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Mozilla Foundation Seeking Switch Success Stories
maggeth writes "mozillaZine has a story about how the Mozilla Foundation is looking to know if any organizations have switched to Mozilla products. Is your organization among them?" Can anyone point out an example of a library system switching? Lots of public libraries use PCs set up as kiosks running a web interface to their catalogs, and they all seem to use IE -- so, no tabbed browsing.
I'm writing to share a tragic little story.
My Dad has a webbrowser that my sister and I used to use for our homework assignments. One night, I was browsing a website on it, when all of a sudden it went berserk, the screen started flashing, and some really weird pictures just appeared. Lots of them. And I was at a good website! I had to reboot and find it again really quickly. Needless to say, my rushed webbrowsing wasn't nearly as good, and I blame IE for the trouble I got into when my Dad checked the cache.
I'm happy to report that my sister and I now share Mozilla Firefox. It's a lot nicer to work on than my dad's webbrowser was, it hasn't let me down once, and my cache has been really clean.
Thanks, Mozilla.
Karma: SELECT `karma` FROM `users` WHERE `userid`=138474;
Hope they dont make it like that annoying apple switch campaign...
Lots of public libraries use PCs set up as kiosks running a web interface to their catalogs, and they all seem to use IE -- so, no tabbed browsing.
and they would be real useful if anyone could actually see what they are browsing past all the pop-ups and ads!
For a site running Active Directory, IE can be locked down completely through group policies. Does anyone know if it is possible to do similar thing with Mozilla (ie. Default start page, proxy setttings, etc)?
I switched to Mozilla 6 months ago and have been enjoying it ever since.
When I got home for the summer and started work back at a Jewelry Store in my hometown, I was able to switch three of the people at work over to Mozilla FireFox. The biggest thing they were impressed with is that 99% of the spyware/ad-ware just doesn't work on it because the coders of those products only code for the dominant browser (IE crap-ola). They also love the Tabbed browsing, the nice clean interface, and the easy access to all your privacy controls (cache, cookies, history etc.). Overall, it's been a great experience with FireFox except for the occasional VBScript-using site with which we have to open up the evil IE to use. I look forward to switching more people over to the dark side of th....never mind.
"To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield." - Tennyson
Having dealt with friends' Windows PCs lately and the sheer volume of destruction spyware, IE, and all the rest have caused, I would think that -- at this point -- tabbed browsing would be the least of anybody's worries in "library IT".
Why does tabbed browsing keep rising to such prominence as a must-have feature more than simple standards-compliance and reasonable security does?
-- Maciek
Since Firefox came out all of my friends have ridiculed me for using IE, and I had played around with it a bit but was not impressed. I've been a faithful IE user since 2.0 (I know =P) and wasn't about to change.
However lately I had been working on a website and in the cross browser testing I've been using Firefox 0.8 and on for Mozilla compatibility. Its taken extensive use of Firefox but I've almost completely switched. I love the tabbed browsing and it renders so much faster on my computer. I've also found it seems to handle some websites better than IE, especially with unknown extensions. I just wish it had Windows integration, but maybe someone will figure that out. Microsoft has a lot to worry about for IE 7. Firefox is improving with every version and I have fewer and fewer reasons to use IE.
Having just been looking into setting up one of those library kiosks, I can tell you that's it's because all the easy-install products are built with IE. There are lots of websites about how to set Mozilla up in a kiosk mode, but they invariably involve hacking JavaScript and messing with lots of configs. That takes too much time for anyone but the largest library systems. It's much easier to buy a $30 product like Fortres or Cybrary.
We need an easy download and install kiosk Mozilla, preferably also with an OS lock-down tool to make the catalog PCs as maintainence-free as possible.
You can use the "tabbrowser extensions" extension available from update.mozilla.org. It allows tabs to be dragged and droped, duplicated, auto-reloaded (usefull if you have your e-mail page open), named, colored, and saved upon exit. Overall it is *very* usefull.
Regards, Rob
There were some sites that wouldn't work, although we haven't run across that problem recently. And with the systems set up this way, we can guarantee patrons' privacy from each other (wiped home directory every logout), we can easily synchronize the machines with a central image at night, and we're immune from 99%+ of software exploits on the 'Net. It also means I can spend my time creating new programs and systems for the library, rather than dinking with Windows all day.
Not long ago, every public access computer in the Austin library system was paralyzed for several days by a wandering Windows virus. We were sitting pretty at that point! :-)
I used I.E. for a long time, and it was a terrible terrible time.
Everytime I click on a porn-site, a zillion pop-ups appeared, covering the important pics of naked hot chicks. If nothing else, the pop-ups did a wonderful job lowering my saluting penis. It was horrible.
