Installing Windows with Recent Updates?

MoJo asks: "As a computer technician, I have to re-install Windows often. It takes three attempts to complete Windows Update (get latest update software, validate Windows, download updates). It seems like all this clicking could be scripted somehow, but I can find no-one who has found a way of reducing the whole painful affair to just one or two clicks." Is there a way to build a Windows installation CD that includes the most recent set of updates?

Comments

Slipstreaming

[ckswift]

Ever here of slipstreaming?

Re:Slipstreaming

[Stevyn]

I've slipstreamed service pack 2 onto the windows xp cd, but you still have to go through the process the poster is talking about. I don't know if you can slipstream individual patches, however, even if you could, you'd still have to do it a few times a month. I think the poster is asking about a general script that would do this without human intervention, whereas slipstreaming still takes time.

Re:Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

Ever here of English?

Re:Slipstreaming

[ajayrockrock]

Slipstreaming is great. The windows guy at work does it for a bunch of our servers and he also rolls in his own device drivers into the system as well so there's no searching for floppy disks to install the RAID/SCSI drivers. He got the idea from this Maximum PC article:

http://www.maximumpc.com/2005/01/how_to_slipstre.h tml

--Ajay

Re:Slipstreaming

[cowbutt]

Combine some selective slipstreaming with the unattended build facility, e.g. using http://unattended.sourceforge.net/>unattended. My colleagues slipstream service packs and critcial hotfixes (i.e. those that can result in ones machine being 0wn3d during the install) into the installation image, then have a manually-updated .CMD script that runs on the first boot to bring in the others.

Re:Slipstreaming

[passthecrackpipe]

Thanks for the tip - Unattended looks like a great toolset - I have been wanting to get my team off Ghost for a while now, and I'll get them to look into this.

Re:Slipstreaming

[AmiMoJo]

Yes, I have.

Microsoft told us we couldn't do it. When a customer brings a PC in for repair. we have to use their original Windows CD and licence COA. We can't use ours. If they have recovery discs, they are SOL. If their disc is scratched, they can buy a replacement for £15.00, no CD-R backups allowed.

We even got fined over this. We used to have loads of slipstreamed CD-Rs. Instead, we pull a gig a day of updates from microsoft.com now.

Re:Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

Ouch, that stinks.

Too bad your customers don't use Linux, or BSD. You could do that if they did.

Re:Slipstreaming

[baadger]

Nlite can do this. It can slipstream all the post-SP2 hotfixes, your own drivers, make tweaks, and then reduce the installation process to about 4 clicks.

Use Microsoft Security Bulletin Search to find all the hotfixes you need, making sure you tick the box that reads 'Show only bulletins that contain updates that have not been replaced by a more recent update.'.

Re:Slipstreaming

[Penguin Programmer]

You could always setup a caching proxy server in front of your internal network. This wouldn't make the process any fewer clicks, but it would save a lot of time downloading fixes and things. The first time you download a fix, it would be cached on the server, and all the remaining machines that need the fix would grab it from the local network. This would speed things up, if nothing else.

Re:Slipstreaming

[Karma Farmer]

Microsoft told us we couldn't do it. When a customer brings a PC in for repair. we have to use their original Windows CD and licence COA.

Of course. Microsoft would be insane to allow anything else, and you would be insane to expect anything else.

Your real question seems to be in three parts.

1. As a repair shop routinely working on consumer PCs, customers frequently blame you because they don't understand the license of the copy of Windows XP they own. Many customers bring in non-transferable OEM copies (or obviously pirated copies), and are very disappointed when you tell them that you can't sell them a brand new computer (or motherboard, CPU, and RAM, which is basically the same thing as far as Microsoft is concerned) and install their copy of Windows on it. Microsoft has been very helpful in the past, and kindly allowed you to install dodgy copies or non-transferable copies, despite the obvious license violations. But you really need to find a way to explain to your customers why you can't help them pirate software, and you have to do it in a way that won't lose customers.
2. As a repair shop routinely working on consumer PCs, you end up downloading a lot of patches. Is there some way to cache patches locally, so you don't run up huge bandwidth bills?
3. As a repair shop routinely working on consumer PCs, you end up installing many, many different versions of windows on many different machines. Obviously, you have to install the version of Windows that the customer has a license for; that was never in doubt. However, there are so many different versions of Windows. You wish there were some way to automate the install and patch process. Most of the solutions from Microsoft and third parties are geared towards corporate and university networks, usually with volume licensing. Are there any solutions geared toward your situation?

Frankly, if you're making a good-faith effort to do the right thing, hopefully Microsoft can help you here, since your problems cost you money and customers, and probably cost Microsoft money and customers, too.

Re:Slipstreaming

[quiddity]

very nice expl.
now go fix/explain american political "rhetoric" please. :)

Re:Slipstreaming

[m0ng0l]

Leaving aside the problems of customers and their CDs, or lack of...

Once way to avoid downloading gigs of data from Windows update, is to set up a server running Windows Server Update Services. This essentially brings the Windows updates to a PC on your network, from which client stations can grab updates. It does require you to setup a Group Policy pointing to the internal server, and only works for automaticly recieved updates, not when someone clicks on the "Windows Update" icon or link. But you can setup a cmd script to force the PC to check for updates, and could also export and import the GP settings, so that when you hand the PC back to the client, everything works the original way.

You can even tell the WSUS machine if you want it to download the updates and store them locally, or simply tell the client PCs what updates they can or cannot download, and let them get them from MS (which in your case would defeat the purpose) Also, WSUS can be downloaded and used for free from MS (frightening, isn't it?), although it does require either Windows 2000 or 2003 Server, and either SQL Server, or MSDE (if no SQL Server available)

Re:Slipstreaming

[Karma Farmer]

now go fix/explain American political "rhetoric" please.

Public rhetoric in American politics has two parts:

1. Cynical politicians pushing wedge issues to raise money for 527 / 501c4 organizations, and
2. Cynical talking heads on 24-hour news stations yelling at each other about wedge issues to raise money for 527 / 501c4 organizations.

Most of the public face of politics looks like a Jerry Springer show (and is about as real as the Jerry Springer show was) because our politicians find it immensely profitable. Divisive policies (like gay marriage or abortion) and divisive nominations (like Alito) are pushed by both sides because they're very successful fund raising mechanisms, not for ideological reasons.

But frankly, I think we have to worry a lot more about the parts we don't see. The part of the iceberg above the water didn't sink the Titanic.

Re:Slipstreaming

[Meostro]

I've been working on this for a while, it's harder than it should be but it's certainly possible.

The place that helped the most was MSFN Unattended, the documentation there takes you through this kind of stuff step-by-step. They also have forums and driver packs that will help you install to almost any system you can imagine without needing extra driver disks, the BTS DriverPack is the greatest driver collection I've ever seen.

To make your life easier, nLite will automate a bunch of the steps you'll want to use, plus it can strip out a bunch of stuff that you don't want in your install anyway.

Re:Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

and divisive nominations (like Alito)

Huh? Towing a party line? You don't know what you're talking about.

Re:Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

Alito is divisive. Groups on both sides of the aisle have made a great deal of money from his nomination. This money was not the sole factor driving his nomination, but it absolutely was part of the decision.

I'm not what "party line" you think I'm towing (sic) by stating the obvious.

Google is your friend

[MeanMF]

http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie =UTF-8&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2005-09,GGLD:en&q=windows+ins tallation+cd+with+recent+updates

Re:Google is your friend

[Anonymous Coward]

Goddammit ask /. pisses me off. Half the question asked are answered with a three second google search. This is ask /., not ask-a-really-slow-and-troll-infested-version-of-go ogle.

Re:Google is your friend

[The NPS]

You can't search for slipstreaming if you've never heard of it. Things are only easy to find when you're a little familiar with them in the first place.

Re:Google is your friend

[Achromatic1978]

You did notice that the search terms he fed into Google didn't include 'slipstreaming', but only a couple of keywords the questioner asked in the article?

Re:Google is your friend

[AmiMoJo]

We are not allowed to slipstream for legal reasons. Basically we have to use the customers original Windows CD. Ask Microsoft.

Re:Google is your friend

[Anonymous Coward]

I don't think you know what you're talking about. I can't think of any case where that would be true.

Would you like to elaborate on your situation?

Re:Google is your friend

[Anonymous Coward]

Please don't visit stories in which you have no interest.

Re:Google is your friend

[AmiMoJo]

Sure. We repair computers for members of the public and companies which bring them to us. Microsoft told us, in no uncertain terms, that we MUST have the original CD to re-install from. Not ours, not an OEM disc, not a copy, but the original it was installed from. We argued this over because it makes things very hard for us, but it's the way Microsoft insist we do it. We were even fined for not sticking to their rules.

That's why, when someone gives me a PC with XP on disc, I have to install SP2 and then all the updates manually. Then I have to go hunt for drivers. Luckily we have a 6GB collection of drivers we can point a machine at, but even then...

Re:Google is your friend

[RandomJoe]

Interesting. Provided the customer brings in their original install discs, just so you can prove they had them, how would MS or anyone KNOW that you used your own slipstreamed copy of the same version OS? Is there actually something individually keyed on each of those (non-corporate) versions? I always figured they were just identical discs. Then you plug in the customer's own license key at the end...

Seems like as long as the customer shows up with a valid XP/2K/98/however-far-back-you-go CD, you'd be able to pull out your image of it and no one would be the wiser. Granted, it wouldn't have the brand-specific crap that gets loaded from the likes of Dell and Gateway, perhaps that's the issue.

When you say "not ours, not an OEM disc, not a copy" do you actually mean you can't restore a customer's computer from one of those stupid "image" discs the OEMs were providing for a while?!? I as a customer would have major issues with that, considering that's the only "original" disk they provided. (Well, _I_ wouldn't... I never even boot Windows on my own new machines, but you know... ;) Did they provide a rational explanation for this bit?

Re:Google is your friend

[The NPS]

I did, right after I posted. I was hoping no one else would! =P

Re:Google is your friend

[DeathFromSomewhere]

What kind of sysadmin hasn't heard of slipstreaming?

