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PS3 Missed Ship Targets, Loses Exclusives
Sony's having a rough week. After shootings on launch day and a harsh review from the New York Times, Bloomberg is now calling Sony out as having completely missed its shipping targets. The analyst company says there may have been as few as 50% of aimed-for units available, and that the company may only get about 200,000 units to stores by the end of the year (something Sony flatly denies). PS3 fans now also have to deal with the fact that Koei is cross-platforming two previously exclusive titles. Fatal Inertia and Bladestorm are now in development for the 360 as well, marking the latest in a string of titles that have slipped away from Sony. There is some consolation for the company to take away from this week, though. They did better than Microsoft last week in Japan, with around 81,000 PS3s, 19,000 PSPs, and 16,000 PS2s sold to a mere 4,000 Xbox 360s and ... 4 Xboxes.
Why don't we get USEFUL numbers. Sony launches a console, Microsoft has a console that's been out for a year. Why do we expect Microsoft's console to sell as many?
In america the amount of consoles Microsoft sell weekly isn't that many (probably 5 digits on a good week, but not much more)
Of course it wouldn't be 1up article if it was biased in some random direction.
Then again Microsoft's numbers are picking up in preperation for Blue Dragon, only a couple monthes ago they were barely breaking 1K units. However now it's much more.
I was just in the Sony Style store at 550 Madison Avenue (Sony's US headquarters) and they were selling PS3s. There was a line of about 15 people (ok, men) at the checkout, which is highly unusual in my experience (I shop there regularly) and the staff behind the desk had some PS3s sitting on the floor ready to be handed over. The boxes go out in a distinctive black bag with PS3 graphics on it.
If I'm correct the original PS3 was set to be built without the BluRay.
I'm willing to bet that is the root their delays.
At some point some marketing exec sat down at a global strategy meeting and predicted that to make BluRay work they would need to inject using their most popular gadget.
Won't it suck for that exec if it turns out BluRay killed the PlayStation...or at least crippled it regardless of majority share of the market.
"No doubt one may quote history to support any cause, as the devil quotes scripture." - Learned Hand
I'm not usually a Sony doomsday prophet, but if something can kill the PS3, it's this. They need their RPGs. They need Koei and Squeenix. If those juggernauts start to slip away, then Sony is in big, big trouble. Most switches will lean in the 360 direction because of comparable specs and input mechanisms. If the exodus reaches some sort of critical mass, where companies don't believe that the PS3 will sell anymore, that whole situation might end very badly for Sony, and very well for MS and, to a lesser extent, Nintendo.
Sony is dying.
Same troll, new generation.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
At this stage in the game, who is buying a NEW Xbox? You couldn't find a used one or hit up Ebay? I need to find one of these 4 people. I have a nice 486 with a Turbo button that they might find appealing.
-Now I may be an idiot, but there is one thing I am not sir, and that, sir, is an idiot.
At the end of all this, its just Sony's to lose. They are the reigning KING of consoles. Anyone can spew the facts of Xbox this or Nintendo that, but at the end Sony controls 65%+ of the console gaming pie.
'High DEMAND' thats key word buzz of the report. what the consumers were thinking about for PS3. Chances are a good portion of people who wanted a PS3 and didn't get one will NOT switch over to another system. Its not like they are thinking 'Well I guess I'll get an Xbox 360 since I can't get a PS3' Thats just wrong consumer mentality to assume.
This lack of shortages does not matter. If Sony pushes out PS3 next year this will be a thing of the past. Sure they may lose market share to Nintendo and MS, but unless there is massive failure on their PS3 I don't see anyone knocking them off their throne too soon.
spoken like a true fanboy! shortage=high demand think about it. and the fact that blue-ray is being used is the main reason why there is shortage there expensive and more diffcult to make. sony even had to push back thier home blue-ray players becuase they had the same problems. and ten decades? a decade is ten years? so 100 years ago sony was making gaming consoles. damn your smart. besides the ps3 is computer that runs linix yeah... it's like that.
Don't get ahead of yourself; Netcraft hasn't confirmed it.
Reality has a conservative bias: it conserves mass, energy, momentum...
http://www.the-magicbox.com/topten.htm
For 2006 through the end of October, 84,949 360s sold in Japan. 81,639 PS3s sold at launch.
From what I can find, there were 100K 360s sold in Japan in 2005.
