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Google's Android To Challenge Windows?
PL/SQL Guy writes "Search giant Google is set to offer its free Android mobile-phone operating system for computers, opening a new front in its rivalry with Microsoft by challenging the dominance of the company's Windows software. Acer Inc., the world's second-largest laptop maker, will release a low-cost notebook powered by Android next quarter, said Jim Wong, head of information-technology products at the Taipei-based company. Calvin Huang, an analyst at Daiwa Securities Group Inc, says that adoption of Android-based netbooks will likely eat into Windows' share of PC operating systems."
Meanwhile, notes reader Barence, Asus is continuing to distance itself from Android, saying it "isn't a priority."
Meanwhile, notes reader Barence, Asus is continuing to distance itself from Android, saying it "isn't a priority."
I think the article you wanted to link there was Asus distances itself from Android netbook.
That's odd considering the story we discussed yesterday in which Qualcomm showed an eee PC (an Asus product) running Android with an ARM processor. And in the Bloomberg article (which also mentions that), "Asustek said in February its engineers were trying to develop an Android-based netbook this year."
The comments of Jonathan Tsang, vice chairman of Asus, don't convince me. Actions speak louder than words. Hint: When you release an ARM Processor based chipset in a netbook, you're actually distancing yourself from Windows and x86 applications.
What he means to say is "everything's ready, just don't alarm our Redmond masters until we're sure the consumer likes Android."
My work here is dung.
Right now, Android is more a rival for symbian than for Windows.
Here we have a very interesting inversion of the typical Open vs Closed debate. Although Windows itself may be a closed source OS, it is actually a very open system. And although Android is built on layers of open source components, it is fundamentally a closed system (like iPhone).
The target audience for Android PCs would be one which needs a dedicated internet browsing device. Anything more would mean that they would be looking at Windows.
This strategy has been tried several times before. And it has failed every time. Linux has already been edged out of the netbook market by Windows, so it's going to be interesting to see how an even more crippled system could possibly compete.
Windows != Windows Mobile
...will be the year of Linux on the Desktop.
Seriously. With Ubuntu now in a "just works" state on most hardware, and Android tested by commercial entities to work out-of-the-box fro specific hardware, there is real choice. The lower cost of slick Linux devices and PCs compared to OS X premium hardware from Apple will start to take hold this year.
This article CERTAINLY deserves a GoodLuckWithThat Slashdot article tag! :)
I forgot the most important part "for $99.95".
There is a growing willingness to attack the Windows+Intel+Dell+Apple cartel. Well, Dell is already history. Intel did well with Atom but it's a temporary victory that in fact opened a market segment where ARM-based CPUs can significantly beat Intel ones. And the winning combination is Android + ARM, with long battery lives, Google's guarantee of world-class applications, and massive funding into the open source platforms needed to make it work.
Of course ASUS will produce Android smartbooks when the time comes, but for now they're getting fat discounts on Windows for their loyalty.
Very exciting times, I feel that thin cheap netbooks / smartbooks, and thin cheap VESA-mounted nettops already handle about 80% of the use cases I see. Only a few people need a multicore machine with huge disks.
I wonder how Intel is going to respond to this, but my guess is they will embrace Android and buy ARM.
What does android has that linux doesn't?
Linux has more software than android and if we're talking about familiarity the linux desktop is closer to windows than android.
The android netbooks will be cheaper than the windows ones but, again, if that hasn't helped linux I don't see how it's going to help android.
I'd like to see the microsoft dominance in the os market broken as much as anyone but I don't have much hope this is going to do it.
Yes, Android is going to make it the year of the Linux desktop. Just because you sell a few copies to some geeks doesn't mean you're going to take over the world, it'll be good when you finally get it into your head.
Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
The biggest challenge facing Windows is its size and hardware requirements - as phones get smarter and netbooks become more popular then people will become accustomed to having a 'proper' computer on them at all time- for many people with an iPhone this is already happening. Even Miyamoto (the Nintendo guy) was talking today about broadening the range of applications available for the DS so that gamers begin to take them everywhere and use them for everything. It doesn't really matter whether it's a Nintendo DS, an Apple iPhone, a Palm Pre, a Blackberry or a netbook running Android- the key is portability. Portability is The Next Big Thing and in this market Windows does not seem to have a very attractive offering - Windows Mobile only makes headlines when it's market share is overtaken by something else.
So personally I don't see Android as a specific challenge to Windows, I see Windows being challenged by a fundamental shift in computing - from the desktop to personal - and Windows biggest challenge in this area is probably itself and it's own bloated history.
Putting syrup in coffee is some form of blasphemy.
Asus is continuing to distance itself from Android, saying it "isn't a priority."
They're probably also thinking that those long-haired young guys calling themselves the "Beatles" aren't worth the investment in signing up with their company, either.
A version of Linux that people can pronounce! I'm sure that has been the only thing holding Ubuntu (sp?) back.
In what way is Android a closed system? Anyone can write Android apps. The API is fully open. Anyone can publish them to the Google ap store. Or you can just install them individually like any application for any OS.
I don't see how you can compare Android to the iPhone as both being closed. The iPhone is closed in every single way. Android in nearly none.
Hopefully users will distance themselves from Asus too.
I think windows is challenged enough... ^____^;
Crivens! I kicked meself in me own heid!
When you start looking at the browser based applications that Google is producing/pushing, does the host OS really matter?
"Asus is continuing to distance itself from Android, saying it "isn't a priority.""
If you follow the link from that quote in the summary, the word "Asus" isn't anywhere on the page.
(This is not intended to be a knock on Linux). Linux netbooks, after enjoying a brief marketshare spike when there was no alternative, are not popular with the majority of end-users. So what makes Google think that Android will do any better than Linux did? There's way more software for Linux than Android--and way more for Windows than Linux...
Even if you add a way to connect to the Internet, why would Android be any better for Netbooks than Linux was? At least with Linux, and especially with Windows, I'm not stuck with a useless dumb terminal when I'm not able to connect to the Internet.
Sorry, but if Linux isn't doing too hot on Netbooks, I really don't see how Android wouldn't be worse... Android is a cell phone OS and that's it...
Windows 3.1x calc: 3.11 - 3.10 = 0.00
Android wont challenge windows Unless A. Business Apps work a lot more seemlessly with a linux based OS which Android is and B. Games work better on the platform. Only two areas Android will challenge Windows and that would be Mobile Windows and netbook.
It seems to me that this is all part of the next wave of computing devices. The iPhone showed that portable computing device could be easy to use and fulfill a number of functions including cell phone, internet browser, applications platform and media player. It's not so much a smart phone as it is a computer. Google followed with Android. Nokia and RIM are now inspired to try to make their smartphone operating systems work the same way. They won't. They are going to have to adopt Android or develop new operating systems (Linux-based most likely) if they want to compete for the long term.
The next step (this new wave) is to use the operating system developed for iPhone type devices on larger form factors better suited for more general purpose computing. The rumored Apple tablet and what is being announced here are just that. The approach of trying to fit a full desktop operating system on crapped-down hardware that conforms to a common PC form factor yielded netbooks. If you are used to a full blown laptop netbooks are very unsatisfying. Yet the need for a less expensive, useful and durable device with excellent battery life remains. I think that is what these new devices are trying to address and it makes sense to me that they are more likely to be successful.
Microsoft, watch out. The growth in the computing market will be devices like these, not general purpose computers - desktops and laptops. These devices will be more reliant on browser based RIA apps (e.g. Javascript & HTML5) and web services than on native applications. General purpose PCs will still be around in large but stagnant numbers. If I'm making these more specialized devices, why would I pay for an operating system when I can get one for free? If the browser I put on my device meets all the requisite standards, you can no longer offer me the advantage of lot's of applications.
