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Rugged Laptop/Tablet Suggestions, 2010 Version?
robbievienna writes "I'm currently living in the Arabian desert. Typically, unless a building has been sealed against the elements, sand and dust get everywhere. I purchased a keyboard cover for one of my laptops, and noticed that there was more accumulation on the underside than the topside. I've had sand crunk up the guts of one laptop and one tablet (Nokia N810). My coworkers who are native to the region tend to trade out their technology every six to twelve months, but I don't want to migrate data and adjust to new hardware that frequently. I was wondering what suggestions people have for working in this type of environment — both for laptops and for tablets. For reference, I work in a pseudo-secured zone where computers (phones, etc.) are not permitted to have cameras. A DVD drive would be nice, but is unnecessary. The more USB ports, the better. The last time the question was posted on Slashdot was five years ago, so I'm presuming that there are new industry leaders."
I've been using the HP EliteBook 8540w and it's been hard to destroy. I ran an HP demo unit through the mill too (dropped it from six feet on all corners, etc) - it's rated for military use, and I'm pretty sure it's one step below the ruggedized laptops you can get with armor plating.
// -- http://www.BRAD-X.com/ --
then underclock it.
then laminate it.
Depending on the exact timeframe you're looking at for the standard replacement cycle there vs. your total expected residency, you may be better off financially just going the replacement route and mitigating damage by keeping your N810 sealed in a Ziploc bag or something. Seriously, the last time I looked at prices for truly "ruggedized" equipment, I was floored and my wallet felt violated just by reading the prices.
Try getting a cheap netbook, and just replace it when it dies.
but I don't want to migrate data and adjust to new hardware that frequently
Keep spares in sealed plastic bags so that you won't have to change hardware. For data, put everything (including O/S) on a rugged external hard drive. A single USB/firewire hard drive should be easier to protect than an entire computer.
They've got units that are rated for such harsh environments. They're not cheap, though.
Hail Eris, full of mischief...
E pluribus sanguinem
FWIW, I just spent a few weeks in the Moroccan Sahara and most of the natives who had laptops, had a Macbook
What about using a computer dust filter bag? You could cut a window for typing and seal around the keyboard cover. You could also create flaps for the optical drive and ports, though an extension hub might make more sense and provide for a tighter seal.
I work in the construction industry and instruct our guys that work on site to blast the openings of their laptops/computers with canned air at least once a month.
I get them "spill proof" keyboards as those are sealed and keep things from getting deep in the keyboard. Just turn it upside down and shake it. Plus you can wash them if you really want them clean.
I find that there isn't much more you can do. The sand/dust causes extra wear and tear and the equipment will have to be replaced more often. I buy the "full coverage" warranty for equipment that will primarily be used on construction sites and it pays for itself when you constantly have to replace burnt out PSUs, video cards and CPUs that overheat and die due to clogged fans..
When in Rome, Do as the Romans do.
A quick google came up with the following website: http://www.ruggednotebooks.com/ :) ).
They have notebooks with sealed keyboards, low reflectivity (especially greate for the desert conditions
There are models that meet MIL-STD-810. Have you seen any of these tried in your environment? Some of them have already been mentioned such as the Panasonic Toughbooks and HP Elitebooks.
Dell XFRs start around $1,600 from the Outlet, with Core 2 Duos, no webcam, and designed to operate in the conditions you describe. I don't think they're quite as rugged as the Panasonic Toughbooks, but you can just buy two XFRs for the same price and switch the hard drives out if one breaks.
http://outlet.us.dell.com/ARBOnlineSales/topics/global.aspx/arb/online/en/InventorySearch?c=us&cs=28&l=en&s=dfb
Motion computing makes some fine tablets. The J3400 is particularly interesting and I believe it has earned some good reviews: http://www.motioncomputing.com/products/index.asp Couple it with a bluetooth wireless keyboard and its completely sealed design should work great.