So it looks like somewhere around 190K 360s vs 82K PS3s in Japan currently with Microsoft's 1 year head start.
Value Japanese sales in the greater scheme of things as you please.
"PS3 Missed Ship Targets" the convoy must have made it safely across the channel then.
Why did the chicken cross the road? Because Elon Musk put an AI chip in its head.
PS3 Missed Ship Targets, Loses Executives
Am I hte only one that read it that way the first time.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
3A 4E 22 05 C1 83 0B 7A
It's random, but my posting it here is probably considered illegal to someone.
So, is this only the second time you've posted this exact comment, or have I missed others?
I'd accuse you of karma whoring, but people normally log in for that.
Reality has a conservative bias: it conserves mass, energy, momentum...
In English?
Actually, I'd say it's quite the opposite. I would fully expect 360 sales numbers in Japan to be lower than usual because of Blue Dragon. It makes sense and here's why.
We know that there's surprisingly a lot of interest in the Blue Dragon 360 bundle, set to release in December. It also recently took over the #3 spot on Famitsu's list of most anticipated titles. So, if you know there's a bundle coming out in December, why on earth would you buy a 360 now? It's akin to buying a system when you know a price drop is going to happen in a few weeks.
The numbers will be most interesting a week after the game and bundle launches. (The week it actually ships will see an artificial bump of 360 sales, similar to the PS3 one. I fully expect, "wowzers, 360>PS3 lolololezr" articles then as well) Then we can start tracking trends to see if MS will actually have a chance in Japan, or if it's going to be more of the same.
-- jchenx
I've seen this exact same comment posted on multiple sites in the past couple of days.
Usually someone corrects the lies, like the terrible >97.5% backwards compatibility (compared to the 30% XBox360 backward compatibility).
Yeah, it's funny how the poster is talking about "poor backward compatability" when quite a few users have said that they're minor issues for the most part. Certain titles are unplayable but Sony has said that they're planning on fixing those issues.
Oh, then there's the "numerous" hi-def scaling issues which is really just the same issue (once again, goint to be patched soon) happening to multiple titles.
This guy should be writing for some political or marketing company. He's got the "take a minor issue and blow it out of proportion using clever wording" down to a T.
- Poor backward compatilibity with PS1 and PS2 games
- Numerous high def upscaling issues including PS3 BluRay movies not appearing in high definition properly
Both of which are most likely fixable through firmware upgrades. Especially the compatibility which is supposed to be fixed in short order.
- Poor graphics on side to side game comparison tests
- Poor framerates and "tearing" reported on multiple game titles, including Tony Hawk and Mobile Suit Gundam: Crossfire
I say this a lot. Maybe I should make it my sig. Launch titles suck. Always. It's a fact of life. These games are not representative of the system. Play Kileak for the PS1 and Evergrace for the PS2 and get back to me.
- Poor buggy development tools which make development very hard as compared to other current gen systems
- Multiple launch titles cancelled or delayed due to development issues
When the PS2 was in development the developers of Oddworld were working on the third game for the PS2 when they suddenly announced that they were switching to an XBox exclusive because the PS2 was too hard to code for. This of course sent the game media into a frenzy. And look at where we are now.
And finally the losses-per-system articles all use fuzzy numbers. Many of these devices are patented and manufactured by Sony themselves and nobody outside of Sony knows exactly how much it costs Sony to manufacture said device. Microsoft on the other hand mainly assembles their systems based on parts that they have to buy. I'm not saying the 360 costs more to build than the PS3, I am merely saying that you me and whoever iSuppli are don't know how much they really DO cost.
Me, I'm going to play the waiting game to see who comes out on top. But while Sony certainly has screwed this up I don't see any real indicators yet that they are going to lose.
A small number maybe, but Sony are also undoubtedly losing out on the import markets. After they recently shut down Lik-Sang.com and got importing PS3's to the UK and a number of other countries banned by law they will have surely shut out a sector of the market of those who are the most hardcore gamers and cannot wait for their consoles (with the European and Australasia launch coming in March 2007 due to lack of Blu-Ray components). It's a shame they had to go to these lengths, which would be understandable if they had have had a global launch date, but leaving some countries without the console for a number of months isn't the best idea, and by blocking imports to those countries they are only loosing more sales and aggravating consumers.
