How Do You Job-Hunt If You Work Overtime?

Lord_Dweomer asks: "As a recent college grad, I took a job to pay the bills, but soon realized that it would end up sucking the life out of me. I work a lot of overtime in a high-stress, tight deadline job. Once you get into that kind of downward spiral, how do you find another job?" "All my free time, during the week, is completely non-existent, and the weekends are needed to take care of chores, and preserve my mental health. Are potential employers typically sensitive to the fact that I may not be able to interview during the week or during standard work hours? Also, will having left here after a year seem like a real black mark on my resume? My reasons for leaving, aside from the overtime (I am non-exempt), would be that I've basically been promoted in work load and responsibilities -- and have even taken on another job role, IN ADDITION to my current one. All of this without a raise in pay, or new title.

I'd quit if I had a choice, but I really need the money, yet I'm unable to look for a new job because of lack of time. How am I supposed to job hunt under these circumstances?"

Comments

How about...

[brez180]

The same way you found the time to make this post on Slashdot?

Re:How about...

[Justin205]

I'd set the amount of time needed to write, proofread, edit, proofread, and submit a story to /. being at about 30 minutes. I'm betting hunting for a new job takes significantly more than 30 minutes.

Re:How about...

[grub]

Good point, he's had lots of posts to slashdot... :)

Re:How about...

[Mistlefoot]

He posts while he's working. Which explains why he needs to work overtime. :P

Re:How about...

[MP3Chuck]

He's got a point, though. In the same time it took him to submit a story to Slashdot, he could have probably shined up his resumé and signed up for Monster.com. Hell, I get emails from them every day with relavent job listings! How's that for an easy job search... Granted Monster.com isn't exactly the be-all end-all of job searching, but it's a decent start.

Re:How about...

[CryptoLogica]

Signing up for Monster.com and polishing up one's resume' is one thing.... finding the time to go on the interviews is another.

Re:How about...

[MP3Chuck]

Well, that's when you take a sick day, or come in late, or leave early, or whatever. At any rate, the OP's problem was job hunting ... just saying that it's far from impossible, even on the tightest of schedules.

Re:How about...

[hazem]

It IS hard. But a good way to get in the door is to temp.

I finally got an MBA, but all my experience was in IT. I wanted to be an operations analyst.

I finally got a foot in the door at large footwear/apparel company - but I had to swallow my pride and go in as an "admin assistant". Sure I could make more in IT, but I didn't want to be in IT any more.

My first job was as an admin assistant and it lasted a month. I got transferred to another part of the company as basically an assistant to an operations analyst. 11 months later, I landed a permanent job, making pretty good money, and working as a supply chain performance analyst. It's a perfect job for me - I'm learning the things I want to learn, and am making great connections for my next job.

And by the way, I never would have gotten the job I have now if I had just applied from the "outside". It's all about getting in the door and then busting your ass to make a name for yourself.

If there's a company you want to work for, find out who they temp through, and work your way in. It's not glamorous, but it works!

Re:How about...

[neuroticia]

That's dumb. Job postings are usually the work of a recruiter or HR person that doesn't know what they're talking about. They may get the technologies-required list from the tech staff, but then they tuck in the years-required all on their own to spiffy it up for the job boards.

To assume "this company doesn't know jack squat" and disregard the job just because the years on the posting are wonky is stupid.Respond. You've been using the technology since it became publically available. You're qualified.

If you get the interview, and realize that the description was actually written by the person that will be your new supervisor, and he's a moron, then you can always opt not to take the job. But to just ignore it on the basis of something most likely attributable to some HR lackey's decision to add years to the job requirements? Absurd.

You don't

[Anonymous Coward]

You leave the job when you die at age 41.

Headhunter?

[Ritz_Just_Ritz]

As much as I hate dealing with this festering pool of opportunists, sometimes you just have to contain your revulsion and deal with a headhunter. With the promise of a fat fee, they can be quite motivated to place you and can often get you "in" to places that would just pass your resume by.

Re:Headhunter?

[hsmith]

I don't know why recruiters get such a bad name.

I used them to find my last job, i had 6 offers in 2 weeks. All of which were more than I wanted. I paid nothing, they got a % of what I made through the company that hired me. So the more I made, the more they made. Plus I told them exactly what I want and they found the jobs that fit my profile. It was great, I had to do no work. I will never go without using one again for future job searches.

Re:Headhunter?

[Auckerman]

Recruiters are a fascinating breed. They can be a pain in the ass to deal with. They love to offer you positions that are hardest to fill first, because noone wants that job. But once you find one that likes you and actually wants you find a job that you want, you're home free.

Re:Headhunter?

[MichaelKaiserProScri]

I have been offered every single positon for which I have gotten a face to face interview. Headhunters get you that face time....

Re:Headhunter?

[ScrewMaster]

Yeah ... I used one for my current job. That was seven years ago, and in addition to my own hunting I suffered through a series of useless headhunters. One of them quit her position and (quite unethically) took her contact list with her. When I finally called to find out what was going on the office manager apologized and told me he was sorry but they didn't even have my phone number anymore! However, I finally got a fellow that listened to what I was capable of / interested in, and spent about three hours with me going over my background in detail. Then the next day he called and said he had a possibility ... I went in for an interview and was hired a couple of days later. I'm still there, so I guess he earned his commission. So yes, a good recruiter can be a tremendous asset, but my experience is that good ones are hard to find. Most of them kept offering me positions that had little to do with what I do, other than that they were software/programming jobs. I got very used to hearing, "But, you could do that, couldn't you?" Sure, I probably could ... but it's not what I told you.

Re:Headhunter?

[Midnight Thunder]

The jobs I have got have either been via people I know or head hunters. While one or two have been a pain, I found they usually leave you alone if you tell them you aren't in the market. Since head hunters are interested in getting their cut, don't be afraid as using them as a resource to find out what you could realistically get in terms of salaries an conditions. They can also tell you what the company is willing to give and what will prevent you from getting through the door.

Don't limit yourself to one head hunter and definitely make a note of everyone your CV has been sent to. In company getting your CV from two different sources will trash it, since it is less complicated then trying to work out who gets the comission. In fact you should tell your head hunters only to send your CV to companies you authorise for this sort of reason.

Re:Headhunter?

[shawnmchorse]

I've also heard from some employers that if they get the same person's name from more than one headhunter, then they basically have to throw that person's resume in the trashcan. Because otherwise they'd be opening themselves up to lawsuits from whichever headhunter they didn't pay the fee to. Spamming out resumes to headhunters can actually shoot yourself in the foot it seems.

Re:Headhunter?

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

"I don't know why recruiters get such a bad name."

I personally had a bad experience with a job hunter. They were supposed to get me a second interview and then they just stopped taking my calls. I have NFI what that was about. (Although I wouldn't use this anecdote to base an opinion on all headhunters.)