Re:Google is your friend

[Anonymous Coward]

A new one? (Or one that doesn't administer Windows systems?) /The captcha is "ducked"

Re:Google is your friend

[gd2shoe]

There ARE differences in the images, thought I refuse to believe that there are any sizable differences in the installed OS. A while back there were changes made to the windows activation process. OEM computers will not activate across the internet anymore. Now, Microsoft must be called by phone. I spoke to a customer service rep about this change. He might not have been the brightest bulb in the house, but he told me that the OEM disks could recognize something on the motherboard (chipset?) that identified the brand at start up. OEM computers do not need activation if the OEM disk is used. Likewise, an OEM disk from a major manufacturer cannot be used to install a retail CD key (or on a retail MB, most likely).

Shortly afterwards, MS started this whole "Windows Genuine Advantage" validation process at the begining of windows updates. If there was a noticeable difference between an OS installed from our disk (using the client's CD key), or client disk, I'm certain Microsoft would lock that system out.

Re:Google is your friend

[vivtho]

I don't know about other PC vendors, but I used to work for Dell.

The copy of Windows xp provided with Dell computers is keyed to work only with Dell computers. After install Windows XP checks if the BIOS belongs to a Dell computer (These are slightly modified Phoenix & Award BIOSes). If the BIOS contains a string identifying it as a Dell original, then Windows XP does not require activation. If WinXP was installed on a non-Dell BIOS, the installation proceeds as normal, but will require you to activate the product.

It's called Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

A lot of people just use it to update with SPs, but you can use it for regular updates and drivers, too. If you need help, you can use a utility like AutoPatcher or nLite to get you started.

Re:It's called Slipstreaming

[students]

I've used autopatcher with great success many times.

Re:It's called Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

You might want to try the current version of AutoPatcher: AutoPatcher XP January 2006

It would be nice if Microsoft would make it easy to script the install onto one CD (or DVD). It is a sort of a drag to have to rely on a third-party for what Microsoft could do easily if they didn't want to sell MSCE and other worthless degrees by making sure Windows is (or seems) much more complicated than it can (or should) be. Case in point: here's how Microsoft expects you to "integrate software updates into your Windows installation source files" (please, read the document before you comment on how nice they were to make it easy for us).

Re:It's called Slipstreaming

[AmiMoJo]

It's not legal for us to do so. The editors didn't point that out, even though I wrote it. See my other posts.

Re:It's called Slipstreaming

[baadger]

It would be nice if Microsoft would make it easy to script the install onto one CD (or DVD).

All hotfix installers released since XP-SP2 have had an /integrate switch to do just that.

Re:It's called Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

Too bad all the critical updates, not to mention optional but recommended updates, are not "hotfixes" and thus unable to be integrated. Also, as the link to Microsoft provided earlier shows, it is a non-trivial command line task. But this is supposed to be Windows? So much for the GUI. Welcome to the eighties!!

Re:It's called Slipstreaming

[baadger]

Too bad all the critical updates, not to mention optional but recommended updates, are not "hotfixes" and thus unable to be integrated.

All the critical security patches ARE hotfixes. Goto Add/Remove programs and check the little box to show windows updates if you don't believe me.

Optional extras like Windows Media Player, the .NET framework and IE7 betas cannot be (trivially) integrated, so you'll have to wait for SP3, in 2007, for those to be apart of a clean install process.

Yep

[mikepaktinat]

Two ways to make it easy I would think. One, use microfot's WSUS. Two, download the updates to a disc and read the documentation, you can create your own "slipped streamed" instalation media for reinstalling. I prefer the first option, use ghost to throw an image on a PC, let it sit for a day on the network, and if the GPO are configured properly, you can come in the moring to a completely updated computer.

Re:Yep

[matth]

Well that's great, but Windows 2000 needs service back 3+ before it will work with WSUS... so you have to install something.

Re:Yep

[forsetti]

"Let it sit for a day on the network". Heh -- I wish! Depending on the phase of the moon, we (large public University network) have seen TTC (time to compromise) as small as 15 minutes for an unpatched system. Those patches have to go on immediately!

Re:Yep

[Anonymous Coward]

not if you have an image of 2000 with SP3 installed
Or you slipstream SP3 into your install media

Re:Yep

[mikepaktinat]

We have a downstream WSUS server from our main WSUS server. It sits in a private network. The only thing on this network is Ghostcast, WSUS and new clients.

Re:Yep

[toadlife]

Clients need not have the firewall turned off to update themselves via a WSUS server, as the client intiates the connection. Slipstream an XPSP2 in your WindowsXP CD and the firewall will be on by default. In your default domain policy (or if you want to keep that clean, a seperate policy at the root of your domain), set the appropriate WSUS settings that will point the client to the WSUS server. When you join the PC to the domain it will get it's policy, and automagically update itself via WSUS - reboots and all. You might also need to set deadlines for all of the approved updates in WSUS so the computer updates itself right away.

If the computer is fairly new it should be able to update itself with all of the post-XPSP2 updates via WSUS in around 15-30 minutes with no interaction required.

Hmmm...

[BJH]

If only there were a way to search the Internet and find a particular page, perhaps by keyword...

You never know, you might find the answer to your question!

Re:Hmmm...

[AmiMoJo]

We are not allowed to slipstream for legal reasons. We have to use the customers original Windows CD. Ask Microsoft.

Re:Hmmm...

[Anonymous Coward]

Well, why didn't you say so in your submission to Aks Slashdot? Surely you could have predicted the large number of posters recommending slipstreaming.

Re:Hmmm...

[baadger]

Like Microsoft are going to know. I don't see any legitimate reason why Microsoft should have the right to say you can't meddle with a COPY of their product using official MS method to make your life easier. Screw 'em. You are not commiting piracy by doing so

Re:Hmmm...

[AmiMoJo]

Because the /. editors changed my submission.

Are the systems identical?

[eta526]

If all the hardware is the same, use Norton Ghost to create an image of the hard drive. Store this on an external drive or a network share and use this image on every computer. I did this for UMR (University of Missouri - Rolla) for the computer labs (over 900 computers), and it's really easy to pull down the old image, apply the new updates, and create a new "clean" image that can then be distributed to all the other systems.

We used BartPE or a bootable DOS disk (if the DOS network drivers were available) to boot the computer onto something besides the hard drive in order to create or restore an image.

If the hardware's different, you have to use Sysprep, but I haven't messed with that.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[ShyGuy91284]

That doesn't sound very legal. Even if you do have a license for each computer, as far as I know, there's no way to change the registration number of a Windows install once it's been installed and a ghost image has been made. Not to mention you then legally need a legit copy of Norton Ghost and everything else you might decide to include with it for every computer you install the image to. Although I have done zero research on the subject (Except that You'd need many licenses for Ghost), so this is all just assumption here.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[gEvil (beta)]

Welcome to the world of site licenses and concurrent use licenses.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Ash-Fox]

Actually there is no law stating that you can't use the same license key on every computer. Just that every computer has valid software licenses.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[eta526]

It is legal. Windows was volume licensed, meaning only one key for all the PCs on campus, and the software was either site licensed or only installed in the labs for which we had licenses. Ghost isn't installed everywhere, only on the bootable CDs, so the number of machines isn't an issue.

The procurement guy kept track of all the licenses (and actually read the EULAs as far as I can tell.) I'd have to go to him if I wasn't sure if we had enough licenses to satisfy a request, or if I thought there was a chance that what a professor or TA was requesting wasn't legal.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[toadlife]

"Even if you do have a license for each computer, as far as I know, there's no way to change the registration number of a Windows install once it's been installed and a ghost image has been made."

Got sysprep?

Re:Are the systems identical?

[RESPAWN]

If the hardware's different, you have to use Sysprep, but I haven't messed with that.

Actually, it's always a good idea to sysprep on XP since if you don't you'll end up with multiple computers on the network with the same SID. That really becomes a problem with AD since that's how it uniquely identifies all of the computers in the domain.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Anonymous Coward]

Doesn't volume licensing solve this problem, atleast as far as Windows licensing is concerned? I would imagine that Symantec or another company would also have some type of licensing that is geared towards businesses with that number of machines.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[RESPAWN]

That doesn't sound very legal. Even if you do have a license for each computer, as far as I know, there's no way to change the registration number of a Windows install once it's been installed and a ghost image has been made.

You've never heard of a volume license key (VLK) or of Microsoft's volume license program? The VLP version of XP (like the OEM versions) requires no online activation and uses different licence keys from the standard versions of XP. The CD-Key itself isn't your actual license to use Windows. It's merely one way of ensuring that the media was obtained legally. In the corporate world, you buy the VLP version of XP, and Microsoft emails you a CD key to use for all of your computers.

Also, changing the CD key is trivial. You just run Sysprep (found on the Windows CD) and in the course of running it, Sysprep will ask you for a CD key. This is the same software that you should be running on the PC before you make your Ghost image of it if you plan to join it to a domain.

Not to mention you then legally need a legit copy of Norton Ghost and everything else you might decide to include with it for every computer you install the image to. Although I have done zero research on the subject (Except that You'd need many licenses for Ghost), so this is all just assumption here.

I'm a little hazy on the legalities of this as well. The way it's always been explained to me is that you need a licnece of Ghost to create an image. Also, if you're running the full-on Windows client, you will of course need a license for that. However, I've always been told that when restoring an image to a PC, it is legally permitted to use the DOS version of Ghost without a licence for that PC. Now whether or not that's true, I'm not sure. I've never bothered to read the licence documentation, instead trusting the word of my higher ups.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[eta526]

Sassafras Keyserver is a good way to have a program installed on more systems than it is licensed for but only allow the licensed number to be run concurrently. I don't know details, but they can probably be found on the http://www.sassafras.com/ website.

From the site:
Regardless of the type of licenses you need to manage, when properly configured, K2 will always keep usage within legal limits. You can set it and forget it. K2 does the rest. You can predict future software demand and purchase only what your organization needs. You can even reclaim lost or abandoned software, and prevent the need to purchase replacement software.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[eta526]

I don't know the details, but the Desktop Infrastructure guys set up a nifty little perl script that would unjoin the computer from the domain, rename it based on a database entry (the same database the DNS servers use, I believe) and rejoin it to the domain. Like I said, I don't know details, but it worked great. I just ran the script before making the image and it would unjoin. The next time that computer or any created with its image booted up, it would remane itself and rejoin the domain. (It took 3 reboots to complete this, one after unjoining, one after renaming, and one after rejoining, but it still beats doing it manually on 7-55 computers at a time, depending on which lab.)

Re:Are the systems identical?