But Microsoft is not stupid. The new Zune HD shows me that at least they are thinking about this market and how to compete in it.
Very often, people confuse simple with simplistic. The nuance is lost on most. - Clement Mok
Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. Why not just stick with Windows and save yourself the hassle?
Remember Firefox? Once it reached a 10% market share most websites started abandoning MSFT's walled garden and adopt standards. Same way if enough people migrate to Google docs, Open Office, Android etc etc, it will nail MSFT's underhanded tactics. If 10% of the people are using OpenOffice, they will interact with some 20% of the MsOffice market, and start demanding smooth file transfers. If 10% of the people use Android net book to take a quick look at MsOffice powerpoint it will force MSFT to at least allow a standard compliant export or standard compliant view only mode.
That is all it takes to start shaking the monopoly. Once MSFT market share in Office and OS starts to dip below 80% it will get into a avalanche mode and drop to 40% in just 4 or 5 years.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Most people don't want that many pieces of software, what they want is a simple interface with predictable behaviour. A full blown Linux OS just can't offer that yet. Having something like Android where it's tailored to a specific market/product type should prove to be quite popular IMHO. Just look at the iPhone, cool factor aside it's main selling point is that it's easy to find, install and use the applications on it.
"What does android has that linux doesn't?"
Unity: as opposed to the fragmentation of Linux. Linux has ~1% of the desktop market and that is divided into a hundred fragments. I say this as someone who uses RH at work and Ubuntu at home (secondary boot to windows). I am not going to get into a back and forth over the benefit of the freedom to fork new things. Yep thats nice, but with the utter fragmentation reducing Linux to the ghetto forever, it has IMO relegated it to the backwaters forever.
Name recognition: To stand out from the Linux rabble.
Money: to advertise/fix issue/build whatever they need to make it work...
From all of the above you get buy in, trust, investment.
I'd love to replace my Ubuntu boot with Android if it ever heads in that direction.
If it looks like a portable computer (laptop/netbook), people will expect to see Windows on it, and the vast majority of them will run away if it doesn't have it.
Alternative OSs have a chance on things that have the same compute power as a portable computer, but don't look like them.
Android/Linux/OS X on smartphones or similar things will sell.
I predict that whatever Apple does with all those 10" screens it it rumored to be buying, it won't look like a netbook.
To a Lisp hacker, XML is S-expressions in drag.
If only all commenters were so considerate.
The appropriate title for this should have been: "Is Android a Windows-Killer?"
Come on, stick with the proper conventions.
Who didn't see this coming? But I think the smarter route is to start it as purely a mobile (smartphone/netbook) OS, work out the kinks and extend it THEN break it out as a full fledged OS. You'd hit the ground running, people already familiar with it, apps developed for it, etc. Then crush Microsoft's grapes.
http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
I just realised a few days ago that there was something wrong with the desktop OS market: you have a declining giant which held until now pretty much 98% of its market (non-Mac PC market), a strong but much smaller giant which is much more limited in how it can eat the big declining giant because he requires buying a whole new machine (and doesn't even cover all the ranges of machines, i.e. hardly any low end machines), and the rest, which is the tiny Linux and BSD guys who can't do much because well, none of them are anywhere near being giants.
So I thought something is missing, cause if the big giant is declining fast, then another giant has to help him lose its market share. Apple can only do it in a very limited manner, and even if desktop Linux was ready as a product it just isn't pushed into the desktop OS market by a giant.
And there comes Google and its Android platform. If they are actually going for the desktop market, and if they do things right, then I believe that within a few years they'll manage to relieve Microsoft from a portion of their desktop OS share that we'd consider quite significant by our current standards (understand 5-10% in 5 years), and in the long term they may turn out to be the ones who break the Windows' image of being the big OS you can't do without.
