Can a Customer Loyalty Database Change a Society?

Retrospeak writes "'Organisations that continue to put the brand at their epicentre and pay only lip service to the notion that the customer is king, will fail. It's just a matter of time.' So says business strategist Clive Humby. His marketing company, Dunnhumby handles the loyalty scheme database for Tesco, the third-largest retailer in world and the biggest retailer in Britain. This fact combined with a strong customer loyalty program means they may have one of the largest databases in the world. The Economist goes on to state that Britain itself is being changed by the secondary effects of Tesco's massive customer-driven database." From the article: "Some of these changes are small. The dust jacket of a book that was to be sold in-store was recently altered because a Tesco buyer did not like it. Others are more fundamental. Before the Clubcard came along, the largest panels that suppliers could use consisted of around 20,000 people. But suppliers can now pay for access to the database and many just rely on Tesco."

Comments

I am NaN

[Anonymous Coward]

As long as customer databases are mistaken for customer service, it'll certainly not change anything for the better.

Re:I am NaN

[Smallpond]

Most businesses are moving away from interpersonal service to self-serve backed by monitoring. Look at self-serve gas, supermarket checkout, ATMs. I think ATMs are a win, since they reduce lines. In supermarkets I find a human if I'm in a hurry, tho. Databases are replacing the "Mr. Whipple" model of the manager who knows his customers. Now its the database miners who know their clients. Its just automation moving higher up the chain.

Obligatory OS quote
"I have people skills! I am good at dealing with people! Can't you understand that? What the hell is wrong with you people?"

Re:I am NaN

[Anonymous Coward]

If you're NaN, then you can't multiply, which explains why you're on Slashdot.

Re:I am NaN

[Jeff DeMaagd]

I am usually OK with self serve gas, but pumping gas is a very small number of operations. I am not happy with self-serve checkout because the machines are designed to work with dumb, inexperienced people and in my experience, a poorly calibrated scanner. Even with good scanner, my experience is better with using actual check-out people is that they ring through a stack of items without the hinderance of the unresponsive and demanding computer, maybe at twice the speed. What it tells me is that stores are too cheap to hire minimum wage workers, and those stores are willing to stick me with an expensive garbage machine to save themselves a few bucks at my expense in time and frustration. I would much rather they hire more cashiers and other service people, not less.

Currently, ATMs aren't about shortening lines but getting cash at convenience, putting machines in where there isn't space to put a mini-branch, and for customers to get their money at any hour.

Banks did try getting ATMs to reduce the amount of manpower needed to run the bank, but as it turns out, the number of bank tellers has not decreased, and ATMs are very expensive to maintain. Bankers basically bought them just to save themselves money, but thankfully that backfired.

Re:I am NaN

[cdrguru]

Well, those minimum-wage clerks in stores are getting harder and harder to come by. What you would like it a motivated, English-speaking person that is nice to the customers. What they have settled for in the past as a unmotivated, English-as-an-afterthought, person that feels they just aren't paid enough to be nice.

Increasing wages doesn't help - often the only people that seem to be hired are immigrant labor that aren't all that interested in higher wages - they will do the same low-quality work for minimum wage or below.

The idea of the "working mom" being there is long gone - for one reason or another that labor pool has dried up. High school and college kids aren't motivated enough for the most part. I don't understand why people still (after welfare "reform") still seem to feel it is better to be on welfare or unemployment than working somewhere, but that seems to be the case.

So, if the choice is someone that is nasty to the customers, unmotivated and barely speaks English or a machine ... the supermarket manager chooses wisely for the machine.

Re:I am NaN

[Fulcrum of Evil]

Increasing wages doesn't help - often the only people that seem to be hired are immigrant labor that aren't all that interested in higher wages - they will do the same low-quality work for minimum wage or below.

You gotta be shitting me. Of course the immigrants want more money. If they have enough English to work checkout and do their job well, then you should pay them more. It does help retention. Most of the people I've seen working checkout are citizens that've been here a while (with the exception of the one cute Russian woman). You may also be surprised to learn that checkout can pay up to $13/hr.

The idea of the "working mom" being there is long gone - for one reason or another that labor pool has dried up. High school and college kids aren't motivated enough for the most part. I don't understand why people still (after welfare "reform") still seem to feel it is better to be on welfare or unemployment than working somewhere, but that seems to be the case.

As a former college student, I found that internships paid better than supermarket jobs, but I would have taken a $7/hr job anywhere in a supermarket before doing food service again. Stocking shelves and checkout are way easier than cleaning up after the sunday breakfast crowd and trying not to gag on the smell of old eggs.

Re:I am NaN

[mr_sas]

being an ex-cashier, I quite like the self-serve things. I can serve myself usually just as fast as the other people can serve me, never feel hurried and never have to go through the same stupid quotes and "hilarious" quips that the supermarket staff inevitably have and feel the need to tell me.

The machine doesn't have a fixed plastic smile either.

Re:I am NaN

[lakin]

After so many "Do you need any help? Only with the paying!"'s, the "hilarious quips" are all that stop us attacking customers with the frozen peas...

I havent tried them myself, but a number of customers have tried the self service checkouts at a tesco not far from the one i work, and mostly had positive things to say. But generally, most only found it faster because so few people use it compared to the standard checkouts.

Re:I am NaN

[GameMaster]

"Banks did try getting ATMs to reduce the amount of manpower needed to run the bank, but as it turns out, the number of bank tellers has not decreased, and ATMs are very expensive to maintain. Bankers basically bought them just to save themselves money, but thankfully that backfired."

Where I am (Chicago, IL, USA) they are still doing that. The biggest local bank, BankOne, has very few "full featured" bank branches. The vast majority of their locations are inside Domick's supermarkets (the dominant supermarket chain around here) or in Walgreens drug stores. They consist of ~3 ATM machines and an office or two. All deposits, withdrawals, and balance inquiries are handles by the ATM. The only thing the employees in the offices are there to handle is creating new accounts and loans. This approach seems to be working out fine for them.

We have gotten to a point where technology is cheap enough that they should be able to make reasonably reliable ATMs that are cheaper to maintain than a counter with two or three bank employees behind it. The tellers behind those counters probably aren't qualified to handle loans/new accounts anyway so there isn't any overlap in labor between the people sitting in the office and the ATMs. On top of that, the ATMs are available as long as the store is open (sometimes 24/7) as compared to the typical "bankers hours".

As for the supermarket/home depot automatic registers, I love them. I find that (as long as they are properly maintained/calibrated) they are vastly faster than the register people. In my experience as a consumer as well as having worked in retail, most register people are slow as dirt. I can completely understand that after working 8+ hours for low pay while putting up with demeaning treatment from miserable customers many people working those jobs tend to burn out. Its almost impossible to keep up a fast pace for years under those conditions.

The other thing I have noticed is that store managers have an almost universal tendency to under-staff their registers. I honestly don't know why they bother having 10+ registers at a supermarket if they never staff them. Most of these stores probably don't even have enough register people on the payroll to staff all the registers they have at the same time. Much like the ATMs, self-checkout registers are open the entire time the store is open. All they need is one person to watch over ~4 of the registers to help people and make sure no-one walks away with stuff. This means they can double the number of registers available while cutting manpower in half. Consequently, this means much shorter lines. Maybe when more people get comfortable using them they won't be as open as they are now but then they should be able to simply convert more of they registers over at that point.

As an addendum, I think this is a sign that automation is beginning to make all low-end service jobs/manual labor disappear. I am still waiting for a completely automated McDonald's where the whole store is one giant vending machine. One or two people would be on hand to feed raw materials into the machine/kitchen (such as frozen patties, buns, frozen fries, etc.), fix any jam-ups that occurred, and clean up the equipment at the end of the night. A system of conveyor belts would move the food from place to place where it would be cooked and combined into things like sandwiches (after all, how hard can it be to create a machine that puts together sloppy sandwiches like the ones your get from modern fast food employees). The employees/maintenance people would never have to have direct contact with the customer because self-checkout registers would allow the customers to pay for it themselves and conveyor belts would bring the food right to them. It's kind of scary when you think about it because a massive number of people in the US are employed in the retail and fast food industries (Wal-Mart is the largest employer in the US and possibly the world). What will all those people do when technology automates almost all the jobs they are qualified for?

-GameMaster

Re:I am NaN

[Mike570]

I've used both good and bad automated checkouts. For example, at one store named Price Chopper in my area, the automated checkouts are a nightmare. After you scan an item, you have to place it in a bag and it must remain on the small counter until after you pay or the machine shuts down and keeps saying "please do not remove items". So basically, if you have more than four bags of groceries, you're screwed. But at another store I frequent, called Weis, their automated checkout system is amazing. It's fast, it asks you for coupons, it's precise and it even helps you look up the proper price for produce. So the technology seems to vary widely. I assume it all depends on how willing the supermarket is to make the initial investment and purchase a quality machine to save money in the long run.

Re:I am NaN

[mr_sas]

oh yeah I totally agree, the customers are at least as bad. They always seem to think that whatever they say is the funniest thing ever and that you've never heard it before, then stand laughing at their own stupid quip.

The worst one is when you're having trouble scanning something and some wisecracker says "oh it's free then" before erupting into the worst case of giggles you've ever heard.

For the record I should say that most customers were fine, their were just the odd few that warranted being attacked with the peas.

Re:British Society Tracking Database

[Anonymous Coward]

Stop whoring that link around. It's getting very spammy to see it in every story that remotely mentions the UK now.

Re:British Society Tracking Database

[AnonDotOrg]

What type of database is this running on?

Wegmans v. General Motors

[bgfay]

I live in Central New York where we have the pleasure of shopping at Wegmans Supermarkets. Wegmans uses a shopping card, is very receptive to even the smallest suggestions from customers, and goes out of their way to satisfy all customers. They track purchases carefully and have a giant database from which they mark trends and make changes. To put it simply, they rely less on the brand name and more on continuously improving and changing. For this reason, they have sent at least three different supermarket chains in the area scrambling or out of business. Wal-Mart hasn't even made much headway because Wegmans is so good.

Then there's GM. This dinosaur doesn't give people what they want--a well-built car that lasts a long time and sells for a reasonable price. Simply put, they don't get it. They believe that they have always been and that they have always done things the one true way.

Which company will grow?

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[daviddennis]

When I lived in Los Angeles, we had a great grocery chain called Gelson's that was impeccably run, had no lines, and had beautiful stores. There were cheaper ways to get food, of course, but none more pleasant, and the price premium to shop there was low and getting lower all the time, as the big chains raised their prices and Gelson's didn't.

In Pittsburgh, where I am now, the local grocery market is such a depressing place that I'm shifting my grocery shopping to Wal-Mart. It's cheaper and service is actually friendlier.

I'm plotting my move to Miami as we speak ... Miami has Publix, which is small but very service-oriented.

D

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[newdamage]

I lived in Tallahassee for a year, and I can say from personal experience that Publix rocks. Now that I'm back in the midwest I really miss it. They had amazing prices, really friendly employees, and just outstanding service. Sure it was cheaper to go to Walmart, but Walmart didn't have the selection or quality of food that Publix did.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[coflow]

Wegman's recently moved into my old neighborhood, and I can attest it is one of the most well-run companies I've seen. The stores are huge, the selection is tremendous, and the focus on building a positive customer experience is intense.

Wegman's seems to be a little more serious about their customer database and the quality of data it contains. My mother-in-law tried to use my wife's Wegman's loyalty card, and they checked her ID and wouldn't let her use it. I would really like to see the type of things they're doing with their DW.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[infiniti99]

in Los Angeles, we had a great grocery chain called Gelson's that was impeccably run, had no lines, and had beautiful stores

Yeah, because it costs an arm and a leg to shop there. At least at the bakery and deli, you can spend nearly double what you would at a typical supermarket (like $12 for a pound of turkey?!) Of course, the quality at Gelson's can't be beat, so I guess you get what you pay for. I only did full grocery shopping there once, during the supermarket strikes, and I will say I enjoyed my $10 pumpkin bread loaf.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Anonymous Coward]

My mother-in-law tried to use my wife's Wegman's loyalty card, and they checked her ID and wouldn't let her use it.

They ask for ID before they let you buy bread? What is this, the Soviet Union?

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[archen]

I shop at Wegmans quite often but I actually stopped using my shoppng card. I assumed you needed it to get "regular prices" (ala price chopper) but on an average $40 worth of groceries I usually save about 24 cents. If they'd like to collect all of this data, they should at least give us an incentive for us giving it to them.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[daviddennis]

Compare Gelson's with Whole Foods, though, and it looks downright cheap.

I did control for quality when I mentioned price, though. Their boneless chicken breasts were the best, at $7.99 a pound. Ralph's was a lot cheaper but didn't look nearly as good. They put a lot of care into deboning and deskinning the chicken at Gelson's, and you could really see a difference.

D

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Anonymous Coward]

Wegmans is definitely the best run company I have ever had the pleasure of shopping at. But, the best part about this company is that their policy is NOT, "The customer is always right." Their policy is, "Treat the employee right, and the customer will be happy." They stick to this very well. Wegmans has been rated the number 1 company to work for in Forbes magazine. It almost makes me want to go there and start ringing up gorceries.

As for their club card, one thing many people don't understand is that this card is not necessarily there to save a person money. Instead, it exists to collect data, and if you buy Wegman's products (AKA, the generic stuff, which I actually like better than the regular stuff). But, you can tell that they are really keeping an eye on their data. For example, as trends go one direction or another, you see those items getting pulled into the more visible areas of the store and, sometimes, put on sale for brief periods of time.

As for Walmart - they just tried to put a Super Walmart in my area (Rochester, NY). Now, I did shop there once to check it out. But...no thanks. Walmart's store does not even come close to what they have at Wegmans. And, I could not get it for as cheap, either. And, to top it all off, Walmart does not have Wegman's (in)famous candy section. (I'm talking about the REAL candies that you scoop yourself from the little containers that are dirt cheap.)

Mmmm...candies...

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[NormalVisual]

Publix also is entirely employee-owned and doesn't deal with this "loyalty card" crap to begin with. Translation - they don't charge you a penalty for not providing them with data on your purchases.

I think Publix is probably about the best supermarket chain I've shopped in, but I will say that Sainsbury's in England has by far the best store-brand potato chips. :-)

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Profane MuthaFucka]

Obviously you don't know what people want in a car either. The biggest factor you forgot is *style*. GM makes ugly and inoffensive cars, but no beautiful cars.

The fact that the Toyota absolutely NAILED the American hip-hop submarket with their boxy Scion while sitting in their offices 10,000 miles away ought to scare the living shit out of GM. They've managed to figure out how to sell 10 year old styling to old people (and not in Korea either) but that's about it.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[pthisis]

In Pittsburgh, where I am now, the local grocery market is such a depressing place that I'm shifting my grocery shopping to Wal-Mart. It's cheaper and service is actually friendlier.

At least a few years ago, the Giant Eagle in Squirrel Hill was pretty good . Of course, nothing beats going down to the strip district if you have the time.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[kuom]

I live in Southern Nevada, and we have Sunflower, which is not only very service oriented, but has a large selection of organic food. I was used to the higher mark-ups of Trader Joe's for organic food, and was pleasantly surprised that Sunflower provide the same (or better) food for the same price or lower. What really attracts my wife and I there is the low prices and very friendly services. We once were looking for some Japanese konnyaku, and they didn't have it, but the manager was eager to write down the spelling and kept asking what the product is, so he can get it on the shelf for his customers. These folks take customer service seriously. In fact, I heard that they are doing so well, with so much demand, they are opening up another location in the area.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[rkcarter]

I was just noticing the difference between some stores -- I notice a lot of cashiers these days ask you "did you find everything you were looking for?" I used to auto-answer "yes" (like "have a nice day") but now I answer honestly. I have discovered that approximately half the people just sort of smile and say "oh sorry" or ignore me when I say I didn't find some particular thing; the other half actually have had people go back and double-check, or take down the info as a suggestion, etc. It varies but it's helping me decide where to re-shop.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[StarsAreAlsoFire]

My mother-in-law tried to use my wife's Wegman's loyalty card, and they checked her ID and wouldn't let her use it.