The 2 things that fail on computers are hard disks and fans. I wonder if a really low power cpu could run without sucking dust in if a cpu cooling fan wasn't needed much.
Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely.
Hey I've never experienced such harsh conditions like the ones described but first thing that came to mind while reading your question was the panasonic toughbook series. I've heared and seen some pretty amazing things being done to those toughbooks and they stood tall... It's surely best to do some research but i would surely take those toughbooks in consideration... As with most things it's a matter of choice, you could go for an easy and affordable to replace solution (netbook,...) but since rebuilding backups and stuff every 12 months would like to be avoided, going with a rugged notebook would be worth the thought... http://www.panasonic.com/business/toughbook/toughbook-products.asp
Stretch a ladies nylon stocking over the whole thing... This will take some experimenting to figure out the exact best method (maybe one over the base, one over the screen...), but has the advantages of:
-being extremely cheap
-easily removed/replaced
-thin/flexible/transparent enough to cover the keyboard, and even the screen with
-should filter out the worst offender category of sand/dust without seriously impeding air flow
-will also cut down on glare and reflectivity
For $1 a try, I figure it is worth mentioning...
You can spend a lot of money and buy a ruggedized laptop ( panasonic toughbooks are the best known examples and they have a range of models from semi ruggedized to fully ruggedized ).
However the feature you want from the ruggedized unit is the fact that fully ruggedized laptops are setup to be fanless ( the better designed ones ). Fanless means they don't need to suck in air, which would need to be filtered, which then becomes a point of failure.
So for example most netbooks for example run an atom cpu that just needs a heatsink and no fan. That then eliminates the point of failure of the fan sucking in dust. There are desktop choices that are the same, underclocked or low power cpu's that don't produce enough heat to need more then a heatsink so can run fanless.
Put all of your files on a server on the internet that you can securely connect to, and get a cheap netbook to work on.
Nullius in verba
I've got a now 3ish year old Dell XPS M1710 laptop that survived living in Afghanistan for a year, Kuwait for a year & now a year or so back here in Colorado. Not light, but it did good as my gaming rig. I was in decent quality buildings for being down range, but pretty crappy & unsealed by U.S. standards. I've gone through 3-4ish power bricks for it, but I blame crappy generator power for that. And when the power bricks died, the laptop would only operate in reduced power mode (throttle CPU & not charge the battery), but would still run the laptop. Not bad for bouncing between 110v & 220v power of very dubious quality.
Blow it out frequently with a can of air & it should do pretty good.
I'd recommend waiting until the iPad comes out, then get one.
Software suggestion: Embrace cloud computing for all your data needs (assuming you have a good internet connection.) This will remove the problem of having to change hardware and replicate settings all the time.
Hardware suggestion: Cheap netbooks that can be resold to unsuspecting people in the desert :)
Regardless of what you get, invest in a bunch of cyber clean and clean out your notebook regularly.
http://www.thinkgeek.com/homeoffice/gear/b88d/
I carried a Itronix Duo-Touch II for a few months during field-work. It is a very robust tablet and is pretty much everything-proof (other than driving over it with a truck).
http://www.gd-itronix.com/index.cfm?page=Products:Duo-Touch_II
It is pricey as Itronix was purchased by General Dynamics but is mil rated.
Tisha Hayes
I don't have any suggestions on the hardware but how often do you plan to swap out your lungs or is there a medical procedure to flush out the grit?
Nate
If you are in the middle east you should consider native technologies.
The abacus of course.
The beads on most modern abici are designed to last hundreds of years.
The iPad comment was a joke and it is just not built for the outside. It's barely meant for a kitchen with a tile floor.
