Paul Thurrott Bitten by WGA

Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-07-21 01:44 · Score: 5, Insightful

The acceptable face of spyware

Dear Bill:

The following argument is so old it should probably be modded redundant, but given Steve's mental faculties, perhaps it bears repeating.

1 - Pirates will not be hurt by this as they have corporate keys, etc
2 - Genuine customers will be annoyed by this
3- Therefore this makes no sense

By presupposing your customers are dishonest Microsoft creates tremendous ill-will. This would, of course, normally be a bad thing. Worse - they have that nice monopoly so it doesn't really matter. This causes unhappiness and resentment, even amongst ridiculous Redmond fanbois like Paul Thurrott and Ed Bott.

So, my friends, there is only one way out. If we want to be happy, Windows must be kill -9'd.

Re:Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by joshier · 2006-07-21 01:47 · Score: 5, Interesting

I think this is just brilliant... seriously.. Every time I hear legiment users of windows getting p***** off, or angry because their windows won't work, or that they can't install patch updates because they've installed new hardware, it really lightens up my day.

No, I don't revel in customers unsatisfactory, it bugs me, but I do laugh at how microsoft is loosing popularity and a user base extremely fast due to this.

Ubuntu, Here we come!

p.s. Ubuntu has released a version today based on the 2.6.17 kernel, and that kernel includes many new supported wireless cards, one of which I have in my laptop (broadcom 4308)
Re:Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by arose · 2006-07-21 02:21 · Score: 4, Insightful

I've seen many atempts to bend the "average user" into one or another direction in order to support ones position (no wonder with such a non-term), but this one borders on the absurd.

--
Analogies don't equal equalities, they are merely somewhat analogous.
Re:Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by gfxguy · 2006-07-21 02:57 · Score: 4, Informative

It's more like "mainly if you're a gamer."

The vast majority of people out there are not doing anything remotely "important" with their computers, and most are just surfing and emailing and chatting an so forth. In other words, no difference.

I run Windows at home, but then I play a lot of games, and like most people when it's my leisure time I don't want to spend half of it getting Linux to play a game I can "just play" on Windows.

I would argue it's almost exclusively gamers who need to suffer Windows.

--
Stupid sexy Flanders.
Re:Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by MadJo · 2006-07-21 02:58 · Score: 5, Insightful

In response to the parent post:

Linux is ready for the desktop... it is the wrong question to ask...
The real question is, "Is Linux ready for you?"

And Linux still has quite a lot to offer gamers, it just depends on what your demands are.

From the top of my head, a few native Linux games:
FPS:
- Quake (1 through 4)
- UT (99, 2k3, 2k4)
- W:ET
- Sauerkraut / Cube 2
- Warsow
- Legends

Strategy:
- Freeciv
- Savage (1 and the soon to be released 2)
- Darwinia

Well the list goes on, and it quite extensive (not all are Tetris-clones).
And you can run games in Wine or in Cedega.

But the question you should ask yourself is, 'Is Linux ready for me?'
If the answer to that question is "no", then indeed Linux is not ready for YOUR desktop.

--
80 CC D8 AF AE D3 AB 54 B7 2E CE 67 C7
Re:Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by theonetruekeebler · 2006-07-21 03:50 · Score: 5, Interesting

Back in the 1980s, Yosemite National Park was having a serious problem with bears: They would wander into campgrounds and break into the garbage bins. This put both bears and people at risk. So the Park Service started installing armored garbage cans that were tricky to open -- you had to swing a latch, align two bits of handle, that sort of thing. But it turns out it's actually quite tricky to get the design of these cans just right. Make it too complex and people can't get them open to put away their garbage in the first place. Said one park ranger, "There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists."
I've forgotten why I mentioned this, but it had to do with the considerable overlap between our individual opinions of an "average user."

--
This is not my sandwich.
Re:Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by Sark666 · 2006-07-21 04:28 · Score: 4, Insightful

Ok, I'm getting off topic and I've posted this before, but I guess a tad late and no one noticed. I'm reposting as the issue of games always comes up and I want to see what people think of this. The discussion was originally WoW on linux via wine...