[RESPAWN]

That is pretty nifty. Is there any way I could get a copy of that script and take a look at it? I've taken over the responsibility of creating drive images for my office, and possibly even our sister offices. I've been trying to research a way to make it more automated, but so far I have been unable to come up with the right combination of search terms on google to find what I'm looking for.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[rikkards]

I'm a little hazy on the legalities of this as well. The way it's always been explained to me is that you need a licnece of Ghost to create an image. Also, if you're running the full-on Windows client, you will of course need a license for that. However, I've always been told that when restoring an image to a PC, it is legally permitted to use the DOS version of Ghost without a licence for that PC. Now whether or not that's true, I'm not sure. I've never bothered to read the licence documentation, instead trusting the word of my higher ups.

Nope you need to have a Ghost license for every single workstation that will have a Ghost image applied to it. I was involved in an update for a site of approx 17000 users and they mentioned that they would have to buy new licenses for all the machines if they decided to Ghost. They started investigating RIP from MS which comes free.

Sysprep is your friend you can get the machine to do practically everything including join to a domain (use an account that only has permissions to join a domain so that you don't divulge a key account) as well as creating generic images. I had an image that would work on over 8 different desktops and about 6 laptops.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[ShyGuy91284]

Ah, I see. Sorry for doubting you. I wasn't sure if MS did site licenses using a single key. But it is illegal to use Ghost to apply an image to multiple computers, even if it does only exist on the main computer (Not that they could tell anyways since ghost doesn't leave a "This partition was created by ghost" that i know of). I checked the EULA because I was curious, and 10.v states "You may not use the Software commercially or non-commercially for the purpose of creating multiple computers or hard drives, except for multiple hard drives installed in or attached directly to the original computer." But my bad on the MS software.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[rikkards]

Sysprep is still better. You can do everything needed plus Sysprep resets all the hardware settings so that you can use the image on varying hardware platforms (different NICs, sound cards Video Cards, chipsets). Look up the OEMPNPDriverPath entry.
You can pretty much get it to the point that someone just puts in the workstation Name and that's it, everything else has been automated. You can even automate the naming to a certain degree.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[eta526]

Actually, we're clean on Ghost too, AFAIK. They're using 8 and 9 IIRC, so the license you read doesn't necessarily apply. I haven't read the license, but like I mentioned, the Procurement guy does so far as I can tell. I'm sure they'd have bought a site license if that was necessary. I don't know the exact terms, but as careful as they are about everything else, I sincerely doubt that something on that order could have slipped through the cracks.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[hazem]

You can use linux tools as well to accomplish this.

at a very raw level, using dd and gzip to make images of the harddisks.

Another pretty good tool is partimage. I use this myself. You can put images on another drive, or even over a network (I prefer to use NFS, but you can set up a partimage server elsewhere).

It can cause problems if the hardware in not identical. But, I think there is a windows tool called sysprep that helps the image know that it needs to re-search for hardware when it boots up again.

If your partition/disk sizes are different, then make hte partition as small as your smallest disk, and then use ntfsresize in linux to expand the partition back out to the full size of the disk.

This is so much better than re-installing everything every time because you can also install all your software and set things up "just so".

Re:Are the systems identical?

[BlueStrat]

Actually, we're clean on Ghost too, AFAIK. They're using 8 and 9 IIRC, so the license you read doesn't necessarily apply. I haven't read the license, but like I mentioned, the Procurement guy does so far as I can tell. I'm sure they'd have bought a site license if that was necessary. I don't know the exact terms, but as careful as they are about everything else, I sincerely doubt that something on that order could have slipped through the cracks.

You might check out Ghost for Linux (G4L). http://sourceforge.net/projects/g4l

Assuming it will do what's needed, if your shop hasn't yet taken advantage of any OSS software, this might be a good candidate to get the camels' nose under the tent.

Strat

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Anonymous Coward]

Why not use dd for imaging?

(Note: i'm asking, I've never used it in making an image for a windows system!)

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Anonymous Coward]

I just went through this on a smaller scale and discovered that the combination of RIP Linux (PXE booted of course) and the very excellent ntfsclone makes short work of it. The only thing that isn't handled automatically is creating a properly sized partition on the disk, if someone would put a little wrapper around ntfsclone (I know about partimage, but ntfsclone is way better than the limited ntfs support in partimage) to handle partitioning it would be very possible to make a completely scripted PXE based windows image deployer with free software. The ghost licensing demands are pretty sad considering how close a completely free solution is.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[dotgain]

Actually, it's always a good idea to sysprep on XP since if you don't you'll end up with multiple computers on the network with the same SID.

Wow, I never realised that. Obviously, neither did Microsoft. Not a week goes by you don't learn yet another staggering stupid thing that a Microsoft OS does.

Who'da thunk it? Organisations out there with two or more completely identical machines.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Anonymous Coward]

There's a freakin KB article on how to change the windows key (in short: using system32/oobe/msoobe.exe, possibly requiring a registry edit). Works without any problems.

btw, is there any way of knowing if ghost was used on a hard drive? I mean, it was never installed on the drive, and I doubt the software leaves any traces while restoring an image.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[baadger]

Even if you do have a license for each computer, as far as I know, there's no way to change the registration number of a Windows install once it's been installed and a ghost image has been made

I think that is one of the important roles sysprep plays. It essentially tells Windows to restart the user, license and hardware customisation phase again on the next boot. This is how OEM's ship XP PC's (but of course they use SLP bios-locked installations, not Activation)

Re:Are the systems identical?

[tyldis]

I think you mean RIS, not RIP.
Anyways, Ghost and RIS have their strong sides and weaknesses:
  - Ghost can do multicast, but is bad a lot of work when your hardware isn't 100%
  - RIS can't do multicast, but is a breeze when you have mixed hardware
Without multicast RIS is hopeless if you need to retank a whole computer lab, but for the odd install it's perfect and cheap.

I need the multicast function, but also need more flexibility on the images. My next step is to investigate Altiris.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[level_headed_midwest]

We do the same thing here at UM-Columbia, except the computers are netbooted with PXE and then the OS and all apps are installed from one cluster of servers.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[RobertLTux]

actually the first thing Ghost does (on a virgin drive) is drop a "safe for Ghost" marker on the drive so you can tell

Re:Are the systems identical?

[zerocool^]

Keep in mind also, with regards to licensing issues - the origional poster said he worked in a University. Pretty much every major university has a volume license for the entire MSDN Academic Alliance library. I know we do. Not to mention, we end up with volume licenses, or site-wide licenses, for a lot of software, like Mathematica, Matlab, Autocad, etc.

We've used Norton Ghost to clone the labs before. I think we may have a license for it. This year, however, we used G4U (Ghost4Unix), a free implementation. There are two things it lacks that Norton has. One, Norton Ghost is Multicast. Two, Norton understood filesystems and individual files, and therefore, you could create an image on a 40GB drive and ghost it onto a 20Gb drive if it had less than 20GB worth of stuff.

However, G4U, while it doesn't understand files or filesystems, is more versatile in that the OS's and Filesystems it "supports" are "all of them". It uses gzip on the image, so if you do a bit of dd if=/dev/zero of=/bunchofzeros and let it run for an hour or so, you'll have a compressable image. Also Norton tends to choke on the grub bootloader (no idea why).

~Will

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Shawn is an Asshole]

With dd if you have a 80 hd, you now have an 80 gig image. Gzip or bzip2 might take it down some, but it will still be insanely large.

If you insist on using cloning (imho, bad idea) you can use the free ntfsclone, which is part of the Linux NTFS project. With gzip it will get down to about a gig.

Whenever I have to reinstall someone's Windows system, the first thing I do after activating it and applying all Windows updates is to make a clone with ntfsclone. I then build a Linux-based restore dvd for them so they (and I) won't have to deal with activation the next time.

If you're looking to install more than one computer, though, reconsider using imaging. Spend a weekend learning how to use Unattended, AutoIt, and secedit/a After using this for a little, you're just cringe when someone suggests imaging.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[petermgreen]

btw rather than using filesystem specific imaging software a simple way to get the image size down is to create a file of zeros that fills all free space on the drive and delete it before taking the image.

runs of zeros compress incrediblly well ;)

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Apathetic1]

You can use a program called Ghostwalker that comes with Ghost Corporate 2003 to change a computer's SID after the disk image is loaded.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[warpSpeed]

Assuming it will do what's needed, if your shop hasn't yet taken advantage of any OSS software, this might be a good candidate to get the camels' nose under the tent.

Try G4L first, then move to Perl later, you don't want to scare the rest of the shop off right away with $perl->["leet language"] = true;.

Re:Are the systems identical?

[Anonymous Coward]

You don't need their script. Look up the help for the netdom command. Actually go to the GUI and find the command line help. DO NOT go to a command prompt and type Netdom /? - that information can be incomplete. Anyway, the netdom command will do what you need. It is likely that is what they are using.

By the way, NEVER image a machine AFTER it has joined a domain. ALWAYS image it BEFORE joining a domain. You don't have to worry about SIDs then. Even so, the duplicate SID issue only really matters in a high-security environment.

MSFN's Unattended Windows Install CD

[UnderScan]

Its not that hard to use google. Do you realy want it that bad but are unwilling to search for it?
MSFN's Unattended Windows : Introduction

Have you ever wanted a Windows CD that would install Windows by automatically putting in your name, product key, timezone and regional settings? And have it merged with the latest Service Pack to save time? Followed by silently installing all your favourite applications along with DirectX 9.0c, .Net Framework 1.1 and then all the required hotfixes, updated drivers, registry tweaks, and a readily patched UXTheme.dll without any user interaction whatsoever? Then this guide will show you how you can do just that! Through the course of this guide, you will create a CD that does all the installing for you. The CD will be fully updated with the latest hotfixes, and install all your programs for you.

Re:MSFN's Unattended Windows Install CD

[Gothmolly]

Great... and then you're stuck with the .NET Framework^WDRM^Wspyware^Wkludgeware on your system.

Re:MSFN's Unattended Windows Install CD

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

"Its not that hard to use google. Do you realy want it that bad but are unwilling to search for it?"

It's perfectly reasonable to want to hear the opinions of others that have gone through it. No need to be an asshole.

Re:MSFN's Unattended Windows Install CD

[Anonymous Coward]

Good point. Besides, when I google for something, often I find my question followed by responses like "why don't you google for it?"

Norton Ghost

[Anonymous Coward]

Contrary to the slew of slipstreaming google links, application links (nlite for example), Norton Ghost is a wondeful application. But if you don't feel like spending money or scouring torrent sites, go with slipstreaming nlite.

