Chess for Kids?

cyberbian asks: "My six year old daughter has recently expressed an interest in chess. We have been playing a few games, but I fear that I'm not the best teacher for such a venerable game. Is there any software that the Slashdot community would recommend for learning the mechanics and structures of good chess?"

Comments

Kids' chess set

[Wespionage]

I can't say much about software for kids -- my daughter is five and just starting to show an interest, but hasn't started to try to play yet. But I can remember, when I was a kid, I had an instructional chess set that had fairly simple plastic pieces with all the moves for each piece embossed on them.

Something like this (links directly to an image).

I can remember, even at a young age, my younger brother and I playing together because we could at least shuffle the pieces around without worry about remembering all the rules. Certainly, this doesn't say much for teaching strategy, but I think it could still be a nice set for just keeping the game fun for kids, especially if your daughter might want to play with her friends who might not be as interested by the game.

Re:Kids' chess set

[flogic42]

No, I think that's a nice way to cheat your kids out of actually learning something. It's more fun when you play it right. Otherwise you might as well just be playing with blocks. Teaching a 6 year old all the rules is pretty trivial. You both just need some patience.

Re:Kids' chess set

[damiam]

My parents got me one of those and I hated it. It took maybe a week for me to learn how each piece moved (and the set wasn't very helpful; the instructions on the pieces were hard to decipher). After I learned the basics, the extra instructions were mostly useless to me, and I thought the pieces looked clunky, ugly and juvenile. I'd have been much happier with a nice, professional-looking, standard chess set.

Each to his own, I guess.

Re:Kids' chess set

[Wespionage]

I would agree with you, if you're the kind of parent who takes the approach that if the child has any tools or toys that can enable some independence then you shouldn't participate with them at all. I was assuming, from the submitter's question, that he/she already had some interest in playing chess with his/her daughter and teaching her the rules.

I think there is an added benefit (at least there was for me) to having a chess set that lets a child include friends who might not have the benefit of someone having taught them the game, or even of getting to play with a younger sibling. For me, it helped it feel more like a game and less like a lesson.

I see little difference here between chess and cards for a six year old. Both are fun and rule/strategy based. You could take the time to immerse your kid in the rules every time they want pull out a deck of cards, but you could also give them a pack of cards to just sit there and shuffle through, or play war with once in a while, without having to worry about strategy and more complex rules.

But also, if you're concerned that having your child just play with the board and pieces, or play with people beneath his/her skill level, will be detrimental for his/her later chess tournaments, then you have a different agenda altogether and it's probably better to spend some money on a tutor.

Personally, I was happy to think that the game was both challenging and kinda fun at that age. But then again, I'm sure there were enough times where I had a chess piece sticking out of my mouth or was busy making the neighing and fighting sounds for the knights.

Re:Kids' chess set

[Anonymous Coward]

I had an instructional chess set that had fairly simple plastic pieces with all the moves for each piece embossed on them.

The common Staunton Chess pieces already reflect the moves of the pieces (to a certain extent). It might help beginners to point out the shapes reflect the moves with most sets:
The Bishop moves diagonally and the top of the piece is slanted.
The Rook moves in straight lines and the top is flat (flat enough to turn upside down and it still stands up).
The Knight has a bent horses head and moves in an L-shape pattern
The Queen can move in all directions and her crown has a circle of points reflecting the multiple directions.
The King and the Pawn don't match up as well
The King usually has a cross on top and he moves one space in all directions. This is something like a cross.
The Pawn usually has a single globe on top. This might be like a single space move.

Well it works pretty well for the knight, rook, and bishop.

It does not work for en passant, casteling or the initial pawn move of one or two spaces.

Re:Kids' chess set

[EngrBohn]

My son took up chess in November. To help him remember the moves I drew the possible moves for each piece on a sheet from engineering pad. We saw a set like that in a nearby store shortly before he got interested but couldn't find it again before he grew out of the need for that a couple of weeks later. We since picked up a couple of "Chess Teacher" sets for $5 each on after-Christmas discount and donated them to his school. The sets we found had hollow plastic pieces that squeeze-fit into the bases. If the child doesn't need the help, the bases can be removed.

Re:Kids' chess set

[goatpunch]

I don't see the point of that- anyone capable of decoding that mess of symbols on the edge of the piece should have no problem remembering the moves for the 6 different pieces.

I learned chess at 6, I'm pretty sure that the moves are well within the grasp of any 6 year old.

Re:Kids' chess set

[slysithesuperspy]

Is there not a 'chess club' at her school? I've just remembered after school chess when i was 4.

Re:Kids' chess set

[Anonymous Coward]

Is it true that you're a fag?

Re:Kids' chess set

[Anonymous Coward]

"To each his own".

Re:Kids' chess set

[pla]

I've just remembered after school chess when i was 4.

Four? As in, Earth-years? And you don't have a tail?

You had extracurricular activities in preschool???

Damn, talk about putting too much pressure on a kid to achieve!

chessmaster

[flogic42]

The chessmaster series has good tutorials at any level.

Re:chessmaster

[Jazzer_Techie]

When I was in elementary school, our chess club used Chessmates to help younger players learn. It's a Win 9x piece of software, but it is great. It has 10 levels of play, easy being really easy and hard actually being pretty tough. More importantly, it has great tutorials illustrating various tactics. There are animated characters who guide you through the various skills, complete with puzzles, and when you master something it generates a nice printable certificate. (Example: to illustrate a fork, a handsome prince has to choose between saving a damsel in distress and a treasure chest from a dragon. May sound a bit silly, but it's really effective. And throughout the program Wigby the Wizard can give hints and help.) It's a great program for younger kids.

Re:chessmaster

[Will2k_is_here]

Don't forget Rugby his flying "rug". All in all, it was an excellent game for teaching chess to children.

Re:chessmaster

[Anonymous Coward]

I'll second that. The version 10 of Chessmaster gives good tutorials on how the pieces move, etc, but also has good stuff even for more advanced players.

However, as many other people here point out, the time you spend teaching is golden. When I learned it was my dad who taught me, and I was only about 5. I knew enough to play- something like Chessmaster is really to help hone those rough skills.

Re:YEAH I GOT SOME

[Anonymous Coward]

You mean GO_OUT~1.EXE, QUIT_A~1.DLL and PLAY_A~1.COM.

People are better teachers

[Cyphertube]

I don't know where you live, but I'm sure that your six year old is not interested in sitting in front of a programme as much as sitting with people. You may not be the greatest chess player ever, but I'm sure you're more social than the machine.

If your child starts to beat you regularly, then it's time to start finding new opponents. There are some places where people do actually meet and play chess. Take a look around. See if anyone you know plays as well.

Starting to look for software right away is similar to using the television as a babysitter. Yes, the child will learn something, but will also not learn plenty of other things.

Re:People are better teachers

[hal2814]

"I'm sure you're more social than the machine."

This is Slashdot. I wouldn't be so quick to make that assumption.

Re:People are better teachers

[BoredAtWorkWhatElse]

The parent has a point, however if YOU want to learn how to play chess so you can teach your daughter better you can try ChessMaster. Great software for both the beginners and the experts, many tutorials, quiz, challenges, games with audio commentary (by Chess Master Josh Waitzkin).

Maybe not the best software for a child but definitely a good one for a grown up. And like the parent said, for now you're still the best teacher there is for your daughter =)

Re:People are better teachers

[Anonymous Coward]

I'd be careful about teaching a daughter too much chess at this young age. While it's always a little bit difficult for kids being geeks among their peers, it's gotta be ten times worse for girls than boys, especially with the amount of social skills she'll need. Last thing I'd want is a geek daughter who finds it difficult to socialize because of pursuits I'd led her to when she's 6.

More than likely she just wants your company as her father, so just play muck-about games, don't go too in depth and she'll get her enjoyment from chess with you, and grow up knowing how to be social.

Re:People are better teachers

[VaderPi]

My father and I used to play often when I was little. My memory is a little fuzzy, but I was probably about 8. My father taught me how to play and payed enough attention to make sure that I did not cheat. He also tried to point out why some of my moves were not wise.

