Slashdot Mirror
The FBI Wants To Know About Your IT Skills
AHuxley writes "The FBI, via the Office of Management and Budget, would like to find out more about your information technology expertise if you are part of InfraGard. Terms like 'practical utility' have been included in a 60-day emergency notice of information collection via the Paperwork Reduction Act of 1995. Is your boss or cubicle colleague part of InfraGard? It's a private, non-profit organization run as a public-private partnership with the Federal Bureau of Investigation. Are they passing info back about you or your company?"
Maybe it's not that sinister but that's the first thing that popped into my head. Looking at the website, it's initial intentions aren't that sinister but mandating that much sharing of information sounds a bit creepy. You guys are going to be DHS'd/FBI'd to death if you're not careful.
They want to be ready for the next July 4 just in case they need someone capable to infiltrate into some alien computer system.
The part I don't understand is why anyone would voluntarily become a part of InfraGrad and start "sharing information" about others in the first place.
start up those old german showers boys! don't drop the soap.
... the Stasi of the IT world or am I misreading this? The wording seems intentionally diffuse.
While I'm against snooping without cause, something of this in a collaborative model isn't necessarily a bad thing, though it does open up for potential abuse. There are lots of times when I call up buddies ask them what sort of IT issues they're having with security, spam, etc, and this just seems to formalize it a bit, and get the circle of trust a little bigger. Companies too often seek to distrust the authorities for crimes because it will make their companies look weak. As such criminal will get away with things solely because no one reports them. This doesn't look like a secret "Stone Cutter" type group, just a way to get to know some local colleagues and keep more ears to more ground looking for potential threats.
The musings of just another geek and his junk.
Lol, "Self-identified as IT specialists" indeed. Thats one funny document. What would they need that kind of information for ? To evaluate bragging rights ?
Now the world has gone to bed, Darkness won't engulf my head, I can see by infra-red, How I hate the night.
Wekl, fwirstly, my tyuping sklills are spoty on.
As someone who's in the middle of watching Babylon 5, I couldn't help but think of the Night Watch when I read this story.
Cash, that is, not just "influence" which might backfire. I heard that Stasi rates were rock bottom, but the US screwy agencies have deeper pockets. Hey, in these challenging times lots of folks would be willing to snitch (perhaps even inventively) on their colleagues and other obstacles to job security or promotion (=boss).
Not being a citizen of any NATO country, they'd probably offer me less, the bastards.
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. - Voltaire
So, if the FBI wants to ask for certain records they have to get a warrant.
But, if a member of InfraGard decides to provide the FBI with records without the FBI asking then it's a private citizen reporting "suspicious behaviour"
Or, would a member of InfraGard be considered an officer of the government, making any records they had access to inadmissable?
I'm guessing it's pretty clear that I'm not a lawyer.
search on 'operation TIPS' while you're at it.
it never went away. only press notice of it went away.
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
I don't see any domestic surveillance embedded in what's online.
this gov org isn't as dumb as you think. or, restated, they aren't total idiots and don't fully disclose their actual intent and purpose.
not all gov agencies are as dumb as bush. in fact, bush's dumbness was a cover. no human could be THAT moronic and rise to the level of the most powerful man in the world if he's truly an idiot.
one of the smartest moves is to act dumb and it requires a certain kind of talent to pull it off. bush had that, innately.
operation TIPS is alive and well; just below the radar. things like this never go away. are you kidding me??
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
From the information provided, which is very little, it appears that the FBI is requesting information from people who have voluntarily joined an organization of IT professionals not just sponsored by but directly affiliated with the FBI. Why is this getting everyone's hackles up? It does not say that the information will be required of all members, nor does it say that members will be required to inform on their coworkers or companies. The ACM asks you about your IT skills, too. How is this different?
Can someone put a taxpayer's money cost estimate on the 917 hours annual burden, associated with this information collection?
Let's say $100 an hour for a good salary and a nice office for the guy reading the applications. That's less than $100,000. However you feel about the idea, I can't imagine picking a less significant reason to attack it.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
They only want information about the IT skills of their own members. How else would they process ONLY 28,000 responses at 2 minutes each? This doesn't even seem to apply to all Infragard members, only:
"Public and private professionals
self-identified as having information technology expertise."
This would also be why it's called:
"InfraGard Knowledge/Skills/
Abilities Profile"
IT seems kindof obvious that they might want to know what the skills of their own members are if they need assistance on something. Not like the FBI knows anything about technology.
Perhaps they're looking for resources for the next time they have an IT issue/project they need to not fuck up. According to their website, you need a background check to join. Seems like a good way to build a database of IT professionals that you don't need to do background checks on after the fact.
Disclaimer; I'm an Infragard member (have been for about 7 years). Why are they collecting this? Easy, they're public/private partnership that focuses on emergency response. "In the event", they want to know who within there membership has skills that may be needed. Don't like it, don't join (or quit). Don't want them to have your data, make them remove it (you have the legal right to do so). No conspiratorial aspect here.