I have a feeling that Sony will need to start giving incentives or at least making it a desirable environment for developers in order to create some games that will become a MUST for the console buyers (like Halo for Xbox, Gears of War/Halo 3 for Xbox360, Mario for N64 etc) if they want to really compete with the low priced Wii and the 360 which is flaunting it's powerful internet features now.
Business Voyeur
The are a fixed number of bundles. Apparently they're all reserved/preordered, so there isn't anything to "wait" for.
That's a terrible analogy. Perhaps you'd like to come up with a bad car an logy next.
"You see it's like this: If Honda designed a car with seven engines..."
Touch everywhere, even when inappropriate.
The interesting thing is that if all the numbers are true (or even close), that means that over 10% of all PS3s purchased were resold on eBay -- maybe higher. Don't know why, but that's funny to me.
Granted it bucks the trend, but the DS Lite has been selling over 100,000 units per week in Japan since Nintendo has been able to make over 100,000 systems per week for Japan.
Last I heard, it was the limited edition sets that were all sold-out. If you're telling me that all 100,000 bundles have been reserved, then that's just frickin amazing. And you'd be right, there wouldn't be anything to "wait" for.
Although, I suppose that if Blue Dragon is the only reason why you want a 360, it would make sense to just wait until it launches and pick the system up with the game (even if you can't get the bundle), to save multiple trips to the store. There'd be no worry about limited quantities of the 360, since there's been little demand for the systems.
-- jchenx
Actually the Xbox 360 number is closer to 73%.
Now mind you Sony actually INCLUDED PS2 hardware in the PS3 to play back PS2 games...
Microsoft does it via software emulation.
Looks to me that Sony has some serious issues if they cannot get PS2 games to work on PS2 hardware...
The reason why fans and foes alike are complaining about the backwards compatibility problems is because it has seemed to hit the more popular games. For example, the Final Fantasy series is apparently all broken to one degree or another, with XI not even playable.
"You see it's like this: If Honda designed a car with seven engines..."
Damn, I might just have to buy a Honda!
Sony been leading for what 10 decades now
... yeah, worst post ever.
That would be Nintendo. Otherwise
"When I first heard Daydream Nation it quite frankly scared the living shit out of me." -- Matthew Stearns
As a general rule 'Most' suck. Fine, but Zelda rocks, and there are other exceptions...
It could me I misread something, though honestly 100k units isn't a huge amount when you think about it. It is a large number relative to the number of sales they've already had in Japan, but they still sell 2-3 times that amount every month in the US alone.
I suspect Blue Dragon isn't the only reason to purchase a 360 in Japan, though it is probably the game that will push many people over the edge to get one.
Translation: We love it when people are shooting each other for an overpriced piece of hype. It truly demonstrates the power of PR and short supplies.
OSGGFG - Open Source Gamers Guide to Free Games
Day 2 and Sony is in 3rd place. I believe I called this one months ago.
OSGGFG - Open Source Gamers Guide to Free Games
Searching for a Playstation 3 tech demo on YouTube I found a Gears of Wars like preview of Unreal, on PS3! Today it is marketed as a Microsoft supported game. Does anyone know why that PS3 version has been abandoned? Did Microsoft support it with enough dollars or is this GoW only a preview of the might to come?
I wonder if there's any truth to the hypothesis that whichever console gets Square-Enix's primary franchises first (Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest), wins the market share for that generation. I believe it's always been true (maybe not with the SNES/Genesis, since that race was pretty close I believe).
If so, Sony better be worried and lock up those franchises tightly, and not give Squeenix any wiggle room. We already know they're working on the 360 (with the old Final Fantasy XI and Project Slypheed), so it's not out of the question that some flavor of the next FF or DQ game would be released on the 360. Also, if Blue Dragon really does well, Squeenix may not want Mistwalker Studios to "own" the J-RPG genre for the 360.
-- jchenx
Your selfless concern is touching.
Not a refutation, but a mitigating point, to be sure. Each new console has issues that will be corrected with firmware updates. This is a good thing.
Ok I'll bite:
About 98% of previous titles play just fine. Some have sync issues with FMV sequences, which do not affect gameplay (and yes, will be fixed). This is not 'poor compatibility'. Go check Sony's game database if you like, they have a tool for this.
Again, disingenuous. Some older model HDTVs don't do 720p, and there is an issue with that particular resolution on those particular sets. And fixable. Considering the very small installed base of total HDTVs, this strikes me as a fairly minor problem (although irritating to be sure). And that is the only problem, not 'numerous'.