That's a huge challenge, but the thing about Google is, they're fucking huge now, but their biggest thing is still by far their web searching, and they're as big as one can be there, so I think they need something else that is huge to get into. Taking a shot at replacing Windows on desktops/laptops/netbooks seems like a logical choice.
You just got troll'd!
Did you personally ran Linux on the above platforms?
I did. ARM and M68K. Kernel 2.4 is OK. 2.6 really sucks.
Two things:
1. People don't buy operating systems, they buy applications. Yet another OS is not interesting.
2. Handhelds and netbooks are getting more powerful with every new product. At some point, they can run Windows without sacrificing the "user experience." Small fast OS' have a fleeting advantage.
I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.
So where can I get this for my netbook. Oh that's right, it's vaporware. But boy it is still snappy on Win 7.
Does Android have games? Not Flash games and Solitaire, but WoW and the latest closed source FPS released for Windows. Does Android have photography workflow software? CAD? Anything that's not an internet product, office product, or a widget?
Hrm... I see. Well, if I want an OS that lets me chat, email, and surf the net then I'll install Ubuntu.
mmmm...forbidden donut
Then why everybody here complains about poor commercial SW support for Linux?
I am not going to spend my time on an OS that can't give me a clearly defied target.
The raise and fall of Linux on netbooks (yes, it failed already) proves it's not only me but other commercial devs are frustrated with Linux too.
Actually, come to think about it, it's a grand loss of opportunity.
Netbooks started with Linux and then dwindled down in big part because commercial developers like me did not like what they saw.
Another examples?
1. Google Chrome devs bitching.
2. Already almost lost cause of "World domination 201" (And i think ESR was right!)
I bought my son a DSi when I was in Hong Kong last March. It's a pretty impressive piece of hardware for something that inexpensive, and it makes a wonderful educational platform because of the touch screen. I can see the DSi mark 2 or so supporting GSM and being able to work as a video phone. It already has two cameras - one facing the user and one facing away - that would make it ideal for video phone calls so the person on the other end can see you and then you can say "Hey... look at this..." and just toggle to the other camera while keeping all of the controls where you can access them.
About 2/3 of the "games" we have for the DS family of devices are educational, and they work. The kids use them and the material is "taking" - they're learning it. I know, there are other ways to study and learn, but when you have a very kinesthetic learner (hands-on, moving, etc.) on your hands doing something where you need to interact physically with something during the learning process helps.
The DS could be a pretty darn good PDA if they'd make the calendar a little less lame, add handwriting recognition and an address book, an a few other things. The dual-screen interface has its advantages, too.
These smartphone touch based OSs like Android and iPhoneOS bode well for a market segment that just never took off... Tablet Computing.
Bill Gates was a big believer in the Tablet form factor, but it never took off because it used the Windows UI (Start Bar, icons, windows), AND because it basically requires the use of a stylus. Now Bill Gates may be the kind of guy who has his shit together enough to not lose his stylus constantly, but a lot of the rest of us do not. If there is one thing you have to give Apple credit for is realizing that "nobody likes a stylus" and building an OS around touch.
A scaled up iTouch/Android/WebOS style interface on a tablet sized device sounds pretty cool to me. And if you really want a stylus, it should be and optional device, not the default method of input.
It is hard enough to keep Google out of your personal business. The word privacy is not even in their vocabulary. Now I am supposed to use their operating system?
Any Google guys reading this: look up the work privacy in a dictionary, then apply it. Google still has the #1 worst privacy record of any company on Earth today. If the government pulled the same stunts that Google does we would be taking over the white house with shotguns.
Does Android have ANY applications AT ALL ? What a bogus article.
Android is cool and all, but it has a _long_ way to go before it challenges Windows in any serious way. Maybe (we can hope) Windows Mobile/CE, but Windows proper? Please.
?? 2.6 seems fine on ARM for me...
Lost perhaps in the fervor over "eating into Windows' share of PC operating systems" is the fact that Microsoft doesn't seem to -- or doesn't want to appear to seem to -- care.
