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Human Genome Sequencing Completed

Arthur Dent '99 writes "According to this article at Reuters, the last chromosome in the human genome has finally been sequenced, taking 150 British and American scientists 10 years to complete. The sequenced chromosome, Chromosome 1, is the largest chromosome, with nearly twice as many genes as the average chromosome, making up eight percent of the human genetic code. The Human Genome Project has published the sequence online in the journal Nature, according to the article. It contains 3,141 genes (over 1,000 of them newly discovered), and 4,500 new SNPs -- single nucleotide polymorphisms -- which are the variations in human DNA that make people unique."

70 of 337 comments (clear)

  1. First Chromosome by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I won't bore you with the details, but theres lots of GATCAATGAGGTGGACACCAGAGGCGGGGACTTGTAAATAACACTGGGC type things here

    --
    liqbase :: faster than paper
    1. Re:First Chromosome by PyrotekNX · · Score: 5, Funny

      I always wondered where the movie GATTACA got it's title.

    2. Re:First Chromosome by tomhudson · · Score: 4, Funny

      Well, now that they've sequenced the Genome, can sequencing the KeDE be far behind?

    3. Re:First Chromosome by trentblase · · Score: 2, Informative
      Funny you should mention that, since acording to wikipedia:

      "Each draft sequence has been checked at least four to five times to increase 'depth of coverage' or accuracy. About 47% of the draft were high-quality sequences. The final version will have been checked eight to nine times giving an error rate of 1 in 10,000 bases."

      Which means that there will be an estimated 300,000 errors in the project.

  2. So now. by AltGrendel · · Score: 3, Funny

    Can we start the patent countdown clock?

    --
    The simple truth is that interstellar distances will not fit into the human imagination

    - Douglas Adams

    1. Re:So now. by espressojim · · Score: 2

      You can't patent seqeuence info. You haven't been able to since 2000. Get with the times.

  3. Secret Project Complete by FhnuZoag · · Score: 5, Funny

    Now where's my +1 Talent in every base?

  4. Would've been decoded sooner ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    if God wouldn't have used LISP to encode the darn sequence in the first place

    1. Re:Would've been decoded sooner ... by Fjornir · · Score: 3, Funny
      You thought wrong.
      I was taught assembler
      in my second year of school.
      It's kinda like construction work --
      with a toothpick for a tool.
      So when I made my senior year,
      I threw my code away,
      And learned the way to program
      that I still prefer today.

      Now, some folks on the Internet
      put their faith in C++.
      They swear that it's so powerful,
      it's what God used for us.
      And maybe it lets mortals dredge
      their objects from the C.
      But I think that explains
      why only God can make a tree.

      For God wrote in Lisp code
      When he filled the leaves with green.
      The fractal flowers and recursive roots:
      The most lovely hack I've seen.
      And when I ponder snowflakes,
      never finding two the same,
      I know God likes a language
      with its own four-letter name.

      Now, I've used a SUN under Unix,
      so I've seen what C can hold.
      I've surfed for Perls, found what Fortran's for,
      Got that Java stuff down cold.
      Though the chance that I'd write COBOL code
      is a SNOBOL's chance in Hell.
      And I basically hate hieroglyphs,
      so I won't use APL.

      Now, God must know all these languages,
      and a few I haven't named.
      But the Lord made sure, when each sparrow falls,
      that its flesh will be reclaimed.
      And the Lord could not count grains of sand
      with a 32-bit word.
      Who knows where we would go to
      if Lisp weren't what he preferred?

      And God wrote in Lisp code
      Every creature great and small.
      Don't search the disk drive for man.c,
      When the listing's on the wall.
      And when I watch the lightning burn
      Unbelievers to a crisp,
      I know God had six days to work,
      So he wrote it all in Lisp.

      Yes, God had a deadline.
      So he wrote it all in Lisp.
      All credit to Julia Ecklar -- and (I believe) Heather Alexander who is singing the linked copy.
      --
      I want a new world. I think this one is broken.
  5. I'd like fries with that by gentimjs · · Score: 4, Funny

    I'll take my next kid with larger-than-average height, enhanced frontal lobes, a natural resistance to the polio virus, OH and dont forget the 20/10 vision!

    1. Re:I'd like fries with that by MBCook · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Odd things can be related. I remember hearing about how there were fox fur breeders somewhere (like in Russia). They decided to try to breed tamer foxes so they wouldn't have to worry about getting bit so much. Well after a few generations they succeeded. There was only one problem: all the tame foxes had a big white streak down their back, ruining the pelt. They two traits were related somehow, even though you wouldn't think it.

      So, what if it was a choice between good vision and very high intelligence? How about between good vision or very low risk of cancer/heart disease?