If you don't want to touch the toughbook, maybe the Dell Latitude E6400 XFR http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/laptop-latitude-xfr-e6400?c=us&l=en&s=bsd
so I'm presuming that there are new industry leaders
Not really...It's a tough nut to crack, so the market leaders in the ruggedized notebook sector tend to get there and say there. As others have said, your best (& costliest) options are Panasonic and Itronix (General Dynamics).
per the comment above, there arent many fanless netbooks. My atom makes a lot of heat, definitely needs its fan. I am always inclined to go with lenovo, they are damn rugged. Im sure the panasonic toughbooks can take a beating, but they are kind of expensive for what you get performance wise. The pantyhose suggestion sounds legit.
I realize you asked for a ruggedized laptop. However, that everyone else replaces theirs regularly points to the idea that you should consider that as a serious alternative and not discard it out of hand. I called this 'out of your box' because they're all doing it, and you're rejecting it a priori. I see basically three legitimate issues with this solution:
a) maintaining a consistent interface for you to be used to
b) providing easy data migration to the replacement device
c) total cost of multiple non-ruggedized devices compared to the realistic lifespan of ruggedized ones.
I'm not suggesting that my parent post had the right thoughts in mind, but Apple does provide surprisingly good, quick and easy solutions for a&b in OS X and the iPhone; I would expect the iPad to continue this.
Apple is not historically great about 'c', but that sand environment is hard even on the modestly ruggedized ones so it's not impossible.
Of course, I imagine their are .e.g Linux distros with good solutions to a & b and other laptop vendors who tend to have a consistent interface.
Of course you might need to account for shipping, purchasing, processing, or environmental costs in 'c', but even on the environmental front it's not a given that one device is better than 3, esp if it gets recycled well (many parts of the sandworn one will still work, and it'll be early enough that those, minus your HD, are reasonable used replacement parts in the right shop...)
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At my work we routinely supply panel PC's for industrial conditions, water, dust etc.
http://www.aispro.com/TabletPC/TabletPCQuery_Tab.asp?Type=1310
They are well rated and have options for docking stations as well.
They kinda taste like tasty wheat . . . . kinda . . .
I think that's an excellent idea. He just needs to look at the fridge and get a good schematic so wherever he drills the access holes for the cables doesn't hit anything important. Then once the cables are through, with a little duct tape gasket action, silicone seal the holes further.
Before I read your post I was going to suggest a clean box with reversible gloves and a glass front to see through, but your idea is better.
I would check out the General Dynamics GoBook or General Dynamics GD8000. Pricey new, but reasonable used, fully ruggedized. Though I bought a Lenovo T510, and its a very very durable machine.
"Technology is too complex today."
http://laptop.org/en/laptop/hardware/index.shtml
http://laptop.org/en/laptop/hardware/specs.shtml
There is a lightweight version of Windows they can run if you can't make it with "Sugar". You can find them on eBay.
I use an AMREL Rocky notebook in my field work. Hop out of the helicopter and toss it on the rocks while you unload other gear. Rain? No problem. Dust? No problem, it's completely sealed. The bottom is actually a finned heat sink bonded to the CPU. Since it has no fans/vents, it is a bit under-clocked. But it's awesome. http://www.amrel.com/rugged-computers/default.asp
"You never know when some crazed rodent with cold feet might be running loose in your pants."
-Calvin
I suspect you will find what you need somewhere in the Panasonic Tuffbook line of products. The market to industrial, field maintenance (the people who drive up mountains in their trucks to get to microwave towers and things like that), even the military. Then aren't always the latest technology because the are more focused on dependability and survivability.
Heat Sunks wont be very effective in a desert nvironment where the ambient air temp is hitting 50 C. Even an atom would need a fan in the desert
Sorry, I've spent time in the Sahara desert, and it doesn't usually get that hot there - if it did the people retreat to someplace cooler. At 50 C (122 F) all the people will be dead, so there won't be anyone to worry about heatsinks or fans.
There are heat pump devices, such as Peltier effect devices which with a large heatsink can keep things pretty cool even in the (fictional) temperature you mentioned. I have a project at work that's using Pelter devices to keep an electronic device similar in size and power dissipation to an external hard drive down around 80 F in a 130 F environment.
