Slashdot Mirror
Apple Sued over Tiger, Injunction Sought
An anonymous reader writes "Online retailer Tiger Direct has reportedly sued Apple over the use of the Tiger name just one day before the Mac maker is scheduled to roll-out its next-generation Mac OS X 10.4 'Tiger' operating system, according to an article at AppleInsider. TigerDirect, which owns trademarks on the names Tiger, TigerDirect and TigerSoftware, has requested an injunction that could prevent Friday's launch of the Tiger OS. Tiger Direct is also seeking damages and legal fees. 'Apple Computer has created and launched a nationwide media blitz led by Steven Jobs, overwhelming the computer world with a sea of Tiger references,' Tiger Direct's attorneys wrote in the lawsuit." While the suit may have some merit, it is odd for them to wait until now to try and halt such a heralded product.
Disney will be joining the battle soon as Tiger is misleading to Tigger.
Rock that crushes, Paper & Scissors that don't matter.
Someone at TigerDirect suddenly realized that Apple would/might sue them over the name tiger and they figured they better sue first.
Samsung took back my unlocked bootloader because Google wants me to rent movies. They're both evil.
While the suit may have some merit, it is odd for them to wait until now to try and halt such a heralded product.
;)
Not when now is the time the threat of an injunction to stop distribution could result in a multi zillion pound pay out
Everyone has known it was going to be called Tiger for the last YEAR. Why do they wait until release day to file a lawsuit?
And wait a sec. Are these guys telling me that they have a patent on the word "Tiger"? Somebody better get some lawyers for the local zoo.
Well, I can't say I'm a huge fan of TigerDirect, as they have fairly high prices, I *have* bought some more esoteric parts from them, as well as before NewEgg.com came out, and I've never been disappointed.
I'm also not a fan of Apple, as I absolutely hate using the 10.3 Macs we have in the lab here in our library.
However, this should be pretty clear-cut. If TigerDirect, a computer-related company, owns the trademark on Tiger, as applied to computer products, and Apple has been using that trademark without permission, then TigerDirect should be granted damages.
Especially since, I doubt them having the trademark on Tiger is a new thing.
I think that's really all that needs to be said.
"We are the Dyslexia of Borg. Your ass will be laminated. Futility is resistant."
They should be fine. If I remember correctly, they have at least one lawyer on staff.
At the root of the issue appears to internet search results. Tiger Direct contends that Apple's use of the name has adversely affected its ranking amongst the Internet's largest search engines....
So does that mean they plan on taking on some non-profit who appears above them on google, because hey everyone knows I might get confused while searching for "tiger" instead of "tigerdirect" (which shows them ranked first btw). This whole things stinks of a "get rich quick by settlement" scam.
I Am My Own Worst Enemy
This is a grab for quick settlement money, no questions about it. Clever and slimey-- Apple can either take their chances fighting it (with a small chance to be hurt big) or pay TigerDirect cash. Blackmail, essentially, and the timing of this suit is proof.
I sincerely hope they'll fight it, not only because I believe the lawsuit is meritless and one should never give into blackmail, but also...
Apple has taken the "we defend our legal rights" stance when they've sued Tiger leakers. Fair enough. If they reverse their stance on that now when up against someone with lawyers, I think that'd be quite hypocritical.
So, sock it to them, Apple.
Jobs: "OK I need about a million volunteers: 1) Cross out the 'Tiger' on the box 2) Write 'Big Orange Cat with black stripes' "
I heard Tiger Woods is pretty pissed too.
Homer no function beer well without.
I stopped using TigerDirect years ago after they refused to accept a return on product that they falsely advertised. A dual-processor motherboard that required an extra APIC chip to use the second processor, and despite listing both as in stock when I ordered, the APIC was on back-order for over a month. Since I had not opened the box yet I just went to Fry's and bought a motherboard and called to cancel the APIC and return the useless board. The customer service people were uncooperative and the "manager" I talked to was downright rude.
So, despite having spent thousands of dollars there, they decided that they would rather lose both my personal business and that of the company I work for than accept a return on an unopened $120 board they sold under false pretenses.
Don't fool yourself -- you get what you pay for. TigerDirect is cheap because their service sucks the big one.
When I originally heard of OSX Tiger, I never even imagined a link "TigerDirect." Not that I care about Apple, but now when I hear OSX Tiger, I'll be sure to think "TigerDirect, another corporate bastard."
it is odd for them to wait until now to try and halt such a heralded product.
Not odd at all, for a few reasons. Only upper management (let's call them the CxOs) would have the corporate clout to initiate a lawsuit against a big-name corp like Apple. Consider the following hypothetical scenarios:
1. Prior Apple products have had internal code names that were used in a semi-public way. (The Sagan/BHA saga comes to mind.) The CxOs thought Tiger was just such a code name, and, being clueless as only management can be, didn't realize until this late that it was not the case.