Re:Norton Ghost

[SanityInAnarchy]

If Norton Ghost would work, so would a Linux boot CD, probably more flexibly, too. Unless Norton Ghost has a way to get around the indigestion Windows gets when you change the IDE chipset out from under it.

Slipstream and SMS

[Centurix]

If you manage a lot of desktops, Microsoft's System Management Server (SMS) is a good way to go. You get used to writing scripts for it after a while.

I'm pretty sure SMS is still an up to date product from Microsoft, unless they've developed something else in the last couple of years...

Re:Slipstream and SMS

[pilybaby]

There's SMS 2003 available from here

Re:Slipstream and SMS

[MooseTick]

true, true

Not just for servicepacks I might add

[toadlife]

Most of the pages you will get when you google "slipstreaming" will talk about slipstreaming service packs, but you can also slipstream individual hotfixes into windows installations. Also not that Microsoft makes avaiable for download ISO Images containing every windows critical and security update. If you really want to make a slimpstreamed install of Windows with every single hotfix possible, this will save you time searching and download the iduvidual updates.

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[gEvil (beta)]

Thanks for the link. Are the ISO images a recent thing, or have they been doing it for a while? I ask because it looks like the one available on the linked page only includes the updates released in January. You still need to get all the other updates released in the year+ between SP2 and January.

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[toadlife]

They just started doing the ISO thing. Long overdue I say.

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[Anonymous Coward]

There is a section of the Windows Update site called 'Windows Update Catalog' (http://v4.windowsupdate.microsoft.com/catalog/en/ default.asp). It provides an easy way to download all the hotfixes for a selected Windows version and language. Very nice :).

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[Anonymous Coward]

Ahhh, nonsense! Don't you understand, Microsoft doesn't want it to be easy to install the latest version of Windows (+updates) for any user! This also makes it dificult to re-install Windows when (as it inevitably does) break!

Let's look:
1. initial XP Windows install + all updates (remember SP2 itself is 272M!) is >> 1 CD
2. How would they get a chance to run their "Windows Genuine (dis)Advantage" check?
3. How would they get a chance to force IE down your throat? For instance, another post at this same level reports:
There is a section of the Windows Update site called 'Windows Update Catalog' (http://v4.windowsupdate.microsoft.com/catalog/en/ default.asp [microsoft.com]). It provides an easy way to download all the hotfixes for a selected Windows version and language. Very nice :).
Trying it in Mozilla gives:
Thank you for your interest in obtaining updates from our site.
To use this site, you must be running Microsoft Internet Explorer 5 or later.
To upgrade to the latest version of the browser, go to the Internet Explorer Downloads website.

Whenever it comes to customer convenience or Microsoft dominance, who wins?

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[AmiMoJo]

Thanks, this is probably the most useful suggestion. As I mentioned elsewhere, we download around 1GB/day of updates for customers machines we are repairing. 650MB/month is a lot better, and at least it's legal for us, unlike slipstreaming.

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[Anonymous Coward]

BTW: Try to install an original NT4, and then upgrade IE: nearly impossible, because the included version of IE can't be used to visit the IE update page.

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[flarn]

SP2 can fit on a cd with Windows, I know such a copy. If nothing else you can sign up for classes at a college/uni that has a MSDNAA membership and get yourself free copies of most MS software. flarn

Re:Not just for servicepacks I might add

[Anonymous Coward]

Site fails with Mozilla Firefox 1.5.

GIYF

[vonsneerderhooten]

This and this should get you started.

The essence of what you're looking for here is an unattended windows * install with hotfixes and updates streamlined. You can even go a bit further and build in additional drivers and software(JRE or AV, anyone?). In my experience as a tech, XP is the OS I find myself reload most often. One can also do unattended reloads of W98/ME/2k as well. All involve similar google searches.

Pretty much sums it up...

[the_flyswatter]

This is pretty much what you asked for: http://www.vorck.com/hfslip.html/

From the site:

This process details how to create a CDROM of Windows XP or 2003 that slipstreams a Service Pack and the post-SP patches...

Re:Pretty much sums it up...

[TAiNiUM]

HFSLIP is highly recommended. It is a windows batch file so everything it does is transparent and it can be considered an open solution. It supports 2k/XP/2003.

The batch file calls standard windows programs in order to integrate hotfixes, codecs, drivers, and lots of other neat stuff into a fresh ISO (automatically). Really quite easy, and the support is excellent.

The community is here: http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?s=828e7ef495f9 325af8454bbbb194f79f&showforum=129

And a full description is here: http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?showtopic=5765 9

Use something like Acronis

[Pugslyyy]

Even if you could get a clean (totally up to date) install of Windows, you still need to install all those other apps... I've found it so much easier to just image a base system I like with Acronis and then restore that image onto the new system. If I'm a little behind on Windows updates, it will catch up that first night when it runs update automatically at 3am.

Re:Use something like Acronis

[slaker]

So it doesn't bother you to have lots of PCs on your network with identical SIDs?

If you're taking the step of imaging, use Sysprep (google it) to make each install clean and unique, or at the very least find a copy of GHSTWALK.exe to run after the fact.

Re:Use something like Acronis

[direwolfwr]

So it doesn't bother you to have lots of PCs on your network with identical SIDs?

If it's a domain based environment, having duplicate SID's shouldn't be a problem at all (since the domain-SID is used). Duplicate SID's are only a problem in a workgroup environment (where the local SID is used), in which case s/he could use Ghostwalker, PowerQuest SID changer, Altiris deployment solution or Sysinternal's newSID.

Re:Ever hear of Terminal Server?

[Ash-Fox]

You need to clean your shift key more.

Nlite

[October]

Nlite is a great tool designed exactly for this. I've used it for several installs, and have created a CD that will install XPSP2 with hotfixes and all my drivers, and none of the extra crap that gets installed by default. It starts up in my LCD's native res, includes all my critical apps (firefox, etc.) right on the CD, and is completely unattended.

Re:Nlite

[rhandir]

I've used nlite. It is free as in beer, and worked well for me.

Three good things the previous poster didn't mention:
1. Nlite is menu driven. You can configure almost every aspect of the install, including which services are set to run manual or automatic. No funny stuff with regedit, no hexediting etc.

2. You can bypass the check for adequate memory/hd space to install xp on systems that shouldn't be able to run it.

3. If you are comfortable editing install exe's (or trust other people's edits) you can slipstream in applications. (Though you'll need to have the cd keys on hand when the system first starts up.)

Con:
Nlite uses .NET ver 2.

Re:Nlite

[Anonymous Coward]

I love nLite. I use it all the time to produce updated versions of my XP installation CD that I use for clients.

I do a lot of PC repair, and I keep copies of XP home & Pro with the latest hotfixes, etc. All I need to do is enter the customers cd-key when it asks for it, otherwise I sit back and relax. :-)

Re:NLite

[Nameles]

Works on 2000 (Advanced and servers too)

Re:Nlite

[sheldon]

NLite saved me last week. I was trying to install XP on my machine after having replaced the motherboard. I had configured my two SATA drives in a RAID configuration using the built in Intel RAID controller. This required me to use the RAID driver during the install of XP(The F6-Additional Drivers prompt), but this being a modern computer I had decided to not install a floppy drive.

So I went to my laptop, took NLite and extracted my XP w/SP2 CD, added the additional drivers, and then created an ISO image with the new super CD.

Worked like a charm. I liked NLite in that it handled all the editing of config files, whatever for me. Saved a lot of time and effort.

RyanVM's update pack

[Mitchell Mebane]

As others have mentioned, it is fairly easy to slipstream SP2 into an XP CD. But if you want to integrate the more recent updates, there's really only one option. RyanVM's Windows XP Post-SP2 Update Pack does exactly what you want and works like a charm. There are even third-party addon packs which let you add other interesting things to your XP install CD.

Re:RyanVM's update pack

[Aarondeep]

mod parent up, this site is great and is updated with recent paks so you can keep up with all the hotfixes. I find slipstreaming acrobat reader and the .NET framwork paks saves alot of time

Flamebait?

[Anonymous Coward]

Okay, maybe off topic, but come on! If the parent had been asking for advice regarding updating Linux and a Microsoft advocate had told him to switch to Windows instead, would that have been regarded as flamebait? A troll without a doubt, but not flamebait.

Yeesh. What an intolerant place ./ is these days!

This Worked Very well

[MrShaggy]

This Website was very well done. It explains how to make a bootcd, and how to get the ServicePack in as well. Very quick and easy. As long as you follow a few steps. This will work for Win2k.xp..prolly 2003 as well. Hope it helps. This also works for BIOS updates et al.

mnb Re:Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

Why would you need to slipstream a few times a month?
Microsoft only releases patches the second Tuesday of the month.

Re:mnb Re:Slipstreaming

[Anonymous Coward]

No, they don't. They release whenever they want to. It just so happens that they will often release a bunch on the second Tuesday of the month. But this is by no means certainly the case. Take for instance this month. Updates have been coming out one day, the next day, a couple days later, a week after that. So, no.

It is a drag that MS doesn't make this easier for their customers. I just did an install at work earlier tonight and at least three restarts and a bunch of clicking (at various times) to do the Windows Updates. And don't get me started about Microsoft Update not showing the SP2 Update for Office (the Office Update website does show it). Kind of negates the point of it, doncha think?

Re:Ever hear of Terminal Server?

[colinrichardday]

If you're that upset by being negatively modded, then don't post on slashdot.

You don't

[55555 Manbabies!]

You don't waste time installing the patches, you let WSUS do the work once you hook the computer on your domain.

You can also slipstream hotfixes and apps

[hillct]

While slipstreaming service packs is a common practice, you can also slipstream hotfixes. Hack when I was in IT support we used this great script to automate the process. Some of the other links I still had bookmarked may be of value to people who not only want to slipstream service packs/hotfixes but also build an unattended installation CD. In our case we installed all the apps common to our PC images (except for office) from one CD. We threw the CD in, booted from it and came back 2 1/2 hours later to find a fully installed desktop with all our standard apps. This method is superior to using Ghost or other imaging software when you have a heterogenius enviroment where PC hardware varies drastically from depertment to department or desktop to desktop.

http://www.nu2.nu/bootablecd/
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/ie/ie ak/default.mspx
http://unattended.msfn.org/unattended.xp/
http://www.appdeploy.com/packages/

This last link related to a commercial software distribution enviroment but but it includes an archive of the known switches accepted by various installers to make them silent. The technique we used was to use the unattended.txt file to add a RunOnce registry entry, to regedit (to marge a secondary gegistry file containing other RunOnce entries) to be executed on the second reboot to silently install our list of apps, where the installer commands used included the switches detailed on the appDeploy website (and many other palces across the web).