And you think this is okay? Are you insane? I can't understand how anyone can consider these bullshit 'loyalty' cards a good thing... But to ID someone to make sure they are using their own card?

Why not just require a customer to show their ID? Bypass this BS loyalty card shit completely.

Wake up.

DON'T SHOP AT STORES THAT SCREW YOU FOR NOT USING THEIR DATA COLLECTION SCHEME! Then guess who goes out of business if they don't change their ways?

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Anonymous Coward]

For example, as trends go one direction or another, you see those items getting pulled into the more visible areas of the store and, sometimes, put on sale for brief periods of time.

"Which?" magazine in the UK (a consumer testing magazine) has a good article this month about how supermarkets layout their stores. Be assured that they are not reacting to popularity of items, they are driving popularity of items (the ones with the highest markup) by placing them where they know customers will look.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Anonymous Coward]

holy crap!

As a person who regularly keys in my co-workers home phone numbers to circumvent the "loyally" crap. I am appalled.

How dare they not let me screw with their database!

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Anonymous Coward]

Gelson's also has (usually) plenty of hot chicks shopping there ...

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[toddestan]

The fact that the Toyota absolutely NAILED the American hip-hop submarket with their boxy Scion

This is getting off topic, but I thought it was Chrysler that nailed the hip-hop market with that goofy looking sedan that has the big ass grill on the front. Not that the Scion doesn't do half bad either.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[adpowers]

Unfortunately, it seems most chains are requiring these cards these days. And by require, I mean you get the increased prices if you don't use them. QFC is 1/4 the distance of any other grocery store from my house, and very easy to bike to, but if I ever start using Safeway, I'll be sure to use someone else's club card.

As for the grandparent, I don't consider huge store size a redeeming factor.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Anonymous Coward]

And you don't understand the domestic market, not to mention you don't know much about the car market.

With the Scion brand, Toyota finally "got it." The Scion brand was developed for the exact reason you state against GM--Toyota was getting walked over. They were seen as makers of conservative cars with little styling. Toyota was selling nearly only to the older generations. Scion was developed for the SOLE reason to capture the younger generation market.

If you were to be fair, you would have to see what GM's response will be.

iow, Toyota adapted to the US market. Finally. After they failed for years to capture the younger generation market. Somehow, a recent success is YOUR reason as THE reason why Toyota is going to walk over GM? Please.

GM's conservative approach is the exact reason why they do fine domesticly. Most buyers are trying to save money and keep their automobiles 10-15 years. Conservative styling makes that vehicle still look okay in that time, not some dated then-in styling that has past its prime. They want that sort of conservative styling as a choice, not to mention style is secondary to utility.

Such an attitude is standard-faire for the US market. So while you mention Toyota nailed the hip-hop market, one robin does not make spring or whatever the saying is. Toyota missed the SUV market, which GM and Ford WALKED ALL OVER the imports on for YEARS.

Again, the whole reason why Scion was developed was because Toyota was bleeding and saw they were missing out. Scion is also, as you noted, selling to the hip-hop and generally younger buyers, to the exclusion of the older buyers who also tend to buy vehicles with a higher margin, which was the SUV for some time now. Toyota is doing well but still missing out. It has yet to be seen what might happen when the lower-end market becomes more crowded when the Chinese cars start in, much like the already Korean imports did about 8 years ago.

Scion also has yet to prove whether they will build brand loyalty. Will people come back to buy another Scion or a Toyota or Lexus, the same way the Dodge Neon for the mid 90s tended to make people come back to Chrysler for their next vehicle? I think hip-hop is a fad, and Scion is going to die much like the Geo line did for GM years ago.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Profane MuthaFucka]

They also did a good job on that market. I just want to point out that GM in particular makes some ass looking cars, and they show a complete level of incompetence in market understanding.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[Profane MuthaFucka]

We're picking on GM right now. What is past and what is future is irrelevant. In the future, we'll pick on whoever sucks at that time.

If you like, we can compare the Chevy Classic to the Honda Civic. Yet another case where GM sucks badly compared to the competition.

Re:Wegmans v. General Motors

[bedroll]

I'm obviously a bit late to this conversation, but I like to read threads if I come across an interesting metamod.

What's so interesting about this thread is how completely clueless the posters seem to be about Scion, and even GM.

Scion wasn't some huge awakening with billions spent. It's the re-branding of vehicles that Toyota has sold for years in Japan. The xB is a typical Japanese-style car, minimized footprint with maximize space. It also steals most of it's design from the Nissan Cube. So what is the revolutionary concept that Toyota should be credited for with Scion? They FINALLY brought vehicles that the rest of the world enjoys to the US! That's it. It's not a huge engineering revolution; it's not that these vehicles were designed to fit the hip-hop scene; and it surely isn't why they're gaining on GM.

GM is actually another car company that recently realized that they might do well to import models sold in other countries. The problem is that they picked Australia, instead of Europe. Europe enjoys a wide range of stylish and economic vehicles. Americans tend to get the high end of those vehicles but miss out on the low end. There might be technical reasons why they don't do this, but if Toyota, Honda, and Ford can design world platforms why can't GM, right?

Well, the reasoning why GM has so many problems designing a world car goes straight to the heart of why they're losing market share. They have not innovated since the early 80's at best. They've been spending too much time fighting with the unions, fighting with management that thinks people want new cars the drive like old cars, and trying to figure out any way they can to lower the cost of making cars. They have no time or money to spend on figuring out more efficient manufacturing. The Japanese have had nothing but that time, they were growing their infrastructure, not trying to reshape it.

So, while Toyota was developing a process where every component provider was held to strict standards and thoroughly inspected GM was trying to keep every contract as cheap as possible. While Toyota was honing their assembly lines to have the minimal amount of work done with maximal results (more hands almost always means more chances to mess up) GM was busy fighting with unions that streamlining would cause job cuts and robots replaced a few humans. While Toyota was looking for a practical, if temporary, solution to the world's limited oil supply GM was forced to spend all its research money on hydrogen fuel cell technology in an effort to beat them to the next big thing. (People screaming "Honda!" should take note that GM has spent more on research into the technology to make decent vehicles from it and how to make the fuel more efficiently, GM has fuel cell vehicles but doesn't have the money to put out a small fleet of them at a loss just for PR.)

GM should do everything it can to track and reward it's brand loyalty because that's all GM has right now. Their management finally is starting to "get it", but it really seems to be too little too late. I doubt that the government will let them completely fold (they bailed out Chrysler in the past), but they will lose the number one spot, and they won't get it back in the foreseeable future. In the mean time, who really cares considering that all the foreign companies are producing much of their products in the US anyway. There's more US manufacturing going on in the 2006 line up of Toyotas than there is in Chrysler.

swap your loyalty cards...

[t0mhannen]

I seem to remember a hackers conference where it was suggested that everyone should bring along their loyalty cards, and then do a swap.

If enough people did this, the databases would suddenly start to pick up on unexpected trends - customers whose profile suggested eating tofu and lettuce would suddenly be buying cigarettes and crisps etc.

It seemed like rather an interesting idea to me...

Re:swap your loyalty cards...

[gclef]

I'm always surprised that more people don't just lie on their card forms. Sure, you miss out on the mailed coupons, but the amusement factor of having a clerk try to address you by name when it says "Bozo T. Clown" on their screen is worth it.

Re:swap your loyalty cards...

[Misanthropy]

My local supermarkets all have those cards. You need them to get the good prices. My solution to the database issue is: never get a card using your real name (that and pay cash). Maybe if they get enough George Bushes and Bill Gates in their database they'll finally ditch the scheme.

Seriously, do I really want there to be a record of my May 12th purchase of vaseline, latex gloves, a plunger, and a case of malt liqour? At least no record with my name attached. If they want to keep a database to find out that people who drink malt liquor also buy vaseline, that's cool.
Just not, "Misanthropy buys malt liquor and vaseline every third teusday."

Re:swap your loyalty cards...

[starling]

I always thought it would be fun to hack the code that prints out savings coupons based on your purchases.

You buy a box of cakes and a tub of ice-cream? Get 10% off a Slim-Kwik[TM] diet plan.

Buy veggie-burgers? Special offer on veal cutlets!

Re:swap your loyalty cards...

[Forbman]

...or, you happen to move from one area where one chain of stores is owned by the same parent corporation as a different chain where you're moving to.

I make it a point to use my Dominick's card whenif I happen to shop at a Safeway. I don't care one bit that it's linked to my old address in Illinois, same with my Jewel/Osco card when buying chocochip cookies at Albertson's.

I guess I try to keep my shopping rather local if I can, even if it costs more and the service seems to be worse (yeah, right) than the big chains.

Do I know the owners of Roth's Grocery stores in Oregon? Nope. But I'd rather do that then help make Safeway, Wal-Mart or Alberton's any richer than I have to. Yes, they employ people in the area, but so does Roth's, so that argument is moot to me.

Re:swap your loyalty cards...

[mr.scoot]

Hm. I do tend to use such lovely names as "Marketing Asshats" when filling out registration forms for certain idiotic websites (mostly newspapers). I suppose that could be extended to shopper cards. "Marketing Asshat", "Dataminer Fuckhead", "Corporate AssRapery". MIght make for sme strange looks at those stores that insist cashiers watch for your name and say "Thank you Mr AssHat Fuckhead! Please come again!".

Re:swap your loyalty cards...

[sconeu]

When my local Albertson's went evil (I used to shop there because they had *NO* card), the card app had a check box where you said "I don't want to give any info, just give me the bloody card". I didn't give any info. Now I just have to be careful to use only cash with that card, and I get the bennies plus anonymity.

Whats the news?

[Anonymous Coward]

Welcome to the world of datawarehousing which has been going on for more than a decade. How is this news?

Re:Whats the news?

[Rosco P. Coltrane]

Welcome to the world of datawarehousing which has been going on for more than a decade. How is this news?

It's news because it's turning into a giant datawhorehousing these days...

Re:Whats the news?

[bigsimes]

You are not wrong, these guys are still selling 80's collected (electoral roll, sweeping) data to other orgs when a HUGE percentage have gone away, died e.t.c. Moving into a new home recently I received several of the same 'qualified' list mailings for the same product, addressed to 5 different names.

The time I see a commercial offer with a returnable card saying 'are we writing to the right person?' on it I'll believe big co's give a shit about our info.

The problem is most people will think 'hey, i've just got five coupons for $shit', then THEIR name goes on the list, so next time they get SIX!

Re:Whats the news?

[ferespo]

It's news because it's turning into a giant datawhorehousing these days...

I disagree.

It is a well known fact that Telcos' DWs are the biggest ones.

I worked for a Telco in Argentina. Their DW has 1.500 millon records for long-distance calls per year and 700 millon records for local calls ... per month.

I can't even imagine that number for an say american Telco. Even for an Indian or Chinese one.

Each call is associated with a name, of course.

Even they know when is the most probable time to call to offer you something, based on your calling pattern.

No big news here.

Re:Whats the news?

[netskip]

Walmart has long been a leader in the field of business intelligence and data warehousing. They wrote the book on it, literally. Long before Tesco.

It's not that I like shopping at Walmart. It doesn't appeal to me, but I admire their technology prowess.

Re:British Society Tracking Database

[Timesprout]

Here we like to call the remembering databases becase they remember the information we put in them.

No tracking necessary

[SlashEdsDoYourJobs]

...at least in some instances. For example:

Second, Tesco can adjust its shelves to suit the profile of the local area, or even the time of day. Tesco in Brixton, an area of south London settled by immigrants from the Caribbean, sells plantains, a kind of savoury banana that can also be found for sale on market stalls outside. Tesco stores in central London do not, but are instead designed around selling sandwiches to office workers at lunchtime and then ready-meals to them in the evening.

A database isn't needed for this. If the two Tescos were instead simply two unrelated corner shops, they'd still be selling different things. Local shops tend to do that - sell things that are in demand instead of things that are not in demand. No special database needed.

It's useful for other stuff though, like the article says, customer profiles means you can send a specific set of discount vouchers to each customer based on their preferences. You could get a similar effect by shipping all vouchers to all customers, but I suspect this would be less effective as most people are more likely to use a couple of vouchers that they find interesting rather than look through a booklet of dozens of vouchers to find ones that are interesting to them.

The dust jacket of a book that was to be sold in-store was recently altered because a Tesco buyer did not like it.

That's a bit silly, really. It leads to bland stuff that has been toned down to not offend anybody. Sure, if it offends a whole bunch of people, it might make sense to alter it, but one person?

Re:No tracking necessary

[djmurdoch]

The dust jacket of a book that was to be sold in-store was recently altered because a Tesco buyer did not like it.

That's a bit silly, really. It leads to bland stuff that has been toned down to not offend anybody. Sure, if it offends a whole bunch of people, it might make sense to alter it, but one person?

I think you misread the article. The Tesco buyer is a Tesco employee who buys for Tesco. It wasn't a customer buying from Tesco who complained.

Re:No tracking necessary

[syphoon]

By "Tesco buyer", they don't mean a normal retailer customer, but one of the Tesco employees who is responsible for buying stock to put on Tesco shelves. If they don't like the book cover, then it's not going to go on Tesco shelves.

Re:No tracking necessary

[SlashEdsDoYourJobs]

Ah, gotcha. That's terrible wording though.

Re:No tracking necessary

[grahammm]

No, it is not terrible wording, it is the correct and precise wording. In the retail instrustry (and probably others) the job title 'buyer' has been traditionally been applied to the people who select the goods and suppliers. Also the "buyer" for a large or prestigious retail organisation is a very senior position and is often treated as a VIP by suppliers and potential suppliers.

Re:No tracking necessary

[stefficus]

"...a buyer for Tesco" would, perhaps, have been a bit clearer. proper wording, fuzzy word placement.

Re:No tracking necessary

[cnettel]

The interesting point of a database would be to give other shops ideas about what products they should introduce, based on the success of similar introductions in shops with similar buyer patterns. In addition, one could hope that this would not be ridden by prejudice, but what actually sells well. They may not always coincide.

Re:No tracking necessary

[aussie_a]

A database isn't needed for this.

No, but it is needed to be able to sell it out to other companies.

I just don't get what's so different about Telco, or what is to make customers loyal to it. Telco:

• Tracks customer details and then sells it
• Stocks more of what sells well in the store and stocks less of what doesn't sell as well
• Mails customers discounts (I wonder if they ask permission before sending the spam?)
• Listen's to its employees
• Is trying to avoid legal action
• Has some "philanthropy" in an attempt to dissuade it's bad image.

To me, that's just business as normal for most big businesses. Where's the news?

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

Replace Tesco with Cheep shit, their policy is, find a product and squeeze the producer until they end up using wood chippings as packing, most of their customers are getting fatter and eating too many carbs so diabetes is on the cards.

It doesn't matter if they tone things down, none of their shoppers are intelligent enough to appreciate it in the fist place.