It would be a lot easier for them to port if all games were opengl. I remember way back when John Carmack had his open letter to microsoft on the merits of opengl. Unfortunately, it seems d3d (even though crap back then) has won out in the end. Not that it's better than opengl, it could be now, but that's beside the point. Microsoft saw how big gaming was getting and wanted to tie developers and as a result it's users to one platform.

I think a turning point was the release of half life. Even though being a quake 1 engine game (don't start the q1/q2 halflive thing) it's default support was d3d. If valve stayed native opengl when that game exploded, we might have seen co's like ati get their act in gear a lot earlier with better opengl support. And potentially might have become a more attractive option for future developers.

Glad carmack still codes for win,nix, os X just cause he thinks 'it's a good thing.' Too bad developers like him are far and few between.

Consumers can kill something off like a plague when they are aware of the hardware/software tie in, like the death of the original divx hardware players, but when consumers (even tech savvy ones) don't think about it, or don't care what goes on behind the scenes, things like this happen.

I can't really see it changing drastically now. You hear about the odd port from a company which is great but the only way a lot of games to be natively available on linux is for linux to all of a sudden gain huge market share (hopefully one day, but still a long ways off).

If/when that time comes, developers would have to look at their development strategy, it will be a hassle to support d3d and opengl. So if they did see a market for both windows and linux they'd most likely consider opengl from the get go.

So, it would be nice to at least have more developers using opengl now, so the option is there for a port, but again I can't see that happening. People would have to do something radical and boycott a game and state the reason is because it uses d3d which is enforcing the tie-in of games to only one platform.

And just look at the moves microsoft can pull when they have this clout. Halo 2 being directx 10 only. Please... An xbox 1 port requiring the latest d3d. A strong arm tactic for vista if I ever saw one.

So I'm going to add this, can we actually blame developers for the state of affairs of linux gaming? Should we hold them accountable? See the majority of people do not care about anything except (in this case) what's best for their company. I mentioned Carmack because someone should be recognized when they do something knowing it's not necessarily the profitable move, it's just that they think it's right.
Re:Even if done by M$FT, it's still spyware... by koreth · 2006-07-21 06:05 · Score: 4, Interesting
I have to call bullshit on this one. The areas in which Windows is better than Linux for a nontechnical user are a lot more numerous than just games. I know this firsthand: I tried to replace XP with Ubuntu on my girlfriend's laptop about six months ago and ended up giving up after a week of screwing with it. (And I am not a nontechnical user.) She does not play any games on her laptop. Here's what I spent that week trying to get working:
- Asian input methods. My girlfriend is from Taiwan and sends email to her friends back home, but she primarily wants her computer to be English-language. In Windows, getting Chinese input to work on an English install of the OS takes, oh, roughly 90 seconds or so of clicking around in the control panel UI, and once enabled it works perfectly in virtually every common modern desktop application. Linux, not so much -- please edit your X configuration, please do one thing if you're running GNOME and something else if you're running KDE, oh, and by the way, don't expect to be able to enter Chinese characters when you run an app since most of them either don't handle alternate input methods at all or are only compatible with the input system you aren't using. (I am not blowing smoke on this -- Mark Shuttleworth specifically mentioned lousy Asian input support as one of the reasons he wanted to delay the next Ubuntu release.)
- Media playing. Bitch all you want about how it's the fault of patents or closed formats from evil companies, the fact of the matter is that you can browse the web on a Windows machine and expect to be able to watch most of the video you come across, and listen to most of the music you come across. Linux? Well, if you're willing to violate the law, and you happen to know how to configure your system to install packages from nonstandard repositories, you can hack together support for some of the common formats. Not all of them, but hey, you didn't really want to watch that movie preview, did you?
- Device support. Just try hooking up, say, a Canon scanner (I have one; it works fine on my Mac and my Windows boxes, but it's a doorstop when I'm running Linux.) Again, is this the fault of Linux per se? Maybe not. As a nontechnical user do I care whose fault it is when I want to scan something I could scan when I was running Windows? Nope.
- Fonts. The ones that come with all the Linux distros I've tried are clunky, and they vary in size between font families in odd ways that make a lot of Web pages look funny. Yep, I know all about the Microsoft Core Fonts package. It is not installed by default. It is not in the default repositories on a new system. If I am a nontechnical user it is therefore nigh-irrelevant.
Okay, that's probably enough. The point is that there's more wrong than just games. I completely agree that if all you want to do is read simple HTML email and visit non-multimedia web sites, you don't want to listen to music or watch DVDs, you don't have any devices other than a keyboard, mouse and monitor, you only want to input text in one language, and you never need to trade Word documents or Excel spreadsheets with someone who cares what the formatting looks like, then Linux on the desktop is definitely ready for your nontechnical-user needs!

