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Apple, AT&T Sued Over iPhone 4 Antennas
bannable writes "Apple has been accused of violation of the Federal Communications Act, three counts of products liability related to negligence, defect in design and breach of implied warranty, intentional and negligent misrepresentation, fraud by concealment, unfair business practices and more. 'The iPhone 4 manifests design and manufacturing defects that were known to Defendants before it was released which were not disclosed to consumers, namely, a connection problem caused by the iPhone 4's antenna configuration that makes it difficult or impossible to maintain a connection to AT&T's network,' the California complaint reads."
This will have no affect on Apple's sales.
Remember to maintain your supply of
A lot of times (I suspect most of the time) these sorts of class-action lawsuits are instigated by not just the usual suspects (greedy lawyers), but also with the support of the companies themselves. The lawyers get a big payday. The company gets shielded from any further individual lawsuits. And the consumers get stripped of their right to sue individually, for the "settlement" of a "5% off your next purchase" coupon.
In other words, when you hear "class-action lawsuit," don't think "Yeah, we're sticking it to the big guys!" Think "No, they're sticking it to *YOU*."
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Sorry, Steve, "You're holding it wrong" just doesn't cut it.
If your user's can't actually hold your phone, it's your problem, not theirs.
If Apple is stupid to only do testing:
A. In their Cupertino facility, which has it's own AT&T tower
B. In the field, but covered with their 30$ bumpers
Then this case may have some potential even though it will drag on for years and only the lawyers will gain millions of dollars, with the end result being a small settlement not beneficial to the consumer. Just like all IT lawsuits.
"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has it's limits" - Albert Einstein
FFS, if I bought a phone and it didn't work I'd just take the thing back to the shop and get a refund. That way I get my money back so I can buy a different phone as a replacement. With a class-action lawsuit they'll get $5 worth of iTunes vouchers and still have a phone that doesn't work. What planet are these people on?
Listen to my latest album here
I'm already seeing all the BS going on about how a class-action lawsuit only helps the lawyers at the expense of the plaintiffs. I do not know if this is usually the case or not, but the only Class-Action lawsuit I have ever been a part of, (interestingly against apple) resulted in a solution that I found quite suitable for the offense.
I didn't get a dime, but I didn't want one. I wanted the system I paid for to work. I got a box in the mail with express shipping paid for me to ship my laptop back to Apple. Apple replaced my defective motherboard, and shipped my computer back. All at no charge to me. I did not even pay shipping either direction.
I bought a product that didn't work as it should. I signed up on the Class-Action, I got a product that worked as it should.
BUT LAWYERS ARE TEH EVILZ! CLASS ACTION LAWSUITS ARE ABOUT LINING TEH LAWYERZ POCKETS NOT GETTING ANYTHING TO THE PLAINTIFF!
Little Brother, watching the watchers
Did your brain shut down after the first line of his comment?
That's exactly what the class action lawyers want to happen, in settlement. And they'll get a take of the value of the bumpers. That's how it always pans out. The consumer gets some bobble of junk, or a coupon, and the class action firm gets cash for their trouble.
That said, I do think class action firms are among the only ones capable of putting a bit of fear in evil corporations (Think Merck/vioxx).
I believe this put's us right about here:
In the Apple Product Cycle
if just holding the phone in your hand causes the iphone to lose reception and transmission, guess where all that RF energy is going, right in to your hand, the idiots should have put an external antenna stub on the top of it plus a plug on the back or side so you can connect a magnetic antenna from the roof of your autombile & a hands free setup kit, but i guess steve jobs was so wrapped up in form and fashion he did not even consider functionality.
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
Nooo, it's DOS 4.0 all over again. DOS 3.3 was a great release and then they brought out DOS 4.0 which was so bad I had to wait till DOS 5.0 before I could upgrade. Stick with 3.x releases, they're always the best :D
All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain.
I can see where perhaps there would be a case over this design flaw, but to claim it's "difficult or impossible" to maintain a call is simply a lie. In everyday use, not being careful how I hold the phone at all, I have had no issues with calls with the new phone.
If you make the claims too absurd the case will not have a good chance of success.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Yeah, that's how it went for TD Ameritrade with their suit. All we got out of it was free trade vouchers. Free trade vouchers, really? You leak our private info to spammers and cyber criminals and then you expect us to be around to use those vouchers?
There are exceptions, but that's typically how it works.
Ars has some good analysis. Seeing the games companies play with signal bars apples are oddly accurate... and logarithmic...
http://arstechnica.com/apple/news/2010/06/putting-hard-numbers-to-the-iphone-4-antenna-issue.ars
I don't know what % of iphone users use cases, but I'd imagine its a fairly high %.
The only way I can reproduce the problem is to hold the phone in a way I will never, ever hold it (holding this way obscures a large portion of the screen to hold it in a way that affects my signal). I suppose it could be a design defect if it actually negatively impacted me. What impacts me more is the awful AT&T reception I get at my office -- it's almost unusable there.
