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Pirate Party Comes to the U.S.
Spy der Mann writes "Wired news has published an interview with the Pirate Party of the U.S., which was formed a week after the raid on Pirate Bay. The group patterns itself after Piratpartiet, the Swedish political party associated with The Pirate Bay, and says it wants to reform intellectual property and privacy laws."
We could certainly take a long hard look at copyright law in this country. It's become clear to me that the public domain is, for all intents and purposes, closed. Everytime Mickey gets close to falling into PD congress will suddenly find it in their interest to extend copyright.
The should not have given their party a self-defeating name.
This is exactly what geeks across America have been hoping for: a group intended to defend the consumer's side in privacy and intellectual property discussions. But there's no way they're going to succeed in politics when they've named themselves the "Pirate Party". I don't think I even need to ask whether they realize that they're giving their opponents fodder for later complaints and insults.
ttuttle is a rankmaniac
And I thought they were joking when I saw a comment on Digg or here, (cant remember which), that there was going to become a Pirate Bay USA, will never happen but good to see a little good come out of the RIAA and USA make jackasses out of themselves in the raid.
With the election system of the US, it's always 2 parties with nobody having thet slightest chance to muscle in, at best in local elections (which, frankly, have no impact on copyright laws).
:)
But I support the idea. The idea has been picked up by our communists. I guess I'll become a comrade.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
At least they didn't spell it this way: P1r8 P4rty
Yarrrr!
It be about time that someone be takin' up the mantle of IP reform and greater privacy! Fer sure, the twin armadas of the Republicrats and Democans have failed to take it on, and e'en the Libertarians and Greens don't talk too much about it.
Avast, mateys! Perchance finally there be a Party worth votin' for.
Gifts for Geeks - Stuff that really matters!
I'm not very confident in a group that's set to reform our copyright/patent system when they cannot even have enough common sense to realize that a name such as "The Pirate Party" is NOT going to be taken seriously here in the U.S. This time is investment is better spent on something that has somewhat of a chance in hell.
"True refinement seeks simplicity."
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If brevity is the soul of wit, then how does one explain Twitter?
A politacal party that fights for all the things mentioned on the pirate parties website is great. I'm all for a politcal body finnaly standing up and fighting angainst corporations that take away from what makes this country great. However a party devoted just to those things will never stand. While the geeks of america may band together for this party it just isn't enough. A political party must be ready to face all the challanges of a society not just a select few. The Pirate party would have to take a stand on things like war, poverty, crime, drugs and so many others. And thats not to mention a party needs support from a majority of people with all sorts of backgrounds and cultures.
Just something to think about.
Eating the brains of your enemies does not make you smarter. But it's still fun.
Holy convergance of idealologies Batman!
We all know Al Gore is all about Global Warming (See Here), and we also know there is a direct link between the number of pirates and the average temperature of the earth! (See Here)
This cannot be an accident - it's fate!
DG
Want to learn about race cars? Read my Book
I'm not necessarily a fan of what the Pirate Party represents. But, sometimes, overkill on the other side of the problem may work to balance the mess out. I just hope that we can eventually find a happy medium.
And yet, it was terrorism (and a form of communism; after all, they had to work and share together) that set America on the path to independence from England.
Likewise, OSS was labeled as terrorism/communism by some, and now it is pretty much understood that it is one of the truer forms of capitalism (and charity).
Somewhere down the road, as ip laws are changed, this group may be changed from being consider terrorists to heros.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
...why's the rum gone?! (Look away kiddies, this post be rated ARRRR!!!)
Honestly, at this point, I *do* support piracy.
After seeing how the Republicans are selling my ass out to the telecoms in the house*, I--someone who has been registered as a republican for as long as he could vote--am dumping that party until it comes to its senses.
Keel haul the blaggards!
* There are plenty of reasons to dump them, not just Net Neutrality. It's just that that's the absolute last straw. At this point, I feel like I'm throwing my vote away voting for either of the two main parties, anyhow so I might as well vote with someone I agree with...