      Bad vision is correctable. If there is a trade off to make, good vision would be something that wouldn't be too hard to trade for something better.

      --
      Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
    2. Re:I'd like fries with that by k98sven · · Score: 3, Interesting

      They two traits were related somehow, even though you wouldn't think it.

      Which is more of a typical example of Science challenging our preconceptions than actual "oddity".

      To make an analogy, if you came across a switchboard with 100 light bulbs and 100 switches, you'd probably assume each switch turned on a light. Then you'd be confused to discover that some switches turned on two lights, some lights needed several switches to be on, and some switches did nothing at all.

      Of course, if you looked under the hood and saw how the thing was wired, you'd then find that there wasn't actually anything strange going on, just that your assumption of how the thing worked was oversimplified.

      I think this oversimplification is one of the reasons some people have trouble understanding evolution. It's a bit hard to understand how things like heireditary genetic diseases could exist if you assume that it's a completely independent property (and indeed, most of them probably wouldn't exist if it was).

      Another fun example of non-obvious traits in humans is that a single SNP (prevalent in East Asians) causes you to sweat less, but also causes you to have dry and crumbly earwax instead of the gooey, sticky stuff most people have.

    3. Re:I'd like fries with that by khallow · · Score: 2, Informative
      Odd things can be related. I remember hearing about how there were fox fur breeders somewhere (like in Russia). They decided to try to breed tamer foxes so they wouldn't have to worry about getting bit so much. Well after a few generations they succeeded. There was only one problem: all the tame foxes had a big white streak down their back, ruining the pelt. They two traits were related somehow, even though you wouldn't think it.

      That doesn't mean that the traits will always stay linked. They probably result from residing on the same chromosome. Such things often can be seperated over time with a lucky chromosome aberration.

    4. Re:I'd like fries with that by Daniel+Dvorkin · · Score: 5, Interesting

      You're just wrong about this. 20/10 means you can resolve something 20 feet away twice as well as the average person; similarly, 20/40 means you can resolve something 20 feet away half as well as the average person. But 20/10 does not mean your eye is misshapen or your sense of perspective is off. It simply means you have better distance vision than average. Now, you may also be "farsighted" -- i.e., have trouble resolving things close up -- but the two are basically independent of each other.

      20/20 isn't "perfect," BTW. Human vision is very good compared to that of most animals, but it's laughably bad compared to that of, e.g., birds of prey. I guarantee you an eagle can see better than you can whether it's spotting a rabbit from a few hundred feet in the air, or staring that same rabbit in the face right before dinnertime. ;)

      --
      The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
    5. Re:I'd like fries with that by Fred_A · · Score: 2, Funny

      It is being passed much more slowly though. Everyone knows that people with 20/10 vision have less FPS.

      --

      May contain traces of nut.
      Made from the freshest electrons.
    6. Re:I'd like fries with that by Citizen+of+Earth · · Score: 2, Funny

      Everyone knows that people with 20/10 vision have less FPS.

      Dogs actually have a higher FPS perception than we have. OTOH, they've been known to eat their own poop. There's an efficiency/complexity tradeoff in neural computation systems.

  6. A simple question by helioquake · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Why do one chromosone have more genes than others?

    1. Re:A simple question by WickedScorp · · Score: 3, Informative

      They are all different sizes. Chromosomes are numbered from largest to smallest 1 - 22 (except 21 and 22; 21 is actually the shortest and 22 is slightly bigger; the mistake was made in early cytogenetics because they couldn't distinguish the sizes well enough and those two were named incorrectly) + X and or Y. So chr 1, being very large, has a very large number of genes just because it's huge. It isn't the most gene dense, however, which is chromosome 19 with more genes / Mb than elsewhere in the genome.

    2. Re:A simple question by SnowZero · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Evolution is a process with a lot of randomness. So I'd instead ask the question: Why would you exepct them to be the same?

    3. Re:A simple question by FTL · · Score: 5, Informative

      > Why do one chromosone have more genes than others?

      Same reason some source code files contain more lines of code than others. They do different things.

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      Slashdot monitor for your Mozilla sidebar or Active Desktop.
    4. Re:A simple question by natrius · · Score: 2, Informative

      In addition to what the other posters said, the chromosomes are numbered by their size up chromosome 22, then the 23rd pair is the X and/or Y chromosomes. Since this is chromosome 1 we're talking about, it's the largest one.

