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Will Your Car Tell You To Put Down the Phone?
crimeandpunishment writes with this story from the AP: "We know it's dangerous to text while driving, or talk on a cell phone without using a hands-free device. What if our car knew it as well, and warned us about it? Our cars buzz and beep at us when our seatbelts aren't buckled ... now there are new applications in the works that could lead to a warning if we're driving with a cell phone in our hand."
Will Timothy post another article asking a vague, sensationalist question in the title? The answer may surprise you.
the law makes it more dangerous to text while driving -- instead of holding the phone up by your face where you can see the road you have to hold it down in your lap. good work, leglistators!
I said, First post!
I thought it was still up in the air. Isn't the distraction being on a call?
What a waste of effort.
As a mechanic, I personally removed, disconnected or otherwise rendered useless dozens of "spoken word" feedback systems on cars. They have been around for many years, doing anything from reminding you that your seatbelt is unfastened, that you left your headlights on or to tell you your door is ajar (No it isn't! It's a door!).
I did so at the REQUEST OF THE VEHICLE OWNER.
Once the novelty wears off, spoken word feedback systems are annoying as a kid in the back seat repeatedly asking "Are we there yet?"
Law, or otherwise, such a system would be disabled as soon as the customers patience wore out, and there will never be a shortage of mechanics willing to do it for you if the price is right.
How about the headlights flash when the driver is using their cell phone so everyone else knows to dive out of the way?
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
Run Timmy! Run!
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
The article only seems to mention smartphone apps, which doesn't seem optimal to me.
What about pressure monitors in the steering wheel that sound an alarm when they don't feel anything for more than, say, 30 seconds? Sure it might annoy those who prefer driving with one hand, but I suspect driving with two hands might be inherently safer anyway. Pressure monitors would also prevent you from fiddling with the radio for too long, and would work for people without smartphones - or people you lend your car to.
I'd rather you rationally disagree than irrationally agree.
I don't know what the current numbers are, but as of a couple of years ago the story was that the leading cause of distracted driver accidents was messing with the climate control and radio. So, yeah, let's go for saving lives and make it so you can't change the radio station, volume, or adjust the temperature. There will probably have to be congressional hearings on whether defogging of the windows is worth the risk involved in enabling it. I guess for safety's sake we should just make defogging be on all the time, just in case.
I personally think that the real problem is people not giving the driving the attention it requires. Whether it's your child (my wife was once rear-ended by a woman in a SUV because she was watching her child in the back seat -- did I mention we drive an impossible-to-miss yellow car), having a beverage, or adjusting the climate control... You need to pay attention to the weapon you are steering.
Sean
How far have we drifted from "news for nerds, stuff that matters."
This isn't news.
It doesn't fucking matter.
In other actual news:
There have been two suicide bombings in Moscow's metro this Monday morning rush hour.
All 4 of the Rio Tinto executives on trial in China have been found guilty of bribery, with a 30 year possible maximum sentence.
--
BMO
With cars becoming all *-by-wire, if you are going to the effort to detect the phone being used, why not get it to shut the car down?
(Of course there are safety issues here, but you get my drift)
I lost me sig.
It's a social problem. No amount of gadgets is going to stop idiots from wanting to yammer away instead of paying attention; witness the mechanic in this discussion mentioning how many of those warning systems he disconnected.
The solution is brutally simple: three strikes, and you're out. Three tickets for driving while on the phone? Lose your license. Need your car for work? You should have thought of that and moved to the side of the road before dividing your attention between traffic and your important conversation.
Otherwise it is time for some good old vigilantism and just shoot them in the head. It's not as if they have any brains to splatter the inside of the car, so that keeps its resale value.
Mart
"I know I will be modded down for this": where's the option '-1, Asking for it'?
How would it distinguish between the driver and passengers?
The people that ignore those laws and accept the danger inherent in being distracted from driving don't do so because they don't know better. No, I'm not shitting you!
You can forget to put a seatbelt on, although it is quite hard, and you can easily forget to turn the headlights off. But you cannot forget that you are texting while driving. So unless this system pulls the car over at the next save opportunity and doesn't let you start the engine until you've put the fricking phone away, this won't do squat.
Everyone else who commented that there are other, and worse, distractions, are correct. But people talking on the phone is something that is so easily fixed with just a few bucks, that I find it really annoying that people still keep holding onto their phones.