On the other side of the coin, one of the companies I worked for used a head hunter to find potential candidates. As one of the people involved in conducting interviews, I was pretty pissed at them. We were looking for skilled software engineers. We were bombarded with a bunch of applicants who really weren't all that experienced. (The resumes were a bit decieving, but that's another topic altogether.) We came up with a couple of questions that experienced programmers would know. (Sadly, I'm not a software engineer so I don't really remember the questions. I do remember that we asked "What's 2^10?") On the first day, every applicant got them wrong and on the second day every applicant got them right. After that we made up new questions every day. No more perfect scores. It wasn't hard to figure out what happened. The headhunters figured out why we were asking the questions and prepped the interviewees on what to say. As a result, it made the task of finding the talent we needed needlessly difficult.

Now, I can only guess here, but I can imagine that if that is the way a lot of them work that there would be resentment towards these services because they try to get anybody hired in any way they can. In that scenario, it's then easy to imagine that you could find yourself interviewing at a place that doesn't think so highly of you because of how you've come into contact with them. Suddenly that hard-won interview has turned into a much steeper hill to climb. It's nowhere near as nice as having them pick you out of a group of candidates. It would certainly feel less like time is being wasted.

Well.. I'm already writing a long post so I'll submit my suggestion, here. Do you know other people in other companies that would potentially hire somebody like you? Have you asked them to ask around for you? Even if it seems unlikely, you should. If a company is looking to fill a position, they're going to want to fill it as soon as possible and with as few interviews as possible. As a result, recommendations from people on the staff carry a lot of weight. If a buddy of yours recommends you, you're in a much better position than you were just mailing a resume at them some time after they've put out a feeler.

Re:Headhunter?

[Greg_D]

One of the jobs I've had in the past was as a headhunter. The agency charged a markup of between 50-120% for contract employees and 20% of the employee's first year salary for placing a full time employee. The contract markup is a bit high, but the salary markup is pretty standard throughout the industry.

Of that, I got about 12% of the markup for contract employees and about 4% of his salary for placing him.

Never pay a headhunter, and when you use them, use several. They work for the employer, not you, so use them as an extra networking tool instead of absolutely relying on them for your next position. I networked several hundred consultants in less than a year while I was working in that job. To a recruiter, no matter how special you think you are, you're nothing but another name, and you aren't irreplacable. Quit because I hated the grind.

Also, realize that most keep regular hours and aren't going to set up an interview late at night or on weekends unless the client is a really good one or unless they're desperate for the dough. You need to make time to interview, so schedule your lunch around it.

Re:Headhunter?

[CmdrGravy]

Yeah, some of them are very professional, excellent to deal with and deliver a good result whereas others don't have a clue, are essentially fly by night chancers and are a total nightmare to work with.

My most amusing experience with a recruitment agency was 5 or 6 years ago when I had essentially no IT experience or qualifications and was trying to break into the industry. I went for what was supposed to be a chat with the recruiter but which turned out to actually be the first interview for pretty much my ideal position. As it turned out this was a position with quite a large IT company who were recruiting quite widely and I'd actually had exactly the same interview with another recruitment company a week or so earlier but had been advised I wasn't successful that time.

Having heard all the questions before this time the interview was quite straightforward and thanks to the feedback after the interview the first time I was able to say exactly what the recruiter should have been wanting to hear. The only problem was the recruiter quite obviously didn't have a clue what she talking about ( e.g. once I'd answered a question she'd say she thought we might be better to change it a bit and would suggest adding all kinds of buzzword related nonsense which clearly had nothing to do with the question being asked ) and was asking all kinds of weird unrelated questions and generally giving an excellent performance of being utterly inept at both recruitment and IT. Her boss kept coming in every minute or so to check everything was going OK and seemed to me to just keeping an eye on what she was up to.

Anyway I got out of there as quick as I could and didn't expect to hear anything further from the recruiter at all but a week later the actual company with the job called me and gave me a phone interview for a second line position ( the original one had just been 1st line call logging ) which I passed and offered me a temp position.

I arrived for my first day and was surprised to see my recruiter there as well, I assumed she was there to do some kind of liason for her agency but it turned out her agency had strongly suggested she fill the other position the same as the one I'd been offered. It was immediately evident to me and everyone else we were working with she knew even less about IT than she did about recruitment and would essentially just try to bullshit her way through anything she was asked to deal with. Inevitably the nonsense she was suggesting never worked so she'd announce that such and such was simply "impossible". Within a day or so no one assigned any calls to her and I ended up doing the work of both of us. She was obviously aware of what was going on and would go out and hang around the analysts who assigned us calls and basically grab the phone of them and attempt to deal actually fix something through the application of more bullshit.

A month later the boss called me in and offered me a job and asked what I thought of the other girl to which I said I thought she was useless and was basically just trying to blag it. I got a job and she was told we were both being asked to leave because the boss was worried about what she might do if she thought there was a chance of a job there. During the previous month it became increasingly obvious that the agency weren't going to have her back to her old recruitment role for love or money. She spent the rest of the afternoon going through the company address book phoning everyone with the title manager next to their name and everyone in HR begging for a job. All in all it was a very weird experience.

good news & bad news

[Clover_Kicker]

> Are potential employers typically sensitive to the fact that I
> may not be able to interview during the week or during standard
> work hours?

No.

> Also, will having left here after a year seem like a real black
> mark on my resume?

No.

Re:good news & bad news

[Anonymous Coward]

Agreed.

Always have a job when you're looking for a job. Having a job gives you a better bargaining position, and everyone knows it. Scout out quiet, private locations with good cell coverage for telephone interviews. Never appear in person for a 1st interview... you can only use up so much sick/vacation time, so you want to be smart about it.

Get a copy of "What Color Is Your Parachute" and read it cover to cover during your "mental health time." Make a point to contact 2 people per evening by email about information/opportunities. Soon, your contact list will be self-sustaining and the right job will just fall into your lap.

It really sounds to me like you're conflicted about your priorities. You cannot make a lot of money and NOT work hard. (Oh, some people do, but they're exceptions. The vast majority of well-off people in the world worked very hard indeed. You can always work very hard and make no money, but the reverse is tough). Decide what's right for you: your money or your life.

Re:good news & bad news

[yppiz]

What the parent poster said. Companies can get hundreds of resumes for entry-level tech positions. The first pass someone will do with this stack of resumes is triage - eliminate the obviously bogus applications.

See, of those 200 applicants, 180 are coming from people that shotgun the same resume to each opening they find. These resumes are easy to spot because: 1) there's no cover letter, and 2) the resumes are keyword soup (C++JAVAFORTRANPL/1LISPSNOBOLPOSTSCRIPTVIC-20!!!)

So, you're in the lucky 20. You wrote a cover letter saying who you are, and you wrote a resume that focuses on the strengths, interests, and experience that you have that apply to the company and the specific opening.

You're now in round 2 of triage. At this point, someone with tech experience will go through the 20 surviving resumes to pick out the best 5.

So you've made it to the top 5 - great! Now, for each of these five, an HR person (or someone filling in for this role) will either arrange for a phone interview or an in-person interview. If it's a phone interview, you should have no problem (you do have a cell phone, right? Put it on your resume so they can call you during the day).

The in-person interview will take up a great deal of the company's time. Even if you're only there for an hour, you might be interviewed by eight people. That's eight person-hours of time spent on something other than coding, QAing, or running the things. That's also eight people who have to sync up their schedules to meet you!