    5. Re:A simple question by Jasin+Natael · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I also consider that one of the chromosomes could maintain (as a unit) the code for some very complex interaction that can't be further broken down. Maybe something to control the expression of genes, p2p communication (to correlate production of proteins, etc.), or even the definition of types for cell differentiation. Or a kind of file full of unique keys to keep the immune system from attacking the body's own cells (errors in which might result in allergies). Consider the size of concurrency control and locking code in Enterprise software. It's easy to imagine that one chromosome would be the largest by far, especially if it contains an operation that cannot be split into multiple parts, and any subsequent additions to code could appear randomly on any of the 23.

      Perhaps I'm dead wrong -- I'm not a genetic researcher -- but whatever corpus of code serves functions like these, assuming they're not all n-th level emergent properties of a massive number of proteins, would intuitively seem to be much less tolerant of fragmentation than others. I'm betting that it contains some kind of code where having it all in one place increases its effectiveness to a point of conferring a survival advantage.

      --
      True science means that when you re-evaluate the evidence, you re-evaluate your faith.
  7. In a slow elderly Eastern European accent.... by GoofyBoy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    "To map the very stuff of life; to look into the genetic mirror and watch a million generations march past. That, friends, is both our curse and our proudest achievement. For it is in reaching to our beginnings that we begin to learn who we truly are."
          -- Academician Prokhor Zakharov,
          "Address to the Faculty"

    --
    The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
    1. Re:In a slow elderly Eastern European accent.... by Jerf · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Why do you insist that the human genetic code is "sacred" or "taboo"? It is a chemical process and nothing more. For that matter -we- are chemical processes and nothing more. If you deny yourself a useful tool simply because it reminds you uncomfortably of your mortality, you have uselessly and pointlessly crippled yourself. - Chairman Sheng-ji Yang, "Looking God in the Eye"

      Complete list of quotes here, although for full effect you really need to hear some of them. The voice acting on Alpha Centauri is among the best ever done for video games. Especially the Ascent to Transcendance sequence, though I find I prefer the second-to-last project to the last one.

      I'd post these, but every time I do my bandwidth gets shot all to hell. :)

  8. Oblig. by mk_is_here · · Score: 5, Funny

    Scientists: All your base pair are belong to us!

  9. Remember kids... by TheOldSchooler · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Your single nucleotide polymorphisms are unique! Just like everyone else's.

  10. Part of the sequence: by GroeFaZ · · Score: 4, Funny

    ACGATCGTACGcopyrightTAGATCGCGTAGTAGCTAGCTGTbyGGCGG CGGTACGGCTATiehovaAGTCGATCGATGATCG5billionBC-TAGCT AGCTAGCTAGCTAGinfinityTAGTAGTATTTATTTunauthorizedA GGCGGTATGCTAGCTAGreproductionCTGATGTGTAGCCCAprohib itedCCAGCTTAGCTAbyGCTAGCTAGTGTAAATCGCCATCGCGCCTAdi vineTTCTCTAGAGCTTAGCATGCTAlawCGTACGTAGCTA

    --
    The grass is always greener on the other side of the light cone.
    1. Re:Part of the sequence: by KarmaOverDogma · · Score: 2, Funny

      Dear sir(s)

      You have posted parts of our patented human genome sequence without our prior authorization. We demand that you cease and decist this post and remove it immediatelty, or you will be hearing from our lawyers in short order.

      Sincerely,

      Genectics Mega Corp.

      --
      uR iGn0ranc3, Their Power
    2. Re:Part of the sequence: by ggvaidya · · Score: 4, Funny

      ACTTTTTCGCGAGAGGAGAGTGAGT//todo:this should only return a positive values!AAAAAATTTCTATCTACTATCTACATATCATTACA/*warnin g we are kluding around the antique "arthropod" module, here there be bugs!*/AAAACTCTTATCTATTTATTCATCTATCATTCATCTATCATCT ACTACTATCTAATCTATACA//haha nice hackACTCTACTATAGATCGATGT

  11. Re:Ah yes... by WickedScorp · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'm forced to agree with QuantumG. I'm a Human Geneticist and the genome project is an invaluable tool in the study of human disease. I can understand the fear of the misuse of the technology, but do you think that part of the genome should have been left unsequenced? If so which parts? What would be the benefit of such and action? This technology has allowed for the development of the ability to rapidly screen for the many know disease mutations to assess risk for "genetic" disease. It has also had practical medical impact in daily life. Screen cancer samples for chromosomal abnormalities and mutations has led to the development of rational therapy for specific cancer types. Where everything is leading is rational therapy overall. Individualized medicine and preventative medicine are the goals. I do agree with you that there are dangers associated with such knowledge. The question is whether we can use it to benefit the everyday man or woman to improve the quality of life for everyone.

  12. SNPs by Michael+Woodhams · · Score: 5, Informative

    From the fine article:
    "The scientists also identified 4,500 new SNPs -- single nucleotide polymorphisms -- which are the variations in human DNA that make people unique."

