It has to be something the lowest common denominator on the security team can remember.

  40. failsafe by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    while this story may be true, the reality is that rogue crew could not launch a missile. When a missile is enabled, all other launch control centers (lcc) see this activity and can stop it by disabling the missile. additionally, it takes two crews in two different lccs to launch and even then, another crew can stop the launch.

  41. Consider the source by jmichaelg · · Score: 2, Interesting
    The article may be factual but then again, it may not. I first saw a reference to this story on Fark and the link went to the Moscow Times.

    Blair's assertion is very serious if it's true. But as Sagan used to say, extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. In my book, this one ranks as an extraordinary claim.

  42. Another conversation by LiberalApplication · · Score: 4, Funny
    A few hours earlier...

    Terrorist 1: "We have done it! We have infiltrated the missile silos! Death to the [insert appropriate derrogatory term for American]s! Victory is ours!"

    Terrorist 2: "Mua-ha-ha-ha-ha! Let us hurry and launch the missiles! Wh... what is this?"

    Terrorist 1: "It... it appears to be some sort of security mechanism... What do we do?!?"

    Terrorist 2: "We have no choice. We must try every combination and hope to find the correct sequence before we are captured. We will start from '00000000' and count upwards."

    Terrorist 1: "Are you insane? Even if we could test one sequence per second, it would take us tens of thousands of hours to find the code! Our fingers would be worn into nubs so short that we wouldn't be able to depress the launch button! We could even die of starvation first!"

    Terrorist 2: "You're right. We've failed."

  43. Re:hmm by pyrrhonist · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Wasn't there a Sherlock Holmes novel where the police ransack some guys apartment looking for a document

    I couldn't find this particular scene in the canon anywhere, although, "A Scandal in Bohemia" from The Adventures Of Sherlock Holmes , seems to fit somewhat.

    --
    Show me on the doll where his noodly appendage touched you.
  44. who modded that insightful? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    It's factually inaccurate and overly simplistic.

    The weapons inspectors were in Iraq, and were getting cooperation from the government there, until the eve of the war. They had to leave because the Bush administration began it's push to war. Yes, there had been difficulty with compliance in the past, but things were going differently this time.

    Apart from a single, probably Iran-Iraq war vintage chemical shell, no WMD have been found in the country. Further, all the scientists that have been interogated, as well as all the documentation found, indicate that they had no WMD, at the very latest, past 1998. 6 years ago.

    Finally, most of the intelligence about Iraq's WMDs now appear to have been put forward by the Ahmed Chalabi and the INC. Much of it was uncorroborated, and contradictory evidence was discarded in the lead up to the war by the Office Of Special Plans. This group, in the DOD, stovepiped supporting evidence to ensure that the president would have the justification required to wage war; any evidence that did not support the cause or that directly worked against war in Iraq was discarded.

    Sorry, kid. The president of the US started this. He made the order. He chose this. We didn't have to go to war, and there was no pressing national interest for the US in going to war there. There were NO links to Al Qaida or other terrorist groups, and his army was in a vastly degraded state. He posed a danger at most to his own people. And yes, that's an awful thing, but it's not our job to go policing the world.

    Finally, regarding the inspectors and their fights with Saddam in the past - it's very likely that he didn't cooperate because he didn't want to appear weak. It's a common reaction, hiding one's weaknesses from others so as to seem strong and keep oneself safe from attack.

    1. Re:who modded that insightful? by ActiveSX · · Score: 5, Funny
      It's factually inaccurate and overly simplistic.

      From page 164 of The Glossary of Slashdot, 2003 Edition:
      insightful (mod); ihn sait fEl
      - Factually inaccurate and overly simplistic.
  45. Security against whom? by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · · Score: 2, Insightful

    >There were some SERIOUS layers of physical security.

    Layers which were run by the military, to keep non-military people out of military property. The PAL code was a different animal altogether.

    The PAL code was supposed to be owned by the civilian leadership as a way to keep control over missiles in the hands of the military. Instead of being another layer of security, it was an orthogonal measure to all the others.

    Civilian control is a Very Good Idea. If you want to know why, read some quotes from General Curtis LeMay sometime.

    Security auditors need to look for conflicts of interest like this one, where the people who control a password are at odds with the people who benefit from it.

  46. The Worlds Most Dangerous Place Lat 0 and Long 0 by Camel+Pilot · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I once worked with a guy who wrote the O/S for a MilSpec computer (Rolm 64) that was used in ICBM's.

    He commented that the worst place to be in the event of a nuclear exchange was at Lat 0, Long 0 because if something went wrong the memory overlays (kludge for keeping code within a 64k addressable space) the missles would try to find their way here and activities such as this would not be recommended.