Re:No tracking necessary

[kerrbear]

By "Tesco buyer", they don't mean a normal retailer customer

Since they're so worried about the customer, do you think they could find a way to speed up the huge lines you have to wait in to buy stuff. The Tesco in Edinburgh I frequented was as big as a shoebox and had 1/2 hour waits :-P

Re:No tracking necessary

[Dunbal]

"...a buyer for Tesco" would, perhaps, have been a bit clearer.

purchase engineer?

acquisition specialist?

procurement manager?

      Can't think of any more ;)

Re:No tracking necessary

[Threni]

> most of their customers are getting fatter and eating too many carbs so diabetes
> is on the cards.

It's fat that makes you fat (and is linked with diabetes), not carbs. I wouldn't take that Atkins diet too seriously - it's going right out of fashion.

Re:No tracking necessary

[forgotmyotheraccount]

A database isn't needed for this. If the two Tescos were instead simply two unrelated corner shops, they'd still be selling different things.

Thats the point. Tesco is not a corner shop. Its a huge corporation that buys massive quantities of goods and ships them to multiple locations to sell in different markets. In order to exploit their buying capacity and basic all round size they do need some serious tech to get it right.

Sure unrelated corner shops would stock a diverse range of items and possibly meet market demand based on the local knowledge. Tesco wants to meet all demand in all markets where it can make a possibly profit.

Absolutely they need a database to compete with local knowledge.

Re:No tracking necessary

[SlashEdsDoYourJobs]

Absolutely they need a database to compete with local knowledge.

"Tesco" isn't some big brain residing at the centre of the UK dishing out stock. Tesco don't need to compete with local knowledge because they have local knowledge. The local store managers have it. The local store managers don't need a database to tell them what local people want to buy because they see it every day they go to work.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

'It's fat that makes you fat (and is linked with diabetes), not carbs.'

Oh, really? you don't know too much about fat metabolism do you?

Just the basics, shot chain carbohydrates are absorbed into the blood stream faster than fat creating an effect called a 'sugar rush' followed by a craving for more food. ergo, sugar and short chain carbs are 'addictive' encouraging people to eat more and more making them fat.
Once the 'sugar' has entered you blood stream you liver will start to produce insulin to turn any unburnt sugars into FAT, noting the two key words, insulin and fat.... you know when you liver is overworked producing insulin it kinda stops working properly after a while and any guesses what that's called, ummm.... well done diabetes, and any guesses what that fat does? that's right it makes you fat.

insulin dependant diabetics are often quite thin because their body doesn't have enough insulin to make the fat that makes you fat, that's why sugar in your urine is a sign of diabetes, because the sugar hasn't been turned into fat.

'I wouldn't take that Atkins diet too seriously - it's going right out of fashion.'

since when did fashion follow logic, like the fashion of people going to tesco to eat shit, oh that's right there not intelligent...

I suggest you do a bit of digging on fat metabolism lookup ketosis for a start, then try looking up how HDL and LDL cholesterols are formed.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

sorry insulin is produced by the pancreas but it affects the liver. insulin forces fat cells to take in glucose which is converted to triglycerides;

Re:No tracking necessary

[Dunbal]

It's fat that makes you fat (and is linked with diabetes), not carbs.

      Incorrect.

      Fat makes you fat.

      Excess carbohydrates are turned INTO fat as well. Glucose is turned into pyruvate and enters the Krebs cycle. One of the products of the Krebs cycle is citrate, and when there is too much citrate, it is exits from the mitochondra (where the Krebs cycle occurs) and goes into the cytoplasm.

      Here it is converted to oxaloacetate (which doesn't cross the mitochondrial wall) and acetyl CoA. This is called the citrate shuttle (since the oxaloacetate eventually gets back into the mitochondria via malate and later pyruvate).

      The acetyl CoA is converted to Malonyl Coa by an enzyme called Acetyl CoA Carboxylase. Insulin makes this enzyme more active.

      Malonyl CoA is then turned into a fatty acid (palimitic acid) by the action of Fatty Acid Synthase. Insulin also increases the activity of this enzyme.

      Most of this occurs in the liver. The fatty acids are then exported and end up in the adipose tissue (fat cells).

      Carbohydrates can be turned into fat or protein.

      Proteins can be turned into fat or carbohydrates.

      Fat can only be turned into Acetyl CoA, which can only be burned as fuel (or reassembled to make more fat).

      Notice how all the pathways point towards the production of fat, and only one pathway leads away from fat. This is a survival mechanism to ensure the adequate storage of excess "fuel" in times of plenty, for when we run out of food. The problem is in modern western society, the time of plenty never ends. Solution: a moderate diet and exercise, exercise, exercise.

      I happen to know what I am talking about here, it took quite a few years of suffering to earn those degrees on my wall. I like to think I learned something.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

I didn't say that fat doesn't make you fat, I said that carbs make you fatter due to the addictive nature of the sugar rush.

fat intake also benefits levels of HDL cholesterol and carbohydrates increase levels of LDL cholesterol and transitional lipids like VLDL, but you should know that. This isn't actkins hype, males in my family have a long history of dieing from heart attacks below the age of 60 so you might say I have a vested interst in fat metabolism. And no, I don't eat fat, I'm a white meat and fruit guy.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Threni]

> since when did fashion follow logic, like the fashion of people going to tesco
> to eat shit, oh that's right there not intelligent...

You don't generally eat in Tescos (although they have small cafes in some of the largers stores so you can take a break from shopping) as it's a supermarket chain. I buy a lot of food from there, although not much of it is high in fat - I tend to go for protein and carbohydrates. And beer.

Fashion never follows logic in the long run. People tried the Atkins diet but it was just a fad which won't work in the long run.

> Just the basics, shot chain carbohydrates are absorbed into the blood stream
> faster than fat creating an effect called a 'sugar rush' followed by a craving
> for more food. ergo, sugar and short chain carbs are 'addictive' encouraging
> people to eat more and more making them fat.

Non-sequitur. You know as much about addiction as you know about diet. There's nothing addictive about simple carbohydrates, in the sense that eating them over a long period of time causes physical dependance.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

'There's nothing addictive about simple carbohydrates, in the sense that eating them over a long period of time causes physical dependence.'

How come all the fat people I know eat chips and chocolate? You've never tried to diet have you, even though you have ample fat to keep you alive for a good few months you'll start to feel like hell has frozen over and crave food, sound like addiction to me.

The general definition of addiction is...
"An illness in which a person seeks and consumes a substance, such as alcohol, tobacco or a drug, despite the fact that it causes harm."
It doesn't have to be physical it can be psychological, but i think if you look up the chemistry of dieting you'll find that it's both a physical and psychological addiction to sugar and short chain carbohydrates.

infact a quick google for "Eating sugar causes addiction" turns up about 750,000 pages that must be utter crap. given that sweet foods are generally not poisonous it makes sense for humans to be sugar addicts and children to crave sweet food. I suggest you get a better dietitian.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Cerv]

Unless there's more than one Tesco in Edinburgh now I think I know exactly which store you mean. As long as you avoid 5 to 8 o'clock and lunch times on weekdays you shouldn't have to queue for more than a couple of minutes.

It's still got overpriced crappy fruit and vegetables and an awful selection of everything at any time of the day though.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Alan Partridge]

Why did you frequent it, then? You know, competition only works if you actually vote with your feet and shop elsewhere.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Pete]

you know when you liver is overworked producing insulin it kinda stops working properly after a while and any guesses what that's called, ummm.... well done diabetes,

It's not the liver that produces insulin, it's the pancreas.

I'll be nice and assume that was just a brain fart, as otherwise you seem to have at least a rough idea what you're talking about. ;-)

Re:No tracking necessary

[1u3hr]

"...a buyer for Tesco" would, perhaps, have been a bit clearer

The words "Tesco buyer" are unambiguous. What else could it have meant? Someone making a takeover bid for the Tesco company? A "Tesco customer" is a person who "buys from Tesco".

Re:No tracking necessary

[Dunbal]

I didn't say that fat doesn't make you fat, I said that carbs make you fatter due to the addictive nature of the sugar rush.

Maybe that's what you meant, but that's not what you said. Unfortunately my mind reading skills are not up to speed.

      What you said is (and I quote):

"It's fat that makes you fat (and is linked with diabetes), not carbs. I wouldn't take that Atkins diet too seriously - it's going right out of fashion."

      I don't see any mention about fat not making you fat, in fact it says quite the opposite. It says "It's fat that makes you fat". It also doesn't say that carbs make you fatter. One could imply by your saying "not carbs" that you meant that carbohydrates in fact are less fattening than fat. Nor does it say anything about addictive sugar rushes anywhere in your post.

      Now I replied initially because I happen to know a great deal about the human body, how it works, how it is affected by disease, and how to treat disease. That's basically what we physicians do. I couldn't just sit by and let some (more) disinformation occur. Plus docere in latin means "to teach" and the word doctor is strongly linked to the meaning of "teacher". So I saw an opportunity for education. It's something I enjoy.

      If you insist in changing the words of your argument midstream however there's very little point in discussing anything at all. This sort of defeats the whole purpose of posting, really. Kind of sad that you are unwilling to concede a point and show denial to such a great extent. I wonder what else is happening.

      Anyway, have a great day! I guess I should get some work done...

Re:No tracking necessary

[Dunbal]

Great post, except for this part:

you know when you liver is overworked producing insulin

      Insulin is actually produced in the B cells of the Islets of Langerhans in the pancreas, not the liver. It has been shown that high blood glucose levels are in fact TOXIC for these B cells in some people (there is a genetic predisposition). It's one of the theories that helps explain type 2 diabetes, as your B cells end up dying over time insulin production decreases. It's not the whole story though. Type 2 diabetes is quite a complicated disease and we're only just beginning to understand it.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Dunbal]

We're strolling way off topic here ;)

      Addiction is defined in many ways. One general version of addiction we use in medicine is:

      Anything that produces physiological or psychological change and habit seeking behaviour when the substance is withdrawn is addictive. This is not a verbatim quote, it's from memory, but you get the gist.

      By that token, air is addictive. So is water. So is all food, for that matter, including carbohydrates. To prove it, I can guarantee that you are psychologically addicted to these things - if I take them away you will undergo a behaviour change. They are also physically addictive, you will change your physiology and you will die if I take them away. You will also fight me as much as you can to get these things back. Just not for very long, in the case of air ;)

      The craving for sweet food is probably another consequence of our low risk, high reward, instant gratification society. This is probably behaviour more than anything else. Sweets come in shiny, brightly coloured packages, they don't need preparation, and they taste good. Plus you get the added satisfaction of knowing you are doing something you shouldn't, and "getting away with it" (although you might not be).

      There is a huge drive to sell carbohydrates to people - they don't spoil as quickly as other food types and they are easy to manufacture, store and transport. Look at the amount of floor space dedicated to carbohydrates in your local supermarket and compare it to other foods.

      Poor eating habits (ie choice of foods) and lack of enough exercise are the explanation for the obesity epidemic in the West. Cardiologists have job security for many years to come :)

Re:No tracking necessary

[aslate]

It's useful for other stuff though, like the article says, customer profiles means you can send a specific set of discount vouchers to each customer based on their preferences.

On a recent TV programme about Tesco they covered this scheme. When they send out their vouchers on a 3 month basis they get a sales boom equivalent to Christmas!

And by using the loyalty card scheme, their store profiles match the UK consumer profiles (By income) almost exactly.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Anonymous Coward]

It is still the writer's fault. The point was not communicated clearly. I also misread the phrase.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Threni]

>One general version of addiction we use in medicine is:
>Anything that produces physiological or psychological change and habit seeking
>behaviour when the substance is withdrawn is addictive. This is not a verbatim
>quote, it's from memory, but you get the gist.

It's bollocks. It's not anything I recognize as addiction, anyway. You could apply that to cannabis, sex, music... I can't see that definition being any use, really whatsoever. Certainly by that yardstick addiction isn't negative at all, something that's not true of, say, physically addictive things.

> There is a huge drive to sell carbohydrates to people - they don't spoil as
> quickly as other food types and they are easy to manufacture, store and
> transport. Look at the amount of floor space dedicated to carbohydrates in your
> local supermarket and compare it to other foods.

Yeah, they're good for you too.

> Poor eating habits (ie choice of foods) and lack of enough exercise are the
> explanation for the obesity epidemic in the West. Cardiologists have job
> security for many years to come :)

Sure, but it's because of sugary or fatty things, not because people are eating too much pasta, potatoes and bread! It's all the pizza, kebabs, burgers, chips, crisps, sweets, chocolate and beer people consume, matched by a lack of excercise.

Re:No tracking necessary

[kerrbear]

It's still got overpriced crappy fruit and vegetables and an awful selection of everything at any time of the day though

Agreed. Which makes the point of the article moot in my opinion. Sanesbury's was better, but it was further away from me so I ended up at the Tesco more often than I would like.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Tony Hoyle]

They never sent me a voucher..

mutter..grumble.. free donuts...

Re:No tracking necessary

[Tony Hoyle]

He's just parroting atkins dogma..

unfortunately it's been proven not to be so (can't find the link but I'm sure google will throw up a study or three) - atkins diet makes you thinner, not because of the lower carbs, but because you increase protein intake (ie. you eat things like steak which are high protein). The protein makes you feel full so you eat less...

So you're really eating less fat too.. you just don't realize you are.

I've done a few nonscientific experiments and the basic idea works.. for example if you eat a fry up for breakfast.. loads of fat but also loads of protein, you don't feel hungry until lunchtime.. no mid-morning snacks... lower overall calorie intake.

Re:No tracking necessary

[heinousjay]

Damn man, you went off on that guy and it was the wrong poster. I guess your fancy education didn't cover reading comprehension.

Re:No tracking necessary

[murky_lurker]

I worked at that Tesco, and found it the equivalent to working in a pressure cooker. I avoid it like the plague these days.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

Wrong guy, I said sugar rush. both protein and fat keep you 'filled up' for longer so if you cut out carbs you don't get a sugar rush and don't eat so much. Your just reading Atkins dogma because you don't believe that carbs have a greater chance of making you fat (obese) and not necessarily fat, do you also believe global warming is a lie, or that God exists, maybe you eat Tesco food?
If something isn't true you can get a whole tonne of google links to scientific studdies that prove it's not true, not just one link.

Ok, Vitamin B3 comes in two forms, niacinamide and nicotinic acid, one of them is involved in cholesterol levels, go look them up. I don't see why you fail to believe that I have actually looked this shit up a long time before Atkins came along, and I'm not even spouting Atkins, I'm talking about the sugar rush, diabities and HDL/LDL cholesterol levels.

Go look up Omega oils (3,6,9) Linsceed/Flax oil, fatty fish, mioline, lorenzos oils.

Go look up ADHD and Blood Sugar levels.

Along with the shit (salt, sugar, refined carbs, more sugar, wheat gluten, and probably wood chippings, oh and a tiny bit of fat since fat is 'bad') that they put into Tesco food, this shit is addictive so it's not supprising that consumer studdies show that it's popular.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

I guess you didn't notice that I replied to my own post 'sorry insulin is produced by the pancreas but it affects the liver. insulin forces fat cells to take in glucose which is converted to triglycerides;'

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

The craving for sweet food is probably another consequence of our low risk, high reward, instant gratification society. This is probably behavior more than anything else. Sweets come in shiny, brightly coloured packages, they don't need preparation, and they taste good. Plus you get the added satisfaction of knowing you are doing something you shouldn't, and "getting away with it" (although you might not be).

You appear to be trying to be 'scientific' but you don't know a lot do you? I hope you not an MD? maybe one that eats at Tesco?