I agree. Both the Wii and PS3 online capabilities are inferior to Microsoft's network.
While I agree that the high-end SKU bundle should have included these, you surely must agree that most people would end up throwing this cable away. Nintendo doesn't even think you need to buy one from a store. (Or at all, until December.)
For that game. Talk about intellectually dishonest, you act like its an exhaustive comparison.
Yeah, maybe. Had some slowdown on Gears of War, too. Tony Hawk, being a cross-platform franchise, perhaps had the least amount of time for a PS3 port. Gundam just plain sucks. But point taken.
Remind me again, why do we care what Nolan Bushnell thinks of the PS3 dev environment?
Remind me again, why do WE care about the dev environment? How is that warning consumers of the dangers of the PS3?
Scrapin' the bottom of the barrel, here. Newsflash: software doesn't tend to ship on time. I'm not excusing them but this is hardly anything new.
Tell me, what is it when you remove a title from your previous console's dev roster so you can push it as a launch title for the next console?
The fact is, you are looking at two console launches only a week out. And considering the shortages, the data is skewed anyhow. You cannot project this out in a linear fashion. For instance what do you make of the fact that the PS3 and the DS are in American kids Top 10 Xmas Gifts list and the Wii is no where to be found?
What you are doing is called cherry-picking. You can do this to anything and make it look bad. Hey, what's with the Wii? No component cables for sale until December, and even
If Jesus wants me it knows where to find me.
That is one way to look at it. The other way to look at it is the PS3 almost sold more units in japan a week than the xbox360 has sold in total. I don't think Sony is too worried at this point
Of course, there are consoles that fail to do this, and surprisingly enough they ah...fail. ex. Cybermorph for the Jaguar, Sewer Shark for the Sega CD, Doom for the 32X, Coincidence?
Your rebuttal reeks of as much optimism as the original poster's did of pessimism.
There are numerous, deep flaws with the PS3 and with Sony's strategy over the last year. No amount of rationalization changes that.
Yes, I'm a Nintendo fan. Despite my poor experience with the PS1, I was also very excited about the PS2 -- until I saw that Sony was lying about it. This time around they're just being even more blatant.
--Jeremy
Jesus was a liberal
"Remind me again, why do WE care about the dev environment? How is that warning consumers of the dangers of the PS3?"
;)
Because poor dev environments caused the downfall of several historic game consoles. See: Sega Saturn.
While there were other issues with the Saturn, such as dev libraries being difficult to get ahold of... development of Sega Saturn cross platform titles often meant spending several extra months of development on the Saturn compared to, say, the PS1. It was one of the primary reasons the Saturn failed (along with its high initial pricetag, and difficulty getting hands on dev kits in the first place, low number of game releases outside of japan.. all of which except the last sound eerily familiar when looked at in context of the PS3).
Ease of system development is very important in forecasting how well third party developers will attach to a system. That's why it's important for a consumer to take into account on initial release. After a year or two when it becomes obvious which system will have better developer support, it can be safely ignored. But what we're trying to do is forecast which will be the one that will have the most numbers sold.
On a sidenote, one of the reasons the PS2 caught on initially and sold a huge number of units was adding DVD. At least, in Japan. DVD technology hadn't caught on huge there yet, and that coupled with several exclusive RPGs (squeenix, etc) cemented its success in Japan. This to some extent also helped it sell well in the US. It's what they're trying to do again with the Blu-ray, but unfortunately the blu-ray technology doesn't have a firm foothold in one of their markets already. Blu-ray movies are few and far between, compared to a point when DVDs were being sold like hotcakes - at least, for US movies. This, along with the production woes, make them introducing a new format much more risky at this point in time.
And about your point about the 'top ten xmas gifts':
The kids polled are probably very young. While this is one of the targets of the Wii, I can definitely see how the PS3 came on the list, and the DS as well - without the Wii.
You have to look at where the youngin's are getting their information, and keep in fact that they're more impressionable by the media than your typical teenage/adult gamer. They hear 'blazingly fast' and 'not much faster than the gamecube' and they go apeshit. They list the DS because they've seen older kids at school with them, or schoolmates with them, or they've played their friends DS, etc. You have to keep in mind that younger kids see a bunch of people with something and say "Those are cool! Everyone has one! I want one too!" rather than making a truly informed decision based on market level projections, hardware issues/points, games, etc.