So the HR person goes down the list of five possible in-person, and one can't come in during the week. The other four will get interviews, and *if* none of them get an offer, you might get called back. Alternately, *if* you have a stunning resume or have demonstrated an ability to walk on water, you might get to meet with the hiring manager later in the day.

My advice is for you to take a personal half-day, even if you are an hourly employee, to do interviews. Alternately, either schedule a 1hr interview around lunchtime, and be prepared to do a second 1hr if more people need to interview you from the same company, or ask for a phone interview. Companies may prefer the phone option because they can get a sense for you without spending 8 person-hours. But if they like you, you will still have to do the in-person interview later.

One more thing. If you want your resume to be noticed, do your homework on the company. Spend an hour researching them - what they do, who they are - and think about what *you* can do for them. With that knowledge, write a 3 paragraph cover letter about why you are interested in what the company does, and how you think you can help. Also, make a customized resume for the company that emphasizes your interests as they fit with the company (this is especially true if you have a lot of experience - it helps you focus and helps the person reading the resume to fit you into their model of what they are looking for.)

Best of luck with your search!

--Pat

Quit

[fiannaFailMan]

Got any vacation days? Use them up to go job hunting. Failing that, quit this job now and get something convenient (like working in a friend's bar in the evenings) to pay the bills while you spend the mornings interviewing. Or sign up with a temp agency. I did that when I was between jobs once, got me by until I found something permanent, and it had the 'benefit' of not being obliged to work every day in perpetuity. It was a bit nerve-wracking though, my finances were living on the edge, so it depends on how much reserves you have in the bank.

Can't you do it after work?

[nEoN nOoDlE]

There are lots of positions that you could look for online at any time of the day or night. Why not just look for the job after hours and send off your resume by e-mail then? You're going to have to take a day off or something for the interview, but that's even if you're not working overtime.

Take sick leave.

[supabeast!]

A lot of people take sick leave to go to job interviews. Maybe it's time for your kids to catch a nasty flu or for you to start come down with strange migraines that require you to leave work often and go to the doctor at least weekly.

I used to just be really brazen about it, showing up for work in a nice suit, disappearing for three hours, and taking phone calls from recruiters in front of my coworkers. It got one employer to give me two huge bonuses, a nice raise, and hire a junior SA to handle some of the work. There's this old proverb about squeaky wheels and grease...

Re:Take sick leave.

[karlto]

There's this old proverb about squeaky wheels and grease...

I believe there's also one about the person who sticks his head up the highest getting it knocked off... or something...

Re:Take sick leave.

[njh]

Was it: "The employee that comes to work in a suit and leaves for job interviews on company time gets the unfair dismissal case."?

Re:Take sick leave.

[irony nazi]

be careful with supabeast's advice. Remember that once your employer has the suspicion that you are looking for other jobs, there's no turning back. What i mean is that you may or may not leave your current job, but you can't take back the fact that your employer is now suspicious. Personally, i think of it as an ace-in-hand. I think it's better just to keep it secret until after you've accepted an offer and are almost ready to resign. Remember, that you don't want to burn bridges... even if you hate your current employer. You would be surprised how small your industry is. Even if you change industries, you may run across your former employer again in a different life. I used to get into arguments with one of my bosses on a regular basis. He was ridiculous... but i left under good circumstances, to do something that was "better for my career", not because i hated my job/boss. That boss still calls me about once a month just to see what's up and we bounce ideas off of one another. He gave me a glowing review recently for a different job.

More importantly though is your current situation. You don't need time to interview for other jobs, you just need more time, period. Once you take a few 'sick afternoons' to go interview or leave for a long lunch interview, you may realize just how easy it is to leave you job at a reasonable hour. I had a job that used to make us stay late and work long hours. I was very unproductive. One day, because i hated that job so much, i left early (granted early=6:30, 8:30-6:30). I started doing it every day. One day, as i was leaving my manager stopped me and said 'i noticed you've been leaving at 6:30' (he dare not say 'early'!). I told him, matter of factly, that tonight i was meeting a friend and had to get ready. I made no excuses for the other nights. After that he learned to have more respect for the time i was in the office. He knew that i would be the 1st to leave the office and he would make extra efforts to make sure that i would have everything i needed to finish my projects before 6:30. He knew i wouldn't stay one second later, unless it was an emergency.

My coworkers were jealous that I got to leave 'early' and they had to stay until 9-10pm every night. I told them it was their own doing and they could leave when they wanted. When bonus time came around, my billing was on target and my bonus reflected that. I got more done during 8:30-6:30 when i felt good about my job, than i ever got done working 8:30AM-10PM and hating it.

This is one of my great revelations. It was beginning of restructuring my social life, getting physically fit, starting bike racing, and generally getting my life in order.

Re:Take sick leave.

[Eivind Eklund]

Norway: It's legal to work up to 200 hours of overtime per year, expandable to 400 hours if you apply to the state.

Standard is 7.5 hours per day (8 hours with 30 minute lunch break), with a significant number of unionized workers having negotiated 15 minutes less.

In the private IT sector, it is fairly common to work 10 hours, even though that's illegal. The work environment inspection (Arbeidsmiljøtilsynet) check for this occasionally, and will fine both the employer and the employee heavily if these rules are broken. I know one guy that this has happened to. As I've not heard of any others, I think it's fairly uncommon.

Eivind.

Suck it up,.

[XaXXon]

the weekends are needed to take care of chores, and preserve my mental health

I call whiny bitch. If you really wanted it, you would skip on the "mental health" part of the weekends and spend the time getting a new job. Then, later, when you had a new job, you'd get the benefit of not being so stressed out all the time.

"How do I get something I want but not have to do any work for it?"

Welcome to real life, bud. No pain, no gain. And in this case, a little pain now seems like it could pay off big-time later. To bad for you you're not willing to do anything to obtain your goal.

Re:Suck it up,.

[Anonymous Coward]

I call asshole who's never had it that rough. Some jobs require - absolutely require - that after a few months in you have some spare time on the weekend or else you simply crack up. The OP probably would have had an easier time doing it in the first month or two but, of course, he didn't know he should be looking for a job then.

Re:Suck it up,.

[supremebob]

Very true. If this guy isn't already working the occassional weekend, he already has a better job than most IT folks do.

Re:Suck it up,.

[buck_wild]

I'm not HR either, but speak as a hiring manager. If someone held their current employer in such high regard that they couldn't take time off to come to an interview, and they had "the most awesome resume I've ever seen" then I'd schedule a phone interview. No matter what time, I'll call him from my houme office if necessary. If I still liked him, *hell yes* I'd come in on the weekend to do an in-person interview.

I can't imagine a manager that wouldn't do the same.

Re:Suck it up,.

[Tim Browse]

I can't imagine a manager that wouldn't do the same.

Try harder.

Or failing that, just heave a rock out of the window. You'll hit three of them. No imagining required.

Re:Suck it up,.

[icepick72]

If you're under that much stress and duress, and you're able to handle it, you may be able to handle looking for a job at the same time.

Re:Suck it up,.

[nine-times]

Geeze, why do we always see posts like this? Does it make you feel all good and tough to claim someone is a whiney bitch because they have a limit to the amount of work they want to do? Don't you have some limit after which you'l like to call it quits? How many 20 hour days will you work before you say, "screw this, I'm taking a break!"?* How would you feel if someone called you a whiney bitch for taking that break?