Even with the advice that he gave me, I am not sure that he ever went all that easy on me. Beating my father was my ultimate goal whenever we played. He would try to explain to me why I lost each time, turning the defeat into a lesson. I do not remember winning until I was at least 14. I lost the game right after that, however. :)

Now, my father is no master chess player, and for that matter, neither am I. But I think that I learned more from having him teach me than I think I would have learned from a computer. I also think that he taught me how to gracefully handle defeat as well.

The only thing that my console games taught me about defeat, was that I felt a lot better when the controller hit the wall. Damn you Pitfall. You drove me to break more Atari controllers. :)

Looking back, I am really fond of the time that I spent playing chess with my father. I bet that your daughter will as well.

Re:People are better teachers

[mordors9]

Many school systems will have a chess program in them. Also check with the local library. There is often a local chess scene with weekly club meetings and such that most people are not aware of until they look for it.

Re:People are better teachers

[DigitalCrackPipe]

Schools with a chess program/club often have resources, such as national newsletters and information on local events that may be useful. I don't recall playing at the age of 6, so I'm not sure what the best software resources are for that age. I do agree, however, that interaction with people (such as parents) will probably bring greater rewards than just the intellectual development a program can bring.

Re:People are better teachers

[Profane MuthaFucka]

That was almost over the top. Should have thrown in the comment that a Barbie that says "Math and Chess are hard" would be a good toy. That would have made your post just about perfect. :-)

No reason why a 6 year old girl can't just ignore a world out there that thinks using your head isn't cool. Let her enjoy all the puzzles that come her way without making it cool or uncool.

Re:People are better teachers

[VlartBlart]

I agree with you entirely - *people* are better teachers. I remember my dad teaching me chess at a young age (me - not my dad) - it was *sooo* much fun huddling down over the board with me asking question after question.

Teaching someone a game is also a bonding process. I've taught adult friends games such as Poker, Uno, Backgammon, Combat Flight Sim ;) - and it's always been a really fun time where we've *bonded* that little bit more.

Sharing your intelligence with anyone - especially a kid - is fun.

Re: People are better teachers

[cyberbianMom]

As the mother of said "six-year-old daughter" who truly has initiated an interest in chess (all on her own), I feel the need to weigh in on this discussion. First, we are aware that people are better teachers. I am a qualified teacher and we know the importance of socially mediated interactions. It is reassuring to know that if a cyborg-parent lacking in the ability to teach through modeling and zone of proximal development, that Slashdot readers would be ready to stay them on the humane track. However, I did not think Slashdot was the forum for advice on how to interact with your children. When seeking out the best chess software for kids, it must be said, I would definitely consider Slashdot the place to go for solid software advice. Being the incredibly hip, socially progressive crowd, I would also expect leading edge advice that encompassess accessibility, platform independence, and overall usability. Thanks to all of you who did provide that.

Re:People are better teachers

[zaroastra]

My father teached me chess when i was real young, and beat me in it every time since until around 19. I really looked forward to play with him, and the prospect of winning him stood on my mind until the day I finally managed.
I even remember once, around 16, when I had the upper hand, and he was called for duty. I stayed in front of the board analizing every move, and smiling on how he was screwed.
He arrived a couple of hours later, said something like "nice but no cigar", sacrificed the queen (the only move I had not think about), and beat me in a few more moves.

Back to topic, play with her, teach her, and forget about computer programs until she is at least a teen. (At that age she will be able to pick them herself)

PS: I tried several times to teach girls to play chess. It never proved worthwhile. Hope you have better luck:P

Re: People are better teachers

[adam.skinner]

Right, because we all know that Slashdot is the place where people with no social skills come to wax eloquent.

Rest assured, we're just people who love technology. There are many loving parents and people with well developed social skills who can provide insightful input to questions just like these.

I just happen to not be one of them. (j/k!)

I've got a 6 year old daughter as well, and really the best thing in my mind that you can do is set up a "chess date" some time, where you can sit down and play the game with her, joke it up and share some snacks. I bet if you tied in some baking it would be one of her favorite activities =)

Re: People are better teachers

[plumby]

I think you're missing the point. I don't think (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) that they are suggesting that a chess program should replace family time together playing the game. I think they are looking for a good program for her to learn from in between that family time.

As a parent, you aren't going to be available every second that the kid wants to play, and sometimes they will want to play/study on their own anyway (I know I did, but then my dad stopped playing me once I could beat him).

Re:People are better teachers

[jbolden]

Actually its pretty good for kids. Its one of the few programs that has opponents which are easy enough for a child to beat.

ObGoPost

[Anonymous Coward]

Kids often find Go easier to learn, as it has fewer rules and you can play a simplified version of the game (on a smaller board, or first to capture 5, etc) that is still a meaningful introduction to the strategy.

Re:ObGoPost

[Anonymous Coward]

I agree about Go. It's more commonly played than Chess in other parts of the world, requires far more brainpower, and has fewer and simpler rules than chess. Teach her both.

You

[pizzaman100]

I would say that unless your kid is some kind of chess prodigy, the best teacher is you. A little quality time between parent and child is of more value than a program or even a tutor, and your kid will appreciate it more.

Re:You

[Cmdr-Absurd]

Mod me redundant, but I was about to write the same thing.

Some of my fondest early childhood memories are of long evenings playing chess with my father. I was 6 at the time. I also taught my 1st grade teacher how to play. I would say that I lost interest in the game after a year or two, but the quality time with adults was worth far more than any time with a computer would have been (if computer chess had even been an option back then.)

Don't get me wrong -- I was pretty serious at the time -- always thinking several moves ahead and running a dozen scenarios in my head at once. But I would not have had the same interest playing against an inanimate opponent. The social aspect was just as important as the chess strategy.

Just play the game with your kid. You won't be sorry. Neither will she.

Teach her yourself.

[Eightyford]

Geez man... the least you could do is teach her the basics yourself! After that, I recommend an old program called battlechess. Sure it's kind of violent (in a fun, cartoony, pixelated way), but I take it from your post that you aren't exactly running for father of the year anyway.

Easy Question...

[gasmonso]

The best chess game of course is Battle Chess http://www.dosgamesonline.com/index/game/Battle%20 Chess/30/

http://religiousfreaks.com/

Re:Easy Question...

[Premo_Maggot]

I'm not quite sure that's a great solution for a six year old daughter...

Re:Easy Question...

[rsd]

Yep. I know a lot people started playing and learning chess with Battle Chess.
They just wanted to see the peaces ripping each other appart.

Even without knowing how to play they learned by try.

Later it came Battle Chess 3000 and then Star Wars Battle Chess or something like this.

Today there is Chessmaster 10 which has a kid module that teachs a kid how to play with full 3D animations.

And there is Majestic Chess. That was created by the original author of Chessmaster and has a really interesting adventure game to teach how to play chess. Really interesting even for advanced players. here is a Review.

Not a big chess player, but...

[BigZaphod]

I think the best way to learn at first is by hands-on practice. Trial and error. You could try to teach the theory of the mechanics up front, but I think you might be doing her a disservice by eliminating the learning process. There's much about games that feed intuition and if you remove the need to develop the intuition it seems to me that you'd be removing part of what makes the game fun to begin with. But, then again, I have no children and I'm certainly not an expert.. :-) I'd say just play the game with her and let the learning take care of itself. If she's beating you all the time, though, then that's different - but if this is just about learning the game and having fun with it then who cares if everyone is using the best possible strategy for each move?

And with Dad

[IAAP]

You may not be the greatest chess player ever, but I'm sure you're more social than the machine.

Plus, she's spending time with Mom or Dad. That's more important than anything. She'll progress in her own time.

Re:And with Dad

[CardiganKiller]

A lot of the things I still love to do today that I did as a kid were because my parents were actively involved and interested. Chess was definitely one of those things. Chess is pleasant to play for me because I've been playing it since I was a kid and I have a lot of fond memories associated with it, a lot of which were/are with my dad.