The body tries to balance out the body chemistry any change usually results in a 'withdrawl' and a craving for that which is missing. Sugar has a special place to play in human body chemistry, we all need sugar in our blood to provide energy and help us concentrate, people with ADHD are found to have low blood sugar levels. When you take sugar you body descides that it's better to have too much than too little, because you body doesn't release insulin straight away you end up getting a sugar rush, this affects all parts of the body and can result in a seritonin rush, eating makes you feel good, so good that a compulsive eater will keep eating until they are sick. One method of controling compulsive eating is a fairly high dosage level of SSRI's and other anti-depresants that work by raising seritonin levels. blah blah blah blah blah....... I would have been far easier for me to cut and paste (no spelling mistakes) so as I said, go do some reading.

As for the brightly coloured packets, that's crap humans (and other mammals like Dogs who being colour blind don't give too shits about brightly coloured packets) like the taste of sweet food, it fucks with out little heads and make us go mad like a crack head. I believe it has been shown that children crave sweet food more than tart (and often alcaline) food, I certainly have a lot of imperial evidence to back this up. Now, before the days of brightly coloured packets when we were all in the swap (your not a creationist are you?) why would we 'crave' sweet food? Thats right because 'sweet' foods tend not to be poisionous where as tart foods often tend to be full of alcaloids and their commonly poisionous. It has been shown that women during pregency often crave highly refined foods because of a responce to toxins in the blood.

I don't have any quarms about sweet food, it's all just crap that's sold to us by the coperations nore do I give to shits about brightly coloured packaging, and yet I still get a sugar rush, and still sometime crave sweet foods (often when ill).

What was it you said you do?

BTW, I do thing that the 'office' job has equally as much to answer for as the shit that they feed us, not only because we sit on our ass all day but because you end up at the mercy of the sandwitch van, the pub meal and the sweet and crisp machine. I used to have the school 400 and 3000 meters records (and always came first), I used to be like a stick and eat well (plenty of vedge low salt and sugar) until I started working in an office.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

You could apply that to cannabis, sex, music... , twat, fucking moronic twat, you do eat at Tesco don't you, Jesus that shit food has a lot to answer for.

Ok, sex releases amongst other things dopamine, know what that is? that's right it's that stuff that gets released when you smoke a crack pipe, so yeh I'd say sex may be a tad addictive. (BTW You don't get many physical withdraw symptoms when you come off of crack, your not trying to say it isn't addictive are you?)

Shit loads of people will tell you that their psychologically hooked on cannabis, so much so that stopping causes depression which is a real physical as well as mental illness.

As for music, well that helps with alpha wave and makes you feel 'good' and if something makes you feel good it's an adictive nerochemical that's doing that too. (not God).

Yeah, they're good for you too.

Ok, long chain carbs and water soluable fiber are pretty good for you, they reduce the risk of bowel cancer for a start.

short chain carbs (sugars, white bread, starch, potatoes) are good for you in the same way that crack is good for you, a little crack and you performance will improve, too much and you fucked. Basically you might as well deprive yourself of insulin and stick a block of lard under you skin instead of eating sugars, because that's exactly what happens when you eat them.

Re:No tracking necessary Re:No tracking necessary (Score:1) by Threni (635302) Alter Relationship on Saturday August 06, @01:07PM (#13258561) (http://poldie.fotopic.net/) >One general version of addiction we use in medicine is: >Anything that produces physiological or psychological change and habit seeking >behaviour when the substance is withdrawn is addictive. This is not a verbatim >quote, it's from memory, but you get the gist. It's bollocks. It's not anything I recognize as addiction, anyway. You could apply that to cannabis, sex, music... I can't see that definition being any use, really whatsoever. Certainly by that yardstick addiction isn't negative at all, something that's not true of, say, physically addictive things. > There is a huge drive to sell carbohydrates to people - they don't spoil as > quickly as other food types and they are easy to manufacture, store and > transport. Look at the amount of floor space dedicated to carbohydrates in your > local supermarket and compare it to other foods. Yeah, they're good for you too. > Poor eating habits (ie choice of foods) and lack of enough exercise are the > explanation for the obesity epidemic in the West. Cardiologists have job > security for many years to come :) Sure, but it's because of sugary or fatty things, not because people are eating too much pasta, potatoes and bread! It's all the pizza, kebabs, burgers, chips, crisps, sweets, chocolate and beer people consume, matched by a lack of excercise. In part, but pasta is just like sugar unless it's drum wheat pasta, white bread is a highly refined carbohydrate, you might as well just eat a few spoons full of sugar, stick to whole grain bread and you'll be ok. Potatoes, your kidding right? full of starch another short chain carb go for the boilers and not the mashers to keep the starch levels down otherwise eating potatoes is like eating from a bowel full of sugar. Oh, and try to avoid American long grain rice, stick to brown rice of basmati.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

By that token, air is addictive. So is water. So is all food, for that matter, including carbohydrates. To prove it, I can guarantee that you are psychologically addicted to these things - if I take them away you will undergo a behaviour change.

Ok, I drink 2-2.5 litres of water a day, I can cut this down to say 1 Litre with no side effects. Try doing that with someone hooked on sugar.

Also, I think if you took my air compleatly away I would die is a few minutes. reducing oxygen levels fairly quickly will result in altitude syckness, but a gradual reduction and you body will start to produce enough red blood cells to compensate. I don't start running round like a mad man after holding my breath for a few minutes.

I also take Quetiapine (I ran out a couple of days ago and boots fucked up my repeat, hence the slight manicness), now when I start taking it I have major psychological changes, for a start I stop thinking that everyones in some kind of plot against me, and the people who used to watch me, but then started carring guns just go back to watching me again. Now that That's like extream addiction (too much dopamine amoungst other things) but like crack addiction (another dopamine related problem) there's no 'real' physical side effects (there are psycotic physical side effects but their not real)...

Anyhow, I'm kinda glad because I couldn't tell reality from unreality I relled soley on what I could look up and factual information to keep myself going. Now a 'healthy' paranoia about what they put in the food, and my own family health problems lead me to do several months intensive reashearch into diet, fat metobilism etc... I may overstate things a 'little' but looking at the number of people getting fatter by the day I think more people need to tell them what's going on.

Re:No tracking necessary

[danila]

Me too. The problem is that the Economist's target audience does not consist solely of retail professionals and the author should have known that most readers are not familiar with the meaning of "buyer" in this context.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Threni]

> Shit loads of people will tell you that their psychologically hooked on
> cannabis, so much so that stopping causes depression which is a real physical as
> well as mental illness.

They are weak. But they are not addicted.

Re:No tracking necessary

[sykjoke]

Their not weak, they like it. You are weak because you fit into the rat race, if you were strong you would be smoking crack on street corners trying to change the fucking world.

Re:No tracking necessary

[Threni]

> Their not weak, they like it. You are weak because you fit into the rat race, if
> you were strong you would be smoking crack on street corners trying to change
> the fucking world.

Arnold Swartzenegger is strong and he's not smoking crack on street corners.

tracking devices

[stefficus]

shoppers use these kinds of cards at many u.s. grocery store chains already to get discounts and promotions. the biggest recurring complaint i hear is itchiness about privacy, and it's a little odd the article doesn't mention that at all. i mean, sure... they save a few dollars on your bill and add some clout to your pining for chive chip dip. but do you really want it on record that you bought crayons, vaseline and a spatula on your last stop at the corner market?

Re:tracking devices

[superpulpsicle]

In other news giant-supersized condoms became the top selling item in the UK as everyone try to get that on record.

Re:tracking devices

[Anonymous Coward]

Here in the UK, we have legislation that protects personal information. Tesco have a public declaration on how the information is used, and in general consumers are happy: http://www.tesco.com/clubcard/clubcard/index1.htm

If you don't want Tesco to know you've bought the Vaseline and a spatula, simply don't hand over your Clubcard when you buy.

Re:tracking devices

[stefficus]

"If you don't want Tesco to know you've bought the Vaseline and a spatula, simply don't hand over your Clubcard when you buy."

well, naturally - but then how do you get your discount, hmm? *grin*

Re:tracking devices

[Dunbal]

From the link:

"Data Protection Statement
We would like to use your details from the application form , plus details on how you use your Clubcard and what you buy in our stores, to:

  Help manage Tesco Clubcard and improve the way we run it
  Understand our customers' shopping habits to improve our service
  Unless you indicate otherwise, contact you with offers and information about products and services of interest to you and your family

We will share your details among Tesco companies at home and abroad (e.g. Tesco Personal Finance), and businesses that process Clubcard information on our behalf (e.g. printers who need certain details to print our mailings).

We may also use and share information relating to groups of customers, without identifying individuals, to learn more about customer behaviour and find ways of enhancing our service.
"

So their "data protection" is that basically they can give your personal data (from the application form, you know, the one that says NAME, ADDRESS, PHONE NUMBER and usually other things like OCCUPATION, MONTHLY INCOME) with anyone they choose. Only when they are looking at aggregate data (ie groups of customers and their spending habits) will they not identify you individually, which sort of makes sense if they are only concerned with the group.

      Wow that's some protection. I also don't see anywhere that you have the right to access, dispute and modify your file. YOUR file, not Tesco's file. Private companies are deluded in that they think the information belongs to THEM. The information actually belongs to YOU. Like YOUR medical record, which you can access, and YOUR criminal record, which you can also access, and YOUR credit record, which you can also access, dispute and modify.

Re:tracking devices

[grahammm]

And pay with cash rather than a credit card as they might be able to associate your use of the credit card with your previous purchases.

Re:tracking devices

[Dunbal]

well, naturally - but then how do you get your discount, hmm? *grin*

      Pssst! here...kid... wanna earn $5? Ummm never mind, I guess Michael Jackson already thought of that one...

Re:tracking devices

[gonzo-wireless]

Tesco has been caught invading privacy before with RFID tags in razor blades. A loyalty database is just one way that consumers are being milked. Here's the details from a previous /. article:

http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/08/22/03 27247&tid=158&tid=99

Re:tracking devices

[stefficus]

but... then... you, um, still don't get the discount, and you're out $5 for a gopher who's gonna pocket the crayons for him or herself. heh. fear not, i can think of all sorts of scenarios for discreetly buying 17 weebles and a pregnancy test.

however. the real point was, as i didn't think i'd have to spell out, precisely what you did spell out (thanky) elsewhere in this very thread: that they can and do use personal information and buying habits collected in this way for purposes other than giving shoppers discounts and tailoring what's on the store shelves to fit customer needs. did i still use the cards? yeah. did other people i knew use them even while kvetching about lack of privacy? sure. but it is an issue. besides that, it's the complaint i heard most from fellow shoppers, not the inconvenience of having to show them every time you bought something, and i thought the lack of even a mention of that in the article was noticeable.

i guess that's what i get for trying to be oblique but amusing. that'll learn me.

Re:tracking devices

[jrboatright]

The grocery chain (and tesco) really don't CARE about your identity. They are generally perfectly happy to give a loyalty card to a form made out to "Mickey Mouse" and an address of the local city office.

What they want is the BUYING PATTERNS... and they get this IRRESPECTIVE of your identity. The fact that people who buy Milk on Tuesday, also buy Boneless turkey thighs on Saterday is interesting. Who those people are is not terribly interesting.

This is why, chains with loyalty cards PRINT your discount coupons AT THE REGISTER as you go through. No wasting coupons mailing them to people who don't come in. No mailing cost, etc. And once again, your identity is of no consequence.

Go get the discount card. Put a fake name and an address four blocks over. They DON'T CARE....

Re:tracking devices

[Fulcrum of Evil]

So their "data protection" is that basically they can give your personal data (from the application form, you know, the one that says NAME, ADDRESS, PHONE NUMBER and usually other things like OCCUPATION, MONTHLY INCOME) with anyone they choose.

Read it again. They share your info with Tesco companies and businesses that process the info for them, which apparently means printers. No mention of sharing your home address with strategic partners or anything.

Re:tracking devices

[timthorn]

The only information Tesco get on income is from the amount you spend in store, unless you take out a financial product from them. And, the law in England permits you to see records about you in virtually all databases, and to have corrections made where the data is incorrect. They cannot store data that is unrelated to the purpose of the db - such as if you have a criminal record in this case.

Re:tracking devices

[birder]

Why can't they get this information from the scanner/cash registers then? What is the card doing that makes it a required part of this process?

Re:tracking devices

[LPetrazickis]

Well, the personalized card is supposed to make it seem that they are treating you like a human, not like "a number". We introduce ourselves to other people by our name, not by our social insurance or driver's license numbers. The card is intended to psychologically make it seem that the store is just being friendly and neighbourly. "Hi, Comrade Smith. Here's the discount that is YOURS and just YOURS because the card has YOUR name on it. Have a nice day."

It's ego-stroking. Doesn't work the same way on everyone.

Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[fruey]

The local Tesco store near where my parents live has killed most local commerce and the next town (5 miles away) suffered greatly until a supermarket was given permission to build a large store on a town centre site there.

It is more correct to say that the hypermarket has changed Britain, but Tesco happens to be by far the most successful example. IIRC the statistic is that 1 out of every 3 GBP spent in the UK is spent at Tesco.

In their defense they say "Tesco tries to see off criticism by arguing that it gives customers what they want and keeps staff happy." You could easily turn that around any say that they reinforce customer habits by offering them offers on their usually consumed high value items. You rarely see offers on bread, milk and sugar. Rather more on your favourite desserts and higher margin goods. By suggesting that others purchased Turkey Twizzlers with Claret and then offering other Turkey Twizzlers offers on Claret rather sounds like moving everyone towards a common denominator to me. But one thing is for sure, it sure sells product! So if your goal is to survive in the continual drive to make consumers consume more and more (and at credit too - with the Tesco credit card, Tesco loans and with a Tesco banking service) then you're onto a winner by being just like Tesco.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[s7uar7]

The village where I live is about 3 miles from the nearest Tesco and, one by one, the small family-run shops are closing. But they themselves are partly to blame - apart from Saturday mornings, they're closed when I'm at home. I would buy my meat fresh the butchers, fruit and veg from the greengrocer, and fresh bread from the bakers, but they don't give me that choice. If they stayed open late, just by a couple of hours, one day a week they'd get my business. At the moment the only people able to shop there are pensioners, the unemployed, housewives and shift workers.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[cliffski]

There are other reasons to be wary of the rise of the big supermarkets. in the UK channel 4 recently had a 2 part expose of supermarket food, and the conditions under which it is produced, together with some alarming statistics at how they have (through all sorts of chemicals in the feed etc) pushed the milk output of cows up and up and up, way beyond what might be considered normal. The cows dont graze normally, they are stood inside all day on concrete floors eating from piles of freshly mown grass. As a result, supermarket milk is now cheaper than bottled water, and the supermarkets keep it that way by turning thumbscrews on the suppliers. With the small stores and cornershops gone, no supplier dares anger the supermarkets or they will go out of business.
Supermarkets are massivly convenient, but that convenience comes a a price. The CH4 program did a like for like comparison of prices at a greengrocers and food market, and it turned out to be CHEAPER to buy from the market than from the supermarket.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[sykjoke]

I live in newbury, the place where shops are closing down at an astonishing rate. The local music shop blames downloads, but what they fail to realize is that the collage was rebuild, out of town a few years ago, and any one with any money is working whilst the shops are open leaving only the infirm and elderly left to buy goods.

What's worse is the local council is hard out on demolishing an area that is home to six local businesses and replacing it with a new shopping center, so that all those infirm and elderly people can shop in comfort.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[hachete]

"keeps staff happy". Umm. Tesco's staff - the bottom ranks - are amongst the lowest in the UK. I've talked to a few of their checkout people and they didn't seem that happy working for Tescos. It's a buyers market and Tesco's seem to know it. Of course, areas will differ.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[Tim Browse]

While I was waiting in a Tesco checkout queue, I happened to see a little laminated list of rules on the checkout till. Rules for checkout staff, that is.