The Stasi were very good at collecting information. In fact, they were too good. They collected so much that their analysts couldn't effectively evaluate even a fraction of it. They lacked IT resources (when compared to Western agencies) and the Stasi leadership should have shifted more manpower from spying to analyzing.
The FBI has access to unlimited IT resources, and the US intelligent community if very effective at evaluating the information that they have collected. Just look at how they stopped the underwear bomber . . .
. . . uh-oh . . . never mind . . .
Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
Now we know where he got the rank of Commander.
I am the unwilling control for my Origin.
The FBI has no need or right to know about my IT skills, but I would certainly like to know more about their IT skills, given all of the obvious and avoidable breaches in silicon-based security, document controls and methodologies lately.
I note that the web developers of InfraGaurd don't know how to change their favicon.ico from the sun logo.
Nice to see they're using Sun and Unix, I suppose, but who leaves the sun logo there?
Would it concern being able to surf pron with only one hand?
Just wondering what mad skills they might be looking for....
-Goran
Carpe Scrotum - The only way to deal with your competition.
Bigbrother, snoop, and even Stasi perhaps but KGB, Gestapo? No, as tempting as it may be, the FBI is not rounding up all IT people and sending them to the showers....
For now, they are just recruiting "volunteers" to watch for "suspicious behaviour" and report "unreliable elements".
Just the most obvious problems (as mentioned in other posts)
Another thing to keep in mind: The so-called "War on Terror" can be used to outlaw anything and anyone.
Soon after a high-profile Cyber-Attack all knowledge of critical infrastructure(tm) will become classified. Too bad for those lacking the official clearance for things they already know. The state will have to place such persons in "protective custody" camps to keep the terrorists from expoliting their knowledge. Unfortunately, even a short time spent in a such a camp will disqualify you from ever getting back to your former life: While they could'nt prove any previous contacts to "unreliable elements", now they know where you have met them. Finally, once the "unrecovereable elements" are confined to the camps it wont be long until some politician wants the money wasted on their upkeep be spent on his constituency instead. That is where the "showers" come in ..
The 917 hours represents the amount of burden put on the public, not the burden on the U.S. government. This calculation is a necessary part of the Paperwork Reduction Act for any information gathering.
I'm a lawyer, but not yours. I wouldn't represent someone who thinks taking legal advice from Slashdot is a good idea.
Don't suspect a Friend.
Report Him.
Imagination drew in bold strokes, instantly serving hopes and fears, while knowledge advanced by slow increments...
The only reason that they switched from spying to analyzing is because half of the population was spying on the other half. That was also the reason that they got so much information, speaking of which if you have or did have a family member who lived or visited E.Germany at the time they were in operation you can view their STASI records if they weren't destroyed. My mother visited 2 times since she left as a child, on her first trip back they had 15 banker boxes full of information on her, her habits, and where she went and what she did.
Om, nomnomnom...
InfraGard was the topic on Jesse Venturas Conspiracy Theory
http://www.conspiracytheoryjesseventura.com/category/season-1-episode-4-big-brother/
Perhaps the usual conspiracy theory blahblah but they did really seem fairly creepy with all the "information gathering".
They say that every medium or larger sized company in China has a spy in it reporting to the government. This sounds exactly the same, unfortunately. But then again, did you really expect it to be any different over here?
Couldn't they in turn get sued by their employers?
Where do you think all those guys went when the wall came down?
Here it will be blackshirts; brown is a discredited color.
History: The source book for the unimaginative.
Can we really have this conversation without invoking Godwin's Law? :)
Truth isn't Truth - Guliani
do not judge people based on 'shift key' issues.
you'd be very wrong to do so on such trite matters. hint: there are other reasons for lower case.
you don't know all you think you do. realize that.
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
Under the 1974 Privacy Act the US Government needs to notify we the people whenever they collect information about them. So the FBI needs to know what IT people they can contact for different areas of expertise to help them with investigations. In order to put together so much as an Excel spreadsheet with names and phone numbers they need to examine the privacy considerations. A nationwide database has similar considerations, usually a Privacy Impact Assessment, and if the assessment warrants it, a System of Records Notice in the Federal Register. Under OMB Memo 06-16 this also means the data is Personally Identifiable Information and they should encrypt it on mobile media, and while in transmission. Which means if some Infragard member has hundreds or thousands of names and contact info on their laptop and it is lost or stolen, the information of self-selected members should be protected with a FIPS 140-2 and FIPS 197 compliant algorithm and certified implementation. Lets hope they don't keep it on the Kingston thumb drives. I once attended an Infragard meeting in Maryland right after SQL Slammer hit, there were tons of us standing in line to get in all talking about who hadn't bothered to install a 2 year old patch.
I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one on /. that sees this InfraGard as a group of people who are, in effect, saying, "Yes! Please social engineer me! Here's how!"