Putting moderation advice in your
...that way the end result will be sexy.
Uh, Linux geek since 1999.
Seal your tablet in a vacuum-sealer, like the kind designed for food. I've been pondering ways to reinforce my netbook against impacts. I'm reluctant to just fabricate a steel case for it.
For optimal comment enjoyment, take red pill now.
You need a laptop rated to Military Standard 810F and IP54. A laptop that meets these standards will survive in the sahara, but only one that does, will.
The Panasonic Toughbook range will meet your needs.
Someone mentioned it above but misspelled it.
...and solved it with Panasonic Toughbooks. I did SONAR research systems for a half a decade, and we always had problems with not just sand and dirt from the remote locations we were in, but often saltwater spray as well. Panasonic Toughbooks were the only laptops that stood up to everything we did, and never failed. Yes, they're expensive, but they're worth it, especially when you're paying $2500 per day for a research vessel and your laptop dies when you're 4 days out into the ocean. That's a $20,000 (there and back) failure.
Browsing at +1 - no ACs, I ignore their posts. So refreshing!
Panasonic Toughbook.
They have a range from "Business rugged" all the way through to various MILSPEC certified models. All made in Japan (really!) and built unlike most products today. Made to last.
Really...Just ask any family with kids who use the computer what survives.......no grit or dust, but lots of food and no consideration as to "sensitive electronics"
The people who work there already have this figured out, as you say, by replacing hardware every 6 to 12 months. So, buy identical copies of an inexpensive flash-based laptop and swap the drive each time you lose a chassis. Blowing out the chassis with compressed air frequently should help. If you're in an industrial setting, compressed air should be easy to come by, otherwise, a filling station should have some) frequently should help.
I'd worry more about my lungs in an environment like that, though. You get more-or-less only one set of those, and definitely can't clean them easily.
Put my fist through my alarm clock with its ding-dong death inside my ear. - The Blackjacks.
...and use it regularly.
I would recommend an getting an old Tuffbook off ebay for a few hundred bucks. Assuming you don't want to do any gaming or video editing it should be more than adequate for your needs. I currently have a CF-50 running Xubuntu, and it serves all my mobile computing needs, you could probably pick up a much better one for under $500. If your open to linux I would recommend any distro running Xfce for your OS for added speed. If it ends up getting screwed with sand and the like, you won't be too far in the hole.
Years ago, as a consultant, I was hired by a pet wholesaler to come up with a solution for his computers, which had a very short useful life before the dust got to 'em.
The place was loaded with fine, silty dust, which was *everywhere* and all over everything despite their obvious effort to keep things clean. Birds, lizards, and other pets can generate an *insane* amount of this, and if you can imagine a large, heated warehouse where pets were bred and sold in volume, then you get the idea. They were having trouble keeping brand new computers running much more than a few months!
After some consideration, I realized that the trick for the computer was in the air - the air, otherwise needed to cool the computer, carried the dust that just did the computers in. Most computer ventilation systems create *negative* pressure - air "sucks in" every possible crack, bringing dust with it. After getting clearance for a "non-standard solution", (they were DESPERATE!) here's what I came up with:
1) Normal desktop computers. There were three of them, connected by a LAN.
2) I removed the power supplies and reversed the fans (which normally blow outward) so that they blew inward.
3) I got a bunch of HEPA air filters, 3 large, flat boxes, duct tape, and some dryer hose.
I cut large, square holes on two sides of the box and duct-taped the hepa air filters so that they sealed over the holes. Then, I cut a hole on the small side for the dryer hose, and sealed the dryer hose to the back of the power supply on the computer. If I remember correctly, I put a cheap 6" fan in the bottom of the box to help blow air into the dryer hose, and sealed the box.
This forced clean air into the computer, creating a *positive* air pressure of clean air inside the computer. This worked to push dush and silt out of the computer, and even worked to protect otherwise sensitive parts like the CD/DVD ROM drive. After 6 months, the computers were all working at 100% and they were happy! The solution was cheap, effective, and reliable.