    There are other variations which make us unique.
    Alternate alleles*
    Indels (insertions/deletions)
    Variable numbers of repeats.*

    The genetic code uses 4 letters, but I'll use English for explaination.
    A SNP is a single letter which has different values in different individuals: "The cat and the dog" vs "the hat and the dog".
    An indel is where letters have been inserted into one sequence or deleted from another (without additional data, we can't distinguish these possibilities.)
    "The cat and the dog" vs "the cat and the big dog".
    In alternate alleles there are a bunch of changes which always stick together, e.g. we observe "the cat and the big dog" and "the cat and the small mouse", but never (or exceedingly rarely) "the cat and the big mouse" or "the cat and the small dog."
    Variable repeats are a special case of indels, but common enough to warrant a category of their own. "The cat and and and the dog" vs "the cat and and and and and the dog".

    --
    Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
  13. Finally! by Tehrasha · · Score: 2, Insightful

    So we can start compiling from source code now! We better get this covered under the GPL quickly.

  14. Because it evolved by GrahamCox · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Why do one chromosone have more genes than others

    Why not? It's because it wasn't designed by a computer geek (or anyone/thing else) where you might have said, hrmmm, we need about 30,000 genes for this design, so we'll split that into 26 chromosomes of 1,154 genes apiece. That should do it!

    The fact is, we evolved, and so our components are just bits and pieces taken from all our previous ancestors, modified according to whatever was needed to suit the environment we happened to find ourselves in at the time. As with all natural, biological, dynamic processes, what emerges is often bizarrely disorganised, yet somehow works.

    1. Re:Because it evolved by fyngyrz · · Score: 5, Funny
      Nonsense. We'd design it to have 32 bits to index the chromesomes, 32 bits to index the genes in each chromesome, and an alternate set of registers so you could quickly swap chromesomes for different tasks. You could clock it at any speed, or leave it static, and it'd never lose data. It'd be radiation hardened, low-power, erasable by ultraviolet, reprogramable by anything from dip switches to GHz pulse trains, internally and externally redundant, solar-powered, ecologically friendly, and involve a great deal of caffiene. Primary developmental needs would be met by carefully metered infusions of pizza.

      However, because of technological limitations, only the bottom 4 bits of the gene index would actually be used, with the next 4 bits being set to zero by default, and the remaining 24 bits determining your average skin color.

      Additionally, the 32 bit chromesome index would use 8 bits starting at the MSB, the next 8 bits would be reserved and set to zero, and the remaining 16 bits would be undefined, though later we'd find variations there gave rise to both creationist tendencies and division by zero, leading us towards a new design that is only 16 bits, but ran twice as fast and never divided by zero, or made up answers to questions without having known good data on the input side.

      All other features would be put off for the beta version, because we'd have a little trouble with the alpha we didn't exactly anticipate.

      Unfortunately, all advances gained by this leap in technology would be lost when hardware manufacturers forced new "quantum confusion" technology upon the geeks in a selfish race for more market share. Geeks fail to notice because they're too busy trying to get Genes 0.1 alpha through ANSI committee approval.

      For maximum efficiency, this awesomely fast new technology requires light pipes for communications, however, in a legislative feat worthy of Maltheus himself, congress declares that production of light pipes within the boundaries of any state for use within the boundaries of that state represent interstate commerce of light paraphanalia, and so no one's going to be doing that, thank you. It's all part of the War on Bits. InSmell, primary manufacturer of light pipes in the USA, shuts all production down, fires half its workforce, and its stock goes up by a factor of four.

      At this point, the only light-pipe architecture you can find comes from Japan, and the upper 24 bits of the gene index are all hard-coded to DDDDBB. It is expensive, but everyone buys it anyway. You can only run this hardware in Denmark. Floating (actually, more like drifting) point is emphasized, and virtual reality is experienced by all users, though that is not to say that it is the same virtual reality across the board.

      In the meantime, US geeks invent open-source web 9.0, expend all their energy producing applications for it that have absolutely no merit whatsoever of any kind using the justly famous "Corundum on Wagon Ruts" technology to replace perfectly good desktop apps that already exist, but are really really cool because they can make almost any browser's "Joe" scripting language use all the memory in your computer... subsequently, geeks quietly go extinct while arguing if GPL or PD is the way to go for the open source path.

      --
      I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
    2. Re:Because it evolved by zenmojodaddy · · Score: 2, Funny

      Maybe in Arkansas...

  15. 3,141 genes by Iznogood · · Score: 2, Funny

    pi * 1000 genes. Got to love those fun coincidences.