Fritz and Chesster

[Michael Dorfman]

Fritz and Chesster is what I've used with my daughter-- it's an excellent program.

http://www.chessbase.com/shop/product.asp?pid=165& user=&coin=

I haven't gotten around to picking up Volume 2, though...

http://www.chessbase.com/shop/product.asp?pid=230& user=&coin=

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[Fhqwhgadss]

I have found software from Chessbase (Fritz, etc) to be pretty demeaning to women. In response to moving the queen for the first time in Fritz 7, for example, the opponent replied (audibly): "A woman's place is in the kitchen." I have read reviews (can't find them now, though) that Fritz and Chesster have similar comments, especially in the multimedia sequences and that these cannot be skipped. So unless you want your daughter being repeatedly told how inferior they are, or your son exposed to such sexist views, I would stay away from F & C. If you're just looking for a means to keep your kid quiet for long periods of time without bothering you, I've heard that F & C is great.

As far as the instruction goes, you would serve your kids far better by teaching them yourself, over the board. It's a lot more fun for you too. As long as you can teach the very basics of piece movement, you should be good enough. If you feel the need to suppliment with software after teaching the basics, there is great tactics software for all skill levels; Chess Tactics for Beginners and CT-Art from ChessAssistant come to mind. Teaching strategy with software to a young child, I expect would be a lost cause, though I haven't tried that myself. You're better off learning that yourself or using a professional chess instructor. Jeremy Silman has some good books if you're up to the task of learning yourself. Otherwise call (or visit!) your local chess club and ask for referrals for a good instructor. They may have some sotware to recommend, but will add expert instruction and recommend how to use the software effectively.

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[Anonymous Coward]

A woman's place is in the kitchen.

Until dinner's ready at least. After, it's back to the attic!

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[Dirtside]

I have found software from Chessbase (Fritz, etc) to be pretty demeaning to women. In response to moving the queen for the first time in Fritz 7, for example, the opponent replied (audibly): "A woman's place is in the kitchen." I have read reviews (can't find them now, though) that Fritz and Chesster have similar comments, especially in the multimedia sequences and that these cannot be skipped. So unless you want your daughter being repeatedly told how inferior they are, or your son exposed to such sexist views, I would stay away from F & C.

I've just spend a little bit trying to Google for anything about Fritz or Chessbase involving women, kitchen, misogyny, insults, or anything else that might refer to what you're talking about, and I can't find anything. I find it hard to believe that there wouldn't be a significant uproar about such things if they actually did exist. Do you have any reliable source or reference for these supposed comments that Fritz makes?

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[Fhqwhgadss]

Here's a link to one review of Fritz and Chesster that has a vague mention of the jokes. Another review specifically mentions fat jokes.

I haven't personally used F & C, but I have heard the offensive banter of Fritz 7 first-hand. It's really in poor taste. As far as why no-one cares, that's easy. The world of chess is dominated by men, almost to the point of exclusion. Girls are not encouraged to play serious chess. At my local chess club I've seen precisely one female player out of dozens of players I've seen there. The only female player to ever get any traction in the "men's" league is Judit Polgar. All of the rest play in the league that is specifically for women. Hell I've even seen insulting emails posted online by GMs lambasting a strong player for trying to attain a GM title part of which said that the WIM (Women's International Master) title was not even a possibility, let alone a "real" title. Chessbase's "news" articles are especially awful. More often than not, you'll see exactly 0 articles discussing women in chess on the front page. If there are any, it's more likely to be a tounament that includes both men's and women's divisions, or glamour shots of Alexandra Kosteniuk, than a serious piece.

Perhaps I was quick to judge F & C as having sexist content, but given Chessbase's modus operandi, I'm not going to find out by sitting my daughters in front of it.

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[Danny Rathjens]

Put on your irony detector; the queen is the most powerful piece by far.

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[Anonymous Coward]

I have Fritz 8.

When you first run Fritz, it asks for for the second CD to install "comments". They're optional, though - you can cancel and it won't install them.

They're pretty lame (as you note), and in an annoying dork voice, so I have them disabled. I can't remember if you can disable them from the UI or have to not install them in the first place. There's no subtitles or anything if the audio files aren't there so there's no problem.

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[LandruBek]

In response to moving the queen ... the opponent replied (audibly): "A woman's place is in the kitchen."

Ironic, because that piece that in English you call the Queen, is in Russian called the Ferz', basically, the king's "Grand Vizier" -- a traditionally masculine role. It is Karl Rove, not Laura Bush.

Oh wait, maybe that is not such an apt simile. :-)

Re:Fritz and Chesster

[texaport]

PlayChess.com has a beginner and children's section. 50 Euros or so after the first month
(remains free if your IP is in a third-world country or some former Soviet-bloc countries)

They also push the sale of Fritz quite heavily!

sigh ... like maybe Chessmaster?

[Anonymous Coward]

why was this article posted?

can anyone please explain?

Re:sigh ... like maybe Chessmaster?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's not an article; it's a question. Sentences begin with a capital letter. This question was posted because it was submitted to a Slashdot editor and subsequently accepted as being worthy of posting for reasons that are, and will remain, unknown to anyone but the one who posted it.

Welcome to the internet.

Good introductory game -- Smess

[BobTheWonderMonkey]

As a child I learned a game called Smess (The Ninny's Chess) first. Check out ChessVariants for information. It's a great introductory game that gets you started thinking along chess lines. The transition from Smess to Chess is relatively simple to make, even for a child.

Give it a try!

Re:Good introductory game -- Smess

[cyberbian]

excellent strategy! I'm for oblique approaches any day... I think she's just as much interested in the 'Court' of the game and the all the kings men approach looks sound as well! thanks for the info :D cyberbian - I Fink therefore I can.

Re:Good introductory game -- Smess

[bcrowell]

My daughter went to an after-school program when she was about 7, and they started them off with something they called football chess. I think it only had pawns, and IIRC they moved the normal way except that there was no pawn promotion. (Not sure about en passant.) I think the idea was to get them used to the really basic ideas, and give them something that had some strategy to it, without overwhelming them with all the rules for how the pieces move. To give an idea of what it was like, if the kids were good and didn't throw the pieces, they got gummi bears at the end.

My daughter learned how to play, but never got that serious about it. Nowadays (2 years later) when I play with her, I think I spot her a queen, a bishop, and a knight, and we use a chess clock, with her limited to 30 min, and me to 5 min. It might seem ridiculous, but it's enough that she can learn concepts like development and control of the center, and have some realistic hope of winning without my having to make intentional bad moves.

Dear Slashdot,

[Anonymous Coward]

My kid is showing interest in social interaction, but I'll be damned if any spawn of mine is going to enjoy games in any form other than electronic. Can anyone recommend some software to help nip this disgusting habit in the bud?

Thanks,
Freak Show

Maurice Ashley Teaches Chess

[DyslexicLegume]

I remember having an old game called Maurice Ashley Teaches Chess. It walks you through the basics all the way to intermediate to advanced strategy.

If you can find a copy somewhere cheap (or google it), I'd reccommend it.

the game may only be part of it.

[nocomment]

I have a sneaky feeling that the game may only be part of it. The rest being, doing something with her daddy.

Too young but

[BitterAndDrunk]

The one book I'd heartily recommend is Winning Chess.
She could probably start reading it around 8-10 and be ok with it; until then I think it's best to just let her play for fun and don't beat her up too badly.

I started playing around 6 as well, and the one thing that kept me going was playing with my father; I was given many computer programs/games to use but they weren't what made me want to continue. Playing with my dad was the draw.
Just some food for thought.

Spend time with your child

[RingDev]

I would hazard a guess that what you daughter is actually showing an interest in is spending time with you. She would probrably be just as interested in working on your car, pulling cable, wood working, etc... if you were doing it with her. And besides, Quality time > chess skillz.

-Rick

Re:Spend time with your child

[Anonymous Coward]

Dear God i'm sick of parental advice on Slashdot.

Re:Spend time with your child

[volvolus]

I'd suggest sharing the experience with her. That way you're getting to know her better. And giving her memories of having fun and learning with you. Will her childhood memories be about dad, or about books and software?

Re:Spend time with your child

[RingDev]

Well then don't read posts with titles about parenting. Duh.