While I solved their problem with a bit of redneck engineering, you could probably use/modify a personal air filtration system from the likes of Sears or x-Mart.
I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
You made this comment just so you could use abici in a sentence, didn't you? ;-)
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Panasonic Toughbooks are pretty hard to beat(literally). Had a CF-29 for a long time now and droped, wet, etc.. no problem. CF-30 I think is current model.
"Computers are a lot like Air Conditioners" "They both work great until you start opening Windows"
I'd go and grab one or more MacBooks. Rugedised gear makes Apple pricing look dead cheap and the mac has a couple of other features which will be helpful, depending on how long you are out there.
1. You can easily port your data, setting and user profile to another Mac, even onto the net. This gets you back in the field quickly if anything goes wrong.
2. Macs are designed to have few holes or obtrusions.
3. They are relatively easy to take apart and when you have the keyboard area is dead easy to clean as is the motherboard.
So, grab a Mac or two and some duct tape and Chux cloths. Duct tape up all the ports you're not using and across the front slot of the DVD burner. Fold the Chux cloth over a few times and tape it down over the vents. Close the laptop up whenever you're not typing something. Wipe the keyboard clean every so often with a damp cloth - or hit it with a can of compressed air.
When the Mac is too choked up to keep working well, transport the data to the other Mac and you get to keep working seemlessly. A sync every night is a sensible option. The chocked up Mac gets opened up and carefully cleaned during the night in a clean environment, put back together and ready to go out again as needed.
RAIM - Redundant Array of Inexpensive Macs ;p
All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain.
I realize it's not exactly what you asked for, but a Dirt Bag (http://dirtbag.biz/) may be useful in some cases. They're made for desktops & tower cases though, not laptops.
-Troll, Flamebait, and Offtopic are NOT equivalent to disagreement.
If you want the absolute best then go military spec. Husky has been making water,disaster proof computers for years. Looks like they were bought.
http://www.gd-itronix.com/index.cfm?page=Products:Duo-Touch_II
Why thank you very much!
I work offshore and was going through laptops quite regularly but all that changed when I picked up the XFR laptop. They are very sturdy but are much lighter than the tough book PC's which I also find kind of outdated.
They come in both touch and non-touch screen laptops with 14.1 or 12.1 inch screens. Some of the best features I have found about these laptops are the fact that they have VGA out, SSD hard drives, ability to charge your cell phone (or other USB devices) while the laptop is turned off and it comes with a 3G SIM card slot for mobile broadband built in.
Just my 2 cents.
-- j0uSt
Hi you might consider buying one of the computers made by X2 Computers. An English outfit who specialise in making laptops for Firemen, Police men and the military, so their computers are tough, and obviously dust proof too. Having lived in Beijing, where the Gobi desert sent huge sand storm to us, I iknow what you mean about desert dust, it kills machines! Anyhow, here is their URL.. have a look, and good luck. www.x2mc.co.uk/website1
This is tricky, really. Ultra fine contaminate is basically beyond the scope of most rugged gear. The problem I see here is that in these types of environments it will be very difficult to operate any type of machine requiring ventilation. If an air current can penetrate the gear, it is more than likely that fine contaminates will penetrate the gear. I'm not aware of any surfaces that are permeable by gas but not microscopic contaminate without a dramatic filter system. I think the solution(long term) that you might look at will be to use a portable "safe room" on the cheap. Setting up a safe environment will take extra time, and training, but what you might save in hardware and productivity may justify the cost. I guess it might largely depend on the steps to interface with machines(stairs, narrow walkways, tarzan ropes) however I could envision a reusable portable sterile room. I imagine that hardware users are probably a HUGE part of why micro contaminates enter the hardware, since they are on every inch of a user long before they penetrate the hardware, the more a "dirty" user touches of interfaces with hardware components, the worse it gets. This seems deeper than a simple manufactured solution.
