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Microsoft Fights the Flab as it Turns 30

Alain Williams writes "This review of Microsoft, as it enters middle age, looks at it's problems in maintaining growth." Discusses the recent Kai-Fu Lee/Google debacle, as well as things like Apple's iPod.

44 of 214 comments (clear)

  1. Time for the... by chanda3199 · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...red midlife crisis sports car?

    1. Re:Time for the... by tomhudson · · Score: 5, Funny
      No, they're past the "mid-life crisis" stage.

      Mid-life crisis, you buy stuff to make you feel better (Microsofts' bought LOTS of stuff over the years).

      Cranky old spinster is more like it. Throwing chairs, continually trying to evoke the ghost of the good old days, complaining that nobody gives them the respect they think they still deserve, upset that everyone is going all googley-eyed for those who are younger, prettier, cooler, sexier.

      Now we see the aging dame getting some cosmetic surgery, trying to put a new face on the old battleaxe. Unfortunately, in both looks and code, beauty is only skin deep, but ugly goes right to the bone.

      Sure, she can still get a date. She has money. There are those who are quite willing to play the part of Deuce Bigelow, male gigolo. But she knows that her bedmates are only in it for the bucks, they may be with her physically, but mentally they're miles away, wondering how they can "get lucky" with the new prom queen, and worried that they may never be able to because of the "Ewww - you slept with HER?" factor.

      Stay tuned for the next installment - "Microsoft Windows - Vampire Edition", where a deal with the devil is quickly done, and for some reason users are feeling drained (well, more than usual) ...

    2. Re:Time for the... by english_guy_78 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Does this mean we have another 30 years of Microsoft to "look forward to"...?

    3. Re:Time for the... by MPHellwig · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Microsoft is like oil (in more then one perspective). Sooner or later you have to shift to other resources. Just say that I believe it will be sooner then later. But if you still want to buy oil for your long term investment, be my guest.

  2. Another year older... by burtdub · · Score: 5, Funny

    When Microsoft hits its midlife crisis, what's it going to do? Patent the Porsche?

  3. F**K OFF by gowen · · Score: 5, Funny

    Thirty is not middle aged.

    Love,
    Gaz (age 32)

    --
    Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
    1. Re:F**K OFF by fatman22 · · Score: 4, Funny

      You're not an Old Fart (note the caps) until your grandchildren start building computers out of the parts in your junk bin.

    2. Re:F**K OFF by Pharmboy · · Score: 3, Funny

      You got modded as Funny, but should have been as insightful. According this this then because I am now 40, I will "average" living until I am at least 80 (rough math from extracting data in first document, USA, white, male).

      Seems that middle age starts at 40, NOT 30. Even at birth, the average life expectancy in the US is 73 years, and gets higher as you get older, especially after you are 25.

      --
      Tequila: It's not just for breakfast anymore!
    3. Re:F**K OFF by Ucklak · · Score: 5, Insightful

      When you hit 38 and realize that 18 year olds consider you old, you might retract that comment.

      What's even worse are the 14 year olds that consider you really old.

      But yeah, thirty is not middle aged.

      --
      if you steal from one source, that is plagiarism, if you steal from many, well, that's just research.
    4. Re:F**K OFF by tsa · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yeah that really sucks. But also the other way round: I find time and time again that I'm 37 but I don't feel that age. This is a problem sometimes when dealing with younger people.

      --

      -- Cheers!

    5. Re:F**K OFF by exp(pi*sqrt(163)) · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Does anyone care what a 14 year old thinks?

      --
      Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
    6. Re:F**K OFF by tomhudson · · Score: 3, Funny
      What's even worse are the 14 year olds that consider you really old.
      Hey, everybody - Jerry Lee Lewis posts on slashdot.

      BTW, you know we still think you're a sleeze for marrying your 13-year-old cuz. Now why couldn't you be like that god-fearin' boy Jimmy Swaggart and just settle for a good old-fashioned whore or two?

    7. Re:F**K OFF by neo · · Score: 2, Funny

      Neither is 37... oh f*ck. I'm middle aged.

    8. Re:F**K OFF by FidelCatsro · · Score: 3, Funny

      I was hopping that they hit middle Age around 15.25 years ago .

      I was also thinking ... In the USA corporations are seen as people .
      So any other person with a record like Ms Microsoft would have spent about half her life in and out of prison .

      --
      The only things certain in war are Propaganda and Death. You can never be sure which is which though
    9. Re:F**K OFF by nanowyatt · · Score: 2, Insightful

      On the up-side, eventually you'll grow up and stop measuring yourself against the standards of teenagers.