-Rick

Good program...

[dcapel]

I hear that Deep blue might provide a bit of a challenge for her.

Forget software

[Dr. Sp0ng]

What you need is a good book on chess and your local chess club. Yes, they do tend to have members in the single-digit age range (it sucks being knocked out of a tournament by an 8 year old!)

join a chess club?

[wardk]

they are all over. 5 year old chess is huge. most schools have one, or a neighbor school will adopt kids from other schools.

most chess software quite honestly sucks, especially getting it setup to challenge a 5 year old without discouraging them by getting slaughtered over and over.

Software People

[Gulthek]

Dear Slashdot:

Raising a child is difficult and annoying. They never seem to stop asking questions! Isn't there some computer program (or, if necessary, television show) that will do it for me?

And if they ARE a prodigy...

[jgardn]

And if they ARE a prodigy, how are you going to recognize that unless you play with them?

I'd teach her go instead.

[j2asghar]

Go is great. it's easier and as she gets older it becomes more and more challanging. Check it out, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Go_(board_game)/

hello :-)

[dragons_R_scary]

hi i am a 16 year old kid who learnt to play at the age of 8 .... i learnt by my dad teaching me the basic rules then playing against real people (useing an internet chess program) i found that i learnt more off the net than i did off a computerised program. so after you have taught your kid the basic rules you might want to set up something like yahoo or something :-)

Re:hello :-)

[nwbvt]

She is a six year old girl. Thats a bit young to use a service like Yahoo's main games site. If you really want to let a six year old play on the net, please save us all an Amber alert and make sure she is only on a site dedicated for kids.

Re:hello :-)

[dragons_R_scary]

there is a linux chess game (cant rember name of it ..) witch lets you play real people but it does not have a chat function

Learn as you teach her

[JamesTKirk]

I'm an intermediate chess player, and I'm currently teaching my 9 year old son to play.

You should teach your daughter yourself, rather than look for chess software. She'll be able to ask you questions as you go, and it'll be quality time that you can share with her.

I don't know what your level of chess knowlege is, but you could read some books to pick up the basics of tactics and strategy so that you're prepared to teach her. If you begin by teaching her the mechanics (how the pieces move and capture), by the time she's ready to learn basic tactics (pins, forks) and strategy (control the center), you should know enough about these topics that you'll be able to teach her.

I would recommend two classic books for any beginner to read to pick up the basics:

Chess Fundamentals http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1857440730
Lasker's Manual of Chess http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0486206408

These are both considered essential reading for anyone interested in grasping the basic concepts of chess. If read these these (or any other) books on chess strategy, you'll be prepared to teach your daughter for at least a couple of years, and you'll improve your chess as well. If you get to the point where you are unable (or unwilling) to continue studying, and your daughter starts beating you regularly, then she will probably be ready to start reading on her own, or you might want to consider a chess coach at that point.

Re:Learn as you teach her

[farker haiku]

I find Lasker (both of them) to be insanely dull. I recommend using a book on pure tactics like Seirawan's Winning Chess Tactics to get past the "I'm an average player" phase (when she gets there).

Re:Learn as you teach her

[DrEasy]

"My System" by Aron Nimzowitsch is the book that got me interested in serious chess. I stumbled upon it by accident at a library when I was 12ish, back then I had no idea there were such things as chess books! It's actually a very readable and accessible book, a good read for any beginner+ player: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1880673851/102-65 69902-2362538?v=glance&n=283155

Amateur.

[Orrin Bloquy]

1. Install Monsters Inc. Jr. Scream Team Training as administrator.
2. Log 5 year old daughter in as herself (no admin privs).
3. Run program.
4. Get "no disc" error.
5. Run program as admin user.
6. Get "no disc" error.
7. Log in administrator.
8. Game runs.
9. Uninstall game.
10. Log in as daughter.
11. Run installer as admin user.
12. Run program.
13. Get "no disc" error.
14. Run program as admin user.
15. Get "no disc" error.
16. Tell daughter she's adopted.

My daughter taught herself chess this past summer

[caouette]

This past summer, my daughter (then 6) decided she wanted to teach herself chess. So we found this site http://www.chesskids.com/kidzone/index.shtml. Within a couple of weeks, she had learned the basic moves, and rules.

Now, she's in the Chess Club at her school, and while she is definitely not the best player out there, she really enjoys the game.

Teach her yourself

[Laxitive]

I'd echo the sentiments of others. Teach her yourself. It's far more important that she be learning from someone she is comfortable with than from some random chess teacher guy, or a soulless program.

One thing I've found works well when playing chess (or for that matter, go) with kids is this: interact with them during the game. I don't refrain from talking with them about the game AS it's progressing. Most of the time their strategy is going to be really naive and short-term.. but that's ok. I grin and say things like "oh, you're not getting away with that!" and respond to their moves. If they're about to make a particularly obvious error, I ask if they're sure they want to make the move (and if they want me to, I'll explain why they shouldn't). Also, if I'm setting up some particular attack, I give hints along the way about what they should be worrying about. That way, I don't have to dumb down MY game, but I don't easily defeat them either (which is no fun at all). As time passes, they'll require less and less of your helping hand when making their moves.

If you're successful in achieving that comfortable, interactive environment, you'll find that your daughter really responds to you. It becomes less of a combative game and more of a shared adventure, a little mini-storybook, and that's when kids show the most interest and learn the best. The important thing is to achieve a nice balance between completely disconnecting yourself from interacting with her (professional chess player attitude) and boring her by making it into a lesson instead of a game. Make jokes, have fun, and look at the experience as a way to get some insight into the way your kid thinks. Give her hints and advice when she needs it, leave her alone when she's trying to figure something out herself. Remember, you're playing chess WITH her, not AGAINST her.

If she picks up and runs with it, then she'll figure out how to proceed after she goes past your limits. If she doesn't, then that's fine too, but you got to spend some good quality time with your kid and that's worth a lot all by itself.

-Laxitive

Re:Teach her yourself

[JohnFluxx]

The "play chess with her, not against her" strangely doesn't have any suitable word for that style of gaming, however in go it's "shidougo" which translates to basically teaching go.

A random google search found: http://senseis.xmp.net/?TeachingGame

Re:Teach her yourself

[Laxitive]

That's really interesting, since I actually learned that style of play when I was learning go. It's a very enjoyable approach to the game, where you're ostensibly opponents, but fundamentally it's more about exploring the game space than beating the other guy.

Anyway, I brought that approach back to chess, and I find it works really well when you're playing with kids: really provides a fun and relaxed atmosphere.

-Laxitive

How bout

[GmAz]

Not sure if you kid is a Harry Potter fan, but relating a great game like chess to Harry Potter might get her interested. Try to get her a game like Harry Potter's Wizrd Chess. Its chess, but has a Harry Potter theme and has the pieces like in the movie. I always liked the chessmaster games for the computer. You can play at any level and it teachers you how to play.

buy a book

[prgrmr]

Almost any book on chess will do right out of the gate. Until she can name the pieces, what their basic moves are, and how they capture, you don't need to bother with anything else. After that, just some basic strategy: control of the center of the board at first, so either the king's pawn or the queen's pawn should always be her first move for now. Then just getting the hang of the fact that each piece moves differently, and learning the perspective that it's not where the piece sits but to where the piece can move that dictates what squares it controls are the first tricks.

Once she can see that on her own, she'll either instinctively start looking more than one move ahead which is your signal to go get a more advanced book, or she won't and you can relax about it and just play for fun until her interest winds down.

Recommendations

[ninja_assault_kitten]

ChessMaster is still an excellent piece of software for both learning and playing. It's available for many consoles and the PC (in Windows).

Aside from that, you can hire a mentor for relatively cheap. You would only need to pay for 3-4 hours per month to make steady progress (depending on how involved you'd like her to become).

Get her a membership on ICC (www.chessclub.com) and let her play regularly. It's very important to record and analyze your games. Once you've learned the fundamentals of chess tactics, openings, endgames analyzing previous games is your best tutor.