So spot on, judging from this text only, it seems that I agree with all they say! (hmm, which is the definition of "good", right?) If I were American, I'd vote for them. But wait, I'm Swedish!
Swedish plasma phys. PhD student; MSc EE; knows maths, programming, electronics; finance interest; seeks opportunities
It says "securing for limited Times". What needs to made clear(er) in the Constitution is that Copyright laws that demonstrably do *not "promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts" are not valid.
My turnips listen for the soft cry of your love
why don't all these groups that want to repeal such and such bad law, or change this law, or whatnot, just get together and lobby for campaign finance reform. once that's done they can actually have a snowball's chance in hell of actually getting done what they originally set out to do.
I agree that we need to seriously reform the patent system in the United States. But the Pirate Party isn't going to do this. In fact, one might argue that all it will successfully accomplish is marginalizing the issue and its supporters. There are dozens (if not more) third parties in the US. It is very hard (and in this day and age almost impossible) for a third party to have any electoral success (it does happen on a community level in certain places around the country). There are key differences between the electoral systems of most European countries and the US. In the US, we have a single-member district system that is winner take all. It makes our system functionally a two-party system. Most of Europe has a proporational representation system. Voters in Europe vote for the party, not the candidate. All that is needed for a small party to gain seats in a parliamentary body is to get over the threshold (whatever that threshold may be). Sometimes, that threshold is as low as 5%. Here in the US, you need a plurality of the vote at least (in some parts of the country, you need an outright majority). The pirate party getting 50.1% of the vote? I don't think so. Even 40-45%, not likely. To insist on something like this, just because it works in Sweden is to deny the reality of the electoral constraints place upon the US system.
From the interview:
Sigal: I think the raid is what brought this whole thing to my attention, and to the attention of people around the world. The raid in Sweden could turn out to be the best thing that happened to the internet community. I think it backfired on the MPAA. They wanted to take down a site they thought was illegal, but everyone noticed that the MPAA is terrorizing the people.
No kidding. Whether or not the party manages to elect any members, its time to bring these issues to the public on every front possible, including the political front. A strong grassroots effort behind the Pirate Party would throw these tactics right back in the face of the *IAA organizations.
bashing the name. Most of the time i agree. I, myself, support things like the Green AND Libertarian parties over the Republocrats. I love Defective by Design, much like how i have much respect for the Green and Libertarian parties in the US, the Pirate Party in Sweden, and quite a many groups that may or may not be political parties. There's lots of great advocate groups out there fighting for noble causes.. for smaller government, tech rights, privacy rights, IP law, workers rights, environmental rights, you name it. But most of all of these groups suffer a similar fault and that's one of presentation. Very rarely do they show us that they're professional, they're websites look like crap, they're protests are childish, their statements to the public.. while i might agree with, can get a bit ridiculous at times. Groups like these people who can do something about it.. simply will never take seriously. I'm suprised Defective by Design has done what it has. But frankly if Richard Stallman wants to be taken seriously his needs to quit being a sappy bitch, cut his hair, trim his facial hair and learn how to dress and address professionals, government leaders, and the public. None of these groups that i adore so very much stands a chance in hell, until they can present themselves in a manner the rest of the world will take serious. Generation after generation, people simply don't seem to grasp this concept... and it's a trivial fact of life that makes a huge fucking difference that none of us are going to change. And until people wake up and quit prancing around in obnoxious outfits outside of corporate and government offices, they will be written off as nutbags, hippies, drug addicts, radicals, etc.. Now all of this being said.. The language has already been firmly planted about pirates and piracy. It's engrained into the entertainment and technological culture as it stands. This word isn't going away. I sit and i watch as the word "liberal" has become a dirty dirty word.. and watch the Democrats and Greens try to re-identify themselves as "progressive".. and it's not really working. This country is leaning towards Dems, not b/c this nation is liberal..but b/c they're tired of Republicans. It's really hard to escape a word and play semantics and hope you're new identification for what you do will take a stronger hold. As we've seen with the word "nigga" (though this has nothing to do with professionalism or politics), it's much easier to make an insulting word.. empowering. It has a very "stick it the man" attitude about it and gives way for great marketing. While i don't find it to be the height of professionalism and the ability to be taken seriously.. what are they going to call themselves? The Sharing Party? You think tree huggers get picked on.. that'd be nothing compared to this. I mean seriously.. there's not many names i could think of that would fit. The "lets not always maximize profits party". I mean.. maybe i'm not creative, but you tell me what would be a better idea.