Although it may be a case of CYA, or a byproduct of some Wintel partnership fine print, Microsoft has said it has no plans to port a PC version of Windows over to the ARM core, in a sense leaving the whole "smartbooks" market Linux and Android.
And though it may be true that an Intel deal, a desire not to eat into its own Windows netbook/notebook revenue, or the difficulty of porting a worthwhile version of Windows to ARM is at the heart of this deference to Android, you have to wonder whether there is some grain of truth to the fact that it is 'hard to create new categories' of technology, as Microsoft is claiming in relation to its stated disinterest in "smartbooks."
Then we *have* defined the game we're going to play ourselves. It just doesn't involve total desktop dominance. The problem is that nobody will really admit this. Linux is about choice and freedom first, and development will proceed in that fashion for the forseeable future because that has value to the people who actually develop Linux.
Canonical can choose to play a different game with Ubuntu (which I love, btw, and my entire team has it installed on our development computers). But Linux is not Canonical. If I were Canonical, playing the game Apple is playing might actually help a lot - narrowly define the hardware. As a commercial entity, they can choose to go that route.
Linux is not a commercial entity, it's more like a community with a kernel, and the community is already playing the game it wants to play.
It's rare that you're presented with a knob whose only two positions are Make History and Flee Your Glorious Destiny.
I wish people would realize that its not as good as people think it is. Only if google developer are doing a device, it will happen. The open source community of android developers dont have the power to really make things happen with that platform yet... It needs a good few years before I will be able to do anything cool!
If you could buy a typical sized netbook that could just do email and browse the internet...nobody would care which OS it used.
This is the product that is DOA but won't lie down.
The product the stock boy at WalMart drop-kicks into the dumpster.
It's the 99 pound weakling Charles Atlas pounds into the sand. The clapped-out Yugo the geek drives to work.
You're totally clueless so there's no point even enumerating your mistakes. Every single statement you wrote is factually wrong.
There is such a misunderstanding of what is going on with netbooks. There are two markets developing, and they could not be more different. The most important difference is who the customer really is:
Consumers (meaning you and me) are buying cheap, small, wimpy laptops. This is the market that is going crazy right now as people are buying $279 netbooks instead of $500 laptops. (Windows is a plus here as it protects the buyer's investment in legacy software). For most netbook buyers, it's either a compliment to their desktop or it is the primary machine for a non power user. Linux is important in this market because MS was forced to allow XP to be sold as Vista was too heavy, and will continue to be too heavy. In fact, MS had end of lifed XP before allowing netbook manufacturers to distribute with their computers.
- and -
Cell phone carriers are buying connected netbooks. Cell carriers want to sell these inexpensive netbooks locked on to their network. It's a way to sell another connection to you for $50/month using their traditional loss leader strategy (have a $250 phone for free, just pay us $50/month for two years). Windows is a liability here as it takes a lot more end user support than a purpose built environment like Android. Windows also just can't be locked down like Android either (this is considered good. Android is not itself a consumer product, but Android applications are). Most software is going to be either small applications that are installed on the netbook or bigger ones that are provided via browser (Google Apps). Android is built to deliver internet based applications and distribute applications in a way that limits the need for technical support. In other words: it's amazingly easy to use for end users and doesn't break in ways that reqire support calls. It also can be locked down to the carrier's needs (doing so may limit what Google software may be shipped with the device).
-- $G
I have 2.6 running on several ARM devices - 2 NSLU2's, a sheevaplug and a neo freerunner. Seems fine, especially with the new EABI.
I also have a router that runs 2.6 on MIPS, and a PS3 that runs it on Power (Cell), though I haven't messed with the router much and the PS3 I just installed it on to play with.
If people want Windows, they can have Windows. However, I'll be more than happy to stick with the rarely-used Windows installation I already have.