    1. Re:3,141 genes by pchan- · · Score: 4, Informative

      You seem to be under the impression that the number 1000 has some special meaning. Let's try your comment again, in octal:

      pi * 1750 genes. Got to love those fun coincidences

      Not so exciting now, is it? Nature is not decimal-based. The only reason we tend to be is because of the number of fingers we have.

    2. Re:3,141 genes by gwayne · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's no coincidence, it's the circle of life...

    3. Re:3,141 genes by vrt3 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Indeed, and the number of fingers we have is specified in the genes, so maybe it's not a coincidence after all?

      --
      This sig under construction. Please check back later.
    4. Re:3,141 genes by Opportunist · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Actually there are a few "numbers" that are "magic" in nature. Depending on the species.

      10 certainly is important to us, having 10 fingers and 10 toes. Unless you're carpenter.
      Asking a bee, you'd prolly be called crazy and 6 is the perfect number, from legs to comb.
      A spider would probably tell you 8 is more important, from legs to their web's segments.

      But since this genome has meaning for us, I'd wager that our "magic" applies.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    5. Re:3,141 genes by Opportunist · · Score: 2, Funny

      Superiority by having the bigger foot.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  16. protein modelling by sc0p3 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    This is good news but not too useful until we can model protein shaping.

    The AGCT's code for proteins and so far we can only model very short combinations. All you coders keen for a life project have a crack at it. Theres 20 amino acids formed from combinations of three base pairs. The amino acids have attraction and repulsion properties with each other and their environment and form to make a unique shape. Its the analysis of that 3D shape that will solve:

    - all cancer - modelling protein shapes means instant cancer cures
    - bird flu - again modelling proteins means instant antibodies to diseases
    - the most toxic substance ever invented - it will also open up designer drugs

    1. Re:protein modelling by Dr.+GeneMachine · · Score: 2, Informative
      Sorry to say that, but you are overly optimistic here, as k98Sven stated above. I work in structural biochemistry, so let me clear up a few points here:

      First of all, you can't at the moment crack the protein folding problem by throwing more computational power at it. We still lack lots on insight into many of the fundamental forces governing protein folding. Electrostatics at that level are a nasty thing, for example. The scale of the system would require a quantum mechanical treatment, but then again the total systems are too large, not to speak of problems with the basis sets and parametrization for a QM treatment.
      Oh, and the protein folding and design problem has been shown to be NP-complete.

      Secondly, not all proteins even have defined structures. The class of so-called natively disordered proteins is large and might even comprise about 30% of the whole proteom. Those proteins only adopt structure in interaction with other proteins or other factors.

      Third, in many cases the structure doesn't help you very much. True, a cancer causing mutation might have a clear structural effect. In other cases, it could perhaps just subtly alter electrostatics on a protein surface, causing a slight difference in its interaction with another protein, which finally gets amplified way downstream a regulatory cascade where it causes the final problem. Knowledge of protein structures is useful to clarify that, but you need to know the whole interaction network to fully understand it.

      Fourth, the cell is crowded. Knowing the structure of an isolated protein in solution does not tell you all about its function in the cell, where it is in contact with lots of other proteins.

      Fifth, not only structure determines the function of a protein, but also its dynamics. Proteins move, and these movements are intricately linked to their function.

      Sixth, and final, if you want to use the structure of a protein as a basis for rational drug design, you have also to solve the design problem. How do you exactly build a compound with the desired properties? There is no completely rational approach implemented at the moment, much is just done by large-scale trial and error approaches.

      --
      This comment does not exist.
  17. and then there was a two...! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    gtcatgcgatacgtaggcaaatcg2tgacggcagt

    hmmm i guess its not as funny unless its binary

  18. Re:20/10 is better than perfect!!! by zeno_2 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Just to add on to this

    20/20 vision means that when you stand away from something at 20ft, what you see is what the normal person would see at 20ft.

    20/40 is, well, if you stand 20ft away, you see what a normal person would see at 40ft

    Same goes for 20/10.

  19. How do they know it's a "gene"? by jerometremblay · · Score: 2, Funny

    How do they differentiate junk dna from genes?

    I undestand that even if they don't know what a gene is doing, they can single it out from the rest of the dna. How do they do that?

    What makes a gene a gene?

    1. Re:How do they know it's a "gene"? by kromer · · Score: 2, Informative

      The answer, for bacteria and yeast genes are used to make protein. They start with a 3-base sequence that signals "start making protein," have some sequences that tell the cell which amino acids to put together to make the protein, and end with a 3-base sequence that signals "stop making protien." 3-base "stop" sequences occurs pretty frequently in the genome (just by random chance), so, if you find a long sequence that doesn't have a "stop" sequence, you can be pretty sure it's a gene. For more complicated organisms (like humans), it's much more difficult to tell what's a gene and what isn't, without figuring out what a gene does (because lots of human genes have what look like "stop" sequences in the middle of the gene)--but there are computer models of how genes appear different than "junk" DNA, that can be used to predict what is and isn't a gene. These aren't perfect, but they're fairly accurate.