There are a relatively small number of installers out there that take a relitively well known set of switches to make the installation silent (accepting all the defaults). These methods saves us thousands of man-hours in PC deployment in the two years they was in use.

--CTH

NLite

[Timeburn]

For those with never enough time to be as nitpicky as they'd like:

Nlite is a wizard which will prep custom XP or 2003 install discs for you. It will slipstream service packs and hotfixes in, add drivers (including storage or net drivers for the initial installer), remove drivers and services, allows you to setup unattended install, plus has tons of other tweaks and adjustments. You can then install directly from the modified install folder, or have Nlite prep an ISO and burn a bootable CD.

I recently used it to strip XP down to run in under 64MB RAM on an older laptop. Runs like a charm, and needed no updates when installed.

Also perfect for preparing an initial install image for use with RIS and sysprep.

Of course, you still have to find and download the hotfixes, but I think some of the other posts in this discussion have pretty well covered that part.

A little google...

[Anonymous Coward]

installing windows iso with critical updates. Wow, that first link looks pretty useful.

A step down

[Lacit]

So when did Slashdot become tech support?

These types of questions can be answered using a quick search in Google...

unattendend.msfn.org

[duffbeer703]

This project describes how to do what you are talking about.

If you use ghost images, just setup a baseline PC that uses automatic updates or WSUS. Everytime updates are released, run sysprep and ghost the machine.

I pity those serviced by this computer technician

[juventasone]

Any "computer technician" who doesn't know about slipstreaming or any of Microsoft's other Windows deployment methods probably isn't any more qualified than a random computer enthusiast. As its been posted here, there are also several other third party alternatives found with a simply phrased google search. Additionally, if you know what you're doing, you shouldn't have to be re-installing Windows on a regular basis. The more knowledge and experience you have, the more you'll be able to fix the problem, rather than dicking around or giving up and re-installing.

Re:Ever hear of Terminal Server?

[Anonymous Coward]

FYI - not all applications work properly under wine or Crossover - here are just a few examples direct from the WINE application database: http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?versionId=2023 http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?versionId=3688 http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?versionId=757 http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?versionId=3678 http://appdb.winehq.org/appview.php?versionId=725

Google is your friend

[HardCase]

Fingers broken? Why not Google the answer instead of subjecting yourself to ridicule on Slashdot?

The ISO files don't help you at all.

[Futurepower(R)]

My understanding is that the ISO files don't help you at all. They are huge because they include all languages. Each ISO file includes only the critical updates for ONE month. I know of no way to integrate them into a single CD image containing Windows XP SP2 and all the critical updates.

It is possible to download all the separate critical updates, and run them from a batch file. But that's a hassle; Microsoft does not make that easy. This is another way that Microsoft is adversarial towards customers; they waste the time of some of the best-educated people in the world.

Re:The ISO files don't help you at all.

[toadlife]

Oh I didn't know that they were only for the current month. I guess that makes sense, since ALL of the updates would certainly take more than one CD.

You could allways just install WSUS on a machine and have it download all of the updates for whatever OS you want.

Re:The ISO files don't help you at all.

[Anonymous Coward]

Windows adminstrators are "some of the best-educated people in the world"? Ha! I know this is slashdot, but good lord, that's one of the most ridiuclous things I've ever heard.

Oh, right. IHBT.

Re:The ISO files don't help you at all.

[soupman]

WSUS is quite useful! I've been using for several months already. Once a computer connects to the domain, the updates install automatically or with a notification.

Re:Ever hear of Terminal Server?

[mnmn]

Doesnt work too well for all apps, and youre keeping all your eggs in one basket there. Performance becomes an issue fast. Not to mention upgrading or restoring from backups becomes impossible without disrupting everyone's desktops settings and other files.

Solutions like yours exist already. There are terminal client versions of XP and other companies including sun were selling real cheap graphic terminal thin clients a while ago. Not a smashing success.

And yelling and screaming on slashdot doesnt convince anyone at all.

Images

[gruhnj]

As has been pointed out earlier in this story, the best you can do is http://unattended.msfn.org/

Having said that, if you are doing this often enough why do you not have an image? Imaging spares you this work and you also get all of your applications as well. Your more likey to mess something up the more manual rebuilds you do, especially if you have a non trivial configuration. Better yet, with a little work with sysprep you can add drivers for multiple models. Bâshrat the Sneaky's DriverPacks works for most hardware and takes minimal effort. I currently use the same image for about 15 different models of laptops. Having one image for all of my on site hardware makes updates a snap.

SGT Gruhn
BCT1, 101 ABN DIV(AASLT)

Re:Images

[vexx0]

Yah but how does M$ feel about using your own disks on peoples computer's in a shop. If I'm correct they want you to use their original disc and not your own.

Re:I pity those serviced by this computer technici

[gooman]

Well, every technician starts somewhere, don't be such a curmudgeon. While I agree that slipstream is a valuable (and basic) skill for any tech nowadays, I'm surprised at how many I've met that have never done it or knew it could be done!
That said, I've picked up a couple of links in this thread that were new to me. I was satisfied with the MS tools and method (they did the job) but now I'm interested in trying out some new tools.

You learn by doing. You learn by asking. Just don't stop learning.

Autopatcher

[Lord Kano]

I'm sure that there is a more elegant solution, but I use Autopatcher, when I need to bring a system up to date.

Slipstream SP2 into an install CD. When it's installed copy over and run Autopatcher.

If I had to do it more often, I'd probably look into a better way but the 4-5 times a year that I need to install XP doesn't make it worthwhile.

LK

Re:autopatcher

[AmiMoJo]

Autopatcher has one major issue: it needs to be installed. Why can't it just do the damn updates from a CD without me having to install it... but it's still quite close to being good.

Oh, and if I'm nit picking, it's not exactly unatteneded: there is still a lot you have to do to make it work, just about as much as you have to do to use Windows Update.

Re:autopatcher

[XO]

hmm. It's been awhile since my first installation of it, but I ran it, hit start, and rebooted a couple times quite some time later.

  I guess I missed the "unattended" requirement. But, I think it totally rocks, especially for those who refuse to let Windows phone home :D

Re:Ever hear of Terminal Server?

[Anonymous Coward]

• PARENT IS A TROLL
• PARENT IS A FLAIM[SIC].
• PARENT IS *NOT* THE TRUTH.

Linux is not the only way to do things. Windows performs just as well - and in fact much better then linux does when it comes to running windows apps.

funny enough Windows Server & desktop runs Windows Apps easier than trying to run them on linux (go figure)

. Get a life and learn to be less bigoted and learn a variety of platforms.

Just ghost it if it's the same computer...

[rob1980]

The amount of time you spend tracking down and integrating every security fix will far exceed the amount of time it takes to run Windows Update 3 times. Not to mention the fact your super duper Windows disk will be out of date by the next month anyway.

unattended.sourceforge.net

[matithyahu]

For a completely different, Free Software suggestion,
try unattended at http://unattended.sourceforge.net/ Haven't used this at work but uses a Linux or windows server, a boot disk and you write the Perl scripts. Seems like a neat project, installs programs and does all the rebooting for you.

The university I work at recieves them from Dell with images, apps included we just do the 3 or so non-critical fixes since the image was sent to Dell.

Use IE for this site

[mnmn]

Site fails with Opera.

Re:Use IE for this site

[Anonymous Coward]

Since when has ANY Windows Update site worked properly with Opera? Stop being so pointlessly anal - if only to save *my* sanity...

Use VMPlayer and a WinXP VM with all the updates

[frenchrh]

Just do a virtual machine of windows XP which has the latest updates and other software installed, ( and follow the licensing issues) and then make a snapshot or a clone. This simple directory structure can be booted as a VM (virtual machine) on any Intel/AMD system, under either simple windoes or better yet, simple Linux install. this way also you can "reload" your users to the initial snapshot, and therefore a fresh but up todate Winxp install, without all the windows bureaucratic overhead. so it they keep their files on network stores for example, then they can reset the snapshot on a dialy basis and avoid Windows normal decay/corruption processes. And VMPlayer is free, as is a decent Linux, like Open SuSE.

hfnetchkpro

[Kris_J]

Google for hfnetchk, hfnetchkpro, shavlick or shavlik. Sorry I'm not on a real PC to make looking that up for you easier.

Re:Terminal Server?

[dotgain]

Install Cross-Over Office or WINE if you need to and your Windows applications work..
No more issues. Yeah, sure looks like you've tried it...

A solution for recovery CDs

[Anonymous Coward]

To add another question, how do you do this without installation CDs but with recovery CDs instead? Mine at least don't allow for slipstreaming

Re:A solution for recovery CDs

[AmiMoJo]

You are SOL. You don't have a "full" copy of Windows, just a restore disc. You can't even legally borrow a friends disc to do it.

Disk images with Linux instead of Norton Ghost

[rduke15]

For identical hardware, the best solution is disk imaging. This will also get you all the software installs and configurations, which is much more work than the basic Windows install + updates.

If you don't have Norton Ghost and/or don't want to pay for it, you can use a Linux Live CD and ntfsclone. I use a script on a USB drive based on these disk imaging instructions.

For different hardware, the slipstreamed install disks suggested in previous comments seem to be a good starting point.

Why we can't slipstream

[AmiMoJo]

Just spotted that /. posted my question, yay!

We can't use slipstreamed CDs. Microsoft says that it violated the terms of the licence agreement. To reinstall, we need the customers original CD and COA sticker. If they only have a restore CD which doesn't work, they are SOL and need to buy a new copy of Windows.