      --
      Intellectuals! Liberals! Peacemongers! IDIOTS!!!
    10. Re:F**K OFF by pipingguy · · Score: 2, Funny


      Get used to it; in 10 years he'll be your boss.

  4. Saturated market? by Transcendent · · Score: 5, Insightful

    How can microsoft continue to grow with it's current market share? Granted it still has competition, but that's not going to change much.

    Tons of people use windows, the people that don't aren't going to switch any time soon. Most people (in the US at least) have computers (and probably running windows)... so the only place I can see microsoft going is into a new market section, or just down.

    With embedded media centers not taking off that fast, I'm assuming the latter will most likely happen.

    1. Re:Saturated market? by TooMuchEspressoGuy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "How can microsoft continue to grow with it's current market share?" I don't know; maybe... actually concentrate on releasing quality, bug-free products that people want to buy?

      --
      Many Bothans died to bring you this sig.
    2. Re:Saturated market? by tomhudson · · Score: 2, Informative
      Gaming consoles are an area where they have in fact done okay
      They've never made a profit from the xbox, and, to quote their 10k filing:
      price reductions in the second half of fiscal 2004 related to the late stage of the Xbox lifecycle are expected to lead to lower revenue for the Xbox business.
      Microsfots profits are from Windows and Office, and they're both coming under attack as well.
    3. Re:Saturated market? by tsa · · Score: 2, Insightful

      No, why should they? They are now in the phase where they have to cater the replacement market. The people that buy their products are already used to their quality and don't expect more. Besides, most people don't even know that there are more software manufacturers than MS. How do you think they get away with the new look and feel of Vista that they so obviously (to us) ripped from OSX? Because 90% of their customers never see a Mac end will marvel at the new eye-candy and the 'new and innovative' features this new OS has to offer.

      --

      -- Cheers!

    4. Re:Saturated market? by kamapuaa · · Score: 3, Insightful
      How is this different than in 1992, when basically 100% of the OS market was MS, the vast majority of Word Processors and Database products were MS, and those products were MS's cash cows? They've still managed to grow since 1992, even if their expansions into new markets haven't been nearly as profitable as these core businesses.

      Who's to say they can't keep at it?

      --
      Slashdot: providing anti-social weirdos a soapbox, since 1997.
  5. Weight Watchers by deaddrunk · · Score: 4, Funny

    I lost 44 pounds, perhaps MS should sign up and lose several pounds of chair-throwing, monkey-dancing flab.

    --
    Does a Christian soccer team even need a goalkeeper?
  6. What the fuck is this? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Microsoft getting fat isn't news, Microsoft being fined half its cash reserves, further restricted and split into 2 would be news, good news.

  7. yea right.. by cosminn · · Score: 3, Funny
    Next year it will introduce a new, more secure version of its Windows operating system called Vista,


    ROFL

    as well as an update to its Office suite, which includes Word and Excel.


    as opposed to previous versions, which only came with Access and Outlook.
  8. Said that yesterday by RAMMS+EIN · · Score: 4, Insightful
    All that sounds like a comment I made yesterday (my definition of yesterday, which is as good as any other in a world with different timezones, is "before I slept"). The relevant text:


    I seriously think that Microsoft is currently at or over their peak. Their flagship called Windows has made it to the ocean called 'Internet', but is found not to be seaworthy. Malware is penetrating it at an alarming rate, and it's only a matter of time before it will sink. It remains to be seen if their next OS will be any better. At the same time, their Office software has about reached the point where no new features can be important enough to attract many new customers, and since they have pretty much the whole market, they can only go down from here.

    In both markets, they are receiving competition from opponents that they can't kill. Open source projects just won't die while there are still people using them. Right now, open source is still all potential and no real growth in the market that Microsoft is in. However, with cross-platform products like Firefox and OpenOffice.org slowly creeping in, it is only a matter of time until the benefits of jumping ship from Windows to Linux overcome the resistance, and then the self-sustaining system of platform lock-in will come crashing down.

    Whether or not Microsoft actually loses most of their market share, the truth is that they will be forced to innovate and forced to compete, both of which eat into their profits. The days of them being a virtual monopoly are numbered.
    --
    Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
  9. It will still be around by Brundylop · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Even if Microsoft has slowed down, I'd be very suprised if they all of a sudden went belly-up.

    The increase of competition is a good thing, as companies have to make their products better than their competitors, and sometimes selling them at a cheaper price.

    I just wonder how many small companies with great ideas were too intimidated by Microsoft to put those ideas into action (a certain Simpsons episode comes to mind, no?)