Politicians will totally pander to some groups because they know that if they don't, they'll be punished bad enough to lose elections. In Canada, we have the NDP. They stand no chance of winning an election but they have a huge effect. The Liberals have to steal the NDP's policies in order to win. It is why Canada is very progressive on some issues. Even the Conservatives find themselves constrained because they know that they can lose votes to the NDP. Yes, I know that last one sounds strange; it helps to have been raised in Saskatchewan (it gave us both Tommy Douglas and John Diefenbaker) to understand it.
There are enough people who don't vote that you wouldn't have to turn too many Republicans or Democrats to make a big difference. This is one of those issues where you could get support from both sides. You could also bundle it with America's fading status in the world and the erosion of civil rights. Heck, you could probably even conscript Ralph Nader's followers.
http://elections.gmu.edu/voter_turnout.htm
It would make some people's lives a lot easier if most people became too apathetic to vote. If you let that happen then you deserve what you get.
It won't be their name that keeps them down and anyone who thinks it will is being very naive. It will be the **AA's endless flow of money that keeps them down.
Check out the cave on the east side of lake Hylia. Strange and wonderful things live in it.
The US already holds a Swedish citizen at Guantanamo, in violation of US and international law...
Let me know when the Ninja Party makes its way to the US. Ninjas beat pirates any day. I'm sure they would totally flip out and pass an act abolishing copyright, the *AA, and panhandling all at once. The first two for obvious reasons, the second and third because ninjas don't like whiners.
Slashdot: Where anecdotes and generalizations can be freely substituted for facts, logic, or intelligence
If a party designed to "reform real property laws" called itself the "Robber Party", I would never vote for it, send it money or let its rhetoric/policies influence my politics.
I'd call the cops.
--
make install -not war
You, and people like you, saying it's "futile" and third party votes are "wasted" are the cause of the two party problem. You've helped brainwash the american voter into thinking it's a coin toss, and he should pick the "lesser of two evils".
Then on election day, we see some bullshit like "49% people favor John Kerry and 51% people favor George Bush". Which we all know is wrong. Nearly everybody, in the last election, thought both candidates sucked.
Vote for who you want to vote for. They may not win, but we won't be sending some assclown to the whitehouse with some bullshit "51% american support" argument. The next time the republicrats win, I want to see the number say "7%", followed by maybe Greens or Libertarians with 4% and 5% type numbers. I want the numbers to clearly demonstrate what the people want.
If that were to happen, and the two parties will realize just how tenuous their connection to the voters are, and things will start to change.
But instead, all of the apathetic slugs out there contribute the the problem by saying "I really like blah-blahs positions but I dont want to waste my vote so I dunno, Hillary Clinton I guess".
Vote for the Pirate Party if you like them. They don't have to win to send a message.
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
http://www.fff.org/comment/com0603e.asp The New Mercantilism
m l The Fraud of Intellectual Property
http://www.lewrockwell.com/mcelroy/mcelroy17.html Patently Absurd
http://www.lewrockwell.com/sapienza/sapienza36.ht
http://www.mises.org/blog/archives/002935.asp Mises Economics Blog: Bill Gates: Anti-IP Movement Is Communist
I wish the Pirate party far better success than the Libertarians have had. It is surprising that the message of Liberty does not resonate in the United States.
Bob-
The Ludwig von Mises Institute. The reasoning individuals economics
The problem with parties with a limited scope on issues is that there is far too much room for the elected officle to slide in his own agenda. What would a party with such a small target issue do when it comes to other issues is anyones guess and it makes them a political loose cannon that serious political party supporters are going to have a problem funding even if their target issue is a good one.