Rephrase the question

[olddotter]

I am not the original poster. But I'd like to ask the question a little differently. Can anyone recommend cheap (or free) software where I can learn chess a little faster than my child so I can keep playing chess against my preschool daughter without feeling like Homer Simpson?

Re:Rephrase the question

[plcurechax]

Chessmaster 9000 or 10th edition by Ubisoft should be available for less than $20 at your local computer game store (I saw Chessmaster 10th for $20 Cdn at Staples).

I went from just knowing the rules on how to move the pieces, to being able to give my adult friends a decent game.

Also look at: http://www.danheisman.com/

Teach her yourself

[un.sined]

Just like many others have said, teach her yourself.

If you're uncertain of your own abilities (which it sounds like you are), go and get Chessmaster. You use it and then teach her what you've learned. Not only will it help you to play better, but you'll be teaching her, and spending quality time with her.

Kids are spending too much time in computers...

[gustgr]

In my opinion you should try to improve your game and knowledge of the game and then teach/instruct your daughter the way you think is proper. I don't recommend pushing kids into computers to perform tasks they could perform with other kids or with their parents. I'm sure she will be much happier spending her chess time with her father than with a chess computer software.

That said, I also recommend you to try Go with your daughter. I've read it is used in elementary schools in Japan, China and Korea to stimulate the children's mind.

My Success and Chess Clubs That Suck

[Chagatai]

My father and a good neighbor began to teach me chess when I was about four years old. It was one of the best things they could have done for me. My brothers followed suit and soon we all played together. I am doing the same thing now with my three year-old daughter. I show her how the pieces move, their names, and I praise her even when her pawn moves halfway across the board, two squares over.

As I got older, there was a chess club in junior high that had a tournament. I remember being late the first day and beating my opponent before just minutes after sitting down. By the end of the weeks of play, I won and got a nice handmade walnut board with my name on it that I still use for games.

When I became a junior in high school, there was another tournament in the neighboring town. I decided to go and try winning again. But, a big surprise awaited me. Most of the kids in the tournament were not from our local towns, but had travelled from miles away in the city to play. They were all part of a club, with their nice blue hats and specially made t-shirts that made them look more like Special Olympians than chess players.

Their coach was this man in his forties who looked like he hadn't showered in weeks, instead living, eating, and breathing chess. He was completely obsessed with the velvet ropes used to cordon off the players and the amount of talking. Keep in mind that he was yelling at eight year-olds about this, which shows low class on his part.

I sat down from this fat, smug kid who lay there like a blob with his arms crossed and his hat pulled low. As we played, it was clear his experience trumped mine, but he was a complete ass about it. "Hey," he said, "Is 'checkmate' a hyphenated word?"

"I don't think so," I replied. "Why?"

He moved a piece on the board. "Checkmate," he said with a smug, shit-eating grin.

"Tell me, is 'asshole' a hyphenated word?" I said in a slightly loud voice. Greasy-haired coach told me to be quiet. My drive to go off on him was barely abated. I left soon thereafter.

In the end, I found that while chess clubs can be good places to learn the art, I prefer good old dad and my brothers playing against me. I hope my daughter will feel the same when she gets older.

As for the greasy chess coach, well, he was put in check himself and was arrested for suspicion of sexual assault on a minor.

Re:My Success and Chess Clubs That Suck

[EngrBohn]

Yup -- I'm making sure that my son learns good sportsmanship as he learns chess. For example, I'll tolerate some mild trash-talk and boasting during the game, but if he ever gets mean about it, I'll warn him to be nice. Second offense and I get up and walk away from the game. I also insist on shaking hands after each game. With him only 6 years old, we're still working on getting him not to pout when he loses a game.

Re:My Success and Chess Clubs That Suck

[DrEasy]

Agreed. Chess clubs were what turned me off playing chess. And it's not much better online either.

Re:My Success and Chess Clubs That Suck

[Danny Rathjens]

Great story. It sounds like you have polished it well over the years of retelling. :)

Re:My Success and Chess Clubs That Suck

[Anonymous Coward]

Your story reminded me of one of my own. I used to play in tournaments some years ago and I wasn't very good. Oh I could beat people who knew nothing about chess except how to move the pieces, but in tournaments, I didn't do too well, losing more games than I won. I lived in a small town and the closest tournaments were 2 hours away, so I didn't go too often.

The last tournament I played in, I was just getting hammered. I dropped my first 3 games. Tournaments are set up so that if you start losing, you play weaker and weaker opponents and if you win, you play stronger and stronger opponents. So by game 4, I was playing a guy who also wasn't having much success either. I was about 28 or 29 and my opponent was some kid maybe 17 or 18 years old who looked like Mick Jagger. We started to play and it was obvious that he was ridiculously impatient. If I took more than a couple of minutes on any move, he would get up and pace around the floor. By the way, for those who don't know, tournaments use time clocks and you are required to make so many moves in a certain time period or you lose, so it's not like I had infinite amounts of time to spend. About mid-way through, I made a horrible mistake and lost a knight or a bishop for nothing. At tournament level, even the low rated players understand the game well enough that if you lose a piece for nothing, they can grind out a victory against you. I was toast. My position was not winnable and he wasn't making any mistakes. He was just exchanging down material so he could use the piece advantage to win in the end game. I realized after we exchanged a lot of material that my only hope, slim as it was, was to try to get a stalemate. It was possible for me to move my king into a stalemated position, but it was going to take maybe 8-10 moves to do so and if I made any mistakes or he saw what I was doing, I would have to resign because I couldn't win with what was left on the board. I began to move my king around and I got it to a point where if I could get him to capture my rook with his king, he would stalemate me. If he did anything else except capture my rook, he would win. I gambled that in his impatience, he would go for the easy king capture and he did. I double checked the position and said "Stalemate". His mouth dropped, he looked at the board, said a profanity and knocked all of my pieces off the board as he stormed out of the room. If he had spent 1 minute analyzing the position of the board, he would have seen the stalemate and avoided it and won the game, but no, he was too impatient for that. Even 10+ years later that game gave me more satisfaction than any other game I played in a tournament.

Re:My Success and Chess Clubs That Suck

[Anonymous Coward]

Your story reminded me of the SNL bit from way back where Jim Belushi was a Bobby Knight-esque college chess coach. He gets suspended by the NCAA when he runs out onto the stage and knocks over a single piece of the opponent's.

Re:good suggestions all. Here's a few more

[PastAustin]

Maybe your kid could learn chess the same way he learned dodgeball: get beaten down until you realize the game is stupid and not for the weak anyway. I suggest you toss the little shit a football, or he's gonna be sucking cocks quicker than you can spit three times

Some people don't deserve to live, or at least be part of a community. You, sir, are one of those people.

He said six-year-old daughter. And a sharp mind is better than any game of football you could play with your infantile friends who go on to beat their wives. So wake up, pull that dick out of your own mouth (your own dick) and go play some chess, you'll get more out of it than you would ever think.


Oh wait... You obviously don't think.
By the way. Dodge ball is two words.

Two great chess sites for kids...

[objbuilder]

The first is AcademicChess.com. A great site with free lesons, free chess bios, chess problems, etc.

The second is Chess.ac. It's cool for playing Live chess or postal chess.

Kids ask questions.

[jd]

Even if you had the world's best computer program for teaching, she will STILL ask questions. That is what kids do. It's hard-wired into their brain. Aliens come down at night and beam random question generators into kids brains.

The first thing, then, is to learn the game yourself. Chess is not that hard - there are only a tiny handful of core strategies and tactics you really need to learn. Above all, don't bother looking ahead - that's not how the really good chess players work, they use combinations and patterns.

Kids find patterns much easier to understand than E2-E4, so it would seem a good place to start. Adults may or may not find them easy, but it should still be MUCH easier.

WARNING! Everything above this point is accepted theory in chess. Everything below this point is pure speculation on my part. All disclaimers apply -- unless she becomes the world's youngest Grand Master, in which case I want either 10% of the winnings or, at the very least, a bag of jelly beans.

A good way to learn patterns is to play a game until you're about halfway through, then plug the board into a REALLY good chess program. Have it analyze the board and determine who is ahead and/or if it's even possible to win against any defence. Make a note of where the pieces are, then continue playing.