  10. They're still winning by 00_NOP · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Only this week /. posted an article about how vulnerable Firefox ('our' best hope for the majors) was. Linux on the desktop is as far away as it when I started using it four years ago (ask your non-techie friends), MS are still kings of the hill.
    Sure, our little guerilla band has got a bit stronger: MS know they aren't going to get rid of us, so they just hop to contain us - and so far they are winning.
    Indeed, the competition helps them with all that anti-trust stuff. Basically, I am not as optimistic about a free and open future for computing as I was even 18 months ago, though we have come along way since Byte declared Windows NT was the "death" of Unix.

    1. Re:They're still winning by mcrbids · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Linux on the desktop is as far away as it when I started using it four years ago (ask your non-techie friends), MS are still kings of the hill.

      I guess some people haven't been paying attention to their non-techie friends.

      Windows used to be "cool". Now, it's common knowledge that it sucks, it's inconsistent, unreliable, and a pain in the arse. Many of them have heard of Linux, and a few have even tried it.

      Here's my experience:

      For a while, my computer ran RedHat/Fedora, while my wife's computer ran Windows. Mine worked great, hers crashed often. With little time to spend fixing Windows hiccups, I finally just reloaded her ccomputer with Fedora Core.

      My wife, a real trooper, put out honest effort to get to know it. At first, she didn't like it. She couldn't find N or window X opened in annoying ways... Problem printing, etc. You know the routine.

      But, after using it for 6 months, she's an advocate! She's gotten familiar with the shortcomings (EG: not reliably playing Windows Media files) but more importantly, she's gotten familiar with the strengths, too. (EG: It works day in and day out)

      Her usual line goes something like: "It's not for everyone, and it's not perfect. It won't run Windows software, for example. But if you need your computer to just work everyday like it did yesterday, this is something you need to consider. What do you actually DO on your computer? Really?".

      Next thing I know, I'm installing Linux on another computer...

      Here's the funny thing: My parents recently got NAILED by Yet Another Windows Worm and my wife was espousing the benefits of Linux. Turns out their satellite receiver runs... Linux!

      --
      I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
    2. Re:They're still winning by MisterSquid · · Score: 2, Funny

      so they just hop to contain us - and so far they are winning.

      Tell that to China, Brazil, Germany, and Massachusetts.

      --
      blog
  11. Symptom of FUCKED up investing climate by Monkelectric · · Score: 4, Insightful
    People are worried about the growth of MS, which, were it to never grow again is still a company which makes a BILLION a month? By and standard thats still a HELL of a company.

    Or are people worried because they bought a stock which was far overvalued due to fervor and hype which was known to everyone at the time to be unstable, unsustainable, and a bad risk?

    --

    Religion is a gateway psychosis. -- Dave Foley

    1. Re:Symptom of FUCKED up investing climate by cowscows · · Score: 4, Informative

      Well, there are a couple of ways to make money off of stock. The traditional way is to say, ok, I own a portion of the company, and I get a portion of the profits at regular intervals. These are called dividends, and they're nice.

      The other way to make money is by trading stock, basically hoping the price of your shares goes up so that you can sell it for more than you bought it. You can make a whole lot of money really fast this way if everything goes right. You can also lose a whole lot of money too. This is all well and good, but relies on consistent growth.

      The problem is that somewhere down the line, dividends ceased to be important to many people, and it's all about growth. Many companies don't even pay dividends anymore, instead just stockpiling all their cash if they make any money. Tech companies are all about this business model. Microsoft only recently paid its first dividends out. Now granted, even if you are receiving income from dividends on stock you own, growth is nice because it should mean more profit, meaning bigger dividends.

      So, like you said, it's not really necessary for constant growth to make a stock valuable. But dividends are a longer term investment, so they're unattractive to a lot of people. That being the case, the stock market is basically driven by growth, and the fact that we had a short period of ridiculous growth a few years back still has a lot of people's expectations out of whack.

      Granted, in reality, it's more complicated than this, but the biggest problem is just people's mindsets, and the get rich quick mentality. And since all these companies are competing for investor's dollars, they'll play the game however they can. Another factor that's led to accounting scandals.

      --

      One time I threw a brick at a duck.

    2. Re:Symptom of FUCKED up investing climate by msaavedra · · Score: 2, Insightful
      These are called dividends, and they're nice...but dividends are a longer term investment, so they're unattractive to a lot of people.

      The big problem with dividends is that you are taxed on them immediately. Essentially, with dividends the government skims a percentage off the top every year, whereas if the corporation keeps the money and reinvests it to encourage growth, you should end up seeing that money returned to you in the form of higher stock prices, while avoiding the tax hit until you actually sell your stock. Due to the magic of compounding returns, you make a whole lot more money if you defer the taxes until the end rather than pay them steadily every year. So dividends are bad not only for all those moronic get-rich-quick day traders, but also for canny long-term investors. Indeed, it's this sort of strategy that made Warren Buffett, the quintessential long-term investor, into a very wealthy man.