I've been in this sort of situation before. Frankly, I find that it's hard to go through a good job search if you have a full-time job at all. I find job searches to be worse than any full-time job I've ever had, and having to do it after a long day's work isn't fun. Doing it after working 18 hours straight is pretty demoralizing.

And on top of all the rest, potential employers want everyone to be so goddamn chipper. That's what gets me, is even if your working hard and still looking for a job, you're tired and a bit depressed, which is exactly the wrong state to be in if you want to get hired. They want you to have the most beautiful resume ever, a personally-crafted cover letter, and a big smile on your face when you show up for an interview. Lots of them want you to tell them how they have the best company ever and the job you're interviewing for is your dream job. All this after they went through all the trouble of writing a 2 sentence job post for Monster.com.

Honestly, my theory is that there's a serious problem with the way we find work, in that the skills to find the job, the skills to get the job, and the skills to do the job are often not the same. Sometimes, they're contradictory. And we don't have help, and we treat people like their lazy idiots if they have any trouble with the process.

I mean, yeah, you have to suck it up. If you want a job, you have to do it. But can't we have a little sympathy for someone who works long days, has other things going on in his life (don't we all?), and is frustrated by the job-search process? When he asks for help, can't we offer something more productive than name-calling?

My advice (and others have said similar things) is to put limits on the hours for the current job. When they dump more hours and responsibilities on you, say no. Leave on time. Take vacation/sick/personal time for interviews. Do what you need to do. It won't make your boss happy, but you don't need him to be super-impressed if you're not trying to move up in that company anyway. Wait until you get your new job, then work your ass off to impress the boss. Work your ass off when you work for a good company where hard work will pay off.

*yes, before I got my current job, I interrupted my job search for about a month because I was working 20 hour days sometimes and I didn't have the energy to look.

Re:Suck it up,.

[Aqua OS X]

This is "insightful?"

How about giving the guy some constructive criticism as opposed to taking a crap in his hat? I know everyone likes to be a-know-it-all on the inter web, but truth is, we don't really know what is employment situation and personal life are like.

That said, he sounds pretty bummed out, and he probably doesn't have a lot of experience with handling these situations. He's fresh out of college. It's takes a while before you learn to deal with the crappy nature of real life.

If I were him I would spend a few days collecting my thoughts to confront my employer in a constructive way.

If he has a lot of responsibility (which is sounds like he does), his employer probably would prefer more then 2 weeks notice. Finding and training a replacement in 2 weeks is a royal pain in the ass. Often advanced notice benefits both the employer and the person leaving. The employer has time to collect themselves and utilize the employee to train a new person. Moreover, if the employer knows you're leaving, he / she might be more inclined to let you go to an interview.

That being said... it also helps to drop a good lie in there. Say you're leaving town, going into teaching, whatever. Or, hell, say someone else offered you a job already. That's what I did last time. Yet when I left for interviews, I said they were background checks, introductory meetings, or whatever.

No one ever sees their old boss ever again... so lie away.

start doing less hours

[Alban]

You should start doing less hours in order to make time for your job hunt. Yes, your managers will probably frown upon for doing so, but it would probably take a few weeks of you not doing crazy overtime for them to decide to do something major like firing you. So you're really buying yourself some time. I don't think you would be fired for doing a few weeks of "non-crazy" work hours.

Call the WAAAAHHHmbulance...

[grub]

You just graduated from college yet you sound as drained as someone nearing retirement. Snap out of it, get your resume out there, pound pavement: you don't work 24*7.

Or... are you in over your head? It's one thing to get your degree, another to apply the theory to practical use.

Whatever happens, do not quit your job yet. It's easier to get a job while you already have one. A potential employer may consider you a hothead if you tell them you quit your job with nothing else lined up.

Re:Call the WAAAAHHHmbulance...

[PCM2]

And when I'm not working, its too late to pound the pavement cuz every company is closed. And yeah...I know it sounds like whining...but most of the time I honestly don't have the energy to pound the pavement 24/7.

What's all this about 24/7? Probably the last ten, if not fifty jobs, I've applied for I've sent my resume and cover letter by e-mail. Are you expecting them to get back to you by IM in the next 15 minutes? Then what's the problem? Take a couple of hours each evening to identify a few companies you're interested in and send them your resume. If you're really so inundated with callbacks the next day that you don't have time to keep on top of them all, it's a sign you have even fewer problems than it sounds like you have.

Re:Call the WAAAAHHHmbulance...

[bit01]

You mention you're a recent college grad. which leads me to believe you're young.

The description of your job fits a pattern I see regularly - young enthusastic worker just out of college not knowing how things work and being taken advantage of by a well meaning but highly ambitious small business boss for whom the business is everything. Usually with a short fuse. Eventually young enthustiastic worker burns out but because they don't have a lot of experience they're not sure what to do next. Does this fit? I've seen it time and time again. I was there myself once.

What to do? First of all realise that what you're doing is not the norm for the industry. You need to gradually ease your boss into the idea that you do have a life outside work and it's not reasonable for him/her to regularly keep you outside of 8-9am to 5-6pm except in exceptional circumstances. ("Sorry boss, can't stay, playing tennis with my buddies..."). Next, you need to work your boss into the idea that working hours flexibility works both ways, for both the company and for you. If the company expects you to work late once in a while it's completely reasonable that you should be able to take similar time off once in while. For personal reasons that you shouldn't have to explain in detail. You can then use that flexibility to control your personal life, including things like job interviews and dental appointments.

You need to decide for yourself what you want out of your job and get a better idea of what you're worth and what you're prepared to do to get it. Sounds to me like your temperament is more suited to a large corporation than a small business. Big business is more bureaucratic and less inspiring but it does tend to take working hours and stress more seriously and you do get much more of a social life if you can handle the cubical farm.

In summary, I'd gradually push the wire with the boss on the number and flexibility of hours you're working. If you're good at your job you're not going to get fired and you can gradually improve your conditions. Then use that flexibility (work late one night, work early the next) to job hunt. In the unlikely event you're fired make sure you have a buffer in the bank to tide you over. You can get a new job very quickly if you're willing to accept, temporarily, some compromises like lower pay, boring job and/or part time work.

---

It's not piracy, it's sharing. Didn't your parents teach you to share?

In Soviet Russia Jobs look for you

[fishdan]

But seriously, you need to use this internet thing. Get your resume everywhere it can be online. I'm assuming you're not in the tech field, otherwise you'd have people calling you. Consider a head hunter, but don't take one that you have to pay. A good head hunter will take a commision from your future employer.

Network. Email everyone you can (and by can, I mean everyone who won't get mad at you for eamiling them that you need work). Try getting into some networking groups like Friendster and LinkedIn.com.

Get a Blog and start writing in it, and include the fact that your looking for work and your trials and tribulations etc. It worked wonders for Odd Todd and who knows who might read your blog. Of course to advertise you're gonna have to read/post in others blogs. Do so wisely.

Most importantly -- believe that you can make it happen and you will. But the key is you have to make it happen -- otherwise it won't.