My guess on the outcome? Bumpers for everyone! I'm sure spending a dollar per phone (which is about what I'm guessing bumpers for the iPhone 4 cost to manufacture) is a bargain compared to having to repair or replace a few million phones.
http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/legal/return-policy.jsp
I will bend like a reed in the wind.
If they do this along with offering an extended return period (90 days vs. 30 days) I would be okay with it. The product is obviously flawed. 90 days and a rubber band lets people decide if they can live with the flawed product or not. Honestly, what should happen is that every single iPhone 4 purchaser should return their phones all at once and let Apple deal with taking the financial hit of fixing them or selling them as refurbs with a known design defect. Unfortunately, people are too fanatical about their iPhones to see the forest through the trees. If this was any other company with any other phone, there would be an automatic recall forced by the carrier.
Wise men say, "Forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza."
Who's pre-ordering the iPhone 4 S?
Antenna-ing
Done the right way.
What I didn't realise until I read a review recently is that although the Bumper solves the antenna issue, it means that you cannot plug in your standard iPod/iPhone connectors!
The "solution" is that you have to take the phone partially out of the case so you can plug the connector in - in other words, every single time you plug it in to charge, sync or hook up to your car stereo!
I'm rather surprised that a company that prides itself on the quality of its products manage to muck up what should be a simple plastic case.
Avantslash - View Slashdot cleanly on your mobile phone.
It's not exactly about the phone. Yes, you CAN return the phone, but it's too late at that point - now you're in a 2-year AT&T contract, that you then have to pay $375 to get out of ...
I just went through AT&T's iPhone 4 online upgrade process far enough to be shown:
Service Cancellation & Early Termination Fee
Call the number on your invoice/receipt to cancel your service. You may cancel service within 30 days from the activation date to avoid the applicable early termination fee (the "Early Termination Fee" or "ETF").
--
Perpenso Calc for iPhone. Classic Scientific and HEX functionality plus RPN, fractions, complex numbers, 64/32/signed/unsigned bitwise operations, UTF-8, IEEE FP decode, and RGB decode with color preview.
Then the whole value (for a lot of Apple fans) is completely lost because the phone won't be so stylish anymore. Even for those who value functionality, a bit of value is lost because a slim phone/pocket-sized unix box is now a bulky POS. Why not buy an Android phone instead?
My iPhone? I like Apple's software but I am no Apple fan (I like to be brand-agnostic - someone else always has a better solution sooner or later). I had a case on my iPhone but now it's bare and has quite a few scratches. I got a scratch on the new scratch-resistant phone four days after buying the phone (scratched on a diamond earring - I babied the phone up to then and didn't give holding it up to my ear a second thought). Since then, I haven't been overly worried about scratching it, since the screen is scratched.
I do have it in a charging sleeve about half the time but unfortunately the sleeve does affect reception so I only put the battery in when it's low.
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
This kind of thing, "You are holding it wrong" is par for the course with Apple and no surprise to a long time user.
Back in the day, circa late 80s and into the 90s, Apple computers were mainly used by artists with little technological experience. As such Apple's customer was essentially beholden to the company because let's face it, what were they going to do, use a PC? These days the Apple customer is vastly different, and though the products are nifty and slick, continuing the arrogance towards the end user may prove counter productive in the long run.
Did you ever wake up in the morning, with a Zombie Woof behind your eyes? -- FZ
I think that returning their new iPhone is a problem for many people due to utterly destroying their previous iPhone in an attempt to make a cool youtube video. Now they have no backup phone and cannot possibly exchange the phone being that they are apple loyalists. Lawyers with their keen senses felt an opportunity to make a buck and started a class action lawsuit.
No, if you return it, you are not obligated to the contract.
I'm guessing someone could address this issue themselves by affixing a piece of tape where it's needed. Clear tape to preserve the aesthetic of the phone. Or maybe a strip of screen protector plastic. I'm guessing if a coating would address the issue tape would work as well. At least it's a temporary fix until Apple addresses the problem.
How long before we see some obnoxious, overly complicated guide on Youtube suggesting this very thing?
As everyone can plainly see, "Just don't **** that way" is really showing some serious game and is poised for a title shot. For those scoring at home, "You insensitive clod" has had the crown for a while after it soundly defeated then-reigning champ "My eyes, the goggles do nothing!". But don't rest on your laurels, "Just don't", because wily veteran "You must be new here" is poised for a serious comeback, after it's mauling of midland "I, for one".
They told everyone to just go get a case. They didn't know everyone would come back with a court case.
AFFECT is a transitive verb. "I can affect your computer's operation with this sledgehammer."
EFFECT is an object of action. "The effect of my hitting your computer with my sledgehammer is a reduction in idiotic posts on the wacky."
please everybody to get this correct in the future.
if this is supposed to be a new economy, how come they still want my old fashioned money?