    2. Re:How do they know it's a "gene"? by cnettel · · Score: 2, Informative
      In addition to what's already been mentioned, there are some highly characteristic start sequences "upstream" from the actual coding sequence, including what's called a "TATA box", a sequence of about eight nucleotides, where the most preserved part is TATA. The individual nucleotides vary a little, but it's still quite detectable in the overall noise.

      In addition, we have other effects. For example, there is a varying stability between GC and AT pairs, which gives a tendency to a biased ratio in "junk". This stability issue will naturally also possibly give a contribution to the coding sequence, but there, the selection towards specific function will often dominate. This means that you'll, generally, see a difference in GC/AT ratio between coding and non-coding.

      (Pseudo-genes, that is, simplified, genes that won't be transcribed anymore because they're slightly broken, are of course often quite hard to discriminate from real genes, how hard depends on the mechanism by which they were created.)

    3. Re:How do they know it's a "gene"? by Peter+Mork · · Score: 2, Informative

      Determining what is (and is not) a gene is hard work. We know a number of rules (such as the aforementioned it must start with ATG), but these rules are largely of the form, if X is a gene then X has the following properties. These implications cannot be simply reversed; i.e., not all instances of ATG mark the start of a gene.

      In simpler organisms, you can simply scan for open-reading frames (i.e., instances of ATG) and keep reading until you hit a stop codon because there is no post-processing of the transcribed RNA. If the result has a reasonable length, you've probably found a gene.

      In complex organisms, once the RNA is transcribed, portions of the RNA are removed (spliced out). Thus, there could be a stop codon in the middle of the gene that is removed prior to translation. The splicing process is why certain repeated sequences are needed as filler material. During splicing the RNA strand has to be bent to bring the two ends together. In, for example, the cystic fibrosis gene (CFTR) if you don't have enough repeats, it is less likely that splicing will occur properly.

  20. Re:Stupid Question by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    Half answer:

    The beginning is very likely a non-coding region, since stuff near the ends can get damaged more readily. The chromosome itself probably does not exactly start with GAT, it probably has a few thousand bases worth of telomere, and this just happens the be the chunk that starts once they get past all that.

    Everybody has different genes, but the difference between two indviduals over the total range is measured in decimal-points of a percent. Big chunks of it are exactly the same from person to person.

  21. A dozen sets would be signifigant by BlueCoder · · Score: 2, Insightful

    A dozen actual people please. It doesn't count if your just mixing chromosones from different people to claim you have a complete DNA decoded; there is no gaurantee that mix of dna would be viable. There ought to be a panel of scientists to select 12 people to have their DNA read that are willing to be studied for the rest of their lives. Six men and six women. At least some of which would be siblings. Only then can you actually decode DNA. You'll get 90% of the answers there.

    You always go with a base line. Then you read other people and compare and contrast them. Then add in other species. And voila, the genetic black box of subroutines that evolution found most useful that are 99.99999% of the answer. After that your left with mutations and figuring out what, and how, the code sequences do what they do and finally programming new sequences to test theory.

    In other words 30 years from now it will finally get interesting.

  22. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 5, Funny

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  23. That's not a simple question by SloppyElvis · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It may seem logical to respond that evolution yields varied results, or throw up hypotheses about the physics involved or whatever the hell you want. But these do not explain cause, and cannot answer why chromosomal size is varied.

    So, if you really want to know, the answer is...

    because.

  24. Re:Ah yes... by WickedScorp · · Score: 3, Informative

    The basic idea is this. Our cells need a program that tells them what to do. That's the genome. There are a total of 46 chromosomes consisting of two sets of 23 independent chromosomes (1 - 22 and X or Y). DNA makes up the chromsomes. It's just a chemical structure that stores information; the four chemicals that make up DNA are Adenine (A), Thymidine (T), Cytosine (C) and Guanine (G). Every DNA molecule is actually two pieces of DNA that pair together as A binding to T and C binding to G. Sequencing is a chemical reaction that will tell you what the sequences of these four nitrogenous bases are. For example you may end up getting a read of AGTATTACGTATGCATAGGTCCGATG from a sequencing reaction (usu you'll get about 500 - 700 bases in one reaction). This tells you the sequence of ONE of the TWO strands of the DNA molecule. BUT since they pair in a predictable way, you know the sequence of the opposite strand (A-T and C-G). Our genomes are composed of approximately 3.2 billion total As, Cs, Ts and Gs. The goal of the genome project was just to tell us what the sequence of those bases are. That's it. Finding genes and things of that nature are really things that come about from having the primary sequence to reference. If you want to find a mutation you have to know what the sequence is SUPPOSED to be and WHERE IT IS before you can say it is different. That's your quick answer: the genome project sought to determine (1) what the sequence of bases in human chromosomes where and (2) the physical position of these sequences within the chromosomes. They did some other interesting things to prepare for it along the way, but that is a separate matter.