      The problems you describe are very real, though, and I think we'd be better off as a society if we got rid of taxation of dividends altogether. Of course, there are already some ways to reinvest dividends tax-free, which is good, but usually you are pretty limited in the amount of money you can put into such programs. Also, Pres. Bush managed to pass some big reductions in dividend tax rates, which IMHO is one of the few good things he's done. I suspect that Bush meant this as a favor to the "haves and have-mores" (his own phrase) that make up his base, but it really is good for society as a whole if we can discourage that growth-at-any-cost mentality in corporations by making dividends more attractive to investors.

      --
      "Any fool can make a rule, and any fool will mind it."
      --Henry David Thoreau
  12. ... but that thinking makes it so by the+bluebrain · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Apple's iPod" is only a "debacle" for Microsoft beacuse they decided to make it one. If they concentrated on making good software that plays well with other children, rather than defining each actual innovation in the wider marketplace as a threat to their core competencies - or rather, redefining their core competencies to include any actual innovation as it turns up in the wider marketplace - they might be a "mature" company in two senses of the word.

    --
    yes, we have no bananas
  13. Yes, but what about Google by RAMMS+EIN · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Ok, so let's speculate for a bit. Assume that Microsoft's reign is over. They'll still be around for years to come, and they may stay a major player, but they won't be the f[r]iendly monopolist that they are now.

    What about Google, though? It seems they are showing many of the traits that made Microsoft so strong. They're relatively new, innovative, providing useful products to the masses for cheap, and attracting talented people by good working conditions (including high salaries).

    Where Microsoft dominated the world by virtue of virtually everybody using their OS and office suite, Google is getting hold of people through their Internet services; search, email, instant messaging, voice over IP, and videoconferencing all being key parts of the current and (near) future Interent and computing experience.

    There is also the risk of vendor lock-in; you can access your emails stored in Google Mail only as long as Google allows you to, their VoIP and videoconferencing services are currently only available to users of the proprietary Google Talk client (Google states that they will release protocol specifications, but not a hint as to when this will happen; even with the protocol specifications out there, it's still possible for them to block other clients), some key parts of their search technology are patented, making it difficult for competitors to match the efficiency, etc.

    Note that I am not saying Google is evil or will turn evil, but I am worried at the potential for doing nasty things. I remember the days when Bill Gates was every nerd's idol (except fringe figures like Mac-using nerds and the FSF); look where we are now. A wise person said it this way: "The danger is not that a particular class is unfit to govern. Every class is unfit to govern."

    --
    Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
    1. Re:Yes, but what about Google by yagu · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What about Google, though? It seems they are showing many of the traits that made Microsoft so strong. They're relatively new, innovative, providing useful products to the masses for cheap, and attracting talented people by good working conditions (including high salaries).

      The same can be said about many new companies. The fact any new company becomes strong and offers products shouldn't make them fodder for comparisons to Microsoft. The differences in starting circumstances are striking. Most notably, in my opinion, is Microsoft was aggressive and arrogant from the very beginning. This was probably easy for them from their leader, himself an arrogant spoiled millionaire brat who dropped out of college, drove Daddy's Porsche cross country gathering speeding tickets while thumbing his nose at anyone who got in his way or disagreed with him. (Was he a genius?, a great business man? Maybe, but let's not think the beginnings of Microsoft and Google are really similar at all.)

      As for vendor lockin with Google. I suppose it's a possibility, but their business model isn't based on selling products to consumers. It's based on advertisers and those advertiser's continued faith in Google's excellent consumer services. A 180 degree reversal of that bent by Google would greatly upset their user community and likely create a huge ding in their relationships with their true customers, the advertisers. Not likey, in my opinion.

      And finally, from your post: I remember the days when Bill Gates was every nerd's idol. I don't, and I was around and working in IT back then already. Bill Gates has long been reviled by many for his arrogance and disdain for the rest of the world. Yeah, there were nerds and geeks who adored him, but every as a quantifier is a stretch. The guy was an asshole from day one.

  14. Organizational/software bloat by RradRegor · · Score: 5, Insightful
    I've noticed in my time on this planet that aging organizations and software both show an unavoidable tendancy to bloat over time until they can no longer function and must be replaced.