2. The CxOs, being clueless as only management can be, hadn't heard of Apple's "Tiger" until now.
3. The CxOs, realizing that this was an open-and-shut case, figured they'd give Apple enough rope to hang themselves. They're all expert blackmailers - sorry, "negotiators" - and know that Apple is now facing a time crunch. Apple has a hard deadline and must settle on Tiger Direct's terms.
Don't know about you, but #3 strikes me as really plausible. I don't know if that makes me cynical or just experienced, but I don't see Tiger's behavior as odd, in the sense of "statistically unusual".
If this is true, then Jaguar has standing to sue as well.
"But your honor, these shysters have a prior history of this conduct!"
I've ordered several things from TigerDirect. Now, thanks to Apple, I don't know if I should enter purchases into a web page or just send it directly to the operating system.
try { do() || do_not(); } catch (JediException err) { yoda(err); }
According to a search on USPTO.gov using Tiger Direct on the owner name as my search parameters I don't see them having a trade mark on Tiger.
E RSYSTEMSO M
They have 11 entries almost al with the word Tiger in them but not the word Tiger alone. In fact all of their trademarks with tiger in them are one word entries.
XCONNECT
TIGERPC.COM
TIGERTV.COM
TIG
TIGERDIRECT
TIGERDIRECT
TIGERDIRECT.C
there are all the live trademarks.
See for your self.
Sorry, teleporters just kill you and then make a copy. A perfect, soul-less copy.
http://www.tigerdirect.com/sectors/help/contactus. asp ;)
feel free to give them feed back, you know they deserve it
Blarney Quality Restaurant, Plants
..Would that be an operating system whose tops are made out of rubber and whose bottoms are made out of springs?
"Its not so much a crash.. its more of a bounce, it'll be back up soon."
Starsucks
WWF was having battles with the other WWF for years about the name. The World Widelife Fund finally won a few years back over the World Wrastlin' Federation. Are they in the same specific domain? Maybe, they both have to do with animals...
... as if millions of geeks suddenly added "0.0.0.0 tigerdirect.com" to their hosts file and a web server suddently went silent.
...Rob
The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.
1) Apple only announced the April 29th launch date publicly on April 12, 2005. That's critical in asking "Why only now?" -- there was nothing imminent prior to that.
2) Apple tried registering "Tiger" as a trademark (with intent-to-use) in July 2003, but was denied b/c of possible confusion. Apple won the Tiger trademark by agreeing to limit its use to computer operating software.
3) Tiger attempted to settle, and then filed an opposition to Apple's mark in December 2004.
4) Tiger has six registered marks, and several other common-law marks.
Much of this wouldn't matter (IMHO) if Apple wasn't a reseller itself. But since they do sell many of the same products as TigerDirect, there is a beef. Tiger makes a good case that Apple is using the Tiger mark more broadly that it is entitled, to venture into other sales areas than just operating systems, and that that can affect Tiger's revenues. Here's a quote from their court memorandum:
Personally, I don't think this passes the "likelihood of confusion" test, but that's for a court to decide. If I were in TigerDirect's shoes, I'd similarly be upset.So there's more to that case than just name overlap.
-- $SIGNATURE
TIGER DIRECT, INC.
Customer Experience
Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record with the Bureau due to a pattern of complaints and unanswered complaints.
Specifically our files show a pattern of complaints alleging dissatisfaction with product quality, failure to deliver promised goods, service issues, misrepresentation in advertising and marketing practices and the failure to address and overcome the basic cause of complaints brought to their attention by the Better Business Bureau.
Complaints allege customers are led to believe they are buying new, Brand Name computer systems, parts and other products with either a 90-day, or 1 year warranty. Complainants allege they are receiving generic, defective and refurbished items and only a 30-day warranty with the option to purchase the 1-year warranty. Customers who purchase the warranty also experience difficulty in getting return phone calls to get the problems fixed or replaced. Customer are told they may return the items for replacement, but they will need to pay again for the replacement and will credited back when the item is returned and received by the company.
Some of the complaints have issues with the advertised rebate, both the catalog and web site have numerous offers for items with a mail-in rebate. Upon receiving the products the rebate application is not included in the package. Customers are told the rebate application is on the website and customers are required to comply with the program and submit paperwork that they never received. Many are denied because the product they have purchased does not have the advertised rebate, the rebate has expired, and some rebates are only good if the item is purchased with a computer. Many customers feel they have been victims of bait and switch, and are unable to return the products because the package has been open. Customers who have contacted customer service with concerns have problem with getting return calls, emails, and experience unresponsiveness and unconcerned customer service staff. However, the company has responded to most complaints presented by the Bureau.