Don't let facts get in the way of a good argument.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
You merely assume that the problems are similar. Upon what are you basing the assumption?
Could you 'short' the antenna in the Nexus One merely by holding a phone in the 'wrong' way? No.
What proof do you have that the antenna is "short"ing on the iPhone 4? The only user-doable test is to look at the bars while changing the grip. That does not tell you what is causing it. It doesn't even produce a repeatable result every time.
Is the reception quantifyably worse than either the Nexus One or the previous generation iPhone? Yes.
Actually folks who have done tests report the reception is better than the previous iPhone. Link
Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Maserati Driving Gloves The only acceptable solution really.
You will hold it like the turtle-neck overlord commands, and you will like it!
In Soviet Russia you do not find the class action law suit, it finds YOU!
I am bombarded on a regular basis with class action lawsuit notices for products and services.
AT&T long distance
Volkswagen leaky sunroof
Computer memory
Vonage this or that
Unless I feel that I have been injured in some way I refuse to respond to these baits. As has been stated elsewhere the money goes into the ambulance chasing lawyers pockets and very little flows down to the "injured parties".
I wonder, can we file a class action lawsuit against lawyers who file class action lawsuits??
Tisha Hayes
Yes, but I think lawyers should only get an equal share when doing class action lawsuits. if it is 1 lawyer and 99 people, the lawyer gets 1% of the total settlement.
Also, for anyone not starting the lawsuit, they should be able to opt out simple by returning whatever reward they got.
Those would nearly end all fishing, and ensure an actual fair settlement for the people who were affected.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
"Affect" can also be used as a noun, meaning a state of mind or way of presenting oneself. "The head injury had the effect of creating a new affect in Jim."
Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Their usual response to a design flaw is that it is the users problem. Thats when the Apple Apologists come out of the woodwork and complain about "the usual" pissing on Apple. On the contrary, Apple gets a pretty free and cushy ride most of the time. Most reviews of Apple products gloss over flaws that would result in crucifixtion if it came from Redmond.
I like my 3GS and I like a lot of Apple products but let's face it, they make some real crap too. eg: iTunes (inconsistant, many db bugs, slow, bloated) and Safari (slow, bloated, buggy eyecandy) come to mind on the software side. Arguably, pre ios4 versions have been buggy and wanting as well. I have noticed the Bluetooth driver still has a number of issues (not noticable if you have only one BT device).
On the hardware side, I remember overheating Macs, monitors with wavy screens and of course there is the battery life of the iphone which has led to a large amount of profit for the battery folk. All of these problems get pawned off as "user generated problems" by Apple support.
Hey... they're no worse than anyone else and anybody who has experience in mass production of consumer devices can understand how these things happen. iPhones are a pretty impressive piece of technology. However, Apple products are not sacred.
I just think Apple needs to stand up and say "Yeah, we screwed up" and come out with an engineering fix, a timeline for repair, and a plan to replace the defective product. Just like Detroit.
Gates: "64k is enough for everyone"
Ballmer: Chairs, "I'm fucking going to kill ____"
and
Jobs: "Just don't hold it that way".
your phones.
Yes Apple blew the testing. Yes they should cop to the error and make the rubber bumper available for free. And yes the sticky tape will work... But if you want a more elegent solution, get some tool dip at the hardware store and paint a thin rubber coat over the bloody antenna. Does this solve the problem? Yes. Should the problem never have occured in the first place? Also yes. Fix the issue now..and then who cares what the legal guys do? (Disclaimer:I work in a law office) I've been around long enough to remember the Apple III motherboard issue: " The fix for the motherboard issue is easy - Just drop it a couple of inches and the chips will reseat themselves..." Percussive maintenence anybody?
They don'teven work!
http://apple.slashdot.org/story/10/06/25/2132218/Experts-Explain-iPhone-4-Antenna-Problem?art_pos=10
Life is great! (as told by Lady Susan)
It may have an effect. Especially after the comments Steve Jobs told one iPhone owner.
Steve Jobs tells angry iPhone 4 owner to "relax". Steve Jobs told an owner who posted a video of his problem on YouTube "No, you are getting all worked up over a few days of rumors. Calm down." Get a Life..
Falcon
Should there be a Law?
Perhaps a planet where they have a contract that has termination fees so you can't just get your money back?
Why guess when you can know? Measure!
Ahh yes, the retina display, a piece of misleading deceptive BS that has no basis in reality, unless Steve "Don't Hold It That Way" Jobs also thinks that you should hold the phone at extreme arm's length (and then some) to use it...
Yes, I had one strike (Anecdote).
But then you jumped far past me, and added several more strikes with your refusal to address the fallacy your post was based on.
You being now some eleven strikes ahead of me, why you have obviously lost. Why are you still digging?
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
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