    I'm not just harping on one company here, I'm thinking organizations in general. Just as individuals have a natural birth, aging, and death cycle, the same seems to hold true with other phenomena. Organizations become victims of their own success. They get larger and more unwieldy, and the presence of excess resources seems to create its own economy of waste. Internal empires form. Departments carve up the pie, and defend turf. As waste increases, the survival of the organization tends to trump whatever purpose it originally formed to serve. With hundreds or thousands of individuals depending on the status quo, or at least the continued existence of the organization, there is a convergence that takes place that makes one soul-less organization or government look much like the others after a while.

    Software bloat we all know about. Features get added by divergent interests who don't fully understand the limits of the paradigm, until the structure starts to sag and/or crumble under the weight. Loose ends and bugs multiply and begin to take on a life of their own, like cancer cells multiplying out of control.

    Sometimes organizations or programs can be "born again" and rise from their own ashes in a completely different form. But sooner or later, some kind of major destruction is inevitable, and maybe necessary.

  15. Remember IBM by kilodelta · · Score: 4, Interesting

    IBM went through similar growing pains.

    Their heyday was the 50's to the 80's and then the bottom dropped out of the equipment market. But IBM adapted.

    Microsoft shows some signs of adaptation with the X-Box line but I don't think it will be enough. The bigger they are, the harder they fall and it's usually 30 or so years of the good life, followed by the remainder being rough.

  16. juicy insider blog: minimsft by toby · · Score: 3, Interesting
    minimsft discusses many of the internal issues in depth. In particular, the counterproductive employee ranking system (more), too many middle managers, and the unstable dumbass at the top.

    (Neil Blender cited this blog on the earlier M$ story.)

    --
    you had me at #!
  17. Fighting Flab? by AutopsyReport · · Score: 2, Funny

    I heard the new exercise to remedy this problem consisted of clapping hands and the incessant yelling of "Developers! Developers! Developers!"

    --

    For he today that sheds his blood with me shall be my brother.

  18. To MSFT is like GM by HangingChad · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Back in the day GM ruled the automotive industry. In the 70's and 80's US car companies started turning out junk. After all, what was your alternative back then? You could rebel and buy a Ford or Chrysler, but they weren't any better than the GM's of the day.

    But that lack of quality plus the oil embargo encouraged consumers to try smaller, more fuel efficient foreign cars, specifically Japanese models.

    Consumers discovered that the reputation of Japanese cars being cheap and poorly made was not true. Not only did they get better gas mileage, but they were really reliable cars. My first import was a Toyota Tercel and the only things I put in that car over 100,000 miles were gas, oil, a set of tires and brake pads. Today you couldn't give me an American car, even though the imports are made here and most American cars are assembled elsewhere. Impressions last a long time.

    That's how I see MSFT. For years they were turning out crap and people are in the process of discovering that the alternatives are pretty good. I'm typing this on a Linux box. A few years ago I hadn't even heard of it. I'm never on the bleeding edge of technology and rarely even the leading edge. If I'm using Linux it's because it works. It works for me at home and, where appropriate, for my business customers.

    MSFT will still be around for a long time, but I believe the market will change to include more alternatives and those alternatives will have a following of their own. There are a lot of people walking around with a MSFT chip on their shoulder that they'll never forget.

    If it's one area MSFT has really fumbled it's inspiring customer loyalty. They're one of the few companies inspiring their customers to outright hostility. They've abused their market position by treating customers as a revenue stream. Most people will get tired of being porked after a while. We're there. MSFT traded short term quarterly gains for long term loyalty. That's what happens when bean counters run your company and Republicans run your country. And I believe people will remember a long time.

    --
    That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
  19. FUD by hkb · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Basically all this hubla about Microsoft's employee culture imploding is FUD. While everyone has things they hate about their job, you talk to most any MS employee and they love their jobs.

    It's as if all the tech writers got bored and turned this little Google/Microsoft fiasco into a big blown up epidemic.

    I do wish Microsoft would downsize a little and perhaps shed a little of its "running around like its head is cut off" way of marketing and developing products and not intercommunicating well enough between product groups. I can't even remember how many versions of Vista are slated for release, but its nuts.

    --
    /* Moderating all non-anonymous trolls up since 2004 */
  20. Re:Cut down the fat ( crappy management) by Overly+Critical+Guy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    If Google releases an online office suite, it's over for Microsoft. Imagine an office productivity suite that doesn't require installation, is always up-to-date, and is integrated with the 'net.

    --
    "Sufferin' succotash."
  21. Re:F**K OFF - Care what a 14 year old thinks? by Maow · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Does anyone care what a 14 year old thinks?

    We all did once [for about 12 months]...

  22. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 3, Funny

    Comment removed based on user account deletion