The interesting part around here (Switzerland)? Most of those people don't drive cheap, old Skodas or Renaults, no siree-bob. They're usually wearing business suits and driving new Audi, BMW, Mercedes or Lexus. Now if a single mother of three without a job is on her way to an interview and needs to contact her potential employer due to a detour, that I could understand. Fifty bucks, to her, are probably a lot of cash.
But this guy with the 1000$ suit and the 130'000$ car just does not get to use that excuse.
by not showing characters texting or making phone calls while driving... People see their favourite actor doing it so they think there's nothing wrong with it...
Donald 'Duck' Dunn: We had a band powerful enough to turn goat piss into gasoline.
Thiss wuld b really bad idea becuz it... *CRASH!!* Sent from my iPhone
"...there are new applications in the works that could lead to a warning if we're driving with a cell phone in our hand"
Uh, I think the driver already knew they were driving with a cell phone in their hand; a warning seems superfluous.
"I like systems, their application excepted", George Sand (French)
The cell operator can detect that a user is moving. The operator may be able to warn the caller that the callee is moving (faster than a threshold), allowing for the caller to disconnect before it rings. Drivers should be able to opt in for this warning system so that passengers aren't affected by this check.
As a student who is required to take ergonomic/applied psychology papers, I can assure you that this is just false.
Studies show, very clearly, that hands free devices have almost exactly the same magnitude of effect as just talking on a cell phone. The problem isn't only having one hand, the problem is that your attention is divided.
Example source (there are actually hundreds of studies reproducing these results): http://pss.sagepub.com/content/12/6/462.abstract
what a useless and dumb feature for a car, is it not the same distraction as getting a txt or phone call when driving??? come on people...
After one major display of crap management (leaving the annual budget till the night before he had to present it to the group CEO and then blaming the CFO when the numbers didn't add up) the CFO announced that he now intended to wait till there was a really heavy storm on the M42 and the CEO was driving through it, then call him and tell him exactly what he thought of him. This would surely result in his getting flattened by a truck.
Unfortunately we all got other jobs and left before the opportunity arose, but I still think it would be a legal way to wipe out very aggressive people.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
you could probably fit a hands free phone into the car for the same price?
The problem isn't the absent minded driver it is that humans don't multi-task. We have limited capacities and task switch just like a conventional CPU, and just convince our selves that this is multi-tasking. For example I can play (aka farm) an MMO and listen to a podcast, but if something important happens in the game I will blank out the podcast (and vice versa). This is because playing the MMO is just running on muscle memory and requires very little attention. However I can't really listen to a podcast and read because they are both using the same systems. Similarly you can't be paying attention to driving at the level needed to react quickly to an emergency AND be talking on the phone.
There is plenty of research out there that backs this up.
This is why radio, AC etc, all need to be in the drivers dash and controls need to be on the steering wheel. Drivers still get distracted but that setup minimises it and reduces the chance their eyes will be completely off the road.
P.S. If you think you can multi-task you are dangerously deluded and need to be kept off the road.
YIAAPS
========
CINC, 4th Penguin Legion
And you, sir, are missing the point. We will almost certainly ask our mechanic if he can disable some of the warnings in our car. Not because we dont wear seatbelts, but because the warnings are a nuisance, and sometimes actually dangerous (see below).
There is the parking assistant that beeps when you are close to an object in front of your car. Fine for parking. Drive slowly in a blizzard, and it beeps at the snowflakes, driving you absolutely nuts in the process.
There is the warning that an object is close behind you. This is supposed to detect automatically if you have a trailer. But sometimes it does not - for no reason we can figure. So you get to tow your trailer, with the car yammering at you the entire trip.
There is the warning for glare ice. Implemented so that anytime the temperature changes to 3 degrees centigrade, it warns you. On dry roads, on wet roads, it doesn't matter. It also doesn't matter if it has already warned you 10 times on the same trip.
Or even take the seat-belt warning: If I go shopping, or put my gym bag on the seat, the thing goes off. Do I really have to strap my groceries and my gym bag in?
Warnings with so many false positives are counterproductive. Either people find them so irritating that they disable the things. Or else they get in the habit of ignoring them. Either way, the warnings wind up useless as such - but they can distract at critical moments.
To illustrate that last: I was driving on nasty, icy roads. My car started to skid on glare ice (by the way, no warning, as it was below 3 degrees outside). At this moment, I discovered a warning I had never heard before: the car knew it was skidding and blared at me. Thanks a lot - I knew bloody well I was skidding, and I really, really did not appreciate that distraction at that particular moment in time.