Fanless computers for industrial automation, for example the ones made by Advantech can take LOTS of abuse. They work at coke battery plant, steel plant, sintering plant, ... places that can be at least as hostile as a desert.
A nice example is here:
http://www.advantech.com/eAutomation/fanless-box-pcs/Default.aspx
Panasonic make some very nice tough laptops, there are also a few other makers around that claim they make tough laptops.
However my advice is don't bother. The cost of a low end panasonic toughbook is over 6 times the cost of a good spec thinkpad. The toughbook is unlikely to last 6 times longer and even if it does it's going to be obsolete by that time. Unless your life depends on that one laptop working right now just buy good quality ( not acer ) decent spec laptops and replace either the whole laptop or parts as needed.
You need good and tested backups in any case as even the best laptop could get stolen.
where are the mod points when you need them?
I suggest: 1. control the environment eg, seal the windows, fit a door closer. 2. get a hard airtight case for when you travel. pelican, kincrome, storm etc... this is when your lappy gets really dusty and hammered most. even cheap tupperware is better than a soft bag. 3. backup store your data elsewhere (2X swapping usb mass store or cloud) data on a laptop does not really exist unless it is backed up. 4. get component based. (eg a small brain, separate DVD, keyboard, memory store, display etc. not so portable, but you can replace bits easy. 5. copy the locals. you live in a remote desert area, reliability is very very very expensive because all the tech is operating at the extremem edge of its design spec. heat, dust, etc... I run a digital music and media studio in the central desert of Australia with about 15 different computers, emacs, mac minis, PC towers, macbook pro, PC laptops, Imacs, printers, scanners etc. (Wilurarra Creative). The red dust is fine and worse, conductive from Ferrous oxides. I have been here for 3 years. I fitted a hydraulic door closer the the front door to cut dust made a HUGE difference. also, seal any draft leaks (duct tape, sealant, whatever). sounds dumb, but mopping the floor of your workspace may help keep dust down.
Waiting for the other shoe to...
We live in a very humid climate with lots of dust and sand in Mexico. Usually one of the first things people in the know do after getting a new computer is to spray it with silicone spray (or something like that), supposedly it will protect the computer from outside dust.
Ubuntu is an African word meaning 'I can't configure Debian'
It's been quite a long time since modern laptops used cooling systems that suck in air through vents and blowing the warmed air out through the keyboard in-between the keys... Is it any surprise that all the dust being sucked in was being stopped by the keyboard cover? I would also be unsurprised if this was causing problems for its cooling and probably reducing the life of the laptop...
I'd suggest that a better approach (if feasible) would be to use a netbook that doesn't generate so much heat and hence rely on internal airflow to cool - and hence sucking in dust at the same time...
I would definitely recommend Logic Instruments Fieldbook - extensive review here http://www.ruggedpcreview.com/3_slates_logic_instrument_fieldbook.html
or one of Panasonic Toughbooks. Friend uses one on a boat and it works flawlessly.
That sounds good in theory, but I had one too and seriously...it's made for kids and kids are the only ones who could get any real use out of it. The keyboards are too tiny for adult hands and it feels like a toy. The 5-year-old I gave it too was totally stoked though.
That was the sad thing about it - If they had produced an adult version of the OLPC - the things were intended for use in bush type conditions, from the daylight viewable LCD through to the construction of the keyboard and the ease of fixing.
Toughbooks are great but if you are looking for an outdoors machine without the budget of an oil company, i.e. a university doing field research then it can be a problem.
--Best of both worlds: Linux host OS and Vmware guest (Windows)
o The VM is portable and shouldn't go thru Reactivation after migration unless the *virtual* hardware changes significantly
o The host OS is fairly simple to reconfigure (as stated above) if the drive is moved to a different machine
.
== WolfriderV6 == I'm willing to admit that *I just might* be wrong... Are you??