Granted, no established party is going to really take this issue on in such a way either so I guess it leaves the public that wants this type of reform SOL.
Dedicated Cthulhu Cultist since 4523 BC.
>Everytime Mickey gets close to falling into PD congress will suddenly find it in their interest to extend copyright.
Disney and all the rest of the those with vested interestes in intellectual property have more money than anyone could possibly counter with enough votes to make a difference.
It's all about the cash. Votes are just something to make you feel like you have a representative government.
Steve
A work that expires before its copyright never enters the public domain and thus enjoys eternal copyright protection.
"Bring in a leader with teeth and some money and we'll talk."
:)
They should just talk people into sending them a percentage of the purchase price every time someone pirates something! Even Bush couldn't raise that much money...
As such, the Pirate party will, if it gets anywhere (and it won't) would just suck off energy from the Democrat party.
If they were wise, which they are not, they would recognize the way to have their voice heard and actually get stuff done is to act as a caucus within one of the two established parties.
Years and years ago the presidential campaign of Pat Robertson did the same thing. After LOSING, they formed an organization known as the Christian Coalition. They decided not to form their own political party but to ingrain themselves and take over the Republican party from the ground up. They were largely successful. The Christian Coalition on the national level is just a shel but their mission has largely been accomplished and they, in many cases, _are_ the Republican Party.
The Democrat party can be taken over (or at least heavily influenced) in the same way by an organized group - but it seems the Pirate Party is not it.
Copyright is supposed to be a compromise whereby both the creator of the content and society (most importantly, society) benefit. Since the content "owners" are no longer holding up their part of the bargain, I see no reason why we should continue to hold up ours!
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Actually, that's what I thought at first when they showed up in Sweden too - but I've come to the conclusion that "Pirate Party" is pretty darn clever. It's provocative and attention grabbing ... with the "Copyright Reform Party" or your other suggestions, all we're getting is another EFF. Who are doing an amazing job, of course, but they're not exactly well known (beyond slashdot circles).
These guys are trying to throw a wrench into the machinery; calling themselves "The Pirate Party" helps.
If they can get themselves sued over the name, all the better. They need all the mainstream attention they can get.
And this is where Approval Voting comes into play.
Basically, the idea is that you may vote for as many of the candidates as you approve of.
For instance, a good chunk of people enjoy many of the ideas that the Libertarian party believes in. This same chunk of people often has to make a choice between voting for a democrat or a republican, because everyone knows third parties stand no chance here.
Now, under the Approval voting system, you could vote for both the Libertarian candidate and the party you would have ended up voting for had you no choice.
Now, I do not believe that the Libertarian party would win. What I do believe is that they would receive a much larger number of votes, and many of the idea would be much harder for the main two parties to ignore.
The same, of course, would happen to the Pirate Party. They are not going to win, let's face it. But, if they were to receive a vote from 15-30% of the population (a reasonable goal), the major parties could not ignore that.
What makes this system so great, however, is the incredible ease of implementation. It isn't complicated for voters to understand, and ballots could already support multiple votes.
"...when, as in this case, Congress has not altered the traditional contours of copyright protection, further First Amendment scrutiny is unnecessary."
By implication, this means laws that do alter the "contours" can be challenged constitutionally. I'm thinking DMCA, esp. anticircumvention... which goes beyond the prohibition of copying and denies mere access to works, as pointed out in a good chapter of a very mediocre book: Protecting Ideas by David L. Hudson.
My turnips listen for the soft cry of your love
This is nothing more than a couple of no-names who decided to set up a web page and call themselves a political party because they thought it was cool.
I agree with you, the world's nuts. One of these days we'll have a Finnish kid and a beardy hacker saying "Hey, let's make an operating system!". And I bet they'll give it a cryptic name and a penguin for mascot. And then they'd say stupid things like "Software should be Free". How can a stupid idea like that prosper in today's capitalistic world? Sheesh.</sarcasm>
Hint 2: it doesn't take 100+ years to realize a profit on your intellectual endeavor, if that's your taste. Especially nowadays. As a general rule, your book/record/film is going to profit in its first five years of life or never. If anything, terms should be getting shorter as distribution & marketing technologies continue to improve.