Warning should (a) essentially never have false positives, (b) only warn you if it something you might not notice on your own (and can do something about), and (c) be configurable by the user. Sadly, car manufacturers don't seem to bother to invest the effort to meet any of these conditions.
Enjoy life! This is not a dress rehearsal.
Just go the opposite way: Make your car controlled from your phone. Then concentrating on driving and concentrating on the phone are the same thing. :-)
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
If the steering wheel isn't being touched by both hands for at least 10 seconds whilst moving, sound the warning.
"Please use both hands whilst driving", it might need disabling though for amutee drivers.
People caught using a mobile when driving should have these installed into their motors, in the same vein as electronic tags. Friends can't call people when you're driving? That's your problem; maybe peer pressure will work. Driving is not a right, it is a privilege, and we take away other 'privileges' such as access to the internet and computer equipment for things that couldn't actually result in unnecessary death.
I got a ticket for driving while talking on a cell right after California enacted the law. I was at a stop light, my phone rang, and I answered it to tell them that I was driving and would call them back. I hung up, the light turned green, and I got pulled over and handed a ticket that stated I was being cited for (and I quote) "failure to purchase a BlueTooth device".
For optimal comment enjoyment, take red pill now.
Which Switzerland do you live in? Also living in Switzerland, I can tell you that there are plenty of cheaper models on the roads. Go look in the parking lot at the Migros (the largest supermarket chain).
What is different is that your car registration must be renewed every two years, and any significant, visible rust is forbidden. Hence, you don't find any rust-buckets or junkers on the roads.
Enjoy life! This is not a dress rehearsal.
Ummm.... How about instead of trying to detect that someone has a phone in their hand we try to detect when they're driving poorly for ANY reason? So it's wrong to have a phone in your hand, but not wrong to eat a burrito? Or to keep turning around to have a conversation with someone in the back seat? Or to look in the rear view mirror to put on make-up/shave/etc? People love the idea that cell phone users are obnoxious jerks, but picking on the behavior and claiming it's for safety while ignoring all sorts of real safety issues is hypocritical.
Computer says I on phone.
Insurer demands more moneys.
I get in accident.
Me be texting.
Me get no money.
...that it knows when I'm distracted by a phone call, then it can drive the damn car!
Don't look for a solution in the cars, look for the solution in the phone.
Most if not all phones have some sort of GPS. Simply deactivate the screen keypad, and ringer and send all calls to voice mail if the phone is traveling faster than walking speed.
I read Slashdot for the headlines, because the headlines, unlike the articles, are usually original and never duplicated
Just put an RF shielding coating on the glass and none of the damn handhelds will work in the car.
Or better yet, put up cameras on all the intersections (most cities already have them) and pay all those damn bums that are out begging a dollar for every car they hit with a baseball bat, 5 dollars if they manage to connect with the phone, of people that are chatting or texting away.
Your phone will tell your car to stop.
Anyway why do they build cell towers by the interstates?
Now really, maybe someone might forget about a seat belt but they aren't going to forget they are talking on the phone. The annoying alarm will just get disabled. It's not like you don't know you are on the phone and driving at the same time. What a stupid idea!!!
Or even better, fit each car with a cellular phone jammer that kicks in when the car starts, so you have no way of making a call while driving. Fit the car with a "panic" button which makes a call to 911 and transmits GPS coordinates, so if you have an actual emergency you're covered, but have to pull over to send all your lulz and omgs to your bffjill.
How hard is it for phone manufacturers to make a handset with a Really Freakin' Loud speakerphone?
When I am not in my own car (with a car-kit) I use the iPhone's built-in speaker and it sucks badly. I end up holding the phone an inch from my ear and might as well just be using it normally.
Do you or your partner snore? - Visit www.snoring.com.au
Unless its mandated by law, I highly doubt many people would buy a car with such a feature, myself included. While I'm not one to usually talk on the cell phone, I do have the occasional need to hold the phone up to my ear... or go on speakerphone as to be inconspicuous... if there's a call that needs to be made and it can't wait til I reach my destination. The last thing I want while on an important call is the car issuing warnings or the cell phone asking me to press 7 to continue. I'm sure a large number of people would be in the same boat. (ok... bad choice of words :)
We know that one of the dumbest things anyone has ever done in the history of mankind, bar none, is typing a text message while attempting to drive a motor vehicle
We should probably instead make cars that automatically wrap themselves around phone poles when their drivers are engaged in such activities, to spare the rest of the driving public from their stupidity.