As a sidenote, I like how legos are up there on the list
Not sure what the exact blog is, but I saw it on the
Tech Tracks blog, saying that Sony had only about 125,000 to 175,000 PS3 units to sell last weekend while Nintendo sold about 425,000 to 475,000 Wii consoles at launch, with shipments of 1.5 million to 2 million units to North American stores this year.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Day 2 and Sony is in 3rd place. I believe I called this one months ago.
True, but the big question is - who's on Second?
Right now it's looking like the Wii is selling all it can ship from Nintendo, but will the larger current installed base of xBox360 added to the new Japan-style games allow it to pull a close second, or even edge out the Wii?
Will we have a repeat of the PS2 success, where the Wii pulls way ahead leaving the xBox360 and PS3 to battle it out for a distand second and third, or will we have a neck and neck first and second place struggle, with Sony so far back they end up being a laughingstock?
The earliest we can tell any of this will be January 15th when we get the end of year stats for post-Xmas sales worldwide. But in reality, we really need to give all three a year to get a real feel what's going on.
-- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
Also, try not to explain away the numbers by using the idea that these people would try to save trips. The Japanese are more mobile than Americans. Going to the game store isn't going out of the way. It's just part of another trip.
Oh, and according to Wikipedia:
They want Blue Dragon badly. And they don't care what system it's for.
Why did Sony set a launch when they clearly can't keep up with demand? Do people want it more that they can't have it, and Joey down the block has one? Did they just want to avoid being third in released systems? Nintendo's clearly hurting now that their system was released last. But then, Xbox 360 was the same way. It wasn't in stores for what, a good six months after "launch?" At least then they were the only next-gen console around.
Nintendo seems to be the only one with the supply to meet the demand. Stores are receiving shipments every week. They have a good lineup of games, Zelda being rated very highly by everyone. Some of the PS3 games I've read about seem to just be prettier/high-defier versions of existing fps/racers/madden. Nothing new with them but the price tag.
And how about them developers? All the extra work in textures and such for the prettiest hi-def graphics. One article said it was in the $10+ million range to make a game. Then they only sell for $10 more than Nintendo Wii games. Companies have to sell massive numbers just to keep themselves even, which explains sticking with set genres. No chance for experimenting on new styles or anything with that huge a risk.
By the time there are enough PS3s for stores to have some on their shelves, Nintendo will already be hitting 10 million systems. Each of those will have perhaps 3-5 store-bought games, as well as some Virtual Console games. That's a big hole they have to dig out of.
So, why did they launch prematurely?
Good point, although I'm not sure I completely buy it. For your typical Blue Dragon fan, you can either get a 360 now and check out the other games that are on it. Or perhaps only BD interests you, so you'd rather just pick up the console then. I have no idea, nor should I pretend to know, the mind of the average Japanese video gamer.
In any case, all the speculation will end in a few weeks anyway, once the dang thing ships and we start getting real numbers. I guess my main point is that the sales numbers in Japan now, while interesting, don't tell the whole story. I think we agree on that, at least.
-- jchenx
Well, that and the fact that nobody gives a flip about HD movies anyway. With the video tape->DVD transition, the biggest draw for normal people (i.e., not audiophiles) was simply not having to rewind the stupid thing, not the better A/V quality. Blu-ray has no similar tangible advantage, so people don't care.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
(Yeah, I know the Warriors games have almost always come out on the XBox, but the PS2 versions generally come out earlier and with expansions.)
If you've played the later games (SW and DW5 onwards), you can see why Koei started releasing them on the 360 rather than the XBox - when you play the PS2 version, having a lot of troops on screen really pushes it in a bad way. Enemies disappear but are still able to hit you, or the PS2 even crashes.
Bladestorm is/was one of the PS3 games that really interested me, apart from Devil May Cry 4. It's a new franchise, but it's the Hundred Years War version of the Warriors games so it's most probably in Koei's "million seller" genre. I've actually held off buying Samurai Warriors 2 until I get a 360, and the Bladestorm news just helps that along.
re:"Remind me again, why do we care what Nolan Bushnell thinks of the PS3 dev environment?"
Because I'd never be able to play PONG or BREAKOUT on my PS3!
You really should've gotten that PS2, man. That's certainly the best console available today if believe a console's merit comes from its games. Hell, you probably should go get a PS2 today. Much wiser purchase than a Wii, and most people out there agree with me. 300 bucks gets a new PS2 and seven top notch games. And people out there simply refuse to see that this is why the PS3 delays and production slowness aren't major problems, the PS2 is carrying the PS3's costs on its shoulders.