We have already been fined over this. We phoned up the Dixons group tech support line to see what they said, and they told us we should "borrow a friends CD". Luckily, we taped the conversation and sent a copy to Microsoft. Well, if we are gonna get screwed, at least everyone should be on a level playing field.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[AmiMoJo]

Just like to also say that it would be nice if /. editors would warn submitters of questions a day before posting, so that they can be there when the article hits and can respond to the comments. Loads of people have suggested slipstreaming, which as I say we cannot do. Yes, Microsoft told us in no uncertain terms "you must have the original CD and COA, then download any updates manually." That's why we pull a gig of updates (including service packs) a day from microsoft.com.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[Zephiria]

Well Okay, for customers using "custom" windows like say dell or Compaq then yes, their SOL but for other normal people I fail to see how MS would A know that your using a slipstreamed disk, and B how they could even tell you not to since its what they themselves tell their techs to do.
And I've yet to hear the MSDN people get bad letters from MS about their extensive guides to installing windows via slipstreamed disks :P

That said if you look up theirs a guy suggesting you get the ISO of the latest updates since sp2, so I would suggest going and getting that, then running if after installing windows but before running auto update at the very least it saves bandwidth and some time.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[AmiMoJo]

Microsoft like to "audit" small shops. Basically, if you don't like it, they don't give you the tools you need to do your job, or ask Trading Standards to take a look.

They also seem to be able to tell if you are not using your original install disk. I think maybe it has something to do with the licence codes. If you take a Compaq machine with a restore CD and install a fresh Windows from an OEM CD, it won't activate over the net. You have to call them. They ask you lots of questions, and then validate it anyway. But somehow they seem to know it was a Compaq copy of Windows (they as the machines brand to make sure the COA sticker wasn't transfered).

Technically, if you have a restore disc or OEM Windows and your mobo dies, you are supposed to buy a new copy of Windows.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[thenetbox]

If the customer does not have an installation disk then yes it is too bad and you can't use a slipstreamed CD and they will need to buy Windows XP (and after that use the slipstreamed CD). If the person does have the original CD then go ahead and use a slipstreamed CD.

Were you guys fined because you were installing Windows XP on computers of owners who never bought Windows XP? then it is not surprising at all that you were fined.

I have never read any where that using a slipstreamed CD is illegal as long as the person has bought the software. If you know of such documentation that clearly says that using slipstreamed CDs is illegal then please let me know.

In other cases, if you use a restore CD to restore a Windows machine then you could probably setup an updates server which you could use to push updates to the machines. Search google for "WSUS server"... Once that is set up then you can hook up all the configured machines to the network with the server and make it push all the updates to them. I believe that the cost effectiveness of this solution depends greatly on the number of computers you need to update... and it would still take a lot of time and you would still be downloading the updates but this time you'll be getting them from a local server.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[thenetbox]

Sorry.. I just reread your question and I see why my reply isn't too helpful. I was confused because of Mojos addtion to your question where he says "Is there a way to build a Windows installation CD that includes the most recent set of updates?" -- that is slipstreaming but your question is asking something different.

In that case... I don't know how windows could be activated using a script. sorry :O

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[thenetbox]

I mean Cliffs addition..

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[Anonymous Coward]

We can't use slipstreamed CDs. Microsoft says that it violated the terms of the licence agreement.

As a field consultant who is tasked nearly every day to solve some Windows problem or other, my reasoned and professional response to that is this:

Oh, fuck those assholes. If I have to fix and support their shitty software, I'm doing it by any means I can find to minimize time and hassle. I'll wipe my ass with their fucking license agreement and send it to Ballmer via Certified Mail.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[AmiMoJo]

No, we were fined for using either own own original Windows CDs or CD-R copies. We used copies so we could slipstream, and so the originals didn't get trashed. On average, a CD-R lasts about a month before being killed by dodgy CD-ROM drives.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[AmiMoJo]

Okay, my copy is in the mail, but they still fined us. At the end of the day, they can close us down. Revoke all our licences and refuse to sell us any more. Ask Trading Standards to invesitate us for fraud. Make our job impossible.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[AmiMoJo]

Okay, well thanks anyway. BTW, the editors edited my submission, and that last line they added is very misleading.

If they hadn't mentioned that, maybe my question would have been answered, instead of loads of useless comments about slipstreaming.

I suppose I should blame myself for trying to ask a sensible question on Slashdot. Is it me, or is this place being dumbed down to an idiots guide these days?

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[SanityInAnarchy]

... The problem I have with WSUS is, it's a HUGE amount of additional effort for you, because Microsoft refuses to let you do something which should be perfectly legal. If they're going to force you to click through updates, I say you not only pull them straight from the Microsoft servers, but pull them five or six times. If they're going to make you waste time, you can make them waste bandwidth.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[Karma Farmer]

Technically, if you have a restore disc or OEM Windows and your mobo dies, you are supposed to buy a new copy of Windows.

If your customer has purchased a non-transferable copy of Windows, they can't transfer it to a new computer. That's the license, and the customer agreed to it when they bought the software (or clicked on the EULA). Microsoft bears some responsibility for not making the licensing terms clear to their customers, and for leaving it up to you to explain to them. But ultimately your customers have to be responsible for knowing what they own.

And if you start swapping out parts on a machine, at some point Microsoft must draw the line and say "this is no longer the same machine." Fortunately, the line isn't crossed by swapping the monitor, the keyboard, the mouse, the CD-ROM drive, the case, the power supply, the memory, the extra hard drives, the sound card, etc. It may be crossed if you swap the CPU, the motherboard, the Ethernet card, or the boot drive, at Microsoft's discretion. It sounds like they've allowed you to cross the line several times, but abused the situation and they've cracked down on you.

I can offer sympathy, but I can't offer any advice.

(Frankly, I'm not fond of the idea of non-transferable software, and I'd be very surprised if it help up in court in every US State or foreign country. But that rant does nothing to help solve your current situation, and it does nothing to help your customers. If your customers have a licensing dispute with Microsoft, and wish to find an advocate for their cause, I would suggest that they hire a lawyer, and not ask their local small computer repair shop for legal advice.)

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[Bert64]

That's what happens when your business depends on a single vendor, microsoft screw you over but you still need them... so they can do it again whenever it suits them.
I'd suggest you do everything in your power to promote non microsoft alternatives to your customers, if people think linux is too hard to use then you can make more money supporting it.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[BRTB]

Gotta love Microsoft and their insanely odd policies. Here's another one... at work, we have one of the site license agreements that allows employees to install a copy of Office on their home computer for work purposes, and we pay extra for the privilege. Except in the last version of their license, they changed a few things - now the only legal installation method (that's at all workable) is to have people bring in their whole computer to work. But they have to install the software themselves, and we can't touch their machine except to put in the CD key which they can't watch us do. Has to be installed from official MS media, so no chance of adding a setup.ini for keyless install, sorry. Oh, and their new Office 2003 Service Pack 2 disc (where we can't use the old ones due to some MS patent conflict) doesn't install FrontPage, and that's what most people want our Office for.

Anyway, for your situation, this sounds like a job for a tool like Autopatcher. Install your copy of non-service-packed windows, install Service Pack 2 from a CD, and then install/run Autopatcher. It doesn't do any slipstreaming, it's just a package of post-SP2 hotfixes with an automated installer, so it shouldn't get you in any licensing trouble. Additionally, it comes with some of the commonly-installed plugins (Flash, Shockwave, Java, etc) and there's a facility for unattended automatic installs of the whole thing.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[AmiMoJo]

We do offer Ubuntu on some machines, but to be honest what we do is mostly repairs (i.e. fix Windows).

Also, people know nothing about PCs. They are suprised when they find out that Windows doesn't include Word, and that it's £230 extra (more than the cost of our basic PCs). We usually put Open Office on, but then people complain that our £199 PCs don't include Windows. We can't compete with Dell, because they can use those cheap (and shitty) restore CDs at half the cost of OEM Windows licences.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[stevie-boy]

We can't compete with Dell, because they can use those cheap (and shitty) restore CDs at half the cost of OEM Windows licences.

Although you can add a proper Windows CD for 5.88GBP when you buy and configure a machine on Dell's website

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[Anonymous Coward]

That's why we pull a gig of updates (including service packs) a day from microsoft.com.

Then perhaps you will be interested in SUS. Run your own Windows Update website within your local network.

Re:Why we can't slipstream

[joshio]

What I did when I worked at a computer repair shop, is I downloaded all of the updates manually to our server, I looked up unattended installation switches for each update and put them in a text file, and then Auto-installed everything over the network with a VBScript program I wrote. Worked pretty good, I even set it up so that it would install SP2, reboot, auto-log back in, install the rest of the updates, then reboot again. It worked great b/c I could just start it and walk away. I knew it was done when I walked back by the computer and it was at the login screen after the last reboot.

Automated Deployment Services + Slipstream

[AlphaSys]

If you haven't very demanding third-party driver support, install Automated Deployment Services (the successor to RIS) and slipstream your source. Stop wasting CDs and ISO burn time and do it in a truly manageable way. Even involved driver dependencies can be integrated, but you have to actually learn about what you're doing to make that happen. But when you need to deploy a lot of windows servers at once or the same kind over and over, this is the most straightforward way to get a consistent build and keep the patches current.

RIS & SMS

[TheEvilOverlord]

It amazes me no-one has mentioned RIS.

I'm no fan of MS, but the one place I've worked where it was used, it was invaluable.

Put the machine GUID into Active Directory, PXE boot the machine, select the OS image, it formats the drive and puts the image on. You can add whatever updates/drives you want to the image. The rest can be delivered by SMS (Systems Management Service), it can be very slow though.

The other excellent option I've seen is a custom linux partition on each drive that has a modified version of init, boots and checks the windows partition with an image on a remote network drive using rsync. Once done it reboots with the windows partition selected for default boot.

All the admin need do is update the image and reboot the terminals.

options Re:Slipstreaming

[mennucc1]

this link on slipstreaming is quite interesting; btw, did you note that all necessary operations are carried by command line interface, and that in all commands (such as in "xpsp2.exe -x:c:\sp2 " ) the options are expressed as dashes, and not slashes ? Since when did Windows people start working as Unix/Linux people everdyday do?

Re:options Re:Slipstreaming

[skraps]

Most windows programs will accept both slashes and dashes.

A couple of options

[shyster]

• One, as mentioned, is slipstreaming SP2 + the hotfixes. Pretty much a PITA, since you'd have to continually update your CD as new patches come up.
• Two, is AutoPatcher. Slipstream SP2 and run AutoPatcher after install, and you'll get 90% of the updates. Update AutoPatcher as needed.
• Three, is to hack your own. There's a couple of options for this. You can go the Unattended way and batch/Perl script it, but you still have to download the updates. But, if you do it from a network drive, at least you don't have to reburn a CD.
• The better way, IMHO, is to use the Windows Update API to force the client to run Windows Update, download, install, reboot and repeat until no new updates are returned. I hacked a .NET program together to do just that, but it seems to have issues installing SP2. I haven't had time to delve into the problem yet though. That, and you need the .NET framework installed first - but a bootstrapping installer can take care of that.