Learn to say NO

[melted]

Quite often additional job responsibilities are given not because of evil intent of the management, but because employee is eager to take stuff on in hope of a raise or promotion. This is especially true of new employees just out of college. Make things mechanical. Plan how much time your current workload will take, and once there's an attempt to add something on ask what part of the stuff you currently do your manager wants to "load balance" to someone else. If he has no intent to do so, warn him that things will take longer and some things may not be done.

You will end up working a little overtime (just to recoup the time you spend browsing slashdot at work), but things will become controllable. Working more than 10 hours a day and more than 5 days a week is unsustainable. So it only makes sense to do so if you need or want to do it temporarily, to, say, meet a deadline or to get rich in a startup. Pre-deadline crunches shouldn't last more than two weeks, though. If it's more - your management is doing something wrong and you should simply refuse to come in on the weekend or stay late.

Maybe not quite that....

[djward]

the amount of time needed to write, proofread, edit, proofread

You must be new here.

demand a raise

[dwillington]

Listen, I've been through this... if you've been promoted, and are assuming more responsiblity, etc. NOW!!! Hear me loud and clear, NOW!! is the time to demand for a raise. Tech. work is surprisingly very close to prostitution industry. You're basically a good hoe right now. Recognize it, and firmly ask for a raise. Have a decent figure in mind. 10-20%, more? Whatever you want. Dude, if I've learned one thing, asking never hurts. You've only got money to gain. Rather than looking for another job right now, you probably have a better chance of getting money out of these people. I was able to demand a 50% rate increase, after I got promoted, and I knew I was the shit. Now what made it easy asking for the raise and demanding it? I was ready to walk away from the job, and I knew I could at least get equal or beter pay and better working hours. So recognize you can walk away from this and lose 2-4 weeks, and find something equal and better. To effectively job search from what I've learned, you need the time. This is a whole other subject... After you know you can walk away, you get guts. Free confidence, b/c you've got nothing to lose. And you tell the manager you've got the best relation with (he counts on you like crack): I love this company, the people, etc. I don't want to go, but given everything I've demonstrated (have a list ready), I deserve appropriate compensation. (seem pissed). State a figure (i'd go high, 25%+), and then just shut up and wait for him to respond. Worst case I gaurantee: you'll get a minimal raise. Best case: you find out how afraid they are of losing you, they count on you, you're part of momentum on the project, etc. you get what you ask for. Go for it.

Re:demand a raise

[Lord_Dweomer]

While I wish I was in the above situation, unfortunately due to my lack of appropriate experience for the work they've tossed on me, I am not effective at my job. I'm late on deadlines, have errors in my work, etc. They've been forgiving so far because they know my situation, but it sure doesn't put me in any position for a raise. And unfortunately I can't foresee becoming good enough in the near future to warrant one.

Yeah, that sucks

[algae]

I was in a similar position prior to my current job (yay). What I would do was have a *good* cover letter and resume saved in my web email, and every time they had me work (unpaid) overtime, I'd spend an additional 25-50% of that time to send out resumes. I had a new job within six weeks.

Basically, you have to accept that it's going to suck, and you're going to be spending another 5-10 hours a week on top of your work week just sending out applications.

Also, I had to take some unpaid time off to go to interviews. After the second morning that I couldn't come in, my boss kind of caught on and wouldn't let me use any comp time. Fortunately, that third unpaid morning off was the one that landed me a job.

Nothing is more satisfying than knowing that it was your boss's making you work overtime that landed you a new job.

Re: How Do You Job-Hunt If You Work Overtime?

[Lord_Dweomer]

"Choose your vector first before you start accelerating so hard in that chosen direction"

Hi, story poster here.

Its funny that you said that...because while I've been thinking about other jobs, I have no idea what I want to do next. I have thoughts of law school, but I don't want to go through all of that if I end up disliking it as much. Although the rewards would be big...

Hell, part of me just wants to be a lazy ass and become some surf bum in Hawaii.

I guess that would be a good follow-up question...

Once you're in the real world, how do you get to test out jobs since you can't exactly intern somewhere at a certain point. Does anybody have any suggestions for a test or some guide I can read to perhaps gain some insight into what kind of jobs I might be interested in?

Stop working overtime

[KillerBob]

Simple answer. They can't actually force you to work overtime. It's a myth that a lot of corporate types are all too happy to let continue... but legally, they can't force you to work overtime, and you can sue for wrongful dismissal if they fire you for not doing it. And they know it.

So just stop working overtime. Or cut back on it. It won't take you too long to update your resume, and then maybe an hour a day to check the job sources and send out 2 or 3 resumes a day. And when you get an interview, take a sick or vacation day.

Re:Welcome to the real world.

[rizzo420]

after reading it a second time i came to the conclusion that maybe he just doesn't really want a new job. he needs weekends for down time and cooling off... but if you really want the other job, you put in the effort.

he mentions how he's doing 2 different jobs without any sort of extra compensation but the overtime. maybe he should take it up with teh boss. maybe it would be cheaper for the boss to hire someone else at a lower pay rate than to be paying him all the overtime.

he says he's a recent grad... find a roommate, move into a cheaper apartment, don't go out drinking, don't spend money to have fun. if that's what your friends do, let them. if you can, move back in with your parents. i doubt you're tied down with family stuff being a recent grad. spread your chores out over the course of the evenings. laundry, dishes, cleaning, etc can all be done over time. hell, i haven't cleaned my apartment really well in months, but i pick up and vacuum every now and then. and i have lots of free time.

if you really want the job, you'll put in the extra effort and give up some of the quality of life crap and just deal with it until you find a new job. otherwise, you will have to learn to suck it up and deal with teh status quo. the words are harsh, but that's really what it comes down to.

Re:Mandatory or Voluntary "Overtime"?

[Lord_Dweomer]

It is mandatory in that "it is HIGHLY suggested" that I stay until my tasks are done...because in the end the employer doesn't care really how late I have to work as long as we make the deadlines. Which are always short, and then adding my workload and slight lack of experience to the problem.

Become a Consultant

[nighty5]

Best move I did 7 years ago.

Take time off when you want too, do the things that interest you.

And the kicker, get paid double what every other 9-5 Joe is getting.

Is everybody working this hard, or just you?

[sirwired]

If you are the only one in your dept. working this hard, and you have an understanding boss, let him know, and maybe you can get some relief, like getting some of the work moved to others who aren't working as hard.

Also, I'm a little confused about your overtime situation. If you are paid for overtime, then you are non-exempt. If you do not get paid for overtime, you are exempt. (As in: Exempt from overtime laws.)

If everybody at your office is working this hard, then yeah, it's time to take some "flex" time during the day to do at least a phone interview. If they aren't paying you by the hour, then it is perfectly right for you to do so. (You aren't physically chained to your desk, are you?) If they are paying by the hour, just charge them for less OT.

Remember, you work to live, not the other way around.

SirWired

Re:Is everybody working this hard, or just you?

[Tarwn]

I agree.

Part of the problems faced in the first job out is the deadline. Yes, you had deadlines by the dozen in school, and each major one could potentially ruin several months of your life if missed, however real world work doesn't have to be like that. At least not to the same degree.