Doc Leaf by LiquidCoooled · 2006-07-21 01:44 · Score: 4, Funny

You can remove the sting from WGA bites by wiping some doc leaves over your keyboard and mouse.

--
liqbase :: faster than paper

Only one thing to say... by Anonymous Coward · 2006-07-21 01:45 · Score: 4, Funny

Nelson's Ha Ha!

Genuine Disadvantage by digitaldc · 2006-07-21 01:46 · Score: 4, Insightful

Didn't you know?
You have to keep buying your Windows software every year or two in order to update it, how else is Microsoft going to stay the biggest software company in the world?

--
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson

Well, look on the bright side... by andytrevino · 2006-07-21 01:46 · Score: 5, Funny

at least Microsoft doesn't play favorites!

I'ma coming, F/OSS folks! by Anonymous Coward · 2006-07-21 01:47 · Score: 4, Insightful

Like many people who will see these alerts, I don't believe I did anything wrong. I'm sure that's going to be a common refrain in this new era of untrusting software and companies.

I will be royally pissed if I received one of these messages after spending hundreds of dollars on a software product. And if they disable the software beause they think it's pirated, they will lose me as a customer - forever.

I can just see it now, businesses trying to get work done while dealing with those messages.

This hurts legitimate users by DeathKoil · 2006-07-21 01:48 · Score: 5, Insightful

I've had some problems with the new WGA that has gone out, and I find that it is only hurting and hindering legitimate users. People I know who are running Corporate or otherwise cracked editions are patiently waiting for a new crack for WGA, but legitimate end users are worried / concerned when the little alert pops up saying that their copy of Windows might not be legit. It has been my experience that if you are using a cracked / Volume / Corporate version of Windows, you know it, you ignore the messages, you wait for a crack. The legit users who see this message get scared. Therefore, I don't see WGA solving any of the problems MS intended it to.

ah well, that's all we can muster? by yagu · 2006-07-21 01:49 · Score: 5, Insightful

Like many people who will see these alerts, I don't believe I did anything wrong. I'm sure that's going to be a common refrain in this new era of untrusting software and companies. Ah well.

Ah well?, Ah well? This is the extent of outrage in "this new era"?!? Amazing!

Re:ah well, that's all we can muster? by BlueCodeWarrior · 2006-07-21 02:27 · Score: 4, Interesting

well, thats just how it is nowadays, you'll be back.

What's sad is how true this is nowadays. I'm 20, and so is my girlfriend. After getting shitty service at Best Buy, (and getting my bags searched every time I leave the place) I said, "This is enough. I'm never going back." And I haven't. If my friends want to get something there, I sit on the curb until they're done. Fuck Best Buy.

Anyway, my point: The other day I was sitting on said curb with my girlfriend while my friends went inside. She says, "I don't understand why you can't just even go inside. I'm done trying to figure you out." I replied, "What's so hard to figure out about not shopping at a place that sucks? Good companies get my dollar. Bad ones don't. That's how this is supposed to work." and she says, "Why do you have to be so political all the time?"