"A government is a body of people usually -- notably -- ungoverned." -Shepherd Book
I'd say the only real fishy thing about it is that they are asking for emergency processing in accordance with 5 CFR 1320.13. The Federal Register listing doesn't say why though. I wonder which one of these was their problem:
(i) Public harm is reasonably likely to result if normal clearance procedures are followed;
(ii) An unanticipated event has occurred; or
(iii) The use of normal clearance procedures is reasonably likely to prevent or disrupt the collection of information or is reasonably likely to cause a statutory or court ordered deadline to be missed.
Did someone miss a deadline or did something unexpected happen?
Link if you are interested:
http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&rgn=div5&view=text&node=5:3.0.2.3.9&idno=5#5:3.0.2.3.9.0.48.13
Other than that I don't think anything horrifically fishy is going on. The whole reason InfraGard is a bit opaque has to do with what authorized it in the first place, PDD 63.
Link: http://www.fas.org/irp/offdocs/pdd-63.htm
To save you the reading time, here's are 2 goals I lifted out:
* Seeks the voluntary participation of private industry to meet common goals for protecting our critical systems through public-private partnerships;
* Protects privacy rights and seeks to utilize market forces. It is meant to strengthen and protect the nation's economic power, not to stifle it.
Sometimes you have to do things behind closed doors to get all the players to the table. Security through obscurity? Maybe.
If you really want to learn more about PDD 63, I suggest you read this: http://www.justice.gov/criminal/cybercrime/white_pr.htm
Discuss.
You too can become a James Bond of IT with rights to"shoot to kill".
More details.
I am not an extraterrestrial. I use a Macintosh because it is the best computer available on this backwards planet, even if it is a mere abacus compared to a child's toy from where I come from, which is France, of course.
Do not continue to claim that I am an alien unless you wish to become assimilated into The Collective.
This ain't rocket surgery.
He has a point. It's not like all these other theories in which people that get interviewed aren't allowed to give counter-weight towards claims and question and all... Which is good.
I am not a US citizen and I have not had to deal with being a potential target, but in my country, this spying thing is comming too: Rfid passports and public trafic cards. Camera's starting to pop up in large cities, on streetcorners and my entire traffic back and forth between me and my ISP gets backed up fully by ISPs, every bit and byte, because that's what the goverment demands.
It's a sad story, but who is to blame? Can we still live with all of our rights?
I'd rather give up my safety to get back my freedoms and right. But what about terrorists?
What governments do these days is bad, but even sadder: it seems nessecary. I mean... if you were 'Big Brother', then would you have an idea how to deal with a decentralised, unidentifiable individual threats? Can you think up another way to cope with terrorists?
The simple fact is that there is a terrorist threat. No matter how much BS detectors are now going off in your head, probably, at this very moment. Terrorists who were succesful at harming the 'west' are saying in their videos: "You may stop me, but you can't stop us all!" Sound familiar?
Does the goverment have a choice, realy? And if it were to have that choice, than what is that according to you? Can you think of a way to keep your citizen rights and still be safe? Because the next thing you know, and I know this sounds rediculous and I hate myself for saying this, there will be a 10-11...
So my point here is: does 'Big Brother' have a choice if they want to repect peoples rights? How else can they defend their people? It seems nessecary. But if somebody has a better solution then I'd like to hear it, because it's not my entention to troll and certainly not me trying to convince everyone it's for the better to give up their rights, privacy and freedom.
Wow, my own writing makes me sad :( ...
Here be signatures
Obviously, this is just the first step. First, they register everyone with IT skills. Then they'll impose a tax on bits. Eventually, we'll be denied our constitutional right to keep and bear keyboards.
Is Slashdot now Fox News?
Can you think up another way to cope with terrorists?
Uh I don't know... What about talking to them? They surely aren't doing that for fun... I mean, there must be something they want. How about a compromise? Now it's my turn to ask: Can you think up another way to cope with terrorists?
Tightening up security solves nothing because there's a limit on how tighter it can get while there's none on how creative terrorists can be. This is a consequence of living in a free country. It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye... I find it quite funny how many staunch defenders of freedom suddenly wanna drop it if when they feel threatened.
Does anybody even know what the alleged terrorist organization known as Al-Qaeda wants? Maybe once we understand that, we can find a solution. But instead what is told to us is that they're just a bunch of lunatics that commit enormous amounts of resources blowing things up because they're lunatics or extremists or new_political_buzzword_to_label_undesirables. Yeah right.
For some strange reason it's controversial here to mention the formation of an organisation that acts on behalf of it's members but wouldn't part of the function of an IT Union be to asses and represent the interests of it's members when it comes to organisations like these? Seems to me IT professionals need an organisational structure to support them from bureaucrats.
Asides from a bidding war lowering IT professionals pay rates towards slavery there is the matter of protecting our interests amongst many other issues. It seems to me, if we were as smart as we really think we are, we would work together to protect ourselves and have a focal point - aside from /. , for gathering intelligence on issues such as these.
My ism, it's full of beliefs.
Can you think up another way to cope with terrorists?