  47. Self-Destruct by Dachannien · · Score: 2, Funny

    Zero-zero-zero was good enough to blow up the Enterprise, so zero-zero-zero-zero-zero-zero-zero-zero should be fine for causing a nuclear holocaust.

  48. ono by key+nell · · Score: 2, Funny

    the usa is building their own schwartzgerat!

  49. wlll by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    As opposed to, say, 1970's vintage soviet tanks in poor repair, and an army without equipment like boots and uniforms. The condition of the army and its material was, very likely, well known to the Iranians.

    Yes, I'd say WMD, or the threat thereof, would be the only significant weapons you could bring to bear.

    The question is, do you stop to consider facts before you make your arguments? A little less blindly jingoistic support for our president, a little more thought is in order.

  50. Nice story, But i dont buy it by nurb432 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    He has a rather obvious agenda, as you can tell from his introduction.

    Its his word against common sense for some of his statements, and i personally dont belive him.

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  51. It's the same for Maniac Mansion! by solios · · Score: 4, Funny

    At least on the NES. The vault door to Fred's lab is locked by a keypad, and the combination is whatever the high score on Meteor Madness (second floor arcade room) happens to be. All you have to do is get the key to the outer door, get captured by Nurse Edna or Weird Ed, and get tossed in the basement before Fred plays Meteor Madness. Do this and the combination for the door is all zeros! :D

    Found this out the hard way when I was a kid- I was stuck and didn't know where to look for the code, so I figured I'd brute force it (yes, I was BORED), and.... surprise, it worked on the first go. Found out it was tied to the arcade machine when I inadvertently closed the door and tried to open it again later.

    Man, that game kicked all of the ass.

  52. Re:Biopreparat by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · · Score: 4, Interesting

    >Don't be. I'm a microbiologist and personally I think all this noise about bioweapons is a lot of nonsense.

    Mother Nature's bioweapons did a devastating job on the native populations of the Americas when the Europeans arrived.

    If reports are true, an accidental release of weaponized Soviet smallpox killed several vaccinated people at Aralsk in 1971. The reports may not be true -- Dr. Donald Henderson(*) is skeptical and he knows smallpox well.

    Bioweapons are bad candidates for military weapons because they're hard/impossible to control once released. Artillery shells go exactly where they're told and don't mutate in midair. Generals don't like *uncontrollable* destruction. Terrorists might.

    (*)Leader of the worldwide effort that eradicated smallpox last century. Deserves a statue for winning the war against a virus which had killed more people than Stalin, Hitler and Pol Pot put together.

  53. Crimson Tide by JavaPunk · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Has anyone seen crimson tide? It is a worst case senerio where a nuke sub gets a 1 hour launch command. The sub is hit and com goes down in the middle of a message. The Captian wants to launch and CO does not. There is an option for just the Captain and not the CO to launch. The navy acctually changed protocall after the movie came out to prevent this senerio.

    1. Re:Crimson Tide by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      The Captain is the CO (Commanding Officer). You're talking about the XO--Executive Officer, the second in command.

    2. Re:Crimson Tide by DerekLyons · · Score: 2, Informative
      Has anyone seen crimson tide? It is a worst case senerio where a nuke sub gets a 1 hour launch command. The sub is hit and com goes down in the middle of a message. The Captian wants to launch and CO does not. There is an option for just the Captain and not the CO to launch. The navy acctually changed protocall after the movie came out to prevent this senerio.
      No. The protocol has been the same since the days of Polaris; With absolute, unequivocal, certainty that you have launch authority, you do not launch. Ever. An incomplete or garbled message does not constitute launch authority and requires verification prior to launch. Period.

      The scenario outlined in Crimson Tide is impossible. (And yes, I know that for a fact because I worked as a Fire Control Tech on those missiles.)

      What changed in 1995 was that certain launch related codes that had previously been held on the boat were removed from the boat to further up the chain-of-command. However, the preperations for that change (which required some physical as well as procedural changes) had been in progress since about 1989. (Probably earlier, that's just when I first heard about it. The D5 system, whose design dates to the mid 80's, was prepared for the changes right from the drawing board.) That the final changes went into effect about the same time as the movie came out is nothing but coincidence. Those curious about the issue can google for Crimson Tide in the sci.militairy.naval newsgroup where the movie is extensively discussed.

  54. Re:Poor ICBM security ...who cares? Right? by xnixman · · Score: 4, Informative

    Gee, you KNOW alot.