I'd like to think that most of America is like myself, and not like my girlfriend, but I have the feeling that most of my generation are idiots.
Re:ah well, that's all we can muster? by smellsofbikes · 2006-07-21 03:56 · Score: 4, Interesting

I'm saying this as someone who is twice your age: it's an age thing. She'll realize, some day, that her actions do have an effect. She already does, actually: I bet she doesn't drop her fast food bag, styrofoam container, and drink on the sidewalk when she's done with it because she knows that's disgusting and antisocial. She doesn't yet see that such an action is as "political" as not shopping at a store that's treated its customers badly. (and maybe she never will.)
And on to the other part: you, too, will realize that you don't have to make a crusade out of opposition. I'm not criticizing you: I think you're doing a good, upstanding thing. But you're doing it at the cost of damaging your relationship. In another ten years, you'll think twice about that particular tradeoff. That's why young people drive a lot of the change in the world: they're willing to sit out on the curb to protest things, where people with another twenty years are thinking "I support that, but I don't want to make waves."

--
Nostalgia's not what it used to be.

Sadly Enough... by alphasubzero949 · 2006-07-21 01:50 · Score: 4, Funny

Thurrott will still be ranting and raving about how much Windows is light years ahead of OS X and Linux.

He simply doesn't get it by Kope · 2006-07-21 01:54 · Score: 5, Insightful

". . . I don't beleive I did anything wrong. I'm sure that's going to be a common refrain in this new era of untrusting software and companies. Ah well."

No, not "ah well."

Customers have a legitimate expectation to be treated as if they are wanted and valued not as if they are a threat to the enterprise for using the product they purchased.

Companies that treat their customers as criminals instead of as their reason for being in business will find themselves at a severe competative disadvantage. Such actions will hurt companies who engage in them, in big and small ways.

WGA has already resulted in several lawsuits. Those court proceedings are sapping resources from Microsoft. There is time being spent by developers and software architects in helping lawyers prepare court cases instead of doing the more important parts of their job. Those resources aren't being used to fix bugs, develop new features, or in any way serve current or future customers.

That hurts the both the consumer and the stockholder.

Why would he be outraged? by MarkByers · 2006-07-21 01:55 · Score: 4, Insightful

Why would he be outraged? He is trying to sell Windows. He's trying to get people accustomed to the accusations that come from WGA. He's not trying to discourage them from using Windows altogether. It's his job to do this!

--
I'll probably be modded down for this...

Re:Bigger man than I by Dionysos+Taltos · 2006-07-21 01:55 · Score: 5, Insightful

Look at it again ... I'm sure that's going to be a common refrain in this new era of untrusting software and companies. Ah well."

That's not someone who's being a "bigger" person. That's resignation. That's yet another person who'll refuse to look at alternatives and will stick with Microsoft. Why? I don't know, I really don't ... and I find it scary.

Re:Not that I expected by patrixmyth · 2006-07-21 01:59 · Score: 5, Insightful

Fixing the computers of friends and family, I've had occassion to call in to Microsoft on licensing issues quite a few times. They've always been tremendously helpful, non-judgemental and ready to listen. It's not a perfect system, but it's fairly well designed to handle false-positives and take care of mistakes fairly. It does put them at a competitive disadvantage in that I'd rather buy a product that didn't have activation and authentication, but that's their call to make. I have a problem with our government subsidizing enforcement, but what a private company does with it's own product is fair game, as long as they let me know about it before I buy it.

--
"Don't you know you're going to shock the monkey?"- Peter Gabriel

Re:Seems like the way to go by Kadin2048 · 2006-07-21 02:01 · Score: 5, Insightful

Um ... no.

While it's true (and I'm damn glad) that Apple doesn't mess around with any "activation" crap per se, saying that they don't burden the user with any 'anti-piracy technologies' is a bit rich.

After all, I have a $1500 hardware dongle sitting under by desk to prove it.

Apple doesn't need any WGA-like stuff, because even if you pirate the OS (which, let's face it, happens all the time -- heck, you can dupe an OS X installation CD using tools provided with OS X), you can only run it on hardware purchased from Apple. Assuming they ratchet up the requirements accordingly every few years, they have a stream of income from you. Not as much as if you bought each version of the OS as it came out, but it's still something. Apparently, it's enough for them not to burden their users with onerous phone-home spyware.