Re:A couple of options

[LuckyStarr]

One, as mentioned, is slipstreaming SP2 + the hotfixes. Pretty much a PITA, since you'd have to continually update your CD as new patches come up.

Not really a problem if you do a network installation, which unattended supports btw.

Does that site work for you?

[Futurepower(R)]

That site offers me only downloads I obviously would not want, such as a service pack in Chinese. Do you get a different response? It is certainly NOT a catalog. Only one critical update is offered, for example. I'm using IE, of course, since the site is IE specific.

Nobody's asking the right questions here.

[Khyber]

Nobody's bothered to ask the important questions. Okay, you're a computer technician. Are you working for a computer company that builds and sells computers, or just some repair shop? If the former situation = true, then you should have a Volume License Key or OEM (codeless) installation CD somewhere. If that is true as well, then you can slipstream all you want, as I don't see the word "slipstream" anywhere in the Microsoft License Agreement. No mention of it at all. If you're just working for a repair shop, you're violating the License Agreement all over the world, and you'd best be very careful. Of course, you could try the old "We're auto-patching machines and Windows installs in the interest of national security to protect our nation from cyber-terrorism" and pray that excuse works.

Skillz

[Ratbert42]

As a computer technician, I'd never hire you.

Re:Skillz

[Anonymous Coward]

As a computer technician, I'd never hire you.

I assume this means you have a solution. Care to share or were you just being a dick?

Re:Skillz

[LordEq]

As a computer technician, I'd never hire you.

As a "computer technician", there are very few people you would hire, since the "computer technicians" among the Slashdot crowd tend to regard anyone who doesn't subscribe to their own preferred methods and possess their exact skillset, or a superset thereof (a rare case -- hard to know more than someone who knows everything), as a moron.

Thankfully, as a Slashdot-crowd "computer technician", it is also unlikely that you're in a position to hire anyone.

nLite

[kobach]

http://www.nliteos.com/nlite.html lots of features to put onto xp install cd

Use the downloaded Windows Update files.

[Anonymous Coward]

We build pc's for business and home use. Due to lack of time for building and maintaining a OEM installation server, my co-worker installs all machines from an installation cd.

Now and then, Windows Update downloads are pretty slow. Therefore i have copied everything Windows Update downloads to a fileserver and created a batchfile with which we can install the patches. Ofcourse this is a bit time-consuming and it still has to be maintained each month, but it's quicker than letting Windows Update download and install everything for every pc we build.

These are the steps to follow:

• Install Windows XP using the cd.
• When it's running, install the latest servicepack (SP2 at this time). This can be downloaded from Microsoft once, burned on a cd or copied onto a fileserver and installed manually.
• Open Windows Update and write down which updates it will download and install.
• Let the updates download and install.
• When it's downloading and installing, copy everything (folders and files) in C:\Windows\SoftwareDistribution\Download to another folder as it will delete the folders and files it had installed. These folders contain all the new patch files and an installation program.
• Open the folder in which the folders and files have been copied.
• Open each folder (every folder has a name consisting of 40 hexadecimal numbers) and look in the 'update' folder for a file (for example 'kb873339.cat'). This tells you the patch number.
• Rename all folders according to the KB number. I have called the example folder 'wu-kb873339'.
• Look at the files themselves (also consisting of 40 hexadecimal numbers). Some of these will be textfiles, which can be removed. One of the files might contain the Microsoft Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool, which can be placed in a subfolder and renamed to an EXE file (for example mrt200601.exe). This file will probably be updated every month.
• Create a batchfile and put the following command in it for each folder: start /wait WU-KB873339\update\update.exe /q /z . The flags /q /z will make the update install quietly without rebooting. This will install KB873339. Copy this line, paste it and change the number for the next patch, until all of them are in the batchfile. Save the batchfile.
• Add the Microsoft Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool exe file and add the flags /q /z for quiet installation without reboot (for example mrt200601\mrt200601.exe /q /z ).
• Copy everything to a fileserver which you can access from a freshly installed pc or burn it on a cd-rw (it will be about 150 - 200 Mb because every folder contains several files which are the same).

On a freshly installed pc, which has the same servicepack, you can now copy that folder to the pc, and run the batchfile to install all updated (or perhaps you can assign a driveletter to the share so you don't have to copy the files). If you burned everything to a cd, you can probably start the batchfile without copying everything, i never tried that myself.

Note that you should make a different folder like this for each windows version (pro, home and others).

Anyone who wants to try this should thoroughly test it. You can verify if the patches have been installed by looking at the list displayed in 'Add/Remove programs'.

Re:Use the downloaded Windows Update files.

[Foxman]

You can always use the Windows Services Update Server (WSUS)

It downloads all the updates released by Microsoft onto a server. You choose which ones are stored/released and point all computers on your network to it - you can even have all computers on your network go to this server on a schedule and download any updates available.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserversystem/updat eservices/default.mspx

CORRECTION: I see how to do it.

[Futurepower(R)]

I see now how to get critical updates. Skip "Windows XP Professional SP2" in the menu, and go to "Windows XP SP2".

The system puts the files deep in separate folders. It is necessary to use an application like XXCopy or the File Finder in PowerDesk 4 from Ontrack to extract the exe files to one folder.

XXCopy and the File Finder in PowerDesk 4 are programs you need anyway.

I've had problems with later free versions of PowerDesk, so I stay with the free PowerDesk 4.

That's odd

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm a computer technician too, but I've never seen a Windows install so bonkered that I couldn't save it. I'll admit, I've seen some that I thought I would have to resort to that option, but I've always managed to do without.

Perhaps you have a bit of what I call the "CompUSA Syndrome"? I used to have a friend who worked as a tech at CompUSA. Their policy at the time was that if they couldn't determine the cause of the problem in five minutes, they were to wipe the drive and start fresh. For example, Grandma walks in with her Compaq loaded with all of the grandkids photos. She wants to know how to change her screensaver. But she's installed some fancy screensaver software that the tech hasn't worked with before. Perhaps it is something that they even sold her. Five minutes ticks away and he hasn't quite figured out how the software works. Then, it's "Sorry Ma'am, you're computer is loaded with (choose one or two: viruses, spyware, porn, corrupted Windows install). The only way to fix it is with a complete reinstall." Goodbye, grandkids!

An important disclaimer (so that some CompUSA suit doesn't file suit against me). This was a few years ago, it was one CompUSA store, and these were only the stories of one particular employee.

Re:That's odd

[AmiMoJo]

I agree that you can always save an installation, but look at it from the point of view of a shop. We could do that, but then we would need to test every aspect of Windows, all the installed apps, and hope future updates won't break. After a massive virus/spyware infection, it can be hard to make Windows perfect again, even after doing a refresh install.

On top of that, we never charge more than a certain amount of labour (because PCs are so cheap, it's pointless trying to charge more than the cost of a new one in most cases). So, sometimes, it's better just to do a fresh install, and not have to worry about the customer comming back because something doesn't work in a weeks time.

Re:That's odd

[Clover_Kicker]

What's the longest amount of time you've ever taken to fiddle a Windows back to health?

What's your hourly rate?

There is a point where FORMAT C: is the only sensible fix.

Re:A healthy solution

[hahiss]

I know you got modded ``off topic" for your comment, but this was pretty much my response to the 100s of complicated, time-consuming, and ultimately inadequate solutions too. (Well, not exactly; I didn't think of slack specifically, but I did have the ``why not run *BSD or GNU/Linux?"

the answer is free, but you probably don't want it

[twitter]

I suppose I should blame myself for trying to ask a sensible question on Slashdot. Is it me, or is this place being dumbed down to an idiots guide these days?

You want to use non free software and you want it to be easy. Ultimately, you must do as the owners say. If there really was an answer, you would have found it already. If you want things to be easy, give your customers Mepis, it's not entirely free but none of the owners are as dumb as M$.

use a router

[TheSHAD0W]

Just to go off on a tangent...

My colleagues slipstream service packs and critcial hotfixes (i.e. those that can result in ones machine being 0wn3d during the install) into the installation image...

I recommend doing all your installation behind a cheap cable/DSL router; this will block any incoming traffic from reaching the machine. Unless you decide to go surfing around on suspect web sites with the incompletely updated machine, you're pretty much guaranteed not to get 0wn3d.

Re:use a router

[cowbutt]

I recommend doing all your installation behind a cheap cable/DSL router; this will block any incoming traffic from reaching the machine. Unless you decide to go surfing around on suspect web sites with the incompletely updated machine, you're pretty much guaranteed not to get 0wn3d.

I do so already, on my own network. But work is a university network which has been around for ~20 years with thousands of semi-autonomously administered hosts, so we have to assume it's nearly as hostile as the greater Internet. For now, anyway. But I'm working on fixing that. :-]

Re:use a router

[DeanPentcheff]

Treat your internal network the same way you'd treat the Internet: plug in a cheap firewall box (or use a similarly set up Linux box to do the networking). Do your installs while you're NATed behind your own little firewall. Tighten up the boxes, and only then release them to be plugged into the Great Unwashed University Network.

Re:use a router

[mcrbids]

But work is a university network which has been around for ~20 years with thousands of semi-autonomously administered hosts, so we have to assume it's nearly as hostile as the greater Internet. For now, anyway. But I'm working on fixing that. :-]

Go to Office Depot. Get a $19 ethernet router. (DHCP on the WAN side, provides NAT'd DHCP for clients) Set subnet for client side to something a bit "odd", such as 192.168.100.* or use a 10.1.2

To set up a workstation:

1) Plug router into Internet connection.

2) Plug computer into router.

3) Load Windows, and all patches using NAT'd internet connection.

4) Unplug $19 5-port "SOHO Router", go to next machine.

It really is that simple! I've seen as many as THREE STAGES OF NAT, inside each other, without any problem. EG: Public Internet -> 10.* -> 192.168.1.* -> 192.168.100.* and it all worked without a hitch.

Twenty percent (20%) have barely enough to eat.

[Futurepower(R)]

There are 6,000,000,000 people. Twenty percent (20%) have barely enough to eat. A huge number have no access to education. We are, in fact, way ahead of them.