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
but my wife is usually on the other end. It goes something like this, ...
Wife: Are you driving?
Me: Yes
Wife: While you are talking to me?
Me: Yes Dear
Wife: You know its not good to talk and drive, pull over or call me back when you get there
Me: Yes Dear
Wife: Click
Me: Hey Dude, what's up?
Friend: Not much, I thought you had to call your wife.
Me: I did, but she said to call her back later
Based on "previous experience" regarding humans and handguns, and, maybe, face recognition - one might venture to postulate that backlighted and/or better melanized humans will be at a greater risk of "non-compliance" ?
And, since "being fat is the next tobacco", what's next ? Abstracted-weight-indicator-evaluation ("you look fat" - YLF) locks on refrigerators, food cupboards, cookie-jars... ? THX-1138 ? But, don't worry, I won't mention zombie marches. At least, not here.
Mod PARENT up!
Kentucky Fried Movie is still one of the funniest things that I've ever seen. :)
Absolutely!!
That is why I never txt or use my cell phone in the car.....it might cause me to lose control, and spill my beer.
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Since we're on the topic of bad driving behavior and using technology to solve it, I have another question. If we're going to put sensors / software in our cellphones and in our cars to prevent cellphone usage while driving, why don't we put small transmitters on speed limit signs and sensors in cars to detect what the legal speed limit is? That way, our cars can know what the speed limit is, and prevent us from driving faster than that. I'm not advocating the idea, but I wonder why no legal body has tried to legislate it.
Specifically, a review of the Mazda Rotary Engine Pickup. In 1974 cars had the truly horrible seatbelt interlock system, which would kill the ignition if you didn't put the seatbelt on at the right time. Pickup trucks were exempt from the requirement, as well as many other safety requirements, leading to the following lovely little snippet of text:
"We found the Rotary's cab refreshing in one way: it is devoid of a bunch of buzzers and warning lights and the seatbelt interlock system afflicting today's passenger cars. Once again, we are left to our own judgment as to whether to belt up (we always do), or whether to leave the key in the ignition switch when leaving the pickup. It was nice. We felt almost like grown-ups again."
I have disabled my car's seatbelt buzzer. It's a much calmer place now. I still wear my belt every time.
All the more reason to keep my awesome 1986 Toyota 4Runner in shape. I get to tell the nanny state to go pound sand.
... "I can easily drive while texting, shaving, and putting on my pants, simultaneously. Why punish me when my uber-skills are vastly superior to everyone else on the road?" replies...
Um, how do you dive in/out a car? :P
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
... you're already unsafe. If you drove 12 hours a day, you'd be averaging more than 80 mph. Even if you drove 16 hours a day, you'd be averaging around 63 mph. So one of two things is going on here: you're either 1) driving at ridiculously unsafe speeds, or 2) you're driving so long without a break that your attention is bound to be wandering. Most likely both.
I agree with the larger point - when driving cross-country, it's just not practical (or necessary, really) to hold onto the steering wheel with both hands. But 1000 miles/day? Kind of a silly exaggeration.
There is a easy way to fix this. Just shield the airwaves inside the car so that phones don't have any signal inside the car. how is that?
If you can't handle two tasks at once, then don't drive and use your phone at the same time.
Yet another distraction.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
No. The first one that tries it will find itself under the knife to correct this defect, or if unable to do so, sold off and its manufacturer put on my shitlist.
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The line is crossed when I no longer have control or can regain control, when I need to have control.
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Hence the desire to use a big handgun on the car computer and the idiots who program that nagging shit into it......
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My dream is to have a house that asks me to confirm that I want to have the light on, every time I switch the light on, by asking me, "Hi Dogzdik, did you know you have activated the illumitronic universal room lighting system, if you want the lighting to commence, say "YES", if you do not want the lighting to commence, say "NO" or wait 30 seconds before pressing the light switch on again"....
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jesus fuck... I hate automation, phone robots and stupid, stupid shit and the people who make it.
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Voting up, Voting down - If I really gave a fuck about your approval or not, I'd come and ask you.
http://www.xkcd.com/699/
Most human behaviour can be explained in terms of identity.