First of all, your not being assigned projects or tasks that have been carefully balanced to fit in an allotted time with a nice set of requirements. Your probably getting requirements that float all over the map and a "we need it yesterday" deadline. I sympathise, I have several projects in the air right now that are similar. However, the bonus on these projects is that you can apologize, tell the customer how much you want to have it done on time, and push out the date because such-and-such project takes priority, or because you "really want to give it the time to do it right". Better yet, if you have a good manager, they should be doing it. You have to manage your load instead of allowing it to manage you. Don't be afraid to sit down with your manager and talk about relative priorities of projects and which deadlines seem unhealthy. Remember, your customer wants a working solution in an impossible amount of time. You can either throw something together in a short time and take one step closer to mental break down or get your manager to help you make a realistic deadline that he can then go back and explain to the customer. It's in everyone's best interests that you don't have a mental break down and that you don't slap everything together as fast and dirty as you can.

Second, I had no second :P

In any case, good luck with your situation, been there, or somewhere closely approximating there.

Re:Mandatory or Voluntary "Overtime"?

[Lord_Dweomer]

Sssshhh....they won't give me my 10 minute per day bathroom/lunch break!

You have a few options

[shoolz]

I definitely sympathize with you since I've been in your shoes. Here's what I would have dome differently 10 years ago if I had the experience. Any/all of these should lead to more time to look for work and/or an escape from the hellish grind you find yourself in:

If you are working so hard that you are stressed to the breaking point, see your physician or psychologist, with the possibility of receiving medical clearance to go on sick leave /stress leave. If you can't sleep because you're working so hard, or work is desrupting your otherwise normal life, seriously think about this option. Your medical plan covers this and if you don't have insurance, then you can approach this from a workplace health & safety perspective / unemployment insurance. A hunk of every one of your paychecks goes to fund these goverment programs, so USE THEM. There is nothing wrong with this, and it doesn't mean you're 'weak'.

Recognize that your employer needs you more than you need them. I say this because if you are filling two roles for the price of one, your company probably cannot do without you. While this is tougher for people to do when they have less experience (aren't wise to 'normal' employee / employer expectations), know that you can establish boundaries and expectations. Advise your manager that you will simply not be able to fulfil the duties of BOTH positions and they're going to have to pick the ONE that you will be responsible for. If they won't play ball, tell them you intend to resign. They will do anything to keep a person that does as much work as you, including cutting your hours substantially.

Realize that salary does not mean 'you will complete as much work as we tell you to, even if it means sleeping under your desk'. There are labor laws which govern this type of employee abuse. Spend a few hours calling local government agencies and find out what your rights are. Better yet, consult a labor lawyer. He may actually be able to extract money for all the extra hours you put in. Plus, the company basically can't fire you after this, because that getting fired for attempting to protect yourself from abusive employment practices is called 'wrongful dismissal', and is worth even more money to you in a lawsuit.

All in all, finally I can just tell you to look out for yourself first. Your company isn't looking out for you, so YOU HAVE TO DO IT. I would suspect that you have a strong work ethic, and want to do good for the company and it's clients, but at the end of the day, are you reaping the profits? NO. So always look out for #1.

Can't find time? Make time!

[digital photo]

Lord_Dweomer asks: "As a recent college grad, I took a job to pay the bills, but soon realized that it would end up sucking the life out of me. I work a lot of overtime in a high-stress, tight deadline job. Once you get into that kind of downward spiral, how do you find another job?"

Leverage your time and connections.

All of those co-worker friends you have, all of those business cards you've been stockpiling at all of those work meetings? They're not just interesting pieces of paper used to convey notes and/or passwords. :) If you're on good terms with those folk, maybe it's time to take 5-10 minutes out of your lunch break to ring them up?

Alot of people I know post their resumes up on resume sites like Craigslist or to Monster/Dice/hotjobs/etc. Takes 15-30 minutes to post, then check on it once every few days. Not alot of time.

Another option is to have automated searches run for you through one of the aforementioned job sites.

Yet another option would be to get in touch with people through a business networking service like jigsaw.

"All my free time, during the week, is completely non-existent, and the weekends are needed to take care of chores, and preserve my mental health.

Okay... what do you do at lunch? Are you taking a lunch? Taking a lunch helps preserve sanity. Not to mention keeping things all legal in the employment law books.

Are potential employers typically sensitive to the fact that I may not be able to interview during the week or during standard work hours?

Depends on the employer and on your value to them. Personally, when I had a job interview, I made sure that the time we agreed upon was convenient to them, myself, and my current employer. Ie, during lunch breaks, at the start or end of day, or I take a personal day off.

The fact of the matter is, you are looking for a new job. If the new job is worthwhile to you, then you will need to invest something into getting that job. That means taking a day off sometimes.

Also, will having left here after a year seem like a real black mark on my resume?

Nope. Especially with the recent job losses in the market, it will seem pretty typical. If you are in the tech field, staying for around 1 to 2 years is, I think, around average if you are fairly well established at the company you are working for. 2+ years is if you are working towards a goal within the company. Less than that, you are building up your resume with projects, completed goals, and exposure to new technologies.

The other issue is that if the workplace doesn't work out, you really aren't obligated to stay. What's the point unless you have no other choice? If you are interviewing, you are engaging other choices.

My reasons for leaving, aside from the overtime (I am non-exempt), would be that I've basically been promoted in work load and responsibilities -- and have even taken on another job role, IN ADDITION to my current one. All of this without a raise in pay, or new title.

You really need to look at what you want here. If you want to get compensated for over-time, then you are looking at switching to an hourly wage. In which case, joining a consultant group (Taos, Kforce, ManPower, etc) would be a good way to go. If you just want a higher salary, but don't want to go hourly, then interviewing at a medium to larger sized business is the way to go. Small/Medium businesses and dot coms tend to have a small core of people who work extremely hard and long hours. Many of them are salaried. They are willing to do this because they probably either have stock options or don't feel the effort to switch jobs is good for them.

Whatever the reason, you need to look at your priorities. Want time left over for yourself, your family, your life, etc? Then add it to your want/need list. Want more money, add it onto the list as well. Which one comes first? Decide that before going into the interview.

Absolutely true

[msobkow]

Every agency or tech company I worked with had management and techs available who'd do weekend interviews if it was the only time some one could get together. Far more often an evening or morning phone call was arranged.

Even if you're working 12 hours a day and commuting an hour each way, that's still only 14 hours. That leaves you 2-3 hours per workday with 7-8 hours of sleep. Your choice, but arranging an interview call might be something to consider doing with that time.

MAKE time

[joseph_dcruz]

Well, you have time to hit /., so there's obviously *some* spare time in your day. Learn to be more efficient in your use of time. Spend time on Lifehacker and 43folders instead of Slashdot. Then find a job you want to go for, and go for it. If you need to take time off for an interview, do it. Right now you're sacrificing long-term interests for short term crises. That's not smart.

A small voice of empathy

[pennyher0]

I don't know if this reply will get moderated any higher than anyone elses or will ever be seen but anyone, but I'd like to say that I know what it feels like to be overwhelmed, want a way out, and feel like I can't find a way to get out.

There's not an easy way to offer suggestions to a problem like this, and i wish that the rest of the commentors weren't so big on saying things like "welcome to the real world" and "nope, no way out" and actually offer some SUGGESTIONS.