Just keep doing this, trying to pause when you get to a similar board to one you've seen before. Compare the scores and the positions. Even if you don't know why the scores are what they are, you'll eventually develop a theory. Test that theory. Don't try to work out every possible always-good pattern, you just need two or three that are usually good and usually easy to get to.

You don't even have to do exactly the above. The idea is solely to find a few mid-point combinations that are reliably strong and are relatively easy to reach, then to memorize those combinations.

The second line of attack (which goes along with the first) is to learn what specific actions are generally good and which are generally bad. This isn't as reliable, there will be far more exceptions, but it can help. Some moves are going to be both good and bad. ("en passant" is a great capture move. However, it usually leads to two pawns on the same file and that is generally considered bad, as pawns are strongest when they protect each other.)

Computers as teachers of chess are generally lousy. They typically work through a heavily pruned B+ tree, are lousy at defence and prefer specific goals to a more fluid play. It would be relatively easy to teach a computer to play "perfect" chess (you just need to solve a general 32-variable polynomial in the complex number domain) but the preferred method is to do deep-tree searches. To reduce the time cost, many of the branches in the tree are terminated early, on the assumption that those branches are not worth considering.

If you can establish such a branch as being a precursor to a combination you know is strong for you, the computer will be incapable of detecting what you are doing and therefore will be incapable of setting up any meaningful defence.

All that teaches you is how to attack the opponent's blind-spot. And that doesn't apply to other opponents, so is useless as a method anyway. Play as if you can win against any defence, right from the start. For one of the sides that will be true anyway*. For the other, it can be made to be true, so long as you don't let yourself get thrown by their playing. For one side, even if the other side plays perfectly, a win is guaranteed so long as you don't do anything actually harmful to your position. For the other, all they have to do is make one mistake less, when self-harm is done.

*This was proven to be true of any "full information game" by Von Neumann. Well, almost. The actual proof is that all "full information games" that are played perfectly guarantee a win or draw. Nobody, yet, has established if Chess bel

You could try a smaller version

[robbak]

Take a look at http://www.chessvariants.org/small.dir/losalamos.h tml, a small varient. Less squares used means less possibilities, so the tactics are simpler. That one was used in early chess computers. It also means that you will also be trying to work out new strategies, balancing the scales somewhat. As this one uses standard pieces, upgrading to the full game will be easy. Personally, I'd replace one of the knights with a bishop, to have the full complement of pieces.

Chessmaster requires admin privileges to run!

[rmcd]

Chessmaster is a terrific piece of software, with one very important caveat. It absolutely has to be installed and run with administrative privileges. If you don't want your kids running with administrative privileges, forget Chessmaster. (There is supposed to be a workaround involving symbolic links from the kid's home directory to the administrator's, but I never got it to work.) Talk about brain-damaged software design!

I own Chessmaster 9000. I was told by Ubi tech support that the same issue exists with Chessmaster 10.

Should you teach your children chess at all?

[seminumerical]

The play of chess requires some skills that are relatively useless in real life. One must spend years memorizing book openings in order to play at a competitive level. The right moves to play for all end games with 5 pieces have been precalculated, and can be looked up in a database. The true fun of chess is in the strategy and tactics of game play, not in spending one's autistic years in 15 hour days of study (a la Bobby Fischer, who, incidentally gave up chess in part because of the issue of rote memorization of book openings).

I recommend that children be taught games that are fun, and that contribute to their intellectual development. One possiblilty is the game Arimaa which a child can learn but that has been deliberately designed to make brute force search or alpha beta-pruning less productive for a computer. This has the effect of reducing the amount of memorization involved for a human. I still play chess and haven't learned Arimaa yet. Does anyone have an opinion on how much fun it is?

Another possibility is to play various trump card games with your child, building up from Nines or Hearts to Whist and finally to Contract Bridge. The advantage of Bridge is that it develops both social and analytical skills. Also, an understanding of natural bidding helps one understand some of the less explicit cues one receives in one's personal and business life.

For myself, though I love chess, a human against human real time strategy game, where the computer handles the boring logistical details, trumps chess any day.

Re:Should you teach your children chess at all?

[avi33]

The play of chess requires some skills that are relatively useless in real life.

Like:
-thinking and focusing for longer than GTA3 requires
-encouraging analysis
-building decision trees
-tracking multiple variables in real time
-watching for your opponent's mistakes
-among many others...

With 'usefulness' as the threshold, you might find that Poker or some other form of high-stakes gambling is your best bet, or you might find no games are suitably useful.

One must spend years memorizing book openings in order to play at a competitive level.

While you're at it, don't bother getting them involved in sports, since one in 37,000 kids will end up going professional, and most of those spots will be taken by the ones that are genetically gifted to be either linebackers or power forwards. Why set them up for failure?

Saying they shouldn't try something because 'it won't be any fun at the highest level' would mean shutting the door on most challenges in their lives.

Re:Should you teach your children chess at all?

[seminumerical]

All the skills you describe exist in other games and they are extremely valuable. However, learning the book moves (my 12th edition, Modern Chess Openings, has nearly 500 pages) is done at the expense of, say reading a book on discrete mathematics, or Feynman's Lectures on Physics. The last two are as challenging but have applications in real life. I am proposing introducing kids to games that are more open ended than chess, like the game I suggested that is played on an 8x8 board, involved building decision trees, but in which memorizing opening moves is of little value.

Chess, and competive sports are games, played for FUN, and only incidentally improve mind and body (from the point of view of evolutionary psychology the are fun because they improve mind and body, but that is besides the point). Sadly competive sports are big bucks now and people treat them as jobs. Professionalism weakens the pleasure of Tennis, Chess, Bridge, etc. which ought to be diversions from research, firefighting, teaching, farming, etc., etc, and not careers. I can't even bear to watch tennis now, with graphite rackets, where a studied opening (a well rehearsed serve from a teenage who has spent hours a day being bullied by a professional coach and psycho parents) is 60% of the game. Gone are the days of running about the grass court in the sun with a wooden racket. The only thing worse is college baseball with aluminum bats. Rant rant rant. I voted conservative today for the first time in my life.

Re:Should you teach your children chess at all?

[seminumerical]

avi33, you didn't even read the post before replying to it.

You can do it

[J. T. MacLeod]

You may not be the best teacher out there, but you can probably be the best teacher for her.

I got to spend a lot of good time with my younger sisters as I taught them to play chess at around your daughter's age. Once they had an interest, all I had to do was tell them how each piece moved, then help them by explaining moves for each side. Just a couple of games later, and all I had to do was watch them to make sure they were making valid moves, and occasionally give them pointers when they were losing (or about how I won).

There may be better teachers, but the time you get to share is incredibly valuable. I really couldn't stand doing it, as I hate playing competitive games with a passion, but I wouldn't trade that time with them for anything. Chess allows for a very unique bonding.

American Foundantion for Chess

[neXiZen]

http://www.af4c.org/club/scripts/public/public.asp ?ns=public I work part-time for this organization. They specialize in teaching chess to young children. They might be worth a look.

Consider breadth as well as depth

[91degrees]

Don't want to obsess over chess. There are a lot of other games she hasn't even heard of. We have the other popular strategy games (Backgammon, the obligatory Go, Mancala, and maybe some of the weirder ones like hnefatafl), card games (possibly some card tricks - they can be fun), and maybe some of the better commercial games.

Personally, I think at that age a whole range of experiences is healthy. But feel free to ignore me.

"flick-chess"

[AK__64]

My dad got really bored trying to teach my younger siblings chess, so he ended up teaching them a bowling game in which you flick chess peices with your fingers. The man that still has chess pieces standing at the end wins. Obviously works best with a cheap wooden chess set, and doesn't last very long...

easyChess

[avi33]

Maybe she's already beyond it, but I used QuickChess to teach my daughter, then about 4.