  25. Re:Genes make proteins. by WickedScorp · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Many genes make proteins, but not all. Genes are expressed into RNA. Ribosomal RNA genes don't make protein; instead they make RNA contribution to the ribosome.

  26. Re:One serious thing left to do by Aeonite · · Score: 2, Informative

    I think what you're referring to is Serpentor, The Emperor, who was made *by* Cobra Commander from the DNA of the world's most evil people.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serpentor

  27. Slow by Joebert · · Score: 2, Funny

    At that rate, it must be a group made entirely of male scientists.

    All I have to do is open my mouth once & any female can sequence my genes instantly.
    Their accuracy is amazing, I always get the same conclusion, "You're an asshole !".

    --
    Wanna fight ? Bend over, stick your head up your ass, and fight for air.
  28. Re:Great But... by lbbros · · Score: 3, Informative

    Completing the sequence and actually putting it together are two entirely different affairs. Small sequences called ESTs (Expressed Sequence Tags) were obtained during this effort. The big task after that was to put everything together AND in order. Think of it as a massive puzzle. Even the genome has different "builds" depending on the level of completeness of this work.

    --
    A CC-licensed illustrated horror novel
  29. Re:Ah yes... by fyngyrz · · Score: 2, Informative
    I have questions also, if you'll indulge me:

    When we say that "the gene for xxxx is located at yyyy

    This means that we *do* know where the particular controlling sequence is located?

    Viral gene therapy is a process that can locate the target gene somehow and replace the sequence there with a new sequence?

    Does the sequence have to be broken, segmented, and re-built for viral gene therapy? Or is there a "merge" type of operation that "overlays" the new information?

    I have read a great deal that in a hand-waving manner, describes viral gene therapy as the next great thing either directly, or by implication. Is that so? Anything else like that, in terms of technology, that is currently looking promising?

    --
    I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
  30. Re:Have they found the gene by LordLucless · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Blacks were bred to have more physical ability by slave owners, much like dog breeds were bred to encourage certain traits. There is no gene for it and these qualities will in fact recede over time.

    You do realize that breeding like to like is genetic manipulation? That what you are essentially doing is reinforcing genes that express the desirous trait and eliminating genes that don't? Physical ability may have been bred in to certain people, as you suggest, and it may recede over time, but it's still a genetic trait.

    --
    Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean there isn't an invisible demon about to eat your face
  31. 3,141 genes? by SashaM · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Did anyone else find the number 3,141 interesting? Is that a coincidence, or is there a good reason?

    1. Re:3,141 genes? by ltbarcly · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yea, especially since you have exactly 3,141.59... genes.

      And the distance from the base of the Great Pyramid is exactly twice the distance times 3/23 - the number of pounds in a dozen African Eliphants minus the sum of them... ... you get 666! Therefore, your genes are the antichrist. We should change public policy to better fit with this.

    2. Re:3,141 genes? by Ginnungagap42 · · Score: 2, Informative

      Personally, I'd have found it more interesting if there had been 1618 genes, with phi turning up all over the place in nature and all...

    3. Re:3,141 genes? by Stellian · · Score: 2, Interesting
      No. That sort of coincidence happens all the time.

      If you express your mathematical results with 4 digits, there is a 1 in 9000 chance to get 3141. If you take, say, 9 "magic" numbers like e, phi, pi, 1, sqrt(2), etc. there is still only a 1 in 1000 chance to get a match.
      So it should not happen all the time, and if it does, there is something fishy about it. :)
  32. The genome trading card game by Opportunist · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'd give smarts for insight any day.

    Sometimes, I'd give intelligence for booze. Life'd be a lot easier and less painful.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  33. Finished my ass by pugdk · · Score: 4, Interesting

    There are still large gaps in each chromosome, either due to repetitive sequences, high GC content or closeness to the centromere - basically saying that the human genome is finally done is like saying that 99.9% equals 100%, which it doesn't. This is especially important in cases where you actually NEED to use sequence in areas where it has not been assembled correctly or has not been sequenced... which has happend to me multiple times during the last couple of years... oh and those places in the genome have been unfinished ever since the first installment appeared publicly... they are even lacking in the Celera version of the genome... Finished my ass! -pug

    1. Re:Finished my ass by ill+dillettante · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Sorry I missed your post - basically said the same thing a few posts down.