The PS3 is the pop culture item. Everyone wants one. In Europe, in Japan, and to lesser extent but still certainly in North America. If sony can manage to make any of these things, they will sell. Sony was wise to wait so long to get most of the kinks worked out of this program. Unlike Microsoft, sony wasn't trying to replace a sinking ship with a good console, Sony was trying to replace the most dominating console in gaming history.
No flaws in Sony's strategy. Sony consoles sold more than any other brand this year. Sony games sold more than any other console line too. PS2 is where its at. If some knucklehead out there wants to buy a PS3 now, well there's a large price to pay for that. Sony doesn't care than I'm going to wait it out and keep buying PS2 games and consider a PS3 later doen the road. Why would they care? That means more money for Sony. I'll get a PS3 when they have cheaper production costs.
But to buy a Wii? Why? It's not innovative, it's not a new platform, it's a gamecube and a powerglove ripoff. Is the Wii really better than the venerable Playstation 2?
As far as the XBOX 360 goes, well it's clearly the best system on the market. It's got all the capability and an improving library and the best online experience. But I'm still happy with my PS2 for now. I'm also worried that Microsoft will repeat its past history and move to another platform quickly. Original XBOX owners got shafted. PS2 owners certainly did not (if their system stayed working like mine did anyway)
Sony is actually being brilliant here. Sony is trading some of it's PS3 success to cement Bluray. It's going to work (internet movies suck on large screens and will for at least several years). PS2 will hold down the fort, and any scrutiny of why Sony has waited so long to enter the market should remember that PS2 will net a fuckton more money from license and hardware than 360 or Wii will this year or next. 100 million systems buys a lot more games for middle/lower class folks than a few million 360's and wii's will.
Personaly, I am glad to see SONY eat some pride and stuff.. All the ps/3 is more Hype than hip, More show and little go. I am glad to hear of the imperfections being exploited within Sony's Armor.. It's about time that SONY get theirs, and waws humbled by its own game.. A reputation and hype are no substutite (sp) for quality. My opinion, GK.
Yeah I said it,...
Seriously now people, if you enjoy GAMEPLAY the GC / Xb1 and the PS2 have a plethora of good games for them right now.
Some of the more recent games look really quite nice too.
All 3 companies should have "milked" their consoles closer towards a better end of life, Nintendo 18 months, Sony 12 and MS 24 (my opinion, based on their release date, graphical ability and quantity of games)
This way they could have focused on ensuring these new consoles are up to scratch in all depts - online, graphic ability, cost to manufacture, 3'rd party game support etc.
Mark my words on this, mark my words - all 3 companies are going to be terribly shocked to see people continue to purchase the old consoles for quite a while.
You thought the PS1 lasted a long time after the PS2 came out? You ain't seen nothing yet, these new systems won't sell diddly shit for several years (compared to their expectations)
MGS3 / Okami / Shadow of the Colossus / God of War / GT4 / Guitar Hero 1&2 / FFXII / GTA:San And / Onimusha series
PS2 games, all quite good to play all look quite good and all will keep selling the system for a while - none of those games look specifically "terrible"
Psychonauts / Halo 2 / GTA:San And / Lego Star Wars / Fable TLC / Jade Empire / Beyond Good and Evil / Ninja Gaiden / Forza
Xbox - same as above, most look quite good, play good are likely bargain bin games now and are worth investigating.
Resident Evil 4 / Metroid Prime / Wind Waker / Lego Star Wars / Need for Speed Carbon / Beyond Good and Evil / Monkey Ball / Various sport ports / Pikmin
GCube - again, some good games, cheap as chips to buy, looks pretty darn good overall - bargain bin games.
Don't get me wrong people - we need to move forward, but the PS1 was OLD and shitty when we got the PS2, this time round I couldn't comfortably say that any of the 3 systems out are "shitty"
It's a good time for us as consumers IF we have the balls to stop being consumer whores and stick with the old systems, used or discounted games and wait for them to STOP their microtransaction / overpriced / shit online strategies (one from each manufacturer there, guess which is which...)
The summary: if Sony don't drop prices fast they are going to be hurting even more from lack of adoption - they are in a race which is going to prove to be EVEN MORE expensive than they first suspected.