How often do you use a full-blown OS while you're waiting at the fast food line? Not very often, I'll bet. Why not simply leave the bloat at home or in the office? Most of us would be happy with relatively simple things like a good web browser, email reader, and a cheap old rich text editor, and if you're going to blur the lines between phone and netbook, why not add phone functions to that list? All of those things are things that will come to Android, and it basically takes care of the "necessities" on the go.
As far as the luxuries on the go, you might be able to squeeze a DVD drive into that sub-netbook. Wireless connectivity can be used to connect to the heavier iron, making things that people use at work and home accessible (take for example: MS Office or programming tasks).
VNC is not out of the question; the most you may have to do is bring your little charger around with you. The bigger question than VNC is how to make it accessible to the masses? I'd think that's easy. Google has the connectedness to be able to tell one computer where to find another computer, all you'd need is the connecting software. Granted, it's not quite like having a laptop right in front of you, but it allows the casual person to be able to take care of things at home, including checking on the shopping list.
Let's face it; we're not limited to the world of x86 netbooks. smartbooks (or sub-netbooks) can be the tool of choice; capable of things that you wouldn't even be able to do casually with your favorite phone or Windows-based laptop variant. I know that I'd ditch my laptop for a smartbook that can do the works, even if I have to do some things remotely.
There are no perfect answers, only the right questions. More questions at http://foresightandhindsight.blogspot.com/
Because Google can put a lot more pressure on the hardware vendors than the Linux community can. And that means they will have more "it just works" success rates than Linux. This has always been Apple's big secret. The more you can guarantee that the hardware will just work, the more time the software guys can have working on fancy user interfaces.
I find this kind of interesting... While I haven't yet played with Android yet (or for that matter Windows on a netbook), this does seem to be an interesting development. I would *really* like to see a performance comparison between Android and Windows on the same netbook; both from a speed and resource consumption standpoint.
Overall, I really like the idea of Android, but think the platform is still too new for anyone to really pay it any serious attention. What really needs to happen is for cell phone manufacturers to have a compelling reason to use it on their cell phones.
That being said, I think Android is going to slowly whither away as a technological footnote over the next several years.
I ranted in here many many times about people comparing netbooks to laptops - especially the size of teh keyboard keys - seems that their eye-brain interface fired the "small laptop" neurons and not the "big pda" neurons. I'm now the owner of a 500Mhz ARM, 64MB, 640*480 HTC Universal, can use it for web, email, sms, phone calls as well as playing ScummVM, Quake, Doom and running an amiga emulator. It's about 3" by 6". It rocks
If you don't risk failure you don't risk success.
...We could make a Linux that worked and looked almost exactly like Windows:
http://www.linuxmint.com/
Or we could release an open source alternative to Windows:
http://www.reactos.org/en/index.html
I think Windows or it's design will be with us long after Microsoft has failed as a corporation, which is likely sooner than most are currently guessing. Their huge reserves of cash aren't going to matter when more is not coming in, which I think is inevitable. I know not one person willing to pay for Vista, OR Vista 2.0, which MS is calling Windows 7.
The snake oil is obvious now. Nobody's buying it.
I hold very few opinions. I hold information based on observation and fact. If you wish to disagree, please use facts.
... I think that PRICE is the motivating factor here. As soon as we see quantities of netbooks that are $100, the OS won't matter much. Hell, I'd run Windows 98 if I could get a fast netbook that did skype for $100.
I hold very few opinions. I hold information based on observation and fact. If you wish to disagree, please use facts.
I bet if MS put out a netbook with XP that ran decently for $100, nobody would buy any of that other crap you're talking about. Price will win this war. I know plenty of people who still don't own an iPhone, because it's not worth the price and the egregious AT&T contract. I think ubiquitous wifi and skype (or a FOSS clone) will eventually begin to outweigh all the phone carriers and operating systems, once the hardware is common and cheap enough, which it will be eventually.
I hold very few opinions. I hold information based on observation and fact. If you wish to disagree, please use facts.