      The really bad thing about all these announcements of "finishing the human genome" (apart from making the scientist involved look like idiots) is that it is stopping people from outside the field thinking about new ways of really finishing the genome as they think the problem has already been solved. This is a really hard problem and we need all the help we can get.

  34. Human genome is not finished by ill+dillettante · · Score: 4, Informative
    It is actually only about 75% complete - basically the scientist involved have no idea how to finish the remaining sections (mostly simple repeats) so they have "defined" the genome complete by saying that these regions are unimportant.

    This is by my count the fourth time that the human genome has been announced "finished" - anymore times and they will all be invited to become slashdot editors.

  35. Re:Ah yes... by WickedScorp · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Say I tell you that gene XXXX is located at YYYY. It doesn't necessarily mean that we know anything about the controlling sequences. I'll use a standard protein coding gene. We would know where all the exons are, including the upstream part of the transcript that is made into RNA but isn't translated into protein, the protein coding sequence, and the downstream region that is made into RNA but not made into protein. Also in between the exons of the gene are the introns that are made into RNA with the rest of the gene, but are cut out before the RNA is used. For many genes we have at least a fuzzy idea what *characterized* promoters are in the region. This is where it gets tricky. Enhancers and insulators, that increase and decrease the efficiency of making RNA from DNA, can be at *considerable* distance from the gene they control. They can even be within an intron of the gene AND they can function from either strand of a double stranded DNA molecule pointing in any direction (toward OR away from the sequence of interest). We don't know much about the control most of the time. Let me put it this way. There is evidence that 5% of the genome is under purifying selection i.e. very important to not tinker much with. 1.5% of that is gene coding space. What's the other 3.5%? At least a good fraction of it has to be controller sequences. But the beyond that, we don't know. They are probably going to end up being elements we've never seen and don't understand how they work. Entirely new classes of DNA control sequences.

    Viral Gene Therapy

    I don't know as much about this topic, so be forgiving. The idea with viral mediated gene therapy is that someone is missing a gene entirely or the copy they have is basically defunct. One way to fix it is to target the broken sequence and paste what you want into it. Like a word search and replace. Viruses that integrate into our genes are good at that. The problem is targeting. Most viruses that we can get to integrate do so RANDOMLY. Not a problem, you'll still be pasting a functional sequence into the DNA so they can at least make some of the protein. But what if you land it at a place far away from the uncharacterized control elements that say when to turn on and when turn off? Maybe the small amount of basal transcription will produce enough protein to correct the defect, maybe not. What if it lands in an area that is always very highly expressed? Overexpression of the gene product can be bad too. Then a third problem to look out for is what if this thing randomly integrates and hits the middle of a good gene, killing it. Then you've got a whole other problem entirely. For the sequence to go into the vector what you have to do is really going to be dependent on the sequence. If the gene is very small, maybe you want to put in exons, introns and everything else. Otherwise, if it is too big, maybe you take the introns out and put just the exons in (remember that the exons are cut out of RNA anyway and the exons are spliced together). Some are so big that even just the exons can't all go in. Dystrophin for example is mutated in Duchenne and Becker's Muscular Dystrophy. It would be great for gene therapy but it is *huge* and I mean huge compared to most genes. Maybe there you can only put part of the sequence in, so you try to guess what parts of the protein are the most functionally important. Gene therapy is something that has the potential to be very valuable. It just really hasn't had any success over a pretty big period of time that people have worked on it. One good example is Severe Combined Immune Deficiency (SCID). These are the people that have to live in a bubble because their immune system doesn't work. But if you reconstitute the mutated genes, they would be fine. There were some trials in France of Gene Therapy to fix the problem and in several people they did. Those individuals went from living in sterile conditions to basically a normal life. Then the side effects came in. Where the gene landed in a few of them basically gave some of the patients leukemia!!! So they

  36. Re:Stupid Question by mishmash · · Score: 2, Informative

    One point is that there's very little variation between individuals in terms of coding sequence - in this chromosome from the article there's only just over 1 base where there are known single base changes per gene. The most common type of variation is in the number of times repeated streaches of DNA are repeated, this generally (though not always) has no effect on an individual. The numbers of such repeats in the draft sequence are not meaningful in the published sequence.

    Databases of variation in the human genome are maintained. The paper accompanying the release of the finished sequence does discuss variation - and notes that in some areas of chromosome people have different numbers of copies of a large region which includes genes.

    Nature has made the Full text of the article announcing the completion of the chromosome one finished sequence available online. While this is good, it's still not the open publishing which ought be demanded by those spending public money on scientific endevours such as this.