Uh I don't know... What about talking to them? They surely aren't doing that for fun... I mean, there must be something they want. How about a compromise?
Well, if you've been watching the news at all for the last 5 years, it's pretty obvious that the goal of most of the radical Muslim groups is to make the West bow to Islam and to establish Shariah law everywhere as the law of the land. Just have a look at what is going on in England and especially the Netherlands to see how dangerous this is getting. There is no compromise with someone who is only interested in total domination rather than peaceful coexistence.
I sometimes wonder if I am the only one who when passing through an airport security checkpoint is the only one who is more afraid of the TSA than I am of the terrorists. I have a far greater fear of getting arrested for forgetting to remove a leatherman from my bag or not emptying my water bottle than I am afraid of the plane getting blown up be some nutcase.
The Stasi (early version) lost their records in the in the early days thanks to a defector. :)
They split all the data up, so a walk out would be very hard.
Want a spies details, its paper work and face to face with a few top people.
The system worked well until they thought about nuclear war.
How could the reach their sleeper agents in the West, if the paper work was ash?
So they made digital records and placed them in a safe.
The CIA got a copy and did not share with the Germans
In the end the west injected so much into peace and church groups and on the international stage, that East Germany fell apart.
Domestic spying is now "Benign Information Gathering"
did it ever occur to you why the world trade center was such a target? trade sanctions perhaps, people felt like they were being wronged. Enough to sacrifice their own lives, religion was just how to rally the troops.
Yeah well you're not getting the same news I am buddy. Which is really not surprising... Try watch something other than Western media. Islam wants to rule the world? Riiight...
What about this: US does rule the world - most of it anyway - and the islamists are the only ones with enough balls to put up a fight. Why don't the radical extremists terrorize more liberal muslim countries that don't apply Shariah law then like Jordan and Turkey if they really want Shariah law everywhere? Those should be easier to change...
You don't have the slightest clue of what you're talking about. It's because of people with such absurd opinions like yours that eat whatever crap mainstream media feeds them that there are terrorists in the first place and we almost have to get naked when traveling by airplane. If at least the victims were all people like you, the problem would settle quickly...
As for England and Netherlands, well it's price of globalization. Wasn't it supposed to be a good thing anyway?
Trade sanctions against Saudi Arabia? Do you have any idea what you're talking about? The men who did that were almost exclusively educated, priviledged young men from Saudi Arabia.
And I suppose the call for the death of Salman Rushdie, the film producers and cartoonists in the Netherlands, Ayaan Hirsi Al (a woman who had the independence of thought to dare leaving Islam), etc etc etc... all had to do with legitimate protest of trade sanctions or some such?!
You really need to read up a bit on who these people are. Listen to the ravings of their religious leaders on YouTube, listen to what they are preaching throughout much of Europe but especially in the Netherlands where their numbers are growing rapidly and where Sharia law is taking root. You really have no idea what these guys are about.
Compare the Danish cartoon incident
to, say, the Piss Christ
Read an insider's view of what's going on.
The information is out there and it's overwhelming. Research it a little and educate yourself. Don't take my word for it.
I would accept this if terrorists where actually poor people who have no other options in life and the only thing they can do is use their life to strike against their oppressors (as is possibly the case in other parts of the world). In reality the folk that attack western countries seem to be the well off folk who are radicalised beyond all rationality. They just make life worse for the rest of their people.
And for the question of if they have legitimate grievances against the west - they do but they exaggerate and combine legitimate ones with crazy conspiracy theories which frankly a child could debunk. They are not honest about the atrocities they commit - ie atrocities in darfur and sudan are all western propaganda etc and the popular belief that jews organised 9/11 even within al-quada. There is just no common acceptance of realty that would make negotiations feasible.
Control is an illusion, order our comforting lie. From chaos, through chaos, into chaos we fly
Actually, they have been breeding in both Jordan and Turkey and have made inroads into Egypt as well. The difference is the leaders there recognize it for what it is and are not afraid to use force against the poison within when it wells up. I know there were suicide bombings inside Jordan but I don't know about the others. Their leaders are effective because they don't bend over backward to cater to every demand of the extremists, to the extent that it happens in the even more liberal western nations.
So you're saying that the attempted train bombings and the relentless push for the imposition of Sharia law in England; and the murder of journalists and film makers in the Netherlands; and the public call for death of novelists who remain in hiding in order to stay alive - all this is the price of trying to work with others?
I'll recommend the same book to you, written by a formerly Muslim woman who grew up inside Islam and knows what it is really like in these countries. The most amazing thing about this woman is the optimism and positive emotion that comes through in her writing after everything she was subjected to. She lives in the west now since escaping so maybe you'll chalk this up to mere "western media" as well. <shrug>
Why does their website have a Sun Microsystems favicon?
If it acquires resources on instantiation like a duck, then its a shared_ptr<Duck>
If information is voluntarily given to DHS, then no constitutional problems. How Nazi Germany Hitler youth of them.