Licensing Information
This company is in an industry that may require licensing, bonding or registration in order to lawfully do business. The Bureau encourages you to check with the appropriate agency to be certain any requirements are currently being met.
Additional Business Names
ASSEENONTVPC
Systemax, Inc.
TigerDirect.com.
Additional Telephone Numbers
(305) 415-2200
(305) 415-2201
(305) 415-2295
(800) 269-8709
(800) 349-8133
(800) 364-9483
(800) 677-2562
(800) 678-0198
(800) 800-8300
(800) 879-1597
(800) 888-4437
(800) 888-6111
(800) 897-0021
(800) 955-1888
(888) 333-8200
(888) 335-4062
(888) 776-8382
(888) 872-7274
(888) 999-3600.
Additional Addresses
7795 W. Flagler St Suite 35, Miami, FL 33144
Corporate Sales Dept. 1100 Perimeter W Suite 118, Morrisville, NC 27560
Warehouse 175 Ambassador Dr., Naperville, IL 60540.
Company Management
Carl Fiorentino, President
Gilbert Fiorentino, CEO
Joseph Dunne, CFO
Richard Wallet, Executive Vice President
Tony Jones, Vice President Call Center Op.
Rosemary Lindsay, Customer Service Manager
Kenneth Howard, Customer Service Department.
Government Actions
On November 4, 1999, case C3903, the Federal Trade Commission
issued a Decision & Order against Tiger Direct for violations
of the Pre-sale Availability Rule, the Disclosure Rule and the
Warranty Act. Without admitting any wrong doing, Tiger Direct
agrees to 1) not represent that it provides On-Site Service
unless all limitations and conditions that apply are disclosed;
2) fulfill obligations under the warranty within a reasonable
period of time after receiving notice from the consumer; and
3) shall cease and desist from failing to make warranty text
available for examination prior to s
Here's some equivalents from NT history:
Windows NT 3.1 - Version 1 (the number was picked to be in sync with the 16-bit Windows)
Windows NT 3.5 - First real update - added Alpha support
Windows NT 3.51 - Minor service pack, added PowerPC support
Windows NT 4 - moved GUI and device drivers into kernel mode for speed, added Win95 GUI. Major upgrade.
Then came 6 service packs...
Windows NT 5 - AKA Windows 2000. Not a huge upgrade overall, but added Active Directory.
Windows NT 5.1 - AKA Windows XP. Other minor improvements, more consumer-oriented features, prettier GUI.
The equivalent in Mac-land:
Mac OS (through version 9.2): Older cooperative-multitasking-based systems. 9.2 is still supported under OS X as "Classic", but for more than a year you haven't been able to buy a Mac that would boot 9.x by itself.
Mac OS X 10.0 - "Cheetah". The first cut at the new version. It was updated with minor service packs a few times, then in fall 2001 it was replaced with:
Mac OS X 10.1 - "Puma". Really just the equivalent of a Windows service pack, despite the numbering. It was handed out by Apple as a free update CD. They added the DVD player, fixed a lot of bugs, and such.
Mac OS X 10.2 - "Jaguar". Jaguar was the first version to actually get the "big cat" name made an official part of the product name (the previous names were code names only). Jaguar got updates through 10.2.8, and still is supported with the occasional security update. The biggest change from a GUI perspective was the move to the "brushed metal" look.
Mac OS X 10.3 = "Panther". Panther was released in October 2003, about a year after Jaguar. As it's been around for a year and a half, it's gotten point updates up to 10.3.9.
Basically, there's no direct analogue between the two, but the closest thing in Mac land to a Windows-style service pack was the 10.0 to 10.1 update. It was a free CD at the Apple Stores and from resellers (you could buy it for $20 as a shrinkwrapped update kit IIRC). They didn't make it available for download, though.
Typically, Apple point releases are simply bugfixes and occasional minor feature upgrades (10.3.9 just gave us the new Safari 1.3, which shares most of its guts with Tiger's Safari RSS 2.0), new drivers, etc. But they release them every 2-3 months or so, whereas Microsoft tends to roll a lot more stuff into a service pack, and they release them far less frequently - like every year or two. XP came out in 2001, and they're only on SP2 for it. But Microsoft releases bugfixes and security updates regularly in between service packs - Apple does some of that as well but mostly relies on point releases.
But to Apple overall, they think of what looks like a "minor" update by the version numbers as a major one, and it usually is in terms of features added and the like. Check out the analysis on Ars to see what all the new goodies really entail.
-- Josh Turiel
"2. Do not eat iPod Shuffle."