If i were in that situation (and I will be shortly), is I would find a way to FEEL like I am not so overwhelmed. If you make specific ordered lists of the things you have to do each day, you can get things done sooner (like chores, or work tasks etc) and with better organization and management of time, you may find you have a few hours a night before you sleep to get on Monster.com or write or revise a resume or start searching for a new job. You can also grab a newspaper during your lunch break at work and scan ads, highlight them and stick them in your pocket before you go back to work. Every day, find a way to do some small thing related to searching for a new job instead of trying to find a large chunk of time to devote to searching.

Obviously, you'll never be able to find a large amount of time to dedicate to this if you're as busy as you say. The best solution is to manage what time you have more efficiently.

Another alternative could be to talk to your boss and discuss the pressure/stress you are under and ask if there is a way that you can delegate some of your responsibilities to others, or explain that your productivity would go up if you were able to do so. (Don't let on that you're looking for another job) Perhaps go to a supervisor instead first, or ask the advice of co-workers as to how to approach your boss or supervisor about the fact that you are completely overwhelmed and about to go insane.

just be smart about it. If finding a new job is a priority, come up with strategies for finding a few minutes or a half an hour EVERY DAY to searching for a new job. I would imagine that "searching-for-new-job" time would help your sanity anyway, so you're killing two birds with one stone if you designate this time also as self-sanity time.

Worked for me!

[MarcQuadra]

I wore a suit one day and left mid-day to 'get my car inspected', which was actually the truth. When I got back to the office I got a $7,000 raise from my boss. She was frantically making phone calls while I was out, trying to get immediate authorization for the money.

Playing double-or-nothing is a great way to get a raise or get canned, but in my experience, if you're on-the-ball you'll get the raise. I know my workplace would be in a world of pain if I left, just because I know a little about how everything works.

Re:Worked for me!

[Overzeetop]

Sadly, unless you are both indespensible and underpaid for the market (sound's like your case), these types of raises tend to be merely advances on your next couple of annual review raises.

7-step program.

[Spazmania]

Step 1. Look at your financial situation. If you have a car payment and a high rent and carry a credit card balance each month then you are well and truly screwed. You could have bought a used junker and rented a hole in the wall but you didn't and now your ass is pwnd. Suck it up and the next time you have a choice between cheap and nice, choose cheap.

And Craig if you're reading this: A dog is nice but a pet rock is cheap.

Step 2. Okay, so your finances are reasonable. You have little if any debt and your core living expenses don't eat your entire paycheck. Cut your spending. Cut it to the bone. Dump the cable TV. Skip the chips at the grocery store. Don't even bother visiting Best Buy. You need to put enough money in the bank to pay your core expenses for about six months.

Step 3. Okay, so you have enough money to live off of for six months. Quit. Give two weeks notice set to expire in the first week of the next month and walk away. Note that the two weeks notice is very important. Your next employer probably won't call your last one, but wouldn't it suck if you missed out on a great job because they did? Leaving shortly after the start of the month is important too. You don't want to show a large gap on your resume but nobody counts the days.

Step 4. Sleep. This'll take about two weeks. Kick back, let your whiskers grow, shower if the smell gets too bad but mostly relax and recover.

Step 5. Take a two week vacation. Somewhere dirt cheap 'cause this'll put you a month in to your six months of saved money. Heck, go visit some relatives. That's always cheap. It doesn't really matter where you go as long as its away.

Step 6. Come back fresh and start looking for jobs. Apply for anything that looks vaguely interesting. If you're lucky, 1 in 50 will respond with interest. Don't worry about the response rate. Just keep applying for jobs. Go on interviews and if it looks like a suck job, turn it down. You have five months to find a job. Don't sweat it.

Step 7. Accept one of the jobs. Hopefully you found one you liked, but if you ran out of time then take what you can get and go back to step 2. Do make sure you take the new job before the money in the bank runs out. You absolutely don't want to go in to debt in the hopes of holding out for the right job. That'll just land you back at step 1.

Your mileage may vary, but this worked great for me.

Join the Army

[Ranger]

I work a lot of overtime in a high-stress, tight deadline job. Once you get into that kind of downward spiral, how do you find another job?"

You must work in a call center. Have you thought about joining the Army? I hear they are looking volunteers. Since you have a degree, you could go for officer candidate school. It's not like you'd go and fight in an unpopular war and work in a high-stress environment.

You can save time if you...

[craXORjack]

ask for an application right when you order lunch. That way you won't have to wait in the line twice.

sick days

[paulsomm]

Take sick days. If you're looking to leave, why do you care if you're taking days off. While I'm not saying get yourself fired, there's no reason you can't let your performance suffer a bit to find a better position.

I know my previous employer was suspicious that I had so many "dentist appointments" in the week or so before I handing in my resignation . . .

Re:Welcome to the real world.

[denebian devil]

I don't think you guys are being fair to the OP. Being in a job you need but don't like can be very draining in time, physical energy, emotional energy, etc. While it may appear to the casual viewer that he has time to job hunt (time spent posting on slashdot, for example), the amount of energy required to post on slashdot can hardly be compared to the amount of energy needed to update a resume/cover letter, search for jobs, apply for jobs, arrange a schedule of interviews, etc: one act is a form of relaxation, the others are not.

Set Limits.

[drivekiller]

Is the company big enough to have some kind of personnel manual? It likely has an "hours of operation" paragraph. Adhere to it. Not rigidly. Just start packing up when the day is over and go home if there isn't anyone standing over you with an urgent task. If your company has comp time or overtime policy, be sure to make use of it. If it does not, do a little research into what the law requires in your locale. In my opinion, being unemployed and stone broke is better than being abused. As a rhetorical gesture, it probably helps if you can arrive a few minutes before the boss a few times a week.

Save your money, then quit...

[Anonymous Coward]

Cheapen up your lifestyle (get a roommate, eat out less, get rid of cable tv, etc, etc...) then quit. Once you quit, you'll have all the time in the world to search for a job. And while you hunt, live off of the money you saved from being cheap. Even consider temping to bring in a few extra bucks while you hunt. In theory, with all the overtime you've been doing and the lack of off-time to spend that money, you should already be able to accomplish this.

I did something similar myself. My first job out of college landed me back in good ol' so cal, so I moved back in with my parents (talk about your cheap rent... doesn't get much better!). After I left that job, I moved back to my college town and was able to spend 3 months vacationing/job hunting, just living off of savings and maybe 10 hours of temp work a week. Good luck!

Get yourself a good book

[littleRedFriend]

Get this What Color Is Your Parachute book, which is quite good and goes into much detail on all things you've talked about here.

Works for me!

You're only one person - not 6

[cheros]

Firstly, realise that you will cause real damage to yourself and it takes a long time to recover - is that worth the money? If you work weekends you have reasonable cause to take a days' rest during the week - use that 'rest'.

Secondly, if you have decided to look around it means you have mentally already left (lesson 1 of staff management - missed by many idiot managers). So you're going to feel even worse now - get on with finding a job.

Having no time is an illusion - it's your choice.

No Fightin the Man

[bretberger]

You can't fight The Man, he's too strong. You'll have to stay put. However, there are some extremely effective strategies for showing everyone that The Man don't own you.