Surely more are sold through 2nd hand dealers, or even small shops.
Maybe sony counts all machines out of factory for that week.
Again, surely there are more than 4 people in a land of 180 million that would buy an xbox-1, its not like
they ALL are rich, there are smaller cities, and poor people everywhere.
What are xbox sales in korea like? I thought they hate the Js and would never touch a Sony console.
Liberty freedom are no1, not dicks in suits.
Dangit, I -liked- Evergrace. :(
Not all launch titles suck. But I'll grant you that most suck so badly that they drag the one or two good ones down with them.
"If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
No. It equates to Japanes people not liking stuff because the seller was too fucking stupid to figure out what they actually wanted. The 360 simply has very little games that appeal to Japanes people. Hence, no sales.
Fair enough.
You say that like this is irrefutable; fact is, we just don't know yet. I don't believe I am rationalizing - currently I have no dog in this fight, so to speak.
If Jesus wants me it knows where to find me.
You make a fine case, but there seems to be a gigantic hole in your argument... shaped like a PS2. Everybody said exactly the same things about how hard it was to develop for, and we all know how that turned out.
So while I agree that this can be an issue, from the consumer's point of view I really don't see people wondering about Insomnia's toolchain while standing there considering a console. Frankly, the colour of the unit has a bigger impact.
Umm... didn't you just make my argument for me? :)
If Jesus wants me it knows where to find me.
this time round I couldn't comfortably say that any of the 3 systems out are "shitty"
Me neither. However, I'm totally comfortable in saying that the release schedules for the Cube and Xbox are shitty, and have been for quite a while. If you've played everything you want to on those systems (which admittedly makes you either really picky or insanely dedicated to gaming), then it's time to move on.
Mind you, the PS2 still has some good stuff incoming. That system is not yet dead, but of course Sony couldn't pump out PS3s fast enough for upgraders anyway making the PS2 is a current system in all but name.
If you've played the later games (SW and DW5 onwards), you can see why Koei started releasing them on the 360 rather than the XBox - when you play the PS2 version, having a lot of troops on screen really pushes it in a bad way. Enemies disappear but are still able to hit you, or the PS2 even crashes.
Putting the games on the PS3 should nullify that problem.
Bladestorm is/was one of the PS3 games that really interested me, apart from Devil May Cry 4. It's a new franchise, but it's the Hundred Years War version of the Warriors games so it's most probably in Koei's "million seller" genre.
I'm not sure if Medieval Warriors (if I may call it that) will have the same appeal among Koei's fanboys as the others do. But it's certainly possible.
Rob
I disagree, but only in terms of speed-of-adoption. I think it is a better analogy to use Surround Sound. That was never really a 'must have' feature for many people, but 'sure is nice' for a lot, and it eventually creeped its way into much lower-end setups than when it appeared. Saying no one gives a flip is not accurate, the HD adoption curve is steepening, not flattening.
If Jesus wants me it knows where to find me.
From the Newsweek blog entry/article.
When asked whether Sony's resurgent strength as a console games publisher was pushing the company to shun exclusives, Tretton denied it. "We're the only company in this industry that's got development resources and talent that have established Number one hits on all three continents," he says, which is true, since the bulk of Microsoft's studios are in North America and Europe, while Nintendo's are concentrated in Japan. "We really feel like we're well positioned to contribute platform-defining games from a first-party standpoint, and we're not dependent on third-party community to the degree that a Microsoft would be.
Wasn't the line for why the GameCube wasn't the #1 console, and the reason the Dreamcast died exactly that kind of talk?
No flaws in Sony's strategy. Sony consoles sold more than any other brand this year. Sony games sold more than any other console line too. PS2 is where its at. If some knucklehead out there wants to buy a PS3 now, well there's a large price to pay for that. Sony doesn't care than I'm going to wait it out and keep buying PS2 games and consider a PS3 later doen the road. Why would they care?
Because they must accumulate a userbase quickly during the early life of the console since that's the numbers publishers will base their game development on. As long as the 360 has more units sold than the PS3 publishers will naturally prefer the 360 as there's more money to be made there (the Wii doesn't figure into this much since it'll most likely have a separate game development pipeline which prevents games from being easily shifted between the Wii and 360/PS3). For the publisher it doesn't matter what it costs Sony to make a unit or what the user pays for it, they can only sell one copy per unit anyway and most likely won't sell to more than a fraction of the userbase.