But then, my girlfriend recommended that I use mozilla! Boy, it was a dream come true. No pop-ups. And the amazing thing called "TABBED BROWSING". Now, I don't have to open multiple windows of I.E., I can have multiple PICS of naked hot chicks in the same browser! I tell ya, nothing turn on my libido then being able to stare at the naked hot chicks in various positions, all at once! !
So, thank you Mozilla! I love you!
Mode (3) smart-aleck mode. Press * to return to main menu.
Most patrons are barely capable of using existing public-access terminals let alone a multi-tabbed browser.
Additionally, the majority of catalog lookups are single-item queries--I'm not convinced that throwing a better browser at them would significantly enhance their library experience.
TabBrowser extensionsi nfo/tbe
http://extensionroom.mozdev.org/more-
Probably one of my top 3 favorite extensions. Gives you a lot of control over tabs, saves your last sessions, allows you to reorder tabs, group tabs with the tab they were linked from, and a lot more.
Trondheim public library is using Mozilla on its public PCs (30 machines). I'm not sure if they switched from IE, however.
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I'm a sysadmin at a university library, and we have to run Windows for plugins that professors require for their classes. Mozilla nd Firefox can't be locked down like IE can through the active directory. A security change is a couple clicks in a central location with an Active Diretory and IE.
With Mozilla we would have to visit each workstation.
At my school library, I work as a semi-admin (well, I know all the passwords and help out a lot). Most of the stuff I end up doing is removing spyware. I installed Firefox on every box, but nobody was using it, and the spyware continued to pile up daily. As a last result, I replaced the firefox icon with the IE icon, and renamed it to "Internet Explorer." Everyone started using it, and I heard no complaints.
This is probably an evil way of doing things, but people are set in their ways, once they switch they like it, but getting them to not just use their same old browser is difficult.
Point and click is point and click. Most people don't do anything else with a web browser at all. Anyone who can point and click in IE can definitely do the same in mozilla/firefox/opera/whatever the hell lets you click on a url.
I also reply below your current threshold.
I for one have never had a problem with Mozilla. It has performed flawlessesly from day one without a single hiccup or burrrrr8~ ^%@ ..^ & ! # # ,, ~ 8 j ,,, NO CARRIER
Table-ized A.I.
I'm sorry, Apple owns a patent on "switch" advertising, we have cases pending against proctor and gamble
you can however advertise switching to apple products, speaking of which, have you tried safari?
Central Washington's library uses Firefox excusively on all public internet terminals.
Really? In Australia, a lot of public coin-operated terminals run Konqueror or Galleon on Linux for stability. Most Internet cafes give you a choice of Win/IE or Mac/Safari.
Galion Public Library uses Mozilla.org browsers exclusively. (I'm the
computer guy.)
However, we previously used mostly Communicator. We did have MSIE on *one*
computer at one point, but that system was so much trouble that when Windows
got cranky and needed to be reinstalled, we didn't bother. The librarians
were offering to dig a hole in the flower gardens and bury it; they weren't
interested in having it fixed; they wanted it replaced. Also, reinstalling
would have been a problem since we didn't have the original driver disks
(not my fault; we didn't have them when I was hired), and with its being a
Compaq Deskpro (no model number _anywhere_, and there are dozens of models,
and you have to know which one you have...), finding the correct drivers on
the net was promising real pain. This was late 2000. I put TurboLinux on
it and it served as a CGI server for a couple of years after that without
incident.
None of the librarians has ever asked me why we don't use MSIE. (Some of
them have asked me about the difference between Mozilla and Netscape, though.)
No patron AFAIK has ever specifically asked for Internet Explorer either. I
do get occasional complaints from patrons about certain plugins not being
installed (most frequently Flash), but that's not nearly as many complaints
as I get about the Yahoo! Mail and Hotmail interfaces (neither of which we
endorse or recommend; we officially do not provide email: we merely provide
access to the web).
I should note that our catalog stations within the library are not web-based.
We have a web-based catalog so people can get to our catalog from home, but
within the library the catalog stations are VT510 dumb terminals, connected
only to the automation system via ports (on a DECServer) which are only
privileged for OPAC (i.e., the catalog) and nothing else. For our older
patrons, the dumb terminals are easier to use and less intimidating than
a web-based system. (The OPAC literally tells you what buttons to push,
and there's no need to know how to use a mouse, which is good because a
lot of people around here aren't comfortable with computer mice yet.)
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
Actually we just had a case where we had to switch an entire department of users from Mozilla back to IE. We tried using Mozilla on a win2k terminal server and it was a failure. The footprint for each users mozilla session ranged from 25 to 60(!)mb. Way too much strain on the server. IE only cost us 15-20mb per session. We tried firefox but with w2k's 256 color limitation on terminal sessions, most toolbar icons showed as black squares rendering the software unusable.
We posted several questions/suggestions to the mozilla boards but they went unanswered. We've also had a similar problem with the lack of an msi for mozilla/thunderbird/firebird rollouts. Makes mass migrations near impossible. Mozilla does not seem to want to address large scale use such as terminal services and automated installs.