A large percentage are very old, or young.

We may not think of ourselves as intelligent and educated, but we are some of the best, and it is people like ourselves that the world needs if it is to be improved.

That statement is still true even though there may be 100,000,000 people as educated as we are.

Re:Twenty percent (20%) have barely enough to eat.

[Anonymous Coward]

Most of the "solutions" I've seen solve the solvers' problem(s) before they take care of the folks with the real problems,... but that's how too many charities/businesses "work."

If you can read the above paragraph without any sense of frustration, anger, or disappointment I bow to you.

Keep breathing and keep thinking,... the answer is exceedingly patient.

gerry

WSUS

[bstempi]

Windows Server Update Services.
Instead of building a CD, I took into account that new updates will come out all of the time. Working in an environment of 150+ pcs, this also turns out to be a bandwidth hog. So, i turned to WSUS.

Think of WSUS as a local MSUpdate repo. I tell the server what upates I want, it downloads them, and then distributes them. The only other thing i had to do was to adjust every computers group policy to look for updates from my server at midnight every night. Doing this under active directory is REALLY easy.

Automating Windows Update

[Anonymous Coward]

You might also want to have a look at the /duprepare option of the winnt32.exe to update your installer and driver base http://support.microsoft.com/kb/312110/en-us

Find a sample VBScript on how to scan for missing updates, download and install them with the Windows Update Agent API under http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url= /library/en-us/wua_sdk/wua/searching__downloading_ _and_installing_specific_updates.asp

And slippstreaming http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=828930 not only service packs.

MOD PARENT UP to +5!!! Best comment.

[Futurepower(R)]

fYou said, "All hotfix installers released since XP-SP2 have had an /integrate switch to do just that."

I tried that with two installers I just downloaded, and both had the /integrate switch.

A previous comment said to download the critical updates from here: Microsoft Updates Catalog, using Internet Explorer. Be sure to hunt for "Windows XP SP2". If you choose the logical "Windows XP Professional SP2", you will be offered only a ton of junk.

The system puts the files deep in separate folders. It is necessary to use an application like XXCopy or the File Finder in PowerDesk 4 from Ontrack to move the .EXE files to one folder. XXCopy and the File Finder in PowerDesk 4 are programs you need anyway. I've had problems with later free versions of PowerDesk, so I stay with the free PowerDesk 4.

There was no way to put the command line switches into a Slashdot comment, so I made a web page: Windows Update Installation Command Line Switches.

I haven't done the integration yet, but it looks promising.

Windows Update Server?

[psayre23]

Maybe you could just run a SUS in house to save on external bandwith.

You're supposed to use nlite for this

[Anonymous Coward]

The illegal pirates have it much easier, though. They just search for "windows xp borg edition" on mininova.

autopatcher

[XO]

google for AutoPatcher.

Aw, heck, I guess I'll google it for you.

http://www.autopatcher.com/

  That'll hook up your new windows installation right quick.

Oh boy

[venuspcs]

I have been a computer tech for 11 years now. I have slipstreamed many a cd for purposes like this. Even before slipstreaming was a possibility from Microsoft I was doing it by hacking the iso and putting the newer files into it. With that said, a little creativity and Googling will do wonders for you in this case.

As far as it not being legal to use your own disk to install WindowsXP +SP2 +Updates is BULLSHIT! It is perfectly legal as long as your installation meets a couple requirements.
1.) The installed Operation System is the exact same one as originally came on the system when purchased from an OEM like Dell, Gateway, etc. Meaning if it an OEM system you are installing an OEM version of the OS. If it is a clone system that originally came with a RETAIL version of the OS you must install the RETAIL version of that OS. If it was built/purchased for a business with a VLK license you must install the VLK version of the OS.
2.) You must either return the comptuer to the user UNREGISTERED/ACTIVATED depending on which version of the OS was installed; or you can use a do one of the following:
a.) Use a customer supplied license key to register the OS for them.
b.) Sell the customer a new license key (which you can buy in bulk from Microsoft) and use that
license key to register/activate the Operating System.

With that said, it is possible to create a boot cd that will have every possible version (OEM, Retail, VLK) of WindowsXP/2003 with all the service packs/updates already included. Furthermore, it is possible to make each of those install unattended without entering registration/activation info during setup so that once the OS is installed it has all the updates but has not been activated or registered (doesn't have a licence key entered).

I have one of those CD's that has all three versions of XP SP2, all three versions of 2003 SP2 and all three versions of MCE 2005 SP2. It is perfectly legal to own and use as long as the proper license key is used before returning to the customer or you return it to the customer with no license key used.

To make one of those disks, you can follow a fairly easy process:
1.) Make a folder on your hard drive (in the root for ease) called TechCD
2.) In the folder TechCD create a folder for each OS you want on the disk, like:
a.) Windows XP SP2 (OEM) - Folder name: xpsp2oem
b.) Windows XP SP2 (Retail) - Folder name: xpsp2ret
c.) Windows XP SP2 (VLK) - Folder name: xpsp2vlk
d.) Windows 2003 SP2 (OEM) - Folder name: 2003sp2O
e.) Windows 2003 SP2 (Retail) - Folder name: 2003sp2R
f.) Windows 2003 SP2 (VLK) - Folder name: 2003xp2V
g.) Windows Media Center Edition 2005 SP2 (OEM) - Folder name: mce5sp2O
h.) Windows Media Center Edition 2005 SP2 (Retail) - Folder name: mce5sp2R
i.) Windows Media Center Edition 2005 SP2 (VLK) - Folder name: mce5sp2V
3.) Then copy all the files from each Install CD into the appropriate directory. Don't copy the non
required stuff like Tools, etc. as it will make the CD Image to large to fit on 1 CD.
4.) Now use slipstream the appropriate service packs and updates into each one. (Googling Required)
5.) Now create you a Boot Image with a menu to select which OS/Version to install. (Googling Required)
6.) Now use a tool like UltraISO Media Edition to create a Bootable ISO using the boot image
you made in step 5 and the various folders you created in steps 1-4. I suggest ULTRAISO because
it has a feature (which you have to turn on in setti

Proof that it is legal

[venuspcs]

And if you really need proof that what I told you is legal. Here is a page on Microsoft's Support site that TELLS YOU: "How to integrate software updates into your Windows installation source files".

Re:the answer is free, but you probably don't want

[Anonymous Coward]

oh lololol, that's witty! Install Mepis, yes!

Thanks a lot for helping answer the question. Next time someone asks me how to fixe a b0rked Synaptic config I'll tell them to install Windows!

Idiot.

NEVER reload... use sysprep instead

[urlgrey]

Microsoft sysprep for XP allows you to create a "MASTER" image and from that master, to automagically regenerate the identical config onto a new hard drive again and again (assuming you have legit license keys, of course).

The beauty is that you can re-load not just one machine, but quite literally *thousands* from your original hard drive, reboot once, put in the license key, reboot again, and you have a fully working machine, patched to the most recent level of your MASTER.

I've used this technique since Windows 2000, and I simply do not reload Windows manually anymore.

Re:A healthy solution

[eyepeepackets]

Yeah, /. needs to watch these moderations more closely or the astroturfers will trash the site. Of course it could be too it's just an idiot who can't tell what's on topic and what's not.

Maybe moderation will fix this, maybe not. I wonder if /. has a means to prevent people from getting moderation points who abuse them? Would be a good idea.

Ciao.

Reading between the lines..

[seamonster]

The OP works for a repair shop, not an IS department, so can't use a Enterprise or volume licence agreement, or add the PC to their domain (XP Home anyone?). I deploy/build images for a multinational, and in your situation I think you're out of luck - MS do not make it any easier for you than to hook the PC up to an ADSL line (install firewall, AV first) behind a hardware firewall and run WIndows Update till the PC stops bleating. It's a pain, but on the bright side you don't have to watch it the whole time. An internal WSUS server might save a bit of time/bandwidth if you can be bothered to reconfigure every PC, then change it back to standard when you're done.

Obligatory...

[jrutley]

Get your install CD solution here.

I would love details

[heybiff]

We have thought about doing that here, but haven't quite gotten around to it. We still use: Drive Image, VLA XP, Sysprep to get our machine up. PXE seemed like a simpler method. Heybiff

Unfortunately, some of us user modified Samba...

[heybiff]

...domains. I would love to use SUS, but my understanding is that we would have to switch to a bona fide 2003 server, running AD. I could be wrong. Please, someone prove me wrong. Heybiff

Re:Unfortunately, some of us user modified Samba..

[outcast36]

not a problem. I mean, you will need to have a Windows server with Sql Server..... i'm sure you can read the prereqs, but you do not need an AD setup. You will need to rollout custom registry settings however.

Simple

[Anonymous Coward]

yum -y update

Dude!!!

[heybiff]

I'd been searching for that document for a LONG time, with little success. This pushes me a little closer. Thanks. Heybiff

Roll your own unattended install

[Bravo_Two_Zero]

http://unattended.msfn.org/unattended.xp/ plus a convenient list of patches from http://www.kuku.co.il/windows_xp_sp2_patches.htm , the data from your XP install CD and http://www.nliteos.com should get you a long way on the road to slipstreamed glory.

Re:RIS & SMS custom linux partition question

[navelman978]

I saw your comment regarding different ways to autopatch Windows, and something you had seen where a pc had a custom linux partition, with a modified init. You mentioned the use of rsync, my question is do you recall whether or not the Windows partition was formated NTFS and if so what was being done to mitigate the corruption issues that generally occur when linux writes to NTFS? If you have any other information on how this setup was implemented, or whom I may contact for a little guidance, I would be very appreciative. Thanks, Ron

Is there a civilian equivilant to the 'Gold Disk'?

[Anonymous Coward]

Uncle Sam has something called the 'Gold Disk', a set of DVDs by OS version with all of the patches and scripts to tighten up the OS. It's released monthly and makes the process extremely easy.

If you ever use the Gold Disk be careful about what configuration changes you allow it to make. The default settings check for password complexity requirements, if the requirements aren't met Gold Disk will generate a new password for you. Unfortunately it doesn't tell you what the new password is.

Uncle Sam's Europe CERT also wrote a tool cat BAT (Baseline Applicator Tool), which works similar to the Gold Disk but is more flexible. They created BAT due to issues with Gold Disk.

If you're DOD you should check these out...if you're not, can't help you.