My favourite entry was:

"Toilet breaks are not company policy."

Made me appreciate my job a little more, anyway.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[pbhj]

This is merely a reflection on how society has changed ... small local shops apparently haven't been in demand because everyone now wants to sit in an office all day and only go out in their cars.

It used to be that people got married, and stayed married, one of the couple went out to work and the other stayed closer to home. This freed one of the couple to do perhaps the most important work: child rearing, social cohesion and re-provisioning.

Now get this. In towns and cities, people would walk to local shops!!! So they didn't need to drive out of town to find a parking lot with a shop attached. They'd also buy from several stores. In the country, even in villages, they had shops too.

Now there are lots of things wrong with this sort of model - particularly if you're a capitalist (eg profits can't be maximised with small scale operations). But some of it seemed to work too.

WRT your particular situation. Lots of places now have "box schemes" where you can get fresh fruit and veg from local farmers/suppliers delivered to your door. Also, independent shops may be willing to change their hours. But, I agree - they could get a clue already. Based on your map on the Ivorsky website (header background suggest Chalfont St Giles, which has a Tesco!) - http://www.fieldfare-organics.com/index.html may be able to help.

I run an independent (non-food) local shop. We're pretty much open any time that we're asked + normal hours.

HTH

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[jrumney]

When I lived in a predominantly white middle-class area of London, I found even the corner shops had closed by the time I got home from work (after 7pm). I ended up having to buy a car, just so I could go shopping for essentials at the far from public transport ASDA not quite nearby.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[Anonymous Coward]

thats because the woman is supposed to stay home and take care of this shit. Really that is what we really should be offended about.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[Anonymous Coward]

IIRC the statistic is that 1 out of every 3 GBP spent in the UK is spent at Tesco.

How wrong, more like 1 in 7 GBP for groceries is spent at Tescos. 1 in 3 would make tescos by far the largest company in the UK, and certainly the largest grocery retailer in the world.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[gagravarr]

I go shopping at lunchtime. My office is 2 miles from a village with a number of little shops. Once or twice a week, I head to the village to collect the office sandwich order. While I'm there, I pop into the butchers (also does veg), the deli, and maybe the co-op.

So, I get to shop at local shops. Because I'm there at lunchtime, rather than the going-home-from-work crowd, it's much more pleasant. The small shops are often cheaper, have a nicer range of stuff, and can suggest things. You should try it!

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[danila]

This is mostly about marginal efficiency gains. It's not profitable for small shops to stay open at night, it's profitable for Tesco. So if small shops choose to work 24h, they lose some margin or need to increase prices. :(

Where I live, however, there is plenty of small 24h stores, because the labour is cheap and many people became accustomed to the convenience before the large chains arrived.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[stevey]

Here in Edinburgh I found the same thing. Instead I would walk to the large Tesco store every other Saturday and buy lots of shopping.

When you buy a lot you can then get a Taxi home - cost to me about a fiver.

Nowadays instead I just order online. Less hassle than dealing with a supermarket on a weekend with families and children and the delivery charge I can rationalise away as the fare I would have previously spent upon the taxi ride home.

Of course I still have to remember to buy milk + bread from the supermarket close to my work on the way home, but otherwise I'm good.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[caluml]

If they stayed open late, just by a couple of hours, one day a week they'd get my business.

My sentiments, exactly. I'd prefer to pay a little more and shop locally, for lovely bread, meat, fruit, etc. But if you work, you can't do it.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[wild_berry]

Tesco is the profit-making reincarnation of the old Co-op retail outfit. In the 50's onwards (it may be older than this), local co-operatives of shoppers ran shops for the good of people. The Co-op convenience stores you see sweeping over the convenience store market near me are a part of the CWS group. They are the people behind Co-operative Insurance Services -- who also sponsor Scotland's knock-out football cup -- Co-operative Financial Services -- who do the Internet bank 'Smile', the Co-operative Bank and investment services -- as well as a funeral service. Co-op has been running a loyalty card scheme for years, allowing people to get 'dividend' from purchases, but with less of a data-mining setup of Tesco. The difference between the Co-op and Tesco? Tesco is a business run for shareholders, Co-op a business run for its members -- who can be anyone.

Interestingly, supermarkets provide a singel convenient venue for all the shopping a family needed to do. The market's changing and picking up what's needed conveniently, from smaller and better-placed stores is an smack-in-the-face obvious point of growth in the grocery market.

Re:Tesco has changed Britain, but for the bettter?

[Anonymous Coward]

re: bread milk & sugar:
supermarkets sell these staples at a loss so they can get people in to buy more expensive stuff/tempt you with offers for stuff you didn't set out to buy.

Echoes of WalMart and Microsoft

[DaveRexel]

From the article "Tesco's power is causing resentment. Most openings of big new stores are greeted by fears for local shops and a campaign to keep Tesco out. Tesco suppliers refuse to talk about their relations with a Goliath that is not frightened of using its bargaining power. There is even a pressure group, Tescopoly, dedicated to breaking the company up. Responding to popular pressure, the Office of Fair Trading (OFT), a government agency, has asked if Tesco is too big, and looked at its relations with suppliers. This week it concluded again that the grocery market is working.

There is an urgent need for stricter laws governing the behavior of the mega-corporations and a brave and uncorrupted judiciary to enforce them.

Re:Echoes of WalMart and Microsoft

[jcnnghm]

Couldn't agree more. If you take all of these mega stores to the end there will be no more small business. Everybody will be working in a department of a Walmart somewhere making their $6.75 an hour.

Re:Echoes of WalMart and Microsoft

[egork]

And everybody will be buying their groceries much cheaper.

I do not see how Microsoft can be connected to this article, provided Tesco does not abuse its' market dominance (if it has any)

Re:Echoes of WalMart and Microsoft

[aslate]

There is an urgent need for stricter laws governing the behavior of the mega-corporations and a brave and uncorrupted judiciary to enforce them.

What's the point? Take the following example:

• Tesco sees an area with no local supermarket
• It also happens to be a relatively wealthy area
• There's no land to build their store
• Locals are angry, the local council says no
• Tesco get the OK from the Government instead, they create land by tunneling over the railway line and building ontop of it.
• Tunnel collapses and trains to London are still buggered

Re:Echoes of WalMart and Microsoft

[Anonymous Coward]

Mod parent up!!!

There is a very real need for more regulation of these big firms and the connection to M$ is that the US govt sabotaged its own case against them leaving us, the customers with a very shabby operationg system that is so dysfunctional and virus/malware prone. Tesco is bulling its suppliers just as M$ bullies the OEMs.

Wake up people!!!

Re:Echoes of WalMart and Microsoft

[Anonymous Coward]

Where'd that happen?

Re:Echoes of WalMart and Microsoft

[aslate]

A Money Programme investigation into Tesco mentioned the store planning permission information (It may not be on that page, it was in the broadcast). 3 June 05

A Tunnel Collapse at Gerrards Cross, where the store was being built (See Tesco quote near bottom). 1 July 05

So where's the problem?

[ZPO]

This seems like the perfect implementation of an affinity program. I find the closing parapgraphs regarding the OFTs interest troubling.

Tesco is a public company listening to customers, providing them with the goods and services they desire, and doing so for a fair price. Somehow to a group of people (and the OFT) that is improper. Since when did the "small shops" receive some type of right to exist and operate? If Tesco provided a better value for customers then that is where the customers will go.

I did the majority of my grocery shopping in Tesco while living in the UK. The stores were good, and I could even get home delivery. There were a couple small corner shops on the way home from the tube station as well. If I needed a loaf of bread, carton of OJ, or a pack of smokes they were a good quick stop. If stocking up my pantry/fridge for the week I'd go to Tesco. The small shops didn't have the products I wanted to buy.

Re:So where's the problem?

[grahammm]

I used to use the Tesco internet shopping service. I stopped because, despite placing the order 2 or 3 days in advance*, there were too many 'substitutions' where the items I had ordered were 'out of stock' and often the substitutes sent in their place were very poorly chosen. So now I use Sainsburys and Ocado (Waitrose) who are much better.

Maybe Tesco have improved since I switched, but for me they had their chance and they 'blew it'.

* Thus giving sufficient time for them to obtain any goods which were out of stock at time of ordering.

Re:So where's the problem?

[Anonymous Coward]

If stocking up my pantry/fridge for the week I'd go to Tesco.

Obviously you didn't really live in London - because anyone whose ever lived in England knows that it impossible to stock up a fridge for more than 2 days with those Lilliputian kitchen appliances you can barely have enough room for leftover pizza.

Re:So where's the problem?

[drsquare]

Tesco are crap. They don't sell much of any quality, anything they do sell is overpriced. The eggs are all stale, the milk is watery, the vegetables are already wilting when they're put on the shelves. The meat's dry and tasteless, and only a very limited selection of cuts.

The herbs are over-priced, the bread's stale, most of the aisles are made up of microwavable cardboard ready-meals rather than actual food. The fruit's imported, flavourless crap. The cooked meats are overpriced and dry. The cheeses are plastic.

Of course the drooling masses all turn up every week to fill their trollies with microchips, ice-cream and crisps, and all the butchers and greengrocers and markets actually selling local fresh ingredients go bust.

Of course it's their own fault. The butcher near my house closes before six o' clock. That's not acceptable in the 21st century. The only people who are going to go in there are pensioners and housewives. It isn't the 1950s anymore where the wife didn't work and had the time to trapse round shops all day. If people finish work at 5pm and the butchers/greengrocers are shut, they're not going to do any business.

Re:So where's the problem?

[Dunbal]

Obviously you didn't really live in London - because anyone whose ever lived in England knows that it impossible to stock up a fridge for more than 2 days with those Lilliputian kitchen appliances you can barely have enough room for leftover pizza.

      The joys of livinng in North America. When I have lunch today I will take a great deal of satisfaction in remembering that my refrigerator is probably bigger than the average apartment in London...plus I can have pizza delivered to my home. Do they still fail to deliver pizza/chinese/other food in the UK? :)

Re:So where's the problem?

[ZPO]

I had the same problem (substitutions). I started hitting the NoSubstitutes button (or whatever it was called) and waited until the next order to see if they had it yet.

Re:So where's the problem?

[ZPO]

Yes, I actually did live in London. About 3 blocks from the West Hampstead tube stop on the Jubilee line to be exact.

I chose a flat that came with an almost US sized refrigerator just for that reason. The washer/dryer were still a combined unit that could almost wash/dry a pair of jeans in a day, but my refrigerator was great.

I also spent 2 years up in Scotland. There I had one of the Lillipuian friges - such things are not fit for a uni dorm room, much less a real kitchen.

Re:So where's the problem?

[covertbadger]

I've never lived in anywhere in England that wasn't served by at least three pizza delivery places. Where I am right now, there are also two Chinese places, three Indian restaurants, and two kebab shops that will all deliver. Although I don't live in London, I do work there, and we regularly have pizza and sushi delivered. Where does this ridiculous myth about delivery service come from?

Re:So where's the problem?

[Anonymous Coward]

> fill their trollies with microchips

microwave-ready french fries, for the rest of the world.

Re:So where's the problem?

[Dunbal]

Probably things have changed then. When I lived in the UK in the mid to late 1980's, there was no such thing as delivery :)

Re:So where's the problem?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, English fridges are far too small. So I have 2 fridges and 2 freezers.

Re:So where's the problem?

[marcosdumay]

"Since when did the "small shops" receive some type of right to exist and operate? If Tesco provided a better value for customers then that is where the customers will go."

The "small shops" never received "some kind of right to exist". But it is important to keep in mind that it may be some kind of tragedy of the commons, where the people will be better with the small shops, but see more value (individualy) at the big ones.

Re:So where's the problem?

[Anonymous Coward]

That's just not true. They have large refrigerators in the UK. The problem that they have is they do not have as many preservatives and additives in their food, so they don't last as long. I think they'd rather have shorter life food than perservatives though.

Re:So where's the problem?

[Anonymous Coward]

The joys of livinng in North America. When I have lunch today I will take a great deal of satisfaction in remembering that my refrigerator is probably bigger than the average apartment in London

Wellll ... you don't get to be the most obese nation on earth with a little fridge, do you? Did you consider just eating less?

Re:So where's the problem?

[evilviper]

Since when did the "small shops" receive some type of right to exist and operate?

They don't have a "right" to exist and remain profitable. However, it's rather well-accepted that they are better for the (local) economy than large shops.

In cases of very large shops (eg Walmart), they can crush the economies of entire cities quite easily, which they exploit to get extreme tax breaks, incentives, etc., which serve to further improve their own economic position, and further increase the economic success and weight they have to do that.

Small shops don't have a right to exist, and neither do large shops by the same rationale. A small change in economics or ordinances, and either one may be gone.

Re:So where's the problem?

[bluGill]

In my experience, the small shops the gave good service had no problem with Wal-Mart in town. It was the shops that sold junk at high prices that went out when Wal-Mart came, selling more of the same junk for less. Wal-Mart gave better service too. Which is a sad commentry on the type of store complaining about Wal-Mart.

retail marketeer's wet dream

[ch-chuck]

a loyalty card with rfid and customers with remote control implants.

"Smedley, there's a customer in aisle 7 with a weakness for cream filled donuts - jerk him over to aisle 3 quick!"

Re:retail marketeer's wet dream

[nadadogg]

"College students entering the building. Jerk them to the liquor aisle, stat!"
"Nerds with video game shirts, send'em to the chip and candy section, roll out 2 carts of doritos!"

Tesco = Advanced Commercial Democracy

[G4from128k]

In essence, isn't the Tesco loyalty card system like a sophisticated representative democratic process? People "register to vote" using a loyalty card, vote by buying goods, and Tesco watches the results of the "election." Tesco knows who buys what and can thus go to suppliers and argue for changes that are more likely to satisfy customers.

Although non-loyalty card users still count at Tesco (all retail is a type of democracy in that people vote with their pocketbooks), I'm sure that the product choices of loyalty card users are far more influential with Tesco and thus with suppliers. In that regard not having a loyalty card is like not having a voter registration card.

Some might argue that voting should be anonymous, like political democratic elections, and perhaps it should. Yet non-anonymous voting provides valuable information -- e.g., Tesco might notice that, for example, people who buy lots of hot soups in the winter don't buy high-sugar fizzy drinks in the summer or some other correlation that is only observable if you can know that shopping basket A and basket B (6 months later) represent the same voter. These long-term correlations aid in both store assortment planning and forecasting.

Re:Tesco = Advanced Commercial Democracy

[Dunbal]

Tesco might notice that, for example, people who buy lots of hot soups in the winter don't buy high-sugar fizzy drinks in the summer or some other correlation that is only observable if you can know that shopping basket A and basket B (6 months later) represent the same voter.

      There is a large assumption here, which is that only the customer who was issued the card is the person that ever uses the card, which is not true. Especially when said cards have incentives like "points" that can be accumulated to obtain free items, or a straight discount for using the card. Such card "borrowing" will skew the data in the database, since the computer assumes that the card equals the person, which is not necessarily true.

      You could argue that Tesco's buying policy really is only concerned with the aggregate information anyway since they won't make a purchase decision based on a single cardholder, and this aggregate is unchanged by card "swapping". But then why do you need to track individual information?

      The answer is because they can. However the whole concept of "keeping a file" on someone is rather macabre. I have access to my criminal record, my medical record and my credit record. I should have access to all information ANYONE keeps on me unless it's being used to prosecute me for a crime. When is this going to happen at the supermarket? Until then, I refuse to use these cards.