But to buy a Wii? Why? It's not innovative, it's not a new platform, it's a gamecube and a powerglove ripoff. Is the Wii really better than the venerable Playstation 2?
Since you can't compare a new console that's only available in one region yet with a console that had 6 years or so to accumulate games you'd have to go by comparing the hardware itself. In that case, yes, the Wii is better. The PS2 is really shoddy hardware wise, the games are the selling point and those cannot be compared with a next gen console's games yet (because those next gen consoles still have the first gen of games coming out).
100 million systems buys a lot more games for middle/lower class folks than a few million 360's and wii's will.
It'll go down, the PS2 is outdated now and publishers are scaling down support for it. No matter how much it sold it'll have lost the majority of its support one year into the next generation.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
Nintendo made the Playstation with its shoddy business policy. The Playstion (original one) would not have existed if Nintendo had followed through with Sony's SNES-CD program.
The PS would have existed, it'd just be sold under the SNES CD label. Sony wanted to get all the license fees game developers paid to the console manufacturer (essentially turning it into their console) which is what led to the split. The N64 still made Nintendo a lot of money, had they gone with the SNES CD they'd have had no console to make money from, they'd have ben pushed into a third party developer role.
Never mind that all CD addons and systems failed badly at the time so I don't think it's fair to blame them for not having confidence in the format.
These games came to Sony because they were running from nintendo's cutthroat policies. nintendo treats its customers great, but it plays hardball with busines partners and that's the truly astonishing business policy flaw if you're keen on scrutinizing companies that make half a billion in their worst quarter of deep investment.
It's funny how that changed, now Sony is the one annoying developers to no end by forcing everyone to comply with their vision of the perfect console library and uses their power to deny approval of PS2 games to pressure publishers into all kinds of deals while Nintendo learned its lesson the hard way and heavily cut back on the restrictions (though some publishers are still annoyed that Nintendo will reject a game that's TOO bug prone, considering what does get approved I don't want to know how bad those were). SNK went from Sony to Nintendo because Sony's policies were interfering with their games (namely SCEA forcing them to bundle the games together because 2d games are inferior to 3d in their eyes and the HD requirement having a big impact on the development of 2d games).
We'll see of course. PS3 is really just a delivery for bluray, clearly uneeded, but probably a big seller once HD takes off.
I'm not sure Blu-Ray will start being a big seller before standalone Blu-Ray players cost much less than a PS3 and of course BRD prices drop to the same or a lower level as DVDs.
It's clearly more sophisticated of a strategy than, say, motion sensing or online experience (both are easily replicated).
No, that's not easy. The online experience of XBox Live cannot be recreated without a central authority dictating the standards (since the big feature is uniformity and all games supporting its features) and new kinds of controllers will not get widespread use if the console doesn't ship with them. Sony cannot sit back and hope third party developers make those because then they'll only have several incompatible implementations that only work for one or two games each and get bought by practically nobody. And I'm not sure either would rival their original implementations without the firmware supporting them.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
From what it sounds like I'd guess it's the faster disc drive streaming data faster than the PS2 software expects. No idea why they didn't do the same thing they did with the PS1 emulation on the PS2 and add a speed toggle.
Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
Twilight princess is a Gamecube Game that's been delayed repeatedly for over a year. It's not accurate to call it a launch title for the Wii, as it wasn't designed around the hardware.
Everything about his article was purely opinion, which is fine but come on... It falls right in the quality of reviews that are found in High School newspapers with the (I think this product sucks because I don't like it.) It's just to early to come to the "Seth Schiesel" conclusion. It takes awhile for the software to expose the hardware's full potential.
"Both of which are most likely fixable through firmware upgrades. Especially the compatibility which is supposed to be fixed in short order."
Look, I agree that these aren't really worth complaining about compared to the similar problems we saw with the PS2, but I simply won't abide by this "Ship now, patch later" mentality. If Sony is going to wait until later to fix these problems, then they will also wait until later until they see my six hundred freakin' dollars. I'm not looking to make a "deposit" or an "investment," I want to buy a console.
Granted, I never saw myself buying a PS3 before 2008, but even if Final Fantasy XIII was a launch title, after seeing what happened with the first releases of the PS and then the PS2 I wouldn't be interested in getting one of these first-generation PS3s.
"These games are not representative of the system."
Again, I'm not looking to make a deposit or an investment. If the games for the system suck now then I won't be buying the system now.