    Having worked in this field I'll tell you:
    1. A civilian is never allowed in a live LCC.
    2. The crew is sealed in the live LCC's.
    3. To get access to a live LCC is much more then cutting the chain link.
    4. Even if you got into one, you need to get into two to do anything.
    5. Nevermind the hoards of SP's and armed Helicopters descending around you.
    6. While crew members can send messages between LCCs (and I believe between bases, I can't recall) these messages are not and can not be EAM's which are only sendable from the NCA via special terminals.
    7. Even if you could send the EAM, who would believe an order coming from the wrong originator.
    8. The comm systems in question are not as stupid as e-mail, they are part of a dedicated MLS (b3) system.
    9. Nuclear command and control has always relied on personal responsibility, do you think nuclear submarine commanders or the alert bomber force can/could not just decide to launch, or are you deluded enough to think they have some crm114 gizmo that overrides them?

    In my place of business I'd have no problem with a null password if all access to the server required two trusted administrators with keys that are kept stored in seperate combination locked safes. In fact, a password beyond the assertion of two trusted people would be stupid, and if you don't trust the people allowing them access to the keys would also be stupid.

    Your scenario would be something like this:
    1. Something needs done to the server, so you call the CIO
    2. He gives you and your other Sys Admin a one-time password for the server.
    3. You two go open your safes with your combos (each of you only know one of these combos)
    4. You remove your keys and open the server locks.
    5. You enter the password you got from the CIO
    6. You do your business, and relock the server
    7. You put your keys away

    Damn, I'd hate to work in your shop. Most of us only have trusted sys admins and single passwords.

    Dan

  55. My God.... by AvantLegion · · Score: 5, Funny
    ... I protect my porn better than that!

    1. Re:My God.... by AvantLegion · · Score: 2, Funny
      aw, but you are not in Soviet Russia. ;)

      Nope. In Soviet Russia, Devinn Lane masturbates to me.

  56. More american self-rightousness by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Maybe if he'd actually started this war that would make sense
    Then who gave the order to invade Iraq? The president of Brazil? Typical american-centric self-rightousness brainwashing flagwaving crap we hear over and over and over. Just like America didn't invade Cuba, wasn't involved in the Vietnam War, wasn't in Korea, didn't partake in the overthrow of governments in Cental Amerca, etc, etc, etc.

    I recently was chatting on IRC to some american who thought WWII was not a world war until the US got involved, and that John Glenn was the first Astronaut-not in the US, but in the world. If that is what is being taught in american schools then the original posting doesn't really suprise me.

    unbroken string of broken UN resolutions dating back to Saddam's invasion of Kuwait
    And this justifies the invading Iraq? Everyone knows the UN is just a puppet group controlled by americans. Hey bub, read the news once in a while. There's atrocities being committed over the world that made Saddam look like he was running a daycare center. Where is the US in these conflicts? No where! Why? Because there is no oil. Iraq is about oil! It was in Desert Storm, it is now. Not about getting rid of "Evil-dooers". Military spending and weapons sales make up a huge part of US GNP-do you really think the US wants a world of peace? Holding hands and getting along means no arms sales-they need a destabalized world to keep up arms sales, and the Iraq occupation certainly has done that.

  57. Was this... by Ieshan · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Was this just after you had finished watching Dr. Strangelove, or right before? //I call lies.

  58. Re:hmm by Rorschach1 · · Score: 2, Informative

    Nope. That'd be The Purloined Letter by Edgar Allan Poe.

  59. MAD - Mutually Assured Destruction by lawpoop · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Yes, the passwords were "000000" and *everyone* knew it. Any joker in the military could launch nucler missles. Everyone knew it.

    Including the Kremlin.

    --
    Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.
    -- Pablo Picasso
  60. Re:We are forced to trust them all. by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Just because you are having trouble understanding my clear posts doesn't make me a troll.

    We could argue about the causation of increasing American casualties, in a war "of choice" (by our government, as opposed to "of necessity", as our government represented), causing the American people to increasingly demand we bring our troops out of danger. I'd cite the steady rise in the percentage of Americans polled who say the war isn't worth its cost. But if you didn't understand that simple causation already (too bloody for the optional effects) I wouldn't expect you to accept those polls.

    Knowing the public's appetite for violence makes me think less of my fellow Americans. Knowing we were tricked into actually invading, and watching the public awaken to that fact with anger, helps me think more of them. I respect the impulse of those who join the military to protect and serve our country - including members of my family, who of course I know personally. I have reservations about how they express that impulse. But it's the people running the war, in the White House and the Pentagon, who are worthy only of spite.