1) A Dilbert desk calendar
2) A Tatoo

sincerely,
The Man

You need to get away from that employer!

[Rotorblade]

I was in a situation like that working for the huge worldwide leader in ATMs and Financial equipment called NCR. They were working me like a slave and expected overtime in excess of 20+ hours of it a week. I made some time to contact a head hunter and told them what I wanted to do and they got me a dream job with large employer on the top 100 list of best places to work in the US. One needs to make time for themselves even in a job like that. You will bend under pressure, and if the employer is bending the rules for overworking you then you should bend the use of time to accomodate searching for a new job. I have gotten myself out of few bad jobs by taking time during my work day to sneak in a few phone calls and emails. Don't feel guilty because that employer sure isn't feeling guilty about overworking you!

Re:Welcome to the real world.

[Valdrax]

he mentions how he's doing 2 different jobs without any sort of extra compensation but the overtime. maybe he should take it up with teh boss. maybe it would be cheaper for the boss to hire someone else at a lower pay rate than to be paying him all the overtime.

You must be new to this industry. If you're salaried, you don't get overtime pay -- ever. That's standard industry practice. If you're hourly, you might get a package where they only pay overtime beyond 28 hours per month in exchange for paid vacation and holidays that you'll never get a chance to use.

By federal regulations, even if they do pay you overtime, IT workers are exempt from time-and-a-half requirements. They can choose to only pay you the same rate as you're currently being paid. I've never heard of an IT worker getting paid time-and-a-half. It is no cheaper to hire another worker (and probably more expensive due to overhead costs) when you can just pay the same guy for more hours, especially if he's working less than 80 hours per week (16 hours per day without weekends). Even if he does get time-and-a-half, it's still cheaper unless he works over 66 hours. (13+ hours per day without weekends.)

In my opinion, you should always take one of two options -- salaried with good benefits and an expectation to work less than 45 hours per week or strictly hourly with all working hours paid and no non-working hours paid. Any other kind of job is a sucker's job, and I'm starting to think that the latter job type is one too if you can regularly expect to be on-call as per my current job. Taking job where you're hourly and they can still get free overtime out of you is a job where you're absolutely assured to get overtime work constantly.

have you done anything?

[jim_redwagon]

do you have a resume loaded with all your experience ready? if so, spend the time to load it onto the following sites:

Monster
hot jobs
Dice
Career Builder
and www.yourlocalnewspaper.com

Don't worry about your one year at a company so far, people will understand it was your first job, you got your experience and 'want to find somewhere to build your career' (or at least that's a line that used to work).

Unless you're a lame NFL Head Coach who's original team fired your a$$, no one is going to come looking to give you a job. Stay up late one night, get yourself online and order and extra shot of caffeine in the AM.

Because many of them are liars.

[jotaeleemeese]

Here is my anecdotal evidence:

I applied for a job with a software company some time ago. I was asking for 60 peanuts (peanuts is the currency of my parables) and in fact the advertisment stated that they were offering 65 peanuts.

I went through 3 rounds of interviews, I liked the company, then found my charming and capable (of course) and then we sat dwon to talk peanuts, I mean, money.

Knowing that they were offering 65 peanuts and keeping in mind I wanted 60 peanuts initially I asked for 62 peanuts (unsalted). They looked at me in a combination of anger, disbelief, confussion. Then, with her voice trembling my prospective boss (a readheaded babe worth of a role in a King Kong movie) said "you are a greedy bastard!".

I, feeling aggravated, asked why were they insulting me. Then they told me that asking 12 peanuts more than what they were offering was not on. All of the sudden I realized what had happened, and it just took a couple of phone calls to confirm it: the agency had told me they were offering more (far more) than what they were actually offering, they told the company I was expecting far less than what I was actually expecting, and the agency cynics hoped that somehow we would meet somewhere in between (I mean, boss to be was gorgeous, but still).

getting more time in office

[utnapistim]

One of the best things things to do for getting rid of overload is to dump the decision on the head of your manager.

When he brings you an extra task (that would require you to work overtime) put him in an or-or situation and make him decide on something to leave behind;

Say

I'm currently working on blabla, due this evening; If I start on the new task I won't finish blabla in time. Which one should I defer?

It is an elegant way of enforcing to your manager the fact that you won't work overtime (or that at least you don't expect to do it on a regular basis).

Be good to yourself, first and foremost.

[Anonymous Meoward]

I probably should be posting as an AC here, but who knows, you may want to follow up with emails. What to do when you're worked into the ground without so much as a thank-you?

Some background first: My wife got her MBA, while working full-time, in a 2-year program. During her last year, she was not only working (for a company whose name I can never divulge), but asked to fly all over the globe (Asia, Latin America) in her role, and was putting in weekends -- time she should have been using for the degree. (She still managed to graduate with honors, by the way.)

Her management team was so fraught with cronyism, however, and so dictatorial that she could never get past their bullying. She never did crack the glass ceiling there, even after trying every strategy in the book to succeed, including writing up new business plans. The plans were in fact implemented, but she never received credit for them.

Instead, her manager told her that the object of employment at this company was to do your job, take orders, and retire. (Nice place, huh?)

It got worse: During a celebratory lunch for her group, her skip-level manager never even acknowledged that she received her MBA from a top-flight B-school. He instead chose to heap accolades on a colleague (who, incidentally, was and is a lazy sack of shit).

She's scarred to this day. She has a new job, and it's pretty nice, but she's still wondering what she really wants to do with her life. Can you blame her?

The moral of the story: No matter how hard you try, there are some management teams that will, for whatever reason, ignore or denigrate you. If you find yourself in such a position, you do two things:

1. Learn the craft of networking, and network your ass off. That's how you find the next gig and stay in the game. Make sure this happens long before the shit hits etc. etc.
2. Run, don't walk, when the next gig comes along. Be sure to leave on good terms, but bolt nonetheless. Take care of yourself first!!!
3. Know that you tried, and don't take anything personally. It's not your fault that you wound up working with thankless sociopaths, especially if you've gone above and beyond the call.

Hope this helps. Good luck with whatever decision you make..

Easy

[Syberghost]

Work all the overtime you can, and put all that extra money in the bank. Live cheap for a while.

Once you've got enough in the bank, start leaving on time every day. Just plain flat ignore requests to stay late. Eventually they'll fire you, and you'll live off your savings while you look for another job full-time.

Any potential employer who doesn't understand your frustration at being death-marched is probably somebody you don't want to work for anyway, so the fact that you left your previous employment before you had a new job won't hurt you.

Resource Limiting

[whitelabrat]

One important thing that many folks learn on the job it to make their coworkers aware of resource limits. I can't do 200%. So stop doing two people's jobs, stop working long hours, and pressure your employer for compensation for your extra effort. I doubt anyone would fault you for being "let go" from a job because your employer has unrealistic expectations. Most likely as a recent grad, you are young and you do have more free time than you realize, so a couple extra hours won't hurt now and then. Those of us who have a family with small children can attest that, though worthwhile, there isn't time for extracuricular work, chores, or free time.

Set you limits, and take time for yourself. Besides, what do you care if your sweatshop boss gets upset if you leave the office for two-three hours for a job interview?