Living in Chile
"I'd worry about my government if they did nothing to encourage safe IT practices and if they did nothing but offer passive defense against the hackers employed by opposition countries."
You seem to forget we are not talking here about goverment IT services, do you? We are talking here about privately held bussiness. What the hell has government to do with them except getting away from their path as much as possible?
Betray your family and friends
Fabulous prizes to be won
"A cynic is what an idealist calls a realist" - Sir Humphrey Appleby
Hum ok. Let me recommend a couple things to you too.
First get yourself a good book on the history of oil like The Seven Sisters (google it). This will give an account of all the nice business the US and Europe have been doing in the Middle East and how they basically robbed Muslim countries for a long time.
Then you can turn on your TV and, with some luck, you'll see news about another hit that caused American/NATO casualties in either Afghanistan or Iraq - which, you should remember, was invaded on the premises of having some inexistent(!) WMDs. Oh and where exactly is Bin Laden? You know, the guy that was in Afghanistan, for sure...
To keep it short, let me finalize with the Palestine card. For more than 50 years, the west stood immobile and actually supported Israeli war crimes in Palestine, from house demolitions to blatant colonizing, passing through all-out war and even targeting UN buildings.
And maybe you can explain why is Saudi Arabia, a place where Shariah law is enforced in the worst of it's form, not in the crosshairs of people like you?
So, perhaps you could tell me how would these people not resent the west? It looks to me like they're actually fighting back. But no, they're probably just trying to dominate the world... Like they always did. Oh wait, that was the west every time...
One book doesn't cut it. Nor do your claims of Muslims trying to take over England and Holland. Not against history. Muslims aren't saints and I'm not even religious, but I'm not stupid. I'm being threatened because people like you are supporting the assholes that disturb the hornet's nests for bucks. Excuse me if I don't buy their bullshit.
Wow. I'm amazed how you managed to use so many words to say nothing at all in reponse to my post.
I'm not religious either. An atheist, in fact, which has absolutely nothing to do with anything said here, but you seem to think that's important to mention. And why is Saudi Arabia not in my crosshairs? I'm not sure what that question even means. Did I somehow give you the impression that they get a free pass from me despite being a breeding ground for the worst kind of hateful, bigoted thinking that passes in the name of religion? Nope. No idea what you're going on about there. Nobody is in my "crosshairs", I'm just concerned about the future of freedom when we're afraid to stand up for it without shame or apology.
What do the American oil companies have to do with Muslims going on murderous rampages across the globe after someone drew a cartoon? What does it have to do with Indians suffering Islamic extremist terror inside their borders? Or the Phillipines? Or the Netherlands? Or Somalia? Or Bosnia? Or Indonesia? Or Kurdistan? Or Nigeria? Or Sudan? Or Thailand? For Christ's sake, man (hehe), wake up and do a little research. This is not some great mystery that requires years of painstaking research. Radical Islam is wreaking havoc all over the globe. Peaceful coexistance is not in the nature of people like Bin Ladin and the underwear bomber. Lol... I always wanted to say "the underwear bomber" but haven't until just now!
It's not an America vs Islam thing. Even tolerant Muslim scholars fear for their lives for daring to publish critical studies of their faith or the life of Mohammed. And by critical, I mean formal literary study, not some kind of bashing. Do you even remember who Salman Rushdie is? He is marked for death for writing a work of fiction! You owe it to yourself to face the truth and not bury your head in the sand for the sake of some naive loyalty to a political position.
Ignore the names and parties for the moment.
You can't blame the new guy for what the previous guy set up - that is just being childish and petty. What you can do is blame the new guy for taking a long time to fix the problems left by the previous guy. IMHO it hasn't been a long time yet
In this case I think Jerry Doyle is being childish and petty about where he is laying the blame.
New problems that arise are of course a completely different story but that's not what we are talking about, all this creeping authoritarionism because due process takes too long or requires expensive training of competatant people is well and truly a G.W. Bush legacy. It's not even about the party since McCain actively opposed the more extreme portions of it. It was alway more about things like Wolfowitz getting his girlfriend a better paying job than Rice with less responsibility than actually doing anything to benefit the USA.
Just have a look at what is going on in England and especially the Netherlands to see how dangerous this is getting.
Ehmm, the Netherlands? How, what, where? All we've got is a screaming jackass that appeals to the Telegraaf-reading, SBS-6 watching part of the nation, and some politicians hopping on the bandwagon to get in the limelight a bit.
Yes, in theory, if a political party that wanted to integrate sharia law into dutch society were to get 2/3 of the total votes they'd be able to change the constitution. The odds of that happening are about the same as the odds of me being the prime minister at the time...
People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
Maybe I've been brainwashed too much by mainstream media (I prefer not to watch it, but everybody does so in the end I am recieving it too), but I have never looked at it that way! :o
Where do you live?
Here be signatures
I live in the Netherlands and let me tell you this: this so called islamic threat is a joke. You should get you head out of that shithole called geenstijl.nl and grow some brains.