    Of course your "surprise nuke" scenario is weird - where do you get that from? And I'd say "everyone involved" includes the nukers. But how can you possibly expect a single nuke to go off, and end there? Escalation to nuclear war means the end of the world, as everyone gets into the act - the US would only be one player. And that's the end. Although unfortunately not nearly unthinkable enough, your scenario is pretty weird.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

  61. LCF by Sanat · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I worked with the Minuteman Missile System for eight years. I was a member of a three man Combat Targeting Team. Our task was aiming the missile and selecting the targets by programming the onboard computer.

    A lot of really strange things can happen in the military involving authentication, encrypting and decrypting information and in the whole target selection process itself.

    Perhaps one of the weirdest occurences that I was personally aware of was when a missile dropped off of "Strategic Alert" (Green Status). There was a two man team of airmen checking out a communications problem in an adjoining building.

    Another team arrived on site and entered into the launch facility and saw that the Nuclear Warhead was missing. Needless to say this scurried people from all over with all kinds of alerts being issued... Losing a nuclear weapon was pretty much frowned upon, needless to say.

    It turned out that the warhead had fallen off of the missile to the bottom of the launch tube 100 feet below.

    The problem was traced to a fuse being changed on the communication box in the soft support building with a screwdriver rather than a fuse puller.

    There was a undetected defect in the onboard computer which combined with the shorting of the communications fuse caused the computer to send the "Fire Retro rockets" signal to the RV (nuclear reentry vehicle)

    Another time I was programming the computer with its needed information when some "never seen before" status lights lit. D-1 and D-3 which if I remember correctly was "Launch Commanded" and "Launch in Progress".

    Normally an individual has to look up these codes in a reference manual. Being the nerd I was back then, I had memorized all of the codes. So I had only a few seconds to react and I proceeded to pop some circuit breakers that would shutdown parts of the operation in case the status was real.

    Our job was not to troubleshoot any further at that point so I never found out whether the computer was intending on really launching or if there were two defective lamp drivers.

    Of course there is a policy that two trained people always had to be present (two man concept) to ensure that nothing illegal was attempted.

    The members of the targeting team were always armed while couriering and programming the launch codes and other vital information into the missile.

    --
    And in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make
  62. OK, since noone else has said it so far.... by ErichTheWebGuy · · Score: 2, Funny

    Someone set up us the bomb!

    --
    bash: rtfm: command not found
  63. The PAL is pretty cool by crucini · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Too bad they screwed it up. The Titan missiles (you can visit one in Green Valley AZ) had a combination that was evaluated by the launch valve inside the missile. The airman would enter the code with thumbwheel switches on a rack-mount box in the underground control room. That box had cables running through a tunnel to the silo, where they connected to the missile and ultimately the valve assembly.

    If the wrong code was entered three times, the valve assembly would mechanically destroy itself so the missile could never be launched. At least, it would need major repairs.

    I wonder if the Titan codes were also all 0s.

  64. Stupid passwords by cerberusss · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I'm doing a project and of course we're not working on an ICBM here (that's the next project), but on a publishing system. But people are so freaking damned lazy when it comes to passwords so the passwords of ALL the servers (development, database, source control) is set to the client's name with a "1" (one) instead of an "i". And it's ONE account we got from the UNIX guys, so everyone knows that password.

    I told the project manager, hey look doesn't this need to be changed? Everyone, including the other big player in the market, can walk in and grab the code. Manuals included.

    But they just don't care. "It's a low risk".

    --
    8 of 13 people found this answer helpful. Did you?
  65. More on Permissive Action Links by ronys · · Score: 4, Funny

    Steve Bellovin has a fascinating page on the subject here

    The quote at the beginning has become one of my favourite metaphors for describing a process that should be close to impossible:
    "Bypassing a PAL should be, as one weapons designer graphically put it, about as complex as performing a tonsillectomy while entering the patient from the wrong end."


    --
    Ubi dubium ibi libertas: Where there is doubt, there is freedom.
  66. Re:Poor ICBM security ...who cares? Right? by hemp · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Does anyone hear remember in the late 70's(was anyone here born before the 70's?) the uproar after the remains of several marijuana cigarettes were found in one of the ICBM silos??

    It was about the same time there was the rash of army personel in Germany that were caught dealing drugs on post(I believe the tip off was the enormous number of enlisted personel driving expensive European cars on a salary of $300/month).