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Join Team Mozilla #38050 Folding@home
I beg to differ. at NCPL, http://www.ncpl.lib.in.us/ we use Mozilla on *all* of our patron machines and on somewhere around 60% of our staff use it(we have both IE and Firefox installed on the staff machines, so they can choose). Not only do we use Moz, but we use linux for all of our patron systems(even the two Macintoshes) and plan on doing a migration of the 20 or so staff machines to linux next year. so yes Virginia, you do see Mozilla in Libraries
With Mozilla, productivity has nearly doubled! Employees report that due to reduced administrative downtime and popup windows, their fantasy teams are dominating, they're whacking twice as many moles, and gambling away entire paychecks before lunchtime every payday.
Thanks Mozilla!
You've obviously never tried to show Anything-But-Microsoft to a typical management type. I once had a boss tell me she wanted to use a "normal computer" when I offered to let her use my browser... which was Netscape.
Honey, I shrunk the Cygwin
it's easy to do. It's hard to believe just how relentlessly ignorant the average user is until you meet one face to face and tell them to click 'ok' instead of cancel to get to secure web sites.
Many users simply freeze up when prompted with an small changes to the UI. I've witnessed people lost when presented with Windows XP's classic style control panel (or the catagorical one, if they're used to classic). I think it's a combination of laziness and fear, coupled with the firm, marketing encouraged belief that, by God, this darn here compooter oughta be easy ta larn.
It bothers me, because people want so much from their computers, but put so little effort into them. It'd bother me less if people where willing to pay big bucks for the privilege of ignorance, but they also want their computers cheap and their support free.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
with a 256 color skin? If there isn't one already, it shouldn't be too hard to make. The MSI installer shouldn't be too hard to write either. Installing Firefox is basically just extracting the files and adding a few short cuts. Isn't the MSI api designed to make stuff like that easy?
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
That, in and of itself, is my success story with Firefox. Much of my family didn't even notice for a day or so that I had even switched their browser. The buttons look the same, everything pretty much acts the same, and it's just as intuitive. Using the added features like tabbed browsing involve going a little out of their way, so they don't even notice.
I believe the typical management type is not the typical public library type.
Load an IE theme and nearly no one will notice the difference. URL bar, bookmarks - you need nothing more in a public library.
When you use mozilla in office you will have to deal with a lot of extra functionality of mozilla.
Yeah, s'mee again!
FIX the bloody calendar. Make it work. At least make it so where emailed invites can easily be added to the recipient's calendar, instead of opening within a new browser window. Pretty simple stuff like that.
We can't switch because the calendar just sucks compared to what users have unfortunately become quite accustomed to in Microsoft Outlook.
They don't care about the mail - Mozilla works better. They care about the *Calendar* and the basic PIM stuff that Outlook has. We don't even use Exchange, but if another Outlook user sends a calendar request, Mozilla can't do squat with it.
So, they try to cling to Outlook.
Thunderbird/Firefox are not suitable/mature enough replacements, and besides, the Calendar will still suck because it's from the same codebase.
bring back the days of Netscape Calendar - or something. I'm telling you folks, cross platform calendaring applications may very well be the killer app for small businesses.
Right now, Mozilla isn't going too far where I work because of the lack of a serious calendaring application.
And that sucks, really. =/
With Windows/IE, you can do almost anything and configure it almost completely (within its limits, of course) through the mouse and the menus.
You mean like in IE how you can configure it to be able to download more then 2 files at once? That's right you can use the mouse and menus to go through the registry to fix that right?
http://www.tweakxp.com/tweak764.aspx
or set the default download directory... oops no registry
http://www.tweakxp.com/tweak128.aspx
changing mailto: to load another mail program.. registry again
http://www.tweakxp.com/tweak734.aspx
You try to make it sound like its a big deal to install firefox, it's not any more complex then installing any other windows application you download off net. In the time it takes you to update IE to a stable state, you could already have downloaded, installed, and be adapted to firefox (that's because there basically is no adaption time).
Your rant seems aimed at Linux and not at Mozilla... because there's no reason for the average user (yes even the average slashdot user) to recompile or muck around with scripting (XPI) in firefox. Furthermore Mozilla and Linux have nothing to do with eachother, why you arbitrarily lumped them together is a little odd. The common denominator being that they both compete with Microsoft I guess. While you address only one side of your grouping it makes the argument sound akin to "I don't like cats and dogs... they leave droppings on the lawn, bark at night and they attack the mailman... and that is why I don't like cats and dogs"
How so? The only "advantage" I can see in IE in this regard is that it ignores the "encoding" tag in the HTML header. That way, if the site is marked as "iso-8859-1" in the header, but actually contains unicode chars in the body, IE will show accented characters as the dumbass who created the site intended. However, I'd classify that as a bug, rather than a feature.