Re:Tesco = Advanced Commercial Democracy

[forgotmyotheraccount]

In that regard not having a loyalty card is like not having a voter registration card.

Well kind of.

You will find that an appropriate sample size can quite accurately predict the population. Even though the politicians will have you believe each individual vote counts. Statistically it doesn't. (Except perhaps in some US presidential election cliffhangers)

The same applies for this type of analytical marketing. In order to influence the purchasing officer you'd have to buy a lot of peanut and goats cheese dip before they started ordering extra shelf space. Even so they would know it was the one customer anyway.

Statistically one individual customer is usually insignificant when it comes to segment based marketing. 1:1 marketing is starting to become more prominent and uses data warehouse capabilities to identify and satisfy individual customer demands but with the economies of scale that a large organisation can exploit. Similar to the principles of mass customisation.

Re:Tesco = Advanced Commercial Democracy

[Anne Thwacks]

Tesco loyalty card system like a sophisticated representative democratic process

I think its more like having your own KGB agent to track your movements.

I shop in Tesco. I do not have a loyalty card. I pay cash. I also shop in Asda (Walmart), Netto and Safeways/Morrisons.

Since my local Safeways became Morrisons, the prices have crashed, but the choice has become very "northern" (Mushy peas and black pudding are easy to find, while plantains and Greek bread have gone). I complained that they no longer stocked cocoa, and was told "You are the fifth customer who has complained about that today". They are gradually recovering though. I buy Greek bread from a Turkish shop, and Challa bread from the Happening Beigel Bakery (A Jewish bread shop staffed entirely by Moslems, 100 yards from where the mosque where the "Mad Mullas" preach terrorism), plantains from Dalston market. What do I care? You don't need a loyalty card system or database to know the customers are disatisfied. You need good management to change the stocking policy in response, not a computer.

Re:Tesco = Advanced Commercial Democracy

[Anonymous Coward]

In essence, isn't the Tesco loyalty card system like a sophisticated representative democratic process? People "register to vote" using a loyalty card, vote by buying goods, and Tesco watches the results of the "election." Tesco knows who buys what and can thus go to suppliers and argue for changes that are more likely to satisfy customers.

It's nothing at all like democracy, and I find it highly disturbing that you could suggest this. This is like democracy only in Stalin's view of democracy -- the rulers observe the population and decide what is best for them. Tesco acts in its own interest, not in the interest of the consumers. Its goal is to please customers, not to benefit them. If their interests happen to coincide with Tesco's, then great, but if they don't, then the goal becomes to convince them to act against their own interests.

Granted, people can often be convinced to vote for things that will harm them, so democracy isn't 100% different.

Can anyone say the next WALMART?!

[Anonymous Coward]

mmm

Membership stores do something similar?

[MtViewGuy]

After reading the article about Tesco, you have to wonder does a place with paid annual memberships like Costco do the same thing (not that hard to do given that every time you check out of Costco you have to swipe the membership card anyway) in terms of tracking customer trends.

Re:Membership stores do something similar?

[Anne Thwacks]

you have to wonder does a place with paid annual memberships like Costco do the same thing

You have to wonder? Why not use both brain cells: Of course they do!

What if Wal-Mart

[Recovering Hater]

did some sheesh like this? That would be interesting for the US economy for sure.

Re:What if Wal-Mart

[Asprin]

Regretably, the fact that Wal-Mart doesn't use loyalty cards is one of the few admirable things about them.

Re:What if Wal-Mart

[camusflage]

Hate to break it to you sunshine, but the largest data warehouse (70 terabytes when last I saw) in the United States, outside of anything in the government, is located in Bentonville Arkansas. If you don't think they're profiling based on the cards you swipe, you're fooling yourself.

Re:What if Wal-Mart

[Asprin]

I didn't say they weren't profiling, I said they didn't use loyalty cards. I can't cram all possible related insights into two lines, ya know. ;)

Epicenter

[Anonymous Coward]

I would have hoped that on a science site like this, epicentre would be used correctly, and not colloquially as a synonym of "centre".

That said, I appreciate the proper spelling.

Re:Epicenter

[Anonymous Coward]

I would have hoped that on a science site like this

No science website is like this.

Customers don't know

[Anonymous Coward]

Some of these changes are small. The dust jacket of a book that was to be sold in-store was recently altered because a Tesco buyer did not like it. But customers don't really know what they want. They'll ask for something but in reality it won't be really what they wanted when they get it. Also, a lot of people have different tastes, why try and make one product fit all? Have more variations. Try two different book covers on the same book. They do it for other media (games, videos, music) etc...

From the article:

[Anonymous Coward]

Tesco's power is causing resentment. Most openings of big new stores are greeted by fears for local shops and a campaign to keep Tesco out.

Say what you want about how much nicer Tesco is than Wal-Mart, it seems like they face the same issues in the communities they are entering.

Re:British Society Tracking Database

[forgotmyotheraccount]

Tesco use a Teradata data warehouse analytical/relationship marketing. They're a division of NCR.

A good lesson, a desired info

[NeedleSurfer]

The article doesn't say if the database has it's entry linked to people or store and that is the information I wanted. If they contain people name and infos I'm against it, their suppliers can buy an access to the database and that alone scares me about it. If their database simply is linked to a store then it becomes a really good idea with a lot of practical uses and none of the big brother scare.

However the important point in the article isn't the database, it's the fact that a company is becomming big NOT by becomming cheaper but by becomming better and that alone should be a lesson to many capitalist out there.

ISO9000 series

[alvieboy]

So shall we throw out all the quality managment standards, like ISO9001? I don't think so.

You have to fullfill your customer requirements - if you need a database to track all of them, good. But you should not be able to sell it, rent it or otherwise pass this information to third parties.

ISO9001 Certifications are consumer/customer centric. If you don't know your customer, how can you archieve ceritifcations like this - you need a database of customer requirements, right?

Quoting from the ISO site :

The ISO 9000 family is primarily concerned with "quality management". This means what the organization does to fulfil:

        - the customer's quality requirements, and
        - applicable regulatory requirements, while aiming to
        - enhance customer satisfaction, and
        - achieve continual improvement of its performance in pursuit of these objectives.

Re:ISO9000 series

[Potor]

We all know that consumers willingly sell their souls for loose change, but now ISO 9000 standards demand this?

Try living in a country in which the customer is not king. It is heavenly.

Re:ISO9000 series

[Anonymous Coward]

You must be the only person I've ever met to think ISO 9000/9001 did anything even remotely useful.

At IBM, we took a two hour class on how to respond to ISO 9001 auditors. I'm not kidding. The entire point of this class (as coached by some ISO guy), was to say "We have a process, we follow the process, if you have questions about the process ask Timmy". And we didn't know what the process was, they never told us, we just were to point them to Timmy.

And Timmy didn't know, Timmy was supposed to point them to ... ad nauseum.

ISO 9001 is nothing.

ISO 100, 200, 300, and 400 -- and those regulated shipping container sizes (ISO containers) I might care about.

Re:ISO9000 series

[Anonymous Coward]

ISO doesn't say anything about quality really.

It just wants a repeatable process.

That is, you can make crap, you just have to be sure that you always make crap.

Re:ISO9000 series

[alvieboy]

It just wants *a* process.

Determine the needs of your client, and then build up a process and track it often to see if it is on-time, on-bugdet, and on-effort.

Your client will be satisfied. You will be satisfied. Both parties win.

Re:ISO9000 series

[alvieboy]

At IBM, we took a two hour class on how to respond to ISO 9001 auditors. I'm not kidding.

I also took some classes for an ISO9001 audit. I know how they are.


  And we didn't know what the process was, they never told us, we just were to point them to Timmy.
And Timmy didn't know, Timmy was supposed to point them to ... ad nauseum.
ISO 9001 is nothing.

Well let me ask you:

• You ever had an SQA person or the like (Software Quality Assurance) working with you?
• Did you (and your managers) review periodically the project plan to ensure it was on-time, on-effort and on-budget?

Because it did not work with you (and your superiors) does not mean it does not work with other companies.

You still have to follow a good Quality Policy. Certification is only a small part of it. The least important, IMHO.

Re:ISO9000 series

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes and that is my point.

The process could say "Every day at 3pm, the design engineer will deliver a turd to the customer."

And so long as you do that every day at 3pm, hey what do you know you are ISO compliant!

Never mind that you are making turds.

The difference

[Julian Morrison]

...between a well informed market and a democracy, is that the democracy is zero-sum while the market tries to serve all profitable niches. That's why Tesco carries both regular pasta and low-carb Atkins stuff (and no-gluten stuff, and rice pasta, and etc). It's not an election between the carb and anti-carb parties, where the winner takes all and the rarer minorities get stiffed.

Why?

[brunes69]

What is the point of this? All it would do is screw up all the marketing research, resulting in them shoving more crap you don't care about down your throat whenever you go to buy groceries.

Personally, I hope to hell they learn everything they can about me so that my shopping experience will go smoother and faster.

Re:Why?

[AuMatar]

If they want my grocery store trips to go smoother and faster, all they have to do is hire more fucking cashiers. They don't need to track what I buy. They already know whats being sold by how their supply changes, without trying to track what I buy across visits. So why should they invade my privacy? Shit like that shouldn't be legal- they shouldn't be allowed to record personal information like that, and definitely not allowed to alter prices based on it.

Re:Why?

[Ravatar]

Who says shopping should be anonymous? If they can service me better without a noticeable negative effect on my daily life, then more power to them.

Re:Why?

[gowen]

Shopping must be anonymous. That's why I always go into my local store with a balaclava over my head. Anyone who doesn't is a slave to the corporate society, and insufficiently l33t.

Re:Why?

[wasted time]

Personally, I hope to hell they learn everything they can about me so that my shopping experience will go smoother and faster.

Let's hope what they learn about you is true.
http://www.nocards.org/news/index.shtml#fire

Charges dismissed!
Arson charges against firefighter dropped after another confesses

We previously reported that a fireman in Everett, Washington had been arrested for setting a fire in his own home. The fire was reported to have been started using a "firestarter" which, although charred, still had a "Safeway Supermarket" label attached. Police used Safeway club card records from the family to show there had been a purchase of the firestarters in July, and a police dog that was asked to track the arsonist repeatedly went from the fire to the homes front door.

This week the charges were dropped after "another person accepted responsibility for the fire" according to news reports. At least one media outlet, KIRO TV, is reporting that his wife was the one who came forward.

In our original article on this we noted:

Retail stores attempt to portray privacy fears as being groundless but the fact remains that this data is accessible, and will continue to be so for years. And even though this data "might" help law enforcement officers, the potential is equally large to implicate people who have committed no crime.

Re:Why?

[danila]

Because, as surprising as it may sound to you, the meaning of life isn't to have a smoother shopping experience. Because of the fundamental market deficiencies, the companies that provide marginally better product survive and the rest goes out of business. This forces companies to strive for perfection, which isn't a good thing at all. It isn't a good thing because there is simply no time to think about the important stuff, with all that smooth shopping experiences and everything.

Life in a country doesn't improve when Wegmans or Walmart comes to them. People do not become happier, their lives do not suddently acquire meaning. It's just that they buy more shit, cheaper and smoother, that's all.

So some people enjoy making a statement of opposition to our focus on consumerism and marginal gains of efficiency. These people enjoy screwing up a pointless database that is not doing society any good.

Re:Why?

[Feztaa]

I agree that more cashiers would be beneficial, but your requirement that they be sexually active is quite odd.

Re:Why?

[caluml]

That's why I always go into my local store with a balaclava over my head. Anyone who doesn't is a slave to the corporate society, and insufficiently l33t.

Maybe someone like RMS should go around with a balaclava on his head, to defend his privacy. Is there any reason why one shouldn't go shopping in a balaclava, and sue the police if arrested?

Interesting Question

[Mensa Babe]

Can a Customer Loyalty Database Change a Society? Probably.

Can a Database Customer Loyalty Change a Society? Certainly.

Re:Interesting Question

[Anonymous Coward]

Do superior intellects know something I don't about spelling?

Re:Interesting Question

[Anonymous Coward]

Do superior intellects know something I don't about spelling?

Yes. English. The real English in England.

By driving me crazy? yes

[t_allardyce]

Every time i go to Tesco, without fail, they ask me the same question "do you have a tesco clubcard?"! Do i have a fucking tesco club card? do i?? if i had a tesco club card would i be standing there holding out my money without it? would i actually forget to take it out? I know they are trained to do this, they have no choice and i know by the tone of their voice they are fucking fed up of saying it more than im fed up of hearing it, in fact i feel sorry for them - to have to say the same phrase 100's of times a day while listening to people saying it all around you must be hell. Theres hardly any other talking going on at the check-out, the only thing you hear is the total and do you have a mother fucking tesco club card. Sometimes I wonder, should i just get a tesco club card to make them shut up? even having to pull an extra thing out of my wallet every time would make up for it! If getting a card ment just being handed one and not having to fill anything in then i probably would, but it probably takes a form a mile long. If tesco want me to use a card then its going to have to be anonymous and not require me doing anything.

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[Dunbal]

Sometimes I wonder, should i just get a tesco club card to make them shut up? even having to pull an extra thing out of my wallet every time would make up for it!

      Fight it! Fight it! If you do THAT then they win! You can be strong! I know you can! Just take it one day at a time!

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[Hieronymus Howard]

I feel exactly the same about them. I want a t-shirt saying, "NO, I don't have a fucking clubcard". These days, I tend to avoid shopping at Tesco, except when necessary, as it's such a horrible experience, with crowded stores and long queues. I've mostly switched to shopping at Waitrose, which is far more pleasant or, occasionally, Asda which is even worse.

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[jrboatright]

too bad. :-( I notice that now you can interconvert tesco clubcard points with BA Airline miles.... If Walmart or Food4Less offered that with a US carrier I'ld be on it in a moment...

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[Anonymous Coward]

Do what I did...get your Tesco barcode tattooed on your arm. You'll never need your clubcard again.

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[Anonymous Coward]

If the card were anonymous, how would they send you the money off vouchers for the points you'd earnt?

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[MattBurke]

That's a fantastic idea for a tshirt! I want one now :)

Like you I hate crowds and queues, which is why I either use the little Tesco petrol station by me or go to the main 24hr tesco hypermarket after midnight. It's a much more pleasurable experience. I actually made the mistake of going there today at around 3pm. Took me 1/2hr to find a parking space, about 5x longer to navigate the idiots and grannies in the asiles, and god knows how long it took me to reach the front of the checkout queue - I was comatose by then. Never go shopping before 10pm!

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[t_allardyce]

You would go to the shop and collect them?

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[Anonymous Coward]

It annoys me even as a tourist.

However, in most Tescos you can just grab the form as you walk in, and peel the card from the inside. You can use that card immediately without submitting the form.

After a few weeks, The Computer will point out to the cash desk dummy that the card is not registered yet, and you will be gently reminded to turn in the form.

Ditch the card and start over. This way, you'll only get your bit of annoyance once in a while instead of every single time.

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[nytmare]

, should i just get a tesco club card to make them shut up?

That's why they ask you every time. It's what they want.

Re:By driving me crazy? yes

[murali_v82]

Hey... it is worse in the US. At Safeway counter they ask you "How was your day?"... do i have a choice of telling them i had a screwed up day ?... no way. Everytime i had to smile and say it was great.

Why store-level aggregate data isn't good enough

[G4from128k]

There is a large assumption here, which is that only the customer who was issued the card is the person that ever uses the card, which is not true. Especially when said cards have incentives like "points" that can be accumulated to obtain free items, or a straight discount for using the card. Such card "borrowing" will skew the data in the database, since the computer assumes that the card equals the person, which is not necessarily true.