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  67. Sounds a bit Alarmist by rstovall · · Score: 5, Interesting
    I was in SAC from 1978 - 1982, as a missile maint. tech. (a.k.a. "Missile Monkey"). While I can't speak to security prior to that time, I can say that by 78:
    • Security clearances for all personnel associated with the program were extreme... mine took over 6 months, and I know they talked to many people.
    • To the best of my knowledge, PALs were active by that time, though I was not launch crew. Certainly we were trained that PALs were a factor.
    • The warheads were physically configured such that they could not fully arm until they had experienced the stresses of launch and reentry. There was no way to set them off "in the tube".
    • Visits to the actual capsules in the LCC (Launch Control Center) by non-military were limited to the training simulator.
    • While the LCF (Launch Control Facility) appears to be a soft facility on the surface (simple wooden buildings, chain link fences, lightly guarded) nothing up there matters as far as control over the weapons. Only the LCC, the actual capsule a classified number of feet underground, matters and physically it's very imposing. There is no way to open a capsule in short terms from outside (the only accuators for the door locks are inside) and would certainly be a matter of many days even with modern equipment. Of course, even a minor violation the "topside" security was immediately and vigourously responded to, so these sites are not trivially penetrated as the author implies.
    • The missile sites were in some ways tougher. Even an authorized entrance to the hardened facility where everything worked properly took a minimum of 30 minutes plus the worse case time it would take for a security team to respond to that site. If any of the locks failed (I had it happen twice in the 3 years I was in the field) the break in procedure involved two jackhammers, a 16 ton crane, a load of other equipment and two days.. if pressed, I suspect it could have been done in one very long day. Of course, that would set number of alarms, including seismic and radar. Short of entering the hardened launch facility (the launch tube) there is no way to affect the missiles status.. you could not cause of prevent a launch from outside.

    In short, perhaps if someone could gain access to a capsule they could have commanded a lauch, but they'd have had to subvert 2 complete LCC crews to command an immediate launch, and that's just not likely, even if the PALs were not active. One LCC could not command an immediate launch, and would have been overriden by the other capsules in the flight had it attempted to. As discussed above, penetrations of the control center or the actual missile facility could not yield results before an overwhelming response ended the threat. The way we were watched (and the capsule crews were more watched than we were) I doubt four people so profoundly without anyone noticing.

    As for the "bad guys" gaining access to a warhead from the missile site... not a chance. First, to do that they'd have to penetrate the missile facility (not less than 12 hours work) without setting off any alarms and without any of the heavy equipment being noticed be the frequent roving patrols. Penetrating the LCC would not give anyone "access" to the warheads, as the LCC did not control the locks at the missile site, they just monitored them.

    The only significant risk of the warhead falling in the "wrong hands" was during transport, and I can speak from personal experience that those movements were exceptionally well prepared monitored, and armed, with air support close by at all times.
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  68. Bruce Blair is full of crap. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    I was a Minuteman Missile Combat Crew person at beautiful and sunny Franky's Rocket Ranch, otherwise known as Francis E. Warren AFB, Cheyenne, Wyoming.

    I babysat them suckers for four years. The "all-zero" setting was a day-to-day requirement because, as I recall, that panel was used for more than one function -- like most everything in the "Capsule"

    And, yes, there are people in the loop. You would be surprised how hard is is to actually launch them properly. Especially if you are not supposed to.

    'Nuff said. GO back to sleep. No worries.

  69. Corrections by TamMan2000 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    We gave Hussein many many chances to comply with the weapons inspectors and he kicked them out, do you remember this?

    Hussein never kicked any inspectors out, they were withdrawn by the UN.

    War was and is the last resort (we don't want to kill people)

    Hussein tried to surrender on the eve of war, but bush didn't want to listen to him. How does that fit in with war being the last resort?

    The troops in Iraq are there because they want to be (we don't draft people)

    I am sorry but that is the biggest pile of shit I have ever heard. The people in our military signed up to defend THIS country (USA). If our recruiting posters had told of how they would be sent to foriegn lands where the locals don't want them there, to be shot at so the president can distract us from his failings in the war on terror (Iraq and Bin Laden are 2 completely separate issues), how many do you think would have signed up? I thought about enlisting myself after 9/11, but I realized this would happen, and thought better of it.

    the people in Iraq want us there (despite what the liberal media shows you)

    Where are you getting these facts? Last I heard, a survey of Iraqis showed that most are glad that Hussein is gone, but want us to get the hell out, and the portion who are saying that the invasion was not worth it, and would rather have Hussein back is growing rapidly.

    They don't show you the good things that our troops are doing to rebuild that country.

    NPR (that is liberal media, right?) has done several stories on that very thing.

    These insurgents *hate* Americans and everything we stand for, and have declared war on US

    No, that is Al Qaida, the insurents were not filled with hatred for us, until we showed up in their yards.

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    "I'll have a Guinness, no wait, make that a Coors Light" -Grad student I work with, who shall remain anonymous...