It introduces the pieces one at a time using basic games, but IMO the real value was that it comes with a 5 (wide) x 6 (deep) board with one of each piece (plus 5 pawns each). Though we moved on to a standard board, we often go back and use the smaller one for fast games. Sometimes a 'real' game can drag on a little too long, so we switch between boards so she doesn't get burnt out. Once she caught me slipping and got me in a fool's-type mate (not hard on a a tiny board), and it was a great moment for her.

Obviously, it wouldn't be hard to emulate that set; you could use a printer or tape up a standard one to make your own 5 x 6 board.

Also, I downloaded chess problems. There are more than enough of those on the web, many targeted for kids and beginning players (like yourself?)

Outside of that, a chess club, probably at school. I looked into the camps, but like a lot of 'focused' camps they seem a little high stress (like they are more for the parents then the kids). One that looked interesting was only for girls, since a lot of girls learn to play games much differently than boys, and it can affect their development.

For the record, I'm not advocating that she should *never* play against boys, but I think girls can learn new things more comfortably with other girls. I also think that playing against boys (and this goes for sports as well) in the long run will make her a better player.

You + a book

[PostItNote]

If you feel you lack experience, then teach yourself (I recommend Bobby Fischer Teaches Chess which has recently been reissued). But either that or learning chess together is recommended. Chess from books is profoundly boring until you reach a much higher level than it sounds like you are talking about.

Logical Chess move by move

[Spy der Mann]

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0713484640/104-36 92773-3719953?v=glance&n=283155

by Irving Chernev. When I was 8, I learned chess with that book. It's fundamental to know the apertures, and this book teaches them by explaining each move.

You should also buy her a book on endings. Apertures and endings can be memorized. Then it's up to her to do the difficult combination stuff and taking into account the possibilities yadda yadda.

Software is fine for practicing the combinations and helping her develop her deduction abilities, but without theory, she's a thousand years behind.

Re:Logical Chess move by move

[tomato]

What is a chess aperture? I've been playing for years and read a few books on chess (tho I;m still rubbish) but I've never heard of them.

Re:Logical Chess move by move

[furry_marmot]

Apertures = Openings. My guess is that the poster is not a native English speaker. I made the same kind of mistakes when I lived in France.

I doubt she wants to memorize all...

[Spy der Mann]

just pick 2 or 3 favorite apertures to beat the kids at school with them. Mine are Queen Pawn (Cole's system), the 4 knights aperture, and the Scicillian defense. They're fun :)

Arimaa

[belg4mit]

I recommend Arimaa. It's a really nifty game with simple rules.
It was actually designed by a father and son, and it turns out to be "harder"
for computers than chess while more intuitive for organic beings. It should
be playable and enjoyable by anone, not just children.

See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arimaa

Re:YEAH I GOT SOME

[millennial]

<3

Re:good suggestions all. Here's a few more

[ncurtain]

Take it easy on the kid, he's probably someone's good little boy. Either that or spking formed ickspearience.

Humans; a better teacher.

[Onuma]

I learned Chess first through my older cousin, I was 7 or 8 at the time. He is about 12 years older than me, and he was in West Point at the time - on leave for a holiday or something like that. He was, and still is to this day, my mentor and someone I look up to very much.

The point is, it's much better to learn how to play initially through social means than a computer program. People are more fun and better teachers than computers, in my opinion. After that you can go to Yahoo! chess and learn the intricacies.

Chessmaster

[ashish.sarika]

My 6 year old twins are very interested in chess too. I was very interested in chess when I was in school and so I tried to teach my kids chess. Kids now-a-days are like sponges and they can absorb stuff really fast. I showed them how to setup the board. Then was distracted with something else and the matter remained there. After a week, I asked them if they remembered how to set up the board ... and I was really surprised to see that they remembered.

Now, sometimes I play with them. And I have also bought the latest version of the software - Chessmaster. It has a section where kids can learn. And it has beginning level settings where kids can practise their games.

I think it has helped my kids improve their game. But they prefer playing with me as compared to playing with a computer.

find opponents with similar skill

[j1m 5n0w]

I agree with the parent but would like to add that the best way to learn chess is to play against those with a similar level of skill. That way, no one is bored with an easy win or demoralized by inevitable defeat, and everyone gets better at roughly the same rate.

Software? Please..

[js92647]

I personaly think that having a graphical-system of teaching a child to play a game is awkward. What's wrong with her learning the old fashioned way? Grab a board, grab a friend, and there you have it. I've been in a chess club since I was grade 1. I saw Chessmaster for the first time when I was in grade 6, and didn't find it all that attractive, mainly because its better to play with a person than against a computer, no matter how "complex" the AI (Think Kasparov). Okay, fair point, I didn't own a computer till I was in grade 6. And, if anything, a search engine is your best friend. Most sites will give you the basic principles of the game, for example, certain styles of playing (moving 1 square or 2 squares at beginning) and correct positioning of the figurines. But hey, since we live in such a high-tech world where little spoiled kids need tutorials to learn how to play a simple game of chess -- who gives a flying fuck anyway!

Lego Chess

[namain]

My little brother became interested in the game fairly recently as well. One program that he found helpful was Lego Chess. It features a very nice interface that children can relate to (Lego characters), and has a very useful tutorial for the game that introduces you to pawns, first and then works you up to the more useful peices as the program thinks you are ready. It also has an acually beatable AI that may still offer a challenge to the more experienced players. If you work through all of the tutorials it will even show you a few advanced moves that most people don't really know about.

Chess for Girls

[jayrtfm]

Chess for Girls SNL video

Chessmaster is very good...

[Malor]

I bought a copy of Chessmaster a year or so ago, and thought it was a very good teaching tool. There's a great deal of chess knowledge available there, and a lot of simulated opponent skill levels. I really quite enjoyed it.

As others are suggesting, together time is most important. But if you're trying to learn, learning from an expert is the best way. So my suggestion would be... pick up Chessmaster, but study _together_. That way, you get to be social, but you can learn properly. You'll probably both get better.

Re:Software People

[mrdlcastle]

Come on folks, I think he's just trying to do better for his daughter. Whose to say that he can't approach this by saying "You know you have tapped me out... Let's play with this software program and become better players together".

Majestic Chess

[eugaet]

I'd recommend Majestic Chess, if you can still find a copy. It includes a story-driven 'chess adventure' that teaches the basics of chess by working through a series of challenges. My 5yo likes playing it with me quite a bit.

So long as you're involved in her learning experience, I don't think it matters too much whether your kid learns chess sitting across from you at a real chess board or in a chair next to you playing through the software.

Teaching each other

[filament]

A great way to improve your chess skills (and that of your opponent) is to play a game in which you and your opponent tell each other why you are making each move. You get to learn from their strategy and they do from yours. It can still be a competitive game, and it works with people of different skill levels. After a while you might start learning things from your child! It also can make the game more conversational - not so much sitting in silence while one person ponders, as you can discuss your strategy as much as you like.

From one parent to another...

[Hosiah]

Please, let the kid off the computer for awhile. Play with her on a real, physical board game. Preferably on the porch in the spring time over glasses of lemonade, or next to the window in the winter looking out at the snow.

Incidentally, chess isn't the only game out there. My daughter has so far learned checkers, backgammon, monopoly, othello, and (the very first one I taught her) Go. All on real physical boards. This is coming from a computer geek family with three machines in the house running Linux exclusively: board games are for one-on-one social time.

I'm game...

[Anonymous Coward]

...as I figure my chess skills are roughly on level with a beginner six-year-old.

Very good website for starting to play.

[neo]

www.Schemingmind.com is a correspondence chess site:

Games are played as 'correspondence chess' and can take from a few days to a few months to complete.

'Standard' Membership of SchemingMind.com is free, however some restrictions are placed on standard accounts - for example the number of simultaneous games you can play is limited. For unrestricted use of the site, you should consider upgrading to a 'Full' account.

So for free she could be playing online with people who are friendly and happy to help new players.

Fritz and Chester

[El Rey]

My son likes the "Learn to Play Chess with Fritz and Chester" games from these guys:

http://www.viva-media.com/vivaChess.html

Ob. RvB

[Anonymous Coward]

Smess? A knock-off synthetic chess, from the fine makers of Smoal?