My turnips listen for the soft cry of your love
You know, I think the media really screwd up when they called it "software piracy" Everyone WANTS to be a pirate. If they'd called it "software faggotry" everyone would still buy all their shit
The greatest revenge in life is massive success.
The original Mickey Mouse film trilogy was Plane Crazy, Gallopin' Gaucho, and Steamboat Willie. Any traits of the character that appeared in the original trilogy would pass into PD along with the films.
O rly? The Supreme Court ruled the other way in Dastar Corp. v. Twentieth Century Fox Film Corp. , where Justice Scalia wrote that a trademark can't be hacked to extend copyright.
The US Census Bureau exists to implement the constitutional requirement for an enumeration. A hard limit of half a life expectancy would be easy to implement based on data that the Census Bureau and similar government agencies already publish. But then pegging the copyright term to the progress of medical arts it might make the copyright industry support the drug industry.
i've tried bribes, extortion, blackmail, physical violence, attempted hypnosis, clandestine activites, begging and pleading...maybe now i'll be able to get my friends to vote if i tell them that they're gonna vote for a dude who wears an eyepatch.
He was released in July 2004: http://www.sweden.gov.se/sb/d/4166/nocache/true/a/ 27298/dictionary/true
Proud member of the American Non Sequitur Society. We might not make much sense, but boy do we love pizza!
Our Pasta, who "Arghh" in heaven, Swallowed be thy shame.
Thy Midgit come. Thy Sauce be yum, On top some grated Parmesan.
Give us this day our garlic bread. And give us our cutlasses,
As we swashbuckle, splice the main-brace and cuss.
And lead us into temptation, But deliver us some Pizza.
For thine are Meatballs, and the beer, and the strippers, for ever and ever. RAmen.
http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_Mon
Copyright, patent reform, and privacy reform will only take a political party so far. If this party is going to succeed in any major way it also has to develop a clear stance on issues that white-bread america will be interested in. What are the party's stance on things like preventing the FEMA fiasco in the wake on Hurricane Katrina? What's their policy on the minimum wage laws? Where's their stance on drug policy and education and taxes?
These are what most people will want to know before signing up for a party.
Perhaps the best thing the Pirate Party could do is try to fuel a grassroots compaign for a Constitutional Amendment that sets in stone the fourteen year terms and registration requirements of the original US copyright laws so that Congress can't use the "harmonizing" excuse anymore. This of course would have to be done by the states themselves since the **AAs and gerrymandering have pretty much ensured that Congress itself would not introduce the necessary legislation.
Time is what keeps everything from happening all at once.
An AC post, replying to what could easily be considered flamebait at best (I should know, I wrote it that way ;-), that is rational and insightful? Wha?!? Where's the real AC, what have you done with him?
You hit the nail on the head about Libertarians. They are idealogues, and a bit crazy, but they have some good ideas. And I hadn't even thought about migration difficulties in voting systems, you are right, Condorcet may be more fair, but it is really complicated. You basically have to take every possible pairing of candidates and say who you would prefer given those two choices. Approval voting is not as fair in some ways, but much simpler to implement.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
It's not piratepartiet. It's piratebyran...
It is the owner that crashes the system. If you are enough of an idiot to put 50 background processes in Windows you sho
How about the 'Free Information' party instead? Many of the comments around here defending the Pirate party name come from that other doesn't sound as good or grab the attention that is needed. That's fair but before running to call your party the Murderer's party or Rapist party, when your party has absolutely nothing to do with either of those seems counterproductive. It tips the scales against you before you've said anything. There are many more decent sounding names than ones with criminal denotations that people can rally behind. They surely would be more popular at first sight with average citizens of America than something already subverted by its incorrect literal interpretation.