Here be signatures
If your worst offense against the extremists is posting a message to Slashdot defending them, I'm sure you will cease to have problems with like artists showing up dead in the street, or locked down under police protection for the rest of their lives. I just wonder where the others will escape to as the wave of capitulation continues.
I guess these kinds of things are always a joke for those who are accustomed to taking orders and falling into line nicely via self-censorship. I don't worry about freedom of expression for people like you. You probably will never have any worth defending. I worry that we'll never see, for example, Islamic studies in the United States that would dare to subject the Koran to higher criticism because of simple fear of pursuing an offensive line of intellectual inquiry.
I'm being threatened because people like you are supporting the assholes that disturb the hornet's nests for bucks. Excuse me if I don't buy their bullshit.
I forgot to address this statement in my initial response. However, it's too important to let pass because of the monumental ignorance implied therein. You really have no idea whatsoever who Ayaan Hirsi Ali is.
If you have any intellectual honesty in you at all, you should at least do yourself the favor of skimming this article. She's a truly admirable human being and overcame tremendous hardships simply in order to be true to her beliefs. In so doing, and trying to defend the rights of women to simply live their lives how they will, she comes under attack by both the extremists and liberals in the west who see her as "disturbing the hornet's next." And yet she remains positive - an amazing person.
I've made both of those mistakes (taking a leatherman, and a full bottle) and was allowed to drop the leatherman off with the airline (and re-queue for another 20 minute wait) and just got the bottle taken away in the other case.
Of course, I have white skin and North European features, so that tends to see a different reaction than others might get.
My poetry site welcomes the unusual.
You should read up on Sayyid Qutb
He was an Egyptian author who studied in the US in the 1950s. He was shocked and appalled at the licentiousness of US culture, its focus on materialism and immorality. When he returned to Egypt he wrote extensively on the subject and gained a good many followers, including many who would go on to form the current crop of islamist groups. The early motivation seemed to be to prevent the creeping westernisation, and consequential moral decline of muslim nations. Coincidentally, the same root cause (1950s rock-and-roll) was the crucible in which Leo Strauss saw "permissive egalitarianism", and consequently birthed "Neo-conservatism", and this also was related to his political zionist views.
The goals of the Islamists is islamisation of the world, but short term their goals are to overturn the state of Israel, and turn back the westernisation of muslim states. Unfortunately American cultural imperialism and influence is spread largely through consumer goods, media, the internet and commercial interests. This is at least part of the reason why China has created their "Great Firewall". Also Christian Zionism has taken root in a great deal of US churches, and is now a powerful force behind Republicanism.
You can't win Darth. If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine
What's so wrong for a government to want to know who they can call on in case of cyber emergency?
I know people are afraid of big brother now, but not everything is done out of fear or terrorism....sometimes doing a head count of
a trade or career that can or is important to society is a good thing, else we would not have doctor's lawyers or engineers being
asked to register to let the government know who they are.
I guess we could view this as a compliment to the IT industry being promoted to being important enough to warrant a
head count. Just my opinion
I'm just concerned about the future of freedom when we're afraid to stand up for it without shame or apology
Who's freedom?
You seem to imply in your statements that Islam is worse, or less tolerant, than other religions. But it isn't. Every other religion has or does repressively act against people that question it. Or do you think Christian radicals in the US or Jewish ultra-orthodox clerics are in someway better than Muslims? As for freedom, I feel my own threatened more throughout Europe for matters related to the Holocaust say, than for religious matters. You can't question the establish historiography of the Holocaust because that will get you in jail in many european countries. You can, however, denounce and criticize all forms of religion. I do not feel my freedom is being threatened by Islam more than it is by copyright associations or drug dealers.
And to make it really clear, so that you don't get to say that I waste a lot of words saying nothing, I'm gonna baby feed you my point: You, and people like you, are extrapolating how an entire community of millions of people think and act from a few negative incidents and individuals. You are spreading fear by distorting facts about these people, and making the straw man argument. You are either consciously doing this, knowing it's wrong, or you just don't see and think about what's around you. The proof is, that you fail to acknowledge the significance of the oil business in the Middle East, which is the only reason the west is even interested in it. You also don't seem to think that unjustifiably invading two muslim countries is relevant. Well the best way to fight propaganda, you know, is make sure it doesn't fit the reality. Finally, you don't even mention the situation in Palestine which as I see it, is the epicenter of the whole problem. While the west keeps supporting the mischiefs of Israel, while they can continue to get away from the Goldstone reports, while they can continue to overtly commit war crimes and target civilian populations, while they can restrain food and water to Palestinians, while they can dismiss every criticism as anti-semitic, then you have absolutely no chance of stopping Islamic terrorism because they actually have a just cause!
As for your Ayaan Ali I confess I ignore who she is. Though I find it more monumental an ignorance your own about critical geo-strategic interests and players directly involved in this question. A book doesn't tell you the whole story. And truly admirable human beings are going down every day because people like you fail to understand the real issue here. Why don't you go preach that to them?