"Ah, just get everybody the same thing. That's what I did."
"Lemme guess -- everybody's getting a lump of coal."
"Fuck no! You know how much coal costs? It's like 5 bucks a ton! I'm not spending that much on you losers. You're all getting a lump of smoal."
"What's smoal?"
"It's a knock-off synthetic coal. Just as good as the real thing. Except when you burn it it doesn't make any heat, just makes smoke."
"Heh! What? How does it make smoke with no heat?"
"The fuck do i know? Ask the fine makers of smoal."

FICS

[CronoCloud]

Chessmaster has been mentioned, as far as I know all versions now have online play.

The ICC has also been mentioned, membership is half price for students

You might also want to look into:

FICS Free Internet Chess Server

http://www.freechess.org/

They've got a Java app for interfacing but there's non-Java ones as well like Eboard or Xboard. Eboard and Xboard will also act as graphical frontends for GnuChess/Crafty (and you can use them with ICC too)

Just don't

[EnsilZah]

Just don't intentionally lose, it used to drive me nuts when my dad used to do that.

Except..

[Julian Morrison]

Go is cool, except the baroqueness comes out in (1) the scoring (2) all the rule subvariants about time, scoring, ko/superko, etc.

It's probably easier for a kid to estimate winning/losing in a game of chess. Go's simplicity means you have to do more mental heavy lifting to analyse a position. In chess, discrete units are discrete pieces, but in Go the units are several pieces and may span gaps or interlock black and white stones.

Re:Except..

[Abcd1234]

Go is cool, except the baroqueness comes out in (1) the scoring (2) all the rule subvariants about time, scoring, ko/superko, etc.

I humbly disagree. :) No child needs to know the intricacies of ever Go ruleset. Just pick one scoring system (Japanese is probably simplest), regular ko (superko is interesting, but certainly not worth introducing early on), and don't even both teaching byoyomi. At this point, Go has a mere handful of rules, and no wonky special cases (aside from Ko), as opposed to Chess with it's 6 pieces, all with different properties, not to mention a variety of more obscure rules.

It's probably easier for a kid to estimate winning/losing in a game of chess.

This is certainly true, and is difficult for even experienced amateur players. OTOH, children are little sponges and can catch on to such things remarkably quickly. Moreover, early on, it's rarely necessary to be able to accurately count score, since games aren't typically that close.

Frankly, I think both games have something to offer, and which to play is really more a matter of taste.

In the end, I think the biggest problem with teaching Go is finding cheap, quality equipment to play with. While you can makeshift a Go board pretty easily, getting at least a cheap wood board + plastic stones can be surprisingly difficult.

Battle Chess (PC)

[phorm]

I remember that "Battle Chess 2000" interested both myself and the younger cousins for awhile. Having the chess pieces stand up, laugh at each other, and or engage in virtual combat was a neat way to make it more interesting for the young'ns... and I must admit that there was a degree of humour and fun that made added to it for myself as well.

GNU Chess

[ObsessiveMathsFreak]

GNU Chess is a great program, especially if you're like me and keep losing all your pieces.

I had this one back in the dawn of time, when we had OS2 on a dual boot with 3.11, before I even knew what dual boot was. Hours of fun. On the higher difficulty settings the computer simply cannot be defeated!

At least, I think it was GNU Chess. It looked exactly like it.

I know the experience

[SeanDuggan]

The last time I went on a trip with the chess club, they had a hotel manager throw them out of the lobby because they were trash-talking too loudly. He said that there was one thing he couldn't stand and that was chess nuts boasting in an open foyer.

Thank you. I'm here all week and Joe's grocery down the road has a special on rotten tomatos, so stock up.

Great for long car rides

[lumbar_nerve]

For long car rides with the kids, I recommend a handheld chess computer called "LCD Chess / Executive Electronic Handheld Chess Game" by Excalibur Electronics. It has 70+ levels, and is good for both beginners and more advanced players. Other features are:

"info mode," which allows you to see what the computer is "thinking" while it plays

selectable openings

the ability to replay "historic" games

"problem solving" mode.

It normally lists for $25-30, but I have seen it on sale for as low as $15.

Forget the computer

[vitroth]

The US Chess Federation has a massive scholastic chess program, there may be a group in your area that you can get in contact with. Check out http://www.uschess.org/ - in particular the scholastic services page

Don't need much for a good game.

[jakel2k]

Get a http://yahoo.com/Yahoo account and access the games... after playing a few people you start to understand how to play. There are rooms for beginners. The great thing about chess is that it can be played by all ages and does not need a lot of skill to have a good game.

I taught my son at 5 and he had concentrated better because of it. The great thing was seeing him think 2 - 3 moves ahead. Granted I give him and initial advantage of removing my rooks queen and a knight at first but that also allows me to improve my game. My son is now 11 and he does better in school and he takes time to plan ahead. Overall a much more cleaner thought process.

On a personal note... my son has had night terrors, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Night_terror in the past, and during an episode he would not know where he was, what he was doing or why he was so upset. One time I took out the chess board and we started playing... his ability to focus and concentrate on the game help ease him out of his terror.

Uniformly bad advice

[figa]

There's a lot of bad advice on here. It's great that your daughter wants to learn chess. I have two daughters, 3 and 7, and I'm teaching them the game. My younger daughter asked to play with me this morning (she mostly just sets up the pieces).

First, I'm disappointed that so many posters assumed that there's some hidden meaning in your daughter's interest. I can say from experience that, when my daughters don't feel like playing chess, no promises of quality time will get them near the board. I think it's fair to assume that your daughter is genuinely interested, which is great. Also, if she's interested in chess, don't be afraid to teach her chess. Go is a great game, but there's no reason not to teach her chess.

Over the board play is best for learning chess, as people suggest, but I've found that it's not always the best way to interest my older daughter in the game. I bought Fritz and Chesster, and she enjoys working with it over working with me. It does a great job of breaking down the game into practical lessons that are fun to play. It may be a bit advanced for your daughter, but I think it's better than using Chessmaster on the easiest level. I have noticed that it's geared toward a male player and a lot of the humor is distinctly Teutonic, but I didn't find it particularly offensive. I think it's probably all you really need for software until she's a tournament player, and it's reasonably priced. I even caught my wife working with my daughter when she got stuck on the king and rook mate. My wife never gets involved in over-the-board games.

I'd also say that, contrary to what others are writing, chess is not easy for a parent to teach, nor is it an easy game in any sense. It's difficult to play on the same level as your kid if you're at all good, my older daughter doesn't want to play with a handicap, and she as soon as she makes a few opening moves, she gets bogged down and confused. I've had some success setting up chess mazes for her, where I sprinkle pawns on the board and she has to move pieces through the pawns. I've also had success getting her interested in puzzles. I can't blame you for looking for ways to supplement her learning.

Don't just buy any chess book. Most chess books, even beginner ones, are written for an adult audience, and you'll have to translate what you're reading into lessons that are appropriate for a kid. Plus, for the poster that recommended Lasker's Manual, it's in descriptive notation. No child or parent should have to deal with descriptive notation. Make sure any book you buy is in algebraic notation.

I can't recommend beginner books for children from my experience, but Chess for Juniors and How to Beat Your Dad at Chess are universally acclaimed. I got my daughter Simple Checkmates, and she's able to work through it on her own. Kudos to the person who mentioned Dan Heisman. His Novice Nook columns are a great resource for beginning tournament players, and he's the author of A Parent's Guide to Chess. He does online tutoring, and I have a friend who is an online student of his who recommends him highly. I haven't read it, but Susan's Polgar's instruction book might also be of interest. She's one

from what i gather from my younger brother

[petermgreen]

lego chess is quite good from the teaching chess point of view.

personally though i've never been a fan of the idea of actually trying to learn complex strategies for something like chess, its a just a game damnit ;) (ofc this means my younger brother can beat me at it which is a pain)

Analogy

[quokkapox]

Go:Emacs::Vi:Chess

Sorry. Didn't mean to blurt that out, it was in my kill ring.

Informative depiction of chess machine strategy

[volvolus]

You and your daughter may enjoy interpreting the real-time decisions of a chess machine.
-- volvo -l US