Card borrowing does skew the data, but how high is the actual frequency of this practice? Moreover, I'd bet that many card borrowings are between demographically similar people. If one 22 year old college student borrows a card from another 22 year old college student, then the effect on Tesco is minimal. Yes, card borrowing affects the data, but I doubt it ruins it.

You could argue that Tesco's buying policy really is only concerned with the aggregate information anyway since they won't make a purchase decision based on a single cardholder, and this aggregate is unchanged by card "swapping". But then why do you need to track individual information?

Aggregate data only gets a company so far. Consider the problem deciding where to put a new store. The only way Tesco can accurately do this is by cross comparing the census records for the proposed area with Tesco's own data on who buys how much and from what distances at its existing stores. If Tesco knows that people drive 20 miles to reach a Tesco, then its less likely to put another Tesco within 10 miles of an existing one. And if Tesco sees certain demographic groups is a new area, they can estimate likely sales and the best product assortment by studying the sales habits of those demographic groups within its loyalty card program. Breaking down the customer base by distance to store, types of goods bought, ages, income, etc. all help the company do a much better job of store siting, merchandise assortment, forecasting, etc.

Yes, only aggregate data is useful. But the loyalty card program lets Tesco aggregate data in new ways -- aggregate by customer age, gender, distance to store, household income, or tendencies to buy products. Store-level aggregate data or even simple market basket analysis isn't going to give as good an insight into the relationships between customer categories and shopping habits.

The answer is because they can. However the whole concept of "keeping a file" on someone is rather macabre. I have access to my criminal record, my medical record and my credit record. I should have access to all information ANYONE keeps on me unless it's being used to prosecute me for a crime. When is this going to happen at the supermarket? Until then, I refuse to use these cards.

I very seriously doubt that Tesco spends millions of pounds (probably tens of millions of pounds) on its loyalty card database just because it can. Most businesses insistent on a bottom-line improvement in the business before laying out that kind of money. And if a company does spend that type of money and doesn't get a profitable return, they stop the program. Morevoer, the type of data collected by a loyalty card program is perfect for assessing the business benefits of a loyalty card program. Tesco started their program 10 years ago. I doubt it would still be in use today if it didn't provide direct benefits to the company.

Phony Discounts--Phony Name

[Analog4ever]

Our local Kroger affiliate offers these discounts via a "Plus Card" but you can buy the same item at other stores at the discount price without a card. When I visited my daughter in Augusta, Georgia, all the stores seemed to use this system and rather than pay more I just filled out an application with a phony name. The whole practice is insidious.

Use a credit card once, and you are known.

[Futurepower(R)]

The problem with lying is that, once you use a credit or debit card, your true identity is known exactly.

Re:Use a credit card once, and you are known.

[ultranova]

The problem with lying is that, once you use a credit or debit card, your true identity is known exactly.

Yeah, but there's this wonderfull new solution - a prepaid card that doesn't have your face on it, but some dead presidents ! You can buy them from ATM's or banks, and best of all, you can even know how much money these cards have since it reads on cards surface ! And they're even made of paper, so they won't harm the environment as much as plastic cards !

I think this invention is called "cash". Go get yours right now because there's only a limited supply, since the government insists that it is the only entity which can make these cards - clearly another attempt to compromize your privacy in the name of terrorism - or was it counter-terrorism ? Pre-emptive terrorism ? I can't keep this stuff straight, but that's okay, neither can the government.

Anyway, pay with cash and you stay in cognito. Of course only terrorists need privacy, so you'll propably be shot by London policemen, but hey, Sith happen, and I'm sure Luke will you use his fathers now-unneccessary walking iron lung - except that the ungratefull little creep burned it on Endor. Guess you're screwed, then. Or you would be if you had put more points to charisma, but you can always wear a Nymph Cloak or even a Ring of Invisibility if your stat is really low...

Where's the change?

[Solipson]

Classic example of a headline having nothing to do with the article it refers to :-) The Economist article does not really state that Tesco is changing Britain, except the well know Wal Mart effect of "devastating" small businesses in the areas they moove into. Apart from the issue not making any sense at all, because the only thing the data from the card can change by definition is the behavior of Tesco, not the British society. For me the Tesco card is just an example of a very well executed marketing tool. And it won't help them when the big German retailers get their act together and at least make a serious attempt to grow in Britain. A 25% price differental between German and the British retail prices is an argument the best customer loyalty card cannot beat.

Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[Asprin]

Anyone here ever read Jennifer Govenment by Max Barry?

It's a crime drama/thriller set in a future where People take the name of the company they work for as their surname (John Nike, Ken Wal-Mart, etc.); and customer loyalty cards and brand recognition inpsire riots, war and murder.

I read it the same month I read Farenheit 451, (which might be the single best book I ever read.)

*THAT* was a fun month for paranoia, I can tell you.

All y'all that haven't read those two books need to go out and do so IMMEDIATELY. Thank you, Public Library for having them on the shelves.

Re:Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[magicchex]

I've read Jennifer Government and have even met Mr. Barry. Before everyone reads your post, though, and runs out to get this book, I have something to say. Although the ideas and concepts and story in this book are excellent, it is NOT written well. The writing is very basic, and in no way more impressive than the papers I had to proofread in high school.

Re:Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[Fulcrum of Evil]

Anyone here ever read Jennifer Govenment by Max Barry?

Yeah, it seemed somewhat contrived - slaughtering customers to increase product demand? And anyway, how many people named John work for Nike?

Re:Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[republican gourd]

Another fun one, if you're into this sort of thing, is "The Space Merchants" (and less so, its sequel, "The Merchant's War"), by Frederick Pohl, I believe. Its classic 50s style SF regarding a world in which the advertising agencies own the corporations and the governments. Would the Senator from DuPont please take the stand?

Re:Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[Asprin]

Good point - I have to say that to some extent, I agree with you. I mean, there's quite a contrast between Jennifer Government and Farenheit 451. I don't want to pick on Mr. Barry ('cause this is only his second book), but in my opinion, he relies a bit too much on swearing for dialog (that's what I hate about Elmore Leonard), the characters are kinda flat and it really doesn't take long at all to turn into a standard crime thriller. Despite all that, though, he still shows promise in that the concept is interesting enough to warrant a reading anyway.

Re:Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm unemployed you insensitive clod!

Thomas NoJob

Re:Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[bill_mcgonigle]

That must have been written in a time when the author didn't envision changing your last name every two to three years, or changing your name to something most easily pronounceable by native speakers of Hindi.

Re:Anyone here ever read "Jennifer Govenment"?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah. Entertaining, but somewhat cheesy and simplistic. Certainly not predictive science fiction.

1 out of every 3 GBP? No.

[NotQuiteReal]

From Tesco's own investor site [http://www.tescocorporate.com/ the gross sales was 37,070 million GBP [about $65.8 B USD].

The British GDP is about 1 Trillion [1.7 T USD]

That seems a far cry from 1 out of every 3 GBP. Unless you mean, maybe, actual currency passing thru the stores, at some point.

Re:1 out of every 3 GBP? No.

[Kinlan]

I actually think the statistic he was mentioning was:

1 GBP in every 8 GBP spent by general consumers is spent in Tesco stores.

This figure may be wrong, but it is the best that I can remember.

www.kinlan.co.uk

Re:1 out of every 3 GBP? No.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yep it's 1 in 8. It was on the news not that long ago.

Re:1 out of every 3 GBP? No.

[fruey]

What a terrible memory I have. Yes, 1 in 8 seems much more reasonable. It was certainly consumer high street spending, and not anything to do with GDP which includes exports and so on.

Re:1 out of every 3 GBP? No.

[fatrat]

£1 in every £3 spent on Groceries I believe. It's clearly not 30% of GDP.

Re:1 out of every 3 GBP? No.

[lakin]

He was a bit off, but it is still impressive. £1 out of every £8 spent in a british shop is at tescos (According to the telegraph its now 1 in every £7.70).

hah! and you all scoff at ..

[Anonymous Coward]

.. Scientology.

honest. ron was on top of this in the 50's, people. read the HCOPL's!

What is the opposite of a tinfoil hat?

[Anonymous Coward]

So your shopping experience can go smoother and faster?????? Are you kidding me?

Why do you assume that these stores are using your information to provide you with better service? Yes, that may sometimes be its ancillary effect, but their overall focus and intent is to squeeze as much money out of you as they possibly can. Read some of the studies sometime as to how they use this information.

One store, by studying its databases, found that men often buy beer and diapers on Thursday evenings on the way home from work. Knowing that men are less price sensitive than women generally, and also that such "home from work" purchasers are less likely to be using coupons and comparing prices, the store decided to wildly jack up its prices on beer and diapers on Thursday evenings.

They don't use these cards in some benificent, "oh, let's be kind to the customer today" ways. They're trying every which way to soak you on price! And you go right along with it.

Man, there ought to be a style of hat for the opposite of tin foil, for folks like you who are so incredibly gullible that they will believe anything a store tells them.

I think maybe a nice plastic wrap hat should do it. Anyone got any other good ideas? What is the opposite of a tin foil hat?

Re:What is the opposite of a tinfoil hat?

[Kafka_Canada]

A Ron Popeil hat? A fish-hat?

Re:What is the opposite of a tinfoil hat?

[brunes69]

Why do you assume that these stores are using your information to provide you with better service? Yes, that may sometimes be its ancillary effect, but their overall focus and intent is to squeeze as much money out of you as they possibly can. Read some of the studies sometime as to how they use this information.

Because the most cost-effective way top use marketing research to make money, is to use it to please customers, so that they spend more money at your store.

One store, by studying its databases, found that men often buy beer and diapers on Thursday evenings on the way home from work. Knowing that men are less price sensitive than women generally, and also that such "home from work" purchasers are less likely to be using coupons and comparing prices, the store decided to wildly jack up its prices on beer and diapers on Thursday evenings.

Assuming this is true (link, please?), then that is a pretty stupid company and is likely out of business by now. A smart company (as long as they are not in a monopoly position) offers sales and discounts on products while in peak demand, they don't jack up the prices. Why? because it is worth a lot more to take a small hit on one item to get someone into *your* store, rather than a competitor. This is called "loss-leading", and is the main reason stores have sales. Why? Because...

• They will likely buy other items on that trip
• They will appreciate the good prices, and thus be more likely to come back
• It will re-enforce the idea that "this store has good deals". Over time, said consumer will not even bother to check the other store prices, but assume they are equal to or cheaper than your competitors, even though this may not be the case.

The thing to remember about companies is that they are *always* after their best interests. This is not always a good thing (see environmental damage, insane IP laws, etc). But sometimes it is, such as in the case of customer profiling.

Other than as a means to sell you *what* you want, *when* you want, of what use is it to a company, or anyone else for that matter, to know that you like to buy a six pack whenever you buy a pizza?

Re:Why store-level aggregate data isn't good enoug

[Threni]

> Card borrowing does skew the data, but how high is the actual frequency of this
> practice? Moreover, I'd bet that many card borrowings are between
> demographically similar people. If one 22 year old college student borrows a
> card from another 22 year old college student, then the effect on Tesco is
> minimal. Yes, card borrowing affects the data, but I doubt it ruins it.

Tescos actively encourages card borrowing - my girlfriend has a Tescos card and they mail her smaller cards that fit onto your keyring so partners, family members, friends etc who don't have their own card can earn her points.

Keep shopping!!

[subtropolis]

If you don't use your loyalty card the terrorists will have won.

In other news, authorities say that spatula-related terror incidents may be on the rise. Be vigilant. And keep shopping.

Your time... is my time.

dunnhumby

[Anonymous Coward]

Most folks may not know that Kroger created a USA subsidiary with dunnmumby. The goal is to apply the Tesco magic here in the US.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

customer cards

[a_greer2005]

These sorts of things dont really bug me so long as the clerk at the market will give me cards when the form sais that I am bBart Simpson from 123 Fake street, Antcity Indiana...No joke...I have that as a card for one of Americas biggest chains, and other greats like George Washington, 1600 Pennsilvenia Ave, Washington, DC.

How is this news?

[egork]

May be it's just me, but what we learn from the article about Tesco that we did not know after we've read two years ago about WalMart use of the databases in CRM (BTW it is also Teradata DB).

Re:British Society Tracking Database

[Anonymous Coward]

whats funny is its run by an American on his home ADSL connection
namely

Louis Waweru
youngbonzi@earthlink.net
user-0c8h4ji.cable.mindspring.com
DOB 11/09/1981
AOL: louislogicnyc
YM: lushlouis

must have big ears if he can hear whats going on in the UK, why he would want to spam here (with multiple accounts) is pretty weird, i guess thats what 24 year old Americans do

Cards give you cash back

[grahamsz]

Tesco give you back 1% of what you spend - so there's a very strong incentive to make sure that all your cards are registered to your home address.

They don't pull much of this "card member discount" crap that stores here in the US do. When i lived in the UK I would probably use half of all the coupons that tesco mailed to me - they were THAT effective.

Max Barry anyone

[Kevertje]

This story reminds me of a book written by Max Barry, titled Jennifer Government...
In that book, there are 2 major customer loyalty programs with all big brands participating in one of them. The world is run by the corporations, employees take on the name of their employer and the police is now a publicly owned security firm (participating in one of said programs) which only investigates crimes if they can bill the investigation (on the victim of course)

Affinity cards are still branding

[fermion]

This is still branding. Instead of branding individual products, and incurring the cost of promotion for each product, one brands a retail outlet, and reduce the advertising cost as a percentage of revenue. This is what Walmart does, without any hassles of cards.

Affinity cards are part of this branding. They exist to remind the customer of the shop, and may limit the customer choices due the inconvince of carrying multiple cards. For the purpose of data collection such cards are hardly neccesary, as most of us do not use cash. Sales can be matched to most customer through payment accounts. In fact stores that primarily want to gather personally identifiable information can do so without the need of affinity cards.

In the end customer service is about knowing your customers. What we are talking about here is not really customer service, but customer expansion. That is, knowing what your customers might want, and knowing what those who are not yet your customers want. The megastores provide a service for the consumption hungry person in the west who will drive thier SUV 20 miles and load it up with stuff they don't really need. Those are who the stores want. The customers that don't require service but merely stuff. But they don't really don't do much for the person who just needs to get some food for thier family at a reasonable cost. Those that still value the well stocked but not overwhelming store, helpful people, and competant cashiers.

To stop marketing

[Anonymous Coward]

To stop marketing. Just sell me stuff, don't shove it down my throat. Stop spending money on marketing, start increasing quality and/or lowering prices.

Not Saving Any Money

[Blackbird_Highway]

Stores that use these tracking card systems always charge more than stores that don't. There have been many studies that have proven it. Check the Wall Street Journal. You can prove it yourself, I did. Just check the prices of items in the store, before and after they go on sale with a card discount. One week the frozen fish is 2.99. The next week, it's 3.79, but you get .80 off if you use your card! You're saving .80! What a bargain! As long as the sheep who shop there think they are saving money, the store is more profitable, so it's all good, right?

Re:Not Saving Any Money

[charlequin]

I don't know about all chains, but my local supermarket (Wegmans', mentioned above a ways) certainly doesn't do that. I shop there regularly and watch the actual prices of the items I purchase, not just whether they're "on sale." There's no such deception going on.

Honestly, most people shop for groceries every week and purchase the same items over and over. The idea that you could consistently fool the entire customer base -- that you won't have anyone who pays attention to the "normal" price and compares it to the "sale" price -- is ridiculous.