The biggest reasons why I wish the OSX86 Project people would just crawl under a rock and disappear, is that if OS X ever gets severely cracked to the point where an average user can install it on commodity hardware, I can almost guarantee that Apple will go the activation route. Sure, I'm sure they'll be a lot friendlier about it than Microsoft has, and the whining will be suitably mild (and they'll have lines of pundits defending them), but it'll be obnoxious just the same.

--
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."

UGA - equivalent of WGA for Ubuntu users by dolson · 2006-07-21 02:03 · Score: 5, Funny

Ubuntu users everywhere were jealous when they heard about how Microsoft Windows users get this kind of authenticity test, whereas Linux users have no such thing. Well, fret not! I have been hard at work programming the equivalent for Linux users. The first release I give you is UGA - the Ubuntu Genuine Advantage. (More versions for other distros coming soon.) Here are the steps to follow for Ubuntu users: 1) Hit Alt+F2. 2) Paste this into the text entry box: zenity --info --text "Your copy of Ubuntu is valid.\nThank you for not pirating it\!" 3) Click Run. Enjoy!

Re:UGA - equivalent of WGA for Ubuntu users by Aladrin · 2006-07-21 03:13 · Score: 4, Funny

OMG, it said:

"Could not run the specified command."

Does this mean my Ubuntu is pirated!?!/!111!one!!?!

--
"If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM

Re:Bigger man than I by gilroy · 2006-07-21 02:07 · Score: 5, Insightful

"It is difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends upon his not understanding it."
-=-Upton Sinclair

--
The Mongrel Dogs Who Teach

Re:hypocracy by mopslik · 2006-07-21 02:08 · Score: 5, Insightful

People bitch and moan about a Microsoft software program that is designed to stop piracy...

...except that, if you were to read TFA, you would see that this is not a pirated version of Windows. Do you really want to start a program where you randomly accuse your customers of being software pirates, even when they are not? How will that help "stop piracy" when the real pirates are using corporate keys to begin with (and are immune from WGA) and the real customers are being falsely flagged?

But I guess you just wanted to whine about Apple.

Re:Not that I expected by KarmaMB84 · 2006-07-21 02:10 · Score: 5, Interesting

The one and only time I ever had to call, I was immediately accused of installing the software on too many machines. They were so quick to jump the gun on it, that I know damn well they couldn't have been actually looked at the history for the software since it had been activated ONCE on the EXACT same hardware on ONE machine almost a year prior.

That is the ONE problem I have with Microsoft's software: they see pirates around every corner and their customers are criminals.

Re:TPM by RustNeverSleeps · 2006-07-21 02:10 · Score: 4, Insightful

True, but the story here is that WGA is a problem for legitimate customers of Windows. No legitimate OS X customer is ever going to be bothered by or even realize that OS X checks for TPM. (This assuming that Apple doesn't start doing other, DRM-related stupid stuff with TPM.)

Re:This hurts legitimate users by antic · 2006-07-21 02:15 · Score: 4, Interesting

Legitimate Windows users have to put up with WGA. Legitimate Adobe Creative Suite users have to put up with activation processes that are a pain in the butt if you have a deadline and needed to reinstall on a new laptop because your previous one died. Legitimate DVD purchases have to put up with hard or impossible to skip FBI warnings before the actual content, while pirated versions either physical or downloaded have nothing of the sort.

How are they all getting it so very wrong?

--
'Thats they exact same thing a banana wrench monkey.'

Because he's a Lackey Wuss by Geccie · 2006-07-21 02:17 · Score: 5, Interesting

Its because this guy is a complete and total Lackey Wuss! He has a legitimate copy of a product and - from what I gather - is a journalistic outlet.

He has an opportunity to voice the opinions and concerns of the people and instead chose to bend over and take one right in the arse!

Thanks Paul and Fuck You very much!