I start to think that you are the one that writes a lot and says nothing like all fear mongering fools.
Actually, my freedom of expression is doing just fine, thank you very much. And it isn't the extremists I am defending, it's the massive majority of muslims that just want to get a damn job, raise their kids, put food on the table and be left alone.
Sharia law is scary and the way it treats women is abysmal. However, since this country already has laws dealing with abuse, rape, murder and all the other nastiness, I do not see the point of singling out 1 complete religion and getting all high and mighty about it. As a matter of fact, I am truly convinced that doing so will only give the kind of people that do want to shoot politicians more ammunition.
And yes, the deaths of Theo van Gogh, Pim Fortuijn and others are tragic.
I'll let you get back on your high horse now.
People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
The guy drawing Jews as if they were retards was also not realy sure of his life at the end of Nazi Germany, now was he?
Getting a little perspective here is key... The people in the middle east only see the USA start ruling their country and in the process of waging an uncalled for war, you see your family member die in the process. "Oops! This rocket should have not land on your innocent daughter... Sorry dude."
Get some fucking perspective. There are lunatics everywhere! Be it muslims or not... Offend a guy from a motor gang isn't going to help either, but you're just brainwashed by magnified incidents that happen to happen everywhere on a daily basis. So once again I cannot stress enough to grow some brain cells and start thinking for yourself. Instead of letting be thought for you... Makes sence?
Here be signatures
I live in Portugal. Ironically enough we actually fought the Muslims for 800 years back in the formation of our country back in circa 1000AD...
I am an Infragard member. I was working for a university research group and was required to join Infragard as a part of this research. I did not like the idea of being forced to join an organization I knew little to nothing about so I did research into the organization first. I read up on all of the conspiracy theories about Infragard and spoke with some members before joining.
The conspiracy theories link this organization to "big brother" programs that encourage people to spy on their neighbors. This is not actually the case with Infragard - as far as I can tell.
From what I can see, this organization is put into place for very good reasons. Look into the Russian action in Georgia last year - a large component of that military action was cyber-based. The Russians took over the Georgian infrastructure (electric, news and radio) far before tanks rolled into Georgian territory. If the US is ever attacked on a large scale, our infrastructure will be the first strike. Infragard allows a secured group of IT professionals to be "in the loop" on potential threats that cannot be made widely public yet. It also allows these professionals to collaborate on security issues in real time - as they happen.
Say a new worm was propagating across major infrastructure networks. An administrator at the water company finds evidence of this worm and sends a message to Infragard asking if anybody else has seen it. A person working at the electric company reads that message and notices that it matches something they are addressing as well. The issue may be quickly escalated and addressed appropriately. If these individuals had to deal with conventional reporting then the link between two critical infrastructure networks experiencing the same problem at the same time may be missed.
In my experience Infragard does not care a bit about individuals ripping a CD or something. This is about bridging the gap between law enforcement and IT professionals in order to minimize the time it takes to address a potential cyber threat on critical infrastructure.
Registering your IT skills with Infragard is optional, not mandatory. This is not as evil as it sounds and I see much more upside to this than downside.
oh, I agree.
I'm actually afraid that TSA will blow up an airplane by mistake. Here's a small example.
I take a lot of pictures when I'm traveling for fun. I usually carry about 16hrs worth of batteries (which is about 1 AA / hour at the rate I shoot.) So I go to security w/ my batteries all nicely packaged tight. 4 in the cam, (A cannon S5IS, a good cam for my poor budget) and 3 sets of 4 in my camera bag. Each set is stable, all positives up, all in different locations in the bag. In the camera bag I have a micro tripod, a few lenses & cleaning cloth, and the charger for these batteries.
Some idiot at TSA takes them ALL and dumps em into a big ziplock. Loose, then tried to hand them to me. I just about shit a brick. I'm like hey, you can start a fire... (2650mah rapid discharge cells, not the strongest out there, but nothing to dismiss either) Whoops, I said the magic word. That led to a 20 minute wait while they determined that the batteries and camera posed no risk after they used "TSA tape" to tape them all together in a giant brick. This only after an interview about why I had the batteries and how they could catch fire. (by throwing them all in a bag loose!)
I'd shudder to think how they treat R/C lipos, where mishandling WILL cause a fire vs. might if things are just right...
To those who have never experienced a loose battery setting something on fire, it's not a fun experience.
How much is your data worth? Back it up now.
Let me be explicit so you can finally stop making silly accusations:
Islam is not the problem, as I have said many times; or at least no more a problem that any other irrational beliefs. They are no different than Christians or Jews in this regard, IMO. It's just that your university professors are not afraid to discuss the other Abrahamic religions openly and critically. They aren't likely to show up dead in the street as a result.