Re:Not Saving Any Money

[Andy Davies]

As someone who shops at Tesco's week in, week out - I can tell you they're one of the cheaper supermarkets and delivery pretty good quality food.

Re:Not Saving Any Money

[Andy Davies]

Tesco's are one of the cheaper UK supermarkets and have pretty good quality food.

Re:Not Saving Any Money

[Peeteriz]

In many countries (probably excluding USA, but likely including the object of this article - UK), such 'marketing practices' are illegal. (If advertising the discount, the 'old' price must have been real and available for at least 15 days or something).

Re:Not Saving Any Money

[Anonymous Coward]

In the UK, there is a minimum time a product has to be at a price before you can announce a discount on it.

Tesco is known to have pushed very close to the letter of the law in the past - quietly raising prices, waiting out the limit, and dropping them again, advertsing their "price cut".

I'm surprised, in fact, at all the people defending Tesco. Their stores have a nasty, clinical feel to them - Morrison's is a much nicer place to shop (and, when you take into account all the BOGOFFs you get there, I suspect no real difference in price). They don't muck you around with loyalty cards, yet they still seem to have a better selection.

Safeway ditched its ABC loyalty card a few years ago, saying it would spend the money on price cuts, and Staples stores also dropped their cards (at least in the UK). I approve of this - if every shop required a card, my wallet would be a foot thick.

The only loyalty card I have is from Game - and that's because I talk about my rampant Nintendo fanboyism anyway - so there's less of a privacy issue. Typically, loyalty cards struggle to represent a 1% discount on your shopping (given all the exclusions they have on what earns points), and the effort isn't worth it.

oH

[BlackShirt]

It's such a good article. Go read.

Wal-Mart uses its inventory database instead

[Anonymous Coward]

Wal-Mart was a trailblazer in inventory tracking and control. When they were developing those systems, they probably considered individual customer tracking to be too limited and unweildy for their purposes.

Wal-Mart weilds the same kind of power Tesco does in Britain, it's just that it's all new to Britain--here, the Wal-Martization of America is old hat.

Harrahs Is A Good Example

[Anonymous Coward]

I recently heard a story aired on public radio that claimed Harrahs Casinos maintained a customer loyalty database with something like 40 million names. I realize that it includes international customers but in perspective that's greater than 10% of the entire population of the U.S.

They are in the process of acquiring Caesars International with an eye on combining their customer loyalty database as well. Hell yeah, customer loyalty is important.

My friend is a serious gambler -- with a gambling problem imho -- and claims Harrahs does a fantastic job of rewarding continued play. Discounts on shows, great seats at sporting events, private dining tents, coach bus transportation, etc. They will pay as long as you play. Probably proportional to the amount you "voluntarily contribute."

At this level his activity can easily be seen as a transfer of wealth and a personal choice I suppose. But he and his neighbors recently voted down a referendum to increase taxes for education. His kids are grown so why bother?

Yes, the societal effects are subtle but I do believe they exist.

It's not even a card now.

[Anonymous Coward]

Recently Tesco's sent out keyfobs to all their clubcard customers. Instead of having to have your loyalty card on you they just scan the barcode on the keyfob. It means they can track the "just popped in for" and "I only want" cash sales as people will always have their keys but may not be carrying their wallet.

Only card holders pay the normal price.

[Futurepower(R)]

You are not understanding something. The local Safeway grocery store, for example, raises prices considerably on many items, and then offers the normal price only to card holders. So, if you pay with cash, you will pay 20% more.

Re:Only card holders pay the normal price.

[weekendgeek]

The idea is to pay with cash and use a card registered to Benjamin Over, Richard Nibbler, Michael Hunt or any other 'favorite' name.

Re:Only card holders pay the normal price.

[shmlco]

No, you're not getting it. "The local Safeway grocery store, for example, raises prices considerably on many items, and then offers the normal price only to [loyalty] card holders." You can have a "loyalty" card AND pay cash.

Why do you feel the need...

[Anonymous Coward]

...to tell us all that you're a member of MENSA?

I passed the MENSA test when I was 14 and was quite chuffed with myself (being a typically arrogant little jerk at the time)

By the time I was 17, it had dawned on me that MENSA members were on the whole a bunch of boring, self-congratulatory nonentities.

Also, they didn't really seem to be any cleverer than anyone else, just good at solving silly puzzles.

So stick your MENSA where the sun don't shine 'Babe'.

Re:British Society Tracking Database

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, it's a dead giveaway when he calls mobile phones "cell phones". Nobody in the UK calls them that.

Does this scene seem plausible?

[2008]

Suburban Mother 1: "Oh, I shop at Tesco all the time. The prices are so low, and it's on the way to Timmy's school so you can't beat it for convenience."
Suburban Mother 2: "Oh dear, you mustn't shop there!"
SM1: "Why not, Phyllis?"
SM2: "It's not ISO 9001 certified!"
SM1: *GASP OF HORROR!*

Re:British Society Tracking Database

[Anonymous Coward]

and heres a photo of him

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/7412/louiswawer u0nl.jpg

poor kid, spamming his home adsl connection, and a black gangster/brit wannabe, guess Mcdonalds didnt want to hire him, must be a hard life in NYC

Clubcards are (were?) anonymous

[gzunk]

At least they were the last time I got one, you just said, "Yes I'd like one" and they gave it to you. No form, nothing.

They took the discounts and stuff off when it was swiped through the next time - don't know if that's changed or anything.

Re:Clubcards are (were?) anonymous

[Anonymous Coward]

They start off as anonymous as you can use them straight away without having to give any details. However if you want to get any of the money off vouchers then the form provided with the clubcard has to be filled in - the vouchers are sent to your home address.

SPOILER WARNING

[nanojath]

I heard that Skype kills Dunnhumby in the sixth book.

Missing Link

[colonic]

I think you misread the article. The Tesco buyer is a Tesco employee who buys for Tesco. It wasn't a customer buying from Tesco who complained.

I initially misread this too. But the question then arises: what does this have to do with the customer loyalty database? Did the buyer insist on the alteration after an analysis of the database?
It's not clear from the article that this is so - it appears to be an inapt anecdote.

On the subject of the customer database, I wonder if/how this will affect Jack Cohen's original, um, vision statement: "Pile them high, sell them cheap".

Tick tock, tick tock

[autophile]

Organisations that continue to put the brand at their epicentre and pay only lip service to the notion that the customer is king, will fail. It's just a matter of time.

(glancing at watch) I'm still waiting...

--Rob

Re:Explain please...

[symbolic]

But, you can tell that they are really keeping an eye on their data. For example, as trends go one direction or another, you see those items getting pulled into the more visible areas of the store and, sometimes, put on sale for brief periods of time.

Nothing I've read so far explains why any of this requires a loyalty card. Trends will exist with or without being able to identify individual customers (as they always have). In fact, I can't think of ANY reason that a company would need this, other than to make money off of selling your personal information.

Nope, parent was right.

[SeaFox]

>>>The dust jacket of a book that was to be sold in-store was recently altered because a Tesco buyer did not like it.

>>That's a bit silly, really. It leads to bland stuff that has been toned down to not offend anybody. Sure, if it offends a whole bunch of people, it might make sense to alter it, but one person?

>I think you misread the article. The Tesco buyer is a Tesco employee who buys for Tesco. It wasn't a customer buying from Tesco who complained.

Even if he did misinterpret what a "Tesco buyer" is the comment is still correct. The Tesco buyer is one person and because they in their personal judgement did not like the book jacket it was altered. It's still one person making judgements for many.

Re:Explain please...

[Anonymous Coward]

...so how do you like you tin foil hat?

Just because you can't think of any usage doesn't mean there isn't one, it simply means you're not very intelligent. Trends can easily exists within a subset of the customers, say older women, while not being visible if you simply look at the total data. For example, if certain products are usually bought by the same people then you can attempt to move them closer together. You can also know that trends in one product are likely to cause trends in other products.

Privacy Tax vs. Perceived Savings

[wasted time]

Some of you may be interested in reading a bit about these so called loyalty card programs here. http://www.nocards.org/

I am not usually the tinfoil hat type, and these people tend to go a little overboard with some of their logic (especially on the RFID side) but most of their information about the loyalty card programs I have found to be true.

Having worked for a grocery chain for 8 years and most recently a pharmacy chain for 12 years, I am very familiar with the pricing and promotion models used in both. Buying product, setting prices, and developing promotions was my job. The apparent savings offered to these loyalty card holders is nothing of the sort in most cases. Most chains simply raise the normal everyday price of an item and then offer what used to be the everyday price (pre card program) to only those willing to apply for and use the card. This is effectively charging a privacy tax to anyone not wishing to participate in the data collection program. Ironically, that privacy tax pays for collecting data on card holders, with no true cost benefit to any customers.

My favorite example of this is something near and dear to my heart, my coffee creamer. Back when only one of the three grocery chains in my town had a card program, my favorite coffee creamer retailed everyday for $1.19 in all three stores. Even the card store had to maintain that price everyday to stay competitive with the two non-card stores. This was a few years ago, when this card program was just catching on full force in the US. Well, eventually the other two chains joined in the scam and suddenly the price of my coffee creamer started to go through the roof. This item began retailing from $1.79 to $1.99 everyday but with a loyalty card price of $1.19 to $1.29. This is a non-dairy product, so fluctuating milk prices had nothing to do with it. If I had raised everyday prices in my category by 50-60%, I could have stopped buying and taken a long vacation before too long!

The pharmacy chain I left this spring just implemented one of these card programs about 6 months before I left. I was one of the only dissenters when the topic first came up in a marketing meeting. Everyone else claimed that we just had to have a loyalty program "because we look out of place if we don't." My stance was that not having one of these irritating programs could be a great marketing point. Unfortunately, most market research falsely indicates that the average consumer loves these damn things and of course our management team wanted to be loved.

Once it was decided that they would start their own program, I began to investigate the subject a little deeper and found the site above. It was at that time I also started to seriously think about my role in the process and began looking to get out of retail all together if I couldn't find a new employer with a little common sense and a focus on true customer service. I don't feel right charging more to people who simply wish to remain unmonitored.

If you are lucky enough to live near a grocer and/or pharmacy which does not have a loyalty program, do yourself a favor and support those stores. Tell the managers you shop in their stores because they don't insult your intelligence by offering you artificial savings in exchange for spying on you.

Re:Privacy Tax vs. Perceived Savings

[The_reformant]

Actually over here in the UK loyalty cards usually work a little differently. Basically you swipe your card when you pay and you accumulate points which are redeemed usually with monthsly vouchers off subsequent bills.

You dont receive a discount on items, there isnt a normal price and a card carriers price. Granted that in the balance the company needs to pay for its data mining somehow and that ultimately has to come from the customers but it is certainly a system which is less insulting to the customers on a day to day basis

Re:Privacy Tax vs. Perceived Savings

[jmt9581]

Why do you claim that the market research "falsely indicates that the average consumer loves these damn things?" I'd like to hear what evidence you have to the contrary.

Re:Privacy Tax vs. Perceived Savings

[wasted time]

I believe people are using these cards simply to avoid paying more than they have to for grocery and healthcare items. They are not using them because they like them. Almost everyone agrees that the average card carrying consumer uses cards from multiple competing stores, thereby eliminating the loyalty aspect from the idea. They view the cards as a form of required ID which enables them to buy sale priced merchandise. Given the choice, I believe people would rather they weren't required to show an ID card in order to receive sale prices. (Or even normal, un-inflated prices in many cases)

I left the industry about 6 months ago and therefore no longer have access to all the marketing spin we were subjected to while being sold a loyalty program; otherwise I would share some of those golden nuggets with you. The study below is a little old and not exactly what I was looking for to support my claim but, almost everything else I found online required a journal subscription or $25 to buy the report. It simply doesn't mean enough to me to buy a report or spend too much more time digging through search results. It would make things much easier if the general media would just cite studies and surveys in their reporting, ahem.

PDF
http://scholar.google.com/url?sa=U&q=http://kitkat .wvu.edu:8080/files/2378.1.brumley_catherine_thesi s.pdf

Google HTML
http://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&lr=&c2coff =1&safe=off&q=cache:-07mI1czlpYJ:kitkat.wvu.edu:80 80/files/2378.1.brumley_catherine_thesis.pdf+groce ry+store+loyalty+cards+consumer+attitude

ACNielson research illustrates that U.S. consumers are spending less money at supermarkets because they can find the same products elsewhere in convenience stores, wholesale clubs, and super centers. (US consumers turn their back on supermarkets 2000) In addition, the typical American shopper now uses no fewer than three different supermarket frequent shopper cards and often far more. Moreover, shoppers use loyalty cards the way they once used newspaper ads--to cherry pick the weekly specials. In other words, shoppers today are no more loyal to one particular supermarket than in the era before loyalty programs. (Pinto 2000) Another important point, loyalty in one area does not necessarily translate into other areas.

----

Descriptive statistics and mean calculations reveal the cumulative order of rank data with 1 being the most important to 7 the least important when selecting a supermarket.
The results reveal
1) Everyday low price;
2) quality of merchandise;
3) convenient location;
4) assortment;
5) store deals;
6) customer service;
and dead last
7) loyalty programs.

-----

Conclusions
There may be further implications and effects of loyalty card marketing to consider. After a complete analysis and study, the researcher also suggests that current supermarket loyalty card programs may be best categorized as a form of sales promotion.
This is due to the underlying motive of loyalty card programs. From the consumer's perspective, the perceived brand value from loyalty programs is not much different than everyday and weekly promotional sales. In other words, most supermarkets utilizing cards do so mainly to offer the advertised weekly sale price. If a customer does not have the card, they do not receive the discounts or sale price. It would appear that if loyalty cards programs are supposed to be centered around customer retention and building life-long value then using loyalty cards in a sales promotion capacity, alone should n

Ask to use the store card.

[cyclobotomy]

Ask to use the store card. I have been doing this for years and have never been turned down by the register oprtator.

At Tesco

[Pseudonymus Bosch]

When we shopped at Tesco, we received some cards from friends that were to leave Britain. So we kept the meager points and Tesco found a sudden change in buying behaviour after the "address change".

Fish hat

[Pseudonymus Bosch]

He he.
First I laugh at the mere bizarre image. Then I realized it was a Nigerian scammer and it became better.
Thanks for linking.

They know all about you!

[macjim]

When these Clubcards started we got pestered with forms - as well as your name and address, they wanted to know your income, size and age of family, car, probably favourite colour etc. You could lie to get your card, but you can bet that the database is directly linked to the card user. In contrast, the Co-op restarted its century old dividend scheme using similar cards, but didn't ask for personal details. I find Tesco's worth avoiding, and keep supporting my local shops and small local Co-op.

Re:You have the WRONG idea...

[symbolic]

If this is a matter of intelligence, I think I can reasonably argue that it's completely STUPID to hand over personal information without knowing exactly what it will be used for, and by whom. Typically, once it's out of your hands, it's out of your control. As for me personally, a store would need to have something pretty damed impressive up its sleeve in order for me to justify this constant monitoring of my purchasing preferences. Incremental changes to make things slightly more "convenient" just don't cut it.

Personal Identifier not Required

[bill_mcgonigle]

Personally, I hope to hell they learn everything they can about me

This isn't necessary. If they would give me a card in exchange for learning that I'm a 32-year old married caucasian with one child living in my ZIP code I'd sign right up. That's everything they need to know to do their market research and improve the product supply.

But instead they want my name, address, social security number, and drivers license number so they can cross-reference it with lord knows which databases and sell marketing information about me.

So I use no card and pay $0.39 a pound more for chicken thighs than you do. Only when convenience mandates I not avoid those stores.

These are two entirely separate unrelated activities.