Re:This hurts legitimate users by Kadin2048 · 2006-07-21 02:19 · Score: 4, Insightful

Actually if you look on BitTorrent right now (at one of the bigger trackers, e.g. Pirate Bay) and just type in Windows XP, some of the most popular downloads aren't just straight ISOs of the Microsoft install discs, instead they're cracked versions of them.

In some cases you can get cracked versions of Windows that bypass all the serialization (it just drops in a corporate number), install faster than a legit disc, and have a lot of updates not in the MSFT discs slipstreamed in, so it reduces your update workload once you get the thing installed.

In many ways, the cracked products are superior to the legitimate ones from an ease-of-use standpoint.

Not that I'd know any of this from experience or anying ... heard it from a guy, you know, on the bus.

--
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."

I've heard this before by Space+cowboy · 2006-07-21 02:32 · Score: 4, Insightful

... and I still don't buy it.

The argument that the machine is a "dongle" only works if it were true. It's not. I can purchase a copy of OSX Tiger and give it to any number of other Mac users to install on their machine, and Apple lose money. Sure, you *have* already bought a computer from them, and I'm sure Apple are happy about that, but to claim that it somehow restricts you from piracy is just wrong.

Back when I were a young lad, I had an Atari XL (the first computer I ever had that came with a disk drive :-), there was a bloke ("Rob C", a postman actually, who my brother actually ended up working with for a while) who spent a lot of time cracking games and putting N of them on a disk with his name on the menu. Lots of disks made their way around the pirate scene. Did the XL somehow become a dongle, just because it wasn't a PC ?

People operate within their communities, if there is the potential for theft within that community there will be some people who will take that opportunity. For the mac, the community is mac-owners, and the potential for piracy is just as valid within that community as for PC owners within theirs. The Mac community is smaller, true, but that doesn't matter when you're (ahem) "swapping" software.

I just don't believe that spending $$$ on a computer entitles you to stop spending $ on software from the same company (can you tell I'm a reformed character :-). I must have spent ~$1200 on a mac, and ~$300 on OS so far. 25% is a significant chunk of cash just to assume the user will be "a good guy/gal", but that's what they do, and I (for one) appreciate it.

Simon.

--
Physicists get Hadrons!

Yet another reason to buy a Mac by Enrique1218 · 2006-07-21 02:38 · Score: 5, Funny

When are you Windows users ever going to learn? You guys are just like abused women who just can't seem to get out of the relationship. You may be financially dependent. Emotionally dependent (unusual). Physically (gaming, porn, gambling; even more weird). Microsoft doesn't trust you, manipulates you, gouges you, and neglects you! You need to ditch that guy! With Windows, you are not a user but just plain used! You need to give that artistic guy who always dresses good and seems to be gay a chance. Perhaps, you might like the geeky awkward guy who needs some work to bring him around!

--
You don't have to be smart to use a Mac, you just have to be smart enough to buy one

Re:Bigger man than I by rbochan · 2006-07-21 02:50 · Score: 4, Funny

That's yet another person who'll refuse to look at alternatives and will stick with Microsoft. Why? I don't know, I really don't ... and I find it scary.

"The people hate the lizards and the lizards rule the people."
"Odd," said Arthur, "I thought you said it was a democracy."
"I did," said Ford, "it is."
"So," said Arthur, hoping he wasn't sounding ridiculously obtuse, "why don't the people get rid of the lizards?"
"It honestly doesn't occur to them. They've all got the vote, so they all pretty much assume that the government they've voted in more or less approximates the government they want."
"You mean they actually vote for the lizards."
"Oh yes," said Ford with a shrug, "of course."
"But," said Arthur, going for the big one again, "why?"
"Because if they didn't vote for a lizard, then the wrong lizard might get in."
--Douglas Adams, 'So Long and Thanks for All the Fish...'

--
...Rob
The American Dream isn't an SUV and a house in the suburbs; it's Don't Tread On Me.