Tiger, owned by Systemax Inc. (owners of TigerDirect.com) and first used in 1987, filed in 2000 and registered in 2002. Serial no. 75915934
and
Tiger, owned by Apple Computer Inc. Not yet registered, but filed in 2003 with publication for opposition in August 2004. Serial no. 78269988
While this seems the end for Apple's Tiger, a closer look reveals the important bits. Apple's Tiger has been filed for "computer operating system software", while Systemax's Tiger was registered for "Mail order catalog services featuring computers and computer related products; and Retail store services featuring computers and computer related products."
They are two very different uses for the trademark. I'm sure Apple's lawyers will pounce on this fact. TigerDirect does not have much of a chance of pulling this one off.
On top of this, waiting until the day before the product launch was not the best plan for TigerDirect. Apple's tradmark was published for opposition last year. Given all the publicity, TigerDirect's management would definately have known about this long before now. Any decent judge would see TigerDirect's real intentions in filing this late.
I suspect that TigerDirect's managment are hoping that Apple's lawyers are stupid and will settle immedaitely. If this is the case then I think TigerDirect's management are in for a rude awakening. Steve Jobs will fight this one.
Glad you covered that in school but that's a bit of an oversimplified perspective. It's a balance between how similar the markets of the two products are, how generic the name is, and possibility of confusion. Here, "computers" in general isn't all that narrow, "Tiger" is a pretty common name, and there's almost no possibility for confusion as one is a computer reseller and the other is an operating system. So there's little case for infringement here. Hell, the Windows vs. Lindows case wasn't open/shut, and there it was two operating systems, a much closer match.
Maybe Tiger Direct isn't that naive, but is Apple really that naive as well to just go take names?
You can't own something as generic as "Tiger."
It is certainly fair play that Apple has to play by the rules. All that imagination for computer design, but they couldn't come up with a more original, and unused, name?
OK then kid, you find a name less than 15 letters that hasn't been used in some way - any way, according to your logic - with computers. See how ridiculous that gets? That's why trademark protection isn't as broad as you seem to think.
Guess what, Apple... somebody already thought of it
No they didn't. They have a computer sales business named Tiger. There's no OS tamed Tiger. 'Til tomorrow.
I actually got a good giggle out of this, because I think you honestly believe that titling a comment 'You fuckers' and calling everyone who disagrees with you 'brainwashed' is not flame-bait.
But okay, I'll bite... perhaps you're complaining about the moderation because you don't really know what 'flame-bait' means. Flame-bait doesn't necessarily mean that the person who is posting is wrong... it just means that their comment was posted in just a way as to invite flamage.
For example: if I posted that I thought that desktop Linux was really coming along, and that more people really ought to consider it as an alternative to Windows, I wouldn't be modded down as flamebait. If I posted that desktop Linux still had too many usability problems and that Windows was still better for end users, I wouldn't either. If I posted that I thought anyone who used Windows when Linux was available was a cretin who shouldn't be allowed to breed, I would almost certainly be modded down as flamebait (unless I said it in a fucking hilarious way), and the same goes for saying the same thing about people using desktop Linux.
So, in case you still can't see what you did, a helpful hint: calling people 'fuckers' because they believe different things than you, even if what they believe is so obviously wrong that you just can't imagine anyone actually believing it and it makes you nauseous to even consider the idea that anyone could believe it... well, that invites flames. And thus is flame-bait.
Dickhead.
-fred
PS: By the way, you're also wrong.
Sign #11 of Slashdot overdose: You see the phrase 'moderate Republican' and you wonder if that would be a +1 or a -1.
Yeah, but since they don't actually own the trademark to Tiger, they're really shooting blanks on this one...
:)
Not to mention they just lost the ability to sell iPods. Wait a few days, if this gets any more press and any more aggravation and really does affect Tiger's sale (not release, since they're not going to court tomorrow), Apple will wait until TigerDirect loses.... then pull the reseller stuff and prevent them from selling ANY Apple branded products.
Now, in the case of iPods, that's gotta be a money maker even for these clods (judging from the sale of iPods in general...).
So I guess they haven't thought this crap through. Not that I'd buy from them anyway with their track record, but they have indeed sealed their fate with the millions of mac users (if this inhibits them from buying Tiger) who will never buy from them again, or for the first time. Not to mention they'll tell everyone they know not to as well.
Bad publicity only works for movie stars...
It's the Stay-Puft Marshmallow Man.
[Tiger Direct] has used its family of Tiger trademarks to sell computers and computer related products since 1987
They've only been going under Tiger Direct for a few years. They used to be known as Misco.
Tigers are Asian, not African. (There are some, for the same reason there are tigers in Las Vegas.)
"Oh, and sue Africa too. I heard there were some critters trying to usurp the Tiger name, too."
A tiger? In Africa?
What?
A TIGER? In Africa?
Shhh!
Only in Kenya.