I think at this point you are intentionally conflating radical Islamic extremism with ordinary muslims so you can put me in some convenient bucket. Here in the U.S., the Christian right is attempting to prevent kids from learning current biological theory. I think it's despicable; however, no biology teacher or professor will stop their research or close their books because they are afraid. We don't have people in hiding, with round-the-clock police protection because of fear-mongering. Some western journalists even tried going to the extremists to hear their story, and probably many more would had not one of them gotten to play a starring role in his own beheading video found on the internet.
I don't really understand what drives people like you who refuse to read anything written by someone like Ayaan Hirsi Ali. You would rather disparage her and pretend that her experience doesn't really count because she's not burning Bush in effigy or spitting on a U.S. flag, or something.
1. I don't refuse to read anything.
2.
RADICAL ISLAM (ahem, notice the exact verbiage here) is playing the nasty neighbor who wants everyone to play their way or else.
So does everybody else to different extents. The US doesn't restrain itself from waging wars when it suits them.
3.
They aren't likely to show up dead in the street as a result.
You're making the straw man argument. I suppose you are talking of the incident in Denmark.
4.
however, no biology teacher or professor will stop their research or close their books because they are afraid.
You are exaggerating. Nevertheless, there are historians that are in jail or have been fined for being revisionists or deniers. But not in the US though.
5.
Some western journalists even tried going to the extremists to hear their story, and probably many more would had not one of them gotten to play a starring role in his own beheading video found on the internet.
Again you are making the straw man argument. I have seen plenty of interviews and reports of Islamic radicals from London to the Swat Valley.
6.
her experience doesn't really count because she's not burning Bush in effigy or spitting on a U.S. flag, or something.
I have nothing against the US. I actually admire the country and the people there. But it's not my fault that the successive administrations mess around wherever they want in the world and that that brings unpleasant consequences.
7. You are the one trying to make me play your way or else - if I'm not part of the solution I'm part of the problem. That's not the way it works. But hey, before you ask, IANAT ->I Am Not A Terrorist.
I looked at the website and it doesn't appear that they are trying to create secret spies who report other co-workers to the FBI. It looks like they are trying to get real and practical information from the industry on how to protect the cyber structure. I didn't read anythink which indicates a secret nature to it.
Of course, any cooperation between a law enforcement operation and private citizens leaves open the possibility of an informant kind of role, but that's not new.
Here's the goal statement from the website:
The goal of InfraGard is to promote ongoing dialogue and timely communication between members and the FBI. InfraGard members gain access to information that enables them to protect their assets and in turn give information to government that facilitates its responsibilities to prevent and address terrorism and other crimes.
I send that. An excellent series
You can't win Darth. If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine
First of all, anyone worth anything in IT security circles probably gets finger-printed and retina-scanned, for the record, several times a year.
Why a "non-profit" organization would want to know something that its government client already knows in spades should worry everyone in IT.
Second is the use of the "non-profit" organization status: Anyone who volunteers services to Infragard without knowledge of their employer is likely to get sanctioned for unauthorized provisioning of IT services, including consulting services, and resources, such as storage, power, and bandwidth, to a "non-profit" organization. Without cost-recapture reporting processes in place, "non-profit" quickly becomes theft of services, which should be generating revenue for the employer and tax revenue for the government. Cost-recapture would allow the IRS to grant tax credits to the employer for all of the "volunteered" hours and other IT services appropriated for "national security." Where are the Federal time card and authorized job requisition numbers required by the GAO on the Infragard website?
Third, is that the existence of Infragard creates millions of opportunities for false flag recruitment of IT staffers: How exactly does an IT staffer know when an Infragard request for information is legitimately backed up with a FISA-court signed warrant? How exactly does one Infragard volunteer respond to an information request from another Infragard volunteer? If the request breaks corporate rules, I would go to corporate legal and the FBI anyway, but that's just me. Add to that the number of ex-intel operatives with the ability to counterfeit federal authorization documents and IDs and the shadow world gets darker.
The history of US and allied national security is littered with underpaid, under-appreciated, government operatives who were turned by the offer of cash under the table to work against the national interests. Infragard, being non-profit, should be clearly suspected of harboring similar work conditions rife with opportunites for security breaches by turncoat insiders. The fact that 80% of corporate IT staff feel the same way, makes the opportunity for false flag recruitment even greater.
So, Infragard volunteers have to ask themselves two questions:
Do they want to co-conspire in the theft of corporate IT services with a non-profit organization that claims the authority of the government?
Can they trust operatives of a non-profit organization who can fail to provide the security, confidentiality, and protection that Infragard implies that it can provide?
Because humans can fail, don't expect Infragard to be accountable to volunteers or even the IRS or GAO. At least, if you are going to volunteer, be smart enough to have your employer send you to counter-intelligence courses at Quantico, since the Infragard contact you trust today, might be your last.
Afterall, joining the witness protection program is not a cakewalk, and the Infragard ain't the Eagle Scouts.
-----------
Please feel free to copy and forward to your US congressional delegation.
-----------
Really bad ideas should remain in spy novels.
-----------
DarkStarZumaBeachSurfinApocalypseWow