Re:Not that I expected by johneee · 2006-07-21 02:51 · Score: 4, Interesting

Which is interesting because when I replaced the hard drive in my laptop, which required me to reactivate Windows for the gosh knows how many'th time (The machine and the software is 5 years old almost, I bought it used which meant it was activated at least twice before I bought it - once on the original purchase and once when it was wiped to be resold) the software didn't want to activate by itself since it said it had been activated too many times already. The conversation with the person on the phone went something like this:

MS: Thank you for calling Microsoft, can I have the installation id that's on your screen?
Me: (reads long number)
MS: Thank you. (pause) Ok, how many machines has this been installed on? (You could read this as someone accusing me of piracy, but it's a pretty reasonable question when some people might not realise you're not supposed to install on numerous machines)
Me: Just the one
MS: And why do you need to reactivate?
Me: Replaced the hard drive in my laptop.
MS: Ok, I'm going to read out an activation number for you to put in the box, and you should be ok. (Gives me long number)

Very polite, minimal questions, took less than 5 minutes, and it was at 11:30 at night on a Saturday.

Now, it's fair enough to say that there might not be a real need for activation, that MS is being boneheaded by requiring it, or that they should be more trusting of their customers; these are all fair comments. It's also possible that you might have had a phone agent on a bad day. I just know from my experience that they've been always very very polite and if they err, it's on the side of permissiveness. I also assume that if I was hyper-sensitive and acted like a jerk, they might have been less polite to me. I would never suggest that was the case with you of course.

--
- ------- There are ten kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who... Huh?

Corporate Double-Speak by Aqua_boy17 · 2006-07-21 03:04 · Score: 5, Insightful

This may be somewhat OT, but is anyone else sick to death of this? Welcome to the world of Corporate double-speak where:

Small = Tall
Medium = Grande
Large = Venti

So why in the world is it called "Windows Genuine Advantage" anyway when it's really just an anti-piracy detector? What conceivable "Advantage" is there for the consumer and why wasn't Windows Update just left well enough alone? I know Microsoft has a right to protect it's products but at least have the decency to call it what it is: Anti-Piracy validation.

And before I get modded flamebait, I'm not particularly picking on MS or Starbucks here. I am trying to make the point that in many ways and in many different forms of media we are increasingly being conditioned to accept corporate and marketing double-speak that just does not make any sense. These are just the examples that came to mind first.

--
What if the Hokey Pokey really is what it's all about?

That short phrase says it all. "Ah well." by rdmiller3 · 2006-07-21 03:28 · Score: 4, Insightful

The article's author, while lamenting the fact that Microsoft has just accused him of a federal crime, simply responds with a sigh and a recommendation that we should all get used to the idea.

"Ah well."

EXCUSE ME?!? No.

This guy has already decided to go with the lemming mentality. He figures that lots of people will have this problem, so why worry? That's what people thought about the RIAA's threats too, until the lawsuits started.

Re: No big deal? by Darundal · 2006-07-21 04:06 · Score: 4, Interesting

(EG. One time, I tried to explain that my Windows activation problem was due to experimenting with installing my copy inside Virtual PC, and I had since removed that - and just wanted to put it back on my original PC like it was supposed to be. That was met with the support person repeating the question over and over, "How many total computers have you installed Windows on?" They seemed to have no idea what I was talking about.....)

What is so weird about that? Because they work in one department of a tech company, they aren't suddenly turned into technical virtuosos, or even technically literate people. The person on the other end had probably never heard of a Virtual PC, and would probably be confused if the concept was explained to them, as well as not understanding WHY one would ever want to do a thing like that.

The other persons probably saw the conversation like this;
Support: Ok, can I ask how many computers you have this copy of Windows installed on?
You: I only have it installed on one computer. The only reason it is doing this is because I had it installed on a Virtual PC on another computer awhile ago, but now I want to put this back on the computer it came on
(The Support Person here hears that you (A) had it installed on another computer at one point and (B) hears a term they are completely unfamiliar with, adding to the confusion)
Support: Uhh...How many total computers have you installed Windows on?
You